29 Dec
2001
29 Dec
'01
8:50 a.m.
Be sure of the result before you suggest.
I used to also handle automotive product so I have a better
than average knowledge of the ourcome.
Allison
From: William Donzelli <aw288(a)osfn.org>
To: classiccmp(a)classiccmp.org <classiccmp(a)classiccmp.org>
Date: Saturday, December 29, 2001 5:24 PM
Subject: Re: Try it!!!! (Was - Re: One More PCB Dishwasher Question)
your
> But is not that change the same as going from COLD
to HOT when you
apply
power to the
chip under normal operation of the computer?
For the big stuff, sure. Not for the small stuff (glue, I/O, memory, and
other stuff that does not suck much power).
Here is a test. Boil some water in a big pot, as if you were to make
pasta. Turn the gas off, let it cool just a few seconds, then dump all favorite chips in. I am sure one will not comeout alive
(or maybe
crippled).
William Donzelli
aw288(a)osfn.org
29 Dec
29 Dec
11:34 a.m.
New subject: NEXT Color Printer find
Today I picked up a NEXT Color Printer in a thrift shop. From what I have found, it is a
PostScript color
printer using a Cannon Bubblejet engine, with a SCSI interface (altough it appears to have
a standard LPT
Centronics interface as well). It is Model N2005. It has the extremely interesting
serial number of
ACS-00000017.
The machine, aside from being dusty, is like new.
I don't have a NEXT system, and I have not tried hooking it up to my PC (yet). Does
anyone know if this will
work (using a generic PS driver)?
In any event, if this is the NEXT item on your list to complete your NEXT system, I would
be happy to
discuss a deal.
Louis
12:07 p.m.
New subject: NEXT Color Printer find
I have a NeXT color printer.
From what I know about NeXT printers, none of them are
PostScript. The
NeXT printers are similar to monitors or a 'display
device', in that the
Display PostScript engine in the operating system is the same engine
that handles printing. This would make the use of a NeXT printer on a
PC require a filter, which I don't beleive exists. Both of the
centronics ports on the printer are SCSI. I've never seen one that has
a parellel port.
The printer is interesting to say the least. If you pop the cover off,
you'll see how complicated these early inkjet printers were. There's a
maze of tubing running all of the printer through all kinds of pumps and
reserviours to move the ink. I've rebuilt mine from the ground up, and
I can tell you it's not an easy task. I had to do this because there
was ink that had dried in the lines. It's amazing these printers
actually work.
Jeffrey H. Ingber (jhingber _at_ ix.netcom.com)
On Sat, 2001-12-29 at 20:34, Louis Schulman wrote:
Today I picked up a NEXT Color Printer in a thrift
shop. From what I have found, it is a PostScript color
printer using a Cannon Bubblejet engine, with a SCSI interface (altough it appears to
have a standard LPT
Centronics interface as well). It is Model N2005. It has the extremely interesting
serial number of
ACS-00000017.
The machine, aside from being dusty, is like new.
I don't have a NEXT system, and I have not tried hooking it up to my PC (yet). Does
anyone know if this will
work (using a generic PS driver)?
In any event, if this is the NEXT item on your list to complete your NEXT system, I would
be happy to
discuss a deal.
Louis
1:54 p.m.
New subject: NEXT Color Printer find
On 29 Dec 2001 21:07:48 -0500, Jeffrey H. Ingber wrote:
#I have a NeXT color printer.
#
#From what I know about NeXT printers, none of them are PostScript.
The literature says: "Postscript Level II imaging". I don't know if this is
consistent with your description or
not.
# Both of the
#centronics ports on the printer are SCSI. I've never seen one that has
#a parellel port.
Well, you are mistaken about something. This printer has _three_ Centronics ports, two
are SCSI, and the
other is smaller, the size of a parallel port. My theory is that this is the difference
between a Model 2004,
which is documented in web literature, and Model 2005, of which there may have been few
examples (since
this one is evidently number 17).
#
#
#
#On Sat, 2001-12-29 at 20:34, Louis Schulman wrote:
#> Today I picked up a NEXT Color Printer in a thrift shop. From what I have found, it
is a PostScript color
#> printer using a Cannon Bubblejet engine, with a SCSI interface (altough it appears
to have a standard
LPT
#> Centronics interface as well). It is Model N2005. It has the extremely interesting
serial number of
#> ACS-00000017.
#>
#> The machine, aside from being dusty, is like new.
#>
#> I don't have a NEXT system, and I have not tried hooking it up to my PC (yet).
Does anyone know if this
will
#> work (using a generic PS driver)?
#>
#> In any event, if this is the NEXT item on your list to complete your NEXT system, I
would be happy to
#> discuss a deal.
#>
#> Louis
#>
#
#
2:41 p.m.
New subject: NEXT Color Printer find
My NeXT Color Printer, a model N2004 has both a SCSI in and out as well
as a Centronics style parallel port. It S/N is in the 2600 range (I'm
too busy to look right now).
Louis Schulman wrote:
On 29 Dec 2001 21:07:48 -0500, Jeffrey H. Ingber
wrote:
#I have a NeXT color printer.
#
#From what I know about NeXT printers, none of them are PostScript.
The literature says: "Postscript Level II imaging". I don't know if this is
consistent with your description or
not.
# Both of the
#centronics ports on the printer are SCSI. I've never seen one that has
#a parellel port.
Well, you are mistaken about something. This printer has _three_ Centronics ports, two
are SCSI, and the
other is smaller, the size of a parallel port. My theory is that this is the difference
between a Model 2004,
which is documented in web literature, and Model 2005, of which there may have been few
examples (since
this one is evidently number 17).
#
#
#
#On Sat, 2001-12-29 at 20:34, Louis Schulman wrote:
#> Today I picked up a NEXT Color Printer in a thrift shop. From what I have found, it
is a PostScript color
#> printer using a Cannon Bubblejet engine, with a SCSI interface (altough it appears
to have a standard
LPT
#> Centronics interface as well). It is Model N2005. It has the extremely interesting
serial number of
#> ACS-00000017.
#>
#> The machine, aside from being dusty, is like new.
#>
#> I don't have a NEXT system, and I have not tried hooking it up to my PC (yet).
Does anyone know if this
will
#> work (using a generic PS driver)?
#>
#> In any event, if this is the NEXT item on your list to complete your NEXT system, I
would be happy to
#> discuss a deal.
#>
#> Louis
#>
#
#
.
30 Dec
30 Dec
2:54 a.m.
New subject: NEXT Color Printer find
My NeXT Color Printer, a model N2004 has both a SCSI
in and out as well
as a Centronics style parallel port. It S/N is in the 2600 range (I'm
too busy to look right now).
Was that SCSI to add a font disk to the printer or to actually talk to
the printer....?
I assume the former...=
Bill
4:15 a.m.
New subject: NEXT Color Printer find
----- Original Message -----
From: "Bill Pechter" <pechter(a)bg-tc-ppp1458.monmouth.com>
To: <classiccmp(a)classiccmp.org>
Sent: Sunday, December 30, 2001 11:54 AM
Subject: Re: NEXT Color Printer find
I would imagine it was to talk to the printer. IIRC early Macs used SCSI
printers, too. Pretty neat. I wonder how hard a SCSI <-> parallel
interface would be to build.
My NeXT Color
Printer, a model N2004 has both a SCSI in and out as well
as a Centronics style parallel port. It S/N is in the 2600 range (I'm
too busy to look right now).
Was that SCSI to add a font disk to the printer or to actually talk to
the printer....?
I assume the former...=
Bill
Bob
8:06 a.m.
New subject: NEXT Color Printer find
On Sun, 30 Dec 2001, Robert Schaefer wrote:
I would imagine it was to talk to the printer. IIRC
early Macs used
SCSI printers, too. Pretty neat. I wonder how hard a SCSI <->
parallel interface would be to build.
I seem to remember seeing a few companies offer these kinds of bridges,
but I doubt they would work for anything other then a printer.
I have a SCSI <-> ethernet bridge around here somewhere. I think it was
made for older Macs that lacked nubus or another means of expansion. It
reports itself as a disk device, but I haven't done much with it yet.
-Toth
10:35 a.m.
New subject: NEXT Color Printer find
----- Original Message -----
From: "Tothwolf" <tothwolf(a)concentric.net>
To: <classiccmp(a)classiccmp.org>
Sent: Sunday, December 30, 2001 05:06 PM
Subject: Re: NEXT Color Printer find
On Sun, 30 Dec 2001, Robert Schaefer wrote:
I was thinking that in these times of swiss-army-chips, there would be some
kind of controller with SCSI-1 and parallel onboard. Be a whole lot faster
to print across a SCSI -> parallel bridge than a serial cable, I'd imagine.
I would imagine it was to talk to the printer.
IIRC early Macs used
SCSI printers, too. Pretty neat. I wonder how hard a SCSI <->
parallel interface would be to build.
I seem to remember seeing a few companies offer these kinds of bridges,
but I doubt they would work for anything other then a printer.
I have a SCSI <-> ethernet bridge around here somewhere. I think it was
made for older Macs that lacked nubus or another means of expansion. It
reports itself as a disk device, but I haven't done much with it yet.
I've heard of those too, and was thinking about getting one for some of the
older macs I had, before I decided to get rid of 'em. IIRC they weren't the
most elegant of things, and drivers were a problem.
-Toth
Bob
29 Dec
29 Dec
3:13 p.m.
New subject: NEXT Color Printer find
On Sat, 2001-12-29 at 22:54, Louis Schulman wrote:
Well, you are mistaken about something. This printer
has _three_ Centronics ports, two are SCSI, and the
other is smaller, the size of a parallel port. My theory is that this is the difference
between a Model 2004,
which is documented in web literature, and Model 2005, of which there may have been few
examples (since
this one is evidently number 17).
Very interesting. Mine definitely has only 2 50-pin Centronics ports.
The serial number is 00000078, and is an N2004. What makes this even
more interesting is that NeXT's didn't have a parallel port (that I know
of).
There's an easy way to test if a) That's a parallel port, and b) it has
an on-board PostScript processor. Just connect it to a PC and send some
PostScript to the printer. That would make a nice inexpensive
PostScript color printer if this works, as ink is still available.
Jeffrey H. Ingber (jhingber _at_ ix.netcom.com)
#
#
#
#On Sat, 2001-12-29 at 20:34, Louis Schulman wrote:
#> Today I picked up a NEXT Color Printer in a thrift shop. From what I have found,
it is a PostScript color
#> printer using a Cannon Bubblejet engine, with a SCSI interface (altough it appears
to have a standard
LPT
#> Centronics interface as well). It is Model N2005. It has the extremely
interesting serial number of
#> ACS-00000017.
#>
#> The machine, aside from being dusty, is like new.
#>
#> I don't have a NEXT system, and I have not tried hooking it up to my PC (yet).
Does anyone know if this
will
#> work (using a generic PS driver)?
#>
#> In any event, if this is the NEXT item on your list to complete your NEXT system, I
would be happy to
#> discuss a deal.
#>
#> Louis
#>
#
#
30 Dec
30 Dec
7:07 a.m.
New subject: NEXT Color Printer find
On 30 Dec 2001 00:13:27 -0500, Jeffrey H. Ingber wrote:
#Very interesting. Mine definitely has only 2 50-pin Centronics ports.
#The serial number is 00000078, and is an N2004. What makes this even
#more interesting is that NeXT's didn't have a parallel port (that I know
#of).
#
#There's an easy way to test if a) That's a parallel port, and b) it has
#an on-board PostScript processor. Just connect it to a PC and send some
#PostScript to the printer. That would make a nice inexpensive
#PostScript color printer if this works, as ink is still available.
#
Ok, here's the report. The printer works, and runs the self-test (in full color).
Still has ink!
The 36-pin port is a parallel port, and does receive data from the PC. You select from
SCSI/Parallel on an
LCD menu on the printer.
The printer did not understand PostScript. However, on the printer, there are a number of
different "Modes"
and other options that are selectable, and without a manual, it isn't clear what they
do. One could be
PostScript, I'll have to do some more tests. But plain ascii sent from the PC worked
fine.
Louis
8:40 a.m.
New subject: NEXT Color Printer find
The printer did not understand PostScript. However, on
the printer,
there are a number of different "Modes"
and other options that are selectable, and without a manual, it
isn't clear what they do. One could be
PostScript, I'll have to do some more tests. But plain ascii sent
from the PC worked fine.
From a recent post in COMP.SYS.NEXT.HARDWARE, here is some
additional info on the printer:
----------
Lines: 20
X-Admin: news(a)aol.com
From: willadams(a)aol.com (William F. Adams)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.next.hardware
Date: 28 Dec 2001 21:12:04 GMT
References: <6%KW7.137025$8w3.26609673(a)typhoon.kc.rr.com>
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com
Subject: Re: Wanted: NeXT Color Printer
Message-ID: <20011228161204.15528.00001377(a)mb-ci.aol.com>
``sales'' asked:
Wanted to buy: NeXT Color Printer. Also want
information on this
printer. - Specifications
It's a re-badged Canon BJC-800/820 with SCSI connector and logic board for
same. CMYK, 360 x 360 dpi. Apple also licensed this design as the Apple Color
Printer, and Lexmark sold it as the 4079
At one time, Canon Japan had a NeXTstep driver for the BJC-800/20 on their FTP
site....
William
-----------
--
Home of the TRS-80 Model 2000 FAQ File
http://www.cchaven.com
http://www.geocities.com/siliconvalley/lakes/6757
5:22 a.m.
New subject: NEXT Color Printer find
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7:03 a.m.
New subject: NEXT Color Printer find
On Sun, 30 Dec 2001 19:22:25 +0000 (GMT), Tony Duell wrote:
#> # Both of the
#> #centronics ports on the printer are SCSI. I've never seen one that has
#> #a parellel port.
#>
#> Well, you are mistaken about something. This printer has _three_ Centronics ports,
two are SCSI, and
the
#> other is smaller, the size of a parallel port. My theory is that this is the
difference between a Model 2004,
#> which is documented in web literature, and Model 2005, of which there may have been
few examples
(since
#> this one is evidently number 17).
#
#I've never seen this printer, but I think you're a little confused.
#
#The Centronics interface is a de facto standard for a parallel interface
#to a printer, as originally used by the Centronics company. It's not SCSI
#or anything related to it. To say you have a Centronics port that is SCSI
#is meaningless IMHO.
#
#What I think you mean is that you have 3 'blue ribbon' connectors on the
#unit. 2 are 50 pin (which was often used for SCSI-1 interfaces), the
#other is 36 pin (which is a standard for the Centronics parallel
#interface).
#
#My guess is that the 36 pin connector _is_ a Centronics parallel port,
#but I'd probably not just plug it in on such a rare printer without doing
#some further tests. One test that's easy to do is to trace which pins of
#the connectors go to logic ground (this is generally easy enough to find
#inside) and see if they match up with any known interface pinout.
#
#-tony
#
With all due respect, I disagree. The term "Centronics", whatever its original
meaning, refers to a type of
connector. Looking at the Jameco catalog, for example, the catalog pictures 14, 24, 36
and 50 contact
male and female connectors, all referred to as "Centronics". I have never heard
the term "blue ribbon" used
to describe these connectors.
My understanding is that Centronics was the first to use this type of connector on its
parallel printers, so
when it became the standard type connector the name stuck.
Parallel port nomenclature now has a number of different terms, based on function and
standard, not type of
connector. SCSI connectors are sometimes Centronics type, but not always.
In any event, the "36-pin Centronics Connector" is a parallel connection, and
the PC was able to talk to this
printer.
BTW, this type of connector, regardless of the number of pins, when made for ribbon
cables, is referred to
by Jameco as "IDC Centronics Connector".
Louis
8:33 a.m.
New subject: NEXT Color Printer find
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9:48 a.m.
New subject: Connectors (was: NEXT Color Printer find
As Tony pointed out, misuse by Jameco doesn't make it so.
On Sun, 30 Dec 2001, Tony Duell wrote:
I've seen those connectors misnamed (note :
misnamed) in a lot of
catalogues over here....
Would they call common network connectors "8 pin RJ-11"?
Or would they call them "8 pin telephone connectors"?
How about NMJ?
I've seen plenty of other connectors mis-named as
well. Plenty of
catalogues list the DB9 connector. I've never seen a real DB9 connector,
and actually I doubt they exist.
I have.
It was a cable with what looked from the outside to be DB25 male
connectors on each end. Each connector had pins 1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,20.
What made it a DB9, rather than a DB25 with missing pins is that it was a
molded connector that was made that way, with no holes for the other
pins.
Do TELEPHONE people who have been using the larger connectors since before
Centronics Corp existed, call them "Centronics connectors"?
11:22 a.m.
New subject: Connectors (was: NEXT Color Printer find
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1 Jan
1 Jan
1:26 p.m.
New subject: Connectors (was: NEXT Color Printer find
On Sun, 30 Dec 2001, Fred Cisin (XenoSoft) wrote:
Do TELEPHONE people who have been using the larger
connectors since
before Centronics Corp existed, call them "Centronics connectors"?
I've always known them to be called Amphenol connectors in the telco
world. So pick your favorite misnomer.
Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org
* Old computing resources for business and academia at www.VintageTech.com *
2:27 p.m.
New subject: Connectors (was: NEXT Color Printer find
On Tue, 1 Jan 2002, Sellam Ismail wrote:
On Sun, 30 Dec 2001, Fred Cisin (XenoSoft) wrote:
I've only heard them called Butterfly connectors. Any ideas where that
name comes from?
-- Pat
Do TELEPHONE people who have been using the
larger connectors since
before Centronics Corp existed, call them "Centronics connectors"?
I've always known them to be called Amphenol connectors in the telco
world. So pick your favorite misnomer.
2 Jan
2 Jan
7:51 a.m.
New subject: Connectors (was: NEXT Color Printer find
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30 Dec
30 Dec
11:05 a.m.
New subject: NEXT Color Printer find
On Sun, 30 Dec 2001, Louis Schulman wrote:
On Sun, 30 Dec 2001 19:22:25 +0000 (GMT), Tony Duell
wrote:
#> # Both of the
#> #centronics ports on the printer are SCSI. I've never seen one that has
#> #a parellel port.
#>
#> Well, you are mistaken about something. This printer has _three_ Centronics ports,
two are SCSI, and
the
#> other is smaller, the size of a parallel port. My theory is that this is the
difference between a Model 2004,
#> which is documented in web literature, and Model 2005, of which there may have been
few examples
(since
#> this one is evidently number 17).
#
#I've never seen this printer, but I think you're a little confused.
#
#The Centronics interface is a de facto standard for a parallel interface
#to a printer, as originally used by the Centronics company. It's not SCSI
#or anything related to it. To say you have a Centronics port that is SCSI
#is meaningless IMHO.
#
#What I think you mean is that you have 3 'blue ribbon' connectors on the
#unit. 2 are 50 pin (which was often used for SCSI-1 interfaces), the
#other is 36 pin (which is a standard for the Centronics parallel
#interface).
#
#My guess is that the 36 pin connector _is_ a Centronics parallel port,
#but I'd probably not just plug it in on such a rare printer without doing
#some further tests. One test that's easy to do is to trace which pins of
#the connectors go to logic ground (this is generally easy enough to find
#inside) and see if they match up with any known interface pinout.
#
#-tony
#
With all due respect, I disagree. The term "Centronics", whatever its original
meaning, refers to a type of
connector. Looking at the Jameco catalog, for example, the catalog pictures 14, 24, 36
and 50 contact
male and female connectors, all referred to as "Centronics". I have never
heard the term "blue ribbon" used
to describe these connectors.
Tony is correct.
Regrettably, Jameco has fallen into the bastardization/mongrelization of
the language. Looking at a page of a 1962 Allied Radio catalog, I see
listings and illustrations of the Amphenol "Blue Ribbon" connectors in
sizes running from 8-32 contacts. They obviously derived their name
from the blue Diallyl phthalate dielectric that carried
the rinnon like
contacts.
- don
My understanding is that Centronics was the first to
use this type of connector on its parallel printers, so
when it became the standard type connector the name stuck.
Parallel port nomenclature now has a number of different terms, based on function and
standard, not type of
connector. SCSI connectors are sometimes Centronics type, but not always.
In any event, the "36-pin Centronics Connector" is a parallel connection, and
the PC was able to talk to this
printer.
BTW, this type of connector, regardless of the number of pins, when made for ribbon
cables, is referred to
by Jameco as "IDC Centronics Connector".
Louis
11:57 a.m.
New subject: Nomenclature (was: NEXT Color Printer find
On Sun, 30 Dec 2001, Don Maslin wrote:
Tony is correct.
Regrettably, Jameco has fallen into the bastardization/mongrelization of
the language. Looking at a page of a 1962 Allied Radio catalog, I see
listings and illustrations of the Amphenol "Blue Ribbon" connectors in
sizes running from 8-32 contacts. They obviously derived their name
from the blue Diallyl phthalate dielectric that carried the rinnon like
contacts.
Don provides a hint to the correct approach.
Invoke the 10 year rule.
In place of current accepted sloppy terminology,
how many remember what they were called THEN?
6:27 p.m.
New subject: Nomenclature (was: NEXT Color Printer find
There are plenty of folks who think collectors of old computer hardware are
odd. One oddity I'd like to see adopted is a dedication to correctness in
detail. Where the language used in our society is rapidly heading for the
point at which everyone will only be taught a single syllable, leaving
inflections to communicate whatever little meaning there is, I'd suggest we,
at least, take it upon ourselves to learn and use the correct terminology,
painful as it may be.
more below, BTW.
Dick
----- Original Message -----
From: "Fred Cisin (XenoSoft)" <cisin(a)xenosoft.com>
To: <classiccmp(a)classiccmp.org>
Sent: Monday, December 31, 2001 1:57 AM
Subject: Nomenclature (was: NEXT Color Printer find
On Sun, 30 Dec 2001, Don Maslin wrote:
A lot of this nomenclature problem came about when folks started referring
to the DB25 (and it is a 'B' shell) as an "RS232" connector.
IIRC, both the 'D' subminitature connectors, e.g. DE9, DA15, DB25, DC37,
DD50 ... and the "Blue-Ribbon" series were Amphenol products, the patent on
which expired in the late '70's. Consequently the trade names became
muddled in various competitors' nomenclature. If somebody has kept old
Cramer, Newark, Allied, and other catalogs of the late '60's and early
'70's, (which I haven't) the nomenclature should be much clearer there.
Tony is correct.
Regrettably, Jameco has fallen into the bastardization/mongrelization of
the language. Looking at a page of a 1962 Allied Radio catalog, I see
listings and illustrations of the Amphenol "Blue Ribbon" connectors in
sizes running from 8-32 contacts. They obviously derived their name
from the blue Diallyl phthalate dielectric that carried the ribbon-like
contacts.
Don provides a hint to the correct approach.
Invoke the 10 year rule.
In place of current accepted sloppy terminology,
how many remember what they were called THEN?
31 Dec
31 Dec
2:40 a.m.
New subject: Nomenclature (was: NEXT Color Printer find
There's always a place for the person who knows the correct
and exact answer to something. (It just may not be where you
are at that moment <g>) I for one don't get too bent out of shape
when people can't speak our brand of "Doctor's Latin". "Fifty pin
Centronics style" communicates the point to more people than
the "Latin". Be ready to adapt to the audience.
There was a story on NPR about the people who re-create
revolutionary and civil war battles as a hobby. Some of them
are sticklers to the point where they get pissed when someone
shows up with modern eyeglasses or cotton instead of wool
clothing, etc. They called them "Farby's" for the phrase "Far be
it for me to judge".
John A.
3:47 a.m.
New subject: Nomenclature (was: NEXT Color Printer find
There's always a place for the person who knows
the correct
and exact answer to something. (It just may not be where you
are at that moment <g>) I for one don't get too bent out of shape
when people can't speak our brand of "Doctor's Latin". "Fifty pin
Centronics style" communicates the point to more people than
the "Latin". Be ready to adapt to the audience.
There was a recent thread on the linux-kernel mailing list about
changing all references to KB, MB, etc. to the new standard KiB,
MiB, etc. Some people were for the change, since the new names
are unambiguous, while others think it is kind of ridiculous for
a third-party to change the definitions that have been accepted
for years. I'm in the camp that 1KB of RAM is 1024B, and 1MB of
hard drive is 1024*1024B. That's what they've meant for years,
and the hard drive manufacturers playing with specs and getting
the public thinking 1MB=1000*1024B is not a good reason to change.
I'm not pedantic, though. While I use "Ethernet", I don't get
bent out of shape when people use "ethernet".
--
Eric Dittman
dittman(a)dittman.net
Check out the DEC Enthusiasts Club at http://www.dittman.net/
5:55 a.m.
New subject: Nomenclature (was: NEXT Color Printer find
John Allain wrote:
'The Suits' is my guess ... makes your revised spec-ed HD look
bigger than the other 'Guys'. Next year 1K is 900 bytes ...
--
Ben Franchuk - Dawn * 12/24 bit cpu *
www.jetnet.ab.ca/users/bfranchuk/index.html
it is kind of ridiculous for a third-party to
change the definitions
that have been accepted for {>>30} years.
Do you know who is leading the adoption of the "Bad" IE 1000=K
standard? At least it aint MS This time.
John A.
6 a.m.
New subject: Nomenclature (was: NEXT Color Printer find
it is kind of
ridiculous for a third-party to change the definitions
that have been accepted for {>>30} years.
Do you know who is leading the adoption of the "Bad" IE 1000=K
standard? At least it aint MS This time.
7:32 a.m.
New subject: Nomenclature (was: NEXT Color Printer find
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7:54 a.m.
New subject: Nomenclature (was: NEXT Color Printer find
Even so, Tony, shouldn't WE, the purported experts on the archaic computers,
be able to come up with a precise, if not communcative to the masses, way of
saying what we mean without a long clarification? If WE use the wrong term
amongst ourselves, we'll certainly never show others that there's benefit in
calling it a crescent wrench when, to some folks, "the silver-colored
thingie," would do.
It would, IMHO, save lots of time and bandwidth, not just here, but all
around.
Dick
----- Original Message -----
From: "Tony Duell" <ard(a)p850ug1.demon.co.uk>
To: <classiccmp(a)classiccmp.org>
Sent: Monday, December 31, 2001 9:32 PM
Subject: Re: Nomenclature (was: NEXT Color Printer find
There's always a place for the person who knows the correct
and exact answer to something. (It just may not be where you
are at that moment <g>) I for one don't get too bent out of shape
I thought this list was composed mostly of technical types. And people
who are willing to learn.
when people can't speak our brand of
"Doctor's Latin". "Fifty pin
Centronics style" communicates the point to more people than
the "Latin". Be ready to adapt to the audience.
OK. I doubt this thread would have gone as far had the original
description of the printer been something like 'It's got 3 of those
Centronics-style connectors on the back. 2 50 pin ones (SCSI) and a 36
pin one which might be a Centronics parallel interface'.
There is a big difference (IMHO) between 'Centronics style connector' (a
common, understandable, even if technically incorrect, term for the
connector series we're discussing) and 'Centronics port' (a particular
type of parallel printer interface).
-tony
1 Jan
1 Jan
6:50 a.m.
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31 Dec
31 Dec
11:55 a.m.
New subject: Nomenclature (was: NEXT Color Printer find
Damn. While I generally disagee with Richards approach on most things his
recent postings are things I agree with. Remember the legend of the Tower of
Babel ? Richard have you been smoking those funny little cigarettes ?
And I'm even supportive of your views on Kwanza and Xmas.
Maybe this new rural setting is changing my world-view. GAWD am I to
become a New Hampshire Republican ?
Lawrence
There are plenty of folks who think collectors of old
computer hardware are odd.
One oddity I'd like to see adopted is a dedication to correctness in detail.
Where the language used in our society is rapidly heading for the point at which
everyone will only be taught a single syllable, leaving inflections to
communicate whatever little meaning there is, I'd suggest we, at least, take it
upon ourselves to learn and use the correct terminology, painful as it may be.
more below, BTW.
Dick
----- Original Message -----
From: "Fred Cisin (XenoSoft)" <cisin(a)xenosoft.com>
To: <classiccmp(a)classiccmp.org>
Sent: Monday, December 31, 2001 1:57 AM
Subject: Nomenclature (was: NEXT Color Printer find
Reply to:
lgwalker(a)mts.net
On Sun, 30 Dec 2001, Don Maslin wrote:
A lot of this nomenclature problem came about when folks started referring
to the DB25 (and it is a 'B' shell) as an "RS232" connector.
IIRC, both the 'D' subminitature connectors, e.g. DE9, DA15, DB25, DC37,
DD50 ... and the "Blue-Ribbon" series were Amphenol products, the patent on
which expired in the late '70's. Consequently the trade names became muddled in
various competitors' nomenclature. If somebody has kept old Cramer, Newark,
Allied, and other catalogs of the late '60's and early '70's, (which I
haven't)
the nomenclature should be much clearer there.
Tony is correct.
Regrettably, Jameco has fallen into the bastardization/mongrelization of the
language. Looking at a page of a 1962 Allied Radio catalog, I see listings
and illustrations of the Amphenol "Blue Ribbon" connectors in sizes running
from 8-32 contacts. They obviously derived their name from the blue Diallyl
phthalate dielectric that carried the ribbon-like contacts.
Don provides a hint to the correct approach.
Invoke the 10 year rule.
In place of current accepted sloppy terminology,
how many remember what they were called THEN?
30 Dec
30 Dec
1:47 a.m.
New subject: NEXT Color Printer find
It has an SCSI interface? I've had printers with IEE-488, serial and of
course many types on network NICS. Weird, but then I haven't really messed
with Next's.
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-classiccmp(a)classiccmp.org
[mailto:owner-classiccmp@classiccmp.org]On Behalf Of Louis Schulman
Sent: Saturday, December 29, 2001 7:34 PM
To: classiccmp(a)classiccmp.org
Subject: NEXT Color Printer find
Today I picked up a NEXT Color Printer in a thrift shop. From what I have
found, it is a PostScript color
printer using a Cannon Bubblejet engine, with a SCSI interface (altough it
appears to have a standard LPT
Centronics interface as well). It is Model N2005. It has the extremely
interesting serial number of
ACS-00000017.
The machine, aside from being dusty, is like new.
I don't have a NEXT system, and I have not tried hooking it up to my PC
(yet). Does anyone know if this will
work (using a generic PS driver)?
In any event, if this is the NEXT item on your list to complete your NEXT
system, I would be happy to
discuss a deal.
Louis
2:42 a.m.
New subject: NEXT Color Printer find
It has an SCSI interface? I've had printers with
IEE-488, serial and of
course many types on network NICS. Weird, but then I haven't really messed
with Next's.
We've got some odd Kodak printers at work, connected to some
older PowerMac's, that use SCSI for the interface as well. My guess
is that, at least in this case, the Mac printer port wasn't fast
enough for their liking so they put it on the SCSI port instead. I
don't see where that would be the case with the NeXT though given the
very high-speed nature of it's printer port. To do full Postscript
Level II at 400dpi and 8ppm (NeXT Laser printer) with all the work
being done by the host CPU is going to take a pretty fast serial
interface.
Jeff
--
Home of the TRS-80 Model 2000 FAQ File
http://www.cchaven.com
http://www.geocities.com/siliconvalley/lakes/6757
5:32 a.m.
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7:07 a.m.
New subject: NEXT Color Printer find
Did some NeXTs ever use the 'raw video'
interface to the laser printer?
We discussed this interface on the list about a month ago, it's a very
low-level interface where you have a signal that controls the laser
directly. Once the host has started a piece of paper moving through the
printer, it has to then send data to the laser control input in real
time, at about 11Mbps (IIRC).
Everything I've ever seen concerning the printer's interface
refers to it as a high-speed serial interface, though I've rarely
seen actual throughput figures. I have no doubt that the commands
sent out it are fairly low level though considering the lack of
onboard intelligence on the printer. It doesn't even power on until
the NeXT is powered on. The interface also provides for some status
back to the CPU as well. Due to the host CPU needing to do all the
work, I would think that the amount of data streaming out to the
printer engine, as well as strobes checking printer status, would
require a good deal more bandwidth on the interface than a more
standard connection.
Jeff
--
Home of the TRS-80 Model 2000 FAQ File
http://www.cchaven.com
http://www.geocities.com/siliconvalley/lakes/6757
8:39 a.m.
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9:29 a.m.
New subject: NEXT Color Printer find
On Sun, 30 Dec 2001, Tony Duell wrote:
This sounds suspiciously like the Canon
'video' interface. Just out of
curiousity, what connector is used (the Canon standard one is a DC37-S on
the printer).
DE9F coming out of the back of the NeXT.
I want to say the data rate of the printer port is 1.5 Mbit/sec, but I
can't remember for certain and it may very well be 11 Mbit/sec instead.
I'm nearly certain the exact rate is mentioned in either "The NeXT Book"
or in the comp.sys.next.hardware FAQ.
ok
r.
10:20 a.m.
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10:38 a.m.
New subject: NEXT Color Printer find
On Sun, 30 Dec 2001, Tony Duell wrote:
Of course, r. is right...I should've looked on the back of my
Cube prior to suggesting that it was a DE-9M in my previous post.
That type of thing is why I generally put disclaimers with any info I
post from memory!
Jeff
--
Home of the TRS-80 Model 2000 FAQ File
http://www.cchaven.com
http://www.geocities.com/siliconvalley/lakes/6757
This sounds suspiciously like the Canon
'video' interface. Just out of
curiousity, what connector is used (the Canon standard one is a DC37-S on
the printer).
DE9F coming out of the back of the NeXT.
10:04 a.m.
New subject: NEXT Color Printer find
Everything
I've ever seen concerning the printer's interface
refers to it as a high-speed serial interface, though I've rarely
Which the Canon 'video' interface technically is. You send a serial bit
stream to the laser driver. With no framing or any other kind of protocol. There's a serial clock/data pair for status (paper
out, jam, errors,
paper size, etc) and commands (select paper tray, select manual feeder,
and so on). And some ready signals so both sides know that the other side
is turned on.
The actual pinout for the connection is:
1 LP CLK
2 LP Data In
3 LP Data Out 1
4 LP Data Out 2
5 LP PWR Enable
6 GND
7 GND
8 GND
9 NC
This sounds suspiciously like the Canon 'video'
interface. Just out of
curiousity, what connector is used (the Canon standard one is a DC37-S on
the printer).
The connection on the CPU end is a DE-9M. My NeXT laser
printer is sitting in my office awaiting replacement of it's feed
roller and ejection gear, so I can't doublecheck the connector on the
printer end. I believe it's the same as the CPU though, as I don't
recall the cable being different on each end.
Jeff
--
Home of the TRS-80 Model 2000 FAQ File
http://www.cchaven.com
http://www.geocities.com/siliconvalley/lakes/6757
11:17 a.m.
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4:28 a.m.
New subject: NEXT Color Printer find
On 2001.12.30 16:47 Russ Blakeman wrote:
It has an SCSI interface? I've had printers with
IEE-488, serial and
of course many types on network NICS. Weird, but then I haven't
really messed with Next's.
My Apple LaserWriter IIg has also SCSI besides
AppleTalk, serial and
Ethernet. You can connect a disk to that SCSI port to load fonts on it.
Only a few printers can be feed with the print data via SCSI.
--
tsch??,
Jochen
Homepage: http://www.unixag-kl.fh-kl.de/~jkunz/
8:12 a.m.
New subject: NEXT Color Printer find
Guess even after working piles of printers I can still find out new
things...
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-classiccmp(a)classiccmp.org
[mailto:owner-classiccmp@classiccmp.org]On Behalf Of Jochen Kunz
Sent: Sunday, December 30, 2001 12:29 PM
To: classiccmp(a)classiccmp.org
Subject: Re: NEXT Color Printer find
On 2001.12.30 16:47 Russ Blakeman wrote:
It has an SCSI interface? I've had printers with
IEE-488, serial and
of course many types on network NICS. Weird, but then I haven't
really messed with Next's.
My Apple LaserWriter IIg has also SCSI besides
AppleTalk, serial and
Ethernet. You can connect a disk to that SCSI port to load fonts on it.
Only a few printers can be feed with the print data via SCSI.
--
tsch??,
Jochen
Homepage: http://www.unixag-kl.fh-kl.de/~jkunz/
8390
days inactive
8394
days old
43 comments
21 participants
participants (21)
-
ajp166＠bellatlantic.net -
allain＠panix.com -
ard＠p850ug1.demon.co.uk -
bfranchuk＠jetnet.ab.ca -
cisin＠xenosoft.com -
dittman＠dittman.net -
donm＠cts.com -
edick＠idcomm.com -
foo＠siconic.com -
jhellige＠earthlink.net -
jhingber＠ix.netcom.com -
jkunz＠unixag-kl.fh-kl.de -
jrice＠texoma.net -
lgwalker＠mts.net -
louiss＠gate.net -
pat＠purdueriots.com -
pechter＠bg-tc-ppp1458.monmouth.com -
red＠bears.org -
rhblakeman＠kih.net -
rschaefe＠gcfn.org -
tothwolf＠concentric.net