29 Aug
1997
29 Aug
'97
2:39 a.m.
At 07:58 28-08-97 -0800, you wrote:
<whew!> That, at least, is something... for a while, I thought I had
pestered you to death or some silly thing... ;-)
Tim or
Allison, I could really use your help. Tim, I think something in
the mail system may be preventing my messages from reaching you.
That might be. I see your messages here on classiccmp, at least... OK, one last attempt with VMS EXCHANGE:
<snip>
Thank you! It all worked, and I now have the necessary files unZIPped onto
the MicroVAX.
Now the next hurdle; Ever since I installed OpenVMS 6.2, my second TK50
has disappeared. The device scan, at initial boot, won't even detect it.
Hardware setup is:
KA630 CPU, v. 1.3 firmware
16 MB memory
M3104 8-port serial MUX
DELQA Ethernet card (M7516YA)
RQDX3 (M7555), two RD54's and an RX50
Two TK50 drives/controllers (M7546)
RRD40 CD-ROM controller (M7552)
The Really Odd Thing is that it worked before, under MicroVMS 4.6, but now
it won't even work with that. I suspect, though I've not confirmed it yet,
that it may have to do with:
1). The fact that I've added a CD-ROM controller (appears as DUB0:)...
2). The order that I've got boards plugged into the backplane (BA123 box).
Tonight, I will try transposing the positions of the two TK50 controllers
I have. I will also try jumpering the suspect controller as the primary and
removing the RRD40's board.
Any suggestions would be welcome. As mentioned, I find it interesting that
two TK50's worked under MicroVMS 4.6, then suddenly stopped working under 6.2.
Do I need to use SYSGEN, perhaps, after the fact? If so, what string do I
feed it? (low on docs again!)
For comparison/test purposes, I'm going to CC this to the CLASSICCMP
mailing list as well as your return address. Whichever one you see first
will tell me if there really is a problem with the mail system.
CLASSICCMP users, my apologies. Please bear with me until I can figure out
what's been going weird with mail to Tim's site.
Thanks in advance!
-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
Bruce Lane, Sysop, The Dragon's Cave BBS (Fidonet 1:343/272)
(Hamateur: WD6EOS) (E-mail: kyrrin2(a)wizards.net)
http://www.wizards.net/technoid
"Our science can only describe an object, event, or living thing in our own
human terms. It cannot, in any way, define any of them..."
29 Aug
29 Aug
3:49 a.m.
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4 Sep
4 Sep
6:35 a.m.
New subject: DEC Scrounging & SWTPC 6800 Update
First, the SWTPC is getting closer and closer to being available online.
I'm waiting for a memory board and some documentation to help me locate
a little flakiness it sometimes has and need to do some work to correct
same.
Second, I went and checked out the PDP-11 I mentioned in my web pages
and I'll be picking it up next week! It's a PDP-11/84 with 32 serial
ports, an RA-80 disk, a TU-80 tape drive, RSX-11M on the RA-80 and on
tape, full RSX documentation set, a Tektronix display (forgot the model
darnit) and ...AND a Hayes 1200! =-)
It's been a few years since I've worked on an 11...the last being an 11/73
and an 11/44 so once I refamiliarize myself with this beast and figure out
which house circuit I can connect it to without popping breakers =-) it'll
be placed on the net for access on a limited, scheduled basis...like 2 hours
a day probably. An 11/84 CPU alone apparently pulls 1100 watts and the
RA-80 and TU-80 PROBABLY (maybe more) pull the same so, if I don't run the
TU-80 all the time and assuming that's ok with the CPU which it SHOULD be,
I'll pull roughly 2 kilowatthours every hour! Woo hoo! The local rate
is about 8 or 9 cents per kwhr so that means it'd cost me 16-18 cents
per hour of operation if running current is actually 1100watts or so for
each of the 11/84 and the RA-80. (Hmmm...wonder if that's startup (IE max)
or running draw?) I always loved watching the lights dim when I powered
up my 11/34!
Basically, I can run it whatever amount of time does not consume more than
$10 of power per month.
Now for my request, if anyone has schematics or technical drawings of this
machine or the peripherals I've mentioned, they would be greatly appreciated.
We can work a trade, or compensation or something.
Thanks...
Anthony Clifton - WireHead Prime
7:02 a.m.
New subject: IBM 5100!
I met a friend of mine whom I hadn't seen in several years last night. We
got to talking and I found out she had thrown out an IBM 5110 system a while
ago <sigh>. BUT she still had the 5100 and I picked it up this morning. It
consists of the 5100, a tape unit, printer, and monitor. They will be
looking around for any documentation as it used to be kept with the
machine. In the mean time, does anyone know anything about how to start up
this thing? I doubt I'll have problems with plugging everything together,
but after I throw the power on switch, what happens then? Thanks.
8:10 a.m.
New subject: DEC Scrounging & SWTPC 6800 Update
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8:23 a.m.
New subject: DEC Scrounging & SWTPC 6800 Update
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9:21 a.m.
New subject: DEC Scrounging & SWTPC 6800 Update
(BTW, I'm going to leave this thread public because I think it might
be of interest to collectors new to the PDP series and who might run
across machines like this.)
Well the backplane looked about half full roughly. So this is sounding
a bit more hopeful. I have $10 a month to spend on this machine for
electricity at about 8 cents per kilowatt hour so....
Sheesh. I guess that's true...the print set for my old 34 was several
'books' of many pages a piece if I recall correctly. Ummm...if anyone
has the print set for an 11/84 they'd like to go to a good home then
let me know. =-) (If not, I'll probably run across one one of these
days.)
The machine DOES work apparently and the guy who operated it showed it to
me today. He claims that it worked fine when they shut it down 2 years
ago (yeah yeah I know) and it's just been sitting in the corner since
then. He claims that if I plugged it in, which I didn't have an
opportunity to do, it would come right up into RSX. We'll see after
next week. One other obstacle is that it all has the funky twisty safety
plugs on the AC cords but it's configured for 125 v etc so I'll replace
the plugs, like I did on my 34, with high quality normal ones.
Anthony Clifton - WireHead Prime
An 11/84 CPU
alone apparently pulls 1100 watts
A *fully-loaded* 10.5" 11/84 box will pull 1100 watts. A very much
reduced configuration - just a CPU, memory, and (non KDA50) disk controller
- will only draw 100 watts or so.
I believe the spec for the RA-80 spinup surge current
is 40 Amps. While
running, it's probably about 7 amps.
I didn't have ALOT of time to look the machine over but I did look in the
back of the cabinet containing the TU80 and the RA80 and saw a sticker
that said "30 amps" which I ASSUMED referred to the RA80. I only ever
owned RL and RK series drives when I was collecting PDPs in the early
90s...what are the size etc specs on the RA80? A friend of mine and I
built an 11/34 system with 2 or 3 RK series drives and an older model
DEC 9 track drive. So I'm not completely ignorant but I'm still getting
used to the CURRENT state of the art in throwaway PDPs.
A TU80 doesn't take much; about 50 watts with
power off, and less than
200 watts with the blower and reels running.
Aha! This IS sounding alot more hopeful. Basically, if I could come up
with a controller to drive modern SCSI drives or something a bit less
power hungry, I could probably afford to run this guy at least all weekend
every weekend or something like that. Hmmm...I wonder if there's any
market for converting 9 track media to more modern forms? It'd only
take $60.00 a month, with modern drives, to run the beastie 24 hours...
perhaps less. =-)
(presumably) is in the 11/84 will also talk to
RA7n's and RA9n's. With
a Emulex/CMD/Dilog ESDI or SCSI controller in the box, you can even hook
up perfectly modern 3.5" hard drives.
Hmmmm...what's strange is that they claim they upgraded the drive around
two years ago. Upgrading TO an RA80 seems a bit strange in 1995. But the
front of the drive said RA80 so....
Now for my
request, if anyone has schematics or technical drawings of this
What do you specifically need? A print set for a complete configuration
is several hundred 11x17" sheets... 
10:07 a.m.
New subject: DEC Scrounging & SWTPC 6800 Update
I believe the
spec for the RA-80 spinup surge current is 40 Amps. While
running, it's probably about 7 amps.
I didn't have ALOT of time to look the machine over but I did look in the
back of the cabinet containing the TU80 and the RA80 and saw a sticker
that said "30 amps" which I ASSUMED referred to the RA80. One other obstacle is that it all has the funky twisty
safety
plugs on the AC cords but it's configured for 125 v etc so I'll replace
the plugs, like I did on my 34, with high quality normal ones.
Why not just install a normal Twist-Loc? They can be expensive, but I
have had decent luck finding them at hamfests for pocket change.
One note: many Twist-Locs are isolated ground types (look for a little
triangle), so be sure to provide a suitable ground wire - the socket does
not provide the connection.
William Donzelli
william(a)ans.net
10:30 a.m.
New subject: DEC Scrounging & SWTPC 6800 Update
lasts for a fraction of a second, and properly done
wiring with breakers
or slow-blow fuses can handle the extra current. The heating effect on the
wires is very minor.
And probably doesn't last long enough to matter.
I'm probably going to take Tim's advice and work on switching to SCSI
drives. It sure would be amusing to have a 4' rack (which to most folks
is a monster) with tiny little SCSI drives sitting on top. =-) Come to
think of it...and this is a vague recollection...I seem to recall at the
job I had in '88 programming DIBOL on an 11/44 that the 44 had an
arrangement like that. With little 5 1/4" drives on top. Hmmmmm....
Why not just install a normal Twist-Loc? They can be
expensive, but I
have had decent luck finding them at hamfests for pocket change.
One note: many Twist-Locs are isolated ground types (look for a little
triangle), so be sure to provide a suitable ground wire - the socket does
not provide the connection.
As I mentioned to Tim a buddy of mine is an industrial electrician so I
might have him just come in and make things happy and good. =-)
BTW, what is the objection that you and Tim seem to have to just
switching to normal 3 prong plugs, other than that they can fall out?
Just curious if there's other reasons not trying to be argumentative.
Anthony Clifton - WireHead Prime
11:56 a.m.
New subject: DEC Scrounging & SWTPC 6800 Update
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11:23 a.m.
New subject: DEC Scrounging & SWTPC 6800 Update
BTW, what is
the objection that you and Tim seem to have to just
switching to normal 3 prong plugs, other than that they can fall out?
I have to admit, since my initial measurements, I've reconfigured several
of my systems without measuring the final total current draw. That's
OK for me to do, but nobody else should do that :-)
12:40 p.m.
New subject: DEC Scrounging & SWTPC 6800 Update
As I mentioned to Tim a buddy of mine is an industrial
electrician so I
might have him just come in and make things happy and good. =-)
BTW, what is the objection that you and Tim seem to have to just
switching to normal 3 prong plugs, other than that they can fall out?
Just curious if there's other reasons not trying to be argumentative.
I have kicked one too many plugs out of the wall...
Also, you can run the line on the ceiling and use drops to the machines -
great for computers in the middle of the room.
William Donzelli
william(a)ans.net
10:42 a.m.
New subject: DEC Scrounging & SWTPC 6800 Update
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10:23 a.m.
New subject: DEC Scrounging & SWTPC 6800 Update
Not a problem - give your credit card number to CMD
and you can have
a Unibus SCSI controller tomorrow.
I should probably ask them for a price first. ;-D Perhaps I'll try my
hand at locating a used controller first although I know THAT isn't exactly
a walk in the park.
Upgrading to RA80's two years ago was a mistake,
if that is indeed the case!
Of course, it's also possible there is a much modern drive buried in the
cabinet somewhere - you wouldn't notice it. Heck, the power plug on
the RA80/TU80 power controller is larger and heavier than many
modern SCSI drives.
Before moving it, make sure you lock the heads on the RA80.
Oops. I've only owned RL02s and RK07s before. How does one lock the heads
on the RA80? Guess that'd be useful to know. :-/ I've used machines in
the past that HAD RA80s but I never had a reason to know how to lock the
heads.
My preferred way for dealing with this part is to
install Hubbel Twist-n-
Lock jacks in the computer room! Bring in some 3-phase, while you're at
it, and you'll be set for RP06's, too.
Buddy of mine is an electrician. Twistnlock jacks aren't a problem.
Bringing in three-phase is a bit beyond my budget right now but I am
considering upgrading the service to my house on general principle
when I can better afford to do so. =-)
Anthony
9971
days inactive
9977
days old
13 comments
5 participants
participants (5)
-
kyrrin2＠wizards.net -
marvin＠rain.org -
shoppa＠alph02.triumf.ca -
william＠ans.net -
wirehead＠retrocomputing.com