- test-drb@ccmp.vtda.org - classiccmp.org

by rcini＠msn.com

Allison: >>the mod was to bring out ras* cas* and MUX* with terminating resistors at one or both ends. These signals went through the EI cable but timing was critical at best. the later EIs derived cas* and mux* off of ras* inside rather than pipe them over. Generally speaking the mod was one where if it was mostly working it MIGHT help, sometimes it made it worse. There was another mod after that called the buffered EI cable...not a good idea either. Fixing the EI was the solution.<< One of the two units that I have has the mod and the other doesn't. The one without came with the buffered EI cable, so what you said makes sense. Thanks for the info; now I can trace the mod on the new schematics. ------------------------ Rich Cini/WUGNET - ClubWin Charter Member (6) - MCPS Windows 95/Networking

28 years, 9 months

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Datamaster troubles

by rcini＠msn.com

Philip: Thanks for the error codes. I have no manuals for the Datamaster, so I'm flying blind. The code "09" is inverse-blinking, so there is a real problem. I'll try to pull the chips and re-seat them. The machine worked last summer and wasn't used since then, so I can't imagine the chip going like that. Thanks again for the help. I'll let you know what I find. My company has a UK office (Burdale-Holdings, a trade finance company). If I do need a new chip, maybe we could arrange it so that you could drop it off at our London office (if you're near it) and they could send it to me. ------------------------ Rich Cini/WUGNET - ClubWin Charter Member (6) - MCPS Windows 95/Networking Date: Tue, 15 Jul 97 09:05:06 BST From: Philip.Belben(a)powertech.co.uk To: classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu Subject: Re: Datamaster troubles Message-ID: <9706158689.AA868982856(a)compsci.powertech.co.uk> Rich Cini wrote: > Well, I'm reviving my Datamaster. Last year, it worked fine (I at least > could get into Basic). This year, I can't even get it to boot. I have no > manuals for the darned thing, so I have no idea what the numbers on the screen > during the POST mean. I have one reverse-highlighted number: "09" and I'm > assuming that this is a hardware failure code. As promised, I have hunted through my various IBM System/23 (Datamaster) manuals, and found the meanings of the POD (Power-on Diagnostics) error codes. Here is a summary: FF} 00} CPU Failure (!) 01} 02 Failure of first ROS module (Read Only Storage module, i.e. ROM chip) 03 Reserved. If this is highlighted, panic. 04 Failure in bottom 16k of storage, or of storage controller 05 CRT (presumably actually monitor) or DMA failure 06} CRT interface 07} 08 Page registers 09-} ROS failure. There follows a little diagram to tell you which chip 19 } to replace. Yes, the diagram in the manual is made of text, too. ** TOP VIEW OF PLANAR SEEN FROM THE REAR ** _______________________________________________ | ====== ====== <-- NOT FOUND ON | | | 10 | | 11 | <-- SOME EARLY | | =3=40= =3=60= <-- MACHINES | | | | ====== ====== | | | 19 | | 0D | | | =7=60= =1=60= | | *********************** | | =PATCH= ====== * PHYSICAL LOCATION * | | | 18 | | 0C | * OF ROS MODULES * | | =7=40== =1=40= * FOR EACH ERROR CODE * | | *********************** | | ====== ====== | | | 17 | | 0B | -KEY- | | =6=60= =0=60= ====== | | | XX | | | ====== ====== =Y=ZZ= | | | 16 | | 0A | XX=POD ERROR CODE | | =6=40= =0=40= Y=ROS PAGE VALUE | | ZZ=HIGH ORDER BYTE OF | | ====== ====== FIRST ADDRESS IN | | | 15 | | 09 | ROS MODULE. | | =5=60= =0=20= | | ---(CABLE)-------------- | | ====== ====== | ====== | | | | 14 | | 02 | | | 09 | CO-PLANAR | | | =5=40= =0=00= | =0=20= BOARD. | | | | (FOUND ON | | | ====== | ====== SOME EARLY | | | | 13 | | | 10 | MACHINES.) | | | =4=60= | =3=40= | | | | | | | ====== | ====== | | | | 12 | | | 11 | | | | =4=40= | =3=60= | | | ------------------------ | ----------------------------------------------- 1A-} ROS failure on feature card 26 } 27 ROS failure on 2nd printer card 28} ROS failure on feature card 29} 2A-} RAM failure. Table (which I shan't include) of how codes 30 } relate to different sizes of machine. 31 RAM page access failure 32 DMA page register failure 33 Interrupt controller failure 34 Timer interrupt failure 35 Keyboard error. If flashing, keyboard controller. If not flashing, you pressed a key at the wrong moment :-) 36 Printer failure 37 Printer not switched on 38 Diskette attachment failure 39 24 volt rail not reading 24 volts 3A-} belong to add-ons not to the system. I didn't bring the FE } relevant manual pages. General rules for interpretation: Flashing inverse video = fatal error. Non-flashing inverse video = error. Press the Error-reset key and let the machine finish booting. Then run the diagnostics dikette, I suppose. To summarise, it appears you have a dud ROM chip. I imagine the solution is to copy a ROM chip from another Datamaster. If necessary, I can arrange to copy mine, but I don't know off-hand what sort of chips they are. I would also suggest that, unless you too are in England, logistics of getting the chip to you might be hard... Philip. <><><><><><><><><><><><><><> Philip Belben <><><><><><><><><><><><><><> Das Feuer brennt, das Feuer nennt die Luft sein Schwesterelement - und frisst sie doch (samt dem Ozon)! Das ist die Liebe, lieber Sohn. Poem by Christian Morgenstern - Message by Philip.Belben(a)powertech.co.uk

28 years, 9 months

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What Classic Computer are All About - A Lovers

by manney＠nwohio.com

> Hello there, I run a fileserver that has 2 ST-225 20 meg drives, and 1 NEC > 420 meg IDE drive, this system runs 24/7, and has been running for 2 months > continuous now. My question is what is the life expectancy of these drives, > it is often said that the ST-225 series are not reliable, however they > continue to run strong. also these things run so hot that you can fry an egg > on it! :) Where is the heat localized? The logic board gets hot around the bearing (bushing), but the case itself shouldn't get hot. I'd be worried. I deal with a *lot* of old systems, and I don't see any more dead ST-225's than others. I always keep an ST-225 around, 'cause I *know* it'll go on #2 in the ROM drive table if I can't locate the listing in the BIOS.

28 years, 9 months

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PAM computer, Convergent?

by allisonp＠world.std.com

->On the OUTSIDE, in their scrap yard, is where most of the computer ->stuff ends up. I once found a WICAT *and* an EXORCISOR II out ->there-- both filled with water. (Sob!). Heh, I would have used that to get them cheap. Then I'd take them home wash them out throughly and disassembled and dried them well. Generally water is not that damaging. Just done power them wet. Allison

28 years, 9 months

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While the cat's away...

by bw＠booster.bothell.washington.edu

;) Hi all. Due to a major computer disaster here at work I haven't been reading list mail and probably won't for a few more days. So, I'm not ignoring anyone and if anything is really important e-mail me directly (bill(a)booster.u.washington.edu). And, if anyone can tell me why 11 NT servers in a single domain would crash one at a time every 4 minutes and 20 seconds until the whole network is gone - please let me know ;). Bill

28 years, 9 months

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Computer Museums

by manney＠nwohio.com

> What should be on display considering: > 1) space limitation > 2) Mainframes, minis, micros > 3) What would most attract visitors > 4) What would most attract funding :) Three things which have changed radically over the years.are - 01 Power (including speed) - 10 Cost - 11 Display capabilities (on affordable systems, that is) You might want to consider comparing the above parameters system-by-system. Software has become less klunky over the years. Try having an ancient word processor running so people can see, say, the number of steps required to open a file. Don't forget output technology...compare an old daisy wheel to a laser, a superannuated 9 pin to a modern 24 pin, get a thermal printer, and a thinkjet (really raunchy output, but FAST). I'm collecting historically significant micros (such as the C64 -- they're cheap, so everyone got one.) If you can get the dirt on why, for example, CBM shot themselves in the foot, that would be interesting. Why aren't Apples more common, for example?

28 years, 9 months

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What Classic Computer are All About - A Lovers

by cerebral＠michianatoday.com

At 01:18 PM 7/15/97 +0000, you wrote: >simply too small try first: under the width of drive cage, seal the >grille holes on metal sheet and on case cover on right side, seal >that underside holes, all with a good tape. On that XT PSU, how much >airflow blowing out back, weak? Look for a replacement fan that does >better than this el cheapo fans. Try AT type case if you can, they >has bigger, powerful fan. Ok, I checked it out, and it appears that there already is a vinyl plastic glued to the front, with a 5160 sticker on it. I also put a cardboard cover in the empty bay, and this seems to work. the PSU is actually not IBM made, it is an aftermarket brand that has a strong fan in it, stronger than what I find on NEW Yackard Hells! <G> >XT case design especially in cooling department is bit goofy, blamed >by IBM for this ill. :) It continues to amaze me on just WHY whatever IBM made, as flawed as it is, the public jumped on it and supported it... look at winsucks 95..... >> there is good air flow, just they seem to run this >> hot. >More power to air flow is needed, see the tips.. >> I never ran these drives before and have no idea how hot they should >> be. as for power cycling, they get NONE. this system has been running for 2 >> months continous, without any powerdowns since they were installed, so for 2 >> months now, the thermal stability has (hopefully) stayed the same. >> thanx >Hey, no problem! >Jason D. >

28 years, 9 months

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What Classic Computer are All About - A Lovers

by cerebral＠michianatoday.com

At 09:34 AM 7/15/97 -0400, you wrote: >First off why bother withg the st225s? They are slow (st251s are >faster!) and their reliability is at best ok. FYI: st225s live far I would if I had a ST-251, but I got 4 ST-225's, and 2 of them are in use, and the other 2 are spares. they are slow, but they do work nicely. I also like the sound of old hardware, the new drives you can hardly hear them run, with these, you can hear them a mile away! :) The cooling fan on this machine is as loud as the hard disks, and moves lots of warm air.. >longer if they are cooled. If the fan isn't noisy it isn't moving enough >air past them, seriously! Also if they are in the smae box as all the >other hardware they raise the other components temperature lowering their it is in an XT case, which is huge, and has one slot free for air to move.. and my room is not air condidtioned, but the house is, but the cold never travels in here! <G> >life. Heat is not your friend, this is why computer rooms are air >conditioned an usuialy under 70 degrees F. > >Allison > >

28 years, 9 months

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New surplus outlet!

by kyrrin＠wizards.net

Denizens of the Bay Area, check this out! HMR Recycling (www.hmr-usa.com), when I had the opportunity to visit, reminded me greatly of one of the Surplus Warehouses of Olde. Reasonable prices, huge assortment to choose from, and 100,000 sq. feet of warehouse to peruse! Example: Nearly new-looking Tektronix 7844 dual-beam O-scope, with a pair each of 7B92A timebase and 7A26 vertical plugins, with cart: $400. Other examples: Emulex P3000 print server, $20. DEC RRD42 SCSI CD-ROM drive, $20. Exabyte EXB-8200 2.3 gig 8mm tape drive, $125. One of my finds there was a pair of DEC storage expansion cabinets at $45 each (bargained down from $50 since I bought both of them). They each contained a pair of DEC RZ57 drives (made by Micropolis, 1.0 gigs each, all SCSI). Heck of a deal! They get new stuff in literally every day. I went there twice on different days, and found some neat deals both times. 08:00-16:30, Monday-Friday only, minimum purchase $20.00, and you need to sign the visitor log and wear a visitor badge while looking around. Other than that, enjoy! -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Bruce Lane, Sysop, The Dragon's Cave BBS (Fidonet 1:343/272) (Hamateur: WD6EOS) (E-mail: kyrrin(a)wizards.net) http://www.wizards.net/technoid "Our science can only describe an object, event, or living thing in our own human terms. It cannot, in any way, define any of them..."

28 years, 9 months

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What Classic Computer are All About - A Lovers

by allisonp＠world.std.com

>>>jpero... Sorry if this is long but it is important to users of classic machines. <I gently disagree with this assertion that ST251 series is good than <ST225 series. I got too many dead ST251 series compared to ST225's <due to weaker structral design, pushed design by driving steppers too <hard byond 40ms average and not as rugged as ST225's. Can't say I disagree. You however confused my assertion of better performace in terms of access times, with reliability. Its faster and more storage for less power and heat than two st225s. I never said it was more reliable. My expereince is that the st251 is less tolerrent of heat but if cooled it seems to do as well as most st225s (n=10k+). An experience with a customer in Austrailia using both 225s and 251s proved it. FYI neither like heat! <goal set by designers. If one wants faster seeking time, go voice <coil! I am dreaming wishing that ST251 drive was fitted with voice <coil instead of stepper and better motor design...sigh. true, but there are voice coil dries out there that do not hold up well too. It's a design trade made by some companies thinking the mechanics will never outlive the electronics. Much of it is process quality and handling. Most bad drives I've seen were from warm enviornments or dropped in their life. <reliably. Whole problem was that design of this ST251 spindle motor <is ill-designed to begin with in my opinion: Trying to fit all the <coils and one bearing INSIDE that spindle results in weak axle that <gets bent easily due to this design and the bearings failure rate on <this one is high too. It has a problem with gyroscopc precession, this makes it very susceptable to small shocks when running. The bearing does not like sideloads either. I agree it could have been better thought out. generally going to the smaller 3.5" was actaully an improvement in reliability for disks as it took less power to spin it and also move the heads. With less mass in the media the motors, bearings and all could be more rigid for it's size. The lower heat made bearing life better and also helped dimesional stability. < Recently I pulled this ST225 out of dumpter and fixed up the XT with < this hd and LLF'ed it. Gave whole thing to poor guy to use vax at < college. Still works. Most 225s were not fails, just retired due to small space available. FYI you get better results if the disk is LLF'd in situ and well warmed up. I must have 6 st225s of them all good and solid. I use them but, when I need speed I try to use others (quantum q540 30mb is nice!). <I tore down all kinds of drives from old and 3 years old types for <post-failure analysis which gave pretty good info for me. Same here, mostly limited to: St506, st412, st225, st251, micropolus1325 and quantum Q540, Q2190s and a few other dec disks. I have an st238 that refuses to die! <Snip! Tales of positive things about cooling... <Actually, all drives old and new benefits from cooling and boards <likes the flowing cooling air. Very true, vacuuming the vents from time to time also is a good thing. The big advantage of the newer drives is they consume less power therfore produce less damaging heat enhancing reliability. <We have no choice as many do not have AC so they ran in warm air <but if you are careful, enough fans to make hurriance out of it and <put a fan or two on monitor as well. My 17" needs two otherwise the <HOT transistor will pop again. ARRGgghhh. Tell me! I run microvaxen, Q-bus PDP-11s and s100 systems and 20 years of experince (and reliability studies) has taught me 90F is a hard ceiling and to shutdown with fans running if it gets hotter. I know this from my days at DEC in the mill when my office system (11/23) was fried by an AC failure, the area hit 98f and the 11 went down for the count. I've been pulling the plug regularly this year as we've had a lot of warm here in MA. ;-) Even without AC, every effort to remove heat is good! Even if you can't lower the ambient, keeping the guts closer to it will help greatly. My s100 crate has two 5" 120cfm fans pushing air up through the cage and it runs stone cold. The original layout had an 80cfm fan in the PS section pulling the air around and the boards ran HOT. It makes a racket but compared the the 8" drive and considering it's 20 years old... it still runs. Even my ba123 microvax, I replaced the fans to blow up as someone put them in backwards for less noise. You fight convection and lose cooling efficiencty. Since I have few spares I prefer to keep it going and tolerate a slight increase in noise. This is something to watch for on older systems where things may have been replaced but with the wrong (underrated) items. One last item. MAKE BACKUPS OF EVERYTHING. make duplicate backups and test the backups for integrity. Disks fail, and the cheapest insurance is a boot and backup package that works when you replace/repair the offending drive. Allison

28 years, 9 months

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TRS-80 Model I EI question

by allisonp＠world.std.com

<I'm trying to track-down a mod that Tandy on the Expansion Interface. On o <of my early EIs (SN# 000352), there was a 6-pin DIN modification, which <someone at one time told me was to correct some erratic signal problems. the mod was to bring out ras* cas* and MUX* with terminating resistors at one or both ends. These signals went through the EI cable but timing was critical at best. the later EIs derived cas* and mux* off of ras* inside rather than pipe them over. Generally speaking the mod was one where if it was mostly working it MIGHT help, sometimes it made it worse. There was another mod after that called the buffered EI cable...not a good idea either. Fixing the EI was the solution. Allison

28 years, 9 months

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What Classic Computer are All About - A Lovers

by cerebral＠michianatoday.com

At 02:45 PM 7/15/97 -0400, you wrote: > >One last item. MAKE BACKUPS OF EVERYTHING. make duplicate backups and test >the backups for integrity. Disks fail, and the cheapest insurance is a boot >and backup package that works when you replace/repair the offending drive. > > >Allison > This is why I like the 20 and 40 meg drives, I can back up key elements of the OS and configs, and restore them easily. as for 3.5 being more reliable, they are not, as I bought a Conner CFS-850A 850 meg, and it worked nicely for a year, then one day I am greeted with this error: BOOT DISK FAILURE, SYSTEM HALTED. it suffered a head crash, it would spin up normally, and when the controller tested the head actuator upon startup, there was a time when the head would seek to a location on the disk, and GRIND to a halt. the drive never worked again... I lost 700 megs of stuff, half unreplaceable (my fault, but I have no tape drive). fortunately the drive did have a 3 year warrenty, and a replacement was shipped, a 1.2 gig seagate ST-31276A. and here is another question: Is this going to last me more than a year? If Seagate made good drives in the past, will this new one live up to this, or is this drive chock full of corner cutting?

28 years, 9 months

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What Classic Computer are All About - A Lovers

by manney＠nwohio.com

> Most 225s were not fails, just retired due to small space available. FYI > you get better results if the disk is LLF'd in situ and well warmed up. That's doubly true for RLL encoded ST-506/412 drives. These drives should be LLF'd from time to time anyway. Most HD controllers have a built-in LLF routine which you can access via DEBUG.

28 years, 9 months

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Computer Museums

by IVIE＠cc.usu.edu

> What should be on display considering: > 1) space limitation > 2) Mainframes, minis, micros > 3) What would most attract visitors > 4) What would most attract funding :) I'm afraid number 3 and number 4 will turn you into The Boston Computer Museum. Roger Ivie ivie(a)cc.usu.edu

28 years, 9 months

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Some Commie questions

by manney＠nwohio.com

C64 Porer supplies... I have a box full of C64 P/S's ...I sell them for $18 plus S/H, 60 day warranty. Got cables and manuals and lotsa software, too. I don't have any 128's. Anyone wanna get rid of one cheap? Trade a slightly used Panasonic HHP for one :> > >The next question would be, is it worth trying to repair a C64's power > >supply? I got two of them yesterday, both powersupplies are dead. It > >looks like the 5V line is shorted to ground. I did get a copy of the Old & > > if it is potted, NOPE. some are unpotted and can be fixed. > > >New style users manuals, and a copy of "Troubleshooting and Repairing your > >Commodore 64" yesterday (I love Powells Technical Books!) so I've got some > >documentation. It's been too many years since I worked as an Electrician, > >so my skill level is pretty low (wasn't very high to begin with, which is > >why I switched to computers). > > > > I have these manuals too and I must say that it leaves no tern left unstoned. >

28 years, 9 months

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What Classic Computer are All About - A Lovers

by KFergason＠aol.com

In a message dated 97-07-15 13:32:57 EDT, you write: << IMHO the ST-4096 FH 80 MG was the most reliable of this era. I spent over 600.00 for this drive new and used it for more than 20 years, and ended up selling it to a business for 50.00 to replace their dead st-251. >> hmm, my experience is just the opposite with this drive. I had 6 out 7 fail in less than 6 months back in 1990. The 4096 was just hideous. Kelly

28 years, 9 months

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PC-jr PSU (again!)

by ard＠p850ug1.demon.co.uk

I dug out the PC-jr Techref (in order to look up details on the joystick), and I also looked at the PSU diagrams (page B-23 in my edition). We had a thread on this about a month ago, mainly about the external transformer unit which I don't have. Now, the input connector is a 3-pin thing. The centre pin is connected to shield ground, and then via L3 and L4 on the system board to logic ground. It's thus a DC connection to the system ground. The outside 2 pins go through a filter to the AC terminals of a bridge rectifier (CR7 - CR10) and the output of this goes (via the power switch) to a 1500uF 25V capacitor (C13). The -ve side of this capacitor is also connected to system ground. Thus, IMHO it makes no sense at all for the transformer to be centre-tapped with the tap going to pin 2 on the connector. If it was, the winding would be paritially shorted out by the diodes in the bridge rectifier, which would cause a lot of damage. Also, since C13 is only rated at 25V, the maximum input rms voltage is 25/sqrt(2) volts, which is a lot less than 34V. I therefore still believe that it's a plain 17V transformer between the 2 outer pins on the connector. Incidentally, the +12V output comes from a standard linear regulator, the +5V output from a switching regulator (Z2 is the control IC, Q2 the chopper, and L1 the switching inductor). The -12V output is supplied by a secondary winding on L1, which is then rectifier and smoothed. It's always possible that IBM used several versions of the PSU card, but the schematic in my Techref seems to agree with the one in my machine. -tony

28 years, 9 months

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IBM 5161??

by ard＠p850ug1.demon.co.uk

> Haven't found a IBM cassette recorder either but I did pick up an IBM > joystick (had IBM logo on it and the word "Joystick") plus it had a funky > square connector which looked like it goes to the PCjr. I've dug out the PC-jr Techref, and there's some info in it on the joystick.

28 years, 9 months

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IBM 5161??

by ard＠p850ug1.demon.co.uk

> (MS-DOS machines) since about 1983 and I have yet to see one. Another > thing I've been looking for without success is an IBM Cassette recorder > for the IBM PC cassette interface. I've heard they really do exist. Now that's something I've never seen. One interesting point is that the pinout of the cassette socket on the PC (although not on the PC-jr) is the same as that on a Tandy Model 1/3/4/Coco/etc It is rumoured that IBM intended you to go down to the local Radio Shack and buy one of their recorders + cable. -tony >

28 years, 9 months

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antique computer blowout (fwd)

by kjaeros＠u.washington.edu

Somebody in the Berkeley area might want to answer this call to duty.. I'd be thrilled to get the Sun 1 clone, but it'd cost several hundred dollars to ship up here. ok -r ---------- Forwarded message ---------- Date: 15 Jul 1997 07:39:46 GMT From: Paul Leondis <leondis(a)slip.net> Newsgroups: misc.forsale.computers.workstation Subject: antique computer blowout I'm looking to get rid of some stuff, let me know what you think: I've got a huge amount of old S-100 bus stuff, almost all of it with technical manuals and software on diskette, that was working the last i knew. Most is Godbout stuff, some Morrow, some Dual, etc. Lots of 8" floppy drives and diskettes. I have most of the processor boards that were released by Godbout, including 8088, 8086, Z80, 8080, 68000, and i even have some of the National Semiconductor 32000 series cpus on S-100 cards. I have all the stuff like CP/M 68K with the associated assemblers and linkers etc. I also have a complete working [?] Sun I clone: yes, that's right, the first SUN design was public domain (did you know that?? At least that's the way i understand it...) and a company called Forward Technology made clones of that design. It has a 68K cpu running in a multibus one chassis, and i have lots of peripherals for it, including 9-track tape drive and 1/4" tape drives and disk controllers for several interfaces. I've got all the relevent software, inc. V7 unix and a mess of compilers. I have the (at the time) very high res monochrome monitors that went with the system. It's a real wrench for me to let go of this stuff, if you were in this field 10 or 15 years ago you know what i paid for some of the stuff. But i'm tired of hoarding it all. So, i will take the best offer i can get for all of the stuff. My reserve bid is $0, that is i will give it away if that is the best offer. I will probably be most moved by someone that may actually get some pleasure out of the stuff and esp. someone that would want to take the whole lot. There is a free city dump day coming up in my part of town on July 19th, so i'd like to settle the stuff by then so i can dispose of whatever is left at that time. Paul Leondis leondis(a)slip.net 510-649-0993 phone Berkeley, CA

28 years, 9 months

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What Classic Computer are All About - A Lovers

by thedm＠sunflower.com

IMHO the ST-4096 FH 80 MG was the most reliable of this era. I spent over 600.00 for this drive new and used it for more than 20 years, and ended up selling it to a business for 50.00 to replace their dead st-251. ---------- > From: jpero(a)mail.cgo.wave.ca > To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers <classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu> > Subject: Re: What Classic Computer are All About - A Lovers > Date: Tuesday, July 15, 1997 7:59 AM > > Allison, > > I gently disagree with this assertion that ST251 series is good than > ST225 series. I got too many dead ST251 series compared to ST225's > due to weaker structral design, pushed design by driving steppers too > hard byond 40ms average and not as rugged as ST225's. > I noticed the relationship between higher stepping rate and > terrible high failure rate on many hard drives such as ST251's, > Miniscribes and early 40meg western digital drives compared to > very slow stepping rate on most drives did last long time byond its > goal set by designers. If one wants faster seeking time, go voice > coil! I am dreaming wishing that ST251 drive was fitted with voice > coil instead of stepper and better motor design...sigh. > > Those ST225, ST250 are really best consumer's drives and ST251 series > might be a mistake at cutting corners well as ST277, ST296 are same > design. > > I wished that segate designed ST251 case > more rugged and used internal spindle motor with bearings on outside > and one screw on top of cover to stablize the motor from top. Then > this ST251's would be possible to be expanded to 100 or 120 size > reliably. Whole problem was that design of this ST251 spindle motor > is ill-designed to begin with in my opinion: Trying to fit all the > coils and one bearing INSIDE that spindle results in weak axle that > gets bent easily due to this design and the bearings failure rate on > this one is high too. > > Recently I pulled this ST225 out of dumpter and fixed > up the XT with this hd and LLF'ed it. Gave whole thing to poor guy > to use vax at college. Still works. > > I tore down all kinds of drives from old and 3 years old types for > post-failure analysis which gave pretty good info for me. > > > ->X-Sender: cerebral(a)michianatoday.com > Snip! > > > First off why bother withg the st225s? They are slow (st251s are > Snip! Tales of positive things about cooling... > > If the fan isn't noisy it isn't moving enough > > air past them, seriously! > Actually, all drives old and new benefits from cooling and boards > likes the flowing cooling air. > > > Also if they are in the smae box as all the > > other hardware they raise the other components temperature lowering their > > life. Heat is not your friend, this is why computer rooms are air > > conditioned an usuialy under 70 degrees F. > We have no choice as many does not have AC so they ran in warm air > but if you are careful, enough fans to make hurriance out of it and > put a fan or two on monitor as well. My 17" needs two otherwise the > HOT transistor will pop again. ARRGgghhh. > > > Allison >

28 years, 9 months

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DEC machine?

by allisonp＠world.std.com

<PC500 <RCD31 < <The PC500 seems to be a display with a 5.25 inch floppy drive and some <electronics. It is mounted on top of the RCD31 unit which is in a pizza <box style case. Is this some sort of PC clone or maybe a DecMate? It's called a Vaxmate. what it is is a PC/AT clone(sorta) with a 8mhz 286 and most had 2meg of ram, wd1003 HD controller, an st225(rd31) or st251(rd32) and a Lance eithernet interface. The floppy is RX33 (1.2mb). These are nice machines and were aimed at running as a diskless workstation to vaxen on eithenet using PCSA and later Pathworks networking. It will run dos3.3 and 5.0 that I know of. Allison

28 years, 9 months

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What Classic Computer are All About - A Lovers

by thedm＠sunflower.com

Typo was intended to be 10, but it was still undauntingly reliable. ---------- > From: jpero(a)mail.cgo.wave.ca > To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers <classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu> > Subject: Re: What Classic Computer are All About - A Lovers > Date: Tuesday, July 15, 1997 8:34 AM > > > Date: Tue, 15 Jul 1997 12:07:09 -0500 > > Reply-to: classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu > > From: "Bill Girnius" <thedm(a)sunflower.com> > > To: "Discussion re-collecting of classic computers" <classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu> > > Subject: Re: What Classic Computer are All About - A Lovers > > X-To: <classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu> > > > IMHO the ST-4096 FH 80 MG was the most reliable of this era. I spent over > > 600.00 for this drive new and used it for more than 20 years, and ended up > > selling it to a business for 50.00 to replace their dead st-251. > > Had to ask! Are you kidding? :) None 5.25" hds came out til after > '82 when lot of hds bigger than 8" was king. !!!! 20 yr old > ST4096? Impossible! More like 8 or 9 years. > > Seagate started on this design after 1986. Is this one of yours > that only have one board on bottom with only platter cover painted > black? That is last generation of this design which is finally > reliable. Earlier ones had teething problem of all kinds, no > kidding. All the way back to early first linear voice coil of ST4025 > between 1985 through '88. I pick them up all the time are almost > always dead due to bearing failures. These drives are best left > running horizontal right side up. > > Jason D.

28 years, 9 months

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DEC machine?

by IVIE＠cc.usu.edu

> The PC500 seems to be a display with a 5.25 inch floppy drive and some > electronics. It is mounted on top of the RCD31 unit which is in a pizza > box style case. Is this some sort of PC clone or maybe a DecMate? No, I suspect it's a VAXmate. The VAXmate is a 286 PC clone with some special DECness (Ethernet, included software to do DECnet). Roger Ivie ivie(a)cc.usu.edu PS: Rumor has it that the VAXstation 2000 folks were really pissed that the name 'VAXmate' was already taken...

28 years, 9 months

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ActionMax

by dastar＠crl.com

Picked up an ActionMax system from the thrift store today. I got it nearly complete, which is rare. Only missing the power supply (common 9V) and the VCR cable. This is a game that you hook to your VCR. It has a light gun and some sort of red either sensor or light (don't know yet). It came with a fighter combat VCR tape that you play in the VCR and I assume you use the gun to shoot at stuff on the screen. I'm sure someone else knows more about it than me. I haven't hooked it up yet. But I won't be able to do anything with it until I get the VCR cable. Anyone know how to rig one up? I also finally found a C16 but it has a broken key in the upper row :( These things apparently aren't too common in these parts as this is the first one I've ever seen. Sam ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Computer Historian, Programmer, Musician, Philosopher, Athlete, Writer, Jackass

28 years, 9 months

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DEC machine?

by dbetz＠xlisper.mv.com

Does anyone know what the following Digital part numbers refer to? PC500 RCD31 The PC500 seems to be a display with a 5.25 inch floppy drive and some electronics. It is mounted on top of the RCD31 unit which is in a pizza box style case. Is this some sort of PC clone or maybe a DecMate? -- David Betz dbetz(a)xlisper.mv.com DavidBetz(a)aol.com (603) 472-2389

28 years, 9 months

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Altair Construction Manual

by rcini＠msn.com

Glenn: Thanks for the encouragement. It seems that at one time, one of us did try to contact TA to no avail. Should we try again?? I'd need to get the contact info >from the gent that tried it the first time, and I'll give it a second go-around. ------------------------------------------------- Rich Cini/WUGNET - ClubWin Charter Member (6) - MCPS Windows 95/Networking ---------- From: Glenn Roberts Sent: Tuesday, July 15, 1997 10:23 AM To: Richard A. Cini, Jr. Cc: bcw(a)u.washington.edu Subject: Re: Altair Construction Manual outstanding! i continue to applaud your efforts. i would think that all we need to proceed is a trail of evidence showing a "reasonable effort" to receive permission in this area. this can be a precedent-setting effort for publication of all kinds of useful historical information that might otherwise be lost forever. thanks again for blazing the trail! - glenn At 02:04 AM 7/13/97 UT, you wrote: >To all Altair fans... > > Well, my more-than-kind individual has provided me with the first of three >installments of the original Altair construction manual. He scanned all 102 >pages of the doc and made it into a PDF document -- almost 7mb in size. He is >also providing me with manuals for "the 88-4K, 88-ACR, and other stuff." I'm >not too familiar with all of the available options since the Altair was really >before my time, but it looks like the 4k memory board and other stuff. > > I'm not going to U/L the docs yet, first for size reasons, and second, until >we determine if we should try to contact Triumph-Adler... > >On Thu, 10 Jul 1997, Jim Willing wrote: >>>So, it can be assumed that TA [Triumph-Adler of Germany] now >>owns all of >the rights to things MITS/Altair. I've tried to contact them >>on occasion on >related matters and have gotten no response of any >>kind to date. > >Anybody have any thoughts? >------------------------ >Rich Cini/WUGNET > - ClubWin Charter Member (6) > - MCPS Windows 95/Networking > > > +=========================================================+ | Glenn F. Roberts, Falls Church, VA | Comments are my own and not the opinion of my employer | groberts(a)mitre.org

28 years, 9 months

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book review

by enrico＠Brighton-UK.com

If you like the History of Personal Computers you might like to read my review of the Stan Veit book I just received from him. You will find it at: <http://www.ndirect.co.uk/~e.tedeschi/news/news73.htm> I know that the book has been published in 1993 but some of you (like me) might not have been aware of it till now. Stan has seen all the personal computer revolution from the inside as he opened the second computer store in the USA and the first on the East Coast (New York). Please forgive my spelling mistakes.... Thanks enrico -- ================================================================ Enrico Tedeschi, 54, Easthill Drive, BRIGHTON BN41 2FD, U.K. tel/fax +(0)1273 701650 (24 hours) or 0850 104725 mobile website <http://www.ndirect.co.uk/~e.tedeschi> ================================================================ visit Brighton: <http://www.brighton.co.uk/tourist/welcome.htm>

28 years, 9 months

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PAM computer, Convergent?

by allisonp＠world.std.com

<> wash them out throughly and disassembled and dried them well. Generally <> water is not that damaging. Just don't power them wet. < <I would remove anything high-voltage (front end of the power supply) and <BAKE them for quite some time (a day is nice). Water has a way of getting <into windings and comprimising the insulation (remember, in a transformer <the insulation is _thin_ - often paper and painted on varnish). This is a good point for the masses. I've done enough design(20+ years) so transformer design and the like are familiar to me. But then again I've cleaned boards in the dishwasher! Works great too. Also while In has I made a business of salvaging and repair marine gear that had been dunked in salt water which is very nasty to electronics. Part of the repair process was to very throughly wash out the unit in fresh water as no salt could be left (it's very hydroscopic) then repairing any damage if any. I've had marine equipment work better for this due to residual salt and dust accumulated being cleaned out! A good temp to bake at is just under 200f, it's slow but works and most plastics and semis are ok at this temp! Do monitor it though. Allison

28 years, 9 months

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Classic Video Games

by thedm＠sunflower.com

Sounds like Mattel Electronic Football. My friends and I were the reason they stopped letting us take to school! damn...that was ages ago. ---------- > From: jpero(a)mail.cgo.wave.ca > To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers <classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu> > Subject: Re: Classic Video Games > Date: Friday, July 11, 1997 5:34 PM > > One comment, > > Is the display looks like it was using same LED display, "hair thin" > segments under the plastic lens? > > Jason D. > > Uncle Roger, etc: > > > > In regard to your post about the old hand held football game... I > > certainly do remember that game. There were actually a couple of different > > companies or stores that sold them. Radio Shack did have one, but I > > believe it was the SAME one that was manufactured by Coleco, or a similar > > company. I know up until a few years ago I had one... I'll have to look > > around. Just the other day, I was in a thrift store in Nebraska City, NE > > and they had a pile of 'old' handhelds. I didn't have time to look through > > it close, though.... but I'm darn sure they did have a football game or > > two though. I'll go back and check it out for you, though. Oh, while were > > on the subject of old football games.... how about those darned magnetic > > full-field table football games they used to make?? Do they still exist? > > > > Until next time, > > > > CORD > > > > //*=====================================================================++ > > || Cord G. Coslor P.O. Box 308 - 1300 3rd St. Apt "M1" -- Peru, NE || > > || (402) 872- 3272 coslor(a)bobcat.peru.edu 68421-0308 || > > || Classic computer software and hardware collector || > > || Autograph collector || > > ++=====================================================================*// > > > > > > On Fri, 11 Jul 1997, Uncle Roger wrote: > > > > > At 02:03 PM 7/11/97 -0400, you wrote: > > > >Depends on your definition of "videogame" (coin-operated, home unit, > > > computer, commercial, etc.) One of these should fit what you're looking for: > > > > > > When I was in high school, there was a precursor to the Lynx/Gameboy/etc. > > > crowd that was a football game. There were little red LED's(?) to represent > > > players, and you had up, down, and run buttons to control the quarter back. > > > It was very simplistic; you basically just ran the quarterback until you got > > > a touchdown (but I think you could do a fieldgoal?) Anyway, I think Radio > > > Shack sold one, but it may have been someone else. > > > > > > Anyone else remember this? Know what it was called? Got one you'd part with? > > > > > > Thanks in advance! > > > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- O- > > > > > > Uncle Roger "There is pleasure pure in being mad > > > sinasohn(a)crl.com that none but madmen know." > > > Roger Louis Sinasohn & Associates > > > San Francisco, California http://www.crl.com/~sinasohn/ > > > > > > > > > > > >

28 years, 9 months

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Datamaster troubles

by Philip.Belben＠powertech.co.uk

Rich Cini wrote: > Well, I'm reviving my Datamaster. Last year, it worked fine (I at least > could get into Basic). This year, I can't even get it to boot. I have no > manuals for the darned thing, so I have no idea what the numbers on the screen > during the POST mean. I have one reverse-highlighted number: "09" and I'm > assuming that this is a hardware failure code. As promised, I have hunted through my various IBM System/23 (Datamaster) manuals, and found the meanings of the POD (Power-on Diagnostics) error codes. Here is a summary: FF} 00} CPU Failure (!) 01} 02 Failure of first ROS module (Read Only Storage module, i.e. ROM chip) 03 Reserved. If this is highlighted, panic. 04 Failure in bottom 16k of storage, or of storage controller 05 CRT (presumably actually monitor) or DMA failure 06} CRT interface 07} 08 Page registers 09-} ROS failure. There follows a little diagram to tell you which chip 19 } to replace. Yes, the diagram in the manual is made of text, too. ** TOP VIEW OF PLANAR SEEN FROM THE REAR ** _______________________________________________ | ====== ====== <-- NOT FOUND ON | | | 10 | | 11 | <-- SOME EARLY | | =3=40= =3=60= <-- MACHINES | | | | ====== ====== | | | 19 | | 0D | | | =7=60= =1=60= | | *********************** | | =PATCH= ====== * PHYSICAL LOCATION * | | | 18 | | 0C | * OF ROS MODULES * | | =7=40== =1=40= * FOR EACH ERROR CODE * | | *********************** | | ====== ====== | | | 17 | | 0B | -KEY- | | =6=60= =0=60= ====== | | | XX | | | ====== ====== =Y=ZZ= | | | 16 | | 0A | XX=POD ERROR CODE | | =6=40= =0=40= Y=ROS PAGE VALUE | | ZZ=HIGH ORDER BYTE OF | | ====== ====== FIRST ADDRESS IN | | | 15 | | 09 | ROS MODULE. | | =5=60= =0=20= | | ---(CABLE)-------------- | | ====== ====== | ====== | | | | 14 | | 02 | | | 09 | CO-PLANAR | | | =5=40= =0=00= | =0=20= BOARD. | | | | (FOUND ON | | | ====== | ====== SOME EARLY | | | | 13 | | | 10 | MACHINES.) | | | =4=60= | =3=40= | | | | | | | ====== | ====== | | | | 12 | | | 11 | | | | =4=40= | =3=60= | | | ------------------------ | ----------------------------------------------- 1A-} ROS failure on feature card 26 } 27 ROS failure on 2nd printer card 28} ROS failure on feature card 29} 2A-} RAM failure. Table (which I shan't include) of how codes 30 } relate to different sizes of machine. 31 RAM page access failure 32 DMA page register failure 33 Interrupt controller failure 34 Timer interrupt failure 35 Keyboard error. If flashing, keyboard controller. If not flashing, you pressed a key at the wrong moment :-) 36 Printer failure 37 Printer not switched on 38 Diskette attachment failure 39 24 volt rail not reading 24 volts 3A-} belong to add-ons not to the system. I didn't bring the FE } relevant manual pages. General rules for interpretation: Flashing inverse video = fatal error. Non-flashing inverse video = error. Press the Error-reset key and let the machine finish booting. Then run the diagnostics dikette, I suppose. To summarise, it appears you have a dud ROM chip. I imagine the solution is to copy a ROM chip from another Datamaster. If necessary, I can arrange to copy mine, but I don't know off-hand what sort of chips they are. I would also suggest that, unless you too are in England, logistics of getting the chip to you might be hard... Philip. <><><><><><><><><><><><><><> Philip Belben <><><><><><><><><><><><><><> Das Feuer brennt, das Feuer nennt die Luft sein Schwesterelement - und frisst sie doch (samt dem Ozon)! Das ist die Liebe, lieber Sohn. Poem by Christian Morgenstern - Message by Philip.Belben(a)powertech.co.uk

28 years, 9 months

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Some Commie questions

by 107765.1161＠compuserve.com

Message text written by INTERNET:classiccmp@u.washington.edu >The C=128 does not need any kind of bootfloppy, it will start up in C=128 mode. if you type GO64, it reverts to a C=64 kernal.< You can also hold down the Commodore key (looks like "C=" in the lower lefthand corner) while you turn it on, and it will come up in 64 mode. > the 128 has RF output accessable from the RCA jack, a 5 pin DIN video connector that provides composite, or seperated video plus sound.< The 128 has an 8-pin DIN connector, as do the later 64s. A 5-pin cable will work, but for the best possible separated composite picture, an 8-pin cable will do better. >also there is a RGB 9 pin DSUB connector so you can use ANY CGA monitor for 80 col. for the 1702, you need a video cable(looks like you have this), and use the separated mode for sharper graphics.< The 1702 is composite only. Later Commodore monitors, like the 1902, were composite/RGB switchable. However, pin 7 of the 9-pin 128 video connector puts out a monochrome composite signal, which (with your own hacked cable) allows you to view the 128's 80-column signal (normally viewable only with an RGB monitor) on a composite monitor like the 1702. >Nope. unless you want to run CPM< Or GEOS, which is kinda like Windows. Some of the more advanced Commodore software (like the fax program) runs under GEOS. >>The next question would be, is it worth trying to repair a C64's power supply? I got two of them yesterday, both powersupplies are dead. It looks like the 5V line is shorted to ground. << >if it is potted, NOPE. some are unpotted and can be fixed.< The 64 power supply isn't going to do him much good on a 128; the power supplies have different connectors, and the 64 supplies aren't as strong as the 128 supplies. As to potted supplies, I have fixed one or two; some have fuses up close to the top of the gunk, and it is possible to scrape away enough of the gunk on each end to bypass the fuse if that is the problem. But as to whether it is worth the effort, I'd agree-- usually it isn't. I'm not sure what they pot it with, but starships could use it for deflector shields! Gil Parrish 107765.1161(a)compuserve.com

28 years, 9 months

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C16

by 107765.1161＠compuserve.com

Message text written by Sam: >I also finally found a C16 but it has a broken key in the upper row :( These things apparently aren't too common in these parts as this is the first one I've ever seen.< If the unit powers up, you're ahead of the game. The video chip, called the TED, is weak in those units, and probably 1 our of every two you'll find has a bad TED chip. By the way, the same TED is in the Plus/4, so if need by the chip can be swapped from unit to the other. All those C16s with bad TED chips means there are more than a few non-working units out there that could be a part donor for your keyboard. If fact, if you can't search around and find, drop me a note and I'm sure I can. Gil Parrish 107765.1161(a)compuserve.com

28 years, 9 months

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IEEE 488

by 107765.1161＠compuserve.com

Message from: Uncle Roger <sinasohn(a)crl.com> >Also, if I'm not mistaken, the Commodore PET's used IEEE-488 for disk drives, as well as lab stuff. I'm pretty sure I've got an IEEE-488 interface for the VIC-20 around somewhere. < Yep. Commodore used it on the full PET/CBM line for disk drives, printers, and whatever else you wanted to attach. That was one reason PETs were fairly popular in labs in those days-- easy to plug in test equipment. Gil Parrish 107765.1161(a)compuserve.com

28 years, 9 months

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What Classic Computer are All About - A Lovers

by cerebral＠michianatoday.com

Opps, My name is TJ Plajer, and recently reinstalled the mailer and forgot to add a space for some reason..... <G> I did follow your tips, and the drives are in a XT case and there are no bezels for the drives. there is good air flow, just they seem to run this hot. I never ran these drives before and have no idea how hot they should be. as for power cycling, they get NONE. this system has been running for 2 months continous, without any powerdowns since they were installed, so for 2 months now, the thermal stability has (hopefully) stayed the same. thanx

28 years, 9 months

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What Classic Computer are All About - A Lovers

by allisonp＠world.std.com

->X-Sender: cerebral(a)michianatoday.com ->Hello there, I run a fileserver that has 2 ST-225 20 meg drives, and 1 ->420 meg IDE drive, this system runs 24/7, and has been running for 2 mo ->continuous now. My question is what is the life expectancy of these dri ->it is often said that the ST-225 series are not reliable, however they ->continue to run strong. also these things run so hot that you can fry a First off why bother withg the st225s? They are slow (st251s are faster!) and their reliability is at best ok. FYI: st225s live far longer if they are cooled. If the fan isn't noisy it isn't moving enough air past them, seriously! Also if they are in the smae box as all the other hardware they raise the other components temperature lowering their life. Heat is not your friend, this is why computer rooms are air conditioned an usuialy under 70 degrees F. Allison

28 years, 9 months

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Computer Scrapyards (was: PAM computer, Convergent?)

by allisonp＠world.std.com

->I have seen many gems from DEC, mostly mid-1970s PDP-11s and early VAXe ->I have yet to see any 12, 18, or 36 bit stuff from them, however. The o there is a reason... PDP-8s were the most prolific and the production nubers were in teh low tens of thousands and many still serve. The 18bit stuff were few to start with and hard as hell to expand so they faded away. the 36bit stuff were also few but interesting. Still many made it to the bone yard for lack of takers years back. Some of the less common machines like the PDP/LINK-12s and PDP-15s were only made in the thousands. PDP-11/23s are however like flies but, one complete with software (or better diags) and clean are scarce. Allison

28 years, 9 months

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Some Commie questions

by cerebral＠michianatoday.com

At 02:11 PM 7/13/97 -0800, you wrote: >My main question is on the C= 128, along with all the other stuff I picked >up, I got a Commodore 1702 monitor, and a couple 1541 drives. I've got the >drive attached, and the monitor hooked up via a RF cable (I guess that's >what it's called) through the front connection (This works for the Amiga >500 I also got yesterday). Anyway, I power the thing on, it "buzzes" the >drive like it's expecting to find something, and I don't get anything on >the display. The C=128 does not need any kind of bootfloppy, it will start up in C=128 mode. if you type GO64, it reverts to a C=64 kernal. and if you want to run CPM, then you need a CPM boot disk, however it is not required to run the machine. this is what I liked about the 128, 3 mahcines in 1! :) for your monitor, the 128 has RF output accessable from the RCA jack, a 5 pin DIN video connector that provides composite, or seperated video plus sound. also there is a RGB 9 pin DSUB connector so you can use ANY CGA monitor for 80 col. for the 1702, you need a video cable(looks like you have this), and use the separated mode for sharper graphics. the buzzing you hear is because you have connected the video out RCA jack to the audio in. You should have 5 phono plugs on the end of the video cable, and a din plug on the other. just experament with all the plugs till it works. the video plug colors usually (but not always) YELLOW - sound RED Video chroma WHITE video Luminace BLACK SOUND GRAY Composite video each manufacturer used different color chemes, and this might be wrong for other cables than mine. also the 1702 has a front panel switch that has 3 positions: 1- monochrome this just makes everything green used for composite video 2- Composite video this is just the standard video in, you can hook your VCR to it for a nice sharp TV!! 3- seperated - this uses seperate lines to feed the video, and this has the best quality >I remember that the C64's like the VIC-20 would drop you at the prompt even >if you had nothing attached, and didn't need any kind of boot floppies. Do >I need some kind of boot disk for this beast? Nope. unless you want to run CPM >I gather a CGA monitor will work, so I guess I should dig out one of the >old Mono-CGA monitors I've got in storage. shore will. > >The next question would be, is it worth trying to repair a C64's power >supply? I got two of them yesterday, both powersupplies are dead. It >looks like the 5V line is shorted to ground. I did get a copy of the Old & if it is potted, NOPE. some are unpotted and can be fixed. >New style users manuals, and a copy of "Troubleshooting and Repairing your >Commodore 64" yesterday (I love Powells Technical Books!) so I've got some >documentation. It's been too many years since I worked as an Electrician, >so my skill level is pretty low (wasn't very high to begin with, which is >why I switched to computers). > I have these manuals too and I must say that it leaves no tern left unstoned.

28 years, 9 months

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CLASSICCMP digest 113

by foxnhare＠goldrush.com

> From: "Zane H. Healy" <healyzh(a)ix.netcom.com> > Subject: Some Commie questions > My main question is on the C= 128, along with all the other stuff I picked > up, I got a Commodore 1702 monitor (good composite/Split Composite monitor, ususally JVC or Toshiba Guts) > and a couple 1541 drives. I've got the > drive attached, and the monitor hooked up via a RF cable (I guess that's > what it's called) >through the front connection (This works for the Amiga 500 I also got yesterday). The jack on the front is RF output. > Anyway, I power the thing on, it "buzzes" the drive like it's expecting to find something, > and I don't get anything on the display. When a 128 boots up it will attempt to 'boot' whatever disk is in the drive. A boot disk isn't necessary unless you want to use the CP/M mode of the 128. To boot the 128 into 64 mode hold down the Commodore ket as you turn it on, release and you will be rewarded with a 64 bluescreen. Otherwise it will boot into 128 mode, either 40 or 80 columns depending how you have the 'columns' key locked. > I remember that the C64's like the VIC-20 would drop you at the prompt even > if you had nothing attached, and didn't need any kind of boot floppies. Do > I need some kind of boot disk for this beast? Only for CP/M.. It's a good version too! > I gather a CGA monitor will work, so I guess I should dig out one of the > old Mono-CGA monitors I've got in storage. Only in 80 column mode, the 128 has an RGBI port for that. If you have no color RGBI monitors you can always fasion a composite monochome cable by connecting to pin 7 (monochrome) and pin 1 or 2 (ground) to an RCA plug, that pin was designed for monochome composite output. The best (low cost) configuration is to have the 128 hooked up to the 1702, with the 40 column split/composite & audio plugged into the back and the monochrome 80 columns in the front. The quality of video using a proper (split composite) video cable in the back of the 1702 is excellent, I highly recommend it! > The next question would be, is it worth trying to repair a C64's power > supply? No. Unless you like chipping away Epoxy resin. > I got two of them yesterday, both powersupplies are dead. It > looks like the 5V line is shorted to ground. I did get a copy of the Old & > New style users manuals, and a copy of "Troubleshooting and Repairing your > Commodore 64" yesterday (I love Powells Technical Books!) so I've got some > documentation. It's been too many years since I worked as an Electrician, > so my skill level is pretty low (wasn't very high to begin with, which is > why I switched to computers). > Then there is the Amiga 500. About a month ago, I'd picked up a copy of > "Bards Tale" for the Amiga, so I know it works. Problem is I don't have a > copy of the two floppies that came with the computer originally (also got > the manual for this at Powells). I think I've got the Kickstart 1.2 ROMs > (it has a 1.2 on the screen when asking for the Workbench disk). That is Kickstart 1.2 allright. Kickstart 1.3 or later would be better because they have hard drive autoboot coding and 2.0+ is more compatible with recent Amiga software. I have the 1.2 Workbench and Extras Disk around here somewhere... :) > Where can > I get the disks? I don't suppose it's like the Apple IIgs software that > you can now download. The hard part would be getting it on the right format of floppy... > The second Amiga question would be, is it possible to hook up Apple IIgs, > or Macintosh 3 1/2" external floppy drive with a Amiga? I somehow doubt > it, but... Yes and no... Yes, there are plans for hooking up Macintosh 3.5" floppy drives to the Amiga, BUT, they are used only for the Macintosh Emulators for the Amiga (BTW the Amiga 500 can run a Mac Plus Emulator at just about speed.) > Thanks, > Zane >| Zane H. Healy | UNIX Systems Adminstrator | >| healyzh(a)ix.netcom.com (primary) | Linux Enthusiast | >| healyzh(a)holonet.net (alternate) | Mac Programmer | >-- Recap, I have the Amiga Disks and also have a split-composite cable to hook the 128 to the 1701 (for the best 40 column output). -+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+- Visit our web page at: http://www.goldrush.com/~foxnhare/ Call our BBS (Silicon Realms BBS 300-2400 baud) at: (209) 754-1363 -+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-

28 years, 9 months

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What Classic Computer are All About - A Lovers

by cerebral＠michianatoday.com

At 09:35 PM 7/12/97 +0000, you wrote: >> >Yes, I was experimenting with lots of hds/models/brands which I got >some experience with them. If you have any questions about hds, >floppy drives, fire yours to me. :) > >Jason D. > Hello there, I run a fileserver that has 2 ST-225 20 meg drives, and 1 NEC 420 meg IDE drive, this system runs 24/7, and has been running for 2 months continuous now. My question is what is the life expectancy of these drives, it is often said that the ST-225 series are not reliable, however they continue to run strong. also these things run so hot that you can fry an egg on it! :)

28 years, 9 months

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IBM 5161??

by ard＠p850ug1.demon.co.uk

In message <Pine.SUN.3.91.970714101129.4470B-100000(a)crl5.crl.com> classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu writes: > > I saw an interesting relic in the thrift store the other day...and IBM PC > "Expansion Chassis" (I believe that's what it was called). It was > basically an IBM PC case with two full height hard drives instead of > floppy drives. It's model number was 5161 (if I recall correctly). > Didn't bother with it, even though it is kinda unique. Ah yes, the 5161... It is/was a device for adding 6 more slots to a PC, PC/XT or Portable-PC (basically any of the 8-bit bus system). The 5161 itself was a PC/XT cabinet with an 8-slot passive backplane (OK, there was a 14.? MHz oscillator in there) and a standard PSU. There were a pair of cards (the 'extender' and the 'receiver') and a 62 pin cable that linked them. You put the extender into one slot of the 'host' system, the 'receiver' into the passive backplane, and linked them together. You could put I/O or memory cards (although not graphics cards AFAIK) into the remaining slots of the 5161. One problem with buying one of these second-hand is that the extender card (and often the cable) is almost always missing - it's been left in the host. And that card is difficult to find. Schematics, etc are in Volume one of the Options and Adapters TechRef. > Sam -tony

28 years, 9 months

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HP 9836, HP 86 ??

by sinasohn＠crl.com

At 11:45 PM 7/13/97 GMT, you wrote: >GPIB = General-Purpose Interface Bus. Aka IEEE-488, and very similar to >HPIB (= Hewlett-Packard Interface bus). HP were the company who designed it, >but it turns up on all sorts of machines. It's *the* bus used for disk drives, tape drives, printers, etc. for classic (and, to a lesser extent, spectrum) HP 3000 minicomputers. Trust me, I've got a basement full of 'em. (Bought my 3000 to use -- it's what I do for a living.) Also, if I'm not mistaken, the Commodore PET's used IEEE-488 for disk drives, as well as lab stuff. I'm pretty sure I've got an IEEE-488 interface for the VIC-20 around somewhere. --------------------------------------------------------------------- O- Uncle Roger "There is pleasure pure in being mad sinasohn(a)crl.com that none but madmen know." Roger Louis Sinasohn & Associates San Francisco, California http://www.crl.com/~sinasohn/

28 years, 9 months

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Some Commie questions

by sinasohn＠crl.com

At 02:11 PM 7/13/97 -0800, you wrote: >up, I got a Commodore 1702 monitor, and a couple 1541 drives. I've got the >drive attached, and the monitor hooked up via a RF cable (I guess that's >what it's called) through the front connection (This works for the Amiga The c1702 is a very nice monitor. On the back is (IIRC) RGB connectors (or composite? or something like that) but on the front is standard video and audio in. As in, TV. If you hook up a VCR (with a tuner or cable connection), you've got yourself a very nice TV. A few years back, I set up a VCR and 1702 combo on one of those hospital tables for my dad and he spent his time there watching movies (actually, videos of a local teen theatre group -- <http://www.crl.com/~sinasohn/yptmtc/>). It makes for a very compact setup. I would love to find one or two for <$10 and use them for exactly that. --------------------------------------------------------------------- O- Uncle Roger "There is pleasure pure in being mad sinasohn(a)crl.com that none but madmen know." Roger Louis Sinasohn & Associates San Francisco, California http://www.crl.com/~sinasohn/

28 years, 9 months

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Classic Video Games

by sinasohn＠crl.com

At 10:34 PM 7/11/97 +0000, you wrote: >Is the display looks like it was using same LED display, "hair thin" >segments under the plastic lens? That would fit with what I remember. If all the lights were lit up, it would look a lot like this: - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Only a little closer, vertically. The lights really looked like little red hyphens. --------------------------------------------------------------------- O- Uncle Roger "There is pleasure pure in being mad sinasohn(a)crl.com that none but madmen know." Roger Louis Sinasohn & Associates San Francisco, California http://www.crl.com/~sinasohn/

28 years, 9 months

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Classic Video Games

by sinasohn＠crl.com

At 09:24 PM 7/11/97 -0500, you wrote: >In regard to your post about the old hand held football game... I [...] >believe it was the SAME one that was manufactured by Coleco, or a similar I think the one I had was a Coleco or somebody like that, but I could be wrong. >around. Just the other day, I was in a thrift store in Nebraska City, NE >and they had a pile of 'old' handhelds. I didn't have time to look through >it close, though.... but I'm darn sure they did have a football game or >two though. I'll go back and check it out for you, though. Oh, while were That would be fantastic! I don't know what they sell for now, but I can't imagine it would be bank breaking. Thanks! >on the subject of old football games.... how about those darned magnetic >full-field table football games they used to make?? Do they still exist? I know what you mean, but I never had one. I doubt they still make them; Everyone plays Joe Blow Football '97 on the Super Nintendo nowadays. (My girlfriend's brother does anyway.) I can't even say I've seen one recently. The Musee Mechanique at the Cliff House here in San Francisco probably has one (and other, even older games too!) If you're ever in the City and like that sort of thing, definitely stop in. They have modern games as well as old stuff. --------------------------------------------------------------------- O- Uncle Roger "There is pleasure pure in being mad sinasohn(a)crl.com that none but madmen know." Roger Louis Sinasohn & Associates San Francisco, California http://www.crl.com/~sinasohn/

28 years, 9 months

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TRS-80 Model I EI question

by rcini＠msn.com

Hello, all: I'm trying to track-down a mod that Tandy on the Expansion Interface. On one of my early EIs (SN# 000352), there was a 6-pin DIN modification, which someone at one time told me was to correct some erratic signal problems. So, I called Tandy and ordered the EI service manual, but it only applies to the "new" PCB version (units with SNs 035000 or greater). Does anyone have the schematics to the original one and can check pin functions?? Internally, the board is labelled "1700077-C", does not have the green conformal coating, and has the RAM chips right next to the power supply section. Mod 1 is on IC Z17 (LS157), pins 1 and 8 (GND) Mod 2 is on IC Z24 (LS32), pins 4 and 7 (GND) Mod 3 is on IC Z22 (LS367), pins 12 and 8 (GND) Matching the old ICs and pin numbers to the new schematics produces the following: Mod 1 is for the MMUX line, Mod 2 is for WR* and Mod 3 is for INT* Can anyone verify this? ------------------------ Rich Cini/WUGNET - ClubWin Charter Member (6) - MCPS Windows 95/Networking

28 years, 9 months

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HHC

by 107765.1161＠compuserve.com

Message text written by Sam: >I figure total shipping costs will be $4 for a single unit, $5 for a couple, etc. Not sure exactly. I realize the shipping costs may not be what some people bargained for so at this point I would ask that if you want to or need to back out, please do it soon. I am going to try and negotiate a lump sum for the total units that will hopefully bring the cost per unit to $7. That's what I'm shooting for.< I don't know why anyone in their right mind would back out. You said originally $10 per unit, and if the above figures work out, that would end up $12 for a single unit delivered; not bad at all. In fact, for the folks who asked for two, the above figures would product $19 delivered, CHEAPER than you originally said. Still, you're left doing an awful lot of packaging, etc. You might at least want to build in $1-$2 a unit "profit" just to compensate for all your time and effort. On 400 units, that would at least get you a few nice dinners! Please accept our thanks for all your work on this. Gil Parrish 107765.1161(a)compuserve.com

28 years, 9 months

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Modem Collection

by SUPRDAVE＠aol.com

In a message dated 97-07-14 11:38:57 EDT, you write: actually, i've heard that novation applecat modem was desired by the hacker/phone phreak crowd because of it's abilities. i think it could emulate the dialing tones and do dtmf to make free phone calls. anyone have any correct or detailed info about this? << >> I'm not doing it on purpose, but I find myself unable to let go of this >> Novation CAT modem that I dredged up a few years ago... > >Hmm; I just picked one of these up with an incomplete Apple ][plus system >that I haven't yet had time to muck with, short of cleaning it up a bit. >What's special about it? Absolutely nothing. It's a standard 300 baud modem. Roger Ivie ivie(a)cc.usu.edu >> david

28 years, 9 months

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Western Digital Host Adaptors

by allisonp＠world.std.com

->I'm pretty sure that these aren't host adapters; I think they're ->controllers in the traditional SCSI sense. (i.e. you sandwich ->them between the SCSI bus and a MFM or ESDI drive.) -> ->> One is a WD-1000-05, one's a WD-1000-50, and a WD-1000-TB1. If ->> anyone has docs for these (or can tell me where to get them) I would ->> really appreciate it. Tim, They may be host adaptors depending on the suffix they can be host or SASI (pre-scsi). I know the 1002-05/hdo is host. Allison

28 years, 9 months

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(Fwd)

by allisonp＠world.std.com

->Here's a real classic for ya. I'd have killed for a system like ->this one, but married life, no room, no time, blah blah blah . . . ->Anyone have a use for a ->Motorola 6800 Exorcisor ->System? This is a real I have the granmother to that the 6800D1 board. If it has a 6809 it's not as old as one with a 6800! Delopment systems are real collectable as they are fewer in numbers. Allison

28 years, 9 months

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