10 Apr
2011
10 Apr
'11
10:16 p.m.
I'm having no luck at all installing LOS.
I've tried Lisa Office 3.0 and 2.0, but they both claim they cannot write
to the disk - I tried two 5M and one 10M ProFile. To my knowledge, none of
these have bad sectors. There's no sign that it's even _trying_ to access
the disk. The activity light on the ProFile flickers during _detection_
and I can hear it seek. But, when I push the button to initialize it
comes back immediately claiming it cannot write. I see no sign any access
has occured at this point.
If I try to repair the disk, it tells me to contact a service specialist
and mentions error 200/662. There's no error 200 listed in the Lisa
repair manual, but 662 is ProFile parity error. It's hard to believe
that, since the drive passes format and certify on an Apple /// and
MacWorksXL on the Lisa has no problem with it.
I even tried removing the serialization on Office System disk 1. No joy.
Something tells me I'm overlooking the obvious, but darned if I know what
I'm doing wrong.
Steve
--
11 Apr
11 Apr
11:01 a.m.
--- On Sun, 4/10/11, Steven Hirsch <snhirsch at gmail.com> wrote:
If I try to repair the disk, it tells me to contact a
service specialist and mentions error 200/662. There's
no error 200 listed in the Lisa repair manual, but 662 is
ProFile parity error. It's hard to believe that, since
the drive passes format and certify on an Apple /// and
MacWorksXL on the Lisa has no problem with it.
Are you running MacWorks on the same Lisa, or a different one? And can you write to the
disk running MacWorks? Does the Profile pass the test when running LisaTest? Is this the
same Lisa that had battery corrosion on the mouse connector?
What kind of cable are you using to connect the Profile to the Lisa? I've had issues
in the past with the crimp style ribbon cables coming apart at the edge and causing flakey
behavior.
I would double check by popping the card cage out of the Lisa and using a meter to check
between the solder points on the board and the other end of the cable - make sure you
don't have any corroded pins. Of course, pin 7 won't have continuity, since
that's the key pin.
-Ian
1:27 p.m.
On Mon, 11 Apr 2011, Mr Ian Primus wrote:
--- On Sun, 4/10/11, Steven Hirsch <snhirsch at
gmail.com> wrote:
Same machine.
If I try to repair the disk, it tells me to
contact a
service specialist and mentions error 200/662. There's
no error 200 listed in the Lisa repair manual, but 662 is
ProFile parity error. It's hard to believe that, since
the drive passes format and certify on an Apple /// and
MacWorksXL on the Lisa has no problem with it.
Are you running MacWorks on the same Lisa, or a different one? And can
you write to the disk running MacWorks?
Yes, it intializes the ProFile and copies itself. I can then boot
MacWorks from the hard disk, so I know it was really written.
Does the Profile pass the test
when running LisaTest?
No, it fails under LisaTest with the same odd symptoms: No sign that it's
even trying to access the disk! Just goes away for a a bit and announces a
fail. I never see the ProFile light flicker.
I'm starting to wonder if Lisa OS has stricter timing or perhaps checks
parity while MacOS does not.
Is this the same Lisa that had battery corrosion
on the mouse connector?
Yes, but I've cleaned that up since. Are you thinking that something
adjacent was also damaged? If so, why does it work under MacWorks for
both read and write. I'll take another very close look at the connector.
What kind of cable are you using to connect the
Profile to the Lisa?
I've had issues in the past with the crimp style ribbon cables coming
apart at the edge and causing flakey behavior.
I've tried two different ribbon cables, plus a nice shielded ProFile
cable.
I would double check by popping the card cage out of
the Lisa and using
a meter to check between the solder points on the board and the other
end of the cable - make sure you don't have any corroded pins. Of
course, pin 7 won't have continuity, since that's the key pin.
Yes, I agree with that completely. Will start ringing it out this
evening.
--
13 Apr
13 Apr
9:04 a.m.
On Mon, 11 Apr 2011, Steven Hirsch wrote:
Update: I took the plunge (so to speak) and soaked the motherboard and I/O
board in vinegar for a few hours to neutralize any remaining battery
leakage (had previously cleaned it with PCB flux solvent). This seems to
have done the trick, so there must have been some crud embedded where I
could not see it.
LisaTest is now happy with the ProFile. Onward to system installation (as
soon as I receive some disk copies that are on their way).
What I gather from this is that Lisa OS and LisaTest are far fussier in
their interaction with the ProFile than MacWorksXL. Perhaps the line
carrying the parity bit was not making contact and MacWorks wasn't
checking it?
The edge connectors on the rear of the chassis have been getting
progressively flakier as I've inserted and removed the motherboard and
card-cage. I'm going to have to take a divergence and replace the wiring
harnesses before going any further. It appears that the CRT will need to
come out in order to do this - fun!
Finally, does anyone know if there are later copies of the Profile
formatter EPROM floating around? I have one that works on 5M ProFiles,
but the formatter utility always complains about the version being
backlevel. At least one site on the web shows this procedure with no
complaints, so someone must have it. Would appreciate a copy or leads to
anyone who can help.
Steve
--
On Mon, 11 Apr 2011, Mr Ian Primus wrote:
> --- On Sun, 4/10/11, Steven Hirsch <snhirsch at gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> If I try to repair the disk, it tells me to contact a
>> service specialist and mentions error 200/662. There's
>> no error 200 listed in the Lisa repair manual, but 662 is
>> ProFile parity error. It's hard to believe that, since
>> the drive passes format and certify on an Apple /// and
>> MacWorksXL on the Lisa has no problem with it.
>>
Does the
Profile pass the test when running LisaTest?
No, it fails under LisaTest with the same odd symptoms: No sign that it's
even trying to access the disk! Just goes away for a a bit and announces a
fail. I never see the ProFile light flicker.
I'm starting to wonder if Lisa OS has stricter timing or perhaps checks
parity while MacOS does not.
27 Apr
27 Apr
8 a.m.
On Wed, 13 Apr 2011, Steven Hirsch wrote:
On Mon, 11 Apr 2011, Steven Hirsch wrote:
Update: I took the plunge (so to speak) and soaked the motherboard and I/O
board in vinegar for a few hours to neutralize any remaining battery leakage
(had previously cleaned it with PCB flux solvent). This seems to have done
the trick, so there must have been some crud embedded where I could not see
it.
LisaTest is now happy with the ProFile. Onward to system installation (as
soon as I receive some disk copies that are on their way).
I received a known-good set of diskettes for LOS and the various
applications ("tools"). Installation went smoothly and I now have a
fully-functional 7/7 Office System environment.
Next up: Ressurrect the second system.
On Mon, 11 Apr 2011, Mr Ian Primus wrote:
> --- On Sun, 4/10/11, Steven Hirsch <snhirsch at gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> If I try to repair the disk, it tells me to contact a
>> service specialist and mentions error 200/662. There's
>> no error 200 listed in the Lisa repair manual, but 662 is
>> ProFile parity error. It's hard to believe that, since
>> the drive passes format and certify on an Apple /// and
>> MacWorksXL on the Lisa has no problem with it.
>>
Does the
Profile pass the test when running LisaTest?
No, it fails under LisaTest with the same odd symptoms: No sign that it's
even trying to access the disk! Just goes away for a a bit and announces a
fail. I never see the ProFile light flicker.
I'm starting to wonder if Lisa OS has stricter timing or perhaps checks
parity while MacOS does not. Finally, does anyone know if there are later copies of
the Profile formatter
EPROM floating around? I have one that works on 5M ProFiles, but the
formatter utility always complains about the version being backlevel. At
least one site on the web shows this procedure with no complaints, so someone
must have it. Would appreciate a copy or leads to anyone who can help.
I was unable to find a later version of the 5M formatter, but I found a
copy of the 10M formatter that a user in Germany had given me some time
back. It is too large for the Z8 piggyback I'd been using. Just picked
up a 4k ROM piggyback Z8 on eBay and will try with that one.
Steve
--
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