5 Jun
2016
5 Jun
'16
5:33 a.m.
From: Rod Smallwood
I discovered the RX211 needed to be in CDEF and not
ABCD.
Is _that_ what it was? I'd have never figured that out in a million years!
I'm utterly amazed you didn't fry it - I forget whether the slot you plugged
it into was a MUD (hex) slot, or one of the SPC slots (I know the 11/84
backplane has some MUD and some SPC, but I don't know about the /94, and I'm
too lazy to look) - but there are some odd voltages on various pins.
If you try to boot the RX02 in 11/84 mode you get
...
Unexpected trap to location 114
Well, 0114 is the 'memory system error' vector - i.e. parity, or
un-recoverable ECC error. I'm a bit surprised you're getting that, as I'd
have assumed the boot ROMs test all the memory.
I'm too lazy to read the 11/94 and J-11 manuals to see what the 11/94 has in
the way of registers that record memory issues (the 11/73 has, for instance,
a Memory System Error Register at 17777744), but that's the next step.
R6 = 172276
That seems a bit odd - the stack pointer is pointing into I/0 space? 772276
is the last Supervisor mode Data space PAR - maybe it's using those registers
as a temporary stack?
Noel
5 Jun
5 Jun
11:39 a.m.
On 6/5/2016 5:33 AM, Noel Chiappa wrote:
If the firmware got an error it would seem the first order of business
would be to go to the processor registers, store out the error info
wherever, and halt and catch fire.
I wonder if the boardset that was in the wrong slot might have had
something fried that could create the error.
thanks
Jim
Well, 0114 is the 'memory system error' vector
- i.e. parity, or
un-recoverable ECC error.
<snip>
R6 = 172276
That seems a bit odd - the stack pointer is pointing into I/0 space? 772276
is the last Supervisor mode Data space PAR - maybe it's using those registers
as a temporary stack?
Noel 
1:03 p.m.
On 05/06/2016 19:39, jwsmobile wrote:
On 6/5/2016 5:33 AM, Noel Chiappa wrote:
If the firmware got an error it would seem the first order of business
would be to go to the processor registers, store out the error info
wherever, and halt and catch fire.
I wonder if the boardset that was in the wrong slot might have had
something fried that could create the error.
thanks
Jim
The board that went in did not get fried, baked or boiled. Its twin
brother that only went into the correct location produces the exact same
results.
The RX is clearly alive, The motor runs, belt tension is good and you
can hear the heads load.
I have a box full of 8" floppies. BTW how many 8" floppies do you think
there were in an RT11 distribution?
So the question then arises what next? If we look at what an 11/94 is
then its a single board CPU and a power control card in a three slot
back plane. There after its UNIBUS So is there any thing we can put in
the spare QBUS slot without doing any damage?
Regards
Rod
Well, 0114 is the 'memory system error'
vector - i.e. parity, or
un-recoverable ECC error.
<snip>
R6 = 172276
That seems a bit odd - the stack pointer is pointing into I/0 space?
772276
is the last Supervisor mode Data space PAR - maybe it's using those
registers
as a temporary stack?
Noel 
1:54 p.m.
The board that
went in did not get fried, baked or boiled. Its twin
brother that only went into
the correct location produces the exact same
results.
The RX is clearly alive, The motor runs, belt tension is good and you can
hear the heads load. I have a box full of 8" floppies. BTW how many
8" floppies do you think
there were in an RT11 distribution?
So the question then arises what next? If we look at what an 11/94 is
then its a single board CPU and a power control card in a three slot back
plane. There after its UNIBUS So is there any thing we can put in the
spare QBUS slot without doing any damage?
Regards
Rod
/Mattis
7:51 p.m.
Rod Smallwood wrote:
[Snip]
The RX is clearly alive, The motor runs, belt tension is good and you
can hear the heads load.
I have a box full of 8" floppies. BTW how many 8" floppies do you
think there were in an RT11 distribution?
I can't remember for sure, but I think there were eight SSDD (RX02) floppies
plus an Auto-Install floppy. That would have been for V05.06 of RT-11 which
requires over 6,800 blocks for an RL02 disk pack. Since some of the files
get duplicated, eight seems about right.
I doubt that V05.07 of RT-11 from Mentec was ever supported on RX02
floppies. The size of the binary distribution for V05.07 of RT-11 is over
16,600 blocks on an RL02 disk pack of which over 9,000 blocks are
DSK files (one of which is 7,000 blocks) which Mentec added to the
V05.07 RT-11 distribution.
Using RX01 floppies will take many more since there are only half the blocks
or 494 blocks on a SSSD (RX01) floppy.
Do you have any other questions? I don't know of any RT-11 distributions
on RX02 image files for either V05.06 or V05.07 of RT-11. There may
be some for earlier versions.
Do you have any other questions?
Jerome Fine
8:58 p.m.
On 06/06/2016 03:51, Jerome H. Fine wrote:
The first one out of the box read 1/87 and its not the date.
R
Rod Smallwood
wrote:
[Snip]
The RX is clearly alive, The motor runs, belt tension is good and you
can hear the heads load.
I have a box full of 8" floppies. BTW how many 8" floppies do you
think there were in an RT11 distribution?
I can't remember for sure, but I think there were eight SSDD (RX02)
floppies
plus an Auto-Install floppy. That would have been for V05.06 of RT-11
which
requires over 6,800 blocks for an RL02 disk pack. Since some of the
files
get duplicated, eight seems about right.
I doubt that V05.07 of RT-11 from Mentec was ever supported on RX02
floppies. The size of the binary distribution for V05.07 of RT-11 is
over
16,600 blocks on an RL02 disk pack of which over 9,000 blocks are
DSK files (one of which is 7,000 blocks) which Mentec added to the
V05.07 RT-11 distribution.
Using RX01 floppies will take many more since there are only half the
blocks
or 494 blocks on a SSSD (RX01) floppy.
Do you have any other questions? I don't know of any RT-11 distributions
on RX02 image files for either V05.06 or V05.07 of RT-11. There may
be some for earlier versions.
Do you have any other questions?
Jerome Fine
6 Jun
6 Jun
2:36 a.m.
Rod Smallwood wrote:
> On 06/06/2016 03:51, Jerome H. Fine wrote:
>
>> Rod Smallwood wrote:
>>
>>> I have a box full of 8" floppies. BTW how many 8" floppies do you
>>> think there were in an RT11 distribution?
>>
>> I can't remember for sure, but I think there were eight SSDD (RX02)
>> floppies
>> plus an Auto-Install floppy. That would have been for V05.06 of
>> RT-11 which
>> requires over 6,800 blocks for an RL02 disk pack. Since some of the
>> files
>> get duplicated, eight seems about right.
>>
>> I doubt that V05.07 of RT-11 from Mentec was ever supported on RX02
>> floppies. The size of the binary distribution for V05.07 of RT-11 is
>> over
>> 16,600 blocks on an RL02 disk pack of which over 9,000 blocks are
>> DSK files (one of which is 7,000 blocks) which Mentec added to the
>> V05.07 RT-11 distribution.
>>
>> Using RX01 floppies will take many more since there are only half the
>> blocks
>> or 494 blocks on a SSSD (RX01) floppy.
>>
>> Do you have any other questions? I don't know of any RT-11
>> distributions
>> on RX02 image files for either V05.06 or V05.07 of RT-11. There may
>> be some for earlier versions.
>
> The first one out of the box read 1/87 and its not the date.
Can you provide a DIR of the first few floppies? The names and
sizes of the files will pin down which version of RT-11 if the
actual dates were not correct. Otherwise, the dates of the files,
if they are correct, will specify the version of RT-11 if the dates
are 1983 (or after) when V05.00 of RT-11 was released. Before
1983, there were many updates, so there is more confusion.
Internally, each SAV file has a version and each MAC file also
has a version number which will also help identify the file aside
from a BINCOM to compare two files.
Jerome Fine
8:17 a.m.
On 06/06/2016 10:36, Jerome H. Fine wrote:
Hi Jerome
It a little difficult to do a dir when I have yet to get the drive I
would do it on working
So I'm just inventorying this box of 8" floppies.
There are a number (14) of clear packages with DEC original sets in
They are marked
RT-11 , RT11 V4.5B or RT11 V4.5C
Plus loose disks with RT11 utilities
and OS/8 disks
I do have a pair of RX01's but I am less sure about the controller.
Also available is a TK50 UNIBUS CONTROLLER not a TUK50 CONTROLLER as
sometimes described.
Rod
Rod Smallwood
wrote:
> On 06/06/2016 03:51, Jerome H. Fine wrote:
>
>> Rod Smallwood wrote:
>>
>>> I have a box full of 8" floppies. BTW how many 8" floppies do you
>>> think there were in an RT11 distribution?
>>
>> I can't remember for sure, but I think there were eight SSDD (RX02)
>> floppies
>> plus an Auto-Install floppy. That would have been for V05.06 of
>> RT-11 which
>> requires over 6,800 blocks for an RL02 disk pack. Since some of the
>> files
>> get duplicated, eight seems about right.
>>
>> I doubt that V05.07 of RT-11 from Mentec was ever supported on RX02
>> floppies. The size of the binary distribution for V05.07 of RT-11
>> is over
>> 16,600 blocks on an RL02 disk pack of which over 9,000 blocks are
>> DSK files (one of which is 7,000 blocks) which Mentec added to the
>> V05.07 RT-11 distribution.
>>
>> Using RX01 floppies will take many more since there are only half
>> the blocks
>> or 494 blocks on a SSSD (RX01) floppy.
>>
>> Do you have any other questions? I don't know of any RT-11
>> distributions
>> on RX02 image files for either V05.06 or V05.07 of RT-11. There may
>> be some for earlier versions.
>
> The first one out of the box read 1/87 and its not the date.
Can you provide a DIR of the first few floppies? The names and
sizes of the files will pin down which version of RT-11 if the
actual dates were not correct. Otherwise, the dates of the files,
if they are correct, will specify the version of RT-11 if the dates
are 1983 (or after) when V05.00 of RT-11 was released. Before
1983, there were many updates, so there is more confusion.
Internally, each SAV file has a version and each MAC file also
has a version number which will also help identify the file aside
from a BINCOM to compare two files.
Jerome Fine
7 Jun
7 Jun
4:12 a.m.
Rod Smallwood wrote:
> >On 06/06/2016 10:36, Jerome H. Fine wrote:
>
>> Rod Smallwood wrote:
>>
>>> >On 06/06/2016 03:51, Jerome H. Fine wrote:
>>>
>>>> Rod Smallwood wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> I have a box full of 8" floppies. BTW how many 8" floppies
do you
>>>>> think there were in an RT11 distribution?
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> I can't remember for sure, but I think there were eight SSDD (RX02)
>>>> floppies
>>>> plus an Auto-Install floppy. That would have been for V05.06 of
>>>> RT-11 which
>>>> requires over 6,800 blocks for an RL02 disk pack. Since some of
>>>> the files
>>>> get duplicated, eight seems about right.
>>>>
>>>> I doubt that V05.07 of RT-11 from Mentec was ever supported on RX02
>>>> floppies. The size of the binary distribution for V05.07 of RT-11
>>>> is over
>>>> 16,600 blocks on an RL02 disk pack of which over 9,000 blocks are
>>>> DSK files (one of which is 7,000 blocks) which Mentec added to the
>>>> V05.07 RT-11 distribution.
>>>>
>>>> Using RX01 floppies will take many more since there are only half
>>>> the blocks
>>>> or 494 blocks on a SSSD (RX01) floppy.
>>>>
>>>> Do you have any other questions? I don't know of any RT-11
>>>> distributions
>>>> on RX02 image files for either V05.06 or V05.07 of RT-11. There may
>>>> be some for earlier versions.
>>>
>>>
>>> The first one out of the box read 1/87 and its not the date.
>>
>> Can you provide a DIR of the first few floppies? The names and
>> sizes of the files will pin down which version of RT-11 if the
>> actual dates were not correct. Otherwise, the dates of the files,
>> if they are correct, will specify the version of RT-11 if the dates
>> are 1983 (or after) when V05.00 of RT-11 was released. Before
>> 1983, there were many updates, so there is more confusion.
>>
>> Internally, each SAV file has a version and each MAC file also
>> has a version number which will also help identify the file aside
>> from a BINCOM to compare two files.
>
> It a little difficult to do a dir when I have yet to get the drive I
> would do it on working
> So I'm just inventorying this box of 8" floppies.
>
> There are a number (14) of clear packages with DEC original sets in
> They are marked
> RT-11 , RT11 V4.5B or RT11 V4.5C
> Plus loose disks with RT11 utilities
> and OS/8 disks
> I do have a pair of RX01's but I am less sure about the controller.
>
> Also available is a TK50 UNIBUS CONTROLLER not a TUK50 CONTROLLER as
> sometimes described.
The only two relevant dates that I am confident of are for the RT-11
binary distributions of:
RT-11 V04.00 February 28th, 1980 152 files 3213 blocks
RT-11 V05.00 March 12th, 1983 182 files 4026 blocks
I assume that you may have distributions for V04.05B of RT-11 and
V04.05C of RT-11. I seem to remember that between 1980 and 1982,
DEC provided update files to users who were paying for the update
service and that the users may have been responsible for applying the
updates to their distributions in order to keep their RT-11 distributions
up-to-date.
If you have any additional information, please let us know and we can
attempt to figure things out.
Jerome Fine
4:50 a.m.
On 07/06/2016 12:12, Jerome H. Fine wrote:
Well I have moved on a bit more.
My 11/83 is back together and booting RT on the RD53 via the RQDX3
as normal.
I found not one but two RXV21 RX02 controllers. So I'll give them a
try in the 11/83 and see what happens.
I'll soon know if the RX02 is good or not. If not I'll fix it (my era - TTL)
Regards
Rod
Rod Smallwood
wrote:
> >On 06/06/2016 10:36, Jerome H. Fine wrote:
>
>> Rod Smallwood wrote:
>>
>>> >On 06/06/2016 03:51, Jerome H. Fine wrote:
>>>
>>>> Rod Smallwood wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> I have a box full of 8" floppies. BTW how many 8" floppies
do you
>>>>> think there were in an RT11 distribution?
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> I can't remember for sure, but I think there were eight SSDD
>>>> (RX02) floppies
>>>> plus an Auto-Install floppy. That would have been for V05.06 of
>>>> RT-11 which
>>>> requires over 6,800 blocks for an RL02 disk pack. Since some of
>>>> the files
>>>> get duplicated, eight seems about right.
>>>>
>>>> I doubt that V05.07 of RT-11 from Mentec was ever supported on RX02
>>>> floppies. The size of the binary distribution for V05.07 of RT-11
>>>> is over
>>>> 16,600 blocks on an RL02 disk pack of which over 9,000 blocks are
>>>> DSK files (one of which is 7,000 blocks) which Mentec added to the
>>>> V05.07 RT-11 distribution.
>>>>
>>>> Using RX01 floppies will take many more since there are only half
>>>> the blocks
>>>> or 494 blocks on a SSSD (RX01) floppy.
>>>>
>>>> Do you have any other questions? I don't know of any RT-11
>>>> distributions
>>>> on RX02 image files for either V05.06 or V05.07 of RT-11. There may
>>>> be some for earlier versions.
>>>
>>>
>>> The first one out of the box read 1/87 and its not the date.
>>
>> Can you provide a DIR of the first few floppies? The names and
>> sizes of the files will pin down which version of RT-11 if the
>> actual dates were not correct. Otherwise, the dates of the files,
>> if they are correct, will specify the version of RT-11 if the dates
>> are 1983 (or after) when V05.00 of RT-11 was released. Before
>> 1983, there were many updates, so there is more confusion.
>>
>> Internally, each SAV file has a version and each MAC file also
>> has a version number which will also help identify the file aside
>> from a BINCOM to compare two files.
>
> It a little difficult to do a dir when I have yet to get the drive I
> would do it on working
> So I'm just inventorying this box of 8" floppies.
>
> There are a number (14) of clear packages with DEC original sets in
> They are marked
> RT-11 , RT11 V4.5B or RT11 V4.5C
> Plus loose disks with RT11 utilities
> and OS/8 disks
> I do have a pair of RX01's but I am less sure about the controller.
>
> Also available is a TK50 UNIBUS CONTROLLER not a TUK50 CONTROLLER as
> sometimes described.
The only two relevant dates that I am confident of are for the RT-11
binary distributions of:
RT-11 V04.00 February 28th, 1980 152 files 3213 blocks
RT-11 V05.00 March 12th, 1983 182 files 4026 blocks
I assume that you may have distributions for V04.05B of RT-11 and
V04.05C of RT-11. I seem to remember that between 1980 and 1982,
DEC provided update files to users who were paying for the update
service and that the users may have been responsible for applying the
updates to their distributions in order to keep their RT-11 distributions
up-to-date.
If you have any additional information, please let us know and we can
attempt to figure things out.
Jerome Fine
8:21 p.m.
Rod Smallwood wrote:
[Snip]
My 11/83 is back together and booting RT on the RD53 via the RQDX3
as normal.
Just a suggestion.
Everyone that has mentioned the RD53 has mentioned that
eventually (unfortunately sooner rather than later) the heads
end up sticking. There has been an extensive description
of what to do, but it does usually require a clean room to
perform - although many have managed without that by
doing it inside a plastic bag.
So do NOT depend on any files on the RD53 since they
can disappear without warning.
Jerome Fine
7:06 a.m.
New subject: Osborne 1 in San Antonio
All,
this advertisement appeared yesterday in my company newsletter classifieds:
Working Osborne 1982 Computer, model OCC-1, S/N 119840, with Users Reference Guide,
software programs: Word Star, Lotus 1-2-3, Pearl, Chef, Paschal, MSBasic, Super Calc, and
CBasic. $150. Pictures available. Contact Athena at hough@ gvtc.com or 210-445-0780.
It is not likely to be a scam as only SwRI employees are allowed to place ads, but I have
not contacted the seller directly. Other than being employed at the same place, no
connection to the seller. She does not mention whether she?s willing to ship; I would
expect not but might be convinced for a high enough offer.
- Mark
3118
days inactive
3121
days old
11 comments
6 participants
participants (6)
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jhfinedp3k＠compsys.to -
jnc＠mercury.lcs.mit.edu -
jws＠jwsss.com -
mattislind＠gmail.com -
mtapley＠swri.edu -
rodsmallwood52＠btinternet.com