1 Jan
2013
1 Jan
'13
1:23 p.m.
On 2013-01-01 19:00, Dave McGuire<mcguire at neurotica.com> wrote:
On 12/31/2012 04:39 PM, Rob Jarratt wrote:
Since my name was mentioned...
There are plenty of differences. Virtual terminals for one. Which also
means that only M+ have batch queues. Named directories. Logical names.
Variable send/receive. Secondary pool. Split I/D space support.
Supervisor mode libraries. Accounting. Online reconfiguration. Mixed
massbuses (probably not that big win today, when people run simulators
anyway). Memory is managed slightly differently. I think that only M+
have disk shadowing and disk caching (also perhaps less used in emulated
systems).
Lots of tasks end up having more memory available in M+, which means
they can handle more data, or have more capabilities. This also affects
things like SYSGEN, which in M+ is rather more user friendly.
There are probably more things, if I think some more. But this gives a
fair idea. M+ is basically more.
> >> Straight 11M (non-plus) does.
(fits in 10 actually) Early RSTS/E, like
>v8,
> >>should, but not 10 and likely not 9. RT11 does.
>
>BitSavers looks like it has 11M 4.0 in a 19MB virtual tape, here:
>http://bitsavers.informatik.uni-stuttgart.de/bits/DEC/pdp11/magtapes/rsx11m/
>Assuming that is the right one to go for?
>
>I know next to nothing about RSX, what is the difference between plus and
>non-plus?
Oh jeeze, lots of stuff...I'm quite drunk at the moment, but
I seem to
recall..named directories being a biggie. Johnny (if he's montoring)
can expound. I ran 11M (non-plus) on an 11/34 for many years.
Rock solid, fast,
very nice OS.
Agree. 11M is fine. It's just that if you can run M+, I'd recommend it.
But it do require much more of the hardware.
It takes way more memory, and it requires certain features in the CPU,
that 11M do not.
11M can be run on basically any PDP-11, as long as you have atleast
about 56K of memory (Better with more, of course.)
Johnny
8 Jan
8 Jan
4:50 p.m.
Split I/D space support.
Hello, I wonder if RSX-11M+ can be used on processor without Split I/D space support? Is
there any feature that will became unavailable in this mode?
But it do require much more of the hardware.
It takes way more memory, and it requires certain features in the CPU,
that 11M do not.
11M can be run on basically any PDP-11, as long as you have atleast
about 56K of memory (Better with more, of course.)
What is the practical minimum for the machine to be able to use RSX-11M and RSX-11M+?
thank you,
Andrey
9 Jan
9 Jan
7:42 a.m.
On Jan 8, 2013, at 16:50, Andriy Romanenko <bigral at hotmail.com> wrote:
It'll run on an 11/23 with enough RAM, so yes. I don't know
particular features you lose other than the program size
advantage of split I/D, but others probably do.
CPU-wise, I don't know, but you need a minimum of 512KB
(256KW) of RAM. Like I mentioned, it runs on an 11/23,
which has the EIS and 22-bit addressing. Obviously,
you also need an MMU.
- Dave
Split I/D space support.
Hello, I wonder if RSX-11M+ can be used on processor without Split I/D space support? Is
there any feature that will became unavailable in this mode? But it do
require much more of the hardware.
It takes way more memory, and it requires certain features in the CPU,
that 11M do not.
11M can be run on basically any PDP-11, as long as you have atleast
about 56K of memory (Better with more, of course.)
What is the practical minimum for the machine to be able to use RSX-11M and RSX-11M+?
1:47 p.m.
New subject: Difference between RSX-11M and M+
On 01/09/2013 07:42 AM, David Riley wrote:
CPU-wise, I don't know, but you need a minimum of 512KB
(256KW) of RAM. Like I mentioned, it runs on an 11/23,
which has the EIS and 22-bit addressing.
Nope...256KB or 128KW would be the max for a PDP-11 with 18-bit
addressing. RSX-11M can run with a good bit less than that.
But it do require much more of the hardware.
It takes way more memory, and it requires certain features in the CPU,
that 11M do not.
11M can be run on basically any PDP-11, as long as you have atleast
about 56K of memory (Better with more, of course.)
What is the practical minimum for the machine to be able to use RSX-11M and RSX-11M+?
Obviously, you also need an MMU.
Also not true. You can generate an unmapped system, which will run
without an MMU. (sorry!)
-Dave
--
Dave McGuire, AK4HZ
New Kensington, PA
2:06 p.m.
New subject: Difference between RSX-11M and M+
On Jan 9, 2013, at 1:47 PM, Dave McGuire wrote:
On 01/09/2013 07:42 AM, David Riley wrote:
CPU-wise, I don't know, but you need a minimum of 512KB
(256KW) of RAM. Like I mentioned, it runs on an 11/23,
which has the EIS and 22-bit addressing.
Nope...256KB or 128KW would be the max for a PDP-11 with 18-bit
addressing. RSX-11M can run with a good bit less than that.
For both: I was talking about 11M+! I ran 11M on a 256KB system
for quite a while until I acquired my 4MB memory board, so I'm
aware. :-)
- Dave
But it do require much more of the hardware.
It takes way more memory, and it requires certain features in the CPU,
that 11M do not.
11M can be run on basically any PDP-11, as long as you have atleast
about 56K of memory (Better with more, of course.)
What is the practical minimum for the machine to be able to use RSX-11M and RSX-11M+?
Obviously, you also need an MMU.
Also not true. You can generate an unmapped system, which will run
without an MMU. (sorry!)
3:28 p.m.
New subject: Difference between RSX-11M and M+
On 01/09/2013 02:06 PM, David Riley wrote:
Nope...256KB or 128KW would be the max for a PDP-11 with 18-bit
addressing. RSX-11M can run with a good bit less than that.
For both: I was talking about 11M+! I ran 11M on a 256KB system
for quite a while until I acquired my 4MB memory board, so I'm
aware. :-)
Duh, of course. :) My mistake.
-Dave
--
Dave McGuire, AK4HZ
New Kensington, PA
> But it do
require much more of the hardware.
> It takes way more memory, and it requires certain features in the CPU,
> that 11M do not.
> 11M can be run on basically any PDP-11, as long as you have atleast
> about 56K of memory (Better with more, of course.)
What is the practical minimum for the machine to be able to use RSX-11M and RSX-11M+?
CPU-wise, I don't know, but you need a minimum of 512KB
(256KW) of RAM. Like I mentioned, it runs on an 11/23,
which has the EIS and 22-bit addressing. Obviously, you also need an MMU.
Also not true. You can generate an unmapped system, which will run
without an MMU. (sorry!)
4:57 p.m.
New subject: Difference between RSX-11M and M+
On Jan 9, 2013, at 3:28 PM, Dave McGuire wrote:
On 01/09/2013 02:06 PM, David Riley wrote:
For both: I was talking about 11M+! I ran 11M on a 256KB system
for quite a while until I acquired my 4MB memory board, so I'm
aware. :-)
Duh, of course. :) My mistake.
Not really. I misread the question and assumed the OP was asking
only about 11M+, so I failed to specify. Oops!
- Dave
> What is the practical minimum for the machine to
be able to use RSX-11M and RSX-11M+?
CPU-wise, I don't know, but you need a minimum of 512KB
(256KW) of RAM. Like I mentioned, it runs on an 11/23,
which has the EIS and 22-bit addressing.
Nope...256KB or 128KW would be the max for a PDP-11 with 18-bit
addressing. RSX-11M can run with a good bit less than that.
Obviously, you also need an MMU.
Also not true. You can generate an unmapped system, which will run
without an MMU. (sorry!)
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