11 Nov
2015
11 Nov
'15
1:57 p.m.
I recently got a NeXTstation Turbo running NeXTSTEP 3.3 (with patch 2
applied). It's a fresh install, and I have a complete set of floppies and
disks, including the development CD. The system seems to be working great!
I've burned a CD with OmniWeb 2.7 beta 3 and untar'ed it on the system.
Unfortunately, when I try to open an HTML document, it briefly comes up
with the browser window, then crashes. You can find OmniWeb here:
http://files.omnigroup.com/software/Archive/NEXTSTEP/OmniWeb/
I'm not all too familiar with NeXTSTEP, so I'm not sure how I'd go about
debugging this. But I figured I'd check here first to see if anyone has a
recommended browser for NeXTSTEP 3.3. I would prefer to keep it at 3.3 and
not move onto OPENSTEP if possible, just to keep things original.
I also have Nexus, but I can't even seem to get it to open its browser at
all. Document -> Open does nothing at all. Any ideas?
Thanks,
Kyle
11 Nov
11 Nov
2:35 p.m.
What document did you try to open?
I've never used OmniWeb or Nexis, but my experience with Mosaic and early
Netscape versions makes me think you'd have a hard time getting modern
pages to load without crashing.
I should think that Lynx or the original Line Mode browser would be OK.
http://www.nextcomputers.org/NeXTfiles/Software/NEXTSTEP/Apps/Internet/WWW/…
-Tom
On 11 November 2015 at 18:57, Kyle Owen <kylevowen at gmail.com> wrote:
I recently got a NeXTstation Turbo running NeXTSTEP
3.3 (with patch 2
applied). It's a fresh install, and I have a complete set of floppies and
disks, including the development CD. The system seems to be working great!
I've burned a CD with OmniWeb 2.7 beta 3 and untar'ed it on the system.
Unfortunately, when I try to open an HTML document, it briefly comes up
with the browser window, then crashes. You can find OmniWeb here:
http://files.omnigroup.com/software/Archive/NEXTSTEP/OmniWeb/
I'm not all too familiar with NeXTSTEP, so I'm not sure how I'd go about
debugging this. But I figured I'd check here first to see if anyone has a
recommended browser for NeXTSTEP 3.3. I would prefer to keep it at 3.3 and
not move onto OPENSTEP if possible, just to keep things original.
I also have Nexus, but I can't even seem to get it to open its browser at
all. Document -> Open does nothing at all. Any ideas?
Thanks,
Kyle
3:03 p.m.
On Wed, Nov 11, 2015 at 1:35 PM, Tom Moss <tomjmoss at googlemail.com> wrote:
What document did you try to open?
Trying to open /NextApps/Nexus.app/default.html or help.html, or
/NextApps/OmniWeb.app/English.lproj/Start.html.
I've never used OmniWeb or Nexis, but my
experience with Mosaic and early
Netscape versions makes me think you'd have a hard time getting modern
pages to load without crashing.
Not yet connected to the Internet. Hope to get it connected up soon.
I should think that Lynx or the original Line Mode browser would be OK.
Hoping to get something a little more than Lynx or line mode, but at this
point, I'll take what I can get that works!
On Wed, Nov 11, 2015 at 1:42 PM, Tapley, Mark <mtapley at swri.edu> wrote:
Congratulations on the cool new system!
I have OmniWeb running on my non-turbo cube. It occasionally
crashes, but leaves the system up, and most sessions I get through with no
trouble. I?ll check version number tonight and update you.
How much memory is in your system?
How much disk space left?
There is a distributed.net client - you can be the second NeXT
contributing to RC5-72:
http://www.distributed.net
http://www.distributed.net/Download
But obviously, we need to get your browser playing first.
Thanks Mark! My system has 48 MB and around 650 MB left on the 1 GB HDD.
Excited about the possibility of contributing to RC5-72! I'll have to hook
up my less-than-good monitor if I'm going to leave it running for long
periods of time. Maybe I'll install a switch in there to turn off the
filament in the CRT when not in use. :)
On Wed, Nov 11, 2015 at 1:43 PM, Chris Osborn <fozztexx at fozztexx.com> wrote:
If you need a replacement icon for it, I made some a long time ago:
http://i.imgur.com/EKNAukO.png
Those are awesome! Nice work. I'll be posting to /r/retrobattlestations
soon, by the way...maybe as soon as I can load retro.hackaday.com or the
like.
Kyle
6:14 p.m.
On Nov 11, 2015, at 2:03 PM, Kyle Owen <kylevowen at gmail.com> wrote:
Not yet connected to the Internet. Hope to get it
connected up soon.
on my machine:
mtapley2> /usr/etc/ifconfig -a
en0: flags=63<UP,BROADCAST,NOTRAILERS,RUNNING>
inet 129.162.151.119 netmask ffffff80 broadcast 129.162.151.126
lo0: flags=869<UP,LOOPBACK,NOTRAILERS,RUNNING>
inet 127.0.0.1 netmask ff000000
don?t know if that helps, let me know what else will help. Ethernet plugs in and the
standard instructions at
/NextLibrary/Documentation/NextAdmin/03_SetUpNet.rtfd/
for setting up static IP addresses, while somewhat arcane, worked for me.
(Sure hope they mean, ? ."rich text format document". That would be more polite
than what I fear?.)
I?m running version 2.7 beta 3 according to the splash screen that comes up in response to
?info?.
Thanks Mark! My system has 48 MB and around 650 MB
left on the 1 GB HDD.
Neither of those sound like a problem. Mine has 64 MB but much less iron oxide left.
Excited about the possibility of contributing to
RC5-72! I'll have to hook
up my less-than-good monitor if I'm going to leave it running for long
periods of time. Maybe I'll install a switch in there to turn off the
filament in the CRT when not in use. :)
That would be cool; I have run out my monitor twice (both times, vertical scan collapsed
and I switched to a backup monitor; once, shotgunning all capacitors fixed it, but I have
yet to do that the second time) (Sorry Tony, time and brains both lacking here to do the
job right :-) ).
At the moment, I?m running a backup megapixel display on the Cube board and a Sun 15?
color monitor on the NextDimension. Windows slide nicely from one to the other, but it
does slow things down a little to run that way.
However, if speed were the issue, the system would be in trouble; lots of screen real
estate is one way it can still compete with my laptop!
On Wed, Nov 11, 2015 at 1:43 PM, Chris Osborn
<fozztexx at fozztexx.com> wrote:
>
> If you need a replacement icon for it, I made some a long time ago:
>
> http://i.imgur.com/EKNAukO.png
>
Hee hee! Yeah, it?s an education in patience, as blazing fast as it was on introduction.
6:45 p.m.
On Wed, Nov 11, 2015 at 5:14 PM, Tapley, Mark <mtapley at swri.edu> wrote:
for setting up static IP addresses, while somewhat arcane, worked for me.
(Sure hope they mean, ? ."rich text format document". That would be more
polite than what I fear?.)
Hah! Thanks for the tips. Main issue is getting network services here at
the university to give me an IP address. I'm going to take it home tonight
and try there in the mean time.
I?m running version 2.7 beta 3 according to the splash screen that comes up
in response to ?info?.
Good to know. Thanks for the confirmation! And you're running NeXTSTEP 3.3,
correct?
Neither of those sound like a problem. Mine has 64 MB but much less iron
oxide left.
Hope to get some more RAM in mine at some point, but I'll stick with what
I've got for now. Happy to have that 1 GB drive with plenty of free space,
though. Admittedly, it's a fresh install, so that's a good reason I've got
less than half used.
That would be cool; I have run out my monitor twice (both times, vertical
scan collapsed and I switched to a backup monitor;
once, shotgunning all
capacitors fixed it, but I have yet to do that the second time) (Sorry
Tony, time and brains both lacking here to do the job right :-) ).
At the moment, I?m running a backup megapixel display on the Cube board
and a Sun 15? color monitor on the NextDimension. Windows slide nicely from
one to the other, but it does slow things down a little to run that way.
However, if speed were the issue, the system would be in trouble; lots of
screen real estate is one way it can still compete with my laptop!
The two MegaPixel displays I have are both functional with some burn in,
but they still seem pretty bright. However, one has a very apparent warble,
but it was getting better after leaving it on for a while. I'm sure it had
been a long time since it was powered up.
Thanks,
Kyle
9:50 p.m.
On Nov 11, 2015, at 5:45 PM, Kyle Owen <kylevowen at gmail.com> wrote:
Good to know. Thanks for the confirmation! And
you're running NeXTSTEP 3.3,
correct?
Correct.
The two MegaPixel displays I have are both functional
with some burn in,
but they still seem pretty bright. However, one has a very apparent warble,
but it was getting better after leaving it on for a while. I'm sure it had
been a long time since it was powered up.
Mine looked unusably fuzzy when first turned on. I sighed and left it on, and it has
?cleaned up? remarkably. I?m somewhat curious what causes that. Warble wasn?t much of a
problem, but it seems pretty solid now.
You know about the Lighthouse Design suite of applications, right? Presentation,
spreadsheet, word processor, drawing program, etc.
http://download.ithinksw.com/lighthouse/
Don?t forget the license strings.
I?m also very partial to WriteNow, if you are able to find a copy of it.
Licensing will be a *real* issue, but a version of Mathematica 3 will also run on that
system. No idea where you could possibly find a copy of that, but it?s pretty cool and
remarkably capable.
Mouse wrote:
I don't know if it's related, but that's a
very peculiar broadcast
address for that address-and-netmask. (I'd expect to see 127 in the
last octet, rather than 126.)
That is good to know. I mucked around a long time before I finally .rtfd?d ( :-) ) and
may have left something in a non-standard state.
I can ftp, telnet, ssh, etc to the machine and from it using IP addresses; I have not
tried using machine names. I can surf using Omniweb when I have something else to do while
it loads, and routinely hit the Dilbert Zone, Distributed.net websites, etc.. The
distributed net client successfully gets new work units, except that when I ssh (as
opposed to telnet, which works) into the machine and request an update, it sometimes
?goes wild? and tries to download a near-infinite (until I open another terminal session
and kill the distributed net job) number of work units.
Should I try to fix that broadcast address? Or maybe, ask my IT guys whether it should be
that way?
11:49 p.m.
On Wed, Nov 11, 2015 at 8:50 PM, Tapley, Mark <mtapley at swri.edu> wrote:
You know about the Lighthouse Design suite of applications, right?
Presentation, spreadsheet, word processor, drawing program, etc.
http://download.ithinksw.com/lighthouse/
Don?t forget the license strings.
No, but thanks! Looks like good stuff. I've got NeXTTeX installed on here,
but without a lot of the LaTeX extensions, I'm feeling a little
underwhelmed with its capabilities. :)
I was able to get it online here at the house. Minimal configuration
required, thankfully. In fact, technically it's running wireless; I've got
a nice little WiFi client/bridge/AP that gives me an Ethernet jack from my
wireless router, all through the aether.
I've installed ssh from here: http://nleymann.de/Nextstep/ and it looks
like it works! Now I'd like to see if I can get an X server running. I see
mention of Xnext on a slashdot page, but the link is dead, and archive.org
failed to capture the whole site.
Also trying to get SSL working better with OmniWeb. I still can't go to
Gmail from it as it's complaining about cookie issues, and other sites,
like reddit.com, fail to load altogether. :(
This has been one of the best resources so far for new software to play
with: http://www.nextcomputers.org/NeXTfiles/
Thanks again for the tips, and I look forward to getting distributed.net
running soon!
Kyle
12 Nov
12 Nov
12:06 p.m.
On 12 November 2015 at 04:49, Kyle Owen <kylevowen at gmail.com> wrote:
Also trying to get SSL working better with OmniWeb. I still can't go to
Gmail from it as it's complaining about cookie issues, and other sites,
like reddit.com, fail to load altogether. :(
Does OmniWeb support using a web proxy - if so you might find it
easier to setup a proxy on another box on your local net and have it
handle all the SSL (faster too :-p)
12:33 p.m.
On Thu, Nov 12, 2015 at 11:06 AM, David Brownlee <abs at absd.org> wrote:
Does OmniWeb support using a web proxy - if so you
might find it
easier to setup a proxy on another box on your local net and have it
handle all the SSL (faster too :-p)
Good question; I'll have to look into that tonight!
Here's some photographic documentation of my progress to date:
http://imgur.com/a/ht2G3
Kyle
12:38 p.m.
On 2015-11-11 11:49 PM, Kyle Owen wrote:
On Wed, Nov 11, 2015 at 8:50 PM, Tapley, Mark
<mtapley at swri.edu> wrote:
A complete TeX distribution should be well within the reach of NeXT (and
there are no real obstacles to a port). I ran it on much smaller
hardware even before NEXTSTEP 3.3 was current.
You know about the Lighthouse Design suite of applications, right?
Presentation, spreadsheet, word processor, drawing program, etc.
http://download.ithinksw.com/lighthouse/
Don?t forget the license strings.
No, but thanks! Looks like good stuff. I've got NeXTTeX installed on here,
but without a lot of the LaTeX extensions, I'm feeling a little
underwhelmed with its capabilities. :)
I was able to get it online here at the house. ...
Also trying to get SSL working better with OmniWeb. I still can't go to
Gmail from it as it's complaining about cookie issues, and other sites,
like reddit.com, fail to load altogether. :(
Gmail is a bit optimistic, or are you only aiming at "basic HTML"?[1]
Many sites no longer support browsers that are only a few years old
(e.g. GitHub, which says it only supports "current versions" of even
very modern browsers).
I expect you'll have a lot of problems with public SSL, as ciphers, key
sizes, trust chain are all rapidly moving targets.
--Toby
Cube/slab owner
[1] "In general, Gmail supports the current and prior major release of
Chrome, Firefox, Internet Explorer and Safari."
https://support.google.com/mail/answer/6557?hl=en
This has been one of the best resources so far for new software to play
with: http://www.nextcomputers.org/NeXTfiles/
Thanks again for the tips, and I look forward to getting distributed.net
running soon!
Kyle
12:45 p.m.
On 11/11/15 6:50 PM, Tapley, Mark wrote:
On Nov 11, 2015, at 5:45 PM, Kyle Owen <kylevowen
at gmail.com> wrote:
I no longer have NeXT hardware, but have a few applications with
licenses. Two are different versions of Design! from Lighthouse Design
and are on the website above. Two (Collagist and StayInTouch) are from
SmartSoft and I have not found them anywhere else. The SmartSoft web
page on their NeXT applications was last updated in 1995 and they
haven't responded to my e-mail asking about the license.
I have tried to sell then give these applications away on the NeXT
forums and got no takers.
Good to know. Thanks for the confirmation! And
you're running NeXTSTEP 3.3,
correct?
Correct.
The two MegaPixel displays I have are both
functional with some burn in,
but they still seem pretty bright. However, one has a very apparent warble,
but it was getting better after leaving it on for a while. I'm sure it had
been a long time since it was powered up.
Mine looked unusably fuzzy when first
turned on. I sighed and left it on, and it has ?cleaned up? remarkably. I?m somewhat
curious what causes that. Warble wasn?t much of a problem, but it seems pretty solid now.
You know about the Lighthouse Design suite of applications, right? Presentation,
spreadsheet, word processor, drawing program, etc.
http://download.ithinksw.com/lighthouse/
Don?t forget the license strings.
I?m also very partial to WriteNow, if you are able to find a copy of it.
Licensing will be a *real* issue, but a version of Mathematica 3 will also run on that
system. No idea where you could possibly find a copy of that, but it?s pretty cool and
remarkably capable.
Licensing for Mathematica is stupid. Wolfram still wants money for
25-year-old software that runs on long unsupported hardware.
On a related topic, is there a browser that runs on Openstep 4.2 on
SPARC now? OmniWeb reports that its license is expired and exits on my
system.
alan
1:15 p.m.
On 2015-11-12 12:45 PM, Alan Perry wrote:
Has Wolfram ever done ANYTHING that wasn't predatory, unhelpful and
self-serving?
That said, I own a Mma 3.3 license for NEXTSTEP and it does work.
--Toby
On 11/11/15 6:50 PM, Tapley, Mark wrote:
> ...
> [not sure who wrote]
Licensing will
be a *real* issue, but a version of Mathematica 3 will
also run on that system. No idea where you could possibly find a copy
of that, but it?s pretty cool and remarkably capable.
Licensing for Mathematica is stupid. Wolfram still wants money for
25-year-old software that runs on long unsupported hardware.
On a related topic, is there a browser that runs on Openstep 4.2 on
SPARC now? OmniWeb reports that its license is expired and exits on my
system.
alan
3:05 p.m.
>> The two MegaPixel displays I have are both
functional with some burn in,
>> but they still seem pretty bright. However, one has a very apparent
>> warble,
>> but it was getting better after leaving it on for a while. I'm sure it had
>> been a long time since it was powered up.
Replace all of the electrolytic capacitors in the monitor. The ESR
changes when they warm up. Be careful, could be high voltage if it wasn't
designed to bleed down the charge in the tube.
I'm curious if CRT tube rejuvination would work on bad megapixel displays.
--
Ethan O'Toole
11 Nov
11 Nov
7:21 p.m.
mtapley2> /usr/etc/ifconfig -a
en0: flags=63<UP,BROADCAST,NOTRAILERS,RUNNING>
inet 129.162.151.119 netmask ffffff80 broadcast 129.162.151.126
I don't know if it's related, but that's a very peculiar broadcast
address for that address-and-netmask. (I'd expect to see 127 in the
last octet, rather than 126.)
/~\ The ASCII Mouse
\ / Ribbon Campaign
X Against HTML mouse at rodents-montreal.org
/ \ Email! 7D C8 61 52 5D E7 2D 39 4E F1 31 3E E8 B3 27 4B
2:42 p.m.
On Nov 11, 2015, at 12:57 PM, Kyle Owen <kylevowen at gmail.com> wrote:
I recently got a NeXTstation Turbo running NeXTSTEP
3.3 (with patch 2
applied). It's a fresh install, and I have a complete set of floppies and
disks, including the development CD. The system seems to be working great!
I've burned a CD with OmniWeb 2.7 beta 3 and untar'ed it on the system.
Unfortunately, when I try to open an HTML document, it briefly comes up
with the browser window, then crashes. You can find OmniWeb here:
http://files.omnigroup.com/software/Archive/NEXTSTEP/OmniWeb/
I'm not all too familiar with NeXTSTEP, so I'm not sure how I'd go about
debugging this. But I figured I'd check here first to see if anyone has a
recommended browser for NeXTSTEP 3.3. I would prefer to keep it at 3.3 and
not move onto OPENSTEP if possible, just to keep things original.
I also have Nexus, but I can't even seem to get it to open its browser at
all. Document -> Open does nothing at all. Any ideas?
Thanks,
Kyle
Kyle,
Congratulations on the cool new system!
I have OmniWeb running on my non-turbo cube. It occasionally crashes, but leaves the
system up, and most sessions I get through with no trouble. I?ll check version number
tonight and update you.
How much memory is in your system?
How much disk space left?
There is a distributed.net client - you can be the second NeXT contributing to RC5-72:
http://www.distributed.net
http://www.distributed.net/Download
But obviously, we need to get your browser playing first.
- Mark
2:43 p.m.
On Nov 11, 2015, at 10:57 AM, Kyle Owen <kylevowen at gmail.com> wrote:
I've burned a CD with OmniWeb
If you need a replacement icon for it, I made some a long time ago:
http://i.imgur.com/EKNAukO.png
--
Follow me on twitter: @FozzTexx
Check out my blog: http://insentricity.com
3152
days inactive
3153
days old
15 comments
9 participants
participants (9)
-
abs＠absd.org -
aperry＠snowmoose.com -
ethan＠757.org -
fozztexx＠fozztexx.com -
kylevowen＠gmail.com -
mouse＠Rodents-Montreal.ORG -
mtapley＠swri.edu -
toby＠telegraphics.com.au -
tomjmoss＠googlemail.com