23 Dec
2000
23 Dec
'00
4:51 p.m.
I just figured out that someone asked me how much I was paying for my DSL
from Qwest. Forgive me, but I can't find who the
original poster was.
Anyway: Base rate for the line is $29.95/mo. Round to $30.
Add to that $35/mo for Qwest.net (the ISP) to be the host. Includes web
space (which I no longer use) and mailboxes (which I won't be using much
longer).
Finally, tack on $15/mo for a private block of eight static IP's. Three
are reserved to be the network, gateway, and broadcast addresses for my
subnet (I'm subnetted off a class A block), and five are user-definable,
function-wise. Subtract one more for the router interface, and that leaves
me four usable.
Total: A little under $80/month for everything, and that includes a
guaranteed data rate of 256K down (I get 384 during rainy weather, and 512K
during dry), and 272K up.
If anyone knows of another ISP that can give me my own subnet for
$50/month or less, and equivalent bandwidth, please say so. ;-)
Hope that helps.
-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
Bruce Lane, Owner and head honcho, Blue Feather Technologies
http://www.bluefeathertech.com // E-mail: kyrrin(a)bluefeathertech.com
Amateur Radio: WD6EOS since Dec. '77 (Extra class as of June-2K)
"I'll get a life when someone demonstrates to me that it would be
superior to what I have now..." (Gym Z. Quirk, aka Taki Kogoma).
23 Dec
23 Dec
5:33 p.m.
Hmmm . . . that's interesting, to be sure. I'm not the one who asked, BTW,
and I don't know where you are, of course, but the DSL throught Qwest here
is 19.95 for a 640Kbps albeit time-limited amount. IIRC, the charge for the
persistent session is about $10 more, so that lines up with what you're
being charged. It looks, overall that if you're paying too much at all it's
likely at the ISP, but by $5 at most. The data rate puzzles me, though,
since I get 640Kbps down and 272 up, of which the only reduction in poor
weather is the down-rate, which falls off to 512 K. Perhaps that will
change over time.
Dick
----- Original Message -----
From: "Bruce Lane" <kyrrin(a)bluefeathertech.com>
To: <classiccmp(a)classiccmp.org>
Sent: Saturday, December 23, 2000 8:51 PM
Subject: DSL Rate
I just figured out that someone asked me how much I
was paying for my DSL
from Qwest. Forgive me, but I can't find who the original poster was.
Anyway: Base rate for the line is $29.95/mo. Round to $30.
Add to that $35/mo for Qwest.net (the ISP) to be the host. Includes web
space (which I no longer use) and mailboxes (which I won't be using much
longer).
Finally, tack on $15/mo for a private block of eight static IP's. Three
are reserved to be the network, gateway, and broadcast addresses for my
subnet (I'm subnetted off a class A block), and five are user-definable,
function-wise. Subtract one more for the router interface, and that leaves
me four usable.
Total: A little under $80/month for everything, and that includes a
guaranteed data rate of 256K down (I get 384 during rainy weather, and
512K
during dry), and 272K up.
If anyone knows of another ISP that can give me my own subnet for
$50/month or less, and equivalent bandwidth, please say so. ;-)
Hope that helps.
-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
Bruce Lane, Owner and head honcho, Blue Feather Technologies
http://www.bluefeathertech.com // E-mail: kyrrin(a)bluefeathertech.com
Amateur Radio: WD6EOS since Dec. '77 (Extra class as of June-2K)
"I'll get a life when someone demonstrates to me that it would be
superior to what I have now..." (Gym Z. Quirk, aka Taki Kogoma).
7:34 p.m.
It was thus said that the Great Bruce Lane once stated:
Finally, tack on $15/mo for a private block of eight static IP's. Three
are reserved to be the network, gateway, and broadcast addresses for my
subnet (I'm subnetted off a class A block), and five are user-definable,
function-wise. Subtract one more for the router interface, and that leaves
me four usable.
Um, isn't the gateway the same as the router interface? I have a similar
set up (subblock of 8, one network, one broadcast, one for gateway/router,
leaving me five to play with).
Total: A little under $80/month for everything, and
that includes a
guaranteed data rate of 256K down (I get 384 during rainy weather, and 512K
during dry), and 272K up.
If anyone knows of another ISP that can give me my own subnet for
$50/month or less, and equivalent bandwidth, please say so. ;-)
Try Velotel (http://www.velotel.com/). $65/month gets you DSL (guarenteed
speed dependant upon distance from CO) and 5 static IP addresses, no
restrictions on what you run over your connection.
-spc (Very happy with them so far. Much less happy with Bell South)
8:26 p.m.
New subject: Sol Computer Info
I was really curious about that $3551.53 Sol computer a couple of weeks ago
and went back to check on it. Seems that the bidder is NARU with the last
three feedbacks negs. Something about teenagers and a stolen password. There
is no feedback left on this item for buyer or seller and the computer hasn't
been relisted so far.
24 Dec
24 Dec
1:59 a.m.
At 01:34 24-12-2000 -0500, you wrote:
Um, isn't the gateway the same as the router
interface? I have a similar
set up (subblock of 8, one network, one broadcast, one for gateway/router,
leaving me five to play with).
I meant the router on my LAN. Here's a quick ASCII...
TelcoLine==Cisco675DSU==MyRouter==MyLAN
The 675, based on its configuration, presents the following subnet on its
Ethernet port.
63.226.233.136 (Reserved, Network)
63.226.233.137 (User-assignable, assigned to the Ethernet port on
'MyRouter' by yours truly).
63.226.233.138 - 141 (User-Assignable, various machines)
.142 = Default gateway address on the Cisco side (Reserved).
.143 = Broadcast (Reserved)
Does that make a little more sense?
As for Velotel: Thanks for the word. I will look them over.
-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
Bruce Lane, Owner and head honcho, Blue Feather Technologies
http://www.bluefeathertech.com // E-mail: kyrrin(a)bluefeathertech.com
Amateur Radio: WD6EOS since Dec. '77 (Extra class as of June-2K)
"I'll get a life when someone demonstrates to me that it would be
superior to what I have now..." (Gym Z. Quirk, aka Taki Kogoma).
4:34 a.m.
Bruce Lane wrote:
At 01:34 24-12-2000 -0500, you wrote:
Let me repeat what 'You' wrote: Um, isn't the gateway the same as the
router interface?
Now let me point out what I'm used to seeing.
The network 63.226.233.136 has 8 IP addresses reserved for it. The first
and the last are reserved (both are for broadcast, network and broadcast).
The first host is network +1 the last is network +6. This is what I'd
expect:
---+ +-+ +--------+
ISP|------| |---| Host 1 |
---+ |H| +--------+
|U| :
|B| +--------+
| |---| Host 5 |
+-+ +--------+
This is what you've told me:
---+ +----------+ +-+ +--------+
ISP|--| MyRouter |----| |---| Host 1 |
---+ +----------+ |H| +--------+
|U| :
|B| +--------+
| |---| Host 5 |
+-+ +--------+
Normally the IP's between the Myrouter and the ISP's routers would be
one network and the IP's between Myrouter and the rest of the network
would be another. That is unless Myrouter can do firewalling with
bridging instead of routing. My network at home is setup in a similar
way. I have a 24 network between My router and the ISP and I have a
192.168.x.x, 172.16.x.x, and a 10.x.x.x network behind my router.
Myrouter does Network Address Translation (or IP Masquerading).
--
Linux Home Automation Neil Cherry ncherry(a)home.net
http://members.home.net/ncherry (Text only)
http://meltingpot.fortunecity.com/lightsey/52 (Graphics)
http://linuxha.sourceforge.net/ (SourceForge)
Um, isn't the gateway the same as the router
interface? I have a similar
set up (subblock of 8, one network, one broadcast, one for gateway/router,
leaving me five to play with).
I meant the router on my LAN. Here's a quick ASCII...
TelcoLine==Cisco675DSU==MyRouter==MyLAN
The 675, based on its configuration, presents the following subnet on its
Ethernet port.
63.226.233.136 (Reserved, Network)
63.226.233.137 (User-assignable, assigned to the Ethernet port on
'MyRouter' by yours truly).
63.226.233.138 - 141 (User-Assignable, various machines)
.142 = Default gateway address on the Cisco side (Reserved).
.143 = Broadcast (Reserved)
Does that make a little more sense?
As for Velotel: Thanks for the word. I will look them over.
6:01 a.m.
At 10:34 24-12-2000 -0500, Neil Cherry wrote:
Let me repeat what 'You' wrote: Um, isn't
the gateway the same as the
router interface?
Not to my mind. My router, having two Ethernet ports, must have an IP
address for each of those ports. In order to be a part of the subnet on the
Cisco side, the port attached to it must have an IP address out of the
63.226 block I've been assigned. Ergo, that address is not available for a
machine.
Yes, my router does full 1:1 NAT mapping and firewalling. The Cisco is not
capable of anything near as sophisticated, so I'm simply using it for its
DSU features.
-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
Bruce Lane, Owner and head honcho, Blue Feather Technologies
http://www.bluefeathertech.com // E-mail: kyrrin(a)bluefeathertech.com
Amateur Radio: WD6EOS since Dec. '77 (Extra class as of June-2K)
"I'll get a life when someone demonstrates to me that it would be
superior to what I have now..." (Gym Z. Quirk, aka Taki Kogoma).
6:28 a.m.
At 09:01 AM 12/24/00 -0800, Bruce wrote:
Not to my mind. My router, having two Ethernet
ports, must have an IP
address for each of those ports. In order to be a part of the subnet on the
Cisco side, the port attached to it must have an IP address out of the
63.226 block I've been assigned. Ergo, that address is not available for a
machine.
But the router actually can use the *same* IP address on both sides. This
is running in what is known as 'unnumbered' mode. Since the diagram looks
like this:
+-------------+
| |
ISP +----------+ A Router B +-------> LAN
| |
+-------------+
Both interfaces A and B do not need unique IP addresses. They need only
one, since everything coming in port B that isn't for the local subnet goes
out port A and everything from the ISP is logically appearing at port B.
The the router to ISP path is a point-to-point link this works great.
--Chuck
7:06 a.m.
Chuck McManis wrote:
At 09:01 AM 12/24/00 -0800, Bruce wrote:
I've never used Unnumbered (I forgot about that!), this is sorta, kinda,
maybe like a layer 3 switch. :-) I'll need to look that up, it could be a
very useful tool. Thanks
--
Linux Home Automation Neil Cherry ncherry(a)home.net
http://members.home.net/ncherry (Text only)
http://meltingpot.fortunecity.com/lightsey/52 (Graphics)
http://linuxha.sourceforge.net/ (SourceForge)
Not to my mind. My router, having two
Ethernet ports, must have an IP
address for each of those ports. In order to be a part of the subnet on the
Cisco side, the port attached to it must have an IP address out of the
63.226 block I've been assigned. Ergo, that address is not available for a
machine.
But the router actually can use the *same* IP address on both sides. This
is running in what is known as 'unnumbered' mode. Since the diagram looks
like this:
+-------------+
| |
ISP +----------+ A Router B +-------> LAN
| |
+-------------+
Both interfaces A and B do not need unique IP addresses. They need only
one, since everything coming in port B that isn't for the local subnet goes
out port A and everything from the ISP is logically appearing at port B.
The the router to ISP path is a point-to-point link this works great.
--Chuck
7:02 a.m.
Bruce Lane wrote:
At 10:34 24-12-2000 -0500, Neil Cherry wrote:
(From a previous message:)
Let me repeat what 'You' wrote: Um,
isn't the gateway the same as the
router interface?
Not to my mind. My router, having two Ethernet ports, must have an IP
address for each of those ports. In order to be a part of the subnet on the
Cisco side, the port attached to it must have an IP address out of the
63.226 block I've been assigned. Ergo, that address is not available for a
machine.
Yes, my router does full 1:1 NAT mapping and firewalling. The Cisco is not
capable of anything near as sophisticated, so I'm simply using it for its
DSU features. The 675, based on its configuration, presents the
following subnet
on its Ethernet port.
63.226.233.136 (Reserved, Network)
63.226.233.137 (User-assignable, assigned to the Ethernet port on
'MyRouter' by yours truly).
63.226.233.138 - 141 (User-Assignable, various machines)
.142 = Default gateway address on the Cisco side (Reserved).
.143 = Broadcast (Reserved)
B
A /-----------------\
---+ +-+ +-+ +-+ +--------+
ISP|--|C|---|M|----| |---| Host 1 | <- .138
---+ |i| |y| |H| +--------+
|s| |R| |U| :
|c| |t| |B| +--------+
|o| |r| | |---| Host 5 | <- .141
+-+ +-+ +-+ +--------+
| | |
| | \-> No IP (not really needed)
| \-> .137 (2 interfaces 1 address?)
\-> .142
.136 - reserved, All zeroes broadcast or network (AKA the wire number)
.143 - reserved, All ones broadcast
OK this tells me that MyRouter is acting as a bridge (at layer 3 they're
the same network). Can MyRouter act as firewall and be a bridge?
Because I've done a good job of confusing myself let me ask a really dumb
question. Do you have this working now? My background in network tells me
this shouldn't work. My background in computers tells me that there is a
way to make this work but requires inventiveness on the part of MyRouter.
I have no trouble with everything connected to the hub. My confusion
starts at the MyRouter device, if it is just a router, then this won't
work. If it can firewall/bridge then you're OK. If it's a layer 3 switch/
firwall then you're OK, uhmm I guess ;-). Technology don't you just
love it!
--
Linux Home Automation Neil Cherry ncherry(a)home.net
http://members.home.net/ncherry (Text only)
http://meltingpot.fortunecity.com/lightsey/52 (Graphics)
http://linuxha.sourceforge.net/ (SourceForge)
28 Dec
28 Dec
3:33 p.m.
At 13:02 24-12-2000 -0500, Neil C. wrote:
OK this tells me that MyRouter is acting as a bridge
(at layer 3 they're
the same network). Can MyRouter act as firewall and be a bridge?
<shrug> I've not delved heavily into the OSI layer model. As far as the
features go, the P312 has been released for production so you can look for
yourself at:
http://www.zyxel.com/product/dslcablesharing/p312.htm
Because I've done a good job of confusing myself
let me ask a really dumb
question. Do you have this working now?
Yes! It's been working just fine for over three months. I was in the Beta
program for the P312 prior to its public release. I chose it specifically
because of its extensive NAT capabilities.
In fact, as evidenced by this (and earlier) posts, I brought our mail
server online this past week. It's 1-1 NATted through the Zyxel as well.
The server itself carries a reserved 192.168.x.x address, and that's mapped
1-1 to the outside world with a 63.226.233.x address out of my assigned group.
this shouldn't work. My background in computers
tells me that there is a
way to make this work but requires inventiveness on the part of MyRouter.
Then I'd say we've got some -really- smart engineers at Zyxel. ;-)
I have no trouble with everything connected to the hub.
Actually, the 'hub' is a smart 10/100 switch.
Happy cogitating.
-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
Bruce Lane, Owner and head honcho, Blue Feather Technologies
http://www.bluefeathertech.com // E-mail: kyrrin(a)bluefeathertech.com
Amateur Radio: WD6EOS since Dec. '77 (Extra class as of June-2K)
"I'll get a life when someone demonstrates to me that it would be
superior to what I have now..." (Gym Z. Quirk, aka Taki Kogoma).
8581
days inactive
8586
days old
10 comments
6 participants
participants (6)
-
cmcmanis＠mcmanis.com -
edick＠idcomm.com -
kyrrin＠bluefeathertech.com -
marvin＠rain.org -
ncherry＠home.net -
spc＠conman.org