30 Jan
2004
30 Jan
'04
12:41 p.m.
Has anyone gotten the cross compiler successfully built? I keep trying,
and keep failing... 8-)
Cheers,
Chris
31 Jan
31 Jan
3:33 p.m.
"Christopher Cureau" wrote:
Has anyone gotten the cross compiler successfully
built? I keep trying,
and keep failing... 8-)
If anyone (else) is intertested in this, here's what I've learned:
concerning gcc/binuils & pdp-11
- gcc's (3.3.2) backend generates "unix" style asm
- gas wants "gas" style asm and doesn't like the "unix" style asm
- the pdp-11 gcc maintainer knows this and has some fixes which he's
going to release soon
in the mean time,
You can't simply cross compile the "as" from 2.11BSD because it's
written in assembler. (but it sure looks like it was C at point)
The xinu "as11" assembler accepts "unix style" asm and outputs a.out,
but the format is not quite right (the symbols are wrong with no string
table). Not letting that stop me I hacked "as11" such that
binutils-2.14 is happy with the a.out it produces.
I'm going to try and use this to cross compile a few things. We'll see
how it goes.
I could sure use a complete pdp-11 assembler reference (with floating
point) if anyone has one or knows where one is on-line.
-brad
3 Feb
3 Feb
6 a.m.
On Sat, 31 Jan 2004, Brad Parker wrote:
concerning gcc/binuils & pdp-11
- gcc's (3.3.2) backend generates "unix" style asm
- gas wants "gas" style asm and doesn't like the "unix" style
asm
- the pdp-11 gcc maintainer knows this and has some fixes which he's
going to release soon
GCC version 3.x generates code that, um, sucks. For most C-based
programming, there is absolutely no reason to "upgrade" beyond the
older (V2.95.3) release, which works fine with the pdp11 backend.
You can't simply cross compile the "as"
from 2.11BSD because it's
written in assembler. (but it sure looks like it was C at point)
No, UNIX as was
always written in assembler, although they did use
some tools to clean it up later on. Later (non-PDP11) versions were
in C, obviously.
--f
7:27 a.m.
Fred N. van Kempen wrote:
On Sat, 31 Jan 2004, Brad Parker wrote:
Are you sure? I was working in UNIX in 1980 and the 11/23 port was
definitely C.
Maybe ASM earlier? It must have been a narrow window, The machine at OMSI,
the 11/45 was running RSTS. Some of the guys, Barry White and Jim Bacchus
were booting the maching with some "new" OS late at night., this was in
1972.. UNIX?
Jim Davis.
concerning gcc/binuils & pdp-11
- gcc's (3.3.2) backend generates "unix" style asm
- gas wants "gas" style asm and doesn't like the "unix" style asm
- the pdp-11 gcc maintainer knows this and has some fixes which he's
going to release soon
GCC version 3.x generates code that, um, sucks. For most C-based
programming, there is absolutely no reason to "upgrade" beyond the
older (V2.95.3) release, which works fine with the pdp11 backend.
You can't simply cross compile the
"as" from 2.11BSD because it's
written in assembler. (but it sure looks like it was C at point)
No, UNIX as was always written in assembler, although they did use
some tools to clean it up later on. Later (non-PDP11) versions were
in C, obviously.
--f
3:22 p.m.
At 5:27 AM -0800 2/3/04, Jim Davis wrote:
Fred N. van Kempen wrote:
Are you sure? I was working in UNIX in 1980 and the 11/23 port was
definitely C.
Maybe ASM earlier? It must have been a narrow window, The machine at OMSI,
the 11/45 was running RSTS. Some of the guys, Barry White and Jim Bacchus
were booting the maching with some "new" OS late at night., this
was in 1972.. UNIX?
Jim Davis.
Hey, I used that machine. I was a student at Lewis & Clark at the
time. I was on Tek 4010 over dial-up (300 baud maybe) from campus
doing some programming for the EE and Music departments.
John
7:34 a.m.
On Tue, Feb 03, 2004 at 01:00:02PM +0100, Fred N. van Kempen wrote:
Well. Maybe C was modeled after that assembler code. ;-)
--
tsch??,
Jochen
Homepage: http://www.unixag-kl.fh-kl.de/~jkunz/
GCC version 3.x generates code that, um, sucks. For
most C-based
programming, there is absolutely no reason to "upgrade" beyond the
older (V2.95.3) release, which works fine with the pdp11 backend.
GCC 2.95 has
serious problems corss compiling across the LP32 / LP64
boundary. I can say this out of my own experience as a NetBSD hacker.
You can't
simply cross compile the "as" from 2.11BSD because it's
written in assembler. (but it sure looks like it was C at point)
No, UNIX as was
always written in assembler, although they did use
some tools to clean it up later on. Later (non-PDP11) versions were
in C, obviously. 
3 Feb
3 Feb
11:08 a.m.
On Tue, 2004-02-03 at 04:00, Fred N. van Kempen wrote:
Sorry, wrong. Unix was first written in assembler, then re-written in
BCPL and re-written again in C. I know that by v6 (1975) it was mostly
C with assembly for some of the things that couldn't or wouldn't work
well in C.
I don't know exactly when the transition to C happened but I think that
by the time it escaped from Bell Labs (v5) it was C.
--
TTFN - Guy
You can't
simply cross compile the "as" from 2.11BSD because it's
written in assembler. (but it sure looks like it was C at point)
No, UNIX as was
always written in assembler, although they did use
some tools to clean it up later on. Later (non-PDP11) versions were
in C, obviously.
11:27 a.m.
On Tue, 3 Feb 2004, Guy Sotomayor wrote:
Sorry, wrong. Unix was first written in assembler,
then re-written in
BCPL and re-written again in C. I know that by v6 (1975) it was mostly
C with assembly for some of the things that couldn't or wouldn't work
well in C.
Or which they just didnt care about. They changed it in 1973-1974,
to C, but left out fun stuff like the assembler, Basic, troff and
others. V6 was C based as above, V4 and V5 were intermediates.
I don't know exactly when the transition to C
happened but I think that
by the time it escaped from Bell Labs (v5) it was C.
Yes, the change was between
4th and 5th ed., with the 6th ed. being
the "cleaner" one, culminating in a much more portable V7.
--f
7631
days inactive
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8 comments
7 participants
participants (7)
-
brad＠heeltoe.com -
chrisc＠addpower.com -
dundas＠caltech.edu -
ggs＠shiresoft.com -
jimmydevice＠hotmail.com -
jkunz＠unixag-kl.fh-kl.de -
waltje＠pdp11.nl