If memory serves:
EBCDIC = Extended Binary Coded Decimal Interchange Code
IBM mainframes (360, 370, etc) are the only machines I've seen that used it.
bw
----------
From: Sam Ismail
Sent: Tuesday, June 17, 1997 2:41 AM
To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers
Subject: EBCDIC
DOes anyone have a computer which uses the EBCDIC character set, rather
than ASCII (did I get the acronym right? what does it stand for anyway)?
Just curious.
Sam
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Computer Historian, Programmer, Musician, Philosopher, Athlete, Writer, Jackass
The Victor 9000 sounds like a machine sold in Australia and perhaps Europe
as the ACT Sirius and coexisted for a time with the IBM PC because of a
shortage of the latter. Chuck Peddle (spelling?) was the originator of the
Sirius.
The ACT company I think was British and later changed it's name to Apricot.
Or am I completely on the wrong track?
----------
> From: Uncle Roger <sinasohn(a)crl.com>
> To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers
<classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu>
> Subject: Re: Victor 9000
> Date: Tuesday, June 17, 1997 10:45 AM
>
> At 11:50 PM 6/15/97 -0400, you wrote:
> >So what exactly is a Victor 9000???
> >Just another PC clone?
>
> Not a clone, but similar. Max RAM was 768K, came with a Floppy Drive as
> standard (IIRC). Was the first computer to use variable speed disk
drives
> (as the early Mac's did as well.) Ran an early version of MS-DOS, I
think.
>
> Pong is not the first video game. Nolan Bushnell, who later founded
> Atari, did Pong. Several years before Pong, Nolan created a more
> sophisticated game called Computer Space, built by Nutting and
> Associates.
>
> Computer Space was the first arcade video game.
> Atari home Pong was the first home video game.
> Magnavox Odyssey1 was the first home video game system.
>
> Trust me, I own all of them.
>
> Kai
>
I just pulled out the Pong and manual. I suppose I don't have the
original pong anyway.
Super Pong, Model No. C-140 (1976). It has four different pong games
(labelled differently in the manual and on the box).
So when did the original Pong make its appearance.
Marc
Okay, enough hardware, it's time for a software trade list!
Software wanted:
- Apple DOS 3.3
- Apricot F2 DOS
- Cromemco CP/M on 8" for System 3
- Microsoft Adventure (floppy for TRS-80, Apple II or PC)
- Ithaca InterSystems CP/M, any format
- TI 99/4a Disk Manager II cartridge
- Apple /// Apple II Emulator Diskette
- /// EZ Pieces
- Anything for Spectravideo SV-3x8
Software for trade (all freely distributable to the best of my
knowledge; let me know if you know otherwise):
- Atari DOS 2.0a on 5.25"
- Atari DOS 2.5 on 5.25"
- Kaypro II CP/M, WordStar, FileStar, SpellStar on 5.25"
- Kaypro 10 CP/M (can make diskette from HD if needed)
- North Star NSDOS 2.0 on 5.25"
- Jade CP/M 2.2 on 8"
- Computer Chef on 8"
- Infocom "Suspended" and "Starcrossed" on 8" (these work on an 8080
just fine)
- Osborne CP/M on 5.25"
- Macintosh System 1.0 (yes, Apple has posted this)
- TRS-80 Model 100 floppy drive support diskette
Also, while we're talking diskettes, does anyone have a MicroSolutions
CompatiCard or a Copy II Option Board they'd be willing to sell?
thanks
Kai
Meant to mention this earlier, but over the weekend I also picked up an
Exidy (Sorcerer) dual disk drive chassis (no drives, just the power
supply circuitry) for a dollar. I was amazed to find it. I know little
to nothing about this system, although thanks to Larry Anderson I have
one that is totally hacked up with a funky power-supply that replaced the
original (sticking about 2 inches out the back with wierd cords I have no
idea how to connect) and some interesting mods inside which seem an
attempt to double its memory. Any insights on this system? It's fairly
obscure.
I was told Exidy used standard PC-type full-height 5.25 drives. Anyone
know more about this? Or perhaps know where I can get an interface card
for the beast?
Sam
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Computer Historian, Programmer, Musician, Philosopher, Athlete, Writer, Jackass
RE: Marvin <marvin(a)rain.org>
>Subject: Re: Printers and Finds of the Week
>I am not familiar with the "SuperPET"; where does it fit in with the
>rest of the Commodore line? It sounds like you also had a pretty good
>"haul" this weekend!
The SuperPET was developed by Waterloo University in Ontario, Canada and
was released by Commodore sometime around 1980/81. I read a press
release where the CBM 8096 (a close pre-cursor to the SuperPET) and
VIC-20 were being introduced. It was also referred to as the Commodore
SP9000 and Micro-Mainframe.
The SuperPET was (I'm pretty sure) the last of the PET/CBM series.
After that, in 1982, almost the entire Commodore line was re-vamped
with: the Ultimax, C-64, B-128 series, and P-128/P-500 models.
What the "PET Personal Computer Guide" Says about the SuperPET:
It was designed around the CBM 8032 but boasted a 64k bank-switched RAM
expansion and a 6809 co-processor which could emulate a 16 bit
computer. In order to be truly compatible with IBM the OS had been
retooled to use standard ASCII throughout, it also has a true RS-232
port.
It has a 'Highly flexible terminal mode,' 'highly advanced text editor,'
and 'run time monitor.' Among its more remarkable features is its
ability to trace and repair most errors without losing the current
program or its variables. Another virtue is its ability to send any
program or data to another computer at any time in any language. The
standard languages are IBM-compatible APL (including a complete APL
character set), Waterloo BASIC, COBOL, FORTRAN, and Pascal. All
languages are stored on disk (which I don't have any of *sigh*) until
used. And at the printing of the book the languages worked as
interpreters. Waterloo planned to have compiled versions available for
the SuperPET in the future. Another language is included is 6809
assembly language. SuperPET comes with an assembler, linker, and
loader.
--------------------------------
Many of the features of the SuperPET can be seen in later Commodore
units such as the B-128 and C-128 series (bank switched memory
co-processors, etc.)
Browsing the Web I have found some mentions of them, but many were no
more than that. So far it seems one or two may have more than just the
unit. I hope to get email soon from one person I wrote for info to.
DOes anyone have a computer which uses the EBCDIC character set, rather
than ASCII (did I get the acronym right? what does it stand for anyway)?
Just curious.
Sam
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Computer Historian, Programmer, Musician, Philosopher, Athlete, Writer, Jackass
> Not a clone, but similar. Max RAM was 768K, came with a Floppy Drive as
> standard (IIRC). Was the first computer to use variable speed disk drive
> (as the early Mac's did as well.) Ran an early version of MS-DOS, I think
>
> And, IIRC, it pre-dated the IBM PC.
Ok, some herstory. There were many machines that ran CP/M-86 before in IBM
PC, one in particular was the Seattle Computer co, running Q-dos which after
a deal with MS would be come MSDOS-1.0 aka PCdos to run on the first PC.
I was running a 8086 system in 1980 that clearly blow the doors off a PC.
It was 8086 not 8088 at 5.0mhz and 16bit wide memory using standard
multibuss cards. By late 81 that machine was 8mhz, and 82 brought a copy of
PC dos to it. Early MSdos could be configured like CP/M. The PC was slow,
clunky, closed and expensive! By time the XT arrived still slow, clunky and
expensive there are several S100 and other systems that were very fast
6/8/10 mhz 8088 or 8086 systems.
At 03:49 PM 6/15/97 -0700, you wrote:
>1979? The Victor 9000 came out in 1985/86 according to previous
>discussions. Indeed it would have been the "technological cutting edge"
>in 1979, and for quite some time as it would have pre-dated the computer
>it was supposed to be semi-compatible with.
My (admittedly faulty) memory puts the Victor 9000 pre-IBM. I remember my
parents considering purchasing one, and being horrified at the specs on the
IBM PC when it came out. I couldn't understand why anyone would buy one
when they could have the Victor 9000 instead.
Maybe I should check some of the docs I've got and see what they say.
--------------------------------------------------------------------- O-
Uncle Roger "There is pleasure pure in being mad
sinasohn(a)crl.com that none but madmen know."
Roger Louis Sinasohn & Associates
San Francisco, California http://www.crl.com/~sinasohn/
Was the Aquarius II compatible with the old Aquarius programs?
Can anyone give me a lead on an Aquarius II?
--
Andy Brobston brobstona(a)wartburg.edu ***NEW URL BELOW***
http://www.wartburg.edu/people/docs/personalPages/BrobstonA/home.html
My opinions do not necessarily reflect the opinions of Wartburg College
as a whole.
I finally got a chance to play with my Osborne 1 and must say it is a
nice little system. For its time it was a great product. The software
is very user-friendly and overall the system runs quite nicely. The disk
drives are rather fast. I was making backups of my system disks and it
reads almost 5 tracks per second (but writes at about a rate of 5 seconds
per track).
Hey, my Osborne 1 has serial number A01284. Can anyone beat that?
Sam
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Computer Historian, Programmer, Musician, Philosopher, Athlete, Writer, Jackass
I found these while looking for the docs for my SWTP CT1024 terminal board
that I'm resurecting (it works)
These are available for sale or trade:
SWTP PR40 schematic and wiring drawing (D size sheet two sided)
SWTP MP-S serial interface (SS50, 6800) assembly, schematic
and board views.
Ohiso Scientific sams photofact service manual complete for:
Superboard-II
Model C1P
Model C1PMF
Allison
Well, not a bad weekend for Apple stuff. I visited two swap meets and a
dozen thrifts, and came up with the following stuff (the weird thing is,
all of my traditional good spots were dry, and all the dry ones had good
stuff -- and not only that, these systems weren't complete but instead
all the parts came from different locations!)
- An Apple II
- An Apple II with RAM expansion card, Grappler card, 80 column card
- An Apple /// with ProFile hard disk, second floppy and Monitor ///
- An Apple ///+ with ProFile hard disk, second floppy, serial card, and
a "///+//" Apple II emulation card (!)
- Another ProFile hard disk (that makes 3!)
- Apple /// JOYSTICK !!!!! (egads)
- Two Apple II series joysticks
- Apple II series game paddle set
Plus:
- Three Central Point Copy II Option Boards (copy Apple, Mac, TRS-80,
CP/M formats on PCs)
- Two 8-bit Plus Hard Card 20's
- Silicon Valley ADP50 (run IDE hard drives in an IBM PC)
Kai
Ok, the weekend's not even over, and here's how I did:
101 Online - A neat little terminal with a 9" screen. The keyboard
covers the screen and flips down with the push of a button. It has a
built-in 4800bps modem. It was used to connect to some online service in
California at some time or another. The whole thing is in this cute
10"x10"x10" package - $5
Laser 50 with manuals - $4 (Hi Bill!)
Commodore 64, Commodore 64C (two of 'em, one seems to be this weird clone
since the plastic looks different from the other one and it has no
markings), two 1541 drives, two Star NX-1000C dot matrix printers - All free
Data General One (Model 2) laptop. Two questions: How did the model 2
differ from the model 1? And I didn't get a power supply with this, but
was told by a couple people all it requires is a special three-prong
power cord. The receptacle is an oval with three conductors. Anyone
know about this? - $15
2 Commodore 1541 drives, 2 Commodore 1571 drives - $8
DEC Rainbow 100 with all the trimmings (extra cards, all software and
manuals) - $10
VIC-20 Modem - $1
Commodore 64 user's guide, VIC-20 User's Guide - $1
(the guy I bought this stuff from claims to have 7 PDP-11s and "several"
PDP-8s that he's been hording. Needless to say I threatened him with
great bodily harm if he didn't give me some. We agreed to meet to discuss
the "free taking" of one of each system. He also has lots of other DEC
stuff for sale and for give-away to those who would give it good homes. I
will keep us posted on any late-breaking developments. He also said he
has a Cyber hard drive unit which sounds like the size of a dishwasher as
he described it. I think the model number was 690s or something. I know
I'm way off. If anyone wants this its in California. Apparently he has
tons of mostly DEC stuff he's been collecting from local colleges and
universtities. Again, I'll keep us posted).
And let's see, oh yeah, I'm not done!
ZX-81 with manuals/power supply and...
Victor 9000 and...
IMSAI 8080!
IMSAI MPU-A (Rev 4) 8080A CPU card
IMSAI SIO (Rev 3) Serial card
DCHayes Modem (I am assuming 300baud...S100!)
Disk Jockey 2D/B 8" drive card (and some 8" drive...I forget the
manufacturer)
(4) Digital Research Company Memory Boards (I think each one is 16K)
All manuals/schematics/notes plus some extra IMSAI fron panel overlays
All this from the original owner for $100. What a bargain.
Ok, this guy is cool. First of all, to you guys complaining that you
never get anything good, here's the message I posted on my local forsale
newsgroup which brought about this acquisition:
---BEGIN USENET MESSAGE---
> First edition K&R
I ahve stapled version with bell labs technical report #31 "the C
programming language" by D.M. Richie, and M.E. lesk. october 1975
it has hand scribbles re: tiny C as it was part of communication with
Jon Gibson.
Got it back around 79 while visiting Bell labs homdel on a business call.
No offers acepted as it's my working copy for C and my bible!
Allison
Thought this may be of interest to some of you. His email address should be
Mikeooo1(a)aol.com
Lou
Subj: Aim 65 single board micro
Date: 97-06-16 16:20:52 EDT
From: Mikeooo1
I have several Aim 65's in new condition,a hot item in the 80's it was the
precursor to the pc.Features a single board microprocessor complete with
display,printer,keyboard,power supply,with a 6502 cpu.Fully functional but
also a nice collector's item.
(Embedded
image moved dastar @ crl.com
to file: 06/15/97 03:49 PM
PIC18303.PCX)
Please respond to classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu
To: classiccmp @ u.washington.edu
cc: (bcc: Clark Geisler/NORTEL-NSM)
Subject: Re: Victor 9000
Sam wrote:
>1979? The Victor 9000 came out in 1985/86 according to previous
>discussions. Indeed it would have been the "technological cutting edge"
>in 1979, and for quite some time as it would have pre-dated the computer
>it was supposed to be semi-compatible with.
I recall seeing Victor 9000's newly installed in a computer lab at the
University of British Columbia in 1983.
(Embedded
image moved ard12 @ eng.cam.ac.uk
to file: 06/15/97 02:14 PM
PIC24988.PCX)
Please respond to classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu
To: classiccmp @ u.washington.edu
cc: (bcc: Clark Geisler/NORTEL-NSM)
Subject: Re: Terak 8510a
>Talking of obscure PDP11-related machines, has anyone else ever come
>across the Tektronix 8530 etc systems. These machines were sold as micro
>development systems and lived in 2 racks - one contained an LSI11 (or
>PDP11/23) CPU card + RAM + disk controller + I/O + drives (either a couple
>of 8" floppies or one floppy and a Micropolis 1200 hard disk), while the
>other contained the development options -- in-circuit emulators, logic
>analyser, EPROM programmer, etc. They ran either a much-hacked RT11 or a
>much-hacked Unix.
This sounds a lot like a system I saw installed new at my alma mater
(University of British Columbia) my graduation year (1983). It was a
Tektronix
development system with LSI11 CPU running UNIX. There were a number
of terminals attached, and it was used to teach computer process control
concepts to non-computer eng. types. I remember seeing various pumps and
tanks connected to it.
I never used it seriously myself, but just logged on to play with it: this
was the
first Unix system I had seen. I wasn't very impressed with it at the time:
whenever I used the 'man' program, the pages would just scroll up the
screen
(no pause), then it cleared the screen, leaving the prompt.
Clark Geisler
'just have an Amiga 1000 and a VAX 11/730'
I'm so excited...this is my first post to this great group.
In 1981 I left NCR to work for Victor (Canada) Limited to organize a tech
support team and assist a calculator saleforce become successful sellers of
microcomputers - namely the Victor 9000 or Vickie as it came to be called.
The Victor 9000 came out in 1982. It was produced by a company called Sirius
Computer Corp. Mr. Chuck Peddle designed the 9000 and ran Sirius. Peddle had
preivously worked for Commodre and designed the PET. By golly, before that
he worked on the 6502 chip (the CPU in early Apples).
Now here's more corporate geneology stuff. Victor used to be called Victor
Comptometer. It was owned by the Victor family of Chicago and was bought-out
by the Kidde Corp a conglomerate. Kidde also invested in Sirius.
The 9000 was a machine designed for people. It came with a non-glare
monochrome monitor on a tilt and swivel-base - hey we're talking 1981 here!
It had an ergonomically-considerate keyboard, small footprint, and oh yah,
it had a voice chip on the motherboard. The last step of POST (power-on,
self-test) was the 9000 telling you "Hello, I am a Victor 9000." I get a
kick out of listening to the Comdex 1990 keynote speech by Bill Gates (the
one when he announced the Information at Your Fingertips campaign), because
he declared that someday computers will have voice-digitization on the
motherboard. Did you hear that Chuck?
Unforunately the 9000 didn't last long. Sirius had grand plans to become the
next IBM, they absorbed Victor, sold lots of machines (a single order of
4000 to Ford Motors), then promptly went bankrupt. Victor Canada was closed
down in the mid-1980s.
The 9000 came in two cases. Early (first) models housed the processor in a
rectangular case. Later models used a niffty angular case. I don't know if
voice digitization made it into the angular case.
My 9000 occupies a place in my subcollection of Unique Systems - systems
that were, well let's say they were ahead of their times. Other machines
here include the Lisa, Workslate, Hyperion, Star, Apple III, DG/One, etc.
Hope this helps you, I know it sure was fun for me.
Yours in good faith.
>Hello!
>
>I have a Victor 9000, cheap to good home. The technological cutting edge in
>1979, it has a keyboard that includes a 1/2 and 1/4 key, a wonderfully
>massive dot matrix printer, and a version of Wordstar that is truly hideous.
> Plus other software. The thing seems to run on DOS 1.25. It has been in my
>garage for years, and I hate to see such a monstrosity go without victims.
> Is there someone out there who would like to have it? Please respond to
>MoeHoward1(a)aol.com or David.Stevens(a)pgw.com.
>
>
At 06:21 AM 6/16/97 +0000, you wrote:
>Aaaah! That's more like it! What I meant was the home video game
>console. Now back to the original question: does anybody know where I
>can get a photo of it or at least a description). Thank you
>
>enrico
Enrico,
Try this site. It has a picture of an atari pong machine:
http://members.aol.com/cvendel/vaporware.html
Hope this helps.
Isaac Davis | Don't throw out that old computer,
idavis(a)comland.com | check out the Classic Computer Rescue List -
indavis(a)juno.com | http://www.comland.com/~idavis/classic/classic.html
>
> I don't know if I have any of the Pong advertisements or not, but I most
> likely have something close. It is pretty easy to recognize as the
> cabinet was about 27" or so wide, about 30" deep, and stood somewhere
> around 6 feet high.
Pong had a monitor?!? I didn't know that.
I have Atari's Pong here which is just the console.
First video game we ever got. I plan to pull it out of retirement for
a 1970's party being planned.
Hmm, I'd like to find a pic of that 6ft beast myself.
Marc
--
>> ANIME SENSHI <<
Marc D. Williams
marcw(a)lightside.com
marc.williams(a)mb.fidonet.org
IRC Nick: Senshi Channel: #dos
http://www.agate.net/~tvdog/internet.html -- DOS Internet Tools
Doeas anybody have a photograph of "PONG" the first video game ever? Or
where I can find one? I have never seen it and I don't know how it looks
like so I will not be able to recognize it if I ever bump into one.
Thanks
enrico
--
================================================================
Enrico Tedeschi, 54, Easthill Drive, BRIGHTON BN41 2FD, U.K.
tel/fax +(0)1273 701650 (24 hours) or 0850 104725 mobile
website <http://www.ndirect.co.uk/~e.tedeschi>
================================================================
visit Brighton: <http://www.brighton.co.uk/tourist/welcome.htm>
In a message dated 97-06-12 22:38:21 EDT, marvin(a)rain.org (Marvin) wrote:
> Back when the Atari 400 was introduced, I got hooked on Space Invaders.
> I found the Atari and other Joysticks to be a complete waste when it
> came to playing Space Invaders .....
Why didn't you use the Atari paddles?
Well I'm back from the flea...
I did sell two of the COCOs and a few other odds and ends. The bulk of the
pile remains as "it wasn't VGA or PC".
Of the more interesting things I'd like to sell for nominal fee or trade:
TRS80 docs and tapes...
moto6800D1 pristine with docs
MDS800 mostly complete
The s100 memory cards, s100 crate,
Anadex DP-8000 printer working and docs.
In the process I aquired a real fine PDP11/23+ with RX02. It's excess and
has V4 and v5 DOCs and install kits along with apparently two sets of X11
diags. Also there is a MiniMINC LSI11 kit with mincBaisc. There is an
unopened (shrink intact) box of 8" media. The 11/23 is has 512k of ram 4
serial ports and a RX02 disk system that looks operational.
This is also excess... don't ask, call it a rescue.
Anyone interested let me know as I'm trying to make room for a PDP-8/e/m/f!
Allison
Oh yes! I finally own a little bit of a PDP. The Department of AI at the
university here just disposed of some of its old hardware and I ended up
with a Terak 8510a with extra floppy (8512) and monitor, keyboard (8532).
Lovely!!!
It's a really neat and fast machine. FYI, it has a four-slot backplane
with an LSI-11 board (with FPU), 28kw of MOS RAM, a brilliant framebuffer
card (640x240 text and 320x240 graphics at the same time -- the card mixes
both modes on the same screen and allows hardware panning, smooth scrolling
and other effects), Shugart floppy interface, RS-232/current loop and some
other strange card (probably for controlling some robotic device of sorts --
useful).
It came with all of its documentation (disgustingly complete, including
business reply card with `READ THIS NOW' written at the back, brochures,
reference cards, RT-11 manuals, Shugart tech ref (so you want to take apart
your Shugart 8" drive's head assembly?), etc). Also a set of original
red-and-purple(?) PDP-11 manuals for RT-11. And to top it off, there were a
few 1978-1979 DEC PDP manuals for various architectures. They're in almost
mint condition, but the paper is really showing its age. GOOD documentation,
though.
Software-wise, there are both of the common OSs for the Terak: RT-11 and
UCSD P-System/Pascal (haven't worked with this in ten years, but my fingers
still remember how to press 'F','L',':' really fast). Lots of languages,
including Logo, BASIC and Prolog (it *was* a DAI machine, you see).
The 12" monitor is rock steady and displays a clear image in P3 phosphor
(sort-of paper white) and the keyboard is refreshingly 70s with nice clunky
keys that, however, are really comfortable for touch typing once you get
used to them.
Oh yes, I also got a boxed TI-99/4A with all its manuals and a memory
expansion box, but that is probably too common for you folks in the States
and certainly too mundane in comparison to the Terak.
I'm a happy man. :-)
PS: Oh, the department has quite a nice collection of old stuff, including a
PERQ that just seemed to attract a lot of drool. They're keeping it,
though -- it's going to a real museum (not computer related, though).
All in all, I think I must have looked too much like a kiddie in a sweet
shop.
--------------------------- ,o88,o888o,,o888o. -------------------------------
Alexios Chouchoulas '88 ,88' ,88' alexios(a)vennea.demon.co.uk
The Unpronounceable One ,o88oooo88ooooo88oo, axc(a)dcs.ed.ac.uk
Hello!
I have a Victor 9000, cheap to good home. The technological cutting edge in
1979, it has a keyboard that includes a 1/2 and 1/4 key, a wonderfully
massive dot matrix printer, and a version of Wordstar that is truly hideous.
Plus other software. The thing seems to run on DOS 1.25. It has been in my
garage for years, and I hate to see such a monstrosity go without victims.
Is there someone out there who would like to have it? Please respond to
MoeHoward1(a)aol.com or David.Stevens(a)pgw.com.
Hello folks! I've received the following message from someone who needs to
find a good home for his Atari 800XL system (free):
If interested, please reply to him.
---------- Forwarded message ----------
Greetings!
I have a fully functional working 800-XL with expanded memory, a
Smith-Corona printer, a good disk drive, a good monitor, a 300-baud
modem (whoopee!), enough books and manuals to stock a small library
(currently mine), all issues but the first 12 or or of ANTIC, ANALOG,
and COMPUTE magazines, and a whole lot of disks, some directly from
magazines, some from user groups, most from listings I've typed in.
Since I've upgraded to the PC, the Atari system has become expendable,
and needs to go -- I need the room.
Realizing that, by your email, you are not a hop, skip, OR jump away
>from me, here's hoping you can put me in touch with someone who'll be
able to give my 'baby' a good home.
Thanks,
Doug Rasmussen
1233 - 167th Ave. S.E.
Bellevue, WA 98008
Phone: (425) 747-3846
Fax: (425) 644-8912
email: pptdoug(a)aa.net
----------------------------------------
--------------------------- ,o88,o888o,,o888o. -------------------------------
Alexios Chouchoulas '88 ,88' ,88' alexios(a)vennea.demon.co.uk
The Unpronounceable One ,o88oooo88ooooo88oo, axc(a)dcs.ed.ac.uk
In looking through my garage last night, I found an old (about '84
vintage) NCR I-Tower computer system. 68020 based, this particular beastie
ran a variant of Unix customized for NCR.
I would far rather have the space for DEC stuff. With that in mind, anyone
who cares to visit Kent, WA (east hill) can haul this beast away for the
asking. Worst case, the main tower has an integral UPS; you could probably
adapt such to other systems.
Drop me an E-mail if interested, or give me a call at (253) 639-9555.
Thanks in advance.
-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
Bruce Lane, Sysop, The Dragon's Cave BBS (Fidonet 1:343/272)
(Hamateur: WD6EOS) (E-mail: kyrrin(a)wizards.net)
http://www.wizards.net/technoid
"Our science can only describe an object, event, or living thing in our own
human terms. It cannot, in any way, define any of them..."
I have a question about the value of an IMSAI 8080.
Say someone had a nice, working IMSAI 8080 in decent condition. How
much, realistically, could one expect to sell this for?
Say someone had an IMSAI 8080, in pieces, the working condition being
unknown. How much, realistically, could one expect to sell this for?
Now I have a question about a Victor-9000.
Victor 9000, working...how much?
Victor 9000, bad floppy controller...how much?
Thanks!
Sam
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Computer Historian, Programmer, Musician, Philosopher, Athlete, Writer, Jackass
Well... this may not beat Sam's weekend haul, (and if he finds a
'Straight' 8 from this mysterious person I'm *really* gonna be jealous) but
I think it's significant.
A note to begin: I'm announcing this here initially as a sort of place
holder before I proceed as will be noted below. A bit of a CYA action you
might say...
--- we begin ---
I was doing some *long* overdue cleaning in the Computer Garage this
weekend, and finally located some items that I knew were there but had not
mentioned since I could not locate them. Even now, I have not located
*all* of them, but enough to make their presence known.
Somewhere between probably 5-8 years ago, I purchased some equipment,
documentation, and supplies from a sale being held by some Digital
Research, Inc. staff. Little did I know just what I was coming into.
In addition to some S-100 hardware that been used for development, I
purchased a series of disks and original DRI binders. To be specific to
what I have (re-)located so far, the binders contain complete source
listings for MP/M versions 1.1 and 2.0, and CP/M Plus version 3.0 and all
supporting utilities and programs.
If I recall correctly from when I originally received the materials, I
should also have the sources for CP/M version 2.2 and the associated disks.
(don't hold me to this until I locate the other boxes tho. B^} )
To be fair, I will be contacting Caldera on Monday and will not be
accepting requests for access to these documents until such time as I have
verified their standing with Caldera.
--- why this message? ---
Basically, so that the existance of this material is known in the unlikely
event that I should recieve an unfavourable reaction from Caldera.
I try to avoid entanglements with those in the legal profession, but past
experience has shown that a 'document trail' never hurts...
More news as it becomes available...
-jim
---
jimw(a)agora.rdrop.com
The Computer Garage - http://www.rdrop.com/~jimw
Computer Garage Fax - (503) 646-0174
Heh... I should probably have done this just after I subscribed. Oh well...
Yes, it's me. Some of you may already have at least gotten an E-mail from
me, or spoken to me on the phone. I have a whole garage full of DEC stuff,
including several MicroVAX II's, MicroPDP-11/23 and 11/73, appropriate
monster hard drives, a couple of Cipher front-loading tape units, various
parts and racks, etc.
DEC stuff is my current Big Thing, though I regret that I don't have the
space nor the power facilities to handle the full-size machines (like the
11/70 or the VAX-11 series). Still, MicroVAXen and the PDP's make for
interesting diversions.
I've been working with electronics since I was old enough to start tearing
things apart (not that I got them back together that often!), have been a
ham radio op since 1977, and working with computers on and off since 1978.
I currently work at Boeing Defense & Space group, operations, computing
support (been there since November).
I am happily married, and my mate knew darn well what she was getting into
when she married a techie. I'm not a Washington native, though I do live in
Kent at the moment (I think of myself as an 'unrepentant Californian'). For
those that are curious beyond this post, I invite you to have a look at
http://www.wizards.net/technoid.
Among other things, I have a listing of both Washington and California
electronics-oriented swap meets and surplus stores on the link 'The
Wonderful World of Scrounging.' I gladly invite corrections and updates to
said list!
Let's see, what else...? I try to make at least two trips a year to the
Bay Area for scrounging purposes (Sam? Want to get together sometime and
introduce me to some of the other local collectors?<g>), and to meet up
with a friend of mine in San Jose who shares my interests. We've often done
selling or buying trips to the Bay Area swap meets together, having known
each other since about 1980.
That's about all I can think of at the moment. Caveat emptor!
-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
Bruce Lane, Sysop, The Dragon's Cave BBS (Fidonet 1:343/272)
(Hamateur: WD6EOS) (E-mail: kyrrin(a)wizards.net)
http://www.wizards.net/technoid
"Our science can only describe an object, event, or living thing in our own
human terms. It cannot, in any way, define any of them..."
Hi guys, my collection is still on the small side (25 or so) and lately
I've just been trying to cover "all the bases." I'm mainly interested in
80's micros (since that's what I grew up with) and have a few holes to
fill. OK, enough filler, here's what I need:
- I *still* don't have an Atari!
- I'd like a MSX machine as well (never even seen one in anything other
than magazine articles)
- and maybe a Timex just for the hell of it.
If anyone has any duplicates that they'd like to sell/trade etc. than
PLEASE let me know! I live in the (relatively) Philadelphia area.
BTW, someone on this mailing list mentioned that they needed the TI Speech
box. If by this you mean the Speech Synthesizer that plugged into the
side than I have 2 (and only 1 TI) so....
However, if you mean the Terminal Emulator II cartridge than, sorry, I
only have 1 of those! :(
Les
more(a)crazy.rutgers.edu
With the current thread on Osborne's machines (he was a great writer
about computer concepts, a fair engineer, and a _lousy_ businessman --
level of incompetence at work ala the Peter Principle), I realise that
besides Kaypro, there is another line of pre-laptops I'm interested in.
If anybody gets a line on an available Otrona CP/M system, I am very
interested. I thought it was the prettiest luggable around, even though I
continue very loyal to my TRS-80 4P. What ever happened to Otrona,
anyway? Did they get absorbed by Olivetti and forced to make pathetic PC
semi-compatibles for AT&T? (The Olivetti/AT&T PC 6300 had a video
connector that carried 70vdc to the monitor from a connector that looked
like a PC parallel port [female DB-25] until a customer mistook which
connector was which, I thought that _nothing_ could kill a TRS-80 Daisy
Wheel Printer II -- the aroma of semiconductors reverting to rocks in both
printer and CPU demonstrated that something indeed could).
--
Ward Griffiths
"America is at that awkward stage. It's too late to work within
the system, but too early to shoot the bastards." --Claire Wolfe
Here's a message I recieved last year after the aquisition of my Osborne
Executive that I thought some of you might find interesting:
*** Forwarded message, originally written by Arthur N. Borg on 14-Aug-96 ***
Dear Jeff,
At the time that the Osbourne was being designed, I worked for the company
that made the display. I remember clearly asking one of the Osbourne engineers
what
he thought about the IBM PC that had recently been introduced. He said, that
computer has a color display, It is just a toy or video game. Ours is a
business
computer.
The Osbourne executive ran CP/M 3.0 as the operating system. If you have an
operating system disk and a format and modem disk. You should have access to
everything that you need. Walnut Creek has a CD-ROM with more CP/M material
than
you could imagine.
I (think) that I have a set of manuals but I also (think) that they are in
storage in the United States. One caveat. In the manual there is a drawing
showing
how to connect the parallel port to a Centronics printer. The drawing is
totally
incorrect. I spent a week re-wiring the dongle so that the printer would work.
The
Osbourne Executive has two unusual features. First, the printer port is alsso
a
bi-directional IEE-488 interface and so the machine could control and monitor
lab
equipment and so on. Also, the type face is loaded into ram at start up and
so, you
can devise your own type face or use Greek or whatever.
We also made some of the displays for the Osbourne 1 and having a 63
character display was very limiting. Fitting 80 characters on a 7 inch display
was
not easy. You will note if you have a full screen of characters, as you turn
the
machine around, the earth's magnetic field tends to make the outer characters
slip
out of view. Osbourne was roundly condemned for announcing this machine too
early
and killing sales for the Osbourne 1 and thus killing the company. I think
that
this is a harsh judgement. This was the time that FCC radiation rules were
just
getting started and everyone was having a hard time meeting them. In plain
fact, I
think that they didn't realize how big a task they had to pass this test. I
saw
some figures after the company died. There was no week that they were in
business
that the company had a positive cash flow. You could see from the curves that
somewhere out in the future, they would have a positive cash flow. I think
that the
investors just felt that there was too much going for IBM and pulled the plug
on
Osbourne.
Best regards,
Art Borg
***End of forwarded message
Jeff jeffh(a)unix.aardvarkol.com
--
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Amiga enthusiast and collector of early, classic microcomputers
> On Wed, 11 Jun 1997, Marvin wrote:
>
> > Along the lines of saving stuff, does anyone collect the old printers?
A topic I've given a lot of thought. The original MX-80 and the Paper Tiger
immediately spring to mind as classic printers worthy of incorporating into a
museum but I can't think of much else I'd have to own (aside from maybe an
original laserjet). Given the space limitations that most of us have
collecting printers in the manner that we collect computers is impractical.
But if you are inclined to collect them they are certainly plentiful and
cheap.
Lou
> I bought a TI-99/4A for $2, in its original box. As far as I can tell,
> it's a complete system, but there's no software. All of you have one
> of these machines, right? :)
If I remember it didn't come with software other than the embedded basic.
Allison
Tomorrow I will be at the MIT flea market. I have to thin my excesses.
Of interest will be:
memory and some other parts in tubes with old (pre81) date codes. Stuff
like TMS4060, upd411, upd410, 2012...
Motorola 6800D1 board, with docs and extras.
Some s100 boards SEALS, IMS and PT 8k 2102 memory and others. Some Altair
memory S4k and 88-4MCD, altair front pannel logic and 8080 cpu. Many with
docs available. DUAL inc, 68k s100 cpu. compupro s100 motherboard.
S100 box, industrial strength.
Some extra CPM docs and misc books.
Intel MDS800 nearly complete, no disks. I have a non intel multibus disk
controller for it.
Silver reed LQP, complete with docs, daisy wheels, ribbons. Working.
Anadex printer working, with docs. Both serial and parallel.
2 cocos condition unknown.
MISC qbus PDP11 modules including some core planes(operational!). A couple
of BDV11va. Wire wrap modules. H962 diode rom boot board with docs.
Assortment of power supplies. Very complete TRS80 DOCS, CPU, EI, tapes
extras. Including some z80 and trs-80 books.
Floppy drives, St506 drives, external single floppy boxes (al la TRS80).
Fans for use in s100 or other boxes.
Allison
I decided to go to garage sales this morning.
I passed up an IBM 5150 with some sort of monitor for $15 or offer. It
had a single 5.25" drive. I suspect it had been picked over for parts,
since there was another PC there for sale, and the seller said that he
"wanted to upgrade the other PC's memory with chips from this one." I
didn't really want the machine, and I didn't figure it would be worth
shipping.
I bought a TI-99/4A for $2, in its original box. As far as I can tell,
it's a complete system, but there's no software. All of you have one
of these machines, right? :)
--
Andy Brobston brobstona(a)wartburg.edu ***NEW URL BELOW***
http://www.wartburg.edu/people/docs/personalPages/BrobstonA/home.html
My opinions do not necessarily reflect the opinions of Wartburg College
as a whole.
>I had a good weekend. This is what I got:
[snip]
>All for $50. It was at our local Science center, so I decided to be
>generous with my offers. They keep all procedes. Any offers for
>trades/for sale welcome. Any pointers to info on the softcard?
Ain't kidding you had a good weekend!
--
Andy Brobston brobstona(a)wartburg.edu ***NEW URL BELOW***
http://www.wartburg.edu/people/docs/personalPages/BrobstonA/home.html
My opinions do not necessarily reflect the opinions of Wartburg College
as a whole.
At 10:29 AM 6/13/97 -0700, you wrote:
>On Fri, 13 Jun 1997, Ward Griffiths and/or Lisa Rogers wrote:
>
>> Wish I had my old MX-80 with the bootleg Graftrax ROM.
>
>I'm just curious, but what's special about the MX-80?
Well... to my mind the thing that made the MX-80 somewhat revolutionary for
its time was the user replacable print head that initially retailed for
about $35.00. Compared against other printers of the time which required a
trip to the shop and an average of $200.00 in repairs for a filed head, I
think it deserves its place of recognition.
-jim
---
jimw(a)agora.rdrop.com
The Computer Garage - http://www.rdrop.com/~jimw
Computer Garage Fax - (503) 646-0174
I frequent two thrift stores in the same town on a regular basis and the
prices, while higher than what you folks on the west cost are used to, were
reasonable. However three weeks ago they started getting in a lot of PC
equipment and the prices on it were ridiculous i.e $70 for a Packard Bell XT
clone with a monochrome monitor and $50 for an IBM 5150 PC with monitor.
While I was amused I wasn't really concerned since I have little interest in
this type of gear.
Now however the madness has infected the old 8 bit equipment. Some examples.
Apple IIc with monitor, 5 1/4" and 3 1/2" external drives $75. Not too bad
you say. Well then how about a C-64 with a 1571 disk drive and power supplies
for $80? The killer was a Coco 1 with manuals for $99 dollars.
Three weeks ago the C-64 and the Coco would have been $12 each and the 1571
about $15. I assume that they have someone new pricing this equipment but I
can't for the life of me figure out the rationale behind these prices.
Needless to say they're not moving much equipment.
Sorry for the rant but I just had to let it out. I did complain to the
cashier who said (sincerely I believe) that she would inform the manager .
Lou
I had a good weekend. This is what I got:
2 UNOPENED boxes of QuickFile II for Apple II
1 Pinpoint Software for Apple II
1 Set of manuals for IBM PC AT
2 Sets of manuals for WordPerfect (In box like PC AT manuals)
1 TI 59 Calculator with printer
1 Apple IIE computer
1 Microsoft Softcard
1 Super Serial II card
4 Disk II drives
2 Diks II interfaces
1 Numeric pad for IIe
1 Apple II Parallel card (By apple)
1 Amiga Monitor, the nice RGB/Composite monitor, Mono
1 Kodac Diconix 150+ printer for Mac
All for $50. It was at our local Science center, so I decided to be
generous with my offers. They keep all procedes. Any offers for
trades/for sale welcome. Any pointers to info on the softcard?
Josh M. Nutzman
+----------------------------------------------+
|"Life is like a river, you go with the flow...|
| but in the end you usually end up dammed." |
| -The Red Green Show |
+----------------------------------------------+
> I frequent two thrift stores in the same town on a regular basis and the
> prices, while higher than what you folks on the west cost are used to, were
> reasonable. However three weeks ago they started getting in a lot of PC
> equipment and the prices on it were ridiculous i.e $70 for a Packard Bell XT
> clone with a monochrome monitor and $50 for an IBM 5150 PC with monitor.
> While I was amused I wasn't really concerned since I have little interest in
> this type of gear.
Could be worse. The University of Utah Property Redistribution Center
seems to have a very odd idea of pricing. One day I went in and saw a
teletype marked $300. Walked out with an HP 9100B calculator for $10.
Somebody there seems to know _some_ things are collectable but has no
idea exactly _what_.
Last time I visited, though, it was all boring PC stuff...
Roger Ivie
ivie(a)cc.usu.edu
> repairs. I like mine because it has serial inputs - something that's
> getting increasingly hard to find on 99% of the printers in production.
the venerable LA120! It was the last of the printers that could punch 8part
carbon forms. The more common la100RO or LA210 serial and quite solid. I'm
still running a LA100RO I bought new in 84 wide platten and rugged with fair
near letter quality.
other serial printers from DEC:
LA34, LA36, LA38, LA12 corrospondent, LA50, LA75, LN01 with serial option
(that was a 12ppm xerox laser). To mention a few.
Allison
>
> Well... to my mind the thing that made the MX-80 somewhat revolutionary fo
> its time was the user replacable print head that initially retailed for
> about $35.00. Compared against other printers of the time which required
while significant there were other things of note.
It was low cost but not cheap.
It was widely sold.
Many other vendors copied it, it was a defacto standard in itself.
I represented a step up over many printers at twice the cost.
Later version were based on it.
Allison
> (If you aren't aware - it is a dual processor 8080 (CP/M) and 8086 (CP/M
> 86 or MS-DOS) computer with 2 5.25" floppies). I used to have one that
> belonged to work... it is kinda cool.
No that's z80 and 8088 cpus running cpm80/86. Amoung other things it would
take up to 896k of ram, color adaptor and a hard disk.
Allison
Earl's down here (a liquidation place) has a DEC Rainbow for sale. I
don't exactly remember what they want for it, but i remember thinking it
was ridiculous (probably the better half of 100 bills, maybe more).
However, if anybody wants this particular curio, I will be glad to trot
down there and grab it for you.
(If you aren't aware - it is a dual processor 8080 (CP/M) and 8086 (CP/M
86 or MS-DOS) computer with 2 5.25" floppies). I used to have one that
belonged to work... it is kinda cool.
-mark
Im still looking for a plain Apple][, and an Apple//e platinum, the one
with the numeric keypad on the side, please check if they have any of
either of these, as I need them for my collection.
----------
> From: Marvin <marvin(a)rain.org>
> To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers
<classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu>
> Subject: Classic Computers to Save?
> Date: Friday, June 13, 1997 1:33 PM
>
> I just got back from checking out several places here in Sanata Barbara
> where machines are being sold.
>
> First, there are a number of SpectraGraphics DS1080 machines along with
> some good size terminals, keyboards, etc. I am not familiar with the
> units but the guy indicated this was a workstation assembly. If anyone
> is interested, let me know and I'll get back to him. I *think* there
> were about four of the DS1080 machines, at least a couple large monitors
> (19" or so RGB I think), some keyboards, perhaps some type of digitizing
> pad (not sure about this), and I didn't see any docs or software with
> it. He indicated he would be quite happy with $100 for the lot. My
> guess is that the lot weighs probably about 300 pounds or so. He
> indicated this was used as a CAD system.
>
> Second, there is an NCR PC-8 Xenix machine with some software, monitor,
> and several keyboards. I might end up trying to get it since I don't
> have one in the collection but if someone else is interested, let me
> know. My guess is that the lot weighs in at about 100 pounds or so.
> While I forgot to ask the price on this, he would most likely be more
> than happy with $30 - $50 for the lot.
>
> Thirdly, he had three or four Apple IIC's along with a bit of
> documentation, one of the Imagewriters, and perhaps some a little bit of
> other stuff I missed. Total weight is probably about 50 - 75 pounds,
> and he would take $20 each or probably $40 - $50 for the lot. Each of
> the first three Apples had either one or two external floppy disk drives
> with them.
>
> Finally, I went over to a local rummage sale and there was a bunch of
> Commodore stuff primarily C64s, documentation, some Apple docs, and some
> printers. This will be over this afternoon about 3PM PST so I will show
> up about 2:30 to see what I can haul away :). I will most likely just
> pick it up what is left just to save it from the dumpster but most of
> what I saw, I already have. Total weight was probably about 100 pounds
> including documentation. I did pick up the some of the docs and there
> are duplicate Apple II and IIe manuals.
>
> The first three items may or may not be sold this weekend to someone
> from Los Angeles. However, being here does give me an advantage :), so
> if anyone is interested in anything here, let me know!
