9 Apr
2015
9 Apr
'15
8:07 a.m.
From: Pete Turnbull
> Technically, that's an 11/83 CPU...
Nope, it's only 15MHz ... and the MSV11-Q memory
isn't PMI, so it's an
11/73.
A discussion as to whether the addition of second board can change a first
board from an A to a B would I suspect be non-productive, so I will pass over
that point. :-)
One thing that I am curious about is the 15MHz aspect: what did DEC (if you
recall) call a 15MHz M8190 paired with PMI memory? (Recalling our prior
discussion, which I am too lazy to look up and give a pointer to, about how
all the M8190's can apparently do PMI.) Did they (or would they) have
regarded that as an 11/83, or did only the 18MHz version get the 11/83
moniker? (Too many different configurations - 15/18, PMI/non-PMI - and not
enough names!)
Noel
9 Apr
9 Apr
8:50 a.m.
Noel Chiappa wrote:
Don't know.
..but I have an ex - 15Mhz M8190 with FPU here, put a newer J11 (-008)
on it, changed the xtal und use it with PMI memory as an 11/83.
Tested it with xxdp,rt11 and 2.11BSD over a long time, no problems at all.
Regards,
Holm
--
Technik Service u. Handel Tiffe, www.tsht.de, Holm Tiffe,
Freiberger Stra?e 42, 09600 Obersch?na, USt-Id: DE253710583
www.tsht.de, info at tsht.de, Fax +49 3731 74200, Mobil: 0172 8790 741
From: Pete
Turnbull
> Technically, that's an 11/83 CPU...
Nope, it's only 15MHz ... and the MSV11-Q
memory isn't PMI, so it's an
11/73.
A discussion as to whether the addition of second board can change a first
board from an A to a B would I suspect be non-productive, so I will pass over
that point. :-)
One thing that I am curious about is the 15MHz aspect: what did DEC (if you
recall) call a 15MHz M8190 paired with PMI memory? (Recalling our prior
discussion, which I am too lazy to look up and give a pointer to, about how
all the M8190's can apparently do PMI.) Did they (or would they) have
regarded that as an 11/83, or did only the 18MHz version get the 11/83
moniker? (Too many different configurations - 15/18, PMI/non-PMI - and not
enough names!)
Noel 
8:55 a.m.
On 2015-04-09 14:07, Noel Chiappa wrote:
As far as I know, any CPU with PMI memory would be called an 11/83, even
if running that 15MHz.
Johnny
From: Pete
Turnbull
> Technically, that's an 11/83 CPU...
Nope, it's only 15MHz ... and the MSV11-Q
memory isn't PMI, so it's an
11/73.
A discussion as to whether the addition of second board can change a first
board from an A to a B would I suspect be non-productive, so I will pass over
that point. :-)
One thing that I am curious about is the 15MHz aspect: what did DEC (if you
recall) call a 15MHz M8190 paired with PMI memory? (Recalling our prior
discussion, which I am too lazy to look up and give a pointer to, about how
all the M8190's can apparently do PMI.) Did they (or would they) have
regarded that as an 11/83, or did only the 18MHz version get the 11/83
moniker? (Too many different configurations - 15/18, PMI/non-PMI - and not
enough names!) 
9:48 a.m.
On 09/04/2015 13:07, Noel Chiappa wrote:
From: Pete
Turnbull
> Technically, that's an 11/83 CPU...
> Nope, it's only 15MHz ... and the MSV11-Q memory isn't PMI, so it's
an
> 11/73. A discussion as to whether the addition of second
board can change a first
board from an A to a B would I suspect be non-productive, so I will pass over
that point. :-)
Are you confusing it with a KDJ11-A - a dual-height board which is
always an 11/73? But this is a KDJ11-B, quad-height, which can be
either 11/73 or 11/83. This has been discussed a few times here on
ClassicCmp, and elsewhere on DEC boards. Basically what makes the
difference is whether it's using PMI memory or QBus memory. Originally
11/73s were sold as 15MHz units in a non-PMI config. Originally 11/83s
were the same card[1] but running at 18MHz units in a PMI config. If
you change the config to not use PMI, an 11/83 becomes an 11/73.
[1] there are some early revisions that wouldn't work properly in all
systems and where the DCJ11 wouldn't run at 18MHz or support a FPU
One thing that I am curious about is the 15MHz aspect:
what did DEC (if you
recall) call a 15MHz M8190 paired with PMI memory?
An 11/83, because that's what all diagnostics, bootROMs, XXDP, RT-11
RESORC, etc would report - assuming the PMI memory is ABOVE the CPU.
But as far as I know DEC never sold them as such. All the ones sold
with 15MHz clocks were AFAIK sold with non-PMI memory. And all the ones
sold with an 18MHz crystal were sold with PMI memory as 11/83.
--
Pete
Pete Turnbull
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days inactive
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