A petition would certainly not hurt. Maybe some of us could get bigshot friends to sign on. William Donzelli aw288(a)osfn.org

Maybe I am being simple, but putting in the top bid seems like the sure route to acquiring this unit.

Anybody have a CLUE as to its value as scrap?

One of the bad guys (professional scrapper) said he paid $10K for Each IBM 360 he got. Sounds like more than $1/llb folks.

worn out appliances, junk cars, and such

Mike Ford wrote: I should have clarified. It's not that significant when you factor in the transport, labor, fuel, processing supplies, hazardous disposal costs, and other overhead. I have had occasion to haul off worn out appliances, junk cars, and such to the scrapper, and I even did a spreadsheet or two for one. The margin is not that high without a little help sometimes, if you know what I mean. Something like that might be going on in the case of the Cyber, and the state may be lucky not to lose more than $10K selling it as scrap, even with a slash-and-burn removal. To be fair, that may represent the least cost method of disposal, at least in terms that beancounters can understand. Unless a rescue plan that will cost the state less, or maybe net it something, is established. jbdigriz

Anybody have a CLUE as to its value as scrap?

Anybody have a CLUE as to its value as scrap?

I'm sure you could get the machine released into your hands for some minor kickback

On Wed, 14 Nov 2001, James B. DiGriz wrote: James, I assure you William was trying to be helpful and had your interests at heart. He's from the North, and he's apparently not familiar with your good-ole-boy Southern ways ;) you can get someone in the DOAS (was that the acronym for the agency responsible for disposing of the system?) in your pocket, I'm sure you could get the machine released into your hands for some minor kickback. But be careful what you wish for. Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org

some minor kickback This could probably land you in jail. Even suggesting it may be construed as conspiracy to commit the act.

I spent a good number of years in the Aerospace surplus business in California, 'difficult' situation, and I know of five people who have done jail time for various scams and transgressions.

Re: Jail time for surplus: I spent a good number of years in the Aerospace surplus business in California, and I have personally been involved in more than one 'difficult' situation, and I know of five people who have done jail time for various scams and transgressions. Fortunately, it was the policy of the company I worked for to never get involved in that stuff, because it's like asking the Mafia for a loan... it never ends after that. The manager of a large California firm is probably still in jail... it was well known that it you wanted a particular bid, you just 'negotiated' with him, and damn! You Won it! He got tripped up by making triple payments on his house, buying a big boat and a new truck and trailer for it... a clerk in his credit union wondered out loud just how he was able to afford all this on his regular income.... he 'fessed up when they came to audit him, and was taken away in cuffs. I was working for a small place many years ago that had recieved, by Government contractor error, a 'classified' piece of radio gear stuck in a truckload of other RF junk we bought. The Feds came storming in one afternoon with the swat team (I am *not* making this up!!) and I spent about twenty minutes eating the dirty carpet with the muzzle of a rifle hovering behind my ear...same as the rest of the staff of the place... while they had the owner take them (at gunpoint) out in the 'yard', to the item in "question", which was then covered and taken away. After that, we were allowed up, but had to stay there in the office while the Feds went over and over and over the paperwork, and alternately grilling each of us about the 'item'. Then, they just left, without even a word. It was then 8:00 at night, and a crowd had gathered outside the place. Fun story now, but then, well... Such things go on all the time. Cheers John

Sometimes, even, it's more honorable to actually be a blatant outlaw or an honest thief.

Jeffrey S. Sharp wrote: Nobody is proposing anything else. If you want to say that maybe putting in a bid to remove the CDC properly with qualified personnel, as opposed to a slash-and-burn job, at an s&b price, and then bidding on the property out of the proceeds, is somehow criminal, kindly tell it to the goddamned GA. legislature, who passed the fucked-up bullshit law that makes it necessary. Let's leave Bubba out of this. He's a figment of somebody's imagination. A bogeyman conjured up by the scared-straight hellfire-and-damnation crowd who profess to believe that people won't be civilized unless they're beat or frightened into it. The ones who trot out the reformed ex-cons to terrorize the sunday schoolers with. In actual practice, real people who try to be Bubbas get seriously dead real quick. How bout we terminate this line of discussion? It's a nice day out, it's Friday, and I've been behind this keyboard too long. Ya'll have a nice weekend, jbdigriz

Richard Erlacher wrote: Is that the "Last Tango In Paris" you're talking about?

On Fri, 16 Nov 2001, James B. DiGriz wrote:

> Sometimes, even, it's more honorable to actually be a blatant outlaw > or an honest thief.

No judge is going to bother even looking at a case like that. Why? Because no one but busy bodies and dim-witted spoil sports would be mean enough to consider it in legal terms. The only people who would even pay attention to it would be ex grade school hall monitors and meter maids -in other words, people who have such meaningless and worthless lives that the only personal joy they get from living is to try to make other people feel as pathetic as they do.

Did I say I thought he wasn't or hadn't? What's this supposed to mean, anyway?

Now you appear to think you're patronizing me. I think this discussion is exhausted.

As regards any rescue efforts, I want to implore everyone not to besiege hapless admins in the Ga. University System with requests for information, machines, etc. USG cannot sell or transfer state property itself. We should be grateful for any support they can lend a rescue effort, but all this has to go through the state Dept. of Adminstrative Services, so let's don't put our friends behind the eight-ball, ok? I want to thank those parties who have offered a home, but my best guess and my gut instinct is that it's going to take the governor's approval and maybe an act of the legislature to take the 960 out of the state. If you're playing at that level, you're way ahead of me here.

You must offer them cash for it, because if they don't sell it, it is at a cost to the state and the university.

Eric Dittman wrote: But it has residual scrap value. Hard money that goes back into the states general fund. And believe this, they are not a charity.

but I know that the businesses I've worked for consider fully depreciated items as $0 value and therefore disposable.

and therefore disposable.

and therefore disposable.

Eric Dittman wrote: You must offer them cash for it, because if they don't sell it, it is at a cost to the state and the university.

There are a couple of steps I'd recommend: 1) Calling the University Board of Regents and try to arrange a time to discuss the issue with them, explaining the desire to preserve a bit of history. If they can't set aside some time, ask to send a letter. I would recommend trying to bring the president of the University on board, too. 2) Call your state representative's office to see if they would be willing to discuss the issue. Try the governor's office, too. What you want to stress is this is a part of computing history, and there are people willing to preserve the system at no cost to the state and University. - Eric Dittman dittman(a)dittman.net Check out the DEC Enthusiasts Club at http://www.dittman.net/

Eric Dittman wrote: >>As regards any rescue efforts, I want to implore everyone not to besiege >>hapless admins in the Ga. University System with requests for >>information, machines, etc. USG cannot sell or transfer state property >>itself. We should be grateful for any support they can lend a rescue >>effort, but all this has to go through the state Dept. of Adminstrative >>Services, so let's don't put our friends behind the eight-ball, ok?

Yes, those are excellent suggestions and wlll no doubt come into play at some point, in some fashion, but the best way I see to approach this is as a standard service procurement contract, through DOAS. At this point, actually getting the property is secondary to seeing that it remains worth getting. USG has nothing say about that once the DOAS contractor shows up to remove it. That's what I'm focusing on right now. Bidding on it at auction will be the easy part.