Yes. cctalk and cctech are the same list, except that moderators filter out not-sufficiently-on-topic messages before the cctech view of the list sees them. There is no point subscribing to both, unless you are doing something bizarre with multiple mailboxes. Jay, I know you've been considering this for moderator-time reasons, but maybe it's time to kill one list, or at least decouple them, just to reduce user confusion? /~\ The ASCII der Mouse \ / Ribbon Campaign X Against HTML mouse at rodents.montreal.qc.ca / \ Email! 7D C8 61 52 5D E7 2D 39 4E F1 31 3E E8 B3 27 4B