9 Sep
2006
9 Sep
'06
3:42 a.m.
Is there any problem with punching the left side of a floppy so you
can write to the other side of a floppy in a 1541 drive?
Zane
--
| Zane H. Healy | UNIX Systems Administrator |
| healyzh at aracnet.com (primary) | OpenVMS Enthusiast |
| MONK::HEALYZH (DECnet) | Classic Computer Collector |
+----------------------------------+----------------------------+
| Empire of the Petal Throne and Traveller Role Playing, |
| PDP-10 Emulation and Zane's Computer Museum. |
| http://www.aracnet.com/~healyzh/ |
9 Sep
9 Sep
3:48 a.m.
On Sat, 9 Sep 2006, Zane H. Healy wrote:
Is there any problem with punching the left side of a
floppy so you
can write to the other side of a floppy in a 1541 drive?
Nope. Lots of people did that. You used to be able to buy special hole
punches for making a square notch exactly where it needs to be.
--
David Griffith
dgriffi at cs.csubak.edu
A: Because it fouls the order in which people normally read text.
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11 Sep
11 Sep
11:28 a.m.
And thusly were the wise words spake by David Griffith
On Sat, 9 Sep 2006, Zane H. Healy wrote:
I have even used scissors in a pinch. You just need another floppy to
help line up the notch.
Cheers,
Bryan
Is there any problem with punching the left side
of a floppy so you
can write to the other side of a floppy in a 1541 drive?
Nope. Lots of people did that. You used to be able to buy special hole
punches for making a square notch exactly where it needs to be.
11:44 a.m.
On Mon, 11 Sep 2006, Bryan Pope wrote:
I used to do the same thing with a narrow-bladed Xacto knife.
Mike Loewen mloewen at cpumagic.scol.pa.us
Old Technology http://ripsaw.cac.psu.edu/~mloewen/Oldtech/
On Sat, 9 Sep
2006, Zane H. Healy wrote:
I have even used scissors in a pinch. You just need another floppy to
help line up the notch. Is there any problem with punching the left side
of a floppy so you
can write to the other side of a floppy in a 1541 drive?
Nope. Lots of people did that. You used to be able to buy special hole
punches for making a square notch exactly where it needs to be.
9 Sep
9 Sep
12:01 p.m.
On Sep 9, 2006, at 3:42 AM, Zane H. Healy wrote:
Is there any problem with punching the left side of a
floppy so you
can write to the other side of a floppy in a 1541 drive?
My best friend did that in high school with his C64/1541, and I did
it with my Atari 800/810. These are very dusty neurons, but I'm fairly
certain neither of us had any difficulties.
-Dave
--
Dave McGuire
Cape Coral, FL
2:26 p.m.
On Saturday 09 September 2006 03:42 am, Zane H. Healy wrote:
Is there any problem with punching the left side of a
floppy so you
can write to the other side of a floppy in a 1541 drive?
I knew of folks that did this all the time. What I remember reading about the
practice back when was that some folks thought it not to be a good idea
because they said that the liner of the floppy's package was supposed to
"sweep up" any loose particles of oxide or any other contaminants and that
reversing the direction of rotation would cut all of this stuff loose.
My one machine which uses single-sided drives is my Osborne Executive, and I
never did that bit myself. One time a guy sent me some software on a floppy
where he had done that and I was unable to load all of the info on the second
side, and kept running into errors. Whether this was due to the above or
there was too much wear on the disk or it was something else I couldn't
really say.
--
Member of the toughest, meanest, deadliest, most unrelenting -- and
ablest -- form of life in this section of space, a critter that can
be killed but can't be tamed. --Robert A. Heinlein, "The Puppet Masters"
-
Information is more dangerous than cannon to a society ruled by lies. --James
M Dakin
3:30 p.m.
On 9/9/2006 at 2:26 PM Roy J. Tellason wrote:
I knew of folks that did this all the time. What I
remember reading about
the practice back when was that some folks thought it not to be a good
idea
because they said that the liner of the floppy's
package was supposed to
"sweep up" any loose particles of oxide or any other contaminants and that
reversing the direction of rotation would cut all of
this stuff loose.
I've got a few 8" diskettes that are punched to be "flippies" by the
factory; i.e., there are two index apertures (with a mirror offset) punched
in the jacket and labels on both sides.
I don't think it does much harm to use your diskettes this way.
Cheers,
Chuck
5:22 p.m.
Chuck Guzis wrote:
I've got a few 8" diskettes that are punched
to be "flippies" by the
factory; i.e., there are two index apertures (with a mirror offset) punched
in the jacket and labels on both sides.
I don't think it does much harm to use your diskettes this way.
It doesn't. The C64 flippy disks worked just fine. The 1541 didn't
care about the index hole at all. The floppies that didn't work were
early generations of SS/DD 5.25". Early on, they really were single
sided and could fail.
Later on, even the ones labeled SS/DD were actually DS/DD because it was
easier to manufacture DS/DD's and label them as both.
I used a normal hole puncher to make these. Didn't bother with a
special square one. Worked just fine as long as you aligned the hole
properly.
You shouldn't use DS/HD floppies with the 1541 as the r/w head doesn't
have the proper power to handle to coercivity of high density disks.
(Not sure if that would be ok with the 1571's.)
The only real worry was dirt since you're now spinning the disk
backwards when you put it in upside down. As long as it spins in only
one direction, dirt tends to stick to the inner cladding or whatever
it's called. When you put them in upside down, they spin backwards
releasing some of the dirt back onto the cookie.
In real life however, the only time I had any problems it was due to
magnetic interference or bending when not too careful.
5:32 p.m.
On 9/9/2006 at 5:22 PM Ray Arachelian wrote:
You shouldn't use DS/HD floppies with the 1541 as
the r/w head doesn't
have the proper power to handle to coercivity of high density disks.
(Not sure if that would be ok with the 1571's.)
I doubt that they would work well at all in the 1571. "360K" media is
still the best bet.
11:34 p.m.
At 5:22 PM -0400 9/9/06, Ray Arachelian wrote:
Later on, even the ones labeled SS/DD were actually
DS/DD because it was
easier to manufacture DS/DD's and label them as both.
The ones I'm using are old DS/DD disks that I had in a closet. The
pack I opened last night is probably 10-20 years old :^)
I used a normal hole puncher to make these. Didn't
bother with a
special square one. Worked just fine as long as you aligned the hole
properly.
Can't believe it, but I actually had to buy one today while I was
out! I'd love one of the proper notchers, but don't think there is
much chance of getting one.
The only real worry was dirt since you're now
spinning the disk
backwards when you put it in upside down. As long as it spins in only
one direction, dirt tends to stick to the inner cladding or whatever
it's called. When you put them in upside down, they spin backwards
releasing some of the dirt back onto the cookie.
The disks I'll be notching, are brand new, and/or have been stored in
sealed containers. Managed to also find some the plastic storage
boxes that hold 5-10 floppies and seal up in storage today. So
hopefully I'll be able to minimize any dirt problems.
Zane
--
| Zane H. Healy | UNIX Systems Administrator |
| healyzh at aracnet.com (primary) | OpenVMS Enthusiast |
| MONK::HEALYZH (DECnet) | Classic Computer Collector |
+----------------------------------+----------------------------+
| Empire of the Petal Throne and Traveller Role Playing, |
| PDP-10 Emulation and Zane's Computer Museum. |
| http://www.aracnet.com/~healyzh/ |
10 Sep
10 Sep
12:09 a.m.
On 9/9/2006 at 8:34 PM Zane H. Healy wrote:
At 5:22 PM -0400 9/9/06, Ray Arachelian wrote:
The ones I'm using are old DS/DD disks that I had
in a closet. The
pack I opened last night is probably 10-20 years old :^)
>I used a normal hole puncher to make these. Didn't bother with a
>special square one. Worked just fine as long as you aligned the hole
>properly.
Dig into your toolbox and grab the sheet-metal nibbler. Makes great square
notches. Everybody's got one of these, right? If not, you should--it's
indispensible for making connector holes, etc. in metal, plastic, or PCB.
Makes neat little chips instead of powder or shavings.
Cheers,
Chuck
9 Sep
9 Sep
6:47 p.m.
Chuck Guzis wrote:
On 9/9/2006 at 2:26 PM Roy J. Tellason wrote:
My TSX+ floppies are like that.
Gordon.
I knew of folks that did this all the time. What
I remember reading about
the practice back when was that some folks thought it not to be a good
idea
because they said that the liner of the
floppy's package was supposed to
"sweep up" any loose particles of oxide or any other contaminants and that
reversing the direction of rotation would cut all
of this stuff loose.
I've got a few 8" diskettes that are punched to be "flippies" by the
factory; i.e., there are two index apertures (with a mirror offset) punched
in the jacket and labels on both sides.
6505
days inactive
6507
days old
11 comments
9 participants
participants (9)
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bpope＠wordstock.com -
cclist＠sydex.com -
dgriffi＠cs.csubak.edu -
gordon＠gjcp.net -
healyzh＠aracnet.com -
mcguire＠neurotica.com -
mloewen＠cpumagic.scol.pa.us -
ray＠arachelian.com -
rtellason＠verizon.net