28 Jul
2012
28 Jul
'12
6:51 a.m.
Does anyone know (of) anyone running/restoring an IBM 7090, early 60s vintage?
I am about to clear out a friend's collection of vintage computer bits and I may find
relevant modules and documentation, h/w and s/w.
peter
|| | | | | | | | |
Peter Van Peborgh
62 St Mary's Rise
Writhlington Radstock
Somerset BA3 3PD
UK
01761 439 234
|| | | | | | | | |
29 Jul
29 Jul
3:14 p.m.
Peter,
If you don't find a home for them, please contact The National Museum of Computing at
Bletchley. I'm sure we'd be very interested.
Peter Van Peborgh <peter at vanpeborgh.eu> wrote:
Does anyone know (of) anyone running/restoring an IBM
7090, early 60s
vintage?
I am about to clear out a friend's collection of vintage computer bits
and I may find relevant modules and documentation, h/w and s/w.
peter
|| | | | | | | | |
Peter Van Peborgh
62 St Mary's Rise
Writhlington Radstock
Somerset BA3 3PD
UK
01761 439 234
|| | | | | | | | |
-- Colin
30 Jul
30 Jul
9:43 a.m.
On 28 Jul 2012 at 14:51, Peter Van Peborgh wrote:
Does anyone know (of) anyone running/restoring an IBM
7090, early 60s
vintage? I am about to clear out a friend's collection of vintage
computer bits and I may find relevant modules and documentation, h/w
and s/w.
I think a real find would be a can of 7090 core oil.
--Chuck
12:43 p.m.
On Mon, 30 Jul 2012, William Donzelli wrote:
On a related note, a friend of mine found in his
collection a full
sealed can of whale oil, from ADM, no less. We are not sure what to do
with it.
Look for a squeaky whale?
Mike Loewen mloewen at cpumagic.scol.pa.us
Old Technology http://sturgeon.css.psu.edu/~mloewen/Oldtech/
12:57 p.m.
New subject: Core oil; Re: IBM 7090 mainframe!
On Mon, 30 Jul 2012, Mike Loewen wrote:
On Mon, 30 Jul 2012, William Donzelli wrote:
I must be a bit late coming to this... what's core oil? What would ADMs
want with 'whale oil'?
I can't work out if this is a joke, or not. There's just enough esoterica
in vintage computers that I'm not positive.
Much obliged;
- JP
On a related note, a friend of mine found in his
collection a full
sealed can of whale oil, from ADM, no less. We are not sure what to do
with it.
Look for a squeaky whale?
1:15 p.m.
New subject: Core oil; Re: IBM 7090 mainframe!
On 30 Jul 2012 at 14:57, JP Hindin wrote:
I must be a bit late coming to this... what's core
oil?
No joke.
Early models of various 7000-series mainframes had their 7032 core
stacks immersed in oil (mineral oil?) to aid in dissipating heat.
The 7032A stack used forced air.
--Chuck
5 p.m.
New subject: Core oil; Re: IBM 7090 mainframe!
On 7/30/12 1:15 PM, "Chuck Guzis" <cclist at sydex.com> wrote:
On 30 Jul 2012 at 14:57, JP Hindin wrote:
By maintaining the cores at a particular temperature, access time was
consistent, improving reliability. -- Ian
I must be a bit late coming to this... what's
core oil?
No joke.
Early models of various 7000-series mainframes had their 7032 core
stacks immersed in oil (mineral oil?) to aid in dissipating heat.
The 7032A stack used forced air.
--Chuck
5:27 p.m.
New subject: Core oil; Re: IBM 7090 mainframe!
On 31 Jul 2012 at 0:00, Ian King wrote:
By maintaining the cores at a particular temperature,
access time was
consistent, improving reliability. -- Ian
I thought I'd said that--"dissipating heat" implies that local
heating from cores was dissipated into the oil bath. But maybe I
wasn't clear on that aspect--my apologies. I suspect that fluorinert
might be a better choice today.
I'm a bit surprised that no one picked up on the mention of the
broomstick.
--Chuck
6 p.m.
New subject: Core oil; Re: IBM 7090 mainframe!
On 30 Jul 2012, at 5:27 PM, Chuck Guzis wrote:
On 31 Jul 2012 at 0:00, Ian King wrote:
I suspect Ian is referring to the fact that the oil in the 709T/7090 was't just
cooled, it was also heated as necessary to maintain a near-constant temperature that was
selected to optimize the performance of the magnetic material in the core stack.
By maintaining the cores at a particular
temperature, access time was
consistent, improving reliability. -- Ian
I thought I'd said that--"dissipating heat" implies that local
heating from cores was dissipated into the oil bath. But maybe I
wasn't clear on that aspect--my apologies. I suspect that fluorinert
might be a better choice today. I'm a bit surprised that no one picked up on the
mention of the
broomstick.
Well, broomstick plus magnet, right? Gotta be able to pick up the blown-apart cores.
Those were the days, when computing carried the risk of delightfully catastrophic failures
:)
--
Dr. Christian Kennedy
chris at mainecoon.com AF6AP | DB00000692 | PG00029419
http://www.mainecoon.com PGP KeyID 108DAB97
PGP fingerprint: 4E99 10B6 7253 B048 6685 6CBC 55E1 20A3 108D AB97
"Mr. McKittrick, after careful consideration..."
6:36 p.m.
New subject: Core oil; Re: IBM 7090 mainframe!
On 30 Jul 2012 at 18:00, Christian Kennedy wrote:
Well, broomstick plus magnet, right? Gotta be able to
pick up the
blown-apart cores. Those were the days, when computing carried the
risk of delightfully catastrophic failures :)
Yup, you got it. Couldn't believe the first time I saw the IBM CE
banging on the side of the 7090 core box then fishing around in the
oil for bits.... (that's when bits were *really* bits).
--Chuck
30 Jul
30 Jul
1:41 p.m.
New subject: Core oil; Re: IBM 7090 mainframe!
On Jul 30, 2012, at 3:57 PM, JP Hindin wrote:
On Mon, 30 Jul 2012, Mike Loewen wrote:
A quick Google search for "7090 core oil" turned up the following:
http://ed-thelen.org/comp-hist/vs-ibm-stretch.html
Knowing the TLAs I know, I assumed ADM stood for "Archer Daniels Midland",
an agricultural products company. It's not entirely out of the question
in my mind that they might have dealt in whale oil at one time, but I
have no idea if it is them or not. It's a very useful material, though it
comes at a great environmental cost. I hear it can give rosewood a very
nice sheen if applied liberally.
-Dave
On Mon, 30 Jul 2012, William Donzelli wrote:
I must be a bit late coming to this... what's core oil? What would ADMs
want with 'whale oil'?
I can't work out if this is a joke, or not. There's just enough esoterica
in vintage computers that I'm not positive. On a related note, a friend of mine found in his
collection a full
sealed can of whale oil, from ADM, no less. We are not sure what to do
with it.
Look for a squeaky whale? 
11:43 p.m.
New subject: Core oil; Re: IBM 7090 mainframe!
On Tue, Jul 31, 2012 at 7:52 AM, William Donzelli <wdonzelli at gmail.com> wrote:
Am I the only one who thinks of Lear Siegler (sp?) when I hear ADM?
Camiel.
Knowing the
TLAs I know, I assumed ADM stood for "Archer Daniels Midland",
an agricultural products company.
Yes, that ADM - the happy corn people. 
31 Jul
31 Jul
1:35 a.m.
New subject: Core oil; Re: IBM 7090 mainframe!
On Tue, 31 Jul 2012, Camiel Vanderhoeven wrote:
On Tue, Jul 31, 2012 at 7:52 AM, William Donzelli
<wdonzelli at gmail.com> wrote:
Am I the only one who thinks of Lear Siegler (sp?) when I hear ADM?
No, you're not alone, I was thinking the same. I have a hard time
following discussions where US-internal acronyms are used all along
without any further explanation.
Christian
Knowing
the TLAs I know, I assumed ADM stood for "Archer Daniels Midland",
an agricultural products company.
Yes, that ADM - the happy corn people. 
8:23 a.m.
New subject: Core oil; Re: IBM 7090 mainframe!
On 07/31/2012 04:35 AM, Christian Corti wrote:
Am I the only one who thinks of Lear Siegler (sp?) when I hear ADM?
No, you're not alone, I was thinking the same. I have a hard time
following discussions where US-internal acronyms are used all along
without any further explanation.
The USA is not a small country, and anymore, it seems like we
primarily consist of corporations. [ugh] It'd be incorrect to assume
that everyone here has heard of every little (or even big) company. I
myself don't think I could note a single agricultural company by name,
because I don't give a crap about agriculture.
When I read "ADM", I wondered what terminals had to do with whale oil.
-Dave
--
Dave McGuire, AK4HZ
New Kensington, PA
Knowing the
TLAs I know, I assumed ADM stood for "Archer Daniels
Midland",
an agricultural products company.
Yes, that ADM - the happy corn people. 
1:32 p.m.
New subject: Core oil; Re: IBM 7090 mainframe!
Dave McGuire wrote:
When I read "ADM", I wondered what
terminals had to do with whale oil.
Lear Siegler Incorporated (LSI)'s first big contract for terminals was
with Archer Daniels Midland, which company sold other oils such as
jojoba oil as replacements for whale oil. Originally the terminal was
custom-designed to their requirements, and could not be sold to other
customers. Eventually LSI renegotiated the contract, allowing the
terminal to be marketed to the public, but they kept the "ADM-1"
designation, and continued using the ADM prefix for later terminals such
as the better-known ADM-3 and ADM-3A.
Fred Cisin wrote:
Could you use well whale oil to lube the keyswitches
of an ADM-3A?
Historically well whale oil was used, but since whales are endangered,
it's probably better to use ill whale oil instead. Harvesting ill whales
poses less of a threat to the continued existence of the species.
5:21 p.m.
New subject: Core oil; Re: IBM 7090 mainframe!
Perhaps this is just a silly question but why whale oil? Was whaling super
common at the time and they had an excess of whale oil to sell? Standard
ground oil wasn't good enough?
5:41 p.m.
New subject: Core oil; Re: IBM 7090 mainframe!
Whale oil does not leave much residue of a harmful nature on metals.
Conventional petroleum products frequently are solvents for materials in
computers.
Whale oil does not turn rancid as other animal and vegetable oil products
frequently do.
when the systems were produced it was more available than it soon became.
I don't think synthetics were anywhere near ready in the timeframe to be
used either.
Jim
On Tue, Jul 31, 2012 at 5:21 PM, Sam O'nella <barythrin at gmail.com> wrote:
Perhaps this is just a silly question but why whale
oil? Was whaling super
common at the time and they had an excess of whale oil to sell? Standard
ground oil wasn't good enough?
7:30 p.m.
New subject: Core oil; Re: IBM 7090 mainframe!
On 31 Jul 2012 at 19:21, Sam O'nella wrote:
Perhaps this is just a silly question but why whale
oil? Was whaling
super common at the time and they had an excess of whale oil to sell?
Standard ground oil wasn't good enough?
I remember that the local market back in the 60s sold whale meat at
one time. I recall that my brother, who worked at the market,
brought some home. It was terrible tasting.
Population pressures make everything scarce.
--Chuck
1 Aug
1 Aug
2:16 a.m.
New subject: Core oil; Re: IBM 7090 mainframe!
On 07/31/2012 04:32 PM, Eric Smith wrote:
That's a damn neat piece of tech history trivia! I have two of the
blasted things here (a 3A and a 5) and I never knew that. Thanks!
-Dave
--
Dave McGuire, AK4HZ
New Kensington, PA
When I read
"ADM", I wondered what terminals had to do with whale oil.
Lear Siegler Incorporated (LSI)'s first big contract for terminals was
with Archer Daniels Midland, which company sold other oils such as
jojoba oil as replacements for whale oil. Originally the terminal was
custom-designed to their requirements, and could not be sold to other
customers. Eventually LSI renegotiated the contract, allowing the
terminal to be marketed to the public, but they kept the "ADM-1"
designation, and continued using the ADM prefix for later terminals such
as the better-known ADM-3 and ADM-3A.
12:58 p.m.
New subject: Core oil; Re: IBM 7090 mainframe!
On Wed, Aug 1, 2012 at 6:37 PM, Eric Smith <eric at brouhaha.com> wrote:
Dave McGuire wrote:
Either a very believable fabrication, or I'm just very gullible. Well done!
That's a damn neat piece of tech history trivia!
It's also a complete fabrication to tie together well whale oil and ADM-x
terminals. 
1:26 p.m.
New subject: Core oil; Re: IBM 7090 mainframe!
That's a
damn neat piece of tech history trivia!
It's also a complete fabrication to tie together well whale oil and
ADM-x terminals.
2:34 p.m.
New subject: Core oil; Re: IBM 7090 mainframe!
I have no idea what ADM stands for off the top of my head but hunting
around for factoids
ftp://ftp.whtech.com/datasheets%2520and%2520manuals/Hardware/ADM3A.pdf is a
manual for one and commonly calls the system an Interactive Display
Terminal but does call the monitor part a "Display Monitor".
http://www.old-computers.com/history/detail.asp?n=32&t=3 admits they aren't
sure but gives a few educated guesses: "The ADM-3A was one of the first
affordable serial display terminals manufactered by Lear-Siegler, Inc of
Anaheim California. Why ADM? Nobody knows, maybe *American Dream Machine*or
*Awful Dumb Monitor* or *Advanced Display Module* or, more seriously, *Anaheim
Division, Manufacturing*..."
You'd think they'd spell it out somewhere in an early manual though.
8:45 p.m.
New subject: Core oil; Re: IBM 7090 mainframe!
On Wed, 1 Aug 2012, Cameron Kaiser wrote:
Hey, I swallowed the bait too. So, since you've
unmasked the well-designed
fabrication, what *does* the ADM in ADM-3A stand for?
(You also realize that the original explanation will confidently be picked
up as truth by the incautious.)
It is already probably what people will find if they GOOGLE it. Soon it
will be in Wikipedia, with references that referenc e each other. Soon,
all other accounts will be rejected, since, disunirregardless of truth, it
is the BEST account.
It just needs to get picked up for a TV documentary or two.
--
Grumpy Ol' Fred cisin at xenosoft.com
8:57 p.m.
New subject: Core oil; Re: IBM 7090 mainframe!
Fred Cisin wrote:
On Wed, 1 Aug 2012, Cameron Kaiser wrote:
Not naming names, but more than few years ago, top level US officials
refined to a science
the art of telling lies and getting them accepted as fact by sheer
repetition.
Jim.
Hey, I swallowed the bait too. So, since
you've unmasked the well-designed
fabrication, what *does* the ADM in ADM-3A stand for?
(You also realize that the original explanation will confidently be picked
up as truth by the incautious.)
It is already probably what people will find if
they GOOGLE it. Soon it
will be in Wikipedia, with references that referenc e each other. Soon,
all other accounts will be rejected, since, disunirregardless of truth, it
is the BEST account.
It just needs to get picked up for a TV documentary or two.
--
Grumpy Ol' Fred cisin at xenosoft.com
9:42 p.m.
New subject: Core oil; Re: IBM 7090 mainframe!
> It just needs to get picked up for a TV
documentary or two.
On Wed, 1 Aug 2012, jimpdavis wrote:
Not naming names, but more than few years ago, top
level US officials
refined to a science the art of telling lies and getting them accepted
as fact by sheer repetition.
That's been a tradition, as long as there have been politicians.
I was just thinking in terms of a Cringely "documentary"
--
Grumpy Ol' Fred cisin at xenosoft.com
31 Jul
31 Jul
5:31 p.m.
New subject: Core oil; Re: IBM 7090 mainframe!
On 7/31/12 12:53 PM, "Fred Cisin" <cisin at xenosoft.com> wrote:
On Tue, 31 Jul 2012, Dave McGuire wrote:
I guess it depends on how you respond to the smell of whale oil,
especially a few weeks/months out....
When I read "ADM", I wondered what
terminals had to do with whale oil.
Could you use well whale oil to lube the keyswitches of an ADM-3A? 
30 Jul
30 Jul
2:13 p.m.
New subject: Core oil; Re: IBM 7090 mainframe!
Whale oil is somewhat expensive and hard to find. I believe watchmakers used it.
Paul
On Mon, Jul 30, 2012 at 2:57 PM, JP Hindin <jplist2008 at kiwigeek.com> wrote:
On Mon, 30 Jul 2012, Mike Loewen wrote:
On Mon, 30 Jul 2012, William Donzelli wrote:
I must be a bit late coming to this... what's core oil? What would ADMs
want with 'whale oil'?
I can't work out if this is a joke, or not. There's just enough esoterica
in vintage computers that I'm not positive.
Much obliged;
- JP
On a related note, a friend of mine found in his
collection a full
sealed can of whale oil, from ADM, no less. We are not sure what to do
with it.
Look for a squeaky whale? 
4:19 p.m.
New subject: Core oil; Re: IBM 7090 mainframe!
It's since been superseded in performance by modern synthetic oils. Moebius is the big
maker among watchmakers.
--------
Paul Anderson -- VE3HOP
On 2012-07-30, at 5:13 PM, Paul Anderson <useddec at gmail.com> wrote:
Whale oil is somewhat expensive and hard to find. I
believe watchmakers used it.
Paul
On Mon, Jul 30, 2012 at 2:57 PM, JP Hindin <jplist2008 at kiwigeek.com> wrote:
>
>
> On Mon, 30 Jul 2012, Mike Loewen wrote:
>> On Mon, 30 Jul 2012, William Donzelli wrote:
>>
>>> On a related note, a friend of mine found in his collection a full
>>> sealed can of whale oil, from ADM, no less. We are not sure what to do
>>> with it.
>>
>> Look for a squeaky whale?
>
>
> I must be a bit late coming to this... what's core oil? What would ADMs
> want with 'whale oil'?
> I can't work out if this is a joke, or not. There's just enough esoterica
> in vintage computers that I'm not positive.
>
> Much obliged;
>
> - JP
>
>
10:50 p.m.
New subject: Core oil; Re: IBM 7090 mainframe!
Whale oil is somewhat expensive and hard to find. I
believe watchmakers used it.
Apparently $2000 expensive.
http://www.publicaffairs.noaa.gov/releases2004/jun04/noaa04-r150.html
--
Will
1:01 p.m.
-----Original Message-----
From: mloewen at cpumagic.scol.pa.us
Sent: Mon, 30 Jul 2012 15:43:11 -0400 (EDT)
To: cctalk at classiccmp.org
Subject: Re: IBM 7090 mainframe!
On Mon, 30 Jul 2012, William Donzelli wrote:
Actually, when I got my first field service job servicing word processors,
it was explained to me that the whale oil (in a *tiny* bottle with applicator
needle) was for lubricating the print hammer assemblies on Qume and Diablo daisy-wheel
printers. That was in 1981. I've never seen it before
or since. . . .
Jeff
____________________________________________________________
FREE 3D EARTH SCREENSAVER - Watch the Earth right on your desktop!
Check it out at http://www.inbox.com/earth
On a related note, a friend of mine found in his
collection a full
sealed can of whale oil, from ADM, no less. We are not sure what to do
with it.
Look for a squeaky whale?
12:53 p.m.
On 30 Jul 2012 at 15:00, William Donzelli wrote:
It seems to me that a can of IBM core oil was on Ebay
a few years
back.
A magnet on a broomstick and you're all set...
On a related note, a friend of mine found in his
collection a full
sealed can of whale oil, from ADM, no less. We are not sure what to do
with it.
If it's really old, then it might be for illumination (burned). But
ISTR that whale oil was also used for lubricating instruments, such
as clocks and watches. So it might be worth quite a bit, assuming
the stuff doesn't go rancid with age.
--Chuck
1:25 p.m.
On 7/30/12 2:53 PM, Chuck Guzis wrote:
On 30 Jul 2012 at 15:00, William Donzelli wrote:
Whale oil was popular with motorcyclists (pre-Greenpeace) as chain
oil because it gets thicker instead of thinner when it's heated.
Doc
It seems to me that a can of IBM core oil was on
Ebay a few years
back.
A magnet on a broomstick and you're all set...
On a related note, a friend of mine found in his
collection a full
sealed can of whale oil, from ADM, no less. We are not sure what to do
with it.
If it's really old, then it might be for illumination (burned). But
ISTR that whale oil was also used for lubricating instruments, such
as clocks and watches. So it might be worth quite a bit, assuming
the stuff doesn't go rancid with age. 
1:53 p.m.
On 7/30/2012 1:25 PM, Doc Shipley wrote:
On 7/30/12 2:53 PM, Chuck Guzis wrote:
Keeps the Rosewood chain guards looking nice as well.
g.
On 30 Jul 2012 at 15:00, William Donzelli wrote:
Whale oil was popular with motorcyclists (pre-Greenpeace) as chain oil
because it gets thicker instead of thinner when it's heated. It seems to me that a can of IBM core oil was on
Ebay a few years
back.
A magnet on a broomstick and you're all set...
On a related note, a friend of mine found in his
collection a full
sealed can of whale oil, from ADM, no less. We are not sure what to do
with it.
If it's really old, then it might be for illumination (burned). But
ISTR that whale oil was also used for lubricating instruments, such
as clocks and watches. So it might be worth quite a bit, assuming
the stuff doesn't go rancid with age. 
2:30 p.m.
On 7/30/2012 1:53 PM, Chuck Guzis wrote:
If it's really old, then it might be for
illumination (burned). But
ISTR that whale oil was also used for lubricating instruments, such
as clocks and watches. So it might be worth quite a bit, assuming
the stuff doesn't go rancid with age.
You mean, can you handle the bad 50+ year smell in your watch*?
--Chuck
Ben.
* Just quite make that whale joke and digital watches work from Hitchhikers
guide to the galaxy.
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barythrin＠gmail.com -
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cisin＠xenosoft.com -
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doc＠vaxen.net -
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mcguire＠neurotica.com -
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