17 Aug
2014
17 Aug
'14
5:27 p.m.
I've been playing with a couple VaxStations and a qbus PDP11 recently
and have been having trouble with connecting 10Mb ethernet to 100Mb
and 1Gb switches. I have several 10base-T transceivers that I use
since all my 10base2 hardware is in storage.
Today for example, I connected a DELQA in the PDP11 to a 10-100-1000
switch and it did not work. I got out a 10-100 hub and put it between
the PDP11 and the switch and it worked fine.
Another example, my VS4000/60 netboots fine, but NetBSD will not
detect the network interface unless it is connected to the "right"
switch.
All the switches and hubs I am using are from a collection of
unmanaged consumer grade stuff (TRENDnet, ASUS, Linksys, etc.) that I
have accumulated.
Curious if anybody else has similar trouble when mixing old with new
and slow with fast.
-chuck
17 Aug
17 Aug
6:11 p.m.
On Sun, Aug 17, 2014 at 3:27 PM, Charles Dickman <chd at chdickman.com> wrote:
All the switches and hubs I am using are from a
collection of
unmanaged consumer grade stuff (TRENDnet, ASUS, Linksys, etc.) that I
have accumulated.
I've had trouble with Trendnet gigabit switches not talking to some 10
or 100 Mbps devices, and also with two Trendnet gigabit switches not
talking to each other properly.
Of course, Trendnet uses commodity silicon, so it's entirely possible
that other brands of switches might exhibit the same problems.
6:49 p.m.
I've never had any problems getting 10BT devices connected at 100 or 1000
and I've got some fairly old and/or unusual stuff. I'm using an old
SynOptics AUI transceiver on my Meridian PBX, no issues. I have also had
fine results with DEC transceivers. However, I most often use Allied
Telesyn... I have a huge pile of these and they are very compact and
robust. All Cisco equipment on the switch-side.
Best,
Sean
On Sun, Aug 17, 2014 at 6:11 PM, Eric Smith <spacewar at gmail.com> wrote:
On Sun, Aug 17, 2014 at 3:27 PM, Charles Dickman
<chd at chdickman.com>
wrote:
All the switches and hubs I am using are from a
collection of
unmanaged consumer grade stuff (TRENDnet, ASUS, Linksys, etc.) that I
have accumulated.
I've had trouble with Trendnet gigabit switches not talking to some 10
or 100 Mbps devices, and also with two Trendnet gigabit switches not
talking to each other properly.
Of course, Trendnet uses commodity silicon, so it's entirely possible
that other brands of switches might exhibit the same problems.
7:09 p.m.
BTW, it's worthwhile to pick up a nice managed switch; you can get a real
nice vintage Cisco 10/100 switch, managed, 48 ports, maybe even a few GigE
ports on it (ostensibly for uplink but you can use them however), for like
$25-50 on eBay all day long. If Cisco is not your brand, you can go HP,
Force10, Nortel Networks (nee Bay Networks), Avaya, 3Com, these are all
nice though I find the Cisco command line to be very easy to use as they
come (be sure to get one that's CLI-managed, serial and Telnet, not just
Web-managed!)
Plenty of ports for even the largest collections! And with switch prices
being what they are, leave your old hubs in the dust bin...
Having access to a management plane on the switch side, the difference is
like night and day... you can get in there and get debug info, and you can
manually set switch ports at fixed speed and/or duplex for (the rare)
machines that don't want to play nice and autonegotiate. You can use VLANs
to isolate finicky machines or LAN segments where broadcast traffic is
heavy.
A healthy collection of old network (and telecom) gear is just as fun as a
healthy collection of old computer gear! ;)
Best,
Sean
On Sun, Aug 17, 2014 at 6:49 PM, Sean Caron <scaron at umich.edu> wrote:
I've never had any problems getting 10BT devices
connected at 100 or 1000
and I've got some fairly old and/or unusual stuff. I'm using an old
SynOptics AUI transceiver on my Meridian PBX, no issues. I have also had
fine results with DEC transceivers. However, I most often use Allied
Telesyn... I have a huge pile of these and they are very compact and
robust. All Cisco equipment on the switch-side.
Best,
Sean
On Sun, Aug 17, 2014 at 6:11 PM, Eric Smith <spacewar at gmail.com> wrote:
On Sun, Aug 17, 2014 at 3:27 PM, Charles Dickman
<chd at chdickman.com>
wrote:
All the switches and hubs I am using are from a
collection of
unmanaged consumer grade stuff (TRENDnet, ASUS, Linksys, etc.) that I
have accumulated.
I've had trouble with Trendnet gigabit switches not talking to some 10
or 100 Mbps devices, and also with two Trendnet gigabit switches not
talking to each other properly.
Of course, Trendnet uses commodity silicon, so it's entirely possible
that other brands of switches might exhibit the same problems.
18 Aug
18 Aug
10:50 a.m.
As a data point:
I've an old DEC Alpha here, with it's 10BaseT port, connected and
auto-negotaing successfully with an 8 port HP 10/100/1000 ProCurve
switch. In general, my networking folks have been super happy with
the ProCurve stuff since they switched to it about 6 years ago.
--Jason
17 Aug
17 Aug
6:15 p.m.
On 17 August 2014 22:27, Charles Dickman <chd at chdickman.com> wrote:
I've been playing with a couple VaxStations and a
qbus PDP11 recently
and have been having trouble with connecting 10Mb ethernet to 100Mb
and 1Gb switches. I have several 10base-T transceivers that I use
since all my 10base2 hardware is in storage.
Today for example, I connected a DELQA in the PDP11 to a 10-100-1000
switch and it did not work. I got out a 10-100 hub and put it between
the PDP11 and the switch and it worked fine.
Another example, my VS4000/60 netboots fine, but NetBSD will not
detect the network interface unless it is connected to the "right"
switch.
All the switches and hubs I am using are from a collection of
unmanaged consumer grade stuff (TRENDnet, ASUS, Linksys, etc.) that I
have accumulated.
Curious if anybody else has similar trouble when mixing old with new
and slow with fast.
I have a Mac SE/30 scsi/ethernet adaptor which only works with 10 or
possibly 10/100 hubs (definitely not any of a selection of 10/100 or
10/100/Gb switches I tried)...
6:50 p.m.
On Aug 17, 2014, at 17:27, Charles Dickman <chd at chdickman.com> wrote:
Curious if anybody else has similar trouble when mixing old with new
and slow with fast.
Put shortly, yes. I believe (but have not confirmed) that it has to do with
autonegotiation from the faster switch not playing nicely with 10BaseT hardware not
designed for autonegotiation. The chief symptom I tend to see is about a ~1s vacillation
between link up and down on the switch.
A slower switch or hub in between seems to help, as you've noted. I've found the
problem with a lot of old Mac Ethernet cards, a lot of which we're based on National
Semiconductor silicon (SONIC, ST-NIC chips and variants), but I'm sure it's not
unique; it also seems to mostly be confined to crappier switches (my managed 24-port
gigabit switch had no problems with my DELQA).
- Dave
19 Aug
19 Aug
7:39 p.m.
New subject: FFS: SMC EZ108 10/100 switch, was Re: Using 10Mb Ethernet with 1Gigabit switches
If it'll help anybody, I've got an SMC "EZ Switch 100" or EZ108: A 1U,
10/100, auto-negotiating Ethernet switch suitable for rack mounting
(ears are missing). Front bargraph LED display can be configured to show
link status, utilization%, forwarding%, collision%, a couple others.
Will accept AC or DC (5V @ 17A, 12V @ 0.35) power.
Bought for a project in 2001 and left sitting in the original box since
then. Just powered it up and tested, working well with a thin client on
one side and a TRENDnet desktop GigE switch on the other.
Boxed, it weighs in at 9.5 pounds. Original foamed plastic
padding/cradle is in fine condition.
Free for cost of shipping from California (94703). PayPal preferred;
donations to the local beer fund gladly accepted. Next week this fine
piece of department-class networking equipment will head to eBay for a
bit, then a recycler.
Overview at http://www.bomara.com/SMC/ezswitch100.htm
Thanks,
--Steve.
3620
days inactive
3622
days old
7 comments
7 participants
participants (7)
-
abs＠absd.org -
chd＠chdickman.com -
classiccmp＠crash.com -
fraveydank＠gmail.com -
jason＠smbfc.net -
scaron＠umich.edu -
spacewar＠gmail.com