10 Dec
1999
10 Dec
'99
5:24 p.m.
Drew Amery wrote:
I had to reboot my 11/73 RT-11 system yesterday due to
a brown out.
While it was booting I starting enter some appointments in my PalmV
and realized that I what I had in my hand had more memory, 2Meg
for the Palm compared to 256K for the DEC, and probably more
processing power. Just for fun, has or would someone compare
the processing powers of the Palm vs the DEC 11/23 thru 93 series.
Challenge/Joke:
If you really want to impress your fellow pdp users and have absolutely
nothing
to do this holiday season, I challenge someone to port RT-11 to the Palm
handhelds.
Jerome Fine replies:
Which OS runs on the Palm handhelds? Possibly W95/W98 or even the
old DOS/Win 3.1? I will take the challenge in that case. Care to bet how
long it will take?
Sincerely yours,
Jerome Fine
10 Dec
10 Dec
5:40 p.m.
Jerome Fine replies:
Which OS runs on the Palm handhelds? Possibly W95/W98 or even the
old DOS/Win 3.1? I will take the challenge in that case. Care to bet how
long it will take?
I'm afriad not. They run PalmOS. Totally different architecture. Got to
admit I'm wondering if it's possible to put a PDP-11 emulator on one of
them. The big problem I see is console emulation.
Zane
11 Dec
11 Dec
6:55 a.m.
Rumor has it that healyzh(a)aracnet.com may have mentioned these words:
On a similar vein, I think it would be cool to see an Atari ST emulator on
the Palm... the screen sizes are pretty close, there's enough memory (on a
palm III) for a 1Meg ST emulator, it uses the same processor, so it
shouldn't run *too* slowly... but hooking up that floppy drive would be a
bit tough, I'll admit... ;-)
Just an idea,
Roger "Merch" Merchberger
--
Roger "Merch" Merchberger --- sysadmin, Iceberg Computers
Recycling is good, right??? Ok, so I'll recycle an old .sig.
If at first you don't succeed, nuclear warhead
disarmament should *not* be your first career choice.
Jerome Fine
replies:
Which OS runs on the Palm handhelds? Possibly W95/W98 or even the
old DOS/Win 3.1? I will take the challenge in that case. Care to bet how
long it will take?
I'm afriad not. They run PalmOS. Totally different architecture. Got to
admit I'm wondering if it's possible to put a PDP-11 emulator on one of
them. The big problem I see is console emulation.
8:08 a.m.
Roger "Merch" Merchberger wrote:
Rumor has it that healyzh(a)aracnet.com may have
mentioned these words:
On a similar vein, I think it would be cool to see an Atari ST emulator on
the Palm... the screen sizes are pretty close, there's enough memory (on a
palm III) for a 1Meg ST emulator, it uses the same processor, so it
shouldn't run *too* slowly... but hooking up that floppy drive would be a
bit tough, I'll admit... ;-)
Are you sure the processor is the same? I didn't even think it had a
Motorola processor. If it is based on the 68k I suspect you might find
it's missing some of the instructions. I know I've seen talk in Amiga
circles about the latest 68k chips not having all the instructions
necessary to use them in a Amiga clone.
Zane
| Zane H. Healy | UNIX Systems Adminstrator |
| healyzh(a)aracnet.com (primary) | Linux Enthusiast |
| healyzh(a)holonet.net (alternate) | Classic Computer Collector |
+----------------------------------+----------------------------+
| Empire of the Petal Throne and Traveller Role Playing, |
| and Zane's Computer Museum. |
| http://www.aracnet.com/~healyzh/ |
Jerome
Fine replies:
Which OS runs on the Palm handhelds? Possibly W95/W98 or even the
old DOS/Win 3.1? I will take the challenge in that case. Care to bet how
long it will take?
I'm afriad not. They run PalmOS. Totally different architecture. Got to
admit I'm wondering if it's possible to put a PDP-11 emulator on one of
them. The big problem I see is console emulation.
8:24 a.m.
Are you sure the processor is the same? I didn't
even think it had a
Motorola processor. If it is based on the 68k I suspect you might find
it's missing some of the instructions. I know I've seen talk in Amiga
circles about the latest 68k chips not having all the instructions
necessary to use them in a Amiga clone.
Zane
Guess I might as well correct myself. The processor is a Motorola
Dragonball. However, as mentioned, I don't think the instruction set is
quite the same. Don't know though.
Zane
| Zane H. Healy | UNIX Systems Adminstrator |
| healyzh(a)aracnet.com (primary) | Linux Enthusiast |
| healyzh(a)holonet.net (alternate) | Classic Computer Collector |
+----------------------------------+----------------------------+
| Empire of the Petal Throne and Traveller Role Playing, |
| and Zane's Computer Museum. |
| http://www.aracnet.com/~healyzh/ |
9:15 a.m.
Rumor has it that Zane H. Healy may have mentioned these words:
Well, it's *supposed* to be the same instruction set... but what (if any)
definition of "supposed" Motorola has is anybody's guess...
I can tell you that the 68k cross-compiler you use to create palm proggies
(.prc files) under Linux is stock... no changes required. _Sounds_ pretty
compatible to me, but of course YMMV.
HTH,
Roger "Merch" Merchberger
P.S. If I had:
1) a fair-to-decent assembler/editor for an Atari ST,
2) the .prc file header/footer format, &
3) any fair 68k assembly starter docs, I could test some things out...
--
Roger "Merch" Merchberger --- sysadmin, Iceberg Computers
Recycling is good, right??? Ok, so I'll recycle an old .sig.
If at first you don't succeed, nuclear warhead
disarmament should *not* be your first career choice.
Are you sure
the processor is the same? I didn't even think it had a
Motorola processor. If it is based on the 68k I suspect you might find
it's missing some of the instructions. I know I've seen talk in Amiga
circles about the latest 68k chips not having all the instructions
necessary to use them in a Amiga clone.
Zane
Guess I might as well correct myself. The processor is a Motorola
Dragonball. However, as mentioned, I don't think the instruction set is
quite the same. Don't know though. 
9:50 a.m.
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12:28 p.m.
New subject: Motorola 68k family ( was Re: Comparison of system specs. )
I find that very odd as usually each suceeding
generation of CPU typically
includes more instructions (or more addressing modes). It may be that the
latest 68k CPUs have timing differences that make running certain Amiga
software problematic. Do you have any more information on this?
-spc (Have Amiga will program)
Unfortunatly I don't remember where I read that for sure, and I'm not 100%
sure it's the Dragonball, but the Dragonball sounds like the right follow
on processor. I think I read it in the TEAM Amiga Mailing list, in one of
Dave Haynie's posts, but like I said, I don't remember.
However, I think even some of the 68040 and 68060 series chips don't have
all the instructions of earlier processors. We got any 68k pro's around
here?
Zane
| Zane H. Healy | UNIX Systems Adminstrator |
| healyzh(a)aracnet.com (primary) | Linux Enthusiast |
| healyzh(a)holonet.net (alternate) | Classic Computer Collector |
+----------------------------------+----------------------------+
| Empire of the Petal Throne and Traveller Role Playing, |
| and Zane's Computer Museum. |
| http://www.aracnet.com/~healyzh/ |
12 Dec
12 Dec
7:20 a.m.
New subject: Motorola 68k family ( was Re: Comparison of system specs. )
----- Original Message -----
From: Zane H. Healy <healyzh(a)aracnet.com>
To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers
<classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu>
Sent: Saturday, December 11, 1999 4:28 PM
Subject: Motorola 68k family ( was Re: Comparison of system specs. )
AFAIR, the FPU in had not all the instructions of the original
68881&68882.
some of the trigonemtric functions were missing, and motorola provided a
library with an emulation of this ...
but that's a long time ago ...
cheers,
emanuel
> I find that very odd as usually each suceeding
generation of CPU
typically
>includes more instructions (or more addressing
modes). It may be that
the
latest 68k CPUs
have timing differences that make running certain Amiga
software problematic. Do you have any more information on this?
-spc (Have Amiga will program)
Unfortunatly I don't remember where I read that for sure, and I'm not 100%
sure it's the Dragonball, but the Dragonball sounds like the right follow
on processor. I think I read it in the TEAM Amiga Mailing list, in one of
Dave Haynie's posts, but like I said, I don't remember.
However, I think even some of the 68040 and 68060 series chips don't have
all the instructions of earlier processors. We got any 68k pro's around
here? 
11 Dec
11 Dec
8:37 a.m.
On a similar vein, I think it would be cool to see an
Atari ST emulator on
the Palm... the screen sizes are pretty close, there's enough memory (on a
palm III) for a 1Meg ST emulator, it uses the same processor, so it
shouldn't run *too* slowly... but hooking up that floppy drive would be a
bit tough, I'll admit... ;-)
Maybe you could run the floppy via the IR or serial links?
I just bought my wife a Palm IIIx, but haven't been allowed to touch it
yet. My soldering iron is ready though. ;)
13 Dec
13 Dec
10:57 a.m.
At 11:24 PM 12/10/99 -0500, Jerome Fine wrote:
You'd think it would be easiest to port CP/M 68K to the Pilot,
and the C source is out there.
Do you have a way to convert RT-11's source to 68K assembler?
At 08:40 PM 12/10/99 -0800, healyzh(a)aracnet.com wrote:
Drew Amery
wrote:
to do this holiday season, I challenge someone to port RT-11 to the Palm
handhelds.
Which OS runs on the Palm handhelds? Possibly W95/W98 or even the
old DOS/Win 3.1? I will take the challenge in that case. Care to bet how
long it will take? Got to
admit I'm wondering if it's possible to put a PDP-11 emulator on one of
them. The big problem I see is console emulation.
I think that's the least of your troubles. They ported a small
Linux to Palm, and even to a Nintendo, where characters were
entered by wiggling the joystick and pressing the fire button.
- John
4:01 p.m.
John Foust wrote:
Do you have a way to convert RT-11's source to 68K
assembler?
Jerome Fine replies:
I have at least 2 years (maybe 4) of bug fixes and enhancements that
I want to make to RT-11, so while such a conversion would be
very interesting (and also still illegal), I will pass for the time being.
I will post a list of features that I would like to see for V5.8 of RT-11
if anyone is interested.
Sincerely yours,
Jerome Fine
8983
days inactive
8986
days old
11 comments
7 participants
participants (7)
-
emu＠ecubics.com -
healyzh＠aracnet.com -
jfoust＠threedee.com -
jhfine＠idirect.com -
mikeford＠socal.rr.com -
spc＠armigeron.com -
zmerch＠30below.com