From: David Williams <dlw(a)trailingedge.com>
Ok, I'll have to start searching and see what I can come up with.
BTW, didn't someone say that I couldn't format the RD54s on
here? Or maybe my mind is slipping. What other issue such as
this might I encounter with the different setups?
mostly correct. if you need to format a RD54 or a RD54 like drive
you need either software that is hard to find or a far cheaper solution
another small( 0.5cuFt) Microvax2000. Those can be found for
near nothing to free if there is no disks installed and the firmware
can format disks. FYI if it has 8mb or more of ram it will run VMS
very nicely using a smaller disk for swaping and the eithernet
for remote boot and system.
Allison
From: David Williams <dlw(a)trailingedge.com>
On 2 Jul 2000, at 16:09, Chuck McManis wrote:
> tapes and disks used different protocols (TMSCP vs MSCP). A Viking QTD
> from a DEC Reseller will set you back anywhere from $250 - $800. A
> nicer CMD controller like the one Allison recommended I've seen listed
> for $2000! Contrast that to an ESDI controller that you can usually
> find for $30 - $50.
Wow! Ok, I really want to run VMS but not $2000 enough. Well I
sometimes have some pretty good luck, maybe I'll find one
If you don't your not looking. I got mine for free. The 2000 number
is obviously a price for a new part.
don't forget there is also EDSI and the DEC RQDX3. Of those two
the RQDX3 is generally very cheap and usually free. Drives can
be a problem as the RD54s are the hot item, but they are found.
Allison
From: David Williams <dlw(a)trailingedge.com>
It looks to me like the controller is going to be the more difficult to
locate. I have a box of old unknown boards, some are DEC, I'll
have to sort through and see if I have anything of use (either in my
system or for trading) in there. Does anyone have any good
sources for controllers and/or the drives online? Any suggestions
on average costs?
Ok, SCSI controllers are easy to find just not cheap.
RXDX3 controllers for MFM disks (RD54 and friends)
are fairly common and cheap.
EDSI contrllers are less common but the drives are fairly cheap.
It's the easiest thing to solve in VAXland.
Allison
On 2 Jul 2000, at 7:57, allisonp wrote:
> From: Chuck McManis <cmcmanis(a)mcmanis.com>
> >I'd recommend a nice ESDI controller (Dilog 696-20 or RQ11D/E
> >(Webster/Sigma/etc) If you can find a RRD-40 interface (CD-ROM) that
> would
> >be good to since VMS from CD is easier to load than VMS from TK50
> (having
> >done both recently I really recommend CD). If you can find (good
> >luck!)
> a
> >SCSI controller for it then your options are pretty much wide open.
> >BTW
> VMS
> >lives very nicely on a 500 - 600MB disk with lots of layered
> >products.
>
>
>
> Chuck, a SCSI board with one good drive and a CDrom would be likely a
> better choice depeding on what can be found. I used this combo
> CMD200, RZ56 and toshiba Cdrom.
>
> Allison
>
>
-----
David Williams - Computer Packrat
dlw(a)trailingedge.com
http://www.trailingedge.com
Contact me off list. I have several ESDI controllers that I have been
saving for the hobby users. WQESD, Dilog DQ696, etc. I even have some
drives to go with them.
The cheapest you will find for decent SCSI controllers are the CMD CQD220/TM
(Disk and Tape). I find them on the wholesale side but the min. I have paid
is $500. I typically pay $550 to $650 each even in quantity's of 10+.
Normal end user prices I have seen are $735 to $1200.
Keep your eyes open for Emulex UC07 and UC08. With late versions of the
firmware they work nicely with CD's.
The Vikings are solid but rather slow but will talk to CD's also with late
firmware.
Dan
-----Original Message-----
From: David Williams <dlw(a)trailingedge.com>
To: classiccmp(a)classiccmp.org <classiccmp(a)classiccmp.org>
Date: Sunday, July 02, 2000 6:40 PM
Subject: Re: Reviving a MicroVAX II
It looks to me like the controller is going to be the more difficult to
locate. I have a box of old unknown boards, some are DEC, I'll
have to sort through and see if I have anything of use (either in my
system or for trading) in there. Does anyone have any good
sources for controllers and/or the drives online? Any suggestions
on average costs?
Thanks.
On 2 Jul 2000, at 7:57, allisonp wrote:
> From: Chuck McManis <cmcmanis(a)mcmanis.com>
> >I'd recommend a nice ESDI controller (Dilog 696-20 or RQ11D/E
> >(Webster/Sigma/etc) If you can find a RRD-40 interface (CD-ROM) that
> would
> >be good to since VMS from CD is easier to load than VMS from TK50
> (having
> >done both recently I really recommend CD). If you can find (good
> >luck!)
> a
> >SCSI controller for it then your options are pretty much wide open.
> >BTW
> VMS
> >lives very nicely on a 500 - 600MB disk with lots of layered
> >products.
>
>
>
> Chuck, a SCSI board with one good drive and a CDrom would be likely a
> better choice depeding on what can be found. I used this combo
> CMD200, RZ56 and toshiba Cdrom.
>
> Allison
>
>
-----
David Williams - Computer Packrat
dlw(a)trailingedge.com
http://www.trailingedge.com
From: Chuck McManis <cmcmanis(a)mcmanis.com>
>I'd recommend a nice ESDI controller (Dilog 696-20 or RQ11D/E
>(Webster/Sigma/etc) If you can find a RRD-40 interface (CD-ROM) that
would
>be good to since VMS from CD is easier to load than VMS from TK50
(having
>done both recently I really recommend CD). If you can find (good luck!)
a
>SCSI controller for it then your options are pretty much wide open. BTW
VMS
>lives very nicely on a 500 - 600MB disk with lots of layered products.
Chuck, a SCSI board with one good drive and a CDrom would be likely a
better
choice depeding on what can be found. I used this combo CMD200, RZ56
and toshiba Cdrom.
Allison
Ed,
Did you use the /VE option with DSC?
If you can, use BRU to copy a disk. I never had any problems with disks
copied with BRU.
A possiblility that you could not boot, could be that DU2: is not generated
into your RSX11M+.
Wim
----------
> From: wanderer <wanderer(a)bos.nl>
> To: classiccmp(a)classiccmp.org
> Subject: Duplicating an RSX-11M+ system disk.
> Date: Sunday, July 02, 2000 8:06 AM
>
> Hello All,
>
> I have a bit of a weird problem, I'm trying to make a 2nd bootable
> system disk containig RSX-11M+.
>
> I have an 11/83 with 2 RD53's and 1 RD54, and the system is on one
> of the RD53's. I booted [6,54]brusys.sys and then used DSC to copy
> the contents to the 2nd RD53. DSC did not report any error.
> Then when trying to boot du2 (the 2nd RD53), nothing happens besides
> a number of retries to access the boot information.
>
> DSC is supposed to copy the boot information as well as the data,
> so I'm wondering what I do wrong.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Ed
>
> --
> The Wanderer | Geloof nooit een politicus!
> wanderer(a)bos.nl | Europarlementariers: zakken-
> http://www.bos.nl/homes/wanderer | vullers en dumpplaats voor
> Unix Lives! windows95/98 is rommel! | mislukte politici.
> '96 GSXR 1100R / '97 TL1000S |
> See http://www.bos.nl/homes/wanderer/gates.html for a funny pic. of
> Gates!
I finally unburied a whole shipload of PALs I bought many years ago, and
started to sort them. I have a few National Semiconductor types called
20C1s. What is the organization of these? Apparently not a popular item,
as I found little information on the web.
William Donzelli
aw288(a)osfn.org
Hi,
[Apologies if this has already been mentioned, I'm a bit behind with my
email.]
On Wed, 21 Jun 2000 Tony Duell wrote:
> > I have a copy of the AMD 2900 databook, which I might try to scan in
> > somewhere (I can photocopy sections out for John if he needs them right
> > away); someone also recently provided me with a scanned version of the
> > Am2901 datasheet, which I can share.
> >
> > You're on your own for a copy of Mick and Brick - it's copyrighted, so I
>
> Well, the 2900 databook is copyrighted as well... Most companies don't seem
> to mind people copying their data sheets (after all, it sells their
> chips!), but it doesn't mean you can scan an post a copy of the databook
> without checking first.
None of the companies concerned is likely to care at all. Though actually
getting many to say so officially might not be easy.
On Fri, 23 Jun 2000 Pat Barron wrote:
> Well, I corresponded with some folks at AMD, and didn't quite get
> everything I wanted, but this might help somebody.
>
> They have approved me making up to 10 copies of the Am2900 databook. My
> plan is to scan it in and turn it into a PDF file. Therefore, I can only
> make copies available to 10 people.
>
> ...
>
> If substantially more than 10 people are interested, I'll go back to them
> and request further permission, but this was all they felt they could let
> me do without running my request through legal review.
There is no need to do this, because 2900 data books/sheets by various
companies including AMD are already available in scanned format (PDF files)
online.
Go to http://www.freetradezone.com/
After registering you can use the Design Center section to browse and download
data sheets and data books for many kinds of current and discontinued devices
(including 2900 series from several manufacturers). They even have some data
books from the 1970s online.
Just enter 2900 or 2901 or whatever in the part number box and click the
search button.
That site is probably a good first place to look if you are after the data
sheet for any discontinued device.
-- Mark
From: Richard Erlacher <richard(a)idcomm.com>
>Look around your lab or work area at home . . . how many of your
homebuilt
>bits of apparatus have "real" legends or printed labels for all the
knobs
>and switches? How many of your projects end up in a box that's screwed
>shut? That's where the truth of the matter lies. Everybody has built a
>thingie or two that never gets past the wirewrap board even though it's
been
>used occasionally for 10-20 years. It often starts out as an immediate
>need, but ends up as a tool.
It's one habit I try to avoid and as a result I do have some boxes that
are
in one case 35 years old, labled, docs and all. At that age I'd have to
have been a child prodigy to be a PHD. I build tools for myself, a few
are
hand wired some wirewrap but neither are a bad thing only an idication of
cost to do a decent 2 or 4 layer board was out of reach. Then again
sloppy
work doesn't last. Call it a do it once and do it right mindset.
Now cabinetry, that eluded me for years how to get truly good looking
boxen
not made of wood with some metal.
>I like my tools "finished", i.e. in a sealed box with external knobs
that
>don't require a screwdriver to operate them. I like to be able to use
them
Drills sharp, wrenches clean and all that are part of completing a
project
as well.
>but that's just what they are: unfinished. If I build a tool to
completion,
>you can bet there's documentation. . . particularly for revisions, and
the
It was documentation, in depth that got me a lot of advanced credit. I
was
designing from the ground up by HS. The information and techniques are
not secret, or hard to learn.
The idea that a PHD is required to do something useful is bogus. It
reeks
of classism and ignores those that out there doing it on far less save
for
one skill not discussed, ability to learn for ones self and apply it to
other
technologies.
>I'm sure there are both types, but my experience has been that the PhD
types
>are often working far outside their own discipline but are able to
handle
>the job because of their experience and training. They understand how
I"ve found that there are many hacks out there too, fond of building
Rube Golbergian crap.
Allison
>in getting it up and running. I want to run VMS on this, not
interested in the version of BSD out there, already have enough
Unix boxen. The main thing I'm missing, besides getting VMS
itself are drives. This system is in the BA123 enclosure and has a
TK50 tape drive. It contains the following boards:
M7606-AC CPU
M7608-BP Memory
M7608-BP Memory
M7546 Tape controller (TK50)
M7516 DELQA (eithernet)
M7516 DELQA (eithernet)... machine was likely used as a router.
M3104 16port serial
M9058 Disk breakout board (used for going from RQDX3
controller to MFMdisks and floppies)
>What all drive options are there and what would people
recommend? What are my options for getting VMS for this? Any
other help or comments appreciated.
Ok, what you need is either a RQDX3 (M7555 hard disk controller board
and a few RD54s or a SCSI card like the CMD200 and RZ56(680mb).
The problem is SCSI controllers generally don't go cheap. Ideally to run
VMS7.2 you need 300mb of disk(s) however smaller is possible.
The SCSI board is convenient as it will allow for a CDrom needed to
install from hobbiest CD. Other wise RRD40 and controller will be needed
or someone that can cut TK50s from the CD.
There is a hobbiest VMS license and even media available (www.decus.org).
I happen to run one of these and they are fine systems for 1987
technology.
Allison
