St?phane Tsacas wrote: *boioioioioioioing!!* Peace... Sridhar

On Sunday, October 24, 2010, St?phane Tsacas wrote: wrote: That's as non-classic and nearly as interesting as my SGI Altix 4700. :) http://www.flickr.com/photos/vax-o-matic/sets/72157624868806325/ Pat -- Purdue University Research Computing --- http://www.rcac.purdue.edu/ The Computer Refuge --- http://computer-refuge.org

On Sun, 24 Oct 2010 09:11:06 -0500, Daniel Seagraves wrote: which IBM calls the LIC or Licensed Internal Code, is licensed only for the use of the original purchaser and only on the specific machine and configuration as IBM delivered it. Any other usage by any other party is unlicensed and illegal. Unless licensing arangements are made in advance by the origional owner! I have a client with an old AS400 (I will call System 1) who paid the end of lease buyout along with an additional licensing fee to keep their old system's licensing intact and "bound to the machine" when they upgraded to a new and much bigger system. The origional plan was to sell it to a third pary "friend in the businesss" after it served a few more years duity as part of a disaster recovery plan, and was moed to the data center of a second party. Years latter the third party no longer wants/needs it so there has been talk of putting it on eBay. In its case it is only the current application and associated data that needs to be scrubed before it moves on, not the OS. I agree these exceptions are rare, but they do exsist. All and Never are both constants not to be used lightly :) The client in question has done this with their last 3 AS400's all purchased new from IBM. I worked with leasing companies back in the System 370 days as a 3rd pary CE, there was quite a bit of transfering going on, the company I worked for specialized in it. Concidering the damage on this system I would expect this system to be Insurance Scrap rescued just this side of a crusher with no papers, the new owner would be prohibited from unlicensed comercial use. Fair use should premit a collector to play with it for their personal use. If it does in fact still run, then it is of interest to a number of collectors as a persional toy. Send the sheetmetal to a bodyshop and let them Bondo it up, or wait for a clean cabnet to come along. If they can rebuild a rusted wreck and made it look like new again, cleaning that rack and door up will be a piece of cake. It just takes TLC or a lot of money :) The other Bob

On Oct 24, 2010, at 10:29 AM, "Bob Bradlee" <caveguy at sbcglobal.net> wrote: I don't know where you got this idea. There is no such thing as Fair Use as far as software licenses are concerned. IBM has gone after people for running zOS on the Hercules emulator, they will definitely go after someone with real hardware. Especially a current machine. This is not some ancient retiree we are discussing, this is a z900 that you can still buy brand new.

On 10/24/10 12:14 PM, Eric Smith wrote: You still need the LIC to run Linux, and the LIC is what's tightly controlled. One can get operating systems pretty easily, but not LIC images. The z900 was withdrawn from marketing three or four years ago, which makes them pretty much "last years' model" in the mainframe world. They're still supported. -Dave -- Dave McGuire Port Charlotte, FL

On 10/24/10 12:20 PM, Bob Bradlee wrote: They always do. Have you guys really not seen recent IBM mainframes sell on eBay before? They come up (and sell) maybe half a dozen times per year. I personally have two sitting here, and I'm not even a hardcore mainframer. Certainly not the first, no. -Dave -- Dave McGuire Port Charlotte, FL

On Sunday, October 24, 2010, Daniel Seagraves wrote: <stephane.tsacas at gmail.com> wrote: This isn't true at all. The last time I read the license agreement that popped up booting my S/390's service element, it required you to transfer the LIC with the machine. It certainly didn't allow you to keep the LIC if you got rid of the machine, nor did it require you to destroy the copy of the LIC if you transferred the machine to someone else. Pat -- Purdue University Research Computing --- http://www.rcac.purdue.edu/ The Computer Refuge --- http://computer-refuge.org

This is not correct. I have this about the LIC code "Licensee may transfer possession of Machine Code and its media to another party only with the transfer of the Machine for which that Machine Code is authorized. In the event of such transfer, Licensee agrees to 1) destroy all of Licensee?s copies of that Machine Code that were not provided by IBM, 2) either provide to the other party all Licensee?s IBM-provided copies of Machine Code or destroy them, 3) provide to the other party a copy of this License Agreement, and 4) provide to the other party all user documentation. IBM licenses the other party to use Machine Code when that party accepts the terms of this License Agreement and is the rightful possessor of the associated Machine." In other words, any 'rightful possessor' can run the LIC, and the LIC has to go with the machine or be destroyed. Otherwise how could all the people who sell used mainframes operate?! The last sentences are my friend's comment. The OS's unless they are Linux may not be transferred which may be what you are thinking. IBM does not have police running around enforcing the rule on the OS images, but any entity with a license is on the hook for a lot of trouble if you don't erase an OS for them if you find it as well. On 10/24/2010 7:11 AM, Daniel Seagraves wrote:

The front door is pretty banged up, yes. This is a big, very thick, empty door that is intended as a not-easily-blockable air intake, more ductwork than door. These are made of relatively thin sheet metal so they're easily damaged, especially by warehouse grunts who are under the impression that any computer that's not a Windows PC (rapidly becoming "Windows laptop") is "old garbage" and therefore worthless, and they bang them around. -Dave On 10/24/10 10:44 AM, SPC wrote: -- Dave McGuire Port Charlotte, FL