31 May
2002
31 May
'02
4:46 p.m.
There was this computer Commodore was going to make and then pulled
out of the market. It was based on the 6509 CPU, I guess right before
the 6510 / C64. I thought then as now that the case was especially
nicely shaped (such beautiful round corners, reminescent of my 91
Chevy Caprice.) I still remember when all those boards came onto
the surplus market in a German electronics mail order catalog. When
Commodore pulled them all from the market. I actually bought one
back then, because I needed a replacement SID or something like that
(I don't remember.) So, now I was looking for something in my old
junk box and that board fell back into my hands. I think I don't
need it any more, may be there is some collector here who would
appreciate that board and bring it to life? Nothice that this is
not a running system. It's just a mother board and all ROMs are
pulled. The 6509 is on there and I'll be darned if it wasn't still
good.
cheers,
-Gunther
--
Gunther Schadow, M.D., Ph.D. gschadow(a)regenstrief.org
Medical Information Scientist Regenstrief Institute for Health Care
Adjunct Assistant Professor Indiana University School of Medicine
tel:1(317)630-7960 http://aurora.regenstrief.org
31 May
31 May
5:59 p.m.
Gunther Schadow wrote:
There was this computer Commodore was going to make and then pulled
out of the market. It was based on the 6509 CPU, I guess right before
the 6510 / C64. I thought then as now that the case was especially
nicely shaped (such beautiful round corners, reminescent of my 91
Chevy Caprice.) I still remember when all those boards came onto
the surplus market in a German electronics mail order catalog. When
Commodore pulled them all from the market. I actually bought one
back then, because I needed a replacement SID or something like that
(I don't remember.) So, now I was looking for something in my old
junk box and that board fell back into my hands. I think I don't
need it any more, may be there is some collector here who would
appreciate that board and bring it to life? Nothice that this is
not a running system. It's just a mother board and all ROMs are
pulled. The 6509 is on there and I'll be darned if it wasn't still
good.
These guys might be interested.
http://retrobits.com/ckb/secret
1 Jun
1 Jun
2 a.m.
Rumor has it that Gunther Schadow may have mentioned these words:
There was this computer Commodore was going to make and
then pulled
out of the market. It was based on the 6509 CPU, I guess right before
the 6510 / C64. I thought then as now that the case was especially
nicely shaped (such beautiful round corners, reminescent of my 91
Chevy Caprice.) I still remember when all those boards came onto
the surplus market in a German electronics mail order catalog. When
Commodore pulled them all from the market. I actually bought one
back then, because I needed a replacement SID or something like that
(I don't remember.) So, now I was looking for something in my old
junk box and that board fell back into my hands. I think I don't
need it any more, may be there is some collector here who would
appreciate that board and bring it to life? Nothice that this is
not a running system. It's just a mother board and all ROMs are
pulled. The 6509 is on there and I'll be darned if it wasn't still
good.
Without seeing pictures, it sounds like a Commodore B-128 (the business end
of Commie's computer line) - it was the predecessor of the C-128 - it was
6509-based, with a header to add the Z-80 coprocessor board - they were in
production, but I don't know for how long, or how many were made...
HTH,
Roger "Merch" Merchberger
--
Roger "Merch" Merchberger --- sysadmin, Iceberg Computers
Recycling is good, right??? Ok, so I'll recycle an old .sig.
If at first you don't succeed, nuclear warhead
disarmament should *not* be your first career choice.
2:56 a.m.
Without seeing pictures, it sounds like a Commodore
B-128 (the business end
of Commie's computer line) - it was the predecessor of the C-128 - it was
6509-based, with a header to add the Z-80 coprocessor board - they were in
production, but I don't know for how long, or how many were made...
An interesting thing about the B-128... A large user group formed around
the machine and when Commodore axed it, the user group sued them (and
won!) getting all the schematics, designs & chip masks so they could
continue to maintain their machines. This is what I _heard_ happened, so
you might want to check with Cameron Kaiser(sp?) to find out for sure.
He's be the definitive source on this.
g.
3:24 a.m.
> Without seeing pictures, it sounds like a
Commodore B-128 (the business end
> of Commie's computer line) - it was the predecessor of the C-128 - it was
> 6509-based, with a header to add the Z-80 coprocessor board - they were in
> production, but I don't know for how long, or how many were made...
An interesting thing about the B-128... A large user
group formed around
the machine and when Commodore axed it, the user group sued them (and
won!) getting all the schematics, designs & chip masks so they could
continue to maintain their machines. This is what I _heard_ happened, so
you might want to check with Cameron Kaiser(sp?) to find out for sure.
He's be the definitive source on this.
You spelled it right, but I'm not familiar with that story (though it
certainly seems plausible in Europe, where the machines were more common,
so it's probably true).
--
----------------------------- personal page: http://www.armory.com/~spectre/ --
Cameron Kaiser, Point Loma Nazarene University * ckaiser(a)stockholm.ptloma.edu
-- I cannot see without closing my eyes -- Sarah Masen, "75 Grains of Sand" ---
6:51 a.m.
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7:45 p.m.
Tony Duell wrote:
Hmm, why would the 6509 have more address space than a 6510? Or is
that "extension registers" the same as the "port" zero-page address
that is used in the C=64 to change the memory ROM/RAM layout? I
suppose if you used those 8 bits (or was it just 6 bit?) ports and
hook 'em to address lines, you could get a 24 bit address bus, which
gets you to 16 MB, or, if it's just a 6-bit port, it gets you to
4 MB. Not bad. Almost like the 8088, however you can't have a
stack segment different from a data and text segment. That 256 byte
stack is one big limitation in the 6502 family.
cheers,
-Gunther
--
Gunther Schadow, M.D., Ph.D. gschadow(a)regenstrief.org
Medical Information Scientist Regenstrief Institute for Health Care
Adjunct Assistant Professor Indiana University School of Medicine
tel:1(317)630-7960 http://aurora.regenstrief.org
There was this
computer Commodore was going to make and then pulled
out of the market. It was based on the 6509 CPU, I guess right before
I believe there were several... One of them was the P500, aka the PET-II.
It's got a 6509 CPU, VIC-II video chip (I think), and uses the parallel
IEEE-488 bus for peripherals. A sort of cross between a C64 and a PET.
They are not _that_ rare in the UK, at least not compared with some other
'never sold' machines.
The 6509 is a 6502 core with address extension registers (I think one
used for direct addresses, another for indirect addresses) allowing the
chip to access 1Mbyte of memory.
2 Jun
2 Jun
1:33 a.m.
> The 6509 is a 6502 core with address extension
registers (I think one
> used for direct addresses, another for indirect addresses) allowing the
> chip to access 1Mbyte of memory.
Hmm, why would the 6509 have more address space than a
6510? Or is
that "extension registers" the same as the "port" zero-page address
that is used in the C=64 to change the memory ROM/RAM layout?
Not quite. In the 6510 the registers at $0000/1 (and all 6510 derivatives,
including the 7501, 8500, 8501 and 8502, used in the 264 series, the 64C,
later 264s and the 128 series respectively), are merely an I/O port that
happens to be hooked up to memory banking logic (as well as the Datasette
port). Only a couple of those bits are actually used for ROM enable.
On the 6509, there are four extra address lines, giving you up to 1MB.
These lines are set by location $0000 for execution (which 64K "bank" the
code is running from) and by location $0001 for indirection (i.e., on
indirect indexed LDAs and STAs *only* the four bits in $01 would be
asserted on the address lines to get at another bank). Not quite segment
and offset addressing. :-)
I have some sample code at
http://www.floodgap.com/retrobits/ckb/secret/b128.html
... look under "What's a 6509, Anyway?"
--
----------------------------- personal page: http://www.armory.com/~spectre/ --
Cameron Kaiser, Point Loma Nazarene University * ckaiser(a)stockholm.ptloma.edu
-- Never blame on malice what can be blamed on abject idiocy. -----------------
2:35 a.m.
Cameron Kaiser wrote:
On the 6509, there are four extra address lines,
giving you up to 1MB.
These lines are set by location $0000 for execution (which 64K "bank" the
code is running from) and by location $0001 for indirection (i.e., on
indirect indexed LDAs and STAs *only* the four bits in $01 would be
asserted on the address lines to get at another bank). Not quite segment
and offset addressing. :-)
And the 8086 segment addressing is a improvement?
The only clean 8 bit extended addressing was with the 6809 and OS/9
level Two.
Here you had 16 pages ( 4kb-each ) of virtual memory ,if I remember
right, per
processes with the upper 256 bytes common memory.
--
Ben Franchuk - Dawn * 12/24 bit cpu *
www.jetnet.ab.ca/users/bfranchuk/index.html
3:06 a.m.
Cameron Kaiser wrote:
Actually it was 64 8k banks (512k total). Any 8 banks could be mapped
into the 64k address space.
I wouldn't call it virtual memory because that usually refers to RAM
with a backing store file (usually on a hard disk).
--
tim lindner tlindner(a)ix.netcom.com
"Life. Don't talk to me about life." - Marvin, the android
On the 6509, there are four extra address lines,
giving you up to 1MB.
These lines are set by location $0000 for execution (which 64K "bank" the
code is running from) and by location $0001 for indirection (i.e., on
indirect indexed LDAs and STAs *only* the four bits in $01 would be
asserted on the address lines to get at another bank). Not quite segment
and offset addressing. :-)
And the 8086 segment addressing is a improvement?
The only clean 8 bit extended addressing was with the 6809 and OS/9 level
Two. Here you had 16 pages ( 4kb-each ) of virtual memory ,if I remember
right, per processes with the upper 256 bytes common memory.
10:11 a.m.
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5:54 p.m.
--- Tony Duell <ard(a)p850ug1.demon.co.uk> wrote:
Exactly - the 6504 is a 6502 with few address lines available to the
outside.
Hmm, why would
the 6509 have more address space than a 6510? Or is
Why not? There is no reason why a higher numbered chip should be
'better'... Not at all. The ports on the 6510 are just that --
ports. You could use
them for whatever you wanted, the C64 happens to use them to control the
memory map using external circuitry.
And the cassette.
-ethan
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3 Jun
3 Jun
10:01 a.m.
. . . and what's so "mystic" about this machine? I can see one considering
it
mysterious, but that's another matter.
Dick
----- Original Message -----
From: "Tony Duell" <ard(a)p850ug1.demon.co.uk>
To: <cctalk(a)classiccmp.org>
Sent: Saturday, June 01, 2002 12:51 PM
Subject: Re: What was that mystic Commodore 6509 computer?
There was this computer Commodore was going to make and then pulled
out of the market. It was based on the 6509 CPU, I guess right before
I believe there were several... One of them was the P500, aka the PET-II.
It's got a 6509 CPU, VIC-II video chip (I think), and uses the parallel
IEEE-488 bus for peripherals. A sort of cross between a C64 and a PET.
They are not _that_ rare in the UK, at least not compared with some other
'never sold' machines.
The 6509 is a 6502 core with address extension registers (I think one
used for direct addresses, another for indirect addresses) allowing the
chip to access 1Mbyte of memory.
-tony
8243
days inactive
8246
days old
12 comments
9 participants
participants (9)
-
ard＠p850ug1.demon.co.uk -
bfranchuk＠jetnet.ab.ca -
edick＠idcomm.com -
erd_6502＠yahoo.com -
geneb＠deltasoft.com -
gunther＠aurora.regenstrief.org -
spectre＠stockholm.ptloma.edu -
tlindner＠ix.netcom.com -
zmerch＠30below.com