22 May
2002
22 May
'02
5:51 a.m.
-----Original Message-----
From: Bob Lafleur [mailto:bob_lafleur@technologist.com]
I will shortly be receiving a MicroVax 3100/90 and a
TK50Z-GA
tape drive.
Both have SCSI, and I assumed they would work together.
However, I just read
something that seems to imply the TK50Z-GA is "incompatible"
SCSI, and will
Well, I've never heard of anyone getting it to work with anything
else. :) You could try it. It's the one without the ID selector,
right?
I think the ID is fixed, since the other alternative is to pass
it through the cable, and that would be, well, interesting, to
say the least...
only work on the MicroVax 2000. Can anyone confirm
this
either way? If it
will work, what type of SCSI cable will I need - a standard
one, or some
Should be a standard cable.
proprietary one? If it won't work, is there any
way to "fix"
the TK50Z-GA so
that it will? Thanks.
Um, yes, but it will require the internals from a tk50 drive that
will work ;) (Seriously, the drives are all the same, but some of
the logic that's packed in the case with them is different... so
I've heard.)
Chris
Christopher Smith, Perl Developer
Amdocs - Champaign, IL
/usr/bin/perl -e '
print((~"\x95\xc4\xe3"^"Just Another Perl
Hacker.")."\x08!\n");
'
22 May
22 May
6:11 a.m.
Maybe it would be easier to get a MicroVAX 2000 to hook the TK50Z-GA to!
I bare-bones MV2000 must be fairly inexpensive, right? Anyone got any
extras?!
-----Original Message-----
From: cctalk-admin(a)classiccmp.org [mailto:cctalk-admin@classiccmp.org]
On Behalf Of Christopher Smith
Sent: Wednesday, May 22, 2002 10:52 AM
To: 'cctalk(a)classiccmp.org'
Subject: RE: TK50Z-GA and MicroVax 3100/90?
-----Original Message-----
From: Bob Lafleur [mailto:bob_lafleur@technologist.com]
I will shortly be receiving a MicroVax 3100/90 and a
TK50Z-GA
tape drive.
Both have SCSI, and I assumed they would work together.
However, I just read
something that seems to imply the TK50Z-GA is "incompatible"
SCSI, and will
Well, I've never heard of anyone getting it to work with anything else.
:) You could try it. It's the one without the ID selector, right?
I think the ID is fixed, since the other alternative is to pass
it through the cable, and that would be, well, interesting, to say the
least...
only work on the MicroVax 2000. Can anyone confirm
this
either way? If it
will work, what type of SCSI cable will I need - a standard
one, or some
Should be a standard cable.
proprietary one? If it won't work, is there any
way to "fix"
the TK50Z-GA so
that it will? Thanks.
Um, yes, but it will require the internals from a tk50 drive that will
work ;) (Seriously, the drives are all the same, but some of the logic
that's packed in the case with them is different... so
I've heard.)
Chris
Christopher Smith, Perl Developer
Amdocs - Champaign, IL
/usr/bin/perl -e '
print((~"\x95\xc4\xe3"^"Just Another Perl
Hacker.")."\x08!\n"); '
6:30 a.m.
anyone have an *extra* memory for the MV2000?
----- Original Message -----
From: "Bob Lafleur" <bob_lafleur(a)technologist.com>
To: <cctalk(a)classiccmp.org>
Sent: Wednesday, May 22, 2002 9:11 AM
Subject: RE: TK50Z-GA and MicroVax 3100/90?
Maybe it would be easier to get a MicroVAX 2000 to
hook the TK50Z-GA to!
I bare-bones MV2000 must be fairly inexpensive, right? Anyone got any
extras?!
-----Original Message-----
From: cctalk-admin(a)classiccmp.org [mailto:cctalk-admin@classiccmp.org]
On Behalf Of Christopher Smith
Sent: Wednesday, May 22, 2002 10:52 AM
To: 'cctalk(a)classiccmp.org'
Subject: RE: TK50Z-GA and MicroVax 3100/90?
-----Original Message-----
From: Bob Lafleur [mailto:bob_lafleur@technologist.com]
I will shortly be receiving a MicroVax 3100/90
and a TK50Z-GA
tape drive.
Both have SCSI, and I assumed they would work together.
However, I just read
something that seems to imply the TK50Z-GA is "incompatible"
SCSI, and will
Well, I've never heard of anyone getting it to work with anything else.
:) You could try it. It's the one without the ID selector, right?
I think the ID is fixed, since the other alternative is to pass
it through the cable, and that would be, well, interesting, to say the
least...
only work on the MicroVax 2000. Can anyone
confirm this
either way? If it
will work, what type of SCSI cable will I need - a standard
one, or some
Should be a standard cable.
proprietary one? If it won't work, is there
any way to "fix"
the TK50Z-GA so
that it will? Thanks.
Um, yes, but it will require the internals from a tk50 drive that will
work ;) (Seriously, the drives are all the same, but some of the logic
that's packed in the case with them is different... so
I've heard.)
Chris
Christopher Smith, Perl Developer
Amdocs - Champaign, IL
/usr/bin/perl -e '
print((~"\x95\xc4\xe3"^"Just Another Perl
Hacker.")."\x08!\n"); '
6:54 a.m.
--- Bob Lafleur <bob_lafleur(a)technologist.com> wrote:
Maybe it would be easier to get a MicroVAX 2000 to
hook the TK50Z-GA to!
Perhaps. Large RD-series drives are somewhat rare these days.
I bare-bones MV2000 must be fairly inexpensive, right?
Anyone got any
extras?!
The shipping will probably be equal to or in excess of the value of the
bare CPU. Not necessarily so for an RD54. Memory (as someone already
pointed out) is another gotcha. I have more than one CPU, but not a
single memory card over 4MB (and only one ethernet module). The uVAX
MMJ adapter is also somewhat hard to find unless you get it with the
computer (it fits over the DA15/DE9 and give you three serial ports
from the mouse/keyboard/console ports)
If all you want is a disk formatter, though, a uVAX-2000 with no
ethernet, 4MB of RAM and no disk should be cheap.
-ethan
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
LAUNCH - Your Yahoo! Music Experience
http://launch.yahoo.com
6:11 a.m.
--- Christopher Smith <csmith(a)amdocs.com> wrote:
Nice.
-----Original
Message-----
From: Bob Lafleur [mailto:bob_lafleur@technologist.com]
> I will shortly be receiving a MicroVax 3100/90 and a TK50Z-GA
> tape drive. > Both have SCSI, and I assumed they would work
together.
> However, I just read something that seems to imply the TK50Z-GA
> is "incompatible" SCSI...
Not AFAIK. It's the TK50Z-FA doesn't play nice with others.
Well, I've never heard of anyone getting it to
work with anything
else. :) You could try it. It's the one without the ID selector,
right?
Nope... the -FA is lacking the ID selector (device '5' always, ISTR)
and doesn't like sharing the bus with anyone else.
Um, yes, but it will require the internals from a tk50
drive that
will work ;) (Seriously, the drives are all the same, but some of
the logic that's packed in the case with them is different... so
I've heard.)
If you _have_ an -FA, you can replace the ROMs with -GA ROMs and it
behaves like a -GA at a fixed address. If you have a -GA, I suppose
you could put -FA ROMs in it for use with a MicroVAX 2000, but I
don't know that you are required to do that. I don't own a -GA
to test the theory, just a few -FAs.
As an isolated data point, a buddy of mine did stick a TK50Z-FA on
his Amiga 2000 and read/write data, but it was the only device on
that SCSI card. The board inside the enclosure has a standard
5380 chip, but I don't know what it is about the firmware that
makes it act so wierd.
You will not enjoy depending on a TK50 as a primary backup device.
It holds 95MB *max* per tape (it streams and if there isn't any
data, it writes filler) and takes multiple passes to read one tape
(the head physically moves up and down to read different portions
of the tape on each pass). It is *sloooow*. Personally, I prefer
1600 bpi magtape to the TK50, even though it take at least two reels
for equivalent capacity.
-ethan
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
LAUNCH - Your Yahoo! Music Experience
http://launch.yahoo.com
6:35 a.m.
Think I'd better speak up.
The -GA Has an ID selector on it and supposedly
works on non-DEC SCSI. The non-GA has no ID
sel and is dedicated to the mV2000.
John A.
6:39 a.m.
Thanks for the clarification.
Both the -FA and -GA come in the same style case, right? The MiccroVAX
2000-style box. Or does the -GA come in a different box?
-----Original Message-----
From: cctalk-admin(a)classiccmp.org [mailto:cctalk-admin@classiccmp.org]
On Behalf Of John Allain
Sent: Wednesday, May 22, 2002 11:35 AM
To: cctalk(a)classiccmp.org
Subject: Re: TK50Z-GA and MicroVax 3100/90?
Think I'd better speak up.
The -GA Has an ID selector on it and supposedly
works on non-DEC SCSI. The non-GA has no ID
sel and is dedicated to the mV2000.
John A.
23 May
23 May
10:23 a.m.
Got my TK50Z-GA today, but not the MicroVAX. Guess that will come
tomorrow.
Anyway, it does have the switch selectable SCSI ID on it, and my PC
recognizes it as a tape drive, although I don't have any software that
will play nice with it.
So I guess I don't expect to have any problems getting it to work on the
3100/90. Now the BIG question... Does the 3100/90 have a "standard" SCSI
connector, or the "mangled" one like earlier 3100 models?
10:26 a.m.
On Thu, 23 May 2002, Bob Lafleur wrote:
Got my TK50Z-GA today, but not the MicroVAX. Guess
that will come
tomorrow.
Anyway, it does have the switch selectable SCSI ID on it, and my PC
recognizes it as a tape drive, although I don't have any software that
will play nice with it.
So I guess I don't expect to have any problems getting it to work on the
3100/90. Now the BIG question... Does the 3100/90 have a "standard" SCSI
connector, or the "mangled" one like earlier 3100 models?
It has a SCSI-I style (50pin amphelon) if that's what you mean by
non-mangled.
-- Pat
10:44 a.m.
It has a SCSI-I style (50pin amphelon) if that's
what you mean by
non-mangled.
50-pin "amphenol" you mean... Is that like a 50-pin centronics? I've
basically seen either the 50-pin centronics, or the DB25 type.
What I mean by "mangled" is the 68-pin thing that some 3100's have (3100
VaxStations, anyway... Don't know if the 3100 MicroVAXen follow the same
suit, or have the more standard SCSI-I/II connectors)
10:53 a.m.
In a word, yes. I was trying to avoid the flamewar we got into a while
back when some one else called it a 50-pin centronics (well, at least that
was part of the flamewar). Basically, Centronics is a printer interface
type, not a type of connector. Amphenol (along with others I'm sure) made
the 36pin connector commonly called a 'centronics' connector.
-- Pat
On Thu, 23 May 2002, Bob Lafleur wrote:
It has a
SCSI-I style (50pin amphelon) if that's what you mean by
non-mangled.
50-pin "amphenol" you mean... Is that like a 50-pin centronics? I've
basically seen either the 50-pin centronics, or the DB25 type.
What I mean by "mangled" is the 68-pin thing that some 3100's have (3100
VaxStations, anyway... Don't know if the 3100 MicroVAXen follow the same
suit, or have the more standard SCSI-I/II connectors)
11:02 a.m.
In a word, yes. I was trying to avoid the flamewar we
got into a
while back when some one else called it a 50-pin centronics (well, at
least that was part of the flamewar). Basically, Centronics is a
printer interface type, not a type of connector. Amphenol (along with
others I'm sure) made the 36pin connector commonly called a 'centronics'
connector.
Ok! I got it. Centronics may be a specific printer type, but a
"centronics connector" is much more descriptive to most than an
"amphenol" connector. Amphenol has made MANY kinds of connectors!!
Anyway, OK. I have some of the cables I'll need then, phew! Thought I
was going to have to go searching for a cable.
- Bob
2:52 p.m.
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6:25 p.m.
Tony Duell said:
But the Centronics parallel interface has nothing to do with SCSI, and
thus calling a particular type of SCSI connector a 'centronics connector'
is plain wrong. It's neither a Centronics interface nor even the same
connector as one (the SCSI connector is the 50 pin version, the
Centronics parallel printer interface uses the 36 pin one).
I often refer to these connectors as "centronics style". That way people know
what I mean, but I don't think it's technically wrong either... after all it
is a connector in the same "style" as the centronics printer connector :)
-tony
- Dan Wright
(dtwright(a)uiuc.edu)
(http://www.uiuc.edu/~dtwright)
-] ------------------------------ [-] -------------------------------- [-
``Weave a circle round him thrice, / And close your eyes with holy dread,
For he on honeydew hath fed, / and drunk the milk of Paradise.''
Samuel Taylor Coleridge, Kubla Khan
10:55 a.m.
On Thu, 23 May 2002, Bob Lafleur wrote:
Oh, gods, here we go....
Doc, limbering up his Delete Key
It has a
SCSI-I style (50pin amphelon) if that's what you mean by
non-mangled.
50-pin "amphenol" you mean... Is that like a 50-pin centronics? I've
basically seen either the 50-pin centronics, or the DB25 type.
2:49 p.m.
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8130
days inactive
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15 comments
9 participants
participants (9)
-
allain＠panix.com -
ard＠p850ug1.demon.co.uk -
bob_lafleur＠technologist.com -
csmith＠amdocs.com -
doc＠mdrconsult.com -
dtwright＠uiuc.edu -
erd_6502＠yahoo.com -
pat＠purdueriots.com -
rodyoung＠shaw.ca