13 May
2016
13 May
'16
4:50 p.m.
I don't normally look at 5150's on eBay, but this one popped up in one of the ad
tiles, and it caught my eye because I've never seen one that wasn't the standard
beige.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Vintage-IBM-5150-Personal-Computer-WORKING-plus-acc…
At first glance, it doesn't appear to be hand painted. Anyone on here know about such
things? Were other colors available?
Thanks!
-Ben
13 May
13 May
4:53 p.m.
New subject: IBM 5150 with red case on eBay
At first glance, it doesn't appear to be hand
painted. Anyone on here
know about such things? Were other colors available?
It is hand painted and the owner is very proud of himself. It has been
listed on and off for the past year with no one biting...
-Ali
4:53 p.m.
Neat, but sure does look hand painted, look at the picture showing the back
emblim. You can see the original beige showing through.
On Fri, May 13, 2016 at 4:50 PM, Benjamin Huntsman <
BHuntsman at mail2.cu-portland.edu> wrote:
I don't normally look at 5150's on eBay, but
this one popped up in one of
the ad tiles, and it caught my eye because I've never seen one that wasn't
the standard beige.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Vintage-IBM-5150-Personal-Computer-WORKING-plus-acc…
At first glance, it doesn't appear to be hand painted. Anyone on here
know about such things? Were other colors available?
Thanks!
-Ben
--
Matt Patoray
Owner, MSP Productions
(330)718-3064 (mobile)
mspproductions at gmail.com
KD8AMG Amateur Radio Call Sign
7:59 p.m.
That thing is definitely pained. I never heard of IBM 5150 with other
colors.
On Fri, May 13, 2016 at 1:53 PM, Matt Patoray <mspproductions at gmail.com>
wrote:
Neat, but sure does look hand painted, look at the
picture showing the back
emblim. You can see the original beige showing through.
On Fri, May 13, 2016 at 4:50 PM, Benjamin Huntsman <
BHuntsman at mail2.cu-portland.edu> wrote:
I don't normally look at 5150's on eBay,
but this one popped up in one of
the ad tiles, and it caught my eye because I've never seen one that
wasn't
the standard beige.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Vintage-IBM-5150-Personal-Computer-WORKING-plus-acc…
At first glance, it doesn't appear to be hand painted. Anyone on here
know about such things? Were other colors available?
Thanks!
-Ben
--
Matt Patoray
Owner, MSP Productions
(330)718-3064 (mobile)
mspproductions at gmail.com
KD8AMG Amateur Radio Call Sign
5:24 p.m.
New subject: beige rant (was Re: IBM 5150 with red case on ebay)
On Fri, 13 May 2016, Benjamin Huntsman wrote:>
At first glance, it doesn't appear to be hand
painted. Anyone on here
know about such things? Were other colors available?
I was so disgusted with IBM and other TLAs who I won't name for fear of
being flame-blasted for the "beige orthodoxy". Most companies always acted
like doing any industrial design or adding color would scare off their
business customers. I guess soulless bean counters have to be surrounded
by items just as boring and life-sucking as they are or they will
spontaneously combust along with their checkbooks. The attitude is akin to
the type of suit-wearers or HOA-lawn-preeners who want to *force* their
thoughtless and wasteful conformity on everyone else. Hopefully, during
the 80's punk rock and Iron Maiden nearly gave them a heart attack (at
least there is that).
(Why yes, sir I did have a mohawk.)
In the 1980's and 1990's SGI was a bright shining exception and I love
them for that early middle finger to the beige box priesthood. Apple/NeXT
did a decent job, too. Once they became one and Jobs got his way, he seems
to have set about claiming a significant space in the then-wilderness of
PC industrial design. In the meantime, their stock went from @$30 a share
in 98' into the stratosphere, splitting a few times along the way. Guess
thinking about design wasn't such a bad idea.
In a way I'm glad I didn't learn much appreciation for beige box machines.
My house is already full enough of "pretty" junk. Having ugly junk would
just add insult to injury and possibly lead to homicide by my SO. It's all
in the eye of the beholder, though. Also, nowadays you get machines in all
kinds of colors, shapes, and sizes. The only trouble is that, no matter
what color or size, they are opaque, undocumented, low-quality, and crass.
Be careful what you wish for, I guess.
"Life is too short for beige boxes, b****y women, or bad beer." -Overheard
at SIGGRAPH
-Swift
6:20 p.m.
New subject: beige rant (was Re: IBM 5150 with red case on ebay)
I was so disgusted with IBM and other TLAs who I
won't name for fear of
being flame-blasted for the "beige orthodoxy". Most companies always acted
like doing any industrial design or adding color would scare off their
business customers.
Do not blame the computer companies, blame the customers. Beige and
gray were the colors they wanted. The bright dazzling colors of the
1960s and early 70s were gone, the earthtones of the late 1970s were
phasing out, and the boring colors of the 1980s were starting to come
into play.
IBM did offer a choice of colors for much of their machine line (not
the PC line, however) until the mid 1980s - blue (default), gray (2nd
default), red, white, and yellow, and later brown and green (I have
never seen either brown or green in the wild, but they are options in
the catalog), but most customers wanted blue or gray. If so few
customers wanted the other colors, it is easy to see why they were
discontinued.
In the 1980's and 1990's SGI was a bright
shining exception and I love
them for that early middle finger to the beige box priesthood.
Keep in mind that while most of us think SGI's designs are super
great, most of the customers outside the machine rooms thought they
were, at best, "interesting". "Interesting" is a funny word...
--
Will
8:29 p.m.
New subject: beige rant (was Re: IBM 5150 with red case on ebay)
On 14 May 2016 at 00:20, William Donzelli <wdonzelli at gmail.com> wrote:
Do not blame the computer companies, blame the
customers. Beige and
gray were the colors they wanted.
When companies buy, someone will have to approve (that is, provide the
money). That's often the company's own beancounters.. Engineer:
"We'll need this particular computer. This here model will do."
Beancounter (looking in sales brochure): "Purple? We don't do that
kind of thing here. This other model will do, surely" (points to beige
version).
8:32 p.m.
New subject: beige rant (was Re: IBM 5150 with red case on ebay)
GE used black on their computers for the workmasters witch where IBM 5150's
On May 13, 2016 7:29 PM, "Tor Arntsen" <kspt.tor at gmail.com> wrote:
On 14 May 2016 at 00:20, William Donzelli
<wdonzelli at gmail.com> wrote:
Do not blame the computer companies, blame the
customers. Beige and
gray were the colors they wanted.
When companies buy, someone will have to approve (that is, provide the
money). That's often the company's own beancounters.. Engineer:
"We'll need this particular computer. This here model will do."
Beancounter (looking in sales brochure): "Purple? We don't do that
kind of thing here. This other model will do, surely" (points to beige
version).
9:11 p.m.
New subject: beige rant (was Re: IBM 5150 with red case on ebay)
GE used black on their computers
Ever see one of those black computers from Hell and Bowel, that seem just
like an Apple?
B&H was able to get away with a bluish color for their 500 series
Filmosound projectors, but it was an uphill battle after the JANs and
then the brown suitcases of the 200 and 300 series.
School boards would rubber-stamp B&H equipment, but form committees before
accepting something like an Apple. UNTIL they got established.
9:16 p.m.
New subject: beige rant (was Re: IBM 5150 with red case on ebay)
On May 13, 2016, at 6:11 PM, Fred Cisin <cisin at
xenosoft.com> wrote:
Ever see one of those black computers from Hell and Bowel, that seem just like an Apple?
I sold them in the early 80s. My memory is very fuzzy, but ISTR they were a licensed
clone of the Apple ][. And they actually worked.
--lyndon
9:46 p.m.
New subject: beige rant (was Re: IBM 5150 with red case on ebay)
On 14 May 2016 at 03:16, Lyndon Nerenberg <lyndon at orthanc.ca> wrote:
They weren't even clones, they were the real deal. Apple II Plus
computers produced by Apple for B&H for a time.
On May 13, 2016, at 6:11 PM, Fred Cisin <cisin
at xenosoft.com> wrote:
Ever see one of those black computers from Hell and Bowel, that seem just like an Apple?
I sold them in the early 80s. My memory is very fuzzy, but ISTR they were a licensed
clone of the Apple ][. And they actually worked. 
10:06 p.m.
New subject: beige rant (was Re: IBM 5150 with red case on ebay)
Today, who has a colorful case on their modern PC?
10:22 p.m.
New subject: beige rant (was Re: IBM 5150 with red case on ebay)
On 05/13/2016 07:06 PM, william degnan wrote:
Today, who has a colorful case on their modern PC?
Dunno--the ASUS Vento was pretty cool; very colorful without a right
angle on the case.
Too bad that it had the reputation of being junk.
Can one still buy a Vento case?
--Chuck
14 May
14 May
12:26 a.m.
New subject: beige rant (was Re: IBM 5150 with red case on ebay)
On 13 May 2016 at 22:06, william degnan <billdegnan at gmail.com> wrote:
Today, who has a colorful case on their modern PC?
If we exclude case modders, and people who build their own cases...
Most "gaming" cases are slightly colourful. Still mostly one colour
with highlights. Though the cases have very... interesting... design
choices.
A lot of time however you'll find colour in your components and of
course the strange obsession with "Let's put LEDs on everything." Thus
why a lot of cases marketed towards "gamers" have transparent plexi on
the side.
Cheers,
Christian
--
Christian M. Gauger-Cosgrove
STCKON08DS0
Contact information available upon request.
12:41 a.m.
New subject: beige rant (was Re: IBM 5150 with red case on ebay)
On 05/13/2016 09:26 PM, Christian Gauger-Cosgrove wrote:
A lot of time however you'll find colour in your
components and of
course the strange obsession with "Let's put LEDs on everything."
Thus why a lot of cases marketed towards "gamers" have transparent
plexi on the side.
It's not just LEDs, but intense "blue" LEDs. I'm starting to hate that
color.
--Chuck
1:02 a.m.
New subject: beige rant (was Re: IBM 5150 with red case on ebay)
On 14 May 2016 at 00:41, Chuck Guzis <cclist at sydex.com> wrote:
It's not just LEDs, but intense "blue"
LEDs. I'm starting to hate that
color.
Blue? That's so pass?! Right now the popularity is to go full
*RAINBOW!* with the RGB LEDs...
Though yeah, intense blue is getting just a bit annoying; though I
admit I'd love to see a DECdatasystem-570 version of the PDP-11/70
panel (i.e. "the blue one") with blue LEDs instead of the standard
red; or bright white. If only because those colours would fit.
Cheers,
Christian
--
Christian M. Gauger-Cosgrove
STCKON08DS0
Contact information available upon request.
1:27 a.m.
New subject: beige rant (was Re: IBM 5150 with red case on ebay)
On Sat, 14 May 2016, Christian Gauger-Cosgrove wrote:
Blue? That's so pass?! Right now the popularity is
to go full *RAINBOW!*
with the RGB LEDs...
It's wrong and a crime against nature. I hate that kind of flea market
bait.
Though yeah, intense blue is getting just a bit
annoying; though I admit
I'd love to see a DECdatasystem-570 version of the PDP-11/70 panel (i.e.
"the blue one") with blue LEDs instead of the standard red; or bright
white. If only because those colours would fit.
They would, and I agree that it'd be neat-looking to the right observer.
It's interesting to compare the modern blinkenlights in datacenters to the
flippers and diagnostic LEDs, component LEDs, and even SGI's front panel
CPU graphs. My favorite era of "really cool display tech" was FL displays
that were really popular in the late 70's and all of the 80's. Old
spectrum analyzers and things like that could be very classy and slick
looking (even today). Then there's vue-meters. Folks, we need more excuses
to add them everywhere... metal ones with beautiful backlight displays
etc.. Power is a good enough excuse. We need to monitor that, right?
-Swift
1:30 p.m.
New subject: beige rant (was Re: IBM 5150 with red case on ebay)
On 05/13/2016 10:27 PM, Swift Griggs wrote:
They would, and I agree that it'd be neat-looking
to the right
observer. It's interesting to compare the modern blinkenlights in
datacenters to the flippers and diagnostic LEDs, component LEDs, and
even SGI's front panel CPU graphs. My favorite era of "really cool
display tech" was FL displays that were really popular in the late
70's and all of the 80's. Old spectrum analyzers and things like that
could be very classy and slick looking (even today).
It seems that a number of the retro folks are fascinated by the
7-segment displays on cheap Taiwanese cases of the 80s and early 90s
that can be made to display any number that you care to see, regardless
of actual CPU clock speed (mine were set to display "Lo" and "Hi".
Then there's the oscope tuning display on the Marantz 10B tuner. So eye
candy has been with us for a long time. Note that the "look" back then
was a brushed aluminum panel with matching knobs. Everyone had it.
--Chuck
13 May
13 May
10:20 p.m.
New subject: beige rant (was Re: IBM 5150 with red case on ebay)
On May 13, 2016, at 6:46 PM, Tor Arntsen <kspt.tor
at gmail.com> wrote:
They weren't even clones, they were the real deal. Apple II Plus
computers produced by Apple for B&H for a time.
Apple manufactured an OEM Apple ][+ ? Really? I was pretty sure the B&H's were
an independent product. Apple licensed them to try to step on the clone market. I
can't fathom Apple letting someone else sell their own product (modulo case colour) at
a price that undercut the official product.
I do recall now the local elementary & jr. high schools gobbled them up. (The B&H
variant.)
10:34 p.m.
New subject: beige rant (was Re: IBM 5150 with red case on ebay)
On Fri, May 13, 2016 at 9:20 PM, Lyndon Nerenberg <lyndon at orthanc.ca> wrote:
Apple manufactured an OEM Apple ][+ ? Really? I was
pretty sure the B&H's were an independent product. Apple licensed them to try to
step on the clone market. I can't fathom Apple letting someone else sell their own
product (modulo case colour) at a price that undercut the official product.
Every part but (iirc) the case was Apple's and Apple-branded. It was
just a regular //+, except....
I do recall now the local elementary & jr. high
schools gobbled them up. (The B&H variant.)
The story goes that Apple had trouble getting into certain educational
markets because schools weren't used to budgeting for computers; but
they did buy a lot of A/V equipment. Apple made a deal with
well-known educational vendor B&H, who made black cases with a special
A/V box on the back (a cluster of RCA connectors) and voila, there was
a computer that a school could buy in the same lot as the Wollensak
tape machines, 16mm projectors and those big headphones with the poofy
white ear cushions.
-j
10:40 p.m.
New subject: beige rant (was Re: IBM 5150 with red case on ebay)
On May 13, 2016, at 7:34 PM, Jason T <silent700 at
gmail.com> wrote:
Apple made a deal with
well-known educational vendor B&H, who made black cases with a special
A/V box on the back (a cluster of RCA connectors)
I don't remember the stack of RCA connectors, but yeah, Apple definitely rode on the
coat tails of Bell & Howell 16mm movie (and 35mm film strip) projector sales :-)
14 May
14 May
1:21 a.m.
New subject: beige rant (was Re: IBM 5150 with red case on ebay)
On Fri, 13 May 2016, Lyndon Nerenberg wrote:
I don't remember the stack of RCA connectors, but
yeah, Apple definitely
rode on the coat tails of Bell & Howell 16mm movie (and 35mm film strip)
projector sales :-)
Scope out this picture if you have time:
http://www.oldcomputers.net/pics/bandh-rear.jpg
You can totally see the RCA jacks and other non-Apple-II-normal stuff
going on back there. It's wacky looking and they totally got the "boring
school A/V equipment" look down. However, now, in "retro" spect, (sorry)
it looks a little cool. It's a bit like a Russian clone built like a brick
****hou**.
-Swift
13 May
13 May
11:08 p.m.
New subject: beige rant (was Re: IBM 5150 with red case on ebay)
On 14 May 2016 at 04:34, Jason T <silent700 at gmail.com> wrote:
On Fri, May 13, 2016 at 9:20 PM, Lyndon Nerenberg
<lyndon at orthanc.ca> wrote:
Even the case, according to http://www.oldcomputers.net/bellandhowell.html
"The normally beige case was colored black (only on the surface, it is
still beige underneath)"
Apple manufactured an OEM Apple ][+ ? Really? I
was pretty sure the B&H's were an independent product. Apple licensed them to try
to step on the clone market. I can't fathom Apple letting someone else sell their own
product (modulo case colour) at a price that undercut the official product.
Every part but (iirc) the case was Apple's and Apple-branded. [..]
14 May
14 May
1:11 a.m.
New subject: beige rant (was Re: IBM 5150 with red case on ebay)
On Sat, 14 May 2016, Tor Arntsen wrote:
Even the case, according to
http://www.oldcomputers.net/bellandhowell.html
"The normally beige case was colored black (only on the surface, it is
still beige underneath)"
I think it looks pretty classy. It matches my slide projector. :-)
I agree with those who protest the gawdy blue-LED-ridden 'gamer' cases and
designs. Those just don't cut it.
Personally, I'd go for sustainable-wood, tempered glass, and okay, molded
plastics if they are done well and it has an SGI badge on it :-)
Inevitably, I'm drawn to designs using metal, wood, glass and other
expensive materials that few but boutique computer case makers would dare
contemplate. Heh, but now I hear one of my co-workers who is an old DEC
expert saying "... back when computers were made out of wood ..." and I
think of some that *were* (I can at least see them on the web) and yeah,
okay, so I wasn't around in the 60's and 70's. Well, I was in a portion of
the 70's but I was considerably occupied with being born and other quite
serious matters like house-training and tooth-growing which I believe is a
decent excuse for not remembering all of the fine machines back then. One
should always take the time to have a decent birth.
I figure, if you are going to have a nice interior one has to consider the
space a computer rig takes up, even on a KVM. It's going to be a
significant feature in the room. If it's not locked up in a cabinet, it's
going to be seen quite a bit. Might as well afford the machine as much
design consideration as the furniture, if not a tad bit more. I like
computers more than (most) furniture. Though I do some woodworking and
furniture done right is cool, too. If they can compliment each other, so
much the better. Of course, this is all a desktop consideration. Servers,
I have a different design sense for (mostly pragmatic).
-Swift
13 May
13 May
10:44 p.m.
New subject: beige rant (was Re: IBM 5150 with red case on ebay)
> They weren't even clones, they were the real
deal. Apple II Plus
> computers produced by Apple for B&H for a time.
On Fri, 13 May 2016, Lyndon Nerenberg wrote:
Apple manufactured an OEM Apple ][+ ? Really? I was
pretty sure the
B&H's were an independent product.
Not independent.
Apple licensed them to try to step on the clone
market. I can't fathom
I doubt it. Apple licensed them as a way to get in the
door of school
systems.
Apple letting someone else sell their own product
(modulo case colour)
at a price that undercut the official product.
"undercut"??!?
I seriously doubt that the B&H "Black Apple" was cheaper. But, it had
B&H's credibility backing it up for skeptical school boards, who bought
tons of B&H AV equipment, but didn't know what a "personal computer"
was.
I do recall now the local elementary & jr. high
schools gobbled them up.
(The B&H variant.)
I knew a few teachers who got B&H Black Apples into the classroom, and
THEN were able to get the school board to let them buy Apples, because
they were cheaper, "just as good", and "completely compatible!" with
the
B&H.
10:49 p.m.
New subject: beige rant (was Re: IBM 5150 with red case on ebay)
On May 13, 2016, at 7:44 PM, Fred Cisin <cisin at
xenosoft.com> wrote:
"undercut"??!?
I seriously doubt that the B&H "Black Apple" was cheaper. But, it had
B&H's credibility backing it up for skeptical school boards, who bought tons of
B&H AV equipment, but didn't know what a "personal computer" was.
Maybe the outfit I was working for was lowballing the B&H price, but we definitely had
the price advantage over all the Apple dealers.
Now part of that might have been because we were the only Apple(-ish) dealer in Ft.
McMurray AB, and the only alternatives were the *very* greedy Apple dealers in Edmonton (a
five+ hour drive south).
I do recall now the local elementary & jr.
high schools gobbled them up. (The B&H variant.)
I knew a few teachers who got B&H Black Apples into the classroom, and THEN were able
to get the school board to let them buy Apples, because they were cheaper, "just as
good", and "completely compatible!" with the B&H.
11:05 p.m.
New subject: beige rant (was Re: IBM 5150 with red case on ebay)
On 14 May 2016 at 04:20, Lyndon Nerenberg <lyndon at orthanc.ca> wrote:
Yes, look at this picture:
http://www.digibarn.com/collections/systems/appleII-bell-and-howell/CIMG274…
On May 13, 2016, at 6:46 PM, Tor Arntsen
<kspt.tor at gmail.com> wrote:
They weren't even clones, they were the real deal. Apple II Plus
computers produced by Apple for B&H for a time.
Apple manufactured an OEM Apple ][+ ? Really? 
10:36 p.m.
New subject: beige rant (was Re: IBM 5150 with red case on ebay)
> Ever see one of those black computers from Hell
and Bowel, that seem
> just like an Apple?
On Fri, 13 May 2016, Lyndon Nerenberg wrote:
I sold them in the early 80s. My memory is very
fuzzy, but ISTR they
were a licensed clone of the Apple ][. And they actually worked.
Yes, they were. They had a few specific changes that were thought to be
necessary for classroom use, such as a non-detachable cord (theft of power
cord was more of a worry then than it is now), a serious latch instead of
velcro for the lid, . . .
9:16 p.m.
New subject: beige rant (was Re: IBM 5150 with red case on ebay)
Intel MDS was blue as well
On May 13, 2016 8:11 PM, "Fred Cisin" <cisin at xenosoft.com> wrote:
GE used black on their computers
Ever see one of those black computers from Hell and Bowel, that seem just
like an Apple?
B&H was able to get away with a bluish color for their 500 series
Filmosound projectors, but it was an uphill battle after the JANs and then
the brown suitcases of the 200 and 300 series.
School boards would rubber-stamp B&H equipment, but form committees before
accepting something like an Apple. UNTIL they got established.
14 May
14 May
12:31 a.m.
New subject: beige rant (was Re: IBM 5150 with red case on ebay)
On Fri, May 13, 2016 at 9:11 PM, Fred Cisin <cisin at xenosoft.com> wrote:
Ever see one of those black computers from Hell and
Bowel, that seem just
like an Apple?
They _were_ an Apple - not a clone, but rebadged and with a few
important mods (mentioned here by others with the RCA jacks and the
power cord).
The importance was there was often no budget for computer, but if you
could order something from the B&H catalog, there *was* an A/V budget.
Paperwork. It wasn't so much the "trust" in the B&H name, but the
fact that you could use a P.O. and fill in your A/V accounting code
and... *poof* a _computer_ shows up. Made it possible where other
avenues were impossible.
-ethan
13 May
13 May
9:06 p.m.
New subject: beige rant (was Re: IBM 5150 with red case on ebay)
On Sat, 14 May 2016, Tor Arntsen wrote:
Beancounter (looking in sales brochure): "Purple?
We don't do that
kind of thing here. This other model will do, surely" (points to beige
version).
If you are only going to have one color, then beige is preferable,
followed by black, and quite a bit further back, white, and then blue.
People may not want beige. But, the intensity of their reactions are much
less extreme than the potential dislike for other colors.
If a store has every color in inventory, fine. But just imagine what
management wants to do when a customer says, "I came for Raspberry, but
all that they had some Loquat, so I didn't buy it."
Apple stores, with enormous inventory leverage could pull off an ADM3a in
a fruit salad of colors. But, how do you supply small stores that only
want a few in stock?
"Mediocrity is less dangerous than innovation."
You don't get in touble for buying IBM.
You don't get in trouble for buying beige.
--
Grumpy Ol' Fred cisin at xenosoft.com
10:04 p.m.
New subject: beige rant (was Re: IBM 5150 with red case on ebay)
On Sat, May 14, 2016 at 12:29 PM, Tor Arntsen <kspt.tor at gmail.com> wrote:
On 14 May 2016 at 00:20, William Donzelli
<wdonzelli at gmail.com> wrote:
Companies other than SGI did 'interesting' colors. Here's something
really obscure; bonus points to anyone who can identify it just from
the photo. No cheating! And treble points for anyone who HAS one. A
Prince's ransom if you have one for sale :-) -
http://www.d1.dion.ne.jp/~r_high/memorial/panda/boxes.gif
Mike
http://www.corestore.org
'No greater love hath a man than he lay down his life for his brother.
Not for millions, not for glory, not for fame.
For one person, in the dark, where no one will ever know or see.'
Do not blame the computer companies, blame the
customers. Beige and
gray were the colors they wanted.
When companies buy, someone will have to approve (that is, provide the
money). That's often the company's own beancounters.. Engineer:
"We'll need this particular computer. This here model will do."
Beancounter (looking in sales brochure): "Purple? We don't do that
kind of thing here. This other model will do, surely" (points to beige
version). 
16 May
16 May
12:08 p.m.
New subject: beige rant (was Re: IBM 5150 with red case on ebay)
On Sat, 14 May 2016, Mike Ross wrote:
On Sat, May 14, 2016 at 12:29 PM, Tor Arntsen
<kspt.tor at gmail.com> wrote:
Nobody bit and my curiousity is definitely piqued ... what are those
things?
Best,
Sean
On 14 May 2016 at 00:20, William Donzelli
<wdonzelli at gmail.com> wrote:
Companies other than SGI did 'interesting' colors. Here's something
really obscure; bonus points to anyone who can identify it just from
the photo. No cheating! And treble points for anyone who HAS one. A
Prince's ransom if you have one for sale :-) -
http://www.d1.dion.ne.jp/~r_high/memorial/panda/boxes.gif
Do not blame the computer companies, blame the
customers. Beige and
gray were the colors they wanted.
When companies buy, someone will have to approve (that is, provide the
money). That's often the company's own beancounters.. Engineer:
"We'll need this particular computer. This here model will do."
Beancounter (looking in sales brochure): "Purple? We don't do that
kind of thing here. This other model will do, surely" (points to beige
version). 
12:47 p.m.
New subject: beige rant (was Re: IBM 5150 with red case on ebay)
On 2016-May-16, at 9:08 AM, Sean Caron wrote:
On Sat, 14 May 2016, Mike Ross wrote:
http://www.studiofynn.com/design/computer-server-panda
Found with some judicious googling.
I guess that's cheating, so no prize for me.
Seems to have been purely a design concept, not a product.
It's mentioned a couple times under EXHIBITIONS, AWARDS AND PUBLICATIONS here:
http://www.studiofynn.com/about
Companies other than SGI did 'interesting' colors. Here's something
really obscure; bonus points to anyone who can identify it just from
the photo. No cheating! And treble points for anyone who HAS one. A
Prince's ransom if you have one for sale :-) -
http://www.d1.dion.ne.jp/~r_high/memorial/panda/boxes.gif
Nobody bit and my curiousity is definitely piqued ... what are those things?
12:57 p.m.
New subject: beige rant (was Re: IBM 5150 with red case on ebay)
On Mon, 16 May 2016, Brent Hilpert wrote:
http://www.studiofynn.com/design/computer-server-panda
Found with some
judicious googling. I guess that's cheating, so no prize for me.
I cheated and found it with Google Image Search but I kept quiet to let
others run it down.
Seems to have been purely a design concept, not a
product.
They don't really talk about the guts, at all. Also by 1995 SGI had
already made a lot of really cool machines, but hey others were free to
join in!
Honestly, I didn't say much because at first I thought they were coffee
machines, espresso makers, or some other non-computer. Then when someone
piped up with "Isn't that an early XYZ Frobniz-2000 with the acceleration
module?" he'd spring it on them saying "GOTCHA! It's a coffee
maker!" :-P
-Swift
1:12 p.m.
New subject: beige rant (was Re: IBM 5150 with red case on ebay)
On 2016-May-16, at 9:57 AM, Swift Griggs wrote:
On Mon, 16 May 2016, Brent Hilpert wrote:
Seems it did get a little further than design concept.
The "Archistrat" computer from "The Panda Project" of Boca Raton, Fl.
Was getting a lot of press buzz around 1995.
http://www.pcmag.com/encyclopedia/term/37955/archistrat-computer
http://articles.sun-sentinel.com/1996-02-11/business/9602090578_1_panda-sem…
http://articles.orlandosentinel.com/1994-11-25/business/9411220267_1_panda-…
http://community.seattletimes.nwsource.com/archive/?date=19941112&slug=…
http://ftp.vim.org/documents/published/unix-world/archives/95/review/004.ht…
https://www.pinterest.com/pin/250301691762333319/
http://www.studiofynn.com/design/computer-server-panda Found with some
judicious googling. I guess that's cheating, so no prize for me.
I cheated and found it with Google Image Search but I kept quiet to let
others run it down.
Seems to have been purely a design concept, not a
product.
They don't really talk about the guts, at all. Also by 1995 SGI had
already made a lot of really cool machines, but hey others were free to
join in!
Honestly, I didn't say much because at first I thought they were coffee
machines, espresso makers, or some other non-computer. Then when someone
piped up with "Isn't that an early XYZ Frobniz-2000 with the acceleration
module?" he'd spring it on them saying "GOTCHA! It's a coffee
maker!" :-P
1:41 p.m.
New subject: beige rant (was Re: IBM 5150 with red case on ebay)
On 05/16/2016 09:47 AM, Brent Hilpert wrote:
How do these differ in substance from the ASUS Vento (a real product
from 2005) that I cited days ago?
https://www.asus.com/websites/global/products/2zMfr955ALh3EoZJ/TA-36_three.…
--Chuck
2:19 p.m.
New subject: beige rant (was Re: IBM 5150 with red case on ebay)
On 2016-May-16, at 10:41 AM, Chuck Guzis wrote:
On 05/16/2016 09:47 AM, Brent Hilpert wrote:
How do these differ in substance from the ASUS Vento (a real product
from 2005) that I cited days ago?
https://www.asus.com/websites/global/products/2zMfr955ALh3EoZJ/TA-36_three.…
I'm not a proponent either way, but I guess the difference is the panda/archistrat was
10 years earlier and breaking the monoscape of the beige boxes, while the
Vento was following a 7-year-old trend initiated by the iMac.
2:56 p.m.
New subject: beige rant (was Re: IBM 5150 with red case on ebay)
On 05/16/2016 11:19 AM, Brent Hilpert wrote:
I'm not a proponent either way, but I guess the
difference is the
panda/archistrat was 10 years earlier and breaking the monoscape of
the beige boxes, while the Vento was following a 7-year-old trend
initiated by the iMac.
It wasn't for want of trying. Back in 1980, the company I worked for
investigated making a lower-priced system for more economical customers.
Expandability would be limited, but we had to use existing parts.
What was proposed was to paint (the shells were all structural foam, so
even the "regular" stuff was painted) some triel systems various bright
colors, including red, orange, green and blue. These were turned over
to marketing for customer reactions.
The dogs wouldn't eat it. Same box as the beige and brown ones, just a
different color. No one surveyed displayed any interest at all. Some
actually hated the things.
That probably explains IBM's abandonment of custom colors for their
mainframes.
Don't blame the manufacturers. I note that no one ever proposed a
bright yellow case.
Some made a point of the lack of color. Witness the Rair "Black Box".
--Chuck
9:25 p.m.
New subject: beige rant (was Re: IBM 5150 with red case on ebay)
Anyone remember the multicolored "Orb" computers of the late 70s?
I'm sure there were others.
--Chuck
13 May
13 May
8:42 p.m.
New subject: beige rant (was Re: IBM 5150 with red case on ebay)
For the S/360 systems, there was a wide choice of colors. In fact, most
of the S/360s I saw initially were that orangish-red. I've heard it
referred to as "International Orange" in accordance with Federal
Specification 595:
http://www.fed-std-595.com/FS-595-Paint-Spec.html
In the early 1970s, CDC went from a beige and gray motif to blue glass
and fake woodgrain.
NCR, Cray and Honeywell similarly had brightly-colored systems.
Office interiors in the 1980s were often the bright primary upholstery,
with exposed structure and plumbing being painted similarly bright
colors. It was a bit much, reminiscent of the Pompidou centre in Paris.
Styles change. I don't think much of deep blue as a color scheme.
--Chuck
14 May
14 May
4:10 a.m.
New subject: beige rant (was Re: IBM 5150 with red case on ebay)
-----Original Message-----
From: cctalk [mailto:cctalk-bounces at classiccmp.org] On Behalf Of Chuck
Guzis
Sent: 14 May 2016 01:43
To: General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts
<cctalk at
classiccmp.org>
Subject: Re: beige rant (was Re: IBM 5150 with red
case on ebay)
For the S/360 systems, there was a wide choice of colors. In fact, most
of the
S/360s I saw initially were that orangish-red.
I've heard it referred to
as
"International Orange" in accordance with
Federal Specification 595:
Most other IBM kit came in a range of colors, and I was told by an IBMer
that the salesman should have a chain of color samples but I have never seen
one.
As I recently said in a previous E-Mail many local councils avoid "Blue" as
it has political implications.
Normally certain colors were standard, and choosing others could result in
longer delivery times...
http://www.fed-std-595.com/FS-595-Paint-Spec.html
In the early 1970s, CDC went from a beige and gray motif to blue glass and
fake woodgrain.
NCR, Cray and Honeywell similarly had brightly-colored systems.
Office interiors in the 1980s were often the bright
primary upholstery,
with
exposed structure and plumbing being painted similarly
bright colors. It
was a
bit much, reminiscent of the Pompidou centre in
Paris.
Styles change. I don't think much of deep blue as a color scheme.
--Chuck
Dave
16 May
16 May
2:11 p.m.
New subject: beige rant (was Re: IBM 5150 with red case on ebay)
On Fri, May 13, 2016 at 4:24 PM, Swift Griggs <swiftgriggs at gmail.com> wrote:
In the 1980's and 1990's SGI was a bright shining exception and I love
them for that early middle finger to the beige box priesthood. Apple/NeXT
did a decent job, too. Once they became one and Jobs got his way, he seems
to have set about claiming a significant space in the then-wilderness of
PC industrial design. In the meantime, their stock went from @$30 a share
in 98' into the stratosphere, splitting a few times along the way. Guess
thinking about design wasn't such a bad idea.
While I think the SGIs were cool at the time, their industrial design,
colors and all from the 90's look rather dated today.
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