27 Feb
2003
27 Feb
'03
5:42 a.m.
From: Ethan Dicks <erd_6502(a)yahoo.com>
Reply-To: cctalk(a)classiccmp.org
To: cctalk(a)classiccmp.org
Subject: Re: resurrecting a PDP-11/10
Date: Thu, 27 Feb 2003 10:20:54 -0800 (PST)
--- Fred Flintstone <iamvirtual(a)hotmail.com> wrote:
Thanks for the assistance to date!
Actually, I have a second M7800 card installed on the PDP-11/10 machine.
That's handy (and it ends the speculation if you have two SLUs or not ;-) As far as memory, there are two 16kw core systems
installed on this
machine.
Nice. That should serve nicely. Wish my 11/05 was that well equipped
(but it's in the short box). I am needing
to know what I am looking for to get RT-11 running. What
did DEC call their install tapes? eg. Is the
"RT-11 V03B BIN MT9 1/2" tape the boot/install tape?
It certainly seems like the distribution tape, but it's not clear to
me that you have a bootable tape there. If your TS03 is working
and you enter in the TS bootstrap and you get text, then it is
bootable. Dunno where you'd find install instructions for v3, though.
It's *possible* that there is a second tape that you boot first, one
with either an MS or MT boot block on it. It's also possible that there
is a boot papertape. Again, that's before my time (I got started with
RT-11 v4 on floppy). Is RT-11 the
easiest O/S to get installed?
Yes!
I want to get to a point where I
can verify the hardware is all running.
RT-11 or XXDP (DEC's low-level diagnostic monitor) are the way to go
for that. With 28KW of core (not all of the upper card can be used
due to the I/O page, you don't have a lot of OS options. 2BSD is
out, as are recent versions of RSTS and RSX-11. Don't remember what
the requirements for older OSes are off the top of my head.
As far as media devices, I have 3 x RK05, 1 x
TS03, 2 x RX01, 1 x TU58.
Nice assortment. Have you checked any of your diskettes or disk packs
for labels that suggest they might be bootable? I am trying to
decide what will be moved to the PDP-11/10 from the
11/20.
The goal is to have the PDP-11/20 up and running.
Getting the PDP-11/10
is just a step along the way.
Are you trying to get something historically accurate or just something
runnning well enough to be interesting? How much core do you have in
your 11/20? That might help drive the answer. If you want to run RT-11,
you'll need a storage device on the 11/20. It could be the RX01. If
you want to toggle in a long bootstrap, it could be the TU-58 (but floppies
are easier to find than TU-58 cartridges, and can be reformatted for the
RX01 with an 8" drive and modern to semi-modern computers).
-ethan 
27 Feb
27 Feb
6:34 a.m.
--- Fred Flintstone <iamvirtual(a)hotmail.com> wrote:
Yes, I guess I should call it a 11/05. despite what is
clearly printed on
the console.
They are the same thing except for the label. The 11/04 and 11/35 came
in two flavors also - BA-11 with the boards vertical, or in the shorter
box with the boards horizontal.
If I get the RK05J disk cleaned and ready to go, and
toggle in the
bootstrap and the disk loads, do I need to manually start the O/S at
some location?
If you toggle in the bootstrap and the disk loads, you are *running*
the OS (if the pack was bootable).
The purpose of the bootstrap is to provide just enough code to reset the
controller (sometimes) and load block #0 into memory location 0 and
jump to the right place in it to make _that_ code do something useful.
I believe the M873YA Bootstram ROM is capable of
booting the RK05,
but I don't know what would need to be done next (I believe 773010
will boot the RK05)
If you have a bootable pack spun up in drive 0 with all the right lights
on and you jump to the boot code address (773010, in your example), the
lights will flicker, the code in ROM will load block zero into low core and
jump to it. If the filestructure is intact and hardware is all working,
you should get a "." prompt (for RT-11). Start by typing "DIR" and
see
what's out there.
I want the PDP-11/20 to eventually be historically
correct but with a
full load of options :-)
That's a lotta cabinets! There were plenty of options that would be
appropriate for it. You might have to end up picking a configuration
out of old docs, or picking a year and declaring, "this is how a
commercial user might have had theirs equipped in 1973" or something
similar.
One of these days, I'll have enough time to restore my 11/20. I'm
still up to my armpits in 12-bit projects (like fixing an -8/e so
I can try out my "new" RK8E)
The ultimate goal is to run adventure and Star Trek on
it using the LA36
terminal. ie. the quintessential time-wasting use of a mini-computer
;-)
Perfect. A laudable goal.
Given that, you may want to look into an old version of RSTS once you
are happy with the hardware. It's very BASIC-centric and there are
plenty of BASIC games from the old days... source is available on the
'net (google for "classic basic games"). I spent many hours dialled into
a RSTS machine over an LA-36 w/integral acoustic coupler when I was 10.
Star Trek and Adventure (and other games) are available for RT-11, too,
with much less system management effort.
You can also practice your RT-11 and RSTS skills with Bob Supnik's
SIMH - http://simh.trailing-edge.com/ All the BASIC fun with fewer
cuts and pinches from old cabinets. You'll at least be able to
familiarize yourself with the software while not worrying if the hardware
is behaving.
I still recommend the real thing... it's an auditory and olfactory
experience as well. There are few options for blinkenlights and
emulators. :-(
Of course the blinkenlights and tape operating has to
be
part of it too!
Naturally. Why have blinkenlights if they aren't blinken.
It is interesting that my 10 year-old son asks to play
Star Trek on my
MicroPDP-11 rather than the full-motion flight simulator on the PC.
Smart kid.
-ethan
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