8 Dec
2002
8 Dec
'02
10:43 a.m.
Just heard from a friend that he's interested in a VAX, and he's
based near here in north Bristol. Anybody know of a suitable
machine?
--
John Honniball
coredump(a)gifford.co.uk
8 Dec
8 Dec
1:57 p.m.
Just heard from a friend that he's interested in a
VAX, and he's
based near here in north Bristol. Anybody know of a suitable
machine?
Just about any VAX should be suitable for use in North Bristol. If you
get a 120V one you might have to run it on a stepdown transformer.
Most VAX systems are not suitable for operation in Leadville, Colorado,
USA, however. Though they probably would mostly work OK there.
Eric
3:20 p.m.
Most VAX systems are not suitable for operation in
Leadville, Colorado,
USA, however. Though they probably would mostly work OK there.
Okay, this went over my head.
--
Eric Dittman
dittman(a)dittman.net
Check out the DEC Enthusiasts Club at http://www.dittman.net/
3:45 p.m.
Eric Dittman wrote:
read link.
http://www.hyperdictionary.com/dictionary/VAX
Most VAX
systems are not suitable for operation in Leadville, Colorado,
USA, however. Though they probably would mostly work OK there.
Okay, this went over my head. 
3:58 p.m.
On Sun, 8 Dec 2002, ben franchuk wrote:
read link.
http://www.hyperdictionary.com/dictionary/VAX
So there is some relation between Leadville, Colorado and vacuum cleaners?
-brian.
Eric Dittman wrote:
Most VAX systems are not suitable for operation in
Leadville, Colorado,
USA, however. Though they probably would mostly work OK there.
Okay, this went over my head.
3:55 p.m.
On Sun, 8 Dec 2002, Eric Dittman wrote:
The only interpretations I could guess is that it's either some sort of
Tesla reference, or that maybe Leadville is out in the middle of nowhere
without adequate electricity.
-brian.
Most VAX
systems are not suitable for operation in Leadville, Colorado,
USA, however. Though they probably would mostly work OK there.
Okay, this went over my head.
9:39 p.m.
The only interpretations I could guess is that
it's either some sort of
Tesla reference, or that maybe Leadville is out in the middle of nowhere
without adequate electricity.
No, the electricity is fine there. However, it is not possible to
operate most VAX systems there within the rated specifications of all
of the subsystems.
If no one figures it out in a few days, I'll explain.
9:48 p.m.
Eric Smith wrote:
Altitude?
Cheers,
Dave.
The only
interpretations I could guess is that it's either some sort of
Tesla reference, or that maybe Leadville is out in the middle of nowhere
without adequate electricity.
No, the electricity is fine there. However, it is not possible to
operate most VAX systems there within the rated specifications of all
of the subsystems.
If no one figures it out in a few days, I'll explain.
9 Dec
9 Dec
9:26 a.m.
I wrote (about Leadville, Colorado):
it is not possible to operate most VAX systems there
within the rated
specifications of all of the subsystems.
Dave Woodman wrote:
Altitude?
Bingo!
Disk drives are almost always rated for operation to a maximum altitude
of 10K feet above sea level.
9:36 a.m.
Eric Smith wrote:
I wrote (about Leadville, Colorado):
Well, if people insist on living in the highest incorporated city in the
US...
it is not possible to operate most VAX systems
there within the rated
specifications of all of the subsystems.
Dave Woodman wrote:
Altitude?
Bingo!
Disk drives are almost always rated for operation to a maximum altitude
of 10K feet above sea level. 
10:28 a.m.
--- Eric Smith <eric(a)brouhaha.com> wrote:
I wrote (about Leadville, Colorado):
I've run into that problem in Antarctica - people want to put hard
disks on the side of Mt. Erebus (~13,000 ft) for seismic data collection,
and Amundsen-Scott South Pole station is nominally at 9,300 ft, but
because of the rotation of the earth, the troposphere is noticably
thinner at the poles than the equator - the atmospheric pressure
regularly fluctuates between 620-680 millibars. It rarely exceeds 700
(it in fact did during my visit, which blew up a poorly written spread-
sheet used to track weather statistics). The physio-altitude
(calculated from temp/pressure/humidity to gauge the effect on humans)
at Pole ranges from 9,500 to 14,000 ft.
On Erebus, they use pressurized drive canisters for external SCSI drives.
At Pole, they don't do anything special. Drives die all the time. To
add insult to injury, massively dry air holds a lot less heat than the
air you and I are breathing right now - computers and hard disks frequently
die from overheating at the South Pole - the air is thinner and drier
and can't conduct as much heat away from CPUs and drives.
ObVax: as late as 1997, VAXen were still in daily use at McMurdo and
Pole as primary DNS servers (mcmurdo.gov) and station monitor drivers
(via VT420s around Pole with weather and flight info updated
frequently). Not sure when they retired them. Probably only recently
if at all.
-ethan
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it is not possible to operate most VAX systems
there within the rated
specifications of all of the subsystems.
Dave Woodman wrote:
Altitude?
Bingo!
Disk drives are almost always rated for operation to a maximum altitude
of 10K feet above sea level.
11:14 a.m.
On Erebus, they use pressurized drive canisters for
external SCSI drives.
At Pole, they don't do anything special. Drives die all the time. To
add insult to injury, massively dry air holds a lot less heat than the
air you and I are breathing right now - computers and hard disks frequently
die from overheating at the South Pole - the air is thinner and drier
and can't conduct as much heat away from CPUs and drives.
The flame throwers to incinerate the Things can't help,
either. :-)
I always thought it would be fun to visit Antartica and maybe
work there for a year. Now that I'm married I don't think I'd
be able to go there.
--
Eric Dittman
dittman(a)dittman.net
Check out the DEC Enthusiasts Club at http://www.dittman.net/
5:53 p.m.
At 01:30 PM 12/9/02 -0800, you wrote:
On Erebus, they use pressurized drive canisters for
external SCSI drives.
At Pole, they don't do anything special. Drives die all the time. To
add insult to injury, massively dry air holds a lot less heat than the
air you and I are breathing right now - computers and hard disks frequently
die from overheating at the South Pole - the air is thinner and drier
and can't conduct as much heat away from CPUs and drives.
Quite frankly, to have a system die of heat exhaustion _there_ seems
ludicrous. As long as the assembly can withstand a steep temperature
gradient, there's lots of cooling available, with temperature low
enough to compensate for the decrease in specific heat many times,
right?
carlos.
--------------------------------------------------------------
Carlos E. Murillo-Sanchez carlos_murillo(a)nospammers.ieee.org
10 Dec
10 Dec
10:36 a.m.
New subject: altitude, humidity and cooling (was Re: VAX wanted in Bristol, UK)
--- Carlos Murillo <carlos_murillo(a)epm.net.co> wrote:
At 01:30 PM 12/9/02 -0800, I wrote:
Right, except that these systems are indoors in an office environment
and there isn't an adequate temperature gradient. Indoors, the temps
range from 68F to 75F, depending on the nature of the building and
its physical location (which affects winds and external cooling, thus
affecting humans who affect internal heating ;-)
The AC for the network operations center (NOC) at McMurdo is a glycol
loop, a glycol pump and two radiators, one in an airhandler, one outside
in a shelter. The outside temp fluctuates between a high of 40F for a
few days in the summer, to a typical -20F to -30F temp in the winter
and on spring/fall nights. On those occasions when the heat exchanger
fails (typically due to the fan breaker tripping), they do open windows
and cool with outside air. The room, though, is nominally kept between
60F and 65F. Not much of a gradient to the inside of a PC or server case.
(and this is somewhat on-topic because the room I'm describing was built
in the 1970s and houses (housed?) a pair of MicroVAXen and some older
Sun SPARC hardware).
Pole is worse than McMurdo - at least Mactown is on the coast and at
"sea level" (minus the effects the rotation of the Earth has on the
troposphere which is, ISTR, about 3-5% lower pressure there). I've
seen guys put multiple fans in computer cases used for data collection
to keep the operating temps down to a sane level, and these are old
enough machines that the CPUs don't come from the factory with fans on
them (486-SX/25, etc.)
You'd think things would be cool enough at the South Pole, but there's
some non-intuitive forces at work.
-ethan
http://penguincentral.com/penguincentral.html
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At Pole... drives die all the time... massively
dry air holds a lot
less heat... computers and hard disks frequently die from overheating
at the South Pole - the air is thinner and drier
and can't conduct as much heat away from CPUs and drives.
Quite frankly, to have a system die of heat exhaustion _there_ seems
ludicrous. As long as the assembly can withstand a steep temperature
gradient, there's lots of cooling available, with temperature low
enough to compensate for the decrease in specific heat many times,
right?
2:04 p.m.
New subject: altitude, humidity and cooling (was Re: VAX wanted in Bristol, UK)
At 01:38 PM 12/10/02 -0800, you wrote:
Right, except that these systems are indoors in an
office environment
and there isn't an adequate temperature gradient.
I know, but it doesn't seem impossible to have them enclosed with
circulation from the outside (this is what I was thinking about).
Much easier than pressurized chambers and the like.
Of course, monitors, mice, keyboards would not get this treatment...
You'd think things would be cool enough at the
South Pole, but there's
some non-intuitive forces at work.
It is actually pretty intuitive with a minimal knowledge of physics.
--------------------------------------------------------------
Carlos E. Murillo-Sanchez carlos_murillo(a)nospammers.ieee.org
16 Dec
16 Dec
1:58 p.m.
On Monday 09 December 2002 13:28, Eric Smith wrote:
I wrote (about Leadville, Colorado):
Argh... didn't get the first right answer. The pains of ~20hrs delay in
reading my personal email lists.
-Chris.
it is not possible to operate most VAX systems
there within the rated
specifications of all of the subsystems.
Dave Woodman wrote:
Altitude?
Bingo!
Disk drives are almost always rated for operation to a maximum altitude
of 10K feet above sea level. 
1:57 p.m.
An RA80 drive is spec'd to operate up to 8000ft. Some 2200 feet below
Leadville!
Kevin
-----Original Message-----
From: cctalk-admin(a)classiccmp.org [mailto:cctalk-admin@classiccmp.org]
On Behalf Of Eric Smith
Sent: 09 December 2002 08:42
To: cctalk(a)classiccmp.org
Subject: Re: VAX wanted in Bristol, UK
The only interpretations I could guess is that
it's either some sort
of
Tesla reference, or that maybe Leadville is out in the
middle of
nowhere
without adequate electricity.
No, the electricity is fine there. However, it is not possible to
operate most VAX systems there within the rated specifications of all
of the subsystems.
If no one figures it out in a few days, I'll explain.
1:57 p.m.
On Monday 09 December 2002 01:41, Eric Smith wrote:
I know. :)
...but I must admit an unfair advantage, living in Craig, Colorado, USA.
Regards,
Chris Craft, RetroComputing Nut
The only
interpretations I could guess is that it's either some sort of
Tesla reference, or that maybe Leadville is out in the middle of nowhere
without adequate electricity.
No, the electricity is fine there. However, it is not possible to
operate most VAX systems there within the rated specifications of all
of the subsystems.
If no one figures it out in a few days, I'll explain. 
9 Dec
9 Dec
1:04 p.m.
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8 Dec
8 Dec
4:18 p.m.
On Sun, 8 Dec 2002, John Honniball wrote:
Just heard from a friend that he's interested in a
VAX, and he's
based near here in north Bristol. Anybody know of a suitable
machine?
Given that "suitable" is a qualitative sort of term, it might be useful
to have a few more details. How much physical space and electricity
does he have available? How heavy of a VAX would he consider to be
/too/ heavy? These are all important questions! Now I'm sure a wee
little VAXstation 2000 or 3100 would be convenient, but perhaps some
of his suitability requirements are that it be a big bulky system, one
which would leave a lasting impression on the ladies. Though hopefully
not as a result of the system tipping over and onto them.
-brian.
9 Dec
9 Dec
1:06 p.m.
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8 Dec
8 Dec
7:26 p.m.
Just heard from a friend that he's interested in a
VAX, and he's
based near here in north Bristol. Anybody know of a suitable
machine?
There are currently two Vaxen (and an Alpha) in the UK on eBay:
Item # 2079180081, and 2078871311
both near London but a practical drive from Bristol.
Andy
16 Dec
16 Dec
2 p.m.
-----Original Message-----
From: cctech-admin(a)classiccmp.org [mailto:cctech-admin@classiccmp.org]On
Behalf Of John Honniball
Sent: 08 December 2002 21:40
To: cctalk(a)classiccmp.org
Subject: VAX wanted in Bristol, UK
Just heard from a friend that he's interested in a VAX, and he's
based near here in north Bristol. Anybody know of a suitable
machine?
I know where there's a VAXstation 3100 M48 but it may need parts, and I've
got a couple of spare untested MicroVAX 2000s.....
Any good?
cheers
--
adrian/witchy
www.binarydinosaurs.co.uk - the online computer museum
www.snakebiteandblack.co.uk - monthly gothic shenanigans
7890
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22 comments
13 participants
participants (13)
-
andyh＠andyh-rayleigh.freeserve.co.uk -
ard＠p850ug1.demon.co.uk -
bfranchuk＠jetnet.ab.ca -
carlos_murillo＠epm.net.co -
ccraft＠netgenius.org -
coredump＠gifford.co.uk -
dave＠naffnet.org.uk -
dittman＠dittman.net -
erd_6502＠yahoo.com -
eric＠brouhaha.com -
kevin＠ps8.co.uk -
vaxzilla＠jarai.org -
witchy＠binarydinosaurs.co.uk