19 Sep
2010
19 Sep
'10
6:31 a.m.
Hi guys,
Pushing the boundaries of the Ten Year Rule here, but I think the
"coolness factor" might apply here, so please don't get the pitchforks
and flaming torches out just yet... :)
I just got back from the Barnsley Hamfest, with a new toy in tow: a
Psion Workabout MX, 2MB version, with IrDA, TTL, RS232 and LIF ports, a
256K flash SSD and a 1MB SRAM SSD. Batteries were -- predictably --
shot, but on installing a fresh pair of AAs, it booted to SIBO. Seems
the SSDs are blank, and aside from a few small screen scratches the
machine is in pretty good nick.
Thing is, I'd like to see it do something useful. This dictates that I
write some code for it... I've managed to find a copy of the old Psion
Sibo SDK and some PDF documentation on an FTP site, but this doesn't
include the C compiler required to compile the code: TopSpeed C.
As near as I can tell, this was a 16-bit 8086 C compiler which generated
code under (and for) MS-DOS type platforms. The Psion documentation
references Topspeed Compiler v3.10 and Environment v3.10.002, but I
suspect other versions may also work. Psion suggest it was released by
Clarion, but every other reference I can find suggests it was sold be a
company called "JPI".
Does anyone happen to have a spare copy of Topspeed C kicking around?
Thanks,
--
Phil.
classiccmp at philpem.me.uk
http://www.philpem.me.uk/
19 Sep
19 Sep
11:17 a.m.
New subject: WTD: Clarion/JPI TopSpeed C (for Psion SIBO SDK)
On Sun, Sep 19, 2010 at 6:31 AM, Philip Pemberton
<classiccmp at philpem.me.uk> wrote:
Hi guys,
As near as I can tell, this was a 16-bit 8086 C compiler which generated
code under (and for) MS-DOS type platforms. The Psion documentation
references Topspeed Compiler v3.10 and Environment v3.10.002, but I suspect
other versions may also work. Psion suggest it was released by Clarion, but
every other reference I can find suggests it was sold be a company called
"JPI".
I know others will probably provide more info, but you are mostly
correct. TopSpeed was originally sold and supported by (I believe)
JPI, but they bought Clarion many years ago. These days, Clarion is
the only remnants of the company. Clarion was originally the
purveyors of the Clarion Development System, a 4GL-like system for DOS
and (eventually) Windows. They merged with JPI to gain the compiler
technology of TopSpeed. I don't know if you can still get the
original compiler system from Clarion.
Disclaimer: I worked for Clarion back in 1987 or so, back before
TopSpeed and before they went into the world of Windows. I definitely
have a bias. :) They're idiots.
Mark
12:21 p.m.
New subject: WTD: Clarion/JPI TopSpeed C (for Psion SIBO SDK)
On Sun, Sep 19, 2010 at 2:17 PM, Mark Davidson <mdavidson1963 at gmail.com> wrote:
On Sun, Sep 19, 2010 at 6:31 AM, Philip Pemberton
<classiccmp at philpem.me.uk> wrote:
IIRC, most SIBO programming was done in OPL rather than in C. I'm not
sure how much better performance native C offers over OPL, but I'd
certain think it would be worth trying out before you go crazy looking
for some long-gone C compiler...
Anyways, congratulations on the Workabout. I wish that there were
still PDAs on the market that had the combo of super-readable screens,
excellent keyboards and long battery life that Psion had back in the
early 90s...
Mike
Hi guys,
As near as I can tell, this was a 16-bit 8086 C compiler which generated
code under (and for) MS-DOS type platforms. The Psion documentation
references Topspeed Compiler v3.10 and Environment v3.10.002, but I suspect
other versions may also work. Psion suggest it was released by Clarion, but
every other reference I can find suggests it was sold be a company called
"JPI".
I know others will probably provide more info, but you are mostly
correct. ?TopSpeed was originally sold and supported by (I believe)
JPI, but they bought Clarion many years ago. ?These days, Clarion is
the only remnants of the company. ?Clarion was originally the
purveyors of the Clarion Development System, a 4GL-like system for DOS
and (eventually) Windows. ?They merged with JPI to gain the compiler
technology of TopSpeed. ?I don't know if you can still get the
original compiler system from Clarion.
Disclaimer: ?I worked for Clarion back in 1987 or so, back before
TopSpeed and before they went into the world of Windows. ?I definitely
have a bias. :) ?They're idiots.
Mark
2:30 p.m.
New subject: WTD: Clarion/JPI TopSpeed C (for Psion SIBO SDK)
On 19/09/10 20:21, Michael Kerpan wrote:
IIRC, most SIBO programming was done in OPL rather
than in C. I'm not
sure how much better performance native C offers over OPL, but I'd
certain think it would be worth trying out before you go crazy looking
for some long-gone C compiler...
Yeah, the attraction of C was basically that I already know the
language, so I just have to learn the API. In theory, that shouldn't be
hard with all the Psion SDK docs and some example code to play with.
And I'm lazy. If I don't have to learn a new language, I won't :)
Oh, and the Sibo SDK should (in theory) produce code which would work on
my Acorn Pocketbook (the Mk1, not the Mk2, but I do have the serial
cable and PSU). Said machine does *not* have OPL... :(
Anyways, congratulations on the Workabout. I wish that
there were
still PDAs on the market that had the combo of super-readable screens,
excellent keyboards and long battery life that Psion had back in the
early 90s...
Heh, funny story. Another guy was arguing with the seller on price...
"I figure it's worth at least a tenner!"
"Are you mad, the batteries aren't charged. And there isn't even a
serial cable with it!"
At this point I spot the Psion badge and pick the thing up... and
realise what it is (in short: a Sibo organiser in a ruggedised case, but
with standard ports). Serial port is straight RS232, with a TTL port
next to it, IRDA on the bottom and a Psion LIF port next to that. Two AA
Nicads to run the organiser (Psion seem to like those) and a CR1620
Lithium to do RAM backup. At this point the other guy is still haggling.
I figured ten quid was worth it, even if it was only good for parts value...
"What about two quid?"
"That's a bloody insult!"
"I'll take it for a tenner."
"Bah, you're mad! It'll never work!"
The AAs were already on my shelf (I keep a few charged Eneloops and
several boxes of Duracell ProCell AAs and PP3s and Extralife Lithium
PP3s on standby for multimeters, clocks and TV remotes) and the CR1620s
didn't cost me a thing -- struck a deal with another seller for two 9Ah
12V VRLA batteries, and he threw in a pack of 1620s for free.
That and the CCTV cameras makes this a pretty fun day. Always wanted to
have a play with machine vision, now I have some cameras and just need a
few C or CS-mount lenses... (seriously, half a dozen cameras at 50p
each, there was no reason *not* to take the whole box).
Cheers,
--
Phil.
classiccmp at philpem.me.uk
http://www.philpem.me.uk/
20 Sep
20 Sep
1:24 p.m.
New subject: WTD: Clarion/JPI TopSpeed C (for Psion SIBO SDK)
That and the CCTV cameras makes this a pretty fun day.
Always wanted to
have a play with machine vision, now I have some cameras and just need a
few C or CS-mount lenses... (seriously, half a dozen cameras at 50p
each, there was no reason *not* to take the whole box).
That remoinds me... Some time back I bought a Sony portable video
recorder and camera. No, I don't mean a camcorder, this is 2 separate
units powered by a lead-acid battery pack. It's not a VCR either, it
uses reels of tape. Oh, it's monochrome only (EIAJ format on the tape,
thankfully). Anyway, I didn't pay much for it. Only later when I took the
bits out of the cardboard box did I find a couple of C-mount lenses in
the bottom. Kern-Paillard Switar lenses.... :-)
The only problem was, I didn't have an C mount lens caps. And they seem
to be very hard to get. In the end, I bought some brass rod and cut the
theads msyelf (32tpi is trivial to cut on a lathe with an 8 tpi leadscrew
:-)).
-tony
2:15 p.m.
New subject: WTD: Clarion/JPI TopSpeed C (for Psion SIBO SDK)
On Mon, 20 Sep 2010, Tony Duell wrote:
The only problem was, I didn't have an C mount
lens caps. And they seem
to be very hard to get. In the end, I bought some brass rod and cut the
theads msyelf (32tpi is trivial to cut on a lathe with an 8 tpi leadscrew
:-)).
If you are looking for C-mount rear lens caps, they are,
indeed hard to find.
BUT, eBay has a lot of cheap 5mm C-mount extension tubes
("C-mount to CS-mount adapter") Put a 1" diameter thin disk
(such as, or thinner than, a USA quarter) into one of the
extension tubes, and you have a C-mount rear lens cap,
or C-mount body cap
21 Sep
21 Sep
12:17 p.m.
New subject: WTD: Clarion/JPI TopSpeed C (for Psion SIBO SDK)
On Mon, 20 Sep 2010, Tony Duell wrote:
As of coures are body caps..
The only problem was, I didn't have an C
mount lens caps. And they seem
to be very hard to get. In the end, I bought some brass rod and cut the
theads msyelf (32tpi is trivial to cut on a lathe with an 8 tpi leadscrew
:-)).
If you are looking for C-mount rear lens caps, they are,
indeed hard to find. BUT, eBay has a lot of cheap 5mm C-mount extension
tubes
("C-mount to CS-mount adapter") Put a 1" diameter thin disk
(such as, or thinner than, a USA quarter) into one of the
extension tubes, and you have a C-mount rear lens cap,
or C-mount body cap
Neat... Probably whicher and cheaper than buying a length of 1.25" brass
rod, turning it to size, cutting yhe threads, etc. But not as much fun...
-tony
19 Sep
19 Sep
3:35 p.m.
New subject: WTD: Clarion/JPI TopSpeed C (for Psion SIBO SDK)
On 19/09/10 19:17, Mark Davidson wrote:
Clarion was originally the
purveyors of the Clarion Development System, a 4GL-like system for DOS
and (eventually) Windows.
Apparently good for databases and business apps. The British magazine
"PC Plus" put a demo version of Clarion on a CD a while ago (1996/1997
timeframe), and did a whole series of articles on how to use it.
Didn't seem to make it any more popular though. I always used Delphi and
the BDE for quick database apps, and C, newt (Erik Troan's windowing
toolkit) and one of the SQL engines (sqlite, mysql or postgres) for the
more advanced stuff.
They merged with JPI to gain the compiler
technology of TopSpeed. I don't know if you can still get the
original compiler system from Clarion.
It looks like you can still get Clarion, but TopSpeed C seems to be long
gone. Clarion now seems to be owned by SoftVelocity, who are advertising
the fact that it has a Modula-2 and C++ compiler in addition to Clarion
4GL, but there's no sign of a separate compiler option.
Website is http://www.softvelocity.com/Clarion/Clarion.htm for anyone
who cares...
Disclaimer: I worked for Clarion back in 1987 or so,
back before
TopSpeed and before they went into the world of Windows. I definitely
have a bias. :) They're idiots.
I could name a lot of software companies who could be described as
"idiots"....
--
Phil.
classiccmp at philpem.me.uk
http://www.philpem.me.uk/
4:43 p.m.
New subject: WTD: Clarion/JPI TopSpeed C (for Psion SIBO SDK)
On Sun, Sep 19, 2010 at 3:35 PM, Philip Pemberton
<classiccmp at philpem.me.uk> wrote:
SoftVelocity is the name of the merged company. The compilers are
only available to use with Clarion itself AFAIK.
On 19/09/10 19:17, Mark Davidson wrote:
That was one of the incredibly frustrating things about Clarion...
they had a pretty good product and yes, it was good for database and
business apps. However, they made some incredibly bad decisions, and
the company itself was full of unhappy people. Many people who used
Clarion loved Clarion.
I remember my 2nd day there... the team of developers I had joined
(there were 5 of us) spent the entire lunch telling me how much the
company sucked and how I had better like my salary because raises were
nonexistent. Nice, eh?
Clarion was originally the
purveyors of the Clarion Development System, a 4GL-like system for DOS
and (eventually) Windows.
Apparently good for databases and business apps. The British magazine "PC
Plus" put a demo version of Clarion on a CD a while ago (1996/1997
timeframe), and did a whole series of articles on how to use it. Didn't seem to make it any more popular though. I
always used Delphi and the
BDE for quick database apps, and C, newt (Erik Troan's windowing toolkit)
and one of the SQL engines (sqlite, mysql or postgres) for the more advanced
stuff.
No... they decided they wanted to compete with Ashton-Tate. They lost.
They merged
with JPI to gain the compiler
technology of TopSpeed. ?I don't know if you can still get the
original compiler system from Clarion.
It looks like you can still get Clarion, but TopSpeed C seems to be long
gone. Clarion now seems to be owned by SoftVelocity, who are advertising the
fact that it has a Modula-2 and C++ compiler in addition to Clarion 4GL, but
there's no sign of a separate compiler option. Website is
http://www.softvelocity.com/Clarion/Clarion.htm for anyone who
cares...
Oh, so could I. I just got out of there as fast as I could... it was
the shortest employment period of my life.
Mark
Disclaimer: ?I worked for Clarion back in 1987 or
so, back before
TopSpeed and before they went into the world of Windows. ?I definitely
have a bias. :) ?They're idiots.
I could name a lot of software companies who could be described as
"idiots"....
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ard＠p850ug1.demon.co.uk -
cisin＠xenosoft.com -
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madcrow.maxwell＠gmail.com -
mdavidson1963＠gmail.com