28 Nov
2006
28 Nov
'06
1:06 a.m.
you can do very well copying manuals and such with a
mini digital cam, if its allowed. Id loan you mine if
interested, no problem.
--- cctalk-bounces at classiccmp.org
<dkelvey at hotmail.com> wrote:
Hi
I've been having fun hacking my Cat ( Canon ). It was intended
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---snip---
>
> > A Cat is a machine I would also like, but I am
not
going to find one at a
price I can afford...
Mine...$20 US. Plus shipping. Hope is not lost...
to be only an appliance machine but one can program
with it as well.
There is a page on the web that says one can just
use the word
"see" to decompile words but he must have
had a disk
that someone
typed that definition in with.
I've been slowly hacking how to decompile and I've
made good
progress. Still, there is so much to dig into. My
main reason is
to make a printer driver for my HP 3si.
I was just doing some searches on Jef Raskin and the
Cat and found
that the Standford Library has manuals on the Forth
in the Cat.
Too bad I can't just photo copy them. I do plan on
taking a
day off soon and sit in their viewing room with a
lot of note paper.
They also have a lot of information from Jef's
records on the Mac
and Apple in general. Jef was an interesting fellow.
The Cat is one of my favorite machines.
Dwight
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28 Nov
28 Nov
7:17 a.m.
Hi
Use of cameras is restricted. No flash is allowed and they
even don't allow a tripod. I'm not sure how I'd hold a
camera steady enough to take pictures under those conditions.
The other problem is the number of pages. There are about
700-800 pages. I'm just hoping that most of the pages are
related to teaching Forth and with the glossory being the
most intersting part.
Dwight
From: Chris M <chrism3667 at yahoo.com>
Reply-To: "General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic
Posts"<cctalk at classiccmp.org>
To: cctalk at classiccmp.org
Subject: Re: RE: HP 9000s, Canon Cat, felines, etc. was Re: rogues
galleries
Date: Tue, 28 Nov 2006 01:06:30 -0800 (PST)
you can do very well copying manuals and such with a
mini digital cam, if its allowed. Id loan you mine if
interested, no problem.
--- cctalk-bounces at classiccmp.org
<dkelvey at hotmail.com> wrote:
Hi
I've been having fun hacking my Cat ( Canon ). It was intended
____________________________________________________________________________________
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---snip---
> > A Cat is a machine I would also
like, but I am
not
going to find one at a
price I can afford...
Mine...$20 US. Plus shipping. Hope is not lost...
to be only an appliance machine but one can
program
with it as well.
There is a page on the web that says one can just
use the word
"see" to decompile words but he must
have had a disk
that someone
typed that definition in with.
I've been slowly hacking how to decompile and I've
made good
progress. Still, there is so much to dig into. My
main reason is
to make a printer driver for my HP 3si.
I was just doing some searches on Jef Raskin and the
Cat and found
that the Standford Library has manuals on the
Forth
in the Cat.
Too bad I can't just photo copy them. I do
plan on
taking a
day off soon and sit in their viewing room with a
lot of note paper.
They also have a lot of information from
Jef's
records on the Mac
and Apple in general. Jef was an interesting
fellow.
The Cat is one of my favorite machines.
Dwight
_________________________________________________________________
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age, and price. Try it!
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9:09 a.m.
Rumor has it that dwight elvey may have mentioned these words:
Hi
Use of cameras is restricted. No flash is allowed and they
even don't allow a tripod.
No tripods whatsoever? I just purchased this cute little desktop model that
can pretty much fit in your pants pocket ("Is that a tripod in your pocket
or are you just happy to see me???" ;-) =-= Note: I did *not* say
"comfortably."
Any recent (20 years or newer) military pants would surely have big enough
pockets to hold it.
A Canon/Nikon DSLR with an f1.4 50mm lens, and you might not even need the
tripod; tho you'd best hope the pages are fairly flat (depth of field might
not be "great" at that aperture) and the autofocus is pretty accurate... ;-)
I'm not sure how I'd hold a
camera steady enough to take pictures under those conditions.
The other problem is the number of pages. There are about
700-800 pages.
A 1-Gig flash media (Compact Flash/SD/Insert your favorite here) should
hold that easy, if you set it to JPEG instead of RAW. Unforch, I don't have
my Nikon D70 with me to test it for sure, but it can hold over 150 pictures
in RAW mode, which are 5-6Meg each. 2-each Gig CF cards makes sure I have
*lots* of "film"... ;-)
Too bad I'm not local to myself, let alone anywhere civilized, else I'd
volunteer to help! And no, I'm *not* shipping my camera away... the
holidays are coming up. ;-)
Laterz,
Roger "Merch" Merchberger
--
Roger "Merch" Merchberger | A new truth in advertising slogan
SysAdmin, Iceberg Computers | for MicroSoft: "We're not the oxy...
zmerch at 30below.com | ...in oxymoron!"
9:27 a.m.
On Tue, 28 Nov 2006, dwight elvey wrote:
Use of cameras is restricted. No flash is allowed and
they even don't
allow a tripod. I'm not sure how I'd hold a camera steady enough to take
pictures under those conditions. The other problem is the number of
pages. There are about 700-800 pages. I'm just hoping that most of the
pages are related to teaching Forth and with the glossory being the most
intersting part.
How about one of those little table top camera stands? Surely they'd allow
one of those...
-Toth
10:48 a.m.
How about one of those little table top camera
stands?
right, I was thinking of building a collapsible unit
from brass tubing essentially (hobby and some hardware
stores). It would be light, sturdy, and you could
stick it in your jacket...or somewhere else LOL LOL
LOL. Sorry.
The little Aiptek PenCam thing, which in no way
resembles a pen, works off 2 AAA's, takes an SD card
(though I'm not sure if it'll recognize the whole 1gb,
also have a 128k and 32k cards. Something tells me it
might though). I had rechargeables batteries for it,
but I had been utilizing them in an HP calculator,
left it on top of my van, and drove off! Salvaged the
calc, 1 or 2 of the batteries (not sure I'd trust them
anymore, they look like they got run over partially).
I'm going to buy new ones though.
A little OT, but when I did plug batteries into the
calculator, an HP 49g, although beat up, it seemed to
work fine, though it would drain the batteries FAST,
and 1 in particular got real hot? Any clues?
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10:43 a.m.
Um, is this the droid you're looking for? :-)
http://jef.raskincenter.org/published/cat_ref.html
dwight elvey wrote:
Hi
Use of cameras is restricted. No flash is allowed and they
even don't allow a tripod. I'm not sure how I'd hold a
camera steady enough to take pictures under those conditions.
The other problem is the number of pages. There are about
700-800 pages. I'm just hoping that most of the pages are
related to teaching Forth and with the glossory being the
most intersting part.
Dwight
From: Chris M <chrism3667 at yahoo.com>
Reply-To: "General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic
Posts"<cctalk at classiccmp.org>
To: cctalk at classiccmp.org
Subject: Re: RE: HP 9000s, Canon Cat, felines, etc. was Re: rogues
galleries
Date: Tue, 28 Nov 2006 01:06:30 -0800 (PST)
you can do very well copying manuals and such with a
mini digital cam, if its allowed. Id loan you mine if
interested, no problem.
--- cctalk-bounces at classiccmp.org
<dkelvey at hotmail.com> wrote:
was intended
____________________________________________________________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Everyone is raving about the all-new Yahoo! Mail beta.
http://new.mail.yahoo.com
_________________________________________________________________
Stay up-to-date with your friends through the Windows Live Spaces
friends list.
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---snip---
> > A Cat is a machine I would also
like, but I am
not
>
going to find one at a
> price I can afford...
Mine...$20 US. Plus shipping. Hope is not lost...
Hi
I've been having fun hacking my Cat ( Canon ). It to be only an appliance machine but one can
program
with it as well.
There is a page on the web that says one can just
use the word
"see" to decompile words but he must
have had a disk
that someone
typed that definition in with.
I've been slowly hacking how to decompile and I've
made good
progress. Still, there is so much to dig into. My
main reason is
to make a printer driver for my HP 3si.
I was just doing some searches on Jef Raskin and the
Cat and found
that the Standford Library has manuals on the
Forth
in the Cat.
Too bad I can't just photo copy them. I do
plan on
taking a
day off soon and sit in their viewing room with a
lot of note paper.
They also have a lot of information from
Jef's
records on the Mac
and Apple in general. Jef was an interesting
fellow.
The Cat is one of my favorite machines.
Dwight
_________________________________________________________________
MSN Shopping has everything on your holiday list.
Get expert picks by style,
age, and price. Try it!
http://shopping.msn.com/content/shp/?ctId=8000,ptnrid=176,ptnrdata=200601&a…
10:13 p.m.
Hi Ray
Nope, these are only manuals for normal operation. These
do not have anything about the access to or the words that
are in the underliing Forth. The Forth wasn't really intended
to be used by the average user. It was intended as a diagnostic
tool or for doing things like changing printer drivers or such.
Dwight
From: Ray Arachelian <ray at arachelian.com>
Um, is this the droid you're looking for? :-)
http://jef.raskincenter.org/published/cat_ref.html
dwight elvey wrote:
http://clk.atdmt.com/MSN/go/msnnkwsp0070000001msn/direct/01/?href=http://sp…
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Hi
Use of cameras is restricted. No flash is allowed and they
even don't allow a tripod. I'm not sure how I'd hold a
camera steady enough to take pictures under those conditions.
The other problem is the number of pages. There are about
700-800 pages. I'm just hoping that most of the pages are
related to teaching Forth and with the glossory being the
most intersting part.
Dwight
> From: Chris M <chrism3667 at yahoo.com>
> Reply-To: "General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic
> Posts"<cctalk at classiccmp.org>
> To: cctalk at classiccmp.org
> Subject: Re: RE: HP 9000s, Canon Cat, felines, etc. was Re: rogues
> galleries
> Date: Tue, 28 Nov 2006 01:06:30 -0800 (PST)
>
> you can do very well copying manuals and such with a
> mini digital cam, if its allowed. Id loan you mine if
> interested, no problem.
> --- cctalk-bounces at classiccmp.org
> <dkelvey at hotmail.com> wrote:
> >
> >
> > ---snip---
> > >
> > > > A Cat is a machine I would also like, but I am
> not
> > > > going to find one at a
> > > > price I can afford...
> > >
> > > Mine...$20 US. Plus shipping. Hope is not lost...
> > >
> >
> > Hi
> > I've been having fun hacking my Cat ( Canon ). It
> was intended
> > to be only an appliance machine but one can program
> with it as well.
> > There is a page on the web that says one can just
> use the word
> > "see" to decompile words but he must have had a disk
> that someone
> > typed that definition in with.
> > I've been slowly hacking how to decompile and I've
> made good
> > progress. Still, there is so much to dig into. My
> main reason is
> > to make a printer driver for my HP 3si.
> > I was just doing some searches on Jef Raskin and the
> Cat and found
> > that the Standford Library has manuals on the Forth
> in the Cat.
> > Too bad I can't just photo copy them. I do plan on
> taking a
> > day off soon and sit in their viewing room with a
> lot of note paper.
> > They also have a lot of information from Jef's
> records on the Mac
> > and Apple in general. Jef was an interesting fellow.
> > The Cat is one of my favorite machines.
> > Dwight
> >
> >
> _________________________________________________________________
> > MSN Shopping has everything on your holiday list.
> Get expert picks by style,
> > age, and price. Try it!
> >
>
http://shopping.msn.com/content/shp/?ctId=8000,ptnrid=176,ptnrdata=200601&a…
>
> >
>
>
>
>
>
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friends list.
9:55 a.m.
Chris M wrote:
you can do very well copying manuals and such with a
mini digital cam, if its allowed. Id loan you mine if
interested, no problem.
I keep several of the Canon LIDE models that are usb powered. If you
can walk in with a battery powered laptop somewhere with these, you
can scan with a bed scanner at full resolution.
I strongly recommend collecting them, as they regularly show up at
thrift shops, and swap meets. they were not very expensive, but
run quite well with only the laptop in site.
then you just need a spotter :-)
jim
10:20 p.m.
From: jim stephens <jwstephens at msm.umr.edu>
Chris M wrote:
Hi Jim
Scanners are out as well. They are quite serious about what one
can and can't do. They specify that one can place the book on
the table and use their weights to hold it open while taking the
picture. One needs to hold the camera by hand and not use
flash. One can not stand on anything other than the floor.
These are their rules. It is their game.
Dwight
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you can do very well copying manuals and such with
a
mini digital cam, if its allowed. Id loan you mine if
interested, no problem.
I keep several of the Canon LIDE models that are usb powered. If you
can walk in with a battery powered laptop somewhere with these, you
can scan with a bed scanner at full resolution.
I strongly recommend collecting them, as they regularly show up at
thrift shops, and swap meets. they were not very expensive, but
run quite well with only the laptop in site.
then you just need a spotter :-)
jim 
29 Nov
29 Nov
5:13 a.m.
And thusly were the wise words spake by dwight elvey
Hi Jim
Scanners are out as well. They are quite serious about what one
can and can't do. They specify that one can place the book on
the table and use their weights to hold it open while taking the
picture. One needs to hold the camera by hand and not use
flash. One can not stand on anything other than the floor.
These are their rules. It is their game.
Dwight
Isn't there a type of support available that you hold against
yourself so that the cammer uses you for support? That way
it would at the least put shakey hands out of the picture.. ;)
Cheers,
Bryan
4:27 p.m.
--- Bryan Pope <bpope at wordstock.com> wrote:
Isn't there a type of support available that you
hold against
yourself so that the cammer uses you for support?
That way
it would at the least put shakey hands out of the
picture.. ;)
probably, but a small desktop tripod type thing would
be the way to go. I'm not aware of any such commercial
offerings, but my guess is they would be light and
very portable (i.e. collapsible).
These Aiptek Pencam things are the ticket. They're
not available any longer (in this form exactly anyway)
but they will produce an image with very readable
text. I repeat, the first time I tried it, it worked
surprisingly well. There's always the means to touch
up and enhance an image afterwards (computers are good
at automating certain tasks, aren't they?).
I have a website now, but I don't know what in blazes
I'm doing. I'll post some examples before too long.
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10:02 p.m.
From: Chris M <chrism3667 at yahoo.com>
--- Bryan Pope <bpope at wordstock.com> wrote:
Hi
All that is fine except they state "no tripods". They are not
specific about which type, just "NO".
Dwight
_________________________________________________________________
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Isn't there a type of support available that
you
hold against
yourself so that the cammer uses you for support?
That way
it would at the least put shakey hands out of the
picture.. ;)
probably, but a small desktop tripod type thing would
be the way to go. I'm not aware of any such commercial
offerings, but my guess is they would be light and
very portable (i.e. collapsible).
These Aiptek Pencam things are the ticket. They're
not available any longer (in this form exactly anyway)
but they will produce an image with very readable
text. I repeat, the first time I tried it, it worked
surprisingly well. There's always the means to touch
up and enhance an image afterwards (computers are good
at automating certain tasks, aren't they?).
I have a website now, but I don't know what in blazes
I'm doing. I'll post some examples before too long.
30 Nov
30 Nov
12:25 p.m.
On Wed, 29 Nov 2006, dwight elvey wrote:
Hi
All that is fine except they state "no tripods". They are not
specific about which type, just "NO".
Dwight
Howzbout a quadrapod? There are FOUR legs that screw into the front of
one of my Leica "macro" attachments
Howzbout a simple sturdy cardboard box? Cut out enough of the sides for
light, and a hole for the camera to peer through.
It is odd that they say "no tripods", NOT "no stands".
2:32 p.m.
--- dwight elvey <dkelvey at hotmail.com> wrote:
Hi
All that is fine except they state "no tripods".
They are not
specific about which type, just "NO".
Dwight
Yeah I guess I missed that part. But truthfully with
a bit of practice, you could still use a measly 1.2
mpix cam to do the job. IT IS DOABLE TO ALL THE
NAYSAYERS.
Honestly, I can't see how some sort of support you
place against your chest would be against the rules
though. It's not really a tripod. You could bring it
with you, and if they say no, you can fall back on
your sense of aim.
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6:11 p.m.
New subject: tripods was HP 9000s, Canon Cat, etc. was Re: rogues galleries
Chris M wrote:
--- dwight elvey <dkelvey at hotmail.com> wrote:
> Hi
> All that is fine except they state "no tripods".
> They are not specific about which type, just "NO".
> Dwight
heh. I'm reading "The White Mountains" to my daughter right now and the
"no tripods" gave me a shock :-)
I need to stop reading email in the evenings, but somehow that book seems
close to this list, in spirit anyway :-)
-brad
1 Dec
1 Dec
7:06 a.m.
From: Chris M <chrism3667 at yahoo.com>
\>
--- dwight elvey <dkelvey at hotmail.com> wrote:
Hi
I do have a Canon with a stablizied lens. I'll bring that
on my next trip. First time, I'll just look and take a few notes.
They were specific about not copying entire documents
but like I said, a glossory of the words would be all
I need.
I already have a fair understanding of how the Cat's
token threaded code works. I can go from token to
execution address and back. I can also go from token
to dictionary name and back. That is what is needed
for a high level decompiler.
Dwight
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Hi
All that is fine except they state "no tripods".
They are not
specific about which type, just "NO".
Dwight
Yeah I guess I missed that part. But truthfully with
a bit of practice, you could still use a measly 1.2
mpix cam to do the job. IT IS DOABLE TO ALL THE
NAYSAYERS.
Honestly, I can't see how some sort of support you
place against your chest would be against the rules
though. It's not really a tripod. You could bring it
with you, and if they say no, you can fall back on
your sense of aim.
29 Nov
29 Nov
12:22 p.m.
It was thus said that the Great dwight elvey once stated:
Scanners are out as well. They are quite serious about what one
can and can't do. They specify that one can place the book on
the table and use their weights to hold it open while taking the
picture. One needs to hold the camera by hand and not use
flash. One can not stand on anything other than the floor.
These are their rules. It is their game.
Very odd they won't allow the use of a tripod (are they worried about
someone knocking something over with it?) I wonder if they would allow the
use of a monopod?
-spc (I can understand the restriction against flash ...)
10:13 p.m.
From: Sean Conner <spc at conman.org>
It was thus said that the Great dwight elvey once stated:
Hi
I suspect that they've had troubles in the past. All it takes is
one fool to damage a valuable book and they have to restrict
others. I'm not going to be looking at things that are of that
sort but they have their rules.
Dwight
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Scanners are out as well. They are quite serious about what one
can and can't do. They specify that one can place the book on
the table and use their weights to hold it open while taking the
picture. One needs to hold the camera by hand and not use
flash. One can not stand on anything other than the floor.
These are their rules. It is their game.
Very odd they won't allow the use of a tripod (are they worried about
someone knocking something over with it?) I wonder if they would allow the
use of a monopod?
-spc (I can understand the restriction against flash ...)
6547
days inactive
6550
days old
17 comments
10 participants
participants (10)
-
bpope＠wordstock.com -
brad＠heeltoe.com -
chrism3667＠yahoo.com -
cisin＠xenosoft.com -
dkelvey＠hotmail.com -
jwstephens＠msm.umr.edu -
ray＠arachelian.com -
spc＠conman.org -
tothwolf＠concentric.net -
zmerch＠30below.com