13 Jun
2006
13 Jun
'06
1:54 a.m.
I might have the opporitunity to get a DEC 3000-300X machine for VMS (175 MHz 21064)
I know that 21(1,2,3)64 machines offer substantially improved performance, but for the
moment they are out of reach.
The question- I'm running VMS currently on a VX42 (233MHz 21066A, 512k cache, 88MB
RAM) Multia, and it is quite slow
(user response time with AXP-VMS v7.3-1)
SPEC-92 indicates that the DEC 3300X will be slower (84/100 for the 300X, 97/112 for (a
generic) 21066A/233)
Likely, however, the 300X would have better I/O subsystems. Would it be worth messing
with, or should I not bother (as far as
useablility, not number-crunching prowess)?
13 Jun
13 Jun
2:13 a.m.
At 12:54 AM -0500 6/13/06, Scott Quinn wrote:
I might have the opporitunity to get a DEC 3000-300X
machine for
VMS (175 MHz 21064)
I know that 21(1,2,3)64 machines offer substantially improved
performance, but for the moment they are out of reach.
The question- I'm running VMS currently on a VX42 (233MHz 21066A,
512k cache, 88MB RAM) Multia, and it is quite slow
(user response time with AXP-VMS v7.3-1)
SPEC-92 indicates that the DEC 3300X will be slower (84/100 for the
300X, 97/112 for (a generic) 21066A/233)
Likely, however, the 300X would have better I/O subsystems. Would it
be worth messing with, or should I not bother (as far as
useablility, not number-crunching prowess)?
I'd recommend getting it as long as its cheap enough. It is a
supported system (unless they've dropped support), unlike the Multia.
Besides with two systems you can play with stuff like clustering :^)
Get more RAM for the Multia, it's starving! I found with V7.2 the
realistic bare minimum for an Alpha is 96MB, and the realistic
minimum is actually 128MB for a lightly used system (the V7.2 SPD
says 64MB is the minimum for an Alpha).
IIRC, that would be another advantage to the 300X, it should be able
to take more RAM than the Multia. HOWEVER, you'd best look into what
kind of RAM it takes and how much it has. Depending on the model, it
might be cheaper to get a better system than to upgrade the RAM.
This is why my AlphaStation 500/333 sits unused with only has 96MB
RAM, and you don't even want to know what I paid for it :^(
Oh, and my guess is, the 300X really is faster.
Zane
--
| Zane H. Healy | UNIX Systems Administrator |
| healyzh at aracnet.com (primary) | OpenVMS Enthusiast |
| MONK::HEALYZH (DECnet) | Classic Computer Collector |
+----------------------------------+----------------------------+
| Empire of the Petal Throne and Traveller Role Playing, |
| PDP-10 Emulation and Zane's Computer Museum. |
| http://www.aracnet.com/~healyzh/ |
8:05 a.m.
Zane H. Healy wrote:
IIRC, that would be another advantage to the 300X, it
should be able to
take more RAM than the Multia. HOWEVER, you'd best look into what kind
of RAM it takes and how much it has. Depending on the model, it might
be cheaper to get a better system than to upgrade the RAM. This is why
my AlphaStation 500/333 sits unused with only has 96MB RAM, and you
don't even want to know what I paid for it :^(
I'm trying to remember which DEC3000-300 I have. I'm pretty sure
it's a 300X, but I'm away and my wife gets irked if I call her to look
at model numbers. :)
Anyway, it takes regular 36-bit parity, 72-pin SIMMs. The memory in
mine came out of an Indigo^2.
Oh, and my guess is, the 300X really is faster.
I have a Multia as well, and the DEC3k is considerably faster, at
least at a serial console. My guess is that the reported response times
were obtained on a graphics console with one of the "entry-level" 8-bit
video boards in the DEC3000. Not to put too fine a point on it, the
low-end turbochannel video boards suck.
For what it's worth, there's quite a bit of practical info on the 300
series if you do a search for "Linux DEC turbochannel" I dunno if the
Linux port is still active, but they had good system information.
Doc
11:27 a.m.
At 8:05 AM -0400 6/13/06, Doc Shipley wrote:
Zane H. Healy wrote:
I believe only one or two models of the 3000 take 72-pin SIMMs. My
3000-300LX does, and it's also one of the slowest Alpha's out there.
I have coworker who has a 3000 and her system uses decidedly
non-standard RAM.
Zane
--
| Zane H. Healy | UNIX Systems Administrator |
| healyzh at aracnet.com (primary) | OpenVMS Enthusiast |
| MONK::HEALYZH (DECnet) | Classic Computer Collector |
+----------------------------------+----------------------------+
| Empire of the Petal Throne and Traveller Role Playing, |
| PDP-10 Emulation and Zane's Computer Museum. |
| http://www.aracnet.com/~healyzh/ |
IIRC, that would be another advantage to the 300X,
it should be
able to take more RAM than the Multia. HOWEVER, you'd best look
into what kind of RAM it takes and how much it has. Depending on
the model, it might be cheaper to get a better system than to
upgrade the RAM. This is why my AlphaStation 500/333 sits unused
with only has 96MB RAM, and you don't even want to know what I paid
for it :^(
I'm trying to remember which DEC3000-300 I have. I'm pretty sure
it's a 300X, but I'm away and my wife gets irked if I call her to
look at model numbers. :)
Anyway, it takes regular 36-bit parity, 72-pin SIMMs. The memory
in mine came out of an Indigo^2. 
2:41 p.m.
On 13/6/06 16:27, "Zane H. Healy" <healyzh at aracnet.com> wrote:
I believe only one or two models of the 3000 take 72-pin SIMMs. My
3000-300LX does, and it's also one of the slowest Alpha's out there.
I have coworker who has a 3000 and her system uses decidedly
non-standard RAM.
The 3000-300 models are the only ones that do, the other bigger boxen use
RAM carriers that take bigger DIMMs; I don't have any to hand at the moment
to give specs etc, but I've just won 256mb for my 3000-400 on ebay for ukp4
so I'm quite happy :o)
--
Adrian/Witchy
Binary Dinosaurs creator/curator
Www.binarydinosaurs.co.uk - the UK's biggest private home computer
collection?
2:59 p.m.
On Tue, 13 Jun 2006 08:27:15 -0700
"Zane H. Healy" <healyzh at aracnet.com> wrote:
I believe only one or two models of the 3000 take
72-pin SIMMs. My
3000-300LX does, and it's also one of the slowest Alpha's out there.
I have coworker who has a 3000 and her system uses decidedly
non-standard RAM.
The small desktop 3000-300 machines use PS/2 RAM. The large
desktop and
tower machines like 3000-500 / -600 use proprietary SIMMs.
I suspect the 3000-300 will be still faster then a Multia, as the Multia
has a 21066 and that CPU chip has crippled memory interface. The
3000-300 is no speed deamon either, but at least not that cripled as a
Multia. Also: The -300 has no heat problems like the Multia.
--
tsch??,
Jochen
Homepage: http://www.unixag-kl.fh-kl.de/~jkunz/
14 Jun
14 Jun
6:58 a.m.
Zane H. Healy wrote:
At 8:05 AM -0400 6/13/06, Doc Shipley wrote:
I sort of remember that all the 3000-300 models take "regular" parity
72-pin. I have a 3000-600 that most certainly doesn't.
Do you find the 300LX to be slower than a Multia (running the
standard 2.5" drive)?
Doc
Zane H. Healy wrote:
I believe only one or two models of the 3000 take 72-pin SIMMs. My
3000-300LX does, and it's also one of the slowest Alpha's out there. I
have coworker who has a 3000 and her system uses decidedly non-standard
RAM. IIRC, that would be another advantage to the
300X, it should be able
to take more RAM than the Multia. HOWEVER, you'd best look into what
kind of RAM it takes and how much it has. Depending on the model, it
might be cheaper to get a better system than to upgrade the RAM. This
is why my AlphaStation 500/333 sits unused with only has 96MB RAM,
and you don't even want to know what I paid for it :^(
I'm trying to remember which DEC3000-300 I have. I'm pretty sure
it's a 300X, but I'm away and my wife gets irked if I call her to look
at model numbers. :)
Anyway, it takes regular 36-bit parity, 72-pin SIMMs. The memory in
mine came out of an Indigo^2. 
13 Jun
13 Jun
2:42 a.m.
I have a 3000 600S, 3000 400S, 3000 400, several 5000's and 3100's I'm
thinking of taking to VCF next month. I can re-configure this within reason
in advance, and most will ship UPS ground relatively well for around $25. I
still have to decide what else to take. Anyone need TU56 tapes or other
media?
Thanks, Paul
-----Original Message-----
From: cctalk-bounces at classiccmp.org [mailto:cctalk-bounces at classiccmp.org]
On Behalf Of Scott Quinn
Sent: Tuesday, June 13, 2006 12:54 AM
To: cctalk at classiccmp.org
Subject: VX42 Multia versus 3000-300X
I might have the opporitunity to get a DEC 3000-300X machine for VMS (175
MHz 21064)
I know that 21(1,2,3)64 machines offer substantially improved performance,
but for the moment they are out of reach.
The question- I'm running VMS currently on a VX42 (233MHz 21066A, 512k
cache, 88MB RAM) Multia, and it is quite slow
(user response time with AXP-VMS v7.3-1)
SPEC-92 indicates that the DEC 3300X will be slower (84/100 for the 300X,
97/112 for (a generic) 21066A/233)
Likely, however, the 300X would have better I/O subsystems. Would it be
worth messing with, or should I not bother (as far as
useablility, not number-crunching prowess)?
3:21 a.m.
New subject: LA120 IPB or BOM
Does anyone have part number info on LA120's they can send me or help for a
few minutes on my dime?
Thanks, Paul Anderson
14 Jun
14 Jun
2:29 a.m.
I replied to this last night, but I don't think it went through. I have a
3000-400, 3000-400S, 3000-600S, various DECstation 5000's and 3100's I am
considering taking to VCF. With advance notice, I can possible re-configure
these to meet individual specs. For those who can't be there, most can be
shipped stateside safely UPS ground for around $25.
I'm still looking for ideas of what to bring. Docs, hardware (PDP8,11),
media (TU56, TK50, RL02, etc and a lot of non DEC tapes. Any ideas?
Thanks, Paul Anderson
-----Original Message-----
From: cctalk-bounces at classiccmp.org [mailto:cctalk-bounces at classiccmp.org]
On Behalf Of Scott Quinn
Sent: Tuesday, June 13, 2006 12:54 AM
To: cctalk at classiccmp.org
Subject: VX42 Multia versus 3000-300X
I might have the opporitunity to get a DEC 3000-300X machine for VMS (175
MHz 21064)
I know that 21(1,2,3)64 machines offer substantially improved performance,
but for the moment they are out of reach.
The question- I'm running VMS currently on a VX42 (233MHz 21066A, 512k
cache, 88MB RAM) Multia, and it is quite slow
(user response time with AXP-VMS v7.3-1)
SPEC-92 indicates that the DEC 3300X will be slower (84/100 for the 300X,
97/112 for (a generic) 21066A/233)
Likely, however, the 300X would have better I/O subsystems. Would it be
worth messing with, or should I not bother (as far as
useablility, not number-crunching prowess)?
6608
days inactive
6609
days old
9 comments
6 participants
participants (6)
-
compoobah＠valleyimplants.com -
doc＠mdrconsult.com -
healyzh＠aracnet.com -
jkunz＠unixag-kl.fh-kl.de -
useddec＠gmail.com -
witchy＠binarydinosaurs.co.uk