11 Jan
2002
11 Jan
'02
2:15 a.m.
see below, plz.
Dick
----- Original Message -----
From: "Jerome Fine" <jhfine(a)idirect.com>
To: <classiccmp(a)classiccmp.org>
Sent: Thursday, January 10, 2002 10:13 PM
Subject: Adaptec 1510 - SCSI Hard Drive Question
Much as I hate to admit I am using W95 on a Pentium
166 MMX, it
is really to run E11 and run RT-11.
Included, I have an Iomega SCSI Insider (100 MByte Zip drive) which
came with a (wonder of wonders) Adaptec 1510 SCSI host adapter
(at least I think that was the Adaptec number - it is inside the guts of
the motherboard and I can pull it to check if absolutely necessary).
The first thing I'd suspect as a source of trouble is the IOMEGA product. I
have one or more of nearly every IOMEGA removable media drive that they ever
produced, and not a single one has ever worked as advertised.
BTW, if you're booting from the SCSI chain, the controller is absolutely not
an AHA 1510, since that's a ROM-less version.
Now, wonder of wonders, not only does the 1510 and the Iomega
APSI device drivers support the Zip drive, but I can also connect
the Sony SMO S-501 as well. In fact, at one point, I had 3 of the
Sony magneto optical drives (SCSI ID 0,1,2 and the Zip at ID 6)
all running on the 1510 and of course recognizing all four SCSI
units at boot time (along with a C: drive and an IDE CD-ROM
drive) for a total of 8 drives: A: (3.5" floppy) B: (5 1/4" floppy)
C:, D:, E:, F:, G: (Zip) and H: (CD-ROM).
About half the time I boot without the Sony drives and the ZIP drive
and the Iomega device driver complains there are no SCSI IDs, and
I just press any character to continue.
You may find you have better luck with the ADAPTEC drivers rather than the
IOMEGA verson. I have used both ZIP and JAZ drives with IOMEGA's drivers, and
they've never worked satisfactorily.
On occasion, I want to use a SCSI hard drive (currently I have both
a ST11200N and a ST32550N) instead of the Sony drives (I hardly
ever use the Zip drive - it is normally cabled to the 50-pin cable but
not powered on). When that happens, i.e. want to use the Seagate
drives, I find it necessary to FIRST boot W95 with the Sony drive
powered on at the same SCSI ID I will be using for the Seagate
drive. Then I power down all the Sony drives, disconnect them ALL
from the end of the cable (a 50 pin external centronics connector
since the Sony drives are external boxes) and power up (sometimes
all three) the Seagate drives, i.e. I can't seem to keep both the
Seagate drives and the Sony drives powered up on the SCSI cable
at the same time.
Now, how many devices? At which addresses? It doesn't matter, of course,
which addresses you use, unless you want to boot from one of these devices.
If it's to be a bootable drive, it will have to be at ID=0 or ID=1.
In addition, if I boot W95 with just the Seagate drives powered on,
they are not even recognized at all - actually not quite true. Although
W95 and the device drivers from Iomega will not allow these Seagate
SCSI hard drives, the are "partially" recognized by E11 to the point
that I can "MOUNT" them under E11, but I can't really access them
properly. It looks as if the Iomega supplied device drivers will not
recognize a fixed (i.e. non-removable media hard drive).
This is likely an artifact of the IOMEGA approach to SCSI system
configuration. The IOMEGA driver requires you have a previously defined
configuration in the SCSI.SCF file (or whatever that thing is called) and any
change in the configuration "breaks" the operability of the entire chain. The
ADAPTEC driver will work better in that respect, since it doesn't require a
previously defined configruation. Under W95, you just go to device-manager
and "refresh" the SCSI adapter, after which the newly powered-on devices will
suddenly appear in the "my computer" window.
I would prefer to not use W95, but that is all I have to use when I post
to classiccmp and use email and the internet.
You'll have better luck if you purge all IOMEGA software from your system.
I've found that IOMEGA drives work better with the ADAPTEC drivers, though you
can't perform any low-level functions, such as low-level format, on them
unless you use the IOMEGA setup. You might find that it works most easily if
you boot a version of DOS that you've set up to support the IOMEGA tools
whenever you want to perform those functions.
Plus, I really use the PC to run RT-11 on the PC, so please don't suggest
getting a MAC or running Linux or some equally reasonable answer since
I like having the system right now with RT-11 and the Zip and Sony drives
and I can put up with the problem of having to boot with Sony drives if I
have to.
So, it sounds like a termination problem on the SCSI bus. But
the ST11200N is definitely terminated from the drive. I checked at:
http://www.seagate.com/support/disc/scsi/st11200n.html
and J2 has both the Parity and Terminator jumpers. But when even just
one ST11200N drive is cabled on and powered on by itself, booting W95
does not recognize the ST11200N, but having the Sony drive there first
does the job as stated above.
So I am starting to think the problem is more likely the device drivers.
You'll find that out if you try the ADAPTEC drivers and leave the ZIP drive
off the chain for the moment.
Could the 1510 and the Adaptec device drivers just not recognize an
ST11200N (or any other SCSI hard drive that is not removable), but
be fooled once booted with the Sony drive which has a removable media?
I've found the 1510/152x controllers work about as well as SCSI adapters can
be expected to work, and with a WIDE range of devices. I used the SONY MO
drives with them for some time, until they became too valuable to keep.
NOTE: I want to use the ST32550N under both RT-11 as a permanent
and much faster hard drive (the Sony is quite slow) and W95 as a backup
device - I have an option on a bunch of these drives even if I can't solve
the boot problem - does anyone else want a few as well?
What do you mean by "W95 as a backup device?" Doesn't RT-11 support
backup?
Question: Can anyone HELP? Does anyone have any experience with the
device drivers from Iomega for their Zip drives? If that is the problem,
then
I am probably stuck since I prefer to keep the Sony
and Zip drives over the
hard drives. Plus if having to re-cable after I boot with a Sony drive is
the
answer, then I can probably live with that for a few
more years.
Thanks in advance for any suggestions!
Sincerely yours,
Jerome Fine