12 Apr
1998
12 Apr
'98
3:41 a.m.
I am much more bothered by conmans (read my other reply
here). I collect
for
the historical inportance and for the history of design
of old electronics
and
for what they meant in the lives of millions of
persons. I don't even care
if
something is working or not. It is going to end up
behing glass anyway. I
I find you sick. Very sick. Keep computers functional,
working, cosmetics
should come second. I'm sure that we could find a TRS-80 model 1 CASE
somewhere for you.
can't possibly USE the more than 140 historical
computer I have in my
YES YOU COULD.
collection and don't even switch them on. I
don't collect them for making
them
work but to display them and help to teach children and
people about their
importance in the hsitory of humanity. The appearance is (nearly)
everything
to me and so a mumeric keypad where it should not be is
a GREAT bother to
me.
So what the hell are you bitching about? You got what you asked for, and
now, it's not a great bother to you. So what the %$&( if it's got a
numeric keypad? It's not a GREAT bother to you, but you've been a GREAT
bother to Cord and everyone else on the list.
Tim D. Hotze
12 Apr
12 Apr
7:15 a.m.
Is this a promise?
enrico
Hotze wrote:
I'm sure that we could find a TRS-80 model 1 CASE
somewhere for you.
Tim D. Hotze
--
========================================================
Enrico Tedeschi, 54 Easthill Drive, Brighton BN41 2FD, UK
Tel/fax(+01273) 701650 (24 hours) and 0498 692465 (mobile)
please visit my website at: <http://www.brighton-uk.com>
========================================================
11:25 a.m.
New subject: Collecting Philosophy, was Re: Asshole
Enrico wrote:
<snip> I collect for
Hotze wrote:
the historical inportance and for the history of
design of old
electronics
and
for what they meant in the lives of millions of
persons. I don't even
care
if
>something is working or not. It is going to end up behing glass anyway. I find you sick. Very sick. Keep computers
functional, working, cosmetics
should come second. I'm sure that we could find a TRS-80 model 1 CASE
somewhere for you.
Well, I collect for the same reasons as Enrico and my collection is
somewhere over 300 comupters. It would be wonderful to make sure they are
all working and use them on a regular basis but that is not even remotely
feasible to say the least. We all have different reasons for collecting and
mine are 1) to save them for their historical importance, 2) save them from
the scrap yard, and 3) have fun playing and repairing them as time permits
(not very often!)
1:52 p.m.
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9:01 p.m.
New subject: Collecting Philosophy, was Re: Asshole
Tony Duell wrote:
2) Finding out what the machines I grew up dreaming of
were really like.
I'm especially fond of this reason. I could never afford Apple II or
S-100 equipment, and eventually got inexpensive Vic-20 and
Timex-Sinclair machines... Then some Atari8-bit stuff... I really wanted
to give Mac, ST, and Amiga machines a whirl but had to pass them up in
order afford the PC stuff I really needed for my job... The urge to
backtrack and finally play with machines I reluctantly skipped over is
my main reason for starting a collection. And once I was in a
collecting mindset, and getting familiar with "families" of machines and
the complete history of computers, I found myself reading old literature
and becoming interested in things I was pretty much oblivious to at the
time they were new--like minicomputers, Euro home machines,
Alpha-Micros, HP85's, etc...
I won't claim I run all my 150+ machines all the
time. I have a few that
I run quite often (the PDP11/45, the PDP8/e, the PERQ 2, a TRS-80 M4,
this PC/AT, etc). Others I only run from time to time when I need them.
But I do try to have all my machines operational if at all possible.
I'm of the same feeling, yet I run across more machines at flea markets,
thrift and surplus stores than I have time to work on, and am building
up quite a backlog. I feel better getting them for either a) later
tinkering, or b) someday passing the project off to someone else who's
better prepared to make the effort--than leaving them there, running the
risk of them being trashed... So, despite considering myself a
hacker/user, I've become as much a straight collector, hanging on to as
many machines I may never use, as ones I am continually getting to know
better...
--
mor(a)crl.com
http://www.crl.com/~mor/
10:14 p.m.
New subject: Collecting Philosophy
Tony Duell wrote:
I probably didn't phrase things as well as I could have. I am *always* on
the lookout for technical manuals, documentation, and schematics for the
early machines, and *keeping* the older machines non-working is not the
idea. Most of the machines I have do work. However I also have a number of
them that were given to me not working. Some, such as C-64s, are a dime a
dozen and not worth (to me) the time to fix them. Understand them yes, but
fix them no. Others, such as the Jonas computers, are completely without
docs and I continue to keep my eyes open for stuff like that. In other
cases (pun intended :) ), I simply have no use for the computers and have
gotten them because they were headed to the dump if I had not taken them.
Of course, I usually take them regardless when they are given to me :). I
don't think we differ on the reasons for collecting.
Well, I
collect for the same reasons as Enrico and my collection is
somewhere over 300 comupters. It would be wonderful to make sure they
are
all working and use them on a regular basis but
that is not even
remotely
Hmmm... No flmes intended (and I hope we can agree to differ on this),
but I really can't see the point in collecting non-working computers _and
keeping them that way_. Sure I get a lot of non-working machines, but the
first thing I do is attempt to find a technical manual or scheamatic and
repair them. Working machines are a lot more interesting. The case
13 Apr
13 Apr
1:50 p.m.
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12 Apr
12 Apr
10:23 p.m.
New subject: Collecting Philosophy, was Re: Asshole
On Sun, 12 Apr 1998, Tony Duell wrote:
Well, not all of us have the time to work on every single system we get
our hands on. There are only so many hours in the day left over after
life stuff (ie. job, pets, family...) and this is just a side hobby for
me. My concern first is to at least get the computers to prevent them
Well, I
collect for the same reasons as Enrico and my collection is
somewhere over 300 comupters. It would be wonderful to make sure they are
all working and use them on a regular basis but that is not even remotely
Hmmm... No flmes intended (and I hope we can agree to differ on this),
but I really can't see the point in collecting non-working computers _and
keeping them that way_. Sure I get a lot of non-working machines, but the
first thing I do is attempt to find a technical manual or scheamatic and
repair them. Working machines are a lot more interesting. The case from being disposed of and worry about getting them
running later.
I collect for many reasons, amongst them :
1) The fun and mental challenge of restoring/repairing them. Fault
finding can be interesting, you know
I do it for the joy of being surrounded by such an ecclectic and expansive
collection of computers that span the innovation of two decades. When I
make enough money to relax for a couple months, I'll have fun restoring
and repairing them.
2) Finding out what the machines I grew up dreaming of
were really like.
And the machines that came before them. I could never afford them when
new, now I can play with them
Same here.
4) Tracing the history of certain features. To take a
trivial example,
IOBYTE at location 3 on CP/M can be traced back to the Intellec MCS8i. It
was at location 3 on that machine (with the same format of 4 2-bit
fields) as locations 0-2 were reserved for the reset jump instruction, so
this was the first free RAM location.
This is not only fun, but in my view, relevant. These are the sorts of
tidbits that, in my nerdy opion, would make a fascinating book: where all
the standards came from.
I won't claim I run all my 150+ machines all the
time. I have a few that
I run quite often (the PDP11/45, the PDP8/e, the PERQ 2, a TRS-80 M4,
this PC/AT, etc). Others I only run from time to time when I need them.
But I do try to have all my machines operational if at all possible.
That's commendable, but there's not a lot of need on my end to have
everything running. There's a desire, but not a need. When my collection
goes on display, it will be desirable to have at least one of everything
in the collection working with usable software so that people studying the
artifact can get a better understanding of it.
Sam Alternate e-mail: dastar(a)siconic.com
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Don't blame me...I voted for Satan.
Coming in September...Vintage Computer Festival 2.0
See http://www.siconic.com/vcf for details!
[Last web page update: 04/08/98]
13 Apr
13 Apr
2:52 p.m.
New subject: Collecting Philosophy, was Re: Asshole
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3:17 p.m.
New subject: Collecting Philosophy, was Re: Asshole
[Why collect?]
I like to think that eventually I'll have all my machines on the 'net one way
or another.
So far, it's just the uVAXen...
-------
12 Apr
12 Apr
3:24 p.m.
Hotze wrote:
AMEN--- Go Tim, You are so right. Where has common sense gone, I
think
50/50, (computer/crying) is NOT the percentage most signed on for.
--
To all the good and normal people, " Happy Easter".
Live Long and Prosper
Gil
http://www2.fwi.com/~circuitsurgeon/neonking.html
I am much more bothered by conmans (read my other
reply here). I collect
for
the historical inportance and for the history of
design of old electronics
and
for what they meant in the lives of millions of
persons. I don't even care
if
something is working or not. It is going to end up
behing glass anyway. I
I find you sick. Very sick. Keep computers functional,
working, cosmetics
should come second. I'm sure that we could find a TRS-80 model 1 CASE
somewhere for you.
can't possibly USE the more than 140
historical computer I have in my
YES YOU COULD.
collection and don't even switch them on. I
don't collect them for making
them
work but to display them and help to teach
children and people about their
importance in the hsitory of humanity. The appearance is (nearly)
everything
to me and so a mumeric keypad where it should not
be is a GREAT bother to
me.
So what the hell are you bitching about? You got what you asked for, and
now, it's not a great bother to you. So what the %$&( if it's got a
numeric keypad? It's not a GREAT bother to you, but you've been a GREAT
bother to Cord and everyone else on the list.
Tim D. Hotze
9771
days inactive
9772
days old
10 comments
8 participants
participants (8)
-
ard＠p850ug1.demon.co.uk -
circuitsurgeon＠fwi.com -
dastar＠wco.com -
DSEAGRAV＠toad.xkl.com -
e.tedeschi＠ndirect.co.uk -
marvin＠rain.org -
mor＠crl.com -
photze＠batelco.com.bh