7 Jul
2000
7 Jul
'00
5:31 a.m.
--- Mike Ford <mikeford(a)socal.rr.com> wrote:
=====
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Many people have told me you can't network the IIc
or IIc+
Hmm... I always thought you _could_.
but I am sure I remember somebody telling me the IIc+
could be kludged
to sort of work.
Maybe that's what I'm remembering.
Skipping that issue (unless somebody knows more), I
wonder if a
slower/dumber protocol than LocalTalk/AppleTalk might work?
I _had_ assumed the IIc+ has a Z8530 SIO chip inside. If that is _not_
the case then it's probably some flavor of ACIA 65xx or 68xx UART. The
Z8530 is a great chip, found in Suns, Macs, COMBOARDs ;-)
For LocalTalk, Apple runs the chip at ~230kbps, IIRC (tangentally, I
have the Byte article unveiling the 128K Mac where they describe a
"slotless" architecture using virtual slots off the serial port in a
manner that sounds like what USB has finally brought to the masses).
I do not know if a 4Mhz 65C02 can pull data off the chip fast enough
to be practical. We used to use a 4Mhz Z8530 w/an 8Mhz 68000 with
plenty of cycles to go around.
The idea would be to plug a PhoneNet adapter into a
IIc/IIc+ serial port,
Now add a second IIc/IIc+ to the "network"
and run a normal terminal
program on it. Seems to me all you need to add is some kind of protocol for
a packet with an address field and it should work. Ideas, opinions?
Kermit? That would handle a point-to-point network, any way. You might be
able to start with a PPP implementation for the 6502 and retrofit some kind
of ARPish protocol on top of it (since PPP lacks that sort of thing) and go
from there.
On a side note, I recently aquired an older IIgs. It works and I have no
software for it except my 1978-1983 era stuff for my old II. Did people
ever network the IIgs to a Mac? If so, how?
-ethan
7 Jul
7 Jul
6:13 a.m.
Since the IIc has come up again, I'm still looking for a way to get useable
parallel I/O out of one of these guys. Is there a way to get parllel output
AND input using a IIc? I've had one lying about for some 10 years and still
haven't found a single reason to keep it, except that I'd have to carry it
upstairs to dispose of it.
If I could get, say, 4 bits of input and seven or eight bits of output
without having to open the box, it would be useable for something. Another
useful bit of information would be the memory map that's used. I could see
building a PIA or some such into the thing if I could find a place ion the
map that's sufficiently innoccuous.
Dick
----- Original Message -----
From: Ethan Dicks <ethan_dicks(a)yahoo.com>
To: <classiccmp(a)classiccmp.org>
Sent: Friday, July 07, 2000 8:31 AM
Subject: Re: Networking Apple IIc or IIc+
be
--- Mike Ford <mikeford(a)socal.rr.com> wrote:
port,
Many people have told me you can't network
the IIc or IIc+
Hmm... I always thought you _could_.
but I am sure I remember somebody telling me the
IIc+ could be kludged
to sort of work.
Maybe that's what I'm remembering.
Skipping that issue (unless somebody knows more),
I wonder if a
slower/dumber protocol than LocalTalk/AppleTalk might work?
I _had_ assumed the IIc+ has a Z8530 SIO chip inside. If that is _not_
the case then it's probably some flavor of ACIA 65xx or 68xx UART. The
Z8530 is a great chip, found in Suns, Macs, COMBOARDs ;-)
For LocalTalk, Apple runs the chip at ~230kbps, IIRC (tangentally, I
have the Byte article unveiling the 128K Mac where they describe a
"slotless" architecture using virtual slots off the serial port in a
manner that sounds like what USB has finally brought to the masses).
I do not know if a 4Mhz 65C02 can pull data off the chip fast enough
to be practical. We used to use a 4Mhz Z8530 w/an 8Mhz 68000 with
plenty of cycles to go around.
> The idea would be to plug a PhoneNet adapter into a IIc/IIc+ serial
> Now add a second IIc/IIc+ to the "network" and run a normal terminal
> program on it. Seems to me all you need to add is some kind of protocol
for
a packet with
an address field and it should work. Ideas, opinions?
Kermit? That would handle a point-to-point network, any way. You might able to start with a PPP implementation for the 6502
and retrofit some
kind
of ARPish protocol on top of it (since PPP lacks that
sort of thing) and
go
from there.
On a side note, I recently aquired an older IIgs. It works and I have no
software for it except my 1978-1983 era stuff for my old II. Did people
ever network the IIgs to a Mac? If so, how?
-ethan
=====
Even though my old e-mail address is no longer going to
vanish, please note my new public address: erd(a)iname.com
The original webpage address is still going away. The
permanent home is: http://penguincentral.com/
See http://ohio.voyager.net/ for details.
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Send instant messages & get email alerts with Yahoo! Messenger.
http://im.yahoo.com/
10:34 a.m.
Since the IIc has come up again, I'm still looking
for a way to get useable
parallel I/O out of one of these guys. Is there a way to get parllel output
AND input using a IIc? I've had one lying about for some 10 years and still
I was looking at the floppy port last night and kind of wondering what the
possibilities might be. It has power, data, and control lines, what more
could anybody want?
1:18 p.m.
One thing one might want is signal definitions, along with some way of
characterizing the behavior of the port with respect to software. Is it
completely bit-by-bit controllable? ( You do mean that odd-sized sub-d
connector, right?) I want to talk to an external device on a bitwise basis
and don't need too many bits. 8 each way would be OK. fewer would be
better thanwhat I know of right now. Is there any sort of data on this and
other features that I might snag over the www?
Dick
----- Original Message -----
From: Mike Ford <mikeford(a)socal.rr.com>
To: <classiccmp(a)classiccmp.org>
Sent: Friday, July 07, 2000 1:34 PM
Subject: Re: Networking Apple IIc or IIc+
>Since the IIc has come up again, I'm still
looking for a way to get
useable
>parallel I/O out of one of these guys. Is there a
way to get parllel
output
>AND input using a IIc? I've had one lying
about for some 10 years and
still
I was looking at the floppy port last night and kind of wondering what the
possibilities might be. It has power, data, and control lines, what more
could anybody want?
10:30 a.m.
On a side note, I recently aquired an older IIgs. It
works and I have no
software for it except my 1978-1983 era stuff for my old II. Did people
ever network the IIgs to a Mac? If so, how?
The IIgs is a full localtalk ready Appleshare client machine, might be a
rom version issue, but you can boot them over the net from a mac. I think
the mac might need to be running AppleShare Server, but I haven't "done" it
yet. Its a BIG item on my list of things to do.
8782
days inactive
8782
days old
4 comments
3 participants
participants (3)
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ethan_dicks＠yahoo.com -
mikeford＠socal.rr.com -
richard＠idcomm.com