- test-drb@ccmp.vtda.org - classiccmp.org

by jrkeys＠concentric.net

Today I stopped at Goodwill and found a new unopened copy of A,T&T's ver 3.51 system software and four manuals for the Unix PC for $4. This after getting UnixPC a few months back that was password protected and I could not get in to the hard drive. Now I will get from storage and hope these diskettes are still readable after 11 years sealed in plastic.

28 years, 2 months

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Subject: Re: RSTS/E on a PDP-11?

by rcini＠email.msn.com

On Tue, 17 Feb 1998 09:07:43 -0800 (PST), Tim Shoppa <shoppa(a)alph02.triumf.ca> wrote: > >>What sort of packs? What commands were you issuing to read them? > >>What OS did you try to read them from? What error message did you get > >>when it failed? > > >They're RK05 packs, inserted in the DK2: device. I booted from DK0: with > >RT-11 v.4 and used "dir dk2:" to read the disk directory. Although I > >don't remember the specific error, it's something like "invalid > >directory." > Yep. As you've just discovered, the RSTS/E directory structure is >different than RT-11's. >You can still read raw blocks from the disk, though. Try doing >a DUMP/TERM/RAD50 DK2: and you'll see the directory blocks, followed >by data blocks, scrolling by. I'll give this a try. >Have you tried booting either of the RSTS/E packs? No, but I'll give this a try, too. It seems that the diagnostics pack that I have is unreadable also (that one is not labeled with the required system). Thanks! Rich Cini/WUGNET <nospam_rcini(a)msn.com> (remove nospam_ to use) ClubWin! Charter Member (6) MCP Windows 95/Windows Networking ============================================

28 years, 2 months

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Subject: Re: Apple //gs boot problem

by rcini＠email.msn.com

On Tue, 17 Feb 1998 12:53:07 +0100 (BST), Phil Beesley <pb14(a)leicester.ac.uk> wrote: >>You say that the drive came from a Mac SE. Did you low level format >>or re-partition the disk on the IIGS before installing GS/OS? >>I share a drive between a IIGS and a couple of Macs, so the drive >>has a ProDos partition and a couple of HFS ones too. Often the IIGS >>barfs on startup when it comes across the APPLE_DRIVER43 partition >>map; I find that a Command-Control-Reset sorts this out and the IIGS >>boots normally. First, I know that this may sound silly, but where is the RESET key on the GS? My system came with what looks to be a Mac ADB keyboard. Is the RESET key the power key along the top, above the number keys? Back to the drive. I initialized the drive from within the GS/OS Finder (using the Disk | Initialize menu item). I did not specifically partition the disk, though. If you use the Apple Disk utility (that's probably not the exact name) that comes on the GS/OS disks, it shows no partitions, although it identifies the drive as ProDos. How exactly should I take to get this to work properly? I'm obviously missing a step somewhere. Rich Cini/WUGNET <nospam_rcini(a)msn.com> (remove nospam_ to use) ClubWin! Charter Member (6) MCP Windows 95/Windows Networking ============================================

28 years, 2 months

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LCD life

by manney＠nwohio.com

Um, I believe so (it's at the shop). I'll check. > Manney, > > Is that Nec a MultiSpeed? I have an older model without the backlight > and no hard drive. > > Joe

28 years, 2 months

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System/34, contd.

by maxeskin＠hotmail.com

After some investigation via dejanews, I found that the thing uses 1.7 KW of electrcity. It weighs 1050 pounds. I subscribed to a mailing list that deals with these things and ordered a catalog from system3x.com This was the extent of stuff I found. There was also info on starting and logging into the machine, but I have a while to go until I can do that. I emailed IBM for manuals. ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com

28 years, 2 months

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Can I spin an RL02 up without it connected to the PDP?

by DSEAGRAV＠toad.xkl.com

Just to see if it worked, I showed up at SSI and turned the RL02 on. I'd planned to spin up the pack I have to see if the drive was good. There was a terminator on the OUT port of the drive, and nothing on the IN. I haven't attached it to either PDP yet (I will be this weekend!). I got an error light. So I pulled the manual I have for it, and it's not a diag manual, just a user manual. It says one reason is a loss of clock. Does that clock come from the host computer, or should I be able to spin it up without a host? -------

28 years, 2 months

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System/34 contd.

by maxeskin＠hotmail.com

Please don't tell me that there' something on the side opposite the floppy drive that I need access to! BTW, how would I take the thing apart to get to the PSU? Note that the CE side is against a wall. Do you know how much the thing weighs? Is there a way to move it after it's probably made dents in the floor, short of pyrotechnic charges? What do you suppose is the heaviest part of it, after PSU and case? >[Removing PSU for testing] >That may not be possible. A Sys/34 PSU takes about 1/4 of the machine's size - >It's about 1/2 of the front section of the CPU box. >There's additional parts to it in the rear section. Oh, and there's a small >red switch toward the top center of the non-CE panel side of the machine, see >that? It *HAS* to be on to power the machine up. It'll say "power check" >on the frontpanel if you don't. Oh, another thing: See the big LOAD button >on the frontpanel next to the FDD? You think that's to LOAD a floppy, right? >WRONG, read LOAD as RESET... (I found this out the WRONG way...) >you push it to reload the O/S. >------- > ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com

28 years, 2 months

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Micropolis Disk Storage Module Model No. 1023-II

by wts＠exo.com

I have a Micropolis Disk Storage Module Model No. 1023-II that I got 10 years ago with an Altair. I would like to get it running again. It is a 5.25-inch drive that looks very similiar to the ones used in early Vector Graphic S-100 systems. Does anyone have a manual or information about this drive? Tom

28 years, 2 months

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GP-IB (was Re: Atari 8-bit Find)

by sinasohn＠ricochet.net

At 02:27 AM 2/15/98 -0600, you wrote: >Which reminds me: why didn't IEEE-488 ever become a big hit in the >computer biz? It's been around since the 60's, is standard, has good It's used by: Commodore Pets GRiD Compass HP 3000 HP 1000 (I think) Probably others... --------------------------------------------------------------------- O- Uncle Roger "There is pleasure pure in being mad roger(a)sinasohn.com that none but madmen know." Roger Louis Sinasohn & Associates San Francisco, California http://www.sinasohn.com/

28 years, 2 months

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System/34 contd.

by Philip.Belben＠powertech.co.uk

> For one thing, what is the CE Panel? The thing is in a corner, with > the end that has the floppy drive on it visible, as well as the side Someone else has already given a far better reply than I could. > that has a small power switch on it. I went down to Radio Shack, they > only had 220-110 transformers that could handle up to 40 Watts. I have > a hint this might not be enoug ;) Also, they had 110-220 transformers. > Could I just wire one of those backwards and get the same result? Possible but not a good performer. Step-down transformers are usually wound for around 220-120V and allow for 10V or so of voltage drop. You'd be lucky to get more than 200V out on any sort of load. Also, 40VA is about 100 times too small :-( Try industrial equipment suppliers - 1kVA, 3kVA, even 5kVA transformers should be obtainable. And the bigger it is the less it'll suffer from voltage drop. > Wouldn't it be easier to just wire two 110 volt plugs together like > I was told I could try if I like "but I would far better notter"? > IS this indeed like trying to move heat from a cold to a hot object? Yes, insofar as it can be done, but don't just connect it up and expect it to happen. And if you get it wrong you'll probably melt the cold object, um, I mean wiring, not to mention causing a big flash and bang and/or your death. The two sockets to which you'd have to connect are almost certain not to be in the same room. If you really want to go down this route, here are some things to think about: First, use 3 pin plugs wherever possible - reversing the polarity of a 2 pin plug at any point during the following procedure could quite literally be fatal. One pin of every 110V socket in the house is a "neutral" pin - at ground potential but not part of the ground connection. The other pin of each socket is "live" at 110V to ground. In each socket, identify the neutral pin if you can (a voltmeter between power pin and ground _should_ do it - if you get 0V or something silly like 40V on each side, you haven't found ground) To evaluate a pair of sockets connect the voltmeter between the live pin of one and the live pin of the other. You should get either 0V or 220V (+/- about 20V in each case). If you get 220V you _may_ be onto a winner. The final barrier is protection. Earth leakage protection (GFCI I think it's called in the US) is almost universal. If the two circuits are on the same GFCI relay, you're OK. If they are not, you're not. The test is, connect an ordinary table lamp (or similar) between live on one socket and neutral on the other. (Check with voltmeter first - it should give 110V.) If the GFCI trips, you can't get 220V by this method. If the GFCI remains stable, you wire up a junction box that takes live >from each socket plus ground from somewhere safe and feeds a 220V socket. Now, are you still thinking of using that method? If so, you shouldn't be! Seriously, I'd recommend extracting the PSU from the machine and opening it up. You never know, it may be easily modifiable to 110V operation. Alternatively, you may be able to substitute one or more 110V PSUs to power the LV outputs in the same manner. Finally, if the machine hasn't been powered up for a few years, you should definitely remove the PSU, power it up with no more than light bulbs on the outputs, and measure voltages. Philip.

28 years, 2 months

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Cray articles

by dastar＠wco.com

Here is a series of articles from the Memorybilia web page (http://www.memorybilia.com) about the Cray's Tony Cole bought. Too bad he's doing what he's doing, but then again, nobody drops $15,000 without the intention of making it back. This Cray has had its day What was once the world's fastest computer is sold by Livermore Lab for its scrap value By Tom Abate EXAMINER TECHNOLOGY WRITER Call it a symbol of technology obsolescence, or a museum piece, perhaps. But a Cray1 supercomputer, once the world's fastest computational device, is now sitting in a South San Francisco warehouse, where it will either be sold to a collector or get melted down to recover the five tons of copper and gold inside. Hayward businessman Tony Cole bought the supercomputer for $10,000 at a surplus equipment auction at Lawrence Livermore National Laboratory. When purchased new in the late 1970s, the Cray 1 cost $19,000,000, lab officials said. "We got our money's worth out of it," said Derrol Hammer, a purchasing agent at the lab. "We ran that machine for over 10 years at 24 hours a day." But Hammer said it cost more that $35,000 a month to run the Cray 1, a cylindrical machine that is 7 feet tall and 9 feet in diameter, and requires its own electrical substation to provide it with power. "A desktop workstation of the Sun type, or a Silicon Graphics workstation that we can put on a desk, is a Cray 1 equivalent." Hammer said. "You can buy a workstation for the monthly cost of maintenance" on the Cray 1. So in 1990 Livermore pulled the plug on the aging supercomputer, and began asking other government and university labs if they wanted the 10,000 pound digital dinosaur. When no takers surfaced, the lab auction off the machine in February. Enter Tony Cole, 29 founder of VIPC Computers, a 10-year-old Hayward firm that salvages useful components or scrap metals from surplus machines. Cole offered the highest of seven bids, and drove away on a flat-bed truck with several tons of supercomputer and associated peripherals. "We're sure to make our money back on the scrap value of the metal alone," Cole said. "There's at least $15,000 worth of gold in that thing." Because it is an excellent conductor, gold was used to coat the edge connectors on the more that 1,600 circuits cards that made up the Cray's innards. Cole said each circuit card also contain about 2 pound of valuable copper. But rather than crush the machine for its metals, Cole would like to sell it intact as a relic or the early supercomputer age. "The Cray system is the granddaddy of all of them." Cole said. "I would like to sell it to somebody like Bill Gates or Ross Perot. "It would make a great center-piece." But so far the Hayward entrepreneur has had trouble even giving the Cray away. Gloria Chun Hoo of the Tech Museum of Innovation in San Jose said Cole had offered to loan the machine to her institution, but the museum thinks it is too heavy. "We thought we could put in our lobby," she said. "But occasionally people have evening receptions here, and we couldn't keep moving it out of the way." The Oakland Tribune, Wednesday April 14th. 1993 Lab sells its supercomputer at a bargain-for $10,000 After 10 years or use, the one-time $19 million machine was just too outdated and costly to keep By David Berkowitz STAFF WRITER Was it colossal government waste or just the price of staying in the research game? About 10 years ago, Lawrence Livermore Laboratory paid $19 million for a Cray-1 supercomputer, then the fastest, most complex computer available in the world. In late February, the lab sold that same computer at auction-less a few key propriety components-for $10,000 to Hayward computer reseller. Tony Cole, 29, said he bought the machine figuring that at the very least he could break it down and sell its gold and other metal parts for $16,000 to $20,000. At best, Cole hopes to deal the 30-ton machine to a technology museum or some domestic company able to foot the $100,000 to $500,000 tab of restarting the now-obsolete machine. Seven parties submitted sealed bids to buy the supercomputer at the auction, a lab spokeswomen said. "Normally you can't get hold of one of these, regardless of the age, because of the nature of it." Said Cole, only the second private citizen to buy a Cray-1. Cray Research Inc. installed about 40 Cray-1s between 1976 and 1982, after which it released the more Cray X-MP and the Cray-2, said Ron Rayome, an analyst with Cray in San Ramon. The computer was used to simulate physical events, such as airflow over an airplane's wing or a missile's casing. "The thing that made the Cray-1 unique was that it was products that exhibited a clear superiority to any other previous technology," said Alan Geller, a sales representative for Cray. Lawrence Livermore Laboratory, deeply entrenched in weapons research during the Cold War era, considered the supercomputer crucial to its design efforts. For the lab, it wasn't a matter of paying $19 million for a machine that would lose nearly all of its value in 10 years: it was a matter of getting the most possible use from a top computer for $1.9 million a year, plus maintenance cost, said Mike May, a former lab director. "You don't really buy it with the idea of reselling it," said Gary Dvorchak, an industry analyst with Hambrecht & Quist in San Francisco. "Presumably, they got the full value they were looking for in terms of the projects they were working on. There are things you can't do without a supercomputer. That's why they're buying them." "There's not much choice," agreed Bruce Kelly, a computer scientist at the lab. "That's the price tag they put on those types of machines. And we need the machine. They do large scientific calculations, real number-floating point calculations. They do them very fast, and they can do a lot of them." Today, the lab uses newer versions of Cray supercomputer, including the latest $30 million YMP-C-90, which is 100 times more powerful than the Cray-1. The Cray-1 that Cole bought was actually one or two the lab retired to a warehouse in 1990 because the were outdated and too costly to maintain. The other was sold three years ago. Darrol Hammer, a technician who works with supercomputers, said the lab was paying more than $30,000 a month to keep the Cray-1's running. Meanwhile, he said many modern desktop computers were able to perform the same functions as quickly and accurately as the Cray, he said. "It just does not pay to keep something like that going." Hammer said. "The power requirements on one of those is incredible." Computer Currents Volume 10 Number 23, April 20, 1993 NEWS & INDUSTRY SILICON VALLEY NEWS "Look Honey, I Bought A Cray 1 Supercomputer!" Tony Cole of Hayward, California says he is the first individual on record to own a Cray Model 1 supercomputer. Though the supercomputer doesn't work, Cole says the gold in it alone could be worth as much as $60,000. Cole bought the Cray at a government auction held by Lawrence Livermore National Laboratory (Livermore, Calif.) in February of this year. Cole says the Cray can be fixed, and he plans to sell it to the highest bidder. It stands about seven feet high, weighs in at 20,000 pounds, and cost the government an estimated $19 million new in 1976. Cole said he bid a binary amount, $10,101.01, for the Cray in sealed bids accepted by Lawrence Livermore, figuring the binary number would be lucky. He won the bid, but it took a week for Livermore Labs to requisition a forklift big enough to move the supercomputer the 100 feet to the dock where Cole could load it. The Cray 1 was billed as the first "designer" computer with its cylindrical shape and custom genuine leather upholstery. It took four years for Seymours Cray to build the first Cray 1 when he started Cray Research in 1972. When the first Crays were delivered, they were the world's fastest supercomputers, but only three were known to be still operational in 1991, while others have become museum pieces. The Cray 1 is cooled be liquid nitrogen, and offers 29 14-inch removable media disk drives systems weighing in at 600 pounds each. The main computer housing holds 20 panels with 2,800 printed circuit boards with gold connectors. As for processing speed, Digital Equipment Corporation's new 64-bits Alpha chip, 21064, offers the same processing speed as the Cray 1. Cole says while he could get his money back be selling the Cray for scrap metal, he is hoping to get more. "Selling a Cray just to get gold out of it would be like selling a Model-T Ford for the scrap iron," Cole said. He's hoping Ross Perot or Bill Gates might be interested in having the Cray for their offices. An old Cray employee has even contacted him to offer to get the Cray working again. "I'm waiting to see what happens," Cole added. Own a Piece of History Dept: A couple of years ago, Tony Cole of Hayward, California, became the first and only citizen to own a Cray-1 supercomputer. He bought it at an auction, over the protest of the government. Apparently, the thing is supposed to be sold to the military or who knows what other authorized organizations. Anyway, Tony has taken the printed circuit boards (cards) out of it and selling them enclosed between two thick slabs of Lucite as collectors items, conversation pieces, or whatever you want to call them. These are probably the only cards from a Cray-1 ever to be sold this way, and there are fewer than thousand available. Each one is different, two-sided, and cool looking. Each original card seems to have been mounted on 1 1/2 pound copper plate. Cole is selling them for $xxx.xx each plus $10.00 shipping fee (they weight a lot). Each is about 8 by 10 inches. Grab a piece of history for your desk or wall while you can. Tony can be contacted at Memorybilia Computers, P. O. Box 25554, San Mateo, Ca 94402; 415 525-1212, Pager 415 377-7701. This is one unique and outstanding gift idea for the Techie. Seriously cool. A piece of history TONY COLE IS A COMPUTER freak supercomputers that is. Fascinated with the supercomputers that Lawrence Livermore Laboratory was using to test weapons during the height of the Cold War, Cole bought a 10-ton Cray-1 computer at auction three years ago for $10,101.01. The government originally paid $23 million for the supercomputer. But advances in technology made it obsolete. At the time, Cole told Alameda Newspaper Group he'd melt down it's gold content, sell it and put the Cray's hulk in the San Jose Tech Museum of Innovation. Bill Gates, Microsoft's founder and a history buff, told him to do the same thing. Cole quickly found out that wouldn't work, thought, because his 10-ton baby was to heavy for the museum's floors. THE OPEN SOLUTION: Cole founded Memorybilia Computers, a Hayward company built around his Cray. He is breaking that discarded hunk of machinery into parts, mounting it in acrylic and selling it as historical art. Don't laugh. If you've ever visited a top Silicon Valley firm, you know this stuff is everywhere. And Cole is sure tech-art's popularity will continue that he's just bought three, later model supercomputers from Cray itself for a lowly $5,000. The cost to own a piece of technology history? About $200 to $250. Sam Alternate e-mail: dastar(a)siconic.com ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Computer Historian, Programmer, Musician, Philosopher, Athlete, Writer, Jackass Coming Soon...Vintage Computer Festival 2.0 See http://www.siconic.com/vcf for details!

28 years, 2 months

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Linux, Apache, Scripting books (Off-Topic)

by photze＠batelco.com.bh

No, it's OK... I'm happy with the web. After all, it's getting to be classic, and is probably the future. > >Atari BBS* instead. Mine was a 130XE with 384K ram (I did the upgrade > >myself - had to run it with the cover off because of the heat), 4 1050 > >disk drives, and a single 2400b Codex modem. I was 13 years old, I don't > > ABACUS (the Atari Bay Area Computer Users Society) still runs it's BBS on > an Atari 1040ST. (Though, to keep this off-topic, we're thinking of moving > to a linux box.) A travesty !! Or do you mean minix. The Toronto Atari Federation still uses FoRem on a TT. (still sucks) (The sys-op will get me for that ! ) ciao larry lwalkerN0spaM(a)interlog.com

28 years, 2 months

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Anyone want a Cray

by fmc＠reanimators.org

Ward Donald Griffiths III <gram(a)cnct.com> wrote: > Did the cops catch up with you after you caught up with him? Did he die > slowly enough to encourage the rest of us to discourage the metal dealers? We all start dying the moment we're born, how do you expect Sam to slow that down? Anyway, this thread got me thinking about a note I saw in comp.sys.super a couple of weeks back. Here it is, cut'n'pasted from DejaNews. Just some things for y'all to think about. -Frank McConnell --- cut here --- Subject: Re: Thinking Machines... From: eugene(a)george.arc.nasa.gov (Eugene N. Miya) Date: 1998/02/04 Message-ID: <6b9dut$k445(a)news.arc.nasa.gov> Newsgroups: comp.sys.super In article <34de7adc.64515852(a)news-s02.ny.us.ibm.net> abaddon(a)ibm.net (Michael Ross) writes: >Several Cray beasts have found their way into museums, but I am >unaware of any TMC machines that have been preserved - and I know of >several that have been scrapped... Several. TCM has a CM-1, a CM-2, and a CM-5 by recollection. Brewster Kahle has kept at least one in his basement (so told). I have yet to attend one of his parties to examine it. The fundamental problem appears to be a guy in Hollywood who has taken to supply electronics as props for movie sets who is attempting to corner the market. I can view a piece of the SAGE system, and I think similar panels have been used on television like the Irwin Allen series Time Tunnel. >Does anyone know of any that may be got rid of in the near (or >not-so-near) future? Preferably in Europe? Particularly the earlier >CM-2 and CM-200 models (pre-sparc). Someone has got to make a point of >saving one, and I would fancy the job ( It'll make a change from >saving pdp-8's and DEC 10's :-) > >Come to think of it, if anyone knows any other serious boxes being got >rid of, please let me know... "That would be telling." Oh, there are several people working on this. It depends on your intent. I can tell you, you have "heavy-weight" competition. Saving this stuff is a lot more expensive than most people realized. And then there is Tony Cole..... --- cut here ---

28 years, 2 months

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Anyone want a Cray

by foxvideo＠wincom.net

At 08:56 PM 2/17/98 -0500, you wrote: >> Well, I personally doubt anyone will actually pay that amount since you >> could get similar computing power from a contemporary PC for a fraction of >> that price > >Umm, really... > >Even a low end EL would waste a hotshot PeeCee in a real world number >crunch contest. A Pentium II (or Alpha, or UltraSPARC II) just can not >keep up a good, sustained vector flow like a Cray. Getting a decent 100 >Mflops is very hard to do on a desktop system today, but not for a ca. >1976 Cray-1. If this Cray for sale is a decent Y/MP type, it could >probably sustain many hundreds of Mflops, perhaps into a Gflop. > >And then there is the issue of the memory bandwidth... Seems to me I recall reading a bit of folklore where someone at Apple told Cray that they had used their new Cray to help design their new Apple and Cray replied that they had used an Apple to help design the Cray. Cheers Charlie Fox PS... Sam, did you get your copy of the videotape? > > >

28 years, 2 months

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IEEE-488 and Commodore (was: GP-IB)

by Philip.Belben＠powertech.co.uk

>> Pardon me if I ask a stupid question, but If they were going to >> implement a high-speed serial bus for the C64/VIC/1541's, why would >> they use a device that was primarily designed for PARALLEL >> operation? >> >> It seems that a 6850/6851 ACIA would have been much more appropriate, >> and would have not been such a software mess. > > If computer holy war zealots knew the story behind this Commodore debacle > back in the 80's when the flames were at their highest temperatures, the > anti-C64 contingent would have had a field day. Wouldn't they just! It seems to me that if it's anything like the PET, they were using this parallel chip for all sorts of functions - keyboard scanning for a start - and they were trying to save a chip by putting the high speed serial link onto the shift register function. <rant> It doesn't take that much more time/effort/money to do it properly.... <\rant> Philip.

28 years, 2 months

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LCD life

by sinasohn＠ricochet.net

At 02:16 AM 2/15/98 -0600, you wrote: >Portables also make good collectibles because they tend to have the best >technology of their time, are integrated, and don't take a lot of space! And as the 10-year mark gets further into the dregs of pc-sameness, portables still offer a wealth of individuality. Some more recent portables of note: Atari Portfolio (1989) Fujistu Poquet (1989) Gateway Handbook (?) Dauphin DTR1 Various GRiD's and GRiDPads NCR Pen computers Dolch Lunchboxes Various ruggedized laptops etc. --------------------------------------------------------------------- O- Uncle Roger "There is pleasure pure in being mad roger(a)sinasohn.com that none but madmen know." Roger Louis Sinasohn & Associates San Francisco, California http://www.sinasohn.com/

28 years, 2 months

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Disk Exerciser

by sinasohn＠ricochet.net

At 10:09 PM 2/13/98 -0500, you wrote: >I've never HEARD of a disk exerciser. > >What on earth is one for? Pushups? Situps? To get those oversized 8" disks down to a svelte 5.25"... --------------------------------------------------------------------- O- Uncle Roger "There is pleasure pure in being mad roger(a)sinasohn.com that none but madmen know." Roger Louis Sinasohn & Associates San Francisco, California http://www.sinasohn.com/

28 years, 2 months

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IEEE-488 and Commodore (was: GP-IB)

by photze＠batelco.com.bh

THUS FAR, I HAVE SEEN NO COMPUTERS THAT SUCK. (EXCEPT ONE'S BASED ON MS OS'S) APPLE II'S HAPPEN TO BE ONE OF THE LONGEST RANGING, AND STILL EVOLVING "SPECIES" OF COMPUTERS > >>Oh well, you gotta love it. >> >>PS. So the Commodore did suck after all ;) > >yes, but not quite as sucky as Atari's and especially Apple II's! : P > >Les > > >

28 years, 2 months

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OOPs AT&Ts

by lfb107＠psu.edu

At 09:29 PM 2/16/98, Joe wrote: >At 01:35 PM 2/16/98 -0700, you wrote: >>Joe: >> >>Do you have any software??? > > Nope, none, notta, zip. Do you have any software or docs for the 3B2? >I did find an old software archive for the 3B1 at Ohio State U. There is >supposed to be an archive for the 3B2 but I couldn't find it. >> >>-Mike Software is going to be near impossible to find. have you started up the 3B2 yet? If the root password is changed, your going to be screwed without system disks. Check comp.sys.att for 3B2 stuff. Haven't checked in in a while but when i did, there were hard disks, more 3B2's, NIC's, etc. for sale all the time. System disks are going to be hard to find. I've got a set (only thru extreme luck) but nobody's getting 'em! AT&T might actually still sell the disks though you'd probably pay $1,000 for them or some other silly amount. les

28 years, 2 months

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I got an Apple ProFile hard drive.

by allisonp＠world.std.com

< Geez! An original 5 Mb Seagate 506! I used to have a maintenance <manual for it but I haven't seen it in at least 10 years. I also have a I must have 5 or 6 ST506 and ST412s all good here most with low time. < The squeal is probably coming from the ground strap on the bottom <spindle. Try putting a bit of powered graphite on it and see if that Common! Allison

28 years, 2 months

3
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GP-IB (was Re: Atari 8-bit Find)

by thedm＠sunflower.com

Also used by C3, Sperry and Unisys for the 48 workstation serial link under CTOS/BTOS. -----Original Message----- From: John Rollins <rexstout(a)ptld.uswest.net> To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers <classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu> Date: Tuesday, February 17, 1998 9:02 PM Subject: Re: GP-IB (was Re: Atari 8-bit Find) > >>>Which reminds me: why didn't IEEE-488 ever become a big hit in the >>>computer biz? It's been around since the 60's, is standard, has good > >Maybe because the cables are so expensive? > >>It's used by: >> >>Commodore Pets >>GRiD Compass >>HP 3000 >>HP 1000 (I think) >> >>Probably others... >And don't forget the HP 9000... Actually, HP uses their own variant, called >HP-IB. It's probably compatible with GP-IB, but I'm not sure. I have an >8-bit ISA HP-IB controller around here somewhere, but nothing to use it >with(at least not yet). > >-JR http://members.tripod.com/~jrollins/index.html - Computers > http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Lair/1681/ - Star Trek > >

28 years, 2 months

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9370 is a dog! Was: Re: Re[2]: Firsts

by allisonp＠world.std.com

<Are these all water machines? There are some air-cooled versions that ar <probably reasonable. Water cooling isn't that bad. You could use heating compoents for pumps if needed and heat extraction from the water could be a automotive radiator with a blower to room air. Of cource the room temperature would rise but for short term ops that would work. <Yes, the 400 Hz would be a problem, almost as much as a cooling system (i <one went with a water machine - probably too big of a headache). Assuming you need 50kw, if it were say 10kw or less the scale of things drops to more managable proportions. Allison

28 years, 2 months

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BBC Model B - video help

by allisonp＠world.std.com

<the only thing that could cause this would be the 6845 CRTC chip (IC2 on <my schematic). The cursor signal is produced by that chip (at least in Unlikely but possible. More likely is a memory address error. A stuck address line will cause data to repeat 2*n times in the display memory. <modes 0-6), and so if there was any problem later on, then at least the <cursor would be in the right _phyical_ position, (and would presumably <not line up with what you are typing). If the 6845 is socketed, then try <reseating it (pull it out and push it back in again). Same for other chips around it. Allison

28 years, 2 months

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Linux, Apache, Scripting books (Off-Topic)

by sinasohn＠ricochet.net

At 10:55 AM 2/17/98 +0000, you wrote: >> ABACUS (the Atari Bay Area Computer Users Society) still runs it's BBS on >> an Atari 1040ST. (Though, to keep this off-topic, we're thinking of moving >> to a linux box.) > > A travesty !! Or do you mean minix. The Toronto Atari Federation >still uses FoRem on a TT. (still sucks) (The sys-op will get me for >that ! ) Well, Most of the club members have non-Atari modems... Why stick to only Atari when there is an alternative that will do a better job of letting us make the most of our Atari's? I see the BBS like a modem; doesn't need to be an Atari to host Atari discussions. In any case, it's kind of a moot point as ABACUS now supports Mac and PC users. We decided that the true value in the club was the members. We knew each other, and enjoy our company, and don't want to lose that just because some have moved on to another platform. So now we do everything. Something to think about as an alternative to letting a good club die out. --------------------------------------------------------------------- O- Uncle Roger "There is pleasure pure in being mad roger(a)sinasohn.com that none but madmen know." Roger Louis Sinasohn & Associates San Francisco, California http://www.sinasohn.com/

28 years, 2 months

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MicroVAX II -- Nicely set up! -- Needs rescue

by kyrrin2＠wizards.net

Here's a fellow looking for a good home for his MVII. Anyone? -=-=- <snip> -=-=- From: "Brett A. Farnam" <bfarnam(a)skantech.com> Newsgroups: comp.sys.dec Subject: Micro Vax II Date: Tue, 17 Feb 1998 19:59:49 -0500 Lines: 12 X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.2106.4 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.2106.4 NNTP-Posting-Host: 208.201.215.251 Message-ID: <34ea323c.0(a)news.Skantech.com> Path: Supernews70!Supernews73!supernews.com!newsfeed.direct.ca!streamer1.cleveland.iagnet.net!qual.net!iagnet.net!198.6.0.23!uunet!in4.uu.net!news.Skantech.com!208.201.215.251 Xref: Supernews70 comp.sys.dec:60608 To any one interested, I have a MicroVax II that is nicely configured and licensced in my name. I need to find a home for it. Any thoughts? I am willing to donate it before it becomes trash. I have Open VMS with DEC Net, (2) RA90's, (1) TK 50, (1) TS 05 all in a standard DEC issue 48" cab. Brett A. Farnam -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Bruce Lane, SysOp, The Dragon's Cave BBS (Fido 1:343/272) kyrrin2 {at} wiz<ards> d[o]t n=e=t "...No matter how hard we may wish otherwise, our science can only describe an object, event, or living creature, in our own human terms. It cannot possibly define any of them!..."

28 years, 2 months

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Apple II info ?

by lwalker＠mail.interlog.com

I just picked up an AppleII and 2 FDDs with a bunch of add-ons at a local thrift store. The only Apple I have explored is my Mac+. Anyone able to identify the cards ? A Disk II interface card...... obvious. Ram Module by Multiflex Tech Inc.....I imagine additional ram Grapple+ Printer Interface......... Serial, Parallel ?? Multiflex Tech ...Long card with kludged cable to an RCA male connector and another to a clothes-pin chip staddler labelled AP TC/14. Two labelled chips "Firmware" and "Char. Gen." (imagine this is a video card of some sort.) Modem 80 card with 2 tel. jacks........... Baud-rate ? CableTV kludge to a "SUP 'R' MOD CH.33 TV Interface Unit ?? External added-on connector 2x3 blade (like an AC outlet but with 3 pairs of smaller female recepticles in one unit) ?? It also has what I imagine is stock Ext. video (single RCA) and cassette (2 mini-pin i/o ) Any help appreciated. ciao larry lwalkerN0spaM(a)interlog.com

28 years, 2 months

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Thinking about selling my TRS 80 Model 100

by transit＠primenet.com

Last fall, I bought a Model 100 which was fine, except the LCD doesn't work. I thought I could fix it, but find I really have no time to troubleshoot it . .. I'm willing to resell it to anyone on this list for $10 + shipping, send me e-mail if you're interested. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Charles P. Hobbs __ __ ____ ___ ___ ____ transit(a)primenet.com /__)/__) / / / / /_ /\ / /_ / / / \ / / / / /__ / \/ /___ / -------------------------------------------------------------------------------

28 years, 2 months

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PDP-11/34 & DG Nova-3

by Philip.Belben＠powertech.co.uk

> > 1) Check the PSU in the 11/34 CPU. It's probably fine, > > but you don't want to ruin all your boards > > How should I check the power supply? I know that many people here > say you should always do this but with the small cheap micros I've > picked up so far I haven't bothered. Disconnect the PSU from the backplanes. Inspect it visually to make sure there are no obvious uprooted components, cooked tracks, etc. Connect dummy loads between the important supply rails and ground (I think they are +5V +15V and -15V in a PDP - Can someone confirm this? Do you need a load on the 20V rail as well?) and switch on. Measure the voltages across the dummy loads. Generally the 15V rails don't need to be loaded very heavily - a resistor of 100 ohms rated at a few watts ought to do it. You ought to try and draw several amps from the 5V rail - a 6V car headlamp bulb is ideal. Light bulbs make good dummy loads in any case because you can see if there is any current there... Beyond that, there are plenty of PDP hackers on this list who can take up the story at this point... Philip. PS I too will admit to not doing this nearly often enough...

28 years, 2 months

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Anyone want a Cray

by fmc＠reanimators.org

Sam Ismail <dastar(a)wco.com> wrote: > The Lawrence Livermore National Laboratories (across the street from my > neighborhood) auctioned off their Cray in 1993 and it was sold for $10,000 > to some oaf who said he could get lots of gold out of it and was thus very > excited (there was a newspaper article about it). I was incensed, but oh > well. I expect there will be similarly high bidding by the scrappers on > this poor guy as well. Hmm, Tony Cole? Seems he has put one on display at The Computer Museum's History Center and is selling bits and pieces of others, encased in Lucite as geek memorabilia. There was a story about this in the San Jose Mercury a while back, which probably means that it's up on their web site, hmm.... http://www.sjmercury.com/columnists/cassidy/docs/mc011898.htm -Frank McConnell

28 years, 2 months

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TRS80 Model 4P problem

by KFergason＠aol.com

I have a slightly wierd problem. Not sure if it is hardware or software. Ok, I turn the 4p on with no floppy in the drive. It says: The Floppy Disk Drive is not Ready. (in 3 languages, no less) I put in the TRSDOS 6 system disk, the system appears to boot, but the monitor looks like there is no sync. It is very fuzzy. I can type in the date, and enter a command (dir :1), and the system appears to do it. Why does actually getting booted up cause the monitor to be unusable? Trying other disks in the drive, if they are not system disks, causes other messages to appear, perfectly readable. Any ideas? Kelly

28 years, 2 months

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Epson HX-40 ???

by archive＠navix.net

Greets: This weekend I had a great run of the swap meets, etc., in Wichita, Kansas and came home with about 50 different machines, tons of software, etc., etc. Anyway, there are two specific machines I would like to ask about now, I will post further questions on several others in the future. First, I picked up an Epson HX-40 laptop-sized computer. On the front it says MagicBox above the LCD screen. On the back there is a battery bay as well as a rom chip bay, and it says Epson HX-40 Model # H401A. I understand this machines runs off of program-specific rom chips. It has a chip in the slot under the trap-door, and when I boot it, it comes up to a pharmacetical company inventory, order, etc., menu. The machines runs off of 4 AA batteries or a AC adapter. It really is a cute machine, but I want to know more. In searching the web, I find 1 measly reference to this machine... yes, 1 (or two), neither of which give any info. on this machine. It is listed on a guys resume as having experience in working with it. I do find a lot of information on the well-known Epson HX-20 --- known as the 1st laptop computer. In finding pictures of that, this one looks really similar. This one has ports labeled BCP and one labeled SP on one side, and on the back is the cassette, seriel, and RS-232C, printer, and power adaptor ports. There is also a 50-pin port on the opposite side with no label. I guess what I am wondering is if any of you have some more information on this little guy? No year can be found on it, but I suspect early 1980s. Does anyone have any other 'chips' for it to insert other software into memory. Are these units rare? Please let me know any information. If you're interested in it let me know that to. Next, I am curious about a Data General One laptop computer I picked up. Specifically, I need to know what type of power supply it takes, as I can't find that information anywhere. It says it is ms-dos based, but I am wondering what dos would run on it. It has 2 3.5" disk drives (Epson drives), and I am curious as to if it had a hard drive? It has a full-screen, I would suppose monochrome? Could it display graphics, etc.? Also, when was it made? *any* information on the above two items most certainly are welcome, and would be quite appreciated. Please let me know if you are interested in getting either one of these as well. I will post some more very unique items in the next couple of days that I was lucky enough to get my grubby little hands on.... Thanks in advance, CORD COSLOR -- ___________________________________________________ | Cord G. Coslor : archive(a)navix.net |\ | Deanna S. Wynn : deannasue(a)navix.net | | |---------------------------------------------------| | | http://www.geocities.com/SiliconValley/Vista/4395 | | |---------------------------------------------------| | | PO Box 308 - Peru, NE - 68421 - (402) 872- 3272 | | |___________________________________________________| | \____________________________________________________\|

28 years, 2 months

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Anyone want a Cray

by maxeskin＠hotmail.com

How much sense does that make? Isn't it a bit like saying "You can pay 100,000 for it, or you can pay 10, either is fine with us"? If it doesn't weigh too much, ship it to the US, I'm sure there are more customers here (I doubt I'll get much use from it, unless it runs term and MS Word ;) >How often do these come up for sale? A Cray, about 6 or 7 years old, >apparntly, is being sold in Australia. They're asking $100,000, which >puts it a tad out of my range. :) However, if it isn't sold it will be >scrapped - I wonder if they will accept a couple of cartons of beer over >whatever the scrap offer is? > >Anyone want it? :) > >Adam. > ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com

28 years, 2 months

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Stupid BIOS tricks

by maxeskin＠hotmail.com

I pretty much knew it wouldn't work, but hoped that maybe it would work just like a normal BIOS... anyway, does anyone have that circuit cellar article? What is "inexpensive"? > >> I just downloaded the assembly source to a generic XT bios. It compiles, >> but I can't apparently run it from a command line, or boot off a floppy >> disk that has the thing rawritten on it. > >Um - what are you *expecting* it to do when you run it from the command >line or from floppy disk? > >> Is there a way I COULD do it >> without getting a ROM burner? > >Sure - there are adapters that let you put code into a small CMOS static >RAM with an adapter that fits on the ROM socket. One of Steve Ciarcia's >early Circuit Cellar articles in _BYTE_ shows how to do this. But if I >were you I'd just build or buy an EPROM programmer - they're by no means >expensive. > >Tim. > ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com

28 years, 2 months

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Stupid BIOS tricks

by peacock＠simconv.com

> I just downloaded the assembly source to a generic XT bios. It compiles, > but I can't apparently run it from a command line, or boot off a floppy > disk that has the thing rawritten on it. A BIOS is linked to run at a preset address, usually F000 (64K Z80) or F000:0000 (last 64KB segment on an 8086 in real mode). What I have done when debugging a BIOS is to link it at a lower address (say, 8000:0000), then load it into memory at that address with a debugger, set the CS segment register to 8FFF (a true reset puts it at FFFF), then jump to 8FFF:0000 (simulating a reset to FFFF:0000). Since this is an XT I assume you will be running in real mode, so address translation isn't a problem unless your machine has some kind of additional address mapping logic. Of course you can't run the debugger after that as the BIOS will trash all your vectors. Be sure to modify the BIOS code to stop the memory sizing test below segment 8000 or you will memory test right over your BIOS image. Hope this helps, Jack Peacock

28 years, 2 months

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I got an Apple ProFile hard drive.

by rcini＠email.msn.com

I just got an Apple ProFile hard drive. It seems to work, although I don't have an interface card for it yet. But, it squeaks. You know, like a water pump on a car before it blows (that's the pump bearings, BTW). Does anyone have any check-out/maintenance tips for this drive? The hard drive is labeled "Seagate model ST-506". Thanks! Rich Cini/WUGNET <nospam_rcini(a)msn.com> (remove nospam_ to use) ClubWin! Charter Member (6) MCP Windows 95/Windows Networking ============================================

28 years, 2 months

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Junk nite

by adavie＠mad.scientist.com

Just curious if I should really keep this rather well designed computer Its an "Olivetti M24 Personal Computer". I'd never seen an Olivetti before, which is why I saved it from the scap heap. Now is it scarce or nice enough to attempt to get running? If not, it becomes my new post box - rip out the drives and contents, sit it on top of a pole outside the house, paint the house number on the monitor screen :) Should look good! Also found, and free for a good home (cover my costs) a great condition box set of Texas Instruments Professional Computer MS-DOS manuals. I don't but thought somebody else might want them. Andrew.

28 years, 2 months

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Stupid BIOS tricks

by maxeskin＠hotmail.com

I just downloaded the assembly source to a generic XT bios. It compiles, but I can't apparently run it from a command line, or boot off a floppy disk that has the thing rawritten on it. Is there a way I COULD do it without getting a ROM burner? ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com

28 years, 2 months

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C64 Modem issue

by kroma＠worldnet.att.net

>I have a C-64c and a Commodore brand 1200 modem. Since I still haven't had >a chance to resolve the problem with my 1541 disk drive, I'd like to >explore using the modem a bit. Can it be done in BASIC? Meaning, can I >issue certain BASIC commands to init the modem and dial out? It's been a >while since I've messed with any Commie machine, and when I did, I couldn't >afford the "luxury" of a 1200 baud modem. This may be something simple, and >I'd appreciate any help, even a pointer to info on the internet. >

28 years, 2 months

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Kaypro 4 modem

by alanr＠morgan.ucs.mun.ca

I just got my hands on a Kaypro 4 in excellent condition, complete with software and manuals. However, I cannot seem to get the internal 300 baud modem working. I have two programs here with it, one is KERMIT for the Kaypro II CP/M 2.2, and the other is Superterm Version 5. According to the addendum with the machine, the version of Superterm that I have was modified for use with the internal modem on the Kaypro 4, however I cannot seem to get the modem to do anything. Would this modem accept AT commands? and if not, what commands do I have to send to it in command mode? Any help would be appreciated. On a side note, anybody remember the Star Trek basic game? They just don't make games like that anymore. I'm sitting here with Quake, QuakeII, and a whole slew of other advanced 3D games on my pentium, but I cannot tear myself away from playng Star Trek on the Kaypro! (getting my ass kicked, can't aim the torpedo's worth a damn :)

28 years, 2 months

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Is there some special trick required to get RT-11 to sysgen?

by DSEAGRAV＠toad.xkl.com

I do @sysgen and it runs out of memory every time. Under RT11XM. I have 2 MW of RAM here, shouldn't that be enough? -------

28 years, 2 months

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System/34 contd.

by maxeskin＠hotmail.com

UHOH! That means that I will have to move the thing! It's against the wall! With three 74-pound terminals on it, no less! This machine ran in 1980, when it was last used. Possibly, it has been eaten by the two- foot long rats that live in our building. To restate what I previously said, it needs a 220-v power source and I am trying to run it in an area that only has 110-v plugs. >[Previously, a load of questions...] >The CE panel is the Customer Engineer panel. WHile facing the front of the machine, take a step to your right. Turn left 90 degrees. Take another step >right. You should (Depending on your stride) be looking at a small hinged cover >about 12" high, on the left side of the machine. Open it. Inside is a mess of >switches and lights. This is the CE panel, similar to the frontpanel of a PDP-11 >or similar mini. WHen the machine is running you can watch the LEDs flash at >you. > >I'm not sure on the voltage stuff... >Is this machine running? Are you tyring to get it that way? >------- > ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com

28 years, 2 months

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System/34 contd.

by maxeskin＠hotmail.com

For one thing, what is the CE Panel? The thing is in a corner, with the end that has the floppy drive on it visible, as well as the side that has a small power switch on it. I went down to Radio Shack, they only had 220-110 transformers that could handle up to 40 Watts. I have a hint this might not be enoug ;) Also, they had 110-220 transformers. Could I just wire one of those backwards and get the same result? Wouldn't it be easier to just wire two 110 volt plugs together like I was told I could try if I like "but I would far better notter"? IS this indeed like trying to move heat from a cold to a hot object? How many question marks can the listsevrer handle before crashing? ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com

28 years, 2 months

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9370 is a dog! Was: Re: Re[2]: Firsts

by Philip.Belben＠powertech.co.uk

> > Possibly. But I'm not convinced. I seem to remember the biggest IBM > > 3090 system drew about 250kW (I'll have to look that up too!). I > > imagine a typical system might draw perhaps 50kW. > > That is probably for a typical installation. The actual processor is > nowhere near that value (still enough to make the utility very happy, > however). A big string of DASDs adds up very fast, especially the power > sucking IBM disks (why is that? Really big motors)? I don't know where the figure of 250kW came from. I cannot find it anywhere. I have found some figures, though, for indifidual 3090 processor units _only_, dated 1986 and 1987. While I agree with you in principle, William, you'll be surprised at some of these. Figures are electricity consumption in kVA - an upper bound on kW, but not a useful indicator - and heat output in Btu/h which I have converted to kW, which should give a lower bound on electrical power requirements. 3090 Model kVA kW Heat 150 (1986) 32 23.2 kW 400 (top of range in 1986) 83.6 61.8 kW 400 with vector coprocessor 97.8 70.6 kW 120E (1987) 29.7 21.4 kW 150E (1987, replaces 150) 30.4 22.1 kW 400E (1987, replaces 400) 79.9 59.6 kW 600E (top of range in 1987) 95.6 71.5 kW 600E with all expansion 134.6 103.6 kW Note 1986 figures were given with and without vector facility; 1987 figures were given as minimum and maximum values. These figures are not even for a minimum system - you have to add disk drives and that awful 400Hz motor generator set - which can consume up to 7kW in itself. So, as I said, a typical system based around, say, a model 200 might consume 50kW, but even that needn't cripple you financially. Philip.

28 years, 2 months

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IEEE-488 and Commodore (was: GP-IB)

by foxnhare＠goldrush.com

From: Yowza! <yowza(a)yowza.com> Subject: GP-IB (was Re: Atari 8-bit Find) >On Sat, 14 Feb 1998, Larry Anderson & Diane Hare wrote: >> Remember if you find a hint of something you are collecting at a thrift, >> look around for other components (i.e. if you find a Commodore IEEE-488 >> cable start looking for PET/B-128 drives, printers, computers, tapes, >> disks, manuals, etc.) >Which reminds me: why didn't IEEE-488 ever become a big hit in the >computer biz? It's been around since the 60's, is standard, has good >performance, has IC support, can handle a bunch of devices, etc., but it >became relagated to a niche of scientific instrument control for some >reason. Here is an interesting tidbit I found a year or so ago which partially answers at least Commodore's part of the question: **QUOTE** From: brain(a)garnet.msen.com (Jim Brain) Newsgroups: comp.sys.cbm Subject: PC's as 64 HD's and the 6522 chip! Date: 7 Apr 1994 13:48:35 GMT Right after I posted about hooking a 6522 VIA up to a PC parallel port to turn the PC into a "char-banger" instead of a "bit-banger", someone posted that they had thought the 6522 had a problem with the shift register. The poster also said that Jim Butterfield had alerted him and others to it. Well, I have been in correspondence with "The Commodore Man", so I asked him to elaborate on the topic. Here is the two responses: > Yes, it's true. Although I didn't get official confirmation of this >long after, when a Spectrum article quoted the designers. > As you know, the first Commodore computers used the IEEE bus to connect to >peripherals such as disk and printer. I understand that these were available >only from one source: Belden cables. A couple of years into Commodore's >computer career, Belden went out of stock on such cables (military contract? >who knows?). In any case, Commodore were in quite a fix: they made >computers and disk drives, but couldn't hook 'em together! > So Tramiel issued the order: "On our next computer, get off that bus. >Make it a cable anyone can manufacture". And so, starting with the VIC-20 >the serial bus was born. It was intended to be just as fast as the >IEEE-488 it replaced. > Technically, the idea was sound: the 6522 VIA chip has a "shift >register" circuit that, if tickled with the right signals (data and clock) >will cheerfully collect 8 bits of data without any help from the CPU. >At that time, it would signal that it had a byte to be collected, and >the processor would do so, using an automatic handshake built into the >6522 to trigger the next incoming byte. Things worked in a similar way >outgoing from the computer, too. > We early PET/CBM freaks knew, from playing music, that there was something >wrong with the 6522's shift register: it interfered with other functions. >The rule was: turn off the music before you start the tape! (The shift >register was a popular sound generator). But the Commodore engineers, >who only made the chip, didn't know this. Until they got into final >checkout of the VIC-20. > By this time, the VIC-20 board was in manufacture. A new chip could >be designed in a few months (yes, the silicon guys had application notes >about the problem, long since), but it was TOO LATE! > A major software rewrite had to take place that changed the VIC-20 >into a "bit-catcher" rather than a "character-catcher". It called for >eight times as much work on the part of the CPU; and unlike the shift >register plan, there was no timing/handshake slack time. The whole >thing slowed down by a factor of approximately 5 to 6. > There's more (the follow-on C64 catastrophe), but that's where it >happened. --Jim And the saga continues ... > When the 64 came out, the problem VIA 6522 chip had been >replaced by the CIA 6526. This did not have the shift register problem >which had caused trouble on the VIC-20, and at that time it would have >been possible to restore plan 1, a fast serial bus. Note that this would >have called for a redesign of the 1540 disk drive, which also used a VIA. > As best I can estimate - and an article in the IEEE Spectrum magazine >supports this - the matter was discussed within Commodore, and it was >decided that VIC-20 compatibility was more important than disk speed. >Perhaps the prospect of a 1541 redesign was an important part of the >decision, since current inventories needed to be taken into account. > But to keep the Commodore 64 as a "bit-banger", a new problem arose. >The higher-resolution screen of the 64 (as compared to the VIC-20) >could not be supported without stopping the CPU every once in a while. >To be exact: Every 8 screen raster lines (each line of text), the CPU >had to be put into a WAIT condition for 42 microseconds, so as to allow >the next line of screen text and color nybbles to be swept into the chip. >(More time would be needed if sprites were being used). > But the bits were coming in on the serial bus faster than that: aD >a bit would come in about every 20 microseconds! So the poor CPU, frozen >for longer than that, would miss some serial bits completely! > Commodore's solution was to slow down the serial bus even more. >That's why the VIC-20 has a faster serial bus than the 64, even though >the 64 was capable, technically, of running many times faster. > Fast disk finally came into its own with the Commodore 128. --Jim Now someone also told me at one time that they had seen a fastloader that same someone said he thought it was odd that the author of the loader had credited Commodore with the routines. Well, I can hazard a guess that the routines were the ones they had wanted to put in the 6522, but had to scrap due to the 6522 problem. Now I have no idea what the problem is/was, but I am eager to find out. However, I rescind my plans to build something around the 6522 until we find out what the problem is. Jim "Just the Facts" Brain **END QUOTE** The 64 and VIC would have had a faster drive if it wern't for the cables and the chip problems... Probably HP was doing major IEEE-488 sales and it was a strain on the cable manufactuer. IEEE-488 cables nowadays run from $40-$90 new, of course it is a standard 'get' item on my mental thrift store shopping list. -- -+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+- Visit our web page at: http://www.goldrush.com/~foxnhare/ Call our Commodore 64 BBS (Silicon Realms 300-2400 baud) at: (209) 754-1363 -+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-

28 years, 2 months

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RSTS/E on a PDP-11?

by rcini＠email.msn.com

On Mon, 16 Feb 1998 15:06:55 -0800 (PST), Tim Shoppa <shoppa(a)alph02.triumf.ca> wrote: >>What sort of packs? What commands were you issuing to read them? >>What OS did you try to read them from? What error message did you get >>when it failed? They're RK05 packs, inserted in the DK2: device. I booted from DK0: with RT-11 v.4 and used "dir dk2:" to read the disk directory. Although I don't remember the specific error, it's something like "invalid directory." > Can RSTS/E be used on an 11/34? >>Most later versions support the 11/34, though some early versions (pre- >>1977 or so) don't. RSTS/E tends to be quite picky about peripheral >>configurations that it'll run on. I have v.6 and v.7. ------------------------------------------------- Rich Cini/WUGNET <nospam_rcini(a)msn.com> (remove nospam_ to use) - ClubWin Charter Member (6) - MCP Windows 95/Windows Networking

28 years, 2 months

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I got an Apple ProFile hard drive.

by rcini＠email.msn.com

On Mon, 16 Feb 1998 21:50:15 +0000, jpero(a)cgo.wave.ca wrote: >> does that mean I could just plug one of my old ST-225's or other ST-506 >>type drives intoa ProFile card? >>>Oh, you can. Still 5mb or 10mb. :) >>>Remember, all older MFM, ESDI and some early SCSI drives always >>>need annual or bi yearly LLF job. Thanks for the info. Now all that I need is an interface card for my ///. ------------------------------------------------- Rich Cini/WUGNET <nospam_rcini(a)msn.com> (remove nospam_ to use) - ClubWin Charter Member (6) - MCP Windows 95/Windows Networking

28 years, 2 months

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I got an Apple ProFile hard drive.

by rcini＠email.msn.com

On Sun, 15 Feb 1998 17:39:22 -0800, John Rollins <rexstout(a)ptld.uswest.net> wrote: >>Sounds like the ProFile card is just an ST-506 hard drive interface. A >>ST-506 drive is REALLY old. I'm not an expert on the old hard >>drives/interfaces, so I'll let someone else figure all that out, but I >>can tell you that it is very old. Does the ProFile need a seperate power >>cord (does it have it's own ps), or does it get power from the Apple II? >>And if the ProFile is just an ST-506 interface, does that mean I could >>just plug one of my old ST-225's or other ST-506 type drives intoa >>ProFile card? It's a self-contained drive unit that connects to an interface card on the Apple // or /// with a 25-pin DB straight-pinned cable. It does have an Astec power supply built-in. The interface cable to the drive itself reminds me of a floppy cable (IDC edge connector to IDC header), but I didn't count the conductors. I'm assuming that it is a true ST-506 interface, but I don't know for sure. I also haven't had the time to look the drive up in my ref. materials to determine its capacity, etc., but I think that it's a 5mb drive. ------------------------------------------------- Rich Cini/WUGNET <nospam_rcini(a)msn.com> (remove nospam_ to use) - ClubWin Charter Member (6) - MCP Windows 95/Windows Networking

28 years, 2 months

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Anyone want a Cray?

by adam＠merlin.net.au

>>Several Cray beasts have found their way into museums, but I am >>unaware of any TMC machines that have been preserved - and I know of >>several that have been scrapped... > >Several. >TCM has a CM-1, a CM-2, and a CM-5 by recollection. In trying to find a home for the Convex I found a collector of Supercomputers in Adelaide (where I live). He has the CM-2 and CM-5, as well as something called an Encore Multimax, and is after the Cray but isn't going to pay the $100,000 (Australian) that is being asked. :) It looks like I have found a home for the Convex, if only I can work out how to transport it here. Adam.

28 years, 2 months

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C64 Modem issue

by jfoust＠threedee.com

John Higginbotham <higginbo(a)netpath.net> wrote: >It would be Red Hat linux, and if there's a termcap for the m100, there's >gotta be one for the c64. Yes, I know circa 1985 I used the standard Unix termcaps for the M100 and the C-64 over 300 baud links. >Do you know if anyone makes these cables and sells them? Or, barring that, >any specific links to the assembly instructions? Sure, some people on the net try to sell them, but they're easy to wire if you can find the DIN connector. I did one in a few minutes after digging for the DIN in the junk box. Worked the first time. See <http://ftp.funet.fi/pub/cbm/transfer/1541-to-PC/> for more info. I can't begin to tell you how easy and rewarding it can be to dig around on the web, following one clue to another. If you entered "x1541" or "1541 pc" in <http://www.hotbot.com> or any other search engine, or <http://www.dejanews.com>, I'm sure you'd quickly find dozens of references. - John Jefferson Computer Museum <http://www.threedee.com/jcm>

28 years, 2 months

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I got an Apple ProFile hard drive.

by SUPRDAVE＠aol.com

In a message dated 98-02-16 21:27:14 EST, you write: << At 05:39 PM 2/15/98 -0800, you wrote: >>But, it squeaks. You know, like a water pump on a car before it blows If that's all that's wrong, try lubing the ground strap/ spindle juncture. > does that mean I could just >plug one of my old ST-225's or other ST-506 type drives intoa ProFile card? Yes, As long as it has more cylinder and heads. You'll have to low level format after you install it. >> hmmm, i have heard only a lisa (or is it an apple ///) that can only LLF a profile?

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