6 Jul
2016
6 Jul
'16
4:47 p.m.
Many people used program editors to write articles and books in the
early days! Myself included... Ed#
In a message dated 7/6/2016 1:43:21 P.M. US Mountain Standard Time,
jnc at mercury.lcs.mit.edu writes:
From: Fred Cisin
the first person to use a word processor was probably
typing business
letters and/or legal documents, which is what they were developed for.
Depends what you mean by "word processor". If you mean 'software intended
to
format text', you need to look back to things like TJ2:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/TJ-2
and 'runoff', both circa 1963. Much earlier than any of the 'word
processors'
this person wrote about.
Noel
6 Jul
6 Jul
5:13 p.m.
jnc at mercury.lcs.mit.edu writes:
Depends what you mean by "word processor".
If you mean 'software
intended to format text', you need to look back to things like TJ2:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/TJ-2
and 'runoff', both circa 1963. Much earlier than any of the 'word
processors'
this person wrote about.
On Wed, 6 Jul 2016, COURYHOUSE at aol.com wrote:
Many people used program editors to write articles
and books in the
early days! Myself included... Ed#
EXACTLY.
THAT article is writing about the "first"
well known (that he knew of),
best-selling author
to use a "home computer" for word processing,
to write a published,
best selling book.
AND be publicized for doing so, since merely submitting a manuscript
doesn't count once the publisher has re-typed it, nor would anybody know
about it.
So, who would be the "first" to meet that author's criteria?
In 1969, at Goddard Space Flight Center (Greenbelt, Bldg 26) had cow-
orkers using Selectric terminals on timesharing to do text editing,
but I don't think that any of them ever got published.
In late 1971, I knew a guy using a Silent 700, acoustic coupled to
who-knows-where. But, the lower case was so bad, that it needed to be
printed out on something else before showing his work to anybody.
6:16 p.m.
On 07/06/2016 01:47 PM, COURYHOUSE at aol.com wrote:
Depends what you mean by "word processor".
If you mean 'software
intended to format text', you need to look back to things like TJ2:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/TJ-2
and 'runoff', both circa 1963. Much earlier than any of the 'word
processors' this person wrote about.
I remember punching my documents on an 026 then running a FORTRAN
formatter. Of course, there were many escape codes conventions in the
formatter for stuff like boldface, underlining, tables, word-wrap
suppression, "widow" control, etc.
I wasn't unique in this--indeed the whole practice predates integrated
circuits, I suspect.
Perhaps the author counts only WYSIWYG-type wapros and that things like
the MT/ST don't count either.
--Chuck
6:57 p.m.
On Wed, 6 Jul 2016, Chuck Guzis wrote:
I remember punching my documents on an 026 then
running a FORTRAN
formatter. Of course, there were many escape codes conventions in the
formatter for stuff like boldface, underlining, tables, word-wrap
suppression, "widow" control, etc.
I wasn't unique in this--indeed the whole practice predates integrated
circuits, I suspect.
Perhaps the author counts only WYSIWYG-type wapros and that things like
the MT/ST don't count either.
Actually, he does give an MT/ST example (Len Deighton). But, it was one
where the author composed on a typewriter, and then his secretary re-typed
and edited on an MT/ST.
Just the pronunciation of "MT/ST" made me want to write a word-processor,
just to be able to call it "FULL ST".
The whole thing desperately needs to be changed from "earliest" to
"early", and get rid of the entire "FIRST" nonsense.
The idea of "which authors used word processors 35 years ago" isn't too
bad, but the idea of a "FIRST" is ludicrous.
Yes, the author seems to be young enough to think of "word-processing" as
starting with TRS80/Apple][.
Nowadays, the kids think that word processing can not be done without
on-screen font display.
7:35 p.m.
In high school, I wrote a paper using punched cards and a simple Fortan
program that I wrote on an IBM 1130 to format them and print it out on
a 1403 printer (that was 1974).
In college I used ?Scribe? a markup language and formatter that ran on
TOPS-10 that could send output to an XGP (Xerox Graphics Printer?early
laser printer that was driven from a PDP-11/45). That was 1975+.
At IBM we used Script (again a markup language). That was 1979.
So, it all depends upon what was meant by ?Word Processor? but I agree
with most of what has been said in this thread so far. The author is
ignoring anything earlier than what appeared on micros such as the
Apple II or TRS-80.
TTFN - Guy
On Jul 6, 2016, at 3:57 PM, Fred Cisin <cisin at
xenosoft.com> wrote:
On Wed, 6 Jul 2016, Chuck Guzis wrote:
I remember punching my documents on an 026 then
running a FORTRAN
formatter. Of course, there were many escape codes conventions in the
formatter for stuff like boldface, underlining, tables, word-wrap
suppression, "widow" control, etc.
I wasn't unique in this--indeed the whole practice predates integrated
circuits, I suspect.
Perhaps the author counts only WYSIWYG-type wapros and that things like
the MT/ST don't count either.
Actually, he does give an MT/ST example (Len Deighton). But, it was one where the author
composed on a typewriter, and then his secretary re-typed and edited on an MT/ST.
Just the pronunciation of "MT/ST" made me want to write a word-processor, just
to be able to call it "FULL ST".
The whole thing desperately needs to be changed from "earliest" to
"early", and get rid of the entire "FIRST" nonsense.
The idea of "which authors used word processors 35 years ago" isn't too
bad, but the idea of a "FIRST" is ludicrous.
Yes, the author seems to be young enough to think of "word-processing" as
starting with TRS80/Apple][.
Nowadays, the kids think that word processing can not be done without on-screen font
display.
7:46 p.m.
One thing that sticks in my mind are a fair number of S/360 manuals that
are obviously not typeset. For example, here the FORTRAN IV from 1965/66:
http://bitsavers.informatik.uni-stuttgart.de/pdf/ibm/360/fortran/C28-6515-6…
Given that the thing is printed in two justified columns per page in a
monospaced typewriter font, one can't escape the conclusion that some
sort of formatting/word processing was involved.
I haven't checked to see if this technique goes back farther than that.
But it's a book and it's definitely been processed.
Anyone know what was used to do this?
--Chuck
7 Jul
7 Jul
11:45 a.m.
On Wed, 6 Jul 2016, Fred Cisin wrote:
Yes, the author seems to be young enough to think of
"word-processing"
as starting with TRS80/Apple][.
I can forgive him. So few people actually got to put their hands on
mainframe and "real" (non-micro) computers before the PC "revolution".
I
was in the same boat. However, I do agree there's some hubris in making
claims like "first" etc... as others have already said.
Nowadays, the kids think that word processing can not
be done without
on-screen font display.
No, that was my generation (Gen-X) and came around in the mid 90s, IMHO.
That was right about the time your average administrative assistant and
tech-writer went from using character-based Wordperfect, to some flavor of
GUI "office suite" that included a GUI word processor. Half-joking, but
with a few notable exceptions, the current generation hasn't heard much of
"word processing". To them, it's a widget that sometimes gets embedded
when an application on their phone has the nerve to ask them to type
something. If they are "technical" or a "developer" then they know
that a
word processor is that little javascript thingy you can embed in web pages
when you "need to type". Yes, I'm being snide. There are just as many
smart kids today as there were when mainframes ruled. It's just that most
computing tasks these days seem to revolve around consuming media rather
than creating it. Plus, the same fools you were previously able to simply
ignore like the walking dead as they scurried home to watch TV are now all
carrying computing devices (phones) and influencing (read: disturbing) our
previously peaceful technical spaces.
-Swift
2:13 p.m.
I will nominate as "the first manuscript created on a microcomputer
wordprocessor":
the documentation of ESP-1 ("Extended Software Package 1") by Michael
Shrayer. (to do so, he created "Electric Pencil")
He very well might not have been the first to do so, but it is well known
to be the "FIRST" microcomputer word processing program.
As to "the first best-selling published book created on a home
computer word processor by a major mainstream author", I have no idea.
The "major" "mainstream" "best-selling" have boundaries that
are too
vague. Even the definition of "book" is poorly delineated. And, since
there aren't any records for any of the multitudinous lesser works that
had already been done, I object to calling it "the first book created on
a word processor".
Almost all "FIRST"s are fundamentally flawed.
They almost always ignore similar prior accomplishments
by relative unknowns, and they hardly ever clearly define
WHAT was done "FIRST". Often, there are unstated further
requirements, such as only looking at the major brands, or
only considering ones that were major commercial successes,
or only accomplishments by people in "Who's Who".
On computer products, does "FIRST" mean first announced,
first shown, first available for sale, first sold, first
shipped, first delivered, first in stock in stores, etc.?
First announced is often not first delivered, etc.
Elisha Gray experienced the issue of "first invented" V "first
filed".
--
Grumpy Ol' Fred cisin at xenosoft.com
2971
days inactive
2972
days old
8 comments
6 participants
participants (6)
-
cclist＠sydex.com -
cisin＠xenosoft.com -
COURYHOUSE＠aol.com -
ggs＠shiresoft.com -
swiftgriggs＠gmail.com -
wdonzelli＠gmail.com