19 Aug
1998
19 Aug
'98
6:47 a.m.
At 12:17 AM 8/19/98 -0400, William Donzelli wrote:
I am also now the proud owner of an SGI 4D/380 (and most of another
4D/380). Physically it is in very good shape, but apparently it is quite
sick. 8 processors, buckets of SIMMs, neeto graphics, but the best thing
is the "CPU Power Meter" on the front of the cabinet...
Does anyone have IRIX on 1/4" tape?
With SGI, you're dealing with a (barely? :-) still existent company.
You're supposed to buy IRIX, not copy it. On the other hand, is
there any evidence that an IRIX license was transferred to you
as part of the deal on this machine? Buying a second SGI box that
comes with a license will be cheaper than buying it from SGI. :-)
Ask the experts on news at comp.sys.sgi.*.
- John
19 Aug
19 Aug
5:13 a.m.
It was thus said that the Great John Foust once stated:
At 12:17 AM 8/19/98 -0400, William Donzelli wrote:
Another problem is that nearly each machine used a unique MIPS processor
which were more source compatible than binary compatible. Well, that isn't
exactly true---the opcodes were the same, but each MIPS processor has a
slightly different pipeline and code compiled for one MIPS chip (say, the
R3000) might not work correctly (or work at all) for another (say, the
R10000).
Another thing---early SGI boxes were more stable than later ones. The one
I used for four years (SGI Personal Iris 4D/35) had the mother board
replaced once, the graphics card replaced once and the monitor was going
(everything had a slight green tinge to it).
I enjoyed working on the box, but the hardware flakiness got to me after
a while. I was also upset when I had to upgrade the OS from 3.3.2 (last
version to run NeWS (much better than X)) to 4.0.1 (first version based on
X). Also, avoid IRIX 5.x at all costs (it was their worst version, and
quite possibly the worst version of UNIX this side of SCO).
I'm not fond of the machines now and 6.x is okay at best.
-spc (The 4D/35 I used is now seven years old. New (with the TV video
I/O card we had) it cost $35,000. After four years it was maybe
worth $1,000. Talk about depreciation!)
I am also now the proud owner of an SGI 4D/380 (and most of another
4D/380). Physically it is in very good shape, but apparently it is quite
sick. 8 processors, buckets of SIMMs, neeto graphics, but the best thing
is the "CPU Power Meter" on the front of the cabinet...
Does anyone have IRIX on 1/4" tape?
With SGI, you're dealing with a (barely? :-) still existent company.
You're supposed to buy IRIX, not copy it. On the other hand, is
there any evidence that an IRIX license was transferred to you
as part of the deal on this machine? Buying a second SGI box that
comes with a license will be cheaper than buying it from SGI. :-)
Ask the experts on news at comp.sys.sgi.*. 
7:26 a.m.
Another problem is that nearly each machine used a
unique MIPS processor
which were more source compatible than binary compatible. Well, that isn't
exactly true---the opcodes were the same, but each MIPS processor has a
slightly different pipeline and code compiled for one MIPS chip (say, the
R3000) might not work correctly (or work at all) for another (say, the
R10000).
This really is no different from the early SPARC boxes - Sun-4 really did
not like Sun-4c, etc..
Another thing---early SGI boxes were more stable
than later ones. The one
I used for four years (SGI Personal Iris 4D/35) had the mother board
replaced once, the graphics card replaced once and the monitor was going
(everything had a slight green tinge to it).
Luckily I think I have enough spares. I even yanked the backplane out of
the donor machine. The two machines had different graphics boards - more
research I need to do (first I need to get the box out of the van!).
I enjoyed working on the box, but the hardware
flakiness got to me after
a while. I was also upset when I had to upgrade the OS from 3.3.2 (last
version to run NeWS (much better than X)) to 4.0.1 (first version based on
X). Also, avoid IRIX 5.x at all costs (it was their worst version, and
quite possibly the worst version of UNIX this side of SCO).
I think the IRIX support for the Power Series (or probably most of the 4D/
machines) died around v5.0.x.
William Donzelli
william(a)ans.net
8:50 a.m.
On Wed, 19 Aug 1998, William Donzelli wrote:
Captain Napalm wrote:
> Another problem is that nearly each machine used a unique MIPS processor
> which were more source compatible than binary compatible. Well, that isn't
> exactly true---the opcodes were the same, but each MIPS processor has a
> slightly different pipeline and code compiled for one MIPS chip (say, the
> R3000) might not work correctly (or work at all) for another (say, the
> R10000).
Code compiled for the MIPS-I instruction set (for the R2000/R3000) should
run on later MIPS-II through MIPS-IV machines. Running old MIPS-I code on
an R10000 is extremely inefficient, but it works. SGI's change in object
file formats (from COFF to ELF) and use of several different ABIs (o32,
n32, n64) in their recent OSes seems to cause more compatibility problems
than the differences between the MIPS chips themselves.
I think the IRIX support for the Power Series (or
probably most of the 4D/
machines) died around v5.0.x.
IRIX 5.3 will run on a Power Series (or any other 4D) machine, as long as
the graphics subsystem is supported. GTX, VGX, and Reality Engine should
all work. 5.3 uses more memory than the earlier versions, but I run it
relatively comfortably on a 4D/35 with 32 MB of RAM. IRIX 6.x will not
run on the 32-bit R2000/R3000 processors.
I don't know if the Merced/NT announcement a few months ago is
responsible, but there seems to be a glut of SGI gear on the used
equipment market right now. Hobbyist licenses for old versions of IRIX
would be great, if SGI could be convinced to do such a thing.
If you haven't found it already, there is some useful information about
the 4D series machines (including connector pinouts, specifications, and
power requirements) at
http://www.geocities.com/SiliconValley/Pines/2258/4dfaq.html
--
Scott Ware ware(a)xtal.pharm.nwu.edu
8:59 a.m.
On Wed, 19 Aug 1998, Captain Napalm wrote:
Another thing---early SGI boxes were more stable
than later ones. The one
I used for four years (SGI Personal Iris 4D/35) had the mother board
replaced once, the graphics card replaced once and the monitor was going
(everything had a slight green tinge to it).
The 4D/35 is widely regarded as flakey at best. Much more troublesome than
both the 4D/25 that came before and the Indigo R3000 that replaced it.
I have an R4600 Indy and an R4400 Indigo. I wish the Indy were faster and
that IRIX suffered less from "not-invented-here", but there it is.
ok
r.
8:36 a.m.
It was thus said that the Great R. Stricklin once stated:
On Wed, 19 Aug 1998, Captain Napalm wrote:
How odd. It was originally a 4D/25 that was upgraded (motherboard
replacement) to the 4D/35 (and not because it needed fixing---my bosses
wanted the 4D/35 but it wasn't available at the time it was purchased).
Another thing---early SGI boxes were more
stable than later ones. The one
I used for four years (SGI Personal Iris 4D/35) had the mother board
replaced once, the graphics card replaced once and the monitor was going
(everything had a slight green tinge to it).
The 4D/35 is widely regarded as flakey at best. Much more troublesome than
both the 4D/25 that came before and the Indigo R3000 that replaced it. I have an R4600 Indy and an R4400 Indigo. I wish the
Indy were faster and
that IRIX suffered less from "not-invented-here", but there it is.
IRIX (at least 3.3.2 and 4.0.1) seem to be pretty much stock SYSV with BSD
extentions to me. I did like the administrative tools and the login screen
was great! (it showed a picture for each user and you could replace the
default picture with one of your own)
-spc (Find it odd that the Challenger series is headless ... )
7:20 a.m.
With SGI, you're dealing with a (barely? :-) still
existent company.
Yes, I know. I hope they do not go away. And the damn weenies want to go
with Merced...
You're supposed to buy IRIX, not copy it. On the
other hand, is
there any evidence that an IRIX license was transferred to you
as part of the deal on this machine? Buying a second SGI box that
comes with a license will be cheaper than buying it from SGI. :-)
Well, I am hoping that eventually SGI becomes nice and lets individual
hackers like me play with IRIX, like DEC or Sun has with their OSes.
Ask the experts on news at comp.sys.sgi.*.
I tried to get a very old version of IRIX for my Motorola based IRIS
2500T, and was blasted by the "cops" on the group. These people need to
get real - who the even runs IRIX v2.0 anymore?!
William Donzelli
william(a)ans.net
9475
days inactive
9475
days old
6 comments
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participants (5)
-
jfoust＠threedee.com -
red＠bears.org -
spc＠armigeron.com -
ware＠xtal.pharm.nwu.edu -
william＠ans.net