3 Oct
2015
3 Oct
'15
2 p.m.
Hi
Is there a table of VMS versions and hardware that they support. I know that 7.3 is
the last that supports VAX. But before that, are there limitations to what versions
run on which hardware.
For instance, would VAX/VMS 1.0 run on a VAXstation 4000? Or would 7.3 run on a
11/730?
A somewhat open ended question, but I'm rather clueless to the whole thing.
Also, what separates MicroVMS from VMS?
Thanks,
Pontus.
3 Oct
3 Oct
3:03 p.m.
On Sat, Oct 3, 2015 at 4:00 PM, Pontus Pihlgren <pontus at update.uu.se> wrote:
Hi
Is there a table of VMS versions and hardware that they support.
A ready-to-read table? I do not know of one, but it sounds like a good idea.
I know that 7.3 is
the last that supports VAX. But before that, are there
limitations to what versions
run on which hardware.
Yes.
For instance, would VAX/VMS 1.0 run on a VAXstation
4000?
No.
Or would 7.3 run on a 11/730?
I don't think so.
the SPDs will contain the official list of what hardware is supported.
Disk and memory size are critical to what's in and what is not.
Additionally, sometimes, you can stretch some of the limits, but it
would have been unsupported (like me running VMS 6.x on a MicroVax II
w/RQDX3 and RD54 - the disk was _very_ tight, but the OS itself had no
specific problems running).
-ethan
3:24 p.m.
Please note that VMS is now owned by VMS Software Inc (VSI) and VMS is all we do, no
hardware, no storage just VMS, USA company. We just released OpenVMS v8.4-1h1 with much
more in the pipeline.
Warm Regards,
Sue
On Oct 3, 2015, at 6:03 PM, Ethan Dicks
<ethan.dicks at gmail.com> wrote:
On Sat, Oct 3, 2015 at 4:00 PM, Pontus Pihlgren <pontus at update.uu.se> wrote:
Sue Skonetski
VP of Customer Advocacy
Sue.Skonetski at vmssoftware.com
Office: +1 (978) 451-0116
Mobile: +1 (603) 494-9886
Mit freundlichen Gr??en ? Avec mes meilleures salutations
Hi
Is there a table of VMS versions and hardware that they support.
A ready-to-read table? I do not know of one, but it sounds like a good idea.
I know that 7.3 is
the last that supports VAX. But before that, are
there limitations to what versions
run on which hardware.
Yes.
For instance, would VAX/VMS 1.0 run on a
VAXstation 4000?
No.
Or would 7.3 run on a 11/730?
I don't think so.
the SPDs will contain the official list of what hardware is supported.
Disk and memory size are critical to what's in and what is not.
Additionally, sometimes, you can stretch some of the limits, but it
would have been unsupported (like me running VMS 6.x on a MicroVax II
w/RQDX3 and RD54 - the disk was _very_ tight, but the OS itself had no
specific problems running).
-ethan
4 Oct
4 Oct
11:32 p.m.
Thank you Sue. I've been following the development of VSI. I just read the latest
roadmap.
/P
On Sat, Oct 03, 2015 at 06:24:15PM -0400, Sue Skonetski wrote:
Please note that VMS is now owned by VMS Software Inc
(VSI) and VMS is all we do, no hardware, no storage just VMS, USA company. We just
released OpenVMS v8.4-1h1 with much more in the pipeline.
Warm Regards,
Sue
On Oct 3, 2015, at 6:03 PM, Ethan Dicks
<ethan.dicks at gmail.com> wrote:
On Sat, Oct 3, 2015 at 4:00 PM, Pontus Pihlgren <pontus at update.uu.se> wrote:
Sue Skonetski
VP of Customer Advocacy
Sue.Skonetski at vmssoftware.com
Office: +1 (978) 451-0116
Mobile: +1 (603) 494-9886
Mit freundlichen Gr??en ? Avec mes meilleures salutations
Hi
Is there a table of VMS versions and hardware that they support.
A ready-to-read table? I do not know of one, but it sounds like a good idea.
I know that 7.3 is
the last that supports VAX. But before that, are
there limitations to what versions
run on which hardware.
Yes.
For instance, would VAX/VMS 1.0 run on a
VAXstation 4000?
No.
Or would 7.3 run on a 11/730?
I don't think so.
the SPDs will contain the official list of what hardware is supported.
Disk and memory size are critical to what's in and what is not.
Additionally, sometimes, you can stretch some of the limits, but it
would have been unsupported (like me running VMS 6.x on a MicroVax II
w/RQDX3 and RD54 - the disk was _very_ tight, but the OS itself had no
specific problems running).
-ethan 
3 Oct
3 Oct
4:10 p.m.
On 03/10/15 23:03, Ethan Dicks wrote:
the SPDs will contain the official list of what
hardware is supported.
Exactly, although the hard part will be finding SPDs for each version.
For the versions that shipped
on CD it should be easier as they (almost all, I think) included the
relevant SPD somewhere.
I don't know of anyone who has compiled a full list of what is supported
for any given version.
I also don't know of a good place to get SPDs.
Antonio
arcarlini at iee.org
4:34 p.m.
There is this OpenVMS Release History which has some useful
information. It only goes back to V4.0:
http://h71000.www7.hp.com/openvms/os/openvms-release-history.html
http://h71000.www7.hp.com/openvms/os/openvms-release-history.txt
Here is a copy of the SPD 25.01.69 for HP OpenVMS Operating System for
Alpha Version 7.3-1 and 7.3-2, and VAX Version 7.3:
http://h71000.www7.hp.com/doc/spdalpha731732vax73.pdf
From the above SPD 25.01.69:
System Restrictions
OpenVMS VAX Version 5.1-1 is the final version to support the following systems:
VAX-11/725
OpenVMS VAX Version 6.2 is the final version to support the following systems:
VAX-11/730
VAX-11/750
VAX-11/751
VAX-11/780
VAX-11/782
VAX-11/785
VAXft 110
VAXft 310
VAXft 410
VAXft 610
VAXft 810
MicroVAX I
VAXstation I
OpenVMS VAX Version 7.2 is the final version to support the following systems:
MicroVAX II
VAXstation II/GPX
VAXstation II/QVSS
VAXstation 2000
VAXstation 2000/GPX
VAXstation 2000/MFB
MicroVAX 2000
OpenVMS VAX Version 7.3 is the final version to support the following systems:
VAX 8200, VAX 8250, VAXserver 8200, VAXserver 8250
VAX 8300, VAX 8350, VAXserver 8300, VAXserver 8350
VAX 8530, VAXserver 8530, VAX 8550, VAXserver 8550
VAX 8600, VAX 8650, VAXserver 8600, VAXserver 8650
VAX 8700, VAXserver 8700
VAX 8800, VAX 8810, VAX 8820, VAX 8830, VAX 8840
VAXserver 8800, VAXserver 8810, VAXserver 8820, VAXserver 8830,
VAXserver 8840, VAX 8842, VAX 8974, VAX 8978
VAX 9000, Models 110, 110VP, 210, 210VP, 310, 310VP
VAX 9000, Models 320, 320VP, 330, 330VP, 340, 340VP
VAX 9000, Models 410, 410VP, 420, 420VP, 430, 430VP, 440, 440VP
4 Oct
4 Oct
11:54 p.m.
Thank you Glen, this was the sort of overview I was looking for.
/P
On Sat, Oct 03, 2015 at 04:34:52PM -0700, Glen Slick wrote:
There is this OpenVMS Release History which has some
useful
information. It only goes back to V4.0:
http://h71000.www7.hp.com/openvms/os/openvms-release-history.html
http://h71000.www7.hp.com/openvms/os/openvms-release-history.txt
Here is a copy of the SPD 25.01.69 for HP OpenVMS Operating System for
Alpha Version 7.3-1 and 7.3-2, and VAX Version 7.3:
http://h71000.www7.hp.com/doc/spdalpha731732vax73.pdf
From the above SPD 25.01.69:
System Restrictions
OpenVMS VAX Version 5.1-1 is the final version to support the following systems:
VAX-11/725
OpenVMS VAX Version 6.2 is the final version to support the following systems:
VAX-11/730
VAX-11/750
VAX-11/751
VAX-11/780
VAX-11/782
VAX-11/785
VAXft 110
VAXft 310
VAXft 410
VAXft 610
VAXft 810
MicroVAX I
VAXstation I
OpenVMS VAX Version 7.2 is the final version to support the following systems:
MicroVAX II
VAXstation II/GPX
VAXstation II/QVSS
VAXstation 2000
VAXstation 2000/GPX
VAXstation 2000/MFB
MicroVAX 2000
OpenVMS VAX Version 7.3 is the final version to support the following systems:
VAX 8200, VAX 8250, VAXserver 8200, VAXserver 8250
VAX 8300, VAX 8350, VAXserver 8300, VAXserver 8350
VAX 8530, VAXserver 8530, VAX 8550, VAXserver 8550
VAX 8600, VAX 8650, VAXserver 8600, VAXserver 8650
VAX 8700, VAXserver 8700
VAX 8800, VAX 8810, VAX 8820, VAX 8830, VAX 8840
VAXserver 8800, VAXserver 8810, VAXserver 8820, VAXserver 8830,
VAXserver 8840, VAX 8842, VAX 8974, VAX 8978
VAX 9000, Models 110, 110VP, 210, 210VP, 310, 310VP
VAX 9000, Models 320, 320VP, 330, 330VP, 340, 340VP
VAX 9000, Models 410, 410VP, 420, 420VP, 430, 430VP, 440, 440VP
3 Oct
3 Oct
3:51 p.m.
On 2015-10-03 23:00, Pontus Pihlgren wrote:
Hi
Is there a table of VMS versions and hardware that they support. I know that 7.3 is
the last that supports VAX. But before that, are there limitations to what versions
run on which hardware.
I know that DEC had some information on the first version of VMS for
specific models, but I don't know if I've a comprehensive list.
For instance, would VAX/VMS 1.0 run on a VAXstation
4000? Or would 7.3 run on a
11/730?
VAX/VMS 1.0 only ran on the 11/780. No other hardware supported. So, no.
VAX/VMS 1.0 would not run on a VAXstation 4000.
OpenVMS 7.3 was the last release. And with that release, a few early VAX
models were officially not supported. However, I think it should work,
in theory. There is always the question of the machine being slow
enough, or not have enough memory, to maybe cause problems. But DEC
never removed the hardware support code. But at OpenVMS 7.3, they no
longer even had the hardware around to verify that it worked, so it was
officially unsupported. (Or that's my understanding anyway.)
As far as I can remember, none of the VAX-11 models were officially
supported by OpenVMS 7.3. The oldest model that were supported (if I
remember right) was the VAX 86x0.
It should be possible to find the OpenVMS/VAX 7.3 upgrade manual online,
which should give a little more detail on which models were dropped form
supported.
Also, what separates MicroVMS from VMS?
MicroVMS was specifically tailored for MicroVAX machines, back when they
had rather limited amount of disk. One RD53 or so...
So, it was trimmed down, with components not needed for the specific
platforms removed, some things tailored differently, and some things
moved into optional extras, which you could buy/install if you happened
to have more money and hardware resources.
It also came on one TK50, or about 20 RX50 floppies, for installation.
(I have some "fun" memories of installing it from floppies when I was
working at DEC in the mid-80s... Remind me when we meet, and I'll tell
you all about it.)
Johnny
--
Johnny Billquist || "I'm on a bus
|| on a psychedelic trip
email: bqt at softjar.se || Reading murder books
pdp is alive! || tryin' to stay hip" - B. Idol
8:49 p.m.
On 3 October 2015 at 18:51, Johnny Billquist <bqt at update.uu.se> wrote:
As far as I can remember, none of the VAX-11 models
were officially
supported by OpenVMS 7.3. The oldest model that were supported (if I
remember right) was the VAX 86x0.
Glen Slick posted the official list of what was supported and what had
support dropped for it. However?:
$ sho cpu
NEBULA, a VAX-11/730
Multiprocessing is DISABLED. Uniprocessing synchronization image loaded.
PRIMARY CPU = 00
Active CPUs: 00
Configured CPUs: 00
$ sho mem
System Memory Resources on 3-OCT-2015 23:21:43.53
Physical Memory Usage (pages): Total Free In Use Modified
Main Memory (5.00Mb) 10240 3704 6439 97
Virtual I/O Cache Usage (pages): Total Free In Use Maximum
Cache Memory 347 0 347 3819
Slot Usage (slots): Total Free Resident Swapped
Process Entry Slots 80 70 10 0
Balance Set Slots 17 9 8 0
Dynamic Memory Usage (bytes): Total Free In Use Largest
Nonpaged Dynamic Memory 765440 341248 424192 233984
Paged Dynamic Memory 558080 431888 126192 431440
Paging File Usage (pages): Free Reservable Total
DISK$OVMSVAXSYS:[SYS0.SYSEXE]SWAPFILE.SYS
1008 1008 1008
DISK$OVMSVAXSYS:[SYS0.SYSEXE]PAGEFILE.SYS
31985 17850 34000
Of the physical pages in use, 4063 pages are permanently allocated to OpenVMS.
$ sho sys
OpenVMS V7.3 on node NEBULA 3-OCT-2015 23:21:48.08 Uptime 0 00:12:13
Pid Process Name State Pri I/O CPU Page flts Pages
00000081 SWAPPER HIB 16 0 0 00:00:00.04 0 0
00000084 CONFIGURE HIB 8 10 0 00:00:00.01 113 158
00000086 IPCACP HIB 10 6 0 00:00:00.01 128 95
00000087 ERRFMT HIB 8 32 0 00:00:00.02 145 211
00000089 OPCOM HIB 8 52 0 00:00:00.03 327 96
0000008A AUDIT_SERVER HIB 10 68 0 00:00:00.09 690 488
0000008B JOB_CONTROL HIB 10 27 0 00:00:00.02 191 200
0000008C SECURITY_SERVER HIB 10 32 0 00:00:00.09 2533 456
0000008E SYSTEM CUR 7 544 0 00:00:02.39 3769 349
$
So yes, [Open]VMS 7.3 will run on a VAX-11 series VAX. And probably
even on a microVAX as well (though I haven't tried).
That's SIMH, by the way, not a real 11/730. (Unfortunately.)
Cheers,
Christian
--
Christian M. Gauger-Cosgrove
STCKON08DS0
Contact information available upon request.
5 Oct
5 Oct
12:12 a.m.
On Sat, Oct 03, 2015 at 11:49:28PM -0400, Christian Gauger-Cosgrove wrote:
So yes, [Open]VMS 7.3 will run on a VAX-11 series VAX.
And probably
even on a microVAX as well (though I haven't tried).
The follow up question then is, is there a reason to avoid 7.3 on lower end VAX
models, say VAXstation 2000 or MicroVAX-II, both of which I have.
I suppose disk space is the most pressing issue. What about memory consumption in
a basic install?
Or memory usage for options like TCP/IP or DECWindows.
Thanks,
Pontus
2:21 a.m.
On Mon, 05 Oct 2015 at 09:12:59 +0200, Pontus Pihlgren wrote:
On Sat, Oct 03, 2015 at 11:49:28PM -0400, Christian
Gauger-Cosgrove wrote:
My preference is to not go higher than V5.5-2 on the smaller graphics equipped
machines. This allows the pre-Motif version of DECWindows (I think it is called
XUI?) to be used which is much less of a resource hog than Motif.
Even on machines without a graphics display, significant amounts of Motif are
started up anyway in order to enable remote display and this requires a lot
of disk and memory unless it is disabled.
There is also the pre-DECWindows windowing software called VWS (VAXstation
Workstation Software?) which is even lighter on resources. I haven't looked at
this for many years but I suspect the cut off for using it is also at V5.5-2.
The lower end VAXstation 3100 machines struggle with Motif. It takes a long
time to start and when in use, the response feels sluggish. I can only imagine
what it would do to a VAXstation 2000 or MicroVAX-II.
Regards,
Peter Coghlan.
So yes, [Open]VMS 7.3 will run on a VAX-11 series
VAX. And probably
even on a microVAX as well (though I haven't tried).
The follow up question then is, is there a reason to avoid 7.3 on lower end VAX
models, say VAXstation 2000 or MicroVAX-II, both of which I have.
I suppose disk space is the most pressing issue. What about memory consumption in
a basic install?
Or memory usage for options like TCP/IP or DECWindows.
3:18 a.m.
On 2015-10-05 11:21, Peter Coghlan wrote:
On Mon, 05 Oct 2015 at 09:12:59 +0200, Pontus Pihlgren
wrote:
Agreed that graphics, and especially Motif is a hog.
However, VMS V5 was in itself problematic in that it really had bad
performance.
It was significantly slower than V4, and customers complained. So much
that DEC explicitly addressed this concern with V6.
So, from that perspective, I would avoid V5 if I could...
Johnny
--
Johnny Billquist || "I'm on a bus
|| on a psychedelic trip
email: bqt at softjar.se || Reading murder books
pdp is alive! || tryin' to stay hip" - B. Idol
On Sat, Oct 03, 2015 at 11:49:28PM -0400,
Christian Gauger-Cosgrove wrote:
My preference is to not go higher than V5.5-2 on the smaller graphics equipped
machines. This allows the pre-Motif version of DECWindows (I think it is called
XUI?) to be used which is much less of a resource hog than Motif.
Even on machines without a graphics display, significant amounts of Motif are
started up anyway in order to enable remote display and this requires a lot
of disk and memory unless it is disabled.
There is also the pre-DECWindows windowing software called VWS (VAXstation
Workstation Software?) which is even lighter on resources. I haven't looked at
this for many years but I suspect the cut off for using it is also at V5.5-2.
The lower end VAXstation 3100 machines struggle with Motif. It takes a long
time to start and when in use, the response feels sluggish. I can only imagine
what it would do to a VAXstation 2000 or MicroVAX-II. So yes, [Open]VMS 7.3 will run on a VAX-11 series
VAX. And probably
even on a microVAX as well (though I haven't tried).
The follow up question then is, is there a reason to avoid 7.3 on lower end VAX
models, say VAXstation 2000 or MicroVAX-II, both of which I have.
I suppose disk space is the most pressing issue. What about memory consumption in
a basic install?
Or memory usage for options like TCP/IP or DECWindows.
7:52 a.m.
I ran OpenVMS V7.2 on a MicroVAX II (KA630) back when I was in high school
and it ran quite happily albeit very slowly with 16 MB RAM (and a SCSI
disk). Just text mode but I was able to use layered products like TCP/IP or
some of the compilers.
I've also run OpenVMS V7.2 on VAXstation 3100/30s _with_ DECwindows on GPX
graphics ... again very slow but runs pretty happily with the full
complement of 24 MB RAM in the machine.
I no longer have any VAXstation 2000s but I'd expect they'd do almost as
well as the KA630 ... being bounded by simply that, I don't think you can
put as much memory in the VAXstation 2000, as in the MicroVAX II. I find
OpenVMS runs very well just via netboot using MOP out of a VAXcluster ... I
wouldn't even bother to try to install OpenVMS on the local MFM disk in a
2000; just go boot one out of your cluster and see how it feels - I think
you'll find not as bad as you had originally thought! :O
Best,
Sean
On Mon, Oct 5, 2015 at 3:12 AM, Pontus Pihlgren <pontus at update.uu.se> wrote:
On Sat, Oct 03, 2015 at 11:49:28PM -0400, Christian
Gauger-Cosgrove wrote:
So yes, [Open]VMS 7.3 will run on a VAX-11 series
VAX. And probably
even on a microVAX as well (though I haven't tried).
The follow up question then is, is there a reason to avoid 7.3 on lower
end VAX
models, say VAXstation 2000 or MicroVAX-II, both of which I have.
I suppose disk space is the most pressing issue. What about memory
consumption in
a basic install?
Or memory usage for options like TCP/IP or DECWindows.
Thanks,
Pontus
12:19 p.m.
On Oct 5, 2015, at 3:07 PM, Pontus Pihlgren <pontus
at Update.UU.SE> wrote:
On Mon, Oct 05, 2015 at 10:52:15AM -0400, Sean Caron wrote:
You mean VWS? From what I remember, X11 is, amazingly enough, a fair amount faster as
well as functionally way superior.
paul
you'll find not as bad as you had originally
thought! :O
:)
Thank you, I'll see when I get there. I'm curious about the old window
managers though, the pre X11 stuff. So I'll probably try a few different
versions. 
3:30 p.m.
ISTR having run 7.2 briefly on an 11/785 (to troubleshoot an install
problem with 6.2), and while I didn't do much with it, it did come up and
run. And I've used 7.2 quite a bit on 3100-series machines with minimal
RAM. Granted, I didn't try to do anything resource-intensive, but I did
run the machines over serial. -- Ian
On Mon, Oct 5, 2015 at 12:29 PM, Pontus Pihlgren <pontus at update.uu.se>
wrote:
On Mon, Oct 05, 2015 at 03:19:55PM -0400, Paul Koning
wrote:
--
Ian S. King, MSIS, MSCS, Ph.D. Candidate
The Information School <http://ischool.uw.edu>
Dissertation: "Why the Conversation Mattered: Constructing a Sociotechnical
Narrative Through a Design Lens
Archivist, Voices From the Rwanda Tribunal <http://tribunalvoices.org>
Value Sensitive Design Research Lab <http://vsdesign.org>
University of Washington
There is an old Vulcan saying: "Only Nixon could go to China."
You mean VWS? From what I remember, X11 is, amazingly enough, a fair
amount faster as well as functionally way superior.
Yes VWS, I don't always play with classic computers for their
performance and superiority ;-)
/P
6 Oct
6 Oct
12:14 p.m.
From: Ian S. King
Sent: Monday, October 05, 2015 3:30 PM
ISTR having run 7.2 briefly on an 11/785 (to
troubleshoot an install
problem with 6.2), and while I didn't do much with it, it did come up and
run. And I've used 7.2 quite a bit on 3100-series machines with minimal
RAM. Granted, I didn't try to do anything resource-intensive, but I did
run the machines over serial. -- Ian
Recently upgraded from 6.2 to 7.3 in order to install TCP/IP Services instead
of CMU/IP (discussed in this list at the time). Runs very nicely. For comparison
to Christian Gauger-Cosgrove's SimH instance:
Welcome to Rosencrantz!
(VAX-11/780-5 @ Living Computer Museum)
$ show cpu
ROSIE, a VAX-11/785
Multiprocessing is DISABLED. Uniprocessing synchronization image loaded.
PRIMARY CPU = 00
Active CPUs: 00
Configured CPUs: 00
$ show mem
System Memory Resources on 6-OCT-2015 11:56:59.90
Physical Memory Usage (pages): Total Free In Use Modified
Main Memory (24.00Mb) 49152 17336 29050 2766
Virtual I/O Cache Usage (pages): Total Free In Use Maximum
Cache Memory 6857 0 6857 27869
Slot Usage (slots): Total Free Resident Swapped
Process Entry Slots 130 109 21 0
Balance Set Slots 88 69 19 0
Dynamic Memory Usage (bytes): Total Free In Use Largest
Nonpaged Dynamic Memory 2372608 827264 1545344 591552
Paged Dynamic Memory 1465856 1098720 367136 1097792
Paging File Usage (pages): Free Reservable Total
DISK$VMS062SYS:[SYS0.SYSEXE]SWAPFILE.SYS 2008 2008 2008
DISK$VMS062SYS:[SYS0.SYSEXE]PAGEFILE.SYS 49526 14657 54016
Of the physical pages in use, 13854 pages are permanently allocated to OpenVMS.
$ show sys
OpenVMS V7.3 on node ROSIE 6-OCT-2015 11:57:15.12 Uptime 40 16:53:36
Pid Process Name State Pri I/O CPU Page flts Pages
20200101 SWAPPER HIB 16 0 0 00:08:51.85 0 0
20211504 ALDERSON CUR 4 276 0 00:00:22.08 13616 381
20200106 CLUSTER_SERVER HIB 12 11 0 00:00:00.50 200 307
20200107 CONFIGURE HIB 9 29 0 00:00:00.36 125 185
20200108 LANACP HIB 13 48 0 00:00:01.25 360 864
2020010A IPCACP HIB 10 6 0 00:00:24.77 191 102
2020010B ERRFMT HIB 8 24786 0 00:08:27.24 145 216
2020010C CACHE_SERVER HIB 16 6 0 00:00:00.15 83 123
2020010D OPCOM HIB 9 210903 0 00:48:41.89 4757 230
2020010E AUDIT_SERVER HIB 10 43181 0 00:29:34.51 642 621
2020010F JOB_CONTROL HIB 10 95355 0 00:13:24.10 359 335
20200110 QUEUE_MANAGER HIB 10 37658 0 00:13:55.68 830 735
20200111 SECURITY_SERVER HIB 10 21452 0 01:15:12.72 5131 1338
20200112 SMISERVER HIB 9 35 0 00:09:59.82 346 169
20200113 TCPIP$INETACP HIB 8 375775 0 02:02:09.30 1223 882
20211048 SMJ LEF 6 286296 0 00:41:45.37 937 615
20206662 CROSS LEF 4 7864 0 00:04:36.76 42366 280
2020396E TCPIP$FTP_3 LEF 10 819 0 00:00:24.54 6472 1796 N
2020B277 TORESBE LEF 4 1543 0 00:00:52.86 11107 307
2021147E STREMHLAV LEF 6 319 0 00:00:13.62 6577 308
$
Rich
Rich Alderson
Vintage Computing Sr. Systems Engineer
Living Computer Museum
2245 1st Avenue S
Seattle, WA 98134
mailto:RichA at LivingComputerMuseum.org
http://www.LivingComputerMuseum.org/
1:46 p.m.
So cool ?
On 6 October 2015 at 20:14, Rich Alderson <RichA at livingcomputermuseum.org>
wrote:
From: Ian S. King
Sent: Monday, October 05, 2015 3:30 PM
ISTR having run 7.2 briefly on an 11/785 (to
troubleshoot an install
problem with 6.2), and while I didn't do much with it, it did come up and
run. And I've used 7.2 quite a bit on 3100-series machines with minimal
RAM. Granted, I didn't try to do anything resource-intensive, but I did
run the machines over serial. -- Ian
Recently upgraded from 6.2 to 7.3 in order to install TCP/IP Services
instead
of CMU/IP (discussed in this list at the time). Runs very nicely. For
comparison
to Christian Gauger-Cosgrove's SimH instance:
Welcome to Rosencrantz!
(VAX-11/780-5 @ Living Computer Museum)
$ show cpu
ROSIE, a VAX-11/785
Multiprocessing is DISABLED. Uniprocessing synchronization image loaded.
PRIMARY CPU = 00
Active CPUs: 00
Configured CPUs: 00
$ show mem
System Memory Resources on 6-OCT-2015 11:56:59.90
Physical Memory Usage (pages): Total Free In Use
Modified
Main Memory (24.00Mb) 49152 17336 29050
2766
Virtual I/O Cache Usage (pages): Total Free In Use
Maximum
Cache Memory 6857 0 6857
27869
Slot Usage (slots): Total Free Resident
Swapped
Process Entry Slots 130 109 21
0
Balance Set Slots 88 69 19
0
Dynamic Memory Usage (bytes): Total Free In Use
Largest
Nonpaged Dynamic Memory 2372608 827264 1545344
591552
Paged Dynamic Memory 1465856 1098720 367136
1097792
Paging File Usage (pages): Free Reservable
Total
DISK$VMS062SYS:[SYS0.SYSEXE]SWAPFILE.SYS 2008 2008
2008
DISK$VMS062SYS:[SYS0.SYSEXE]PAGEFILE.SYS 49526 14657
54016
Of the physical pages in use, 13854 pages are permanently allocated to
OpenVMS.
$ show sys
OpenVMS V7.3 on node ROSIE 6-OCT-2015 11:57:15.12 Uptime 40
16:53:36
Pid Process Name State Pri I/O CPU Page flts
Pages
20200101 SWAPPER HIB 16 0 0 00:08:51.85 0
0
20211504 ALDERSON CUR 4 276 0 00:00:22.08 13616
381
20200106 CLUSTER_SERVER HIB 12 11 0 00:00:00.50 200
307
20200107 CONFIGURE HIB 9 29 0 00:00:00.36 125
185
20200108 LANACP HIB 13 48 0 00:00:01.25 360
864
2020010A IPCACP HIB 10 6 0 00:00:24.77 191
102
2020010B ERRFMT HIB 8 24786 0 00:08:27.24 145
216
2020010C CACHE_SERVER HIB 16 6 0 00:00:00.15 83
123
2020010D OPCOM HIB 9 210903 0 00:48:41.89 4757
230
2020010E AUDIT_SERVER HIB 10 43181 0 00:29:34.51 642
621
2020010F JOB_CONTROL HIB 10 95355 0 00:13:24.10 359
335
20200110 QUEUE_MANAGER HIB 10 37658 0 00:13:55.68 830
735
20200111 SECURITY_SERVER HIB 10 21452 0 01:15:12.72 5131
1338
20200112 SMISERVER HIB 9 35 0 00:09:59.82 346
169
20200113 TCPIP$INETACP HIB 8 375775 0 02:02:09.30 1223
882
20211048 SMJ LEF 6 286296 0 00:41:45.37 937
615
20206662 CROSS LEF 4 7864 0 00:04:36.76 42366
280
2020396E TCPIP$FTP_3 LEF 10 819 0 00:00:24.54 6472
1796 N
2020B277 TORESBE LEF 4 1543 0 00:00:52.86 11107
307
2021147E STREMHLAV LEF 6 319 0 00:00:13.62 6577
308
$
Rich
Rich Alderson
Vintage Computing Sr. Systems Engineer
Living Computer Museum
2245 1st Avenue S
Seattle, WA 98134
mailto:RichA at LivingComputerMuseum.org
http://www.LivingComputerMuseum.org/
5 Oct
5 Oct
7:35 p.m.
On 10/05/2015 09:52 AM, Sean Caron wrote:
I ran OpenVMS V7.2 on a MicroVAX II (KA630) back when
I was in high school
and it ran quite happily albeit very slowly with 16 MB RAM (and a SCSI
disk). Just text mode but I was able to use layered products like TCP/IP or
some of the compilers.
I set up my home MicroVAX in 1986 with just the 1 MB of
memory on the CPU card, an Andromeda MFM + floppy disk
controller and the console serial port. As time and money
permitted, I kept adding stuff to it (VCB-01 and then a
VCB-02, mag tapes, SCSI tapes, ESDI disks, then SCSI disks,
DHV11 and so on.)
I ran it until 2007, although I moved all new software
development to other systems after the mid 90's.
Jon
12:04 a.m.
On Sun, Oct 04, 2015 at 12:51:28AM +0200, Johnny Billquist wrote:
OpenVMS 7.3 was the last release. And with that release, a few early
VAX models were officially not supported. However, I think it should
work, in theory. There is always the question of the machine being
slow enough, or not have enough memory, to maybe cause problems. But
DEC never removed the hardware support code.
Interresting, the concensus of this thread seems to be that given enough RAM and
disk space VMS 7.3 should run on most, if not all, VAX models. Whether performance
would be good is another question.
The minimum version needed for a given VAX is another matter. Glen's post gave a
pretty good answer though not complete.
It also came on one TK50, or about 20 RX50 floppies, for installation.
(I have some "fun" memories of installing it from floppies when I
was working at DEC in the mid-80s... Remind me when we meet, and
I'll tell you all about it.)
Will do, didn't know you had worked for DEC.
/P
3 Oct
3 Oct
5:21 p.m.
On 10/03/2015 04:00 PM, Pontus Pihlgren wrote:
Hi
Is there a table of VMS versions and hardware that they support. I know that 7.3 is
the last that supports VAX. But before that, are there limitations to what versions
run on which hardware.
For instance, would VAX/VMS 1.0 run on a VAXstation 4000?
No, absolutely not. I
know that 4.3-4.7 will not run
(properly) on a KA-650. In general, it boots up, but
doesn't have a machine check handler that is compatible with
the 650 architecture. I ran into that one myself.
Or would 7.3 run on a
11/730?
Maybe, but the 730 might not support enough memory to
properly run.
Jon
10:18 p.m.
On Oct 3, 2015, at 5:21 PM, Jon Elson <elson at pico-systems.com> wrote:
No, absolutely not. I know that 4.3-4.7 will not run
(properly) on a KA-650. In general, it boots up, but doesn't have a machine check
handler that is compatible with the 650 architecture. I ran into that one myself.
That's interesting, my system with a KA-650 ran 4.x originally, I forget the actual
version, but I think it was 4.6. Sadly it was on the RD53 that came with the system, and
the RD53 cratered before I could get a backup. :-(
Zane
4 Oct
4 Oct
6:30 a.m.
On Sat, Oct 3, 2015 at 10:18 PM, Zane Healy <healyzh at aracnet.com> wrote:
On Oct 3, 2015, at 5:21 PM, Jon Elson <elson at pico-systems.com> wrote:
http://h71000.www7.hp.com/openvms/os/openvms-release-history.txt
According to that release history version V4.7A in 28-MAR-1988 was a
Limited HW Release for the VAXstation 3200/3500 Mayfair I KA650.
No, absolutely not. I know that 4.3-4.7 will not
run (properly) on a KA-650. In general, it boots up, but doesn't have a machine check
handler that is compatible with the 650 architecture. I ran into that one myself.
That's interesting, my system with a KA-650 ran 4.x originally, I forget the actual
version, but I think it was 4.6. Sadly it was on the RD53 that came with the system, and
the RD53 cratered before I could get a backup. :-(
Zane
8:53 p.m.
On 10/04/2015 08:30 AM, Glen Slick wrote:
On Sat, Oct 3, 2015 at 10:18 PM, Zane Healy
<healyzh at aracnet.com> wrote:
Well, I THOUGHT I was running 4.7 on my home system. Seems
that was the last version that didn't require a license.
But, maybe I was NOT running 4.7, but some earlier version.
But, I would have had 4.7, not 4.7A, so maybe you needed the
4.7A to support the KA650.
I dug out some of my notes from the system, and it seems I
had VMS 4.7 and VMS 5.5 (which I couldn't run fully as I had
no license.) But, my memory of all this is a bit rusty,
now. I did have the system running continuously until 2007,
but didn't use it much online. It ran an environmental
monitoring program in the house, and displayed time, date
temp and humidity on a couple LCD displays. In 2007 I moved
that program over to a Linux PC, and the VAX hard drive
crashed a few weeks later.
Jon
On Oct 3, 2015, at 5:21 PM, Jon Elson <elson
at pico-systems.com> wrote:
http://h71000.www7.hp.com/openvms/os/openvms-release-history.txt
According to that release history version V4.7A in 28-MAR-1988 was a
Limited HW Release for the VAXstation 3200/3500 Mayfair I KA650.
No, absolutely not. I know that 4.3-4.7 will not
run (properly) on a KA-650. In general, it boots up, but doesn't have a machine check
handler that is compatible with the 650 architecture. I ran into that one myself.
That's interesting, my system with a KA-650 ran 4.x originally, I forget the actual
version, but I think it was 4.6. Sadly it was on the RD53 that came with the system, and
the RD53 cratered before I could get a backup. :-(
Zane
8:45 p.m.
On 10/04/2015 12:18 AM, Zane Healy wrote:
On Oct 3, 2015, at 5:21 PM, Jon Elson <elson at
pico-systems.com> wrote:
Somebody gave me a KA-650, and I seem to recall I was
running 4.7 on my home system. I seem to recall that when I
plugged the KA-650 in, it complained about something like
the machine check handler did not support the KA-650. Thus
was all QUITE a number of years ago, so I could be wrong
about the specifics. Anyway, it seemed the choice was to
run 5.1 with the 650, and have to deal with the license
issues, or just keep running 4.7 with no license on the
KA-630, which is what I did.
I think VMS 4.7 would let the system manager do stuff on it,
but would not let general users log on, with the 650.
Jon
No, absolutely not. I know that 4.3-4.7 will not
run (properly) on a KA-650. In general, it boots up, but doesn't have a machine check
handler that is compatible with the 650 architecture. I ran into that one myself.
That's interesting, my system with a KA-650 ran 4.x originally, I forget the actual
version, but I think it was 4.6. Sadly it was on the RD53 that came with the system, and
the RD53 cratered before I could get a backup. :-(
3 Oct
3 Oct
6:36 p.m.
I'm pretty sure I have one, but I'll need to look.
Sent from my iPod
On Oct 3, 2015, at 2:00 PM, Pontus Pihlgren <pontus
at Update.UU.SE> wrote:
Hi
Is there a table of VMS versions and hardware that they support. I know that 7.3 is
the last that supports VAX. But before that, are there limitations to what versions
run on which hardware.
For instance, would VAX/VMS 1.0 run on a VAXstation 4000? Or would 7.3 run on a
11/730?
A somewhat open ended question, but I'm rather clueless to the whole thing.
Also, what separates MicroVMS from VMS?
Thanks,
Pontus.
3146
days inactive
3149
days old
26 comments
15 participants
participants (15)
-
a.carlini＠ntlworld.com -
bqt＠update.uu.se -
captainkirk359＠gmail.com -
cctalk＠beyondthepale.ie -
elson＠pico-systems.com -
ethan.dicks＠gmail.com -
glen.slick＠gmail.com -
healyzh＠aracnet.com -
isking＠uw.edu -
mark＠wickensonline.co.uk -
paulkoning＠comcast.net -
pontus＠Update.UU.SE -
RichA＠LivingComputerMuseum.org -
scaron＠umich.edu -
Sue.Skonetski＠VMSSoftware.com