12 Aug
2007
12 Aug
'07
12:54 p.m.
I'm trying to recover data from an old Conner CFS420A (420MB) Hard
Drive for someone.
http://www.seagate.com/support/disc/specs/ata/cfs420a.html
I've tried hooking it up to my two IDE-to-USB cables, I can't see it
on my Mac when connected to either. I can see it on my WinXP system
when connected to the older cable (which oddly enough doesn't like
most HD's I've plugged into it). However, I don't see any sign of
partitions.
When I plugged it directly into the motherboard, the BIOS complained
and seemed to indicate 0MB.
Do modern PC's have a problem with really old HD's? I'm told that
either Win95 or Win98 was on the drive. Will a HD report info about
itself, even if it is dead?
Thanks,
Zane
--
| Zane H. Healy | UNIX Systems Administrator |
| healyzh at aracnet.com (primary) | OpenVMS Enthusiast |
| MONK::HEALYZH (DECnet) | Classic Computer Collector |
+----------------------------------+----------------------------+
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12 Aug
12 Aug
1:18 p.m.
On 12 Aug 2007 at 12:54, Zane H. Healy wrote:
I've tried hooking it up to my two IDE-to-USB
cables, I can't see it
on my Mac when connected to either. I can see it on my WinXP system
when connected to the older cable (which oddly enough doesn't like
most HD's I've plugged into it). However, I don't see any sign of
partitions.
I've got a couple of those drives and my PC's don't seem to have a
problem with it. Make sure you're using a 40 conductor IDE cable,
and not an 80 conductor one. Setting the transfer mode to PIO (Mode
0) might also help.
Assuming the drive spins up, it should at least respond to an
IDENTIFY command.
Cheers,
Chuck
9:23 p.m.
At 1:18 PM -0700 8/12/07, Chuck Guzis wrote:
I've got a couple of those drives and my PC's
don't seem to have a
problem with it. Make sure you're using a 40 conductor IDE cable,
and not an 80 conductor one. Setting the transfer mode to PIO (Mode
0) might also help.
Assuming the drive spins up, it should at least respond to an
IDENTIFY command.
I suspect it was this simple. I dug out a 40 conductor cable vs. the
80 conductor one in my new box, and plugged it into my old PC (easier
to plug the cable in, even with having to dig it out). Once the
system came up it saw the drive right off, and I've copied it to a
CD-R.
My thanks to everyone that replied!
Zane
--
| Zane H. Healy | UNIX Systems Administrator |
| healyzh at aracnet.com (primary) | OpenVMS Enthusiast |
| MONK::HEALYZH (DECnet) | Classic Computer Collector |
+----------------------------------+----------------------------+
| Empire of the Petal Throne and Traveller Role Playing, |
| PDP-10 Emulation and Zane's Computer Museum. |
| http://www.aracnet.com/~healyzh/ |
13 Aug
13 Aug
8:57 a.m.
At 11:23 PM 8/12/2007, Zane H. Healy wrote:
I suspect it was this simple. I dug out a 40 conductor
cable vs. the 80 conductor one in my new box, and plugged it into my old PC (easier to
plug the cable in, even with having to dig it out). Once the system came up it saw the
drive right off, and I've copied it to a CD-R.
Hmm. And heaven knows how these cheap USB to IDE adapters handle
the many permutations.
Wikipedia has a pretty good IDE/ATA breakdown:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Advanced_Technology_Attachment
Pin 34 tells whether it's a 40- or 80-conductor cable.
I don't remember any male-to-female IDE cables in my junkbox.
- John
10:41 a.m.
On 13 Aug 2007 at 10:57, John Foust wrote:
Pin 34 tells whether it's a 40- or 80-conductor
cable.
...And that's the nasty, ugly, thing about PATA cables. It's the
*cable* that indicates to the host that the drive is UDMA4-capable,
not the drive itself. You can't mix UDMA4 and non-UDMA4 drives on an
80-conductor cable; you must use a 40 conductor cable and operate
both drives as non-UDMA4 types.
Similarly, the spiffiest UDMA4 drive won't do the UDMA4 thing on a 40-
conductor cable and a non-UDMA4 drive will be driven as if were UDMA4-
capable with an 80-conductor cable, giving one nothing but grief.
I can recall getting complaints about one of our software packages
*creating* data errors on drives. It turned out that the system
owner was using an 80-conductor cable on a non-UDMA4 drive. The
setup worked just enough to lull him into thinking that everything
was cabled correctly. The outcome was that he blamed the software.
Cheers,
Chuck
12 Aug
12 Aug
1:27 p.m.
At 02:54 PM 8/12/2007, Zane H. Healy wrote:
I'm trying to recover data from an old Conner
CFS420A (420MB) Hard Drive for someone.
http://www.seagate.com/support/disc/specs/ata/cfs420a.html
I've tried hooking it up to my two IDE-to-USB cables, I can't see it on my Mac
when connected to either. I can see it on my WinXP system when connected to the older
cable (which oddly enough doesn't like most HD's I've plugged into it).
However, I don't see any sign of partitions. When I plugged it directly into the
motherboard, the BIOS complained and seemed to indicate 0MB. Do modern PC's have a
problem with really old HD's? I'm told that either Win95 or Win98 was on the
drive. Will a HD report info about itself, even if it is dead?
There's lots of possibilities, of course. The drive could be dead. I've used
at least three IDE to USB/Firewire adapters and it seems each acts a little
differently when it comes to older drives and older partitions, so don't expect
all levels of reporting to come up fine. It does sound like you're having more
luck when it's directly on the motherboard. Be sure the jumper on the drive
is set to "master" when on an adapter. Don't declare it dead until
you've
cold-booted with everything powered-up; sometimes I've found they don't
quite wake-up the way you'd hope.
Next, there's the issue of what's really on the drive. If you think it's
readable,
examine what's there in terms of partitions. The partition types may tell you more.
It might have DoubleSpace or any of that era's disk-expanders. It might have a
backup safety utility like GoBack in place. Either are odd enough that
any contemporary Mac or PC won't see a simple FAT or FAT32 partition, so
they'll give up without any useful error message.
There are a number of useful bootable CDs out there with collections of
tools for examining and imaging drives. The rule that "Sometimes you only
get one chance to read a drive" is always in my mind. Image it ASAP.
1996 is "really old"? :-)
- John
4:02 p.m.
Zane H. Healy wrote:
I've tried hooking it up to my two IDE-to-USB
cables, I can't see it on
my Mac when connected to either. I can see it on my WinXP system when
connected to the older cable (which oddly enough doesn't like most HD's
I've plugged into it). However, I don't see any sign of partitions.
What Chuck said. I have successfully connected IDE drives as small as
40MB to my Athlon 3200+ XP machine (vintage 2004) and they showed up
just fine.
If you're still having a problem, keep trying different cables,
computers, and operating systems.
When I plugged it directly into the motherboard, the
BIOS complained and
seemed to indicate 0MB.
I'd try a different computer just to be safe. Usually drives show up as
all or nothing, not "I'm here but 0 MB".
--
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Help our electronic games project: http://www.mobygames.com/
Or check out some trippy MindCandy at http://www.mindcandydvd.com/
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3:34 p.m.
When I plugged
it directly into the motherboard, the BIOS complained
and seemed to indicate 0MB.
I'd try a different computer just to be safe.
Usually drives show up
as all or nothing, not "I'm here but 0 MB". 
5:08 p.m.
Zane H. Healy wrote:
I've tried hooking it up to my two IDE-to-USB
cables, I can't see it on
my Mac when connected to either. I can see it on my WinXP system when
connected to the older cable (which oddly enough doesn't like most HD's
I've plugged into it). However, I don't see any sign of partitions.
The IDE-USB cables are probably expecting a drive that supports LBA...
OTOH, the PC's IDE controller should be able to handle the drive, unless it's
so old it doesn't support the ATA IDENTIFY command...
--
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classiccmp at philpem.me.uk | (='.'=) into your signature to help him gain
http://www.philpem.me.uk/ | (")_(") world domination.
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