- test-drb@ccmp.vtda.org - classiccmp.org

by kandres＠epssecurity.com

It seems to my memory that we used just a RCA phono jack to the board, and RG58 with RCA phono plug on one end and a BNC on the other with a standard black and white security video monitor in the field, typically already located at the site as part of the existing video surveillance, so service personnel didn?t have to carry anything with them. We used a RF modulator, channel 3 or 4, on a larger screen TV set in engineering spaces for ease of viewing when developing or modifying the embedded application we were running on these, again it seems to me we picked that up at Radio Shack when we needed one back then, and fed it directly from the OSI board. It seems to me we got power for the modulator from the same connector that the video appeared on. We ran these on a battery backed up linear power supply, in the event that AC was lost to the facility. We didn?t need video with our application, so video was never left running in the field. I can?t remember when I last had that Superboard fired up, but I did it with a 5? black and white security monitor from my truck I use to setup video camera views with. Nothing extra involved, and it hasn?t been powered since. It is stored downstairs with the PET and a Data General Micro Nova. Kevin J Andres Senior Technician Engineered Protection Systems Inc. mailto:kandres at epssecurity.com -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.308 / Virus Database: 266.9.16 - Release Date: 4/18/2005 -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.308 / Virus Database: 266.9.16 - Release Date: 4/18/2005

21 years, 2 months

1
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HP-2116A manuals

by Tim＠rikers.org

I'm making some progress on restoring my HP-2116A system. I really need the manuals at this point. I see a couple that are related to the 2116 on bitsavers: http://bitsavers.org/pdf/hp/21xx/02152-90004_2116FPP_sep70.pdf http://bitsavers.org/pdf/hp/21xx/5950-8704_2116B_classVol2.pdf However I really need something more like a service manual. Schematics, test proceedures, etc. I know there are quite a few folks out there with 2116A systems. Anyone have electronic versions of the docs? I'd be willing to do the pdf conversion if someone would loan me paper manuals. FYI: I'll be out of town tomorrow through sunday. (SLC, UT) I continue to put up more pictures: http://rikers.org/gallery/hardware -- Tim Riker - http://rikers.org/ - TimR at Debian.org Embedded Linux Technologist BZFlag maintainer - http://BZFlag.org/ - for fun!

21 years, 2 months

1
0
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HP CRT mould update

by sloboyko＠yahoo.com

I sealed the edges of the faceplate/CRT with aquarium-grade clear RTV. This was outside the field of view permitted by the housing of my HP terminal. Keep everything absolutely clean (I used acetone) so that no dirt or smudges will be permanently trapped between the two surfaces. Use good lighting, outdoors (because of the acetone). I would STRONGLY advise ALWAYS replacing this faceplate. I'm sure that having it in front of the CRT itself will be very helpful if there is an implosion. I have read that the neck a a CRT tends to be shot through the front of a CRT in the event of implosion. This would be bad. Once assembled this way, there has been no optical affect whatsoever visible on my CRT. It is impossible to tell that there is a space between the CRT and faceplate (in my case, around 1/4-1/8". -Steve Loboyko Website: http://juliepalooza.8m.com/sl Nixie Watch (one-tube):http://juliepalooza.8m.com/sl/complwatch.htm __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com

21 years, 2 months

1
0
0 0

OSI video

by kandres＠epssecurity.com

It seems to my memory that we used just a RCA phono jack to the board, and RG58 with RCA phono plug on one end and a BNC on the other with a standard black and white security video monitor in the field, typically already located at the site as part of the existing video surveillance, so service personnel didn?t have to carry anything with them. We used a RF modulator, channel 3 or 4, on a larger screen TV set in engineering spaces for ease of viewing when developing or modifying the embedded application we were running on these, again it seems to me we picked that up at Radio Shack when we needed one back then, and fed it directly from the OSI board. It seems to me we got power for the modulator from the same connector that the video appeared on. We ran these on a battery backed up linear power supply, in the event that AC was lost to the facility. We didn?t need video with our application, so video was never left running in the field. I can?t remember when I last had that Superboard fired up, but I did it with a 5? black and white security monitor from my truck I use to setup video camera views with. Nothing extra involved, and it hasn?t been powered since. It is stored downstairs with the PET and a Data General Micro Nova. Kevin J Andres Senior Technician Engineered Protection Systems Inc. HYPERLINK "mailto:kandres at epssecurity.com"mailto:kandres at epssecurity.com -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.308 / Virus Database: 266.9.16 - Release Date: 4/18/2005

21 years, 2 months

1
0
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HP-2116A chassis (or repairing cast aluminum)

by pete＠dunnington.u-net.com

On Apr 16 2005, 16:33, Tim Riker wrote: > The HP-2116A in my haul yesterday has a broken chassis: > > http://rikers.org/gallery/hardware/20050416_120314 > 3) Thoughts on repairing the chassis? I could bondo, superglue, epoxy, > silversolder, etc. the pieces together, and add a plate behind it > attached with countersunk screws. Would not be very visible once the > panels are put back. I have the two side panels and the bottom panel, > but no top panel. Thoughts on which would work best? Glues aren't going to be effective at all, and you can't silver solder aluminium. It's possible to TIG weld aluminium and that might not be expensive if you know someone who has a TIG welder (they're often found in small engineering shops and car body shops). It's also possible to MIG weld aluminium, but TIG is more common and tends to give better results in my experience. If you want to try it yourself, there are various forms of aluminium solder, but most need special fluxes to cope with the oxide, they can be tricky to use (depends on the grade of aluminium, which is rarely pure, it's normally really an alloy), and not very strong. They also need a lot of heat because aluminium conducts heat away extremely well (this is also one of the problems with MIG welding it). Aluminium is often soft-soldered with a stainless steel scratch brush to remove the aluminium oxide under the solder pool, or done with an ultrasonic soldering iron (expensive -- I once nearly bought a *cheap* one for UKP300). For hard-soldering, or fusion welding really, the best stuff is Techno-Weld. It really works, and you can get it in the States as well as in the UK: http://www.techno-weld.com http://www.techno-weld.co.uk One of the basic "kits" of rods would have all you need; they also include the scratch brush, abrading wire and instructions. Or just rivet or bolt an L-shaped bracket on each side. Whatever you do, be prepared to file a bit off the broken edges to make sure it fits back together; whatever broke it probably stretched and bent it too. -- Pete Peter Turnbull Network Manager University of York

21 years, 2 months

10
10
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Dead AIM 65??

by dm561＠torfree.net

-----------------Original Message: Date: Sat, 16 Apr 2005 01:53:07 -0400 From: Ethan Dicks <ethan.dicks at gmail.com> Subject: Re: Dead AIM 65?? >On 4/15/05, Andy Dannelley <andyda at mac.com> wrote: >> First, Thanks for all the helpful suggestions! >You are welcome. >> Couple of things about general AIM-lore: >> >> The original AIM 65 (not the AIM 65/40) had a 20 char alpha LED >> display. The Aim 65/40 had a 40 character vacuum fluorescent display >> and 40 character printer, much more friendly for development than the >> 20 char display and printer. >I think I have heard of the AIM 65/40... if someone here knows such >things, was the motherboard re-engineered? Is it possible to retrofit >the 40-col display to the original AIM? Also, was the 40-col VFD run >by something like an HD44780 chipset, or was it some kind of raw >interface? These days, 40x1 or 40x2 VFDs based on the HD44780 are not >difficult to locate and are not all that expensive. They are also >trivial to send chars to. >-ethan ---------------Reply: The /40 was considerably different; bank-switched memory, intelligent display & printer, different keyboard etc. (Also more than twice the price of a /20). Both the display & the printer had their own microprocessor (6504) and could be mounted off-board. See Interactive Issue # 5 for a preview (on Rich's site). Also see issue # 8 for a description of the "official" Rockwell case. There were also larger cases to house the /20 or /40 along with its expansion card cage. There was an application note (R6500 N12) describing how to build a video interface (including the software listing) and it even references Lancaster's TVT Cookbook! Those were the heady days of OEM support... If you have trouble finding a display maybe that's the answer; just stick it inside an old monitor or terminal. BASIC & the editor are 80 (79) column capable BTW. I did indeed find some extra display covers; I'll be in touch with you (Ethan) & Jules off-list. mike

21 years, 2 months

2
1
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Rescue in Wisconsin

by news＠computercollector.com

-----Original Message----- From: Gil Carrick [mailto:gilcarrick at comcast.net] Sent: Saturday, April 16, 2005 10:55 PM To: news at computercollector.com Subject: Rare Items looking for a home I was contacted this week by Larry Metzler of Green Bay, Wisconsin. He is looking for a home for an IBM 513 reproducer and a 405 accounting machine. It is too far away for me. Anybody interested should contact Larry at 800-270-7725. Tell him I sent you. Gil A. G. (Gil) Carrick, Director The Museum at CSE University of Texas at Arlington Department of Computer Science & Engineering Box 19015, 471 S Cooper Street Arlington, TX 76019 817-272-3620 http://www.cse.uta.edu/TheMuseum at CSE/

21 years, 2 months

2
1
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TCF goodies

by cb＠mythtech.net

>> I was surprised I couldn't find a decent deal on a rack mount PC >> server, > >Wow, what was wrong with those dual PII/PIII ones in the pickup truck? >They had dual ethernet, dual RS-232, Ultra SCSI, were tested right >in front of the purchaser, and started at $40. Highway robbery (and OT >I realize). But they seemed rather "pre-Carly". Nothing was wrong with them. Somehow I managed to miss them!!! I went back today based on your statement that there would be someone with them cheap... I found the guy, and realized that I never saw him Saturday. I don't know how, and I'm kind of annoyed that I didn't see him. I got a good deal on a pair of them. 2u, dual p2 400 MHz with dual 9.1 GB scsi drives, $40 each. His Saturday price was $55 each for the same setup, and I would have happily paid the extra $15 each to avoid the drive a 2nd time (in fact, these units cost me MORE then the saved $30 combined between tolls, gas, and my time). So I'm happy now as I can replace my tower server and get it into my rack, and replace 3 other machines acting as web and FTP for a series of domains with a single one of these rack servers. Thanks for the heads up that he was there. -chris <http://www.mythtech.net>

21 years, 2 months

1
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TCF goodies

by cb＠mythtech.net

I went to the Trenton Computer Fest today. I didn't get over to the MARCH table, sorry. I did see John Allain however, but down the end of a row, and by the time I got down there to say hi, I lost track of him. Back to the point. I picked up a pair of NeXT slabs for $2 each. I think even Sellam would agree that is a good price ;-) One is a Turbo the other is a Color. No idea yet was is in them other than visually, there is a floppy drive and a hard drive. I've never played with a NeXT, and at that price, I wasn't going to ask many questions. The Turbo has a DA-15 connector that looks like a Mac RGB connector. Is it compatible with Mac monitors? The Color has a connector that I don't know what it is called, but looks like a Sun monitor connector. Is it compatible with those monitors? I'm crossing my fingers for a yes on both counts since I have both available to me already. And to verify, the keyboard/mouse uses ADB correct? These slabs were just the computer, nothing else. (although I did find a guy that had a NeXT mouse, but he was holding it to sell with his MacTV and wouldn't part with it. I considered getting the MacTV, but since I got one from John a while back, I decided against spending the $50 since it didn't have any docs, software, cables, keyboard, remote, or the correct mouse). The only other thing I picked up that might be of interest to this group is some kind of video conferencing terminal. I don't know anything about it at all yet, I wasn't actually interested in it, but the guy said if I took it away right then, I could have it for free, so I took it simply because it looked cool. Over all, I was a little disappointed this year in the items available. It is only the 2nd time I've gone, the first was two years ago, and I remembered there being far more vendors with a better selection. This year was a bunch of so-so priced used PCs, TONS of old laptops, and some over priced used Macs. I was surprised I couldn't find a decent deal on a rack mount PC server, or much in the way of RJ-45 patch panels (I needed two 72 port ones, I was able to find two 48 port ones at an ok price, and that was about it). Its possible that some of the vendors just weren't there yet or fully unpacked, I was there from about 10 am to 12:30. I also didn't go indoors anywhere, so I may have missed a bunch of other dealers (I had limited time today as I had to be back home by 2, and it takes about 1.5 hours on the drive). Anyone else get anything of interest? Oh, and Hi John, since I didn't get to say it to you today. :-) -chris <http://www.mythtech.net>

21 years, 2 months

3
3
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Another rescue, in Calgary

by news＠computercollector.com

_____ From: Garry B [mailto:garryb at hotmail.com] Sent: Saturday, April 16, 2005 11:12 PM To: news at computercollector.com Subject: Toshiba T3200 Have a functional T3200 computer I no longer want/need wondering if it can be posted on your website or listed in your newsletter. I reside in Calgary Alberta Canada. regards Garry Beutler 403-275-5425 Cell/Voice Mail 403-630-9003 <http://graphics.hotmail.com/emwink.gif>

21 years, 2 months

1
0
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TCF goodies

by cb＠mythtech.net

>Hope this helps. Thanks for the info. -chris <http://www.mythtech.net>

21 years, 2 months

1
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cctalk Digest, Vol 20, Issue 47

by cb＠mythtech.net

>and some Russian Vendor selling Blue and >White G3's for $100 that everyone said to stay far >away from. He was asking $150 each on those when I was there. I went back today, and most of the pile was gone. I didn't ask how much they were down to. I'd have considered one if they dropped below $35, but it wasn't important enough to me to ask. -chris <http://www.mythtech.net>

21 years, 2 months

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SMS FWD0101

by pspan＠amerytel.net

Hello, The Stomberg Carlson DCO switches used to use that combo and were based on a dec 11/23. I believe I have controllers and Documentation for the SMS Drives. If you would like to to try and dig up the info and parts That I have available, let me know. Phil

21 years, 2 months

2
1
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Data General books available in the UK

by jim＠g1jbg.co.uk

Hi, after a visit to the local tip this week, I have a few Data General books available (no computer though :-(). Data General Interface Designer's Manual for Nova and Eclipse line computers and the following EMI books detailing the system and programming of the DG machine coupled to a medical scanner: Scintron 3 camera diagnostic softwares Scintron 3 service manual Scinticamera detector head NE8900 & NE8960 IO tester for eclips processor Parts A & B Nova 3 Exerciser test (N3EXS) Eclipse microcode flowchart Eclipse basic instruction ROMS and Decoding Nova 3 Multi-Programming Rel (SH) (N3MORT03) a number of these seem to be re-bindings of the equivalent DG publication. They cost me a beer for the lot, yours for the cost of postage (and a beer if your feeling generous :-)) Jim. (weight is around 6lbs for the lot) Please see our website the " Vintage Communication Pages" at WWW.G1JBG.CO.UK

21 years, 2 months

1
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cctalk Digest, Vol 20, Issue 47

by alhartman＠yahoo.com

I went to Trenton too, I missed those two NextStations... I heard about them from the guy who had the MacTV and watched it being sold. I think it finally went for less than $50.00. There wasn't much there. I barely spent anything. I think I spent more on food from the food stand than I did on stuff. The only thing I got there, that I couldn't have gotten from a regular show, was a LaserXT computer. Which is an Apple IIc Sized Computer (Actually built into a case used for the Laser IIc Clone) that is an IBM XT Compatible. For $5.00, I got the unit alone. One Floppy drive and the manual. No software, no power supply (I believe it uses a IIc power supply, which should be easy to scrounge up), and unknown condition or RAM. Once I get a powersupply for it, it should be fun to power it up. Hopefully the 5 1/4 disks I've still got, are working and I can boot from them. But not much else... As someone else said, lots of PC stuff, overpriced beige Macs, and some Russian Vendor selling Blue and White G3's for $100 that everyone said to stay far away from. One vendor in the back had tons of tubes, so anyone there looking for tubes would have had a ball... The kids from the college made out like bandits selling sodas and t-shirts to raise money for their clubs. I brought $150.00 with more available from local ATM's and I think I spent less than $50.00 ($15.00 of which being the admission.) I did however, get a nice sunburn... I was hoping to see a TRS-80 Model I or III (or my holy grail an LNW-80), some NextStations (which I missed), maybe an Amiga 500 or an Atari ST, or assorted peripherals. I didn't see ANY Tandy stuff there. Not a Model 100, Coco of any type, Tandy 1000 or anything... I saw one vendor with an MC-10 Ram Pack, and that was it. A Commodore Plus/4 was there, but no C-64/Vic-20/C-128's... Or any peripherals. No Ataris, of any type... Including the VCS. Mostly PC, and the most Mac I've EVER seen at a TCF. Though this flea was about 1/5 the size of the show in it's heyday... If last year was like this, I'm not so sorry now I missed it. __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Make Yahoo! your home page http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs

21 years, 2 months

1
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HP-2116A chassis (or repairing cast aluminum)

by pete＠dunnington.u-net.com

On Apr 17 2005, 12:19, Teo Zenios wrote: > Pure magnesium ignites at 476 C and burns at 2200 C so if the case is pure > enough (doubtful, additives change the burning properties) and you get it > hot enough then good luck trying to put the fire out. That temperature is for powder or dust. It's much higher for bulk solid magnesium, normally quoted as 625C or thereabouts, though lower than its melting point (648C). There are various factors that affect ignition temperature. See for example: http://www.netl.doe.gov/coolscience/res_archive/q&a_36.html http://www.eh.doe.gov/techstds/standard/hdbk1081/hbk1081c.html and for common alloys: http://www.parkwayproducts.com/thixomolding/engineering_data.html Oh, and for some more pictures of what happens when it does burn, and how hard it is to make that happen: http://www.theodoregray.com/PeriodicTable/Stories/012.2/ By the way, titanium dust and grit is worse than magnesium dust; when turning titanium you're supposed to use water-based collant to avoud ignition risk -- but it's only a few months ago I had my titanium spectacle frames welded back together. Aluminium too; damp aluminium dust will spontaneously ignite (another standard school chemistry demo, it used to be mixed with iodine to produce purple smoke) and its bulk ignition temperature is lower than that of magnesium's, but I've seen its auto-ignition temperature quoted as high as 780C. I suppose the reason I've replied to so many of the posts about this is that people remember seeing magnesium ribbon burning in school chemistry classes, but Real Life ain't like the science lab. -- Pete Peter Turnbull Network Manager University of York

21 years, 2 months

1
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HP-2116A chassis (or repairing cast aluminum)

by pete＠dunnington.u-net.com

On Apr 16 2005, 21:32, Bob Shannon wrote: > I think the actual frame here is magnesium alloy, not aluminum. > > Any attempt to weld this might be spectacularly bad idea. Why? Welding magnesium alloy is done in exactly the same ways as welding aluminium, except of course that different composition filler rods are preferred. The relevant properties (strength of the base metal, electrical conductivity, melting point of the metal, high melting point of the oxide, hydrogen inclusion in the molten metal, etc) are very similar. -- Pete Peter Turnbull Network Manager University of York

21 years, 2 months

3
2
0 0

Dead AIM 65

by andyda＠earthlink.net

On Apr 17, 2005, at 9:32 AM, Jules Richardson wrote: > > On Sat, 2005-04-16 at 10:51 -0700, Andy Dannelley wrote: >> Well, I tried the next steps, with my limited equipment, and no joy. >> >> Here's what I've tried so far, > > Possible reset fault? Check connections to display logic too (PIA / > 6520 / U1) - pin 1 is ground, 22, 22 and 24 should be at +5V. Pin 11 is > clock, and pin 8 is the same reset line as for the CPU. > > I've got the schematic - it's around the size of 6 sheets of A4 so > could > just about scan it if you want (and can't find it on the web already). > > cheers > > Jules Thanks for the offer, But I still have the complete documentation set that I got with the AIM when I bought it way, back then... Thanks for the suggestion, I'll check out as soon as I can, Later, AndyD

21 years, 2 months

1
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HP-2116A chassis (or repairing cast aluminum)

by Tim＠rikers.org

The HP-2116A in my haul yesterday has a broken chassis: http://rikers.org/gallery/hardware/20050416_120314 A few questions: 1) does anyone have a 2116 on the list? working or otherwise? 2) The chassis sides appear to be identical. Having a cracked top would be much better than a cracked bottom. Anyone know if they are in fact identical and if it's possible to take the whole thing apart and swap the sides? Recommendations for or against? I know it would be a big project. 3) Thoughts on repairing the chassis? I could bondo, superglue, epoxy, silversolder, etc. the pieces together, and add a plate behind it attached with countersunk screws. Would not be very visible once the panels are put back. I have the two side panels and the bottom panel, but no top panel. Thoughts on which would work best? My door is missing the glass: http://rikers.org/gallery/hardware/20050415_131216 If/when I get the system up and running, I'd like high res scans of a front panel to recreate one. Anyone know if they panel was glass or some other material? Bob? I know your listening. ;-) -- Tim Riker - http://rikers.org/ - TimR at Debian.org Embedded Linux Technologist BZFlag maintainer - http://BZFlag.org/ - for fun!

21 years, 2 months

10
14
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HP-2116A chassis (or repairing cast aluminum)

by ajp166＠bellatlantic.net

> >Subject: Re: HP-2116A chassis (or repairing cast aluminum) > From: gordonjcp at gjcp.net >> I think your best bet is welding. I believe that welding aluminum >> requires special equipment. A guy at my office does something called >> TIG welding for his robotics projects. > Aluminum can be direct welded but it's harder to do and many shops will resort to TIG as it gives cleaer results. Once you alloy magnesium more than 25% with anything ti's tendancy to burn like a torch drops ways off. I've done most Aluminum alloys using TIG and the preferd torch is the single arc (Arc to work) and the prefered gas either argon or helium. When done with He the process gets called heliarc. I've done both. In both cases you need a TIG rig and inert gas. Many welding shops worth their salt can do this. But often charge by the hour for a one off. It helps of you've done all the prep so they can hook up and go. A good TIG weld should require minimal refinishing to look good. Don't forget a lot of trucks and trailers these days have a lot of Aluminum and they do get repairs so the skills are out there. Due to costs, I'd seriously first try to fine a stripped chassis first. Allison

21 years, 2 months

2
1
0 0

Dead AIM 65

by andyda＠earthlink.net

> The stock AIM 65 was offered with either 1K or 4K RAM, I bought a 1K > and a guy I knew at Rockwell gave me the other 3K. : That RAM wouldn't happen to be in 2114s, would it? If so, I'd suspect : those early on, I've had more trouble with 2114s than with any other : chip. I've lost count of the number I've replaced (certainly the RAM in : my Commodore 8050, the video RAM in my TRS-80 Model 3, the RAM in my : HP82163 (HPIL video interface)...) : -tony Yep, the RAM is 2114! I swapped the zero page RAM with others in several configurations. Out of 8 RAM how many would you suspect as bad? Could it be all 8, or a significant number such that getting just the right 2 for zero page wold be difficult, maybe I should buy at least a couple just to hope I get 2 good ones to try?! Thanks, AndyD

21 years, 2 months

1
0
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Questions - Universe/68, HP-9134A,VT420 composite video

by david_comley＠yahoo.com

--- Patrick Finnegan <pat at computer-refuge.org> wrote: > First off, before you go around modifying VT420s, > you may want to test > the Pro first. Yes, the Pro is a complete unknown quantity at the moment. My suspicions about someone messing with the power supply were confirmed when, after removing the already-unscrewed top cover I found a nice green jumper cable across what was left of the fuseholder. I think I will take my time on this one. Perhaps I should make sure I have a fire extinguisher handy as well. > The 'composite' output of the > machine nicely matches > NTSC (RS-170) composite signal specs, so you can > hook the output > directly to a TV with a composite input. Beware If I can ever get the thing to power up I have an old portable TV upstairs I could use - no composite input but I do have an RF modulator I bought years ago. Perhaps that will work. And the VT420 I had in mind needs to be repaired anyway since it screeches at me when I turn it on, so perhaps that's not the best approach. Thanks for the advice. Regards, Dave __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Plan great trips with Yahoo! Travel: Now over 17,000 guides! http://travel.yahoo.com/p-travelguide

21 years, 2 months

1
0
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HP-2116A chassis (or repairing cast aluminum)

by pete＠dunnington.u-net.com

On Apr 17 2005, 7:32, Vintage Computer Festival wrote: > On Sat, 16 Apr 2005, Bob Shannon wrote: > > > I think the actual frame here is magnesium alloy, not aluminum. > > > > Any attempt to weld this might be spectacularly bad idea. > > Listen to the man (with an emphasis on "spectacular" in the true sense of > the word). Probably not, actually. It's hard to get the stuff to burn, and it might well collapse under its own weight before you got it all that hot, at which point you'd probably remove the hot flame and emit a few hot words instead ;-) [1] Yes, the ignition temperature of some magnesium alloys is below the melting point, but you need an *awful* lot of heat to make it catch, not just a high local temperature. You also need an awful lot of heat to sustain it -- remember it dissipates heat readily -- and you need oxygen[2] to keep it going. Under normal welding conditions, the inert gas used for TIG/MIG excludes the oxygen (that's the whole point of the method) and the heat is highly localised, and other techniquesuse much lower temperatures. TIG welding of mag alloys is quite commonplace, and most items of magnesium alloy you'll come across are heat treated during manufacture, at high temperatures. This is not something you can do at home with a paraffin (kerosene) blowlamp, it's usually done in ovens in an inert atmosphere, but it's nevertheless standard procedure. If you want to know just how hard it is to burn a mag alloy chassis, take a look at Simson Garfinkel's infamous webpage at http://simson.net/photos/hacks/cubefire.html and note how much gas it took to cause even sporadic ignition. It was a pile of molten slag by the time it caught. Disclaimer: if you do have an enormous blowtorch, don't blame me if you set your workshop on fire. However, if you have such a blowtorch, you can do that more easily without the magnesium alloy :-) And if you do set a magnesium alloy chassis alight, there's not much will put it out. For small fires, copious water (not a spray) to deluge it is sometimes used, but common practice, I'm told, is to protect the surroundings and let the metal burn out. There's at least one firefighter on the list who might know more about that than I do. [1] Yes, I found out the hard way when trying to repair something. [2] Or more usually air. However, once the reaction gets going, magnesium is sufficiently reactive to burn in carbon dioxide or nitrogen, stripping the oxygen from CO2 leaving soot behind, or forming magnesium nitride. Standard school chemistry demonstration. That's why MIG/TIG for aluminium and magnesium (and their alloys) use pure argon instead of cheaper gasses. -- Pete Peter Turnbull Network Manager University of York

21 years, 2 months

1
0
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HP-2116A chassis (or repairing cast aluminum)

by pete＠dunnington.u-net.com

On Apr 17 2005, 8:51, Bob Shannon wrote: > Could be I have no idea what I'm talking about here. > > But I do know many older HP devices use magnesium rather than > aluminum. As to how to weld these materials, I'm no expert. > > But I'd rather not hear that the machine, and the shop that attempted > the repair had been reduced to ashes. Agreed :-) To be quite honest, although welding would be the neatest solution short of finding a replacement chassis, I'd just buy a couple of those L-shaped brackets used for reinforcing woodwork, and rivet them onto the frame. -- Pete Peter Turnbull Network Manager University of York

21 years, 2 months

1
0
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Cool test gear

by vcf＠siconic.com

I just checked what that GenRad box was and it's a 2610 Universal Field Tester. What the? Whatever it is, it looks complete with pods and a plug-in module in the inside compartment. Also realized I had an HP 1640B Serial Data Analyzer. Sweet debugging tools! -- Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org [ Old computing resources for business || Buy/Sell/Trade Vintage Computers ] [ and academia at www.VintageTech.com || at http://marketplace.vintage.org ]

21 years, 2 months

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ebay score

by wh.sudbrink＠verizon.net

Every now and then, you can still get a good buy on ebay. Described simply as: 5 1/4 Full height floppy disk drives this lot: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=4193&item=5183306657 is not one, not two, but three MPI B51 floppy drives. Ohio Scientific used this model in all of their "MF" (mini-floppy) offerings. If you don't want to bother following the link, I got the lot for $10 plus shipping. One of the drives has a gray faceplate, which I've never seen before. I've had a hard time figuring out what other manufacturers used B51s. Atari used the mechanism in some of their 810s but with their own custom electronics. Before any Atari enthusiasts scream, I have not and will not disassemble any working 810s for parts.

21 years, 2 months

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PAGING: Fred van Kempen

by kyrrin＠bluefeathertech.com

Fred? Would you please contact me when you have a moment? I've still not heard back from you as to which address you want the tape drive you got from me to go to. Thanks much. -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Bruce Lane, Owner & Head Hardware Heavy, Blue Feather Technologies -- http://www.bluefeathertech.com kyrrin (at) bluefeathertech do/t c=o=m "If Salvador Dali had owned a computer, would it have been equipped with surreal ports?"

21 years, 2 months

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free stuff

by molsen＠runbox.com

I am moving from a home in South West Michigan, between St. Joseph and South Haven. I have old classic computer equipment I will give away, but will not ship, as I do not have time to pack it. It can be picked up between Monday April 25 and 29. Email or call me if interested. I have the following: DG Computer with 64 K RAM, Z-80 CPU DG Keyboard 2 Monitors that work but are not original DG Phideck with 4 drives. External Floppy drives Digital Group dot matrix printer. A box of misc boards for use in the DG Model 33 Teletype Model 40 Teletype One S-100 Computer configured to use with TurboDOS, a multi-user operating system much like C/PM. This has a 5 MB hard drive and one 8 inch floppy drive. I have additional software on disk for this system. It needs a minor repair, a cable needs to be made for the controller. Televideo terminal, for use with the S-100 box. Marshall G. Olsen molsen at runbox.com 312-498-2955

21 years, 2 months

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Stuff

by molsen＠runbox.com

Thanks to all that replied. I gave everything away to the first person that called to pick it up except I still have model 40 teletype printer. It is a great printer for Z-80 systems, printing 400 lines a minute. If interested, CALL my cell. 312-498-2955 Marshall G. Olsen molsen at runbox.com

21 years, 2 months

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7201 (was Re: Z8530 (was Re: Navtel 9460 Protocol Analyzer info?))

by ajp166＠bellatlantic.net

>Subject: Re: 7201 (was Re: Z8530 (was Re: Navtel 9460 Protocol Analyzer info?)) > From: Tom Jennings <tomj at wps.com> > Date: Fri, 15 Apr 2005 22:24:29 -0700 (PDT) >8251! Now there's a turkey! At least it was simple. One of the >buggiest pieces of crap I ever had to initialize. I use the for basic serial as they depending on version are predictable and easy to init. using them for other protocals, can you say masochistic! >Serial chips, I get post-traumatic-stress just thinking about >them. I'll remember that one. Though compared to serial chips many disk controllers and their associated stuff that wraps around them programtically are pretty horrid too. Allison

21 years, 2 months

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Dead AIM 65??

by andyda＠mac.com

First, Thanks for all the helpful suggestions! I plan to swap the RAM around this weekend, and do as Tony suggested, which is to use my VOM just to see if the clocks and/or address data lines are stuck high or low. I also have the assembler and basic ROMs installed (they were both options when my AIM was new) and I guess maybe it might be a good idea to remove them as well, just to have only the absolute minimum on the board. Also, I have been corresponding with another person off-list, so maybe I can get this thing repaired after-all!! :) Couple of things about general AIM-lore: Most AIM 65's were sold as boards, the case came later, but I never got around to getting one. The original AIM 65 (not the AIM 65/40) had a 20 char alpha LED display. The Aim 65/40 had a 40 character vacuum fluorescent display and 40 character printer, much more friendly for development than the 20 char display and printer. The stock AIM 65 did not come with the Assembler or Basic (those were options) Later Rockwell also offered a set of FORTH ROMs ( I have them, never did program much FORTH though) The stock AIM 65 was offered with either 1K or 4K RAM, I bought a 1K and a guy I knew at Rockwell gave me the other 3K. Way back then, I used to be a consultant, did most of my work with Rockwell PPS 4 and PPS 8 and 6502 I even used to teach seminars for Rockwell to their customers on PPS 4 and 8 (mostly PPS 4). The AIM 65 was a fair development platform, we used to use a Rockwell System 65 for much of our code development and test, but we also used the AIM 65 for development and test, and I could also my AIM 65 at home when I didn't go to the office. Way more than anyone wanted to hear, I hope it is not too long a message. Later, AndyD

21 years, 2 months

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cctech Digest, Vol 20, Issue 31

by james＠attfield.co.uk

If you hit T from an RDOS prompt it will enable the upper 32K, copy itself to 0xC000 and re-issue the prompt. I'm not quite sure where the stack goes, perhaps K still works to kick the stack. Not sure if this also works on a 4FDC Jim Message: 12 > Date: Sat, 16 Apr 2005 00:04:20 -0500 > From: "Randy McLaughlin" <cctalk at randy482.com> > Subject: Re: Some said they have CDOS and Cromemco disks > To: "General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts" > <cctalk at classiccmp.org> > Message-ID: <003b01c54241$c76faf60$023dd7d1 at randylaptop> > Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; > reply-type=original > That's great! I can make a few suggestions: > > I can send you older CDOS's that should be more memory lean. Some older > CDOS's had normal SA800 support via undocumented drive type 'X' > even though > CDOSGEN only references 'S'mall & 'L'arge. > > If you have 64K of RAM RDOS can be copied to RAM giving you access to the > full 64K allowing Larger CDOS's: Using a random address such as 1000H: > > ld hl,0C000H > ld de,2000H > ld bc,1000H > ldir > ld a,1 > out (40H),a > ld hl,2000H > ld de,0C000H > ld bc,1000H > ldir > ret > > Just use the substitute memory command to enter the above code > (hex) and do > a g 1000 (a return returns to RDOS). You are now running RDOS out of RAM. > You can have one 32K CDOS and maybe a 64K CDOS to transfer. BTW you never > have to use 8080 only opcodes since RDOS & CDOS only run on > Z80's. Also the > above code can go in any free space and is not address dependent. > > > Remind people of my favorite mantra: 3.5" drives with DD media will be > happy to act as 5.25" DD drives. > > > Randy

21 years, 2 months

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Searching: Info about Racal-Redac Monarch

by gerold.pauler＠gmx.net

Part of my last haul of pdp8/e equipment (more about this will follow when pictures are online) are 20 to 30 8" floppies labeled "Racal-Redac Monarch System Disks", etc. A quick google showed nothing relevant. Any info about this would be appreciated. Thanks Gerold

21 years, 2 months

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7201 (was Re: Z8530 (was Re: Navtel 9460 Protocol Analyzerinfo?))

by ajp166＠bellatlantic.net

> >Subject: Re: 7201 (was Re: Z8530 (was Re: Navtel 9460 Protocol Analyzerinfo?)) > From: Ben Franchuk <bfranchuk at jetnet.ab.ca> >> The Zilog SIO types are fine by me. The yard sale full of assorted >> and scattered registers is annoying, but programmers opinions >> don't count. It does pretty much everything required for >> full-featured async. At least it does what you tell it to. They seem to. Darn things were never cheap though but being two for one made them tolerable if you needed two. >Well I favor dumb chips at the moment because I don't have >several MEG or EPROM to bootstrap my HOMEBREW computer.Infact I have >no PROM of any kind, just toogle switches*. Since I favor a 6809 >style of memory access** I am using 68B50's. I just need to finish >the CPU logic design and build it. :) I kinda liked that one to. The MITS 2SIO card used them and it worked very well. That was for 8080, works well for 8085 too. Allison

21 years, 2 months

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7201 (was Re: Z8530 (was Re: Navtel 9460 Protocol Analyzer info?))

by ajp166＠bellatlantic.net

> >Subject: Re: 7201 (was Re: Z8530 (was Re: Navtel 9460 Protocol Analyzer info?)) > From: Scott Stevens <chenmel at earthlink.net> >You might want to check out the 6402. I have a bunch of them from some >syncronous modems I scrapped a few decades back. It has the distinction >of being from the same family as the 6100 'PDP-8 on a chip' micro, and >is fairly bare-bones. It has several simple registers, but much of the >config is done with hardware by enabling pins and what-not. ;) I have a few. They go well with 6100, 6120 and 1802 being cmos. Allison

21 years, 2 months

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7201 (was Re: Z8530 (was Re: Navtel 9460 Protocol Analyzer info?))

by ajp166＠bellatlantic.net

>Subject: Re: 7201 (was Re: Z8530 (was Re: Navtel 9460 Protocol Analyzer info?)) > From: "Eric Smith" <eric at brouhaha.com> >I've been saying for years that hardware design is far too important >to be left up to hardware engineers. :-) At an interview once They asked me what kind of engineer I am? I kept it fairly simple. I design things, I fix things and sometimes I fix things others designed. Hardware and software sould never be designed in isolation, they become poor partners from their estrangement. It's a good thing have all elements on friendly terms. Then again, lifes tough enough but, then we have commercally available parts. ;) Allison

21 years, 2 months

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Dead AIM ^%??

by andyda＠mac.com

Well, I tried the next steps, with my limited equipment, and no joy. Here's what I've tried so far, 1. visually inspect - looks OK, nothing obvious like cracked or discolored components 2. check power supply - OK 3. check voltages on board - OK 4. remove extra ROMs 5. check clock with analog VOM - did not appear stuck high or low 6. check low addess lines with analog VOM - did not appear stuck high or low 7. remove all but low order RAM 8. swap RAM to try to find if bad zero page RAM - could all 8 RAM be bad? 9. feel parts for heat - nothing extraordinary, all appeared cool to touch I have an offer of someone (he's got 6 AIMs) I can mail it to, and he said he would look at it, but if there is something I can do here I would not have to impose on him. Any more ideas, or have I reached the end of what I can do here? BTW: I am not comfortable with de-soldering and soldering, it's just been too many years. I'm out of practice. So let me know anything you think I can try (W/O solder) and I'll try. Thanks again for such a wonderful response. Later, AndyD

21 years, 2 months

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N8234N datasheet

by rigdonj＠cfl.rr.com

Does anyone have a datasheet for these? I THINK they're Quad 2 input multiplexers but I'm not sure. I found them in an i8008 computer system. Joe

21 years, 2 months

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N8234N datasheet

by rigdonj＠cfl.rr.com

Oops! I meant to add that these are 16 pin DIP packages and appear to have been made by Signetics in the early 1980s. Does anyone have a datasheet for these? I THINK they're Quad 2 input multiplexers but I'm not sure. I found them in an i8008 computer system. Joe

21 years, 2 months

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Some said they have CDOS and Cromemco disks

by dave04a＠dunfield.com

Hi Randy, >I can send you older CDOS's that should be more memory lean. Some older >CDOS's had normal SA800 support via undocumented drive type 'X' even though >CDOSGEN only references 'S'mall & 'L'arge. That would be ideal - It would be nice if I could skip the intermediate step of making a SSSD and go straight to making the final disks. It would also eliminate the requirement to have 48k in order to transfer the final disks. I'll email you the transfer program - perhaps you can read in a version of CDOS that INITs in 32k and send it back to me. Btw, it's pretty easy to test: - Gen a CDOS for 32k - Boot it, run INIT but don't respond to the first prompt - Reset system - Enter G100 - INIT will startup again, try formatting DSDD disk and see if it works. When I try to do a DSDD disk under 32k CDOS I get: Logical disk error 03h, drive 'h', block BC7241h Under a 48k or 64k CDOS it works fine. >If you have 64K of RAM RDOS can be copied to RAM giving you access to the >full 64K allowing Larger CDOS's: Using a random address such as 1000H: > >ld hl,0C000H >ld de,2000H >ld bc,1000H >ldir >ld a,1 >out (40H),a >ld hl,2000H >ld de,0C000H >ld bc,1000H >ldir >ret > >Just use the substitute memory command to enter the above code (hex) and do >a g 1000 (a return returns to RDOS). You are now running RDOS out of RAM. >You can have one 32K CDOS and maybe a 64K CDOS to transfer. BTW you never >have to use 8080 only opcodes since RDOS & CDOS only run on Z80's. Also the >above code can go in any free space and is not address dependent. I thought about doing this - in fact, you can use the 'T' command to cause RDOS to copyitself to RAM ... but I would like to keep it running in 32k as this is more easily achieved configuration in many cases. I've put together a bit of documentation, and I have the transfer program as well as CDOS and Cromix images ready to put up, however I'm having a bit of trouble with permissions on the server (which is remote to me)... I hope I can get it resolved this weekend and get the files up. Regards, Dave -- dave04a (at) Dave Dunfield dunfield (dot) Firmware development services & tools: www.dunfield.com com Collector of vintage computing equipment: http://www.parse.com/~ddunfield/museum/index.html

21 years, 2 months

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Identify this IBM box?

by pat＠computer-refuge.org

The seller (obviously) doesn't know much about it, but it appears to be a fairly large deskside IBM machine from around 1980. Link to auction: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=5185251356 Ideas, anyone? Pat -- Purdue University ITAP/RCS --- http://www.itap.purdue.edu/rcs/ The Computer Refuge --- http://computer-refuge.org

21 years, 2 months

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7201 (was Re: Z8530 (was Re: Navtel 9460 ProtocolAnalyzerinfo?))

by ajp166＠bellatlantic.net

> >Subject: Re: 7201 (was Re: Z8530 (was Re: Navtel 9460 ProtocolAnalyzerinfo?)) > From: woodelf <bfranchuk at jetnet.ab.ca> >Has anybody made a easy to use serial chip, all seem to be lacking some >feature? >The only way I like to program is I/O is 'hardware" setup ... Dip >switches and hard reset >lines. :) What you want then is a MITS SIO-B. Has a COM2502. That generation of chips trade extreme simplicity for dip switches and loads of support chips. When I build and use serial I look at a few things: Chip count < the fewer I have to wirewrap the better> Functions I want <Vs gobs of unused features> Availability (are they in my stock) Usually I end up with 8253 countertimer as BRG and 8251, or 8250. Though the 6850 is friendly enough. I also have others to pick >from like 6850, 7201, Z80SIO, 2681 and others. Allison

21 years, 2 months

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Dead AIM 65??

by andyda＠earthlink.net

> Couple of things about general AIM-lore: > > The original AIM 65 (not the AIM 65/40) had a 20 char alpha LED > display. The Aim 65/40 had a 40 character vacuum fluorescent display > and 40 character printer, much more friendly for development than the > 20 char display and printer. : I think I have heard of the AIM 65/40... if someone here knows such : things, was the motherboard re-engineered? Is it possible to retrofit : the 40-col display to the original AIM? Also, was the 40-col VFD run : by something like an HD44780 chipset, or was it some kind of raw : interface? These days, 40x1 or 40x2 VFDs based on the HD44780 are not : difficult to locate and are not all that expensive. They are also :trivial to send chars to. : -ethan The AIM 65/40 was quite different from the original AIM 65, it was really useable as a fairly powerful, though inexpensive 6502 development system. I never used one as I left consulting in 1980, but I did see one, and it appeared to be a pretty good computer. More details can be found at: http://oldcomputers.net/AIM-65-40.html which has info on the AIM 65/40 (which came in several models) and a Rockwell Design Center (which I never used) and System 65, which I did use and thought it was a very capable development system. As you can see, the AIM65/40 is a completely new board, I don't know if one could use the 40 Char display on a normal AIM 65, but I suppose you could, you would just need to write new driver software for it, maybe replace the AIM 65 ROMS with EPROMS with most of the AIM 65 OS and new drivers for the display. Could be an interesting Project, but it could compromise an otherwise vintage computer (the AIM 65) in the process. IHTH, AndyD

21 years, 2 months

1
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7201 (was Re: Z8530 (was Re: Navtel 9460 Protocol Analyzerinfo?))

by ajp166＠bellatlantic.net

>Subject: Re: 7201 (was Re: Z8530 (was Re: Navtel 9460 Protocol Analyzerinfo?)) > From: Ethan Dicks <ethan.dicks at gmail.com> >I have *hundreds* of COM5025 chips on the shelf here. Never found a >use for them. Use them to make FDC for PCs to do other formats. ;) Allison

21 years, 2 months

1
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Some said they have CDOS and Cromemco disks

by ajp166＠bellatlantic.net

> >Subject: Re: Some said they have CDOS and Cromemco disks > From: "Randy McLaughlin" <cctalk at randy482.com> >The only real issues are either differences in different soft-sectored >controllers (Western Digital based chips have some formats that the 765 >based chips can't handle but are rarely used) or the basic ability to handle >FM (as in 3740 format). The difference between 1771 and 765 are that 765 only does IBM style formats FM or MFM. As a result you only supply Cylinder, Head, Record<sector>, and N a lenth encoding. The 1771 you pump every byte required for the entier track until it times out. That difference is significant as one was designed as a IBM format controller and the other was more universal. However the 765 series chip does do FM and at all data rates. Many boards for PCs limit that by not implmenting needed peices or not supporting it in the bios. So if the 765 based controller doesnt do any of the common formats (especially FM) blame the designer of the board. Allison

21 years, 2 months

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7201 (was Re: Z8530 (was Re: Navtel 9460 Protocol Analyzer info?))

by ajp166＠bellatlantic.net

>Subject: 7201 (was Re: Z8530 (was Re: Navtel 9460 Protocol Analyzer info?)) > From: "Eric Smith" <eric at brouhaha.com> >That chip sucked when used as a plain old UART. In order to handle slight >speed mismatches between two modems emplying synchronous modulation, ;-) It was nearly a full clone of the Z80 SIO with one difference, the interrupt logic matched the 8085/8086 rather than Z80. As a simple SIO it was a major pita to use, too dang many registers. As a result I ahve a bunch of them and never use them. Ise the 2681, 8251 or 8250 before that beastie. The only thing worse to design with and use was the COM2501, dumb as a stump. Allison

21 years, 2 months

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OT: Prank paper accepted for computer comference

by r_a_feldman＠hotmail.com

This is OT, but computer related. A computer-generated nonsense paper was accepted for presentation at the World Multiconference on Systemics, Cybernetics and Informatics (WMSCI). The story is at: http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/americas/4449651.stm and the paper can be read at: http://www.pdos.lcs.mit.edu/scigen/rooter.pdf Bob

21 years, 2 months

3
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OS Challenger Video?

by Watzman＠neo.rr.com

Re: "Can the Challenger drive a compostite video monitor directly or is it only designed to drive an RF modulator?" Since the input to a modulator is a composite video signal, the answer is that both of your "or" options are the same thing. However, some of the OSI video cards were 5-signal outputs (red, blue, green, H sync, V sync) which, in terms of your question, would be "neither". It's not difficult, however, to mix the two sync signals with one of the video signals and then drive a monochrome monitor or a modulator.

21 years, 2 months

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CP/M-80 Kermit source, in TDL/Xitan Z80 mnemonics, anyone?

by tomj＠wps.com

I know this is a long shot, but does anyone have a Kermit assembler source for the Phoenix Software Associates PASM assembler? I'm lazy, and trying to avoid lots of tedious editing to convert from some other version. Or a BDS C version?

21 years, 2 months

1
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Some said they have CDOS and Cromemco disks

by Watzman＠neo.rr.com

I put a bios and boot code up on Howard Harte's site some time ago. This was source code for CP/M 2.2 (and it's in 8080 MAC/ASM assembler). If you have a working system, it's not too difficult to get this running. Again, the source code can be downloaded from Howard's site. As it exists, it's configured for 8". Should not be difficult to modify for 5.25". It works, I'm actually running it on a 16FDC (I believe that it will work on a 4FDC also).

21 years, 2 months

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