>Well, obviously you use the right tools :-). Attacking any
computer board
>with a sheet-metal iron is going to do some damage. But I don't
>understand why a PC motherboard is any more fragile than (say)
a board
>from a minicomputer, workstation, or whatever.
Well, for one thing old boards used .1 inch traces, now with
surface mount it's .05 or .025. I don;t know about you, but my
hand (wasted from advanced age and hard living) isn't steady
enough to solder a surface mount IC.
Jack Peacock
Personally, I *love* IE4.
However, the point of this message is to point out that you can make sure
all your email is in plain text format by choosing Tools/Options/Send/Plain
Text
Its pretty simple, really.
Cheers
A
>I'm almost certain that IE4/outlook express HTMLizes email you send from
it.
>there is a way to turn it off, but i dont remember how one does it. i'm
>staying far away from IE4 myself!
On Mar 13, 21:28, SUPRDAVE wrote:
> with all this talk of soldering and desoldering, is it possible for a layman
> to do this with just a regular low wattage soldering iron? any tips from the
> pros?
Sure, with a little care and practice, but don't use a really low-power iron.
Many of them don't have much thermal storage (some people call it thermal
inertia) which means that when you place it on the joint, the heat flows out of
the tip (to be shared with the joint) and it all cools down. It takes a while
for the element to raise the temperature above the solder liquidus point again,
and in the meantime that heat is travelling to all the places you don't want.
Far better to use a reasonable wattage temperature-controlled iron (mine is
50W), which heats the joint up fast, so you can remove the iron fairly quickly.
For the same reason, don't use *too* fine a bit.
For larger stuff, I use a 120W Weller soldering gun which I bought in the
heyday of valves (vacuum tubes, for you colonists). At the University, we have
a Steinel temperature-controlled hot-air gun which chucks out lots of air at up
to 400C, great for surface mount removals (and refitting/reflow, with care).
There's a proper SMD station as well, but only one person is allowed near
that. However, I confess I'm a member of the blowtorch club at at home. I can
confirm that it's possible to remove DIL and SIMM sockets that way, as well as
ICs!
Personally, I use a fairly large piston-type desolder sucker. I hate braid -
although it's good for removing bridges on SMDs - and hate those awkward
desolder bulbs. I once had a vacuum desoldering iron, but it was always
getting clogged...
--
Pete Peter Turnbull
Dept. of Computer Science
University of York
On Mar 14, 12:16, Kip Crosby wrote:
> >I don't think the sender INTENDS to send out HTML. If you really look
> >close at such messages, you will see an actual message....
Sure, but it's no less irritating. I've stopped reading most of them. Once or
twice I've replied with suggestions to fix it; sometimes the sender has even
fixed it :-)
> That's it. MIME-enabled clients read the MIME part; MSIE4 reads the HTML
> part; MS-Outlook and Outlook Express I _think_ offer the choice between the
> two. Microsoft no longer considers flat-ASCII mail to be an important
> fraction of the traffic.
Unfortunately, quite a lot of *mail* readers can't handle that, especially the
"multipart/alternative" header. Zmail stubbornly refuses to display either
part, so I resort to /usr/sbin/Mail or /usr/bsd/mail if it's important. As far
as I'm concerned, MIME is fine, but HTML has no business in email.
--
Pete Peter Turnbull
Dept. of Computer Science
University of York
Hi,
I just picked up an Apple IIGS without the keyboard.
Can I use a MAC keyboard on it?
Also it was connected to an Apple IIe via a super serial port on the GS and
an I/O controller on the IIe side. Is that some sort of "Networking"? There
was no disk drive attached to the IIe.
-------------------------------------------------------------
Francois
Visit the Sanctuary at: http://home.att.net/~francois.auradon
And I just learned that it was safe to tuch motherboard/cards when your
computers on! (BTW, any one know aout DIMM stuff?)
Ciao,
Tim D. Hotze
-----Original Message-----
From: Allison J Parent <allisonp(a)world.std.com>
To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers
<classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu>
Date: Saturday, March 14, 1998 10:52 PM
Subject: Re: Getting bent (ON topic if not thread)
>
><>FYI in the old days when people would salvage chips of old unmarked card
><>a popular way to remove them was a propane torch and pliers!
><
><Old days??? I recovered chips using this method a few months ago...
>
>Same here but some of the kids may never have heard of a propane torch!
>
><Cool! If one is careful, there is more than just chips that can be
><recovered using this method -- at one point in time I could recover usabl
><chip sockets (even some 40-pinners) that I'm still using for other
><projects, and I now have a *boatload* of 8-switch DIP switch packages fo
><my hardware playing...
>
>Also SIP resistor packs, caps and even SMT devices.
>
>I've also been known to use gas stoves and even electric stoves. I've
>found the electic stoves with care can be used to pull chips with no
>board damage.
>
>Allison
>
>Date: Fri, 13 Mar 1998 20:39:33 -0600 (CST)
Why do you say this? I found an AIWA all-in-one thing (radio,tape,
phono,cd) in the trash a few years ago, and it has worked fine. Does
it damage CDs or something?
>
>I have [music] CD's going back to the mid-80's. They all work fine.
>(P.S., never buy an Aiwa CD player.)
>
>
>
>---------------------------------------------------------------------
O-
>
>Uncle Roger "There is pleasure pure in being mad
>roger(a)sinasohn.com that none but madmen
know."
>Roger Louis Sinasohn & Associates
>San Francisco, California
http://www.sinasohn.com/
>
>
______________________________________________________
Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com
Curretly using IE4, I've got to say that MS does have some innovation left.
The problem is that it comes TOO LATE to be useful. However, seeing as how
the current version of Netscape and IE use HTML emails, and how an aditional
1 million people support it (with Hotmail), and how, when you get down to
it, it does increase functionality, it's going to be a standard. IE4 does
send it by default, but, you can change that by clicking on Format -> Plain
Text. If the e-mail that you wish to respond to's in plain text, that's
what it'll send. The problem is that if M$ supports it, the WHOLE WORLD
suddenly has to all have HTML-ized e-mail readers. It's nice if you have
it, but a pain in the A** if you don't.
Ciao,
Tim D. Hotze
-----Original Message-----
From: SUPRDAVE <SUPRDAVE(a)aol.com>
To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers
<classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu>
Date: Sunday, March 15, 1998 5:05 AM
Subject: Re: What's with the raw HTML?
>I'm almost certain that IE4/outlook express HTMLizes email you send from
it.
>there is a way to turn it off, but i dont remember how one does it. i'm
>staying far away from IE4 myself!
>
>david
>
>In a message dated 98-03-14 15:20:25 EST, you write:
>
><< That's it. MIME-enabled clients read the MIME part; MSIE4 reads the
HTML
> part; MS-Outlook and Outlook Express I _think_ offer the choice between
the
> two. Microsoft no longer considers flat-ASCII mail to be an important
> fraction of the traffic.
>
> Kip Crosby >>
I'm almost certain that IE4/outlook express HTMLizes email you send from it.
there is a way to turn it off, but i dont remember how one does it. i'm
staying far away from IE4 myself!
david
In a message dated 98-03-14 15:20:25 EST, you write:
<< That's it. MIME-enabled clients read the MIME part; MSIE4 reads the HTML
part; MS-Outlook and Outlook Express I _think_ offer the choice between the
two. Microsoft no longer considers flat-ASCII mail to be an important
fraction of the traffic.
Kip Crosby >>
Well, without changing the blower motor or fuses, I plugged in my newly
rewired 4967 hard drive. I turned it on, the power supply made that
electrical buzzing noise that big PS's do(and a 220v motor in the
background running at half speed), then the drive started to spin up. Is
there a miniaturized jet plane in there? ;-) Anyways, it starts up(power
light comes on), and then after about 10-15 seconds there is a clunk sound
and the drive kinda shuts down until it tries again about 20 seconds
later(or maybe because I turned on the CPU). I'm not quite sure what ti
think. I haven't bothered taking it apart yet(too much work to get the
PS/controller unit off). Anyone have any ideas, or know someone who would?
---------------------------------------------------------------
| http://members.tripod.com/~jrollins/index.html - Computers |
| http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Lair/1681/ - Star Trek |
| OrHam(a)qth.net list admin Call sign coming soon!
|
---------------------------------------------------------------
There are plenty of free and shareware BBS programs on the 'net.
Check out www.cdrom.com (SimTel) and www.filelibrary.com (Channel 1)
for stuff. Channel 1 needs you to register, by the way. Here is a
question for you all: How is it done that several people can dial up
a BBS at the same number and all connect?
>Hello. A while back, I was asking about BBS stuff. Does anyone have a
BBS
>program (prefferably color, etc., possibly HTML-style), with
server/client
>software that they could give me? (I could pay for software, shipping,
>etc.)
> Thanks,
>
>Tim D. Hotze
>
>
______________________________________________________
Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com
I recently aquired 3 of these tape drives and have been trying to locate any information on them to see if they are any good/worth useing.
I was surfing the web and saw some Email messages you sent concerning these tape drives. Could you share any information you have? I would prove to be most helpful to me.
Thank You
Dennis Magnan
dmagnan(a)hotmail.com
anthony clifton:
:Er...most ISPs (except the really big guys where all bets are off)
really big guys...? well, aside from the hourlies, who would that be?
aside from aol and compuserve (which don't sell internet access, they
sell a nice new toy) the largest over here is really demon internet,
with 90k users. what about over there? are there very big companies
there that aren't the "pretend" ones?
(we're assuming you meant compushite and arseholes online in your
original comment, however.)
our experience of ISPs is generally good, except that they all seem to
have bandwidth problems. maybe that's because stuck as we are right
between america and europe, we're in the middle of nowhere. ;> ;>
anyway, this is way off-topic, so to bring it back on:
what machine did the first tcp implementation pootle along on? also
what's the smallest machine tcp has lived on so far?
-- Communa (together) we remember... we'll see you falling
you know soft spoken changes nothing to sing within her...
Net-Tamer V 1.08X - Test Drive
I have just got a couple of VT320s and connected one to my MicroVAX II
instead of the Wyse 50 that came with it. I see more messages during
the boot process now, including a menu at the start asking me what
language to use.
When I am using Ultrix and running vi how do I get back from edit to
command mode - I can't find an Esc key on the VT320?
TIA
Pete
I finally finished this version of the web page, it now has pictures of all
of the expansion cards I have, taken with a Mavica FD-7 digital camera...
That is one great camera! Too bad I don't own my own, I had to borrow
one(actually, I took the cards to the camera)... The main page is
completely different, I made very few modifications to the links, and
added/deleted a few things from the computer page.
Go check it out at http://members.tripod.com/~jrollins/index.html.
---------------------------------------------------------------
| http://members.tripod.com/~jrollins/index.html - Computers |
| http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Lair/1681/ - Star Trek |
| OrHam(a)qth.net list admin Call sign coming soon!
|
---------------------------------------------------------------
<>FYI in the old days when people would salvage chips of old unmarked card
<>a popular way to remove them was a propane torch and pliers!
<
<Old days??? I recovered chips using this method a few months ago...
Same here but some of the kids may never have heard of a propane torch!
<Cool! If one is careful, there is more than just chips that can be
<recovered using this method -- at one point in time I could recover usabl
<chip sockets (even some 40-pinners) that I'm still using for other
<projects, and I now have a *boatload* of 8-switch DIP switch packages fo
<my hardware playing...
Also SIP resistor packs, caps and even SMT devices.
I've also been known to use gas stoves and even electric stoves. I've
found the electic stoves with care can be used to pull chips with no
board damage.
Allison
Yesterday, I saw three interesting machines but I didn't get them
because A) I was short on cash and B) I'm really running out of room
around here and trying not to buy everything I see... I'm not at all
familiar with any of these, but if I were to go back and possibly get
one of them, I'd like some comments on them to help me decide:
- Amstrad PCW 8256 (z80/cpm system?)
- Sanyo MBC 550 (straight PC clone?)
- Olivetti EVT300 (I may have botched the part number from faulty
memory, it's a stylish black metal PC-ish box with one 3.5"
floppy--related to AT&T 6300?)
All were priced in the 10-15 dollar range. Which, if any, would you
buy?
--
mor(a)crl.com
http://www.crl.com/~mor/
At 12:23 3/14/98 -0600, you wrote:
>I don't think the sender INTENDS to send out HTML. If you really look
>close at such messages, you will see an actual message....
>buried amongst the tags....which, when read on a client like Eudora or
Netscape,
>look fairly normal....it
>contains a plaintext version of the message AND the HTML-ified version,
>which is what your plaintext email reader is seeing while Eudora and
>Netscape can pick out the plaintext version.
That's it. MIME-enabled clients read the MIME part; MSIE4 reads the HTML
part; MS-Outlook and Outlook Express I _think_ offer the choice between the
two. Microsoft no longer considers flat-ASCII mail to be an important
fraction of the traffic.
__________________________________________
Kip Crosby engine(a)chac.org
http://www.chac.org/index.html
Computer History Association of California
I convinced the 5363 to give me Service mode. (Diddled with plugs behind
the keyswitch until it let me try IPLing.). The IPL fails, someone has
nuked these harddisks. (Erased, not destroyed). So, I have the whole
set of SSP, RPG, and Utilities disks, how do I do a reload? I have the directions
for doing this on a 5360, but not 5363. I'm at the microcode loading stage,
but where the 5360 has 1 disk for microcode, I have 2. I can finish loading
the 1st disk, but I can't get it to load the second - I don't know how.
Anyone know?
-------
Could be, but I'm also asking for CLASIC stuff. ;-)
I'll check, but seeing as how batelco.com.bh (the ONLY Bahrain ISP...
owned by the gov't.) isn't really up to date.... thanks anyway.
Ciao,
Tim D. Hotze
-----Original Message-----
From: Tim Shoppa <shoppa(a)alph02.triumf.ca>
To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers
<classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu>
Date: Saturday, March 14, 1998 7:39 PM
Subject: Re: BBS Server/Clinet Software
>> Hello. A while back, I was asking about BBS stuff. Does anyone have a
BBS
>> program (prefferably color, etc., possibly HTML-style), with
server/client
>> software that they could give me? (I could pay for software, shipping,
>> etc.)
>
>There's an entire "alt.bbs.*" as well as a "comp.bbs.*" hiererarchy on
>USENET. Wouldn't that be a more appropriate place to ask?
>
>Tim. (shoppa(a)triumf.ca)
Hello. A while back, I was asking about BBS stuff. Does anyone have a BBS
program (prefferably color, etc., possibly HTML-style), with server/client
software that they could give me? (I could pay for software, shipping,
etc.)
Thanks,
Tim D. Hotze
Rant mode on...
Is it just me, or are others on the list not pleased about what seems to
be a sudden influx of raw HTML code posted here?
Sorry to be such a snit about this, but wading through that crap is making
it a lot harder to read the articles. The Web is not the Internet, and the
Internet is not the web. Last time I checked, CLASSICCMP was a TEXT-BASED
mailing list.
Rant mode off. We now return to our regularly scheduled posts. ;-) BTW, I
would ask those who are posting raw HTML code to please stop!
-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
Bruce Lane, Sysop, The Dragon's Cave BBS (Fidonet 1:343/272)
(Hamateur: WD6EOS) (E-mail: kyrrin(a)jps.net)
"Our science can only describe an object, event, or living thing in our own
human terms. It cannot, in any way, define any of them..."
Hi!
I had some luck today, and picked up and Amstrad CPC464, two IBM JX's,
and an Altos 486. No idea what I'll do with the spare JX - but they are
neat. Did it take JR cartridges, or ones of it's own? And does anyone
know whether they had to have their own system disks, or could they boot
off standard DOS? Currently I'm stuck with the default BASIC.
The Altos is something new for me - it appears to be from 1984, and has a
number of ports for terminals on the back. It says that it is running a
4186 as the cpu, but I don't know that one and the cpu is covered by the
power supply. Was this actually the 80186, or something else? And does
anyone know anything about Altos and the Altos 486?
Thanks heaps,
Adam.
On 1998-03-10 classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu said to lisard(a)zetnet.co.uk
:It's been a long time since I've looked at a CS book, but I
:remember the Turing machine as a *theoretical* machine that reads
:and writes symbols on an *infinitely long* tape. I'm sure somebody
:could build an approximation of this, but the main interest in the
:Turing machine is that it is used as the definition of
:computational "power." One of theories is that no machine built
:today, or at any time in the future, no matter what the
:architecture, will be able to compute anything that a simple Turing
:machine cannot compute..
that's the one. alan turing defined these machines as part of his
contribution to the proof that mathematics has some unprovables.
anything that can be proved, period, can be proved by a turing machine;
anything that a turing machine can't prove is unprovable. kurt godel
(most famously, perhaps?) and alonzo church producd alternative theorems
to demonstrate the same thing, but turing's work laid the basis for
computer science, and turing himself became quite active within the
field of early uk computation (the original ACE design is his, and he
subsequently worked on manchester's computers).
there are even such things as "universal turing machines", which can be
given definitions of turing machines and used to solve such problems,
which we suspect led directly on to universal computers which could be
programmed to simulate special purpose devices.
the "infinite tape" idea is as important as you suggested, however.
--
Communa (together) we remember... we'll see you falling
you know soft spoken changes nothing to sing within her...
Today's haul...
TWO Aquarius II computers (Serial numbers 8 and 10)
Lots of software for the above (cartridges/ cassettes)
box of 10 disks for the Aquarius drive (no drive, alas)
teletext software/cartridges, several modems for the above
Printer for the above
Two tape drive units
One prototype smart card unit (credit card size card) - for videotext access
Prototype Commodore disk drive interfaces (2) for Aquarius
Schematics and manuals for Aquarius
Extension interface
Prototype 16K RAM unit (functional)
OSI superboard II with homemade case, including voice synthesis add-on
Another good day.
I'll be trading at least one of the Aquarius II computers, probably.
Offers?
Cheers
A
>It was thus said that the Great jpero(a)cgo.wave.ca once stated:
>>
>> > You forgot the AS/400 series.
>> There's one already!
>
> Oops. Missed it.
How about 1130, 1401, 7090, 4300 series? And the ancestor of
the powerPC, what was it, 801?
At 11:09 AM 3/11/98 -0800, you wrote:
>The reason I can't say the same for CD-ROM's is that I don't have any that
>are more than a decade old. Some of my floppies will be 30 years old
>pretty soon.
I have [music] CD's going back to the mid-80's. They all work fine.
(P.S., never buy an Aiwa CD player.)
--------------------------------------------------------------------- O-
Uncle Roger "There is pleasure pure in being mad
roger(a)sinasohn.com that none but madmen know."
Roger Louis Sinasohn & Associates
San Francisco, California http://www.sinasohn.com/
At 06:16 AM 3/13/98 -0800, you wrote:
>because A) I was short on cash and B) I'm really running out of room
>around here and trying not to buy everything I see... I'm not at all
Ah, I'm not alone! 8^)
>
>- Amstrad PCW 8256 (z80/cpm system?)
"Personal Computer Word Processor" I have book 1 of the "User Guide - CP/M
Logo & Word Processor Manual". Seems like it came with "LocaScript" a WP,
DR Logo, and CP/M Plus. A pretty interesting looking machine, actually.
>- Sanyo MBC 550 (straight PC clone?)
Not exactly "straight". Semi-compatible, iirc. Very early in the PC
timeline, and probably pretty significant.
>- Olivetti EVT300 (I may have botched the part number from faulty
>memory, it's a stylish black metal PC-ish box with one 3.5"
>floppy--related to AT&T 6300?)
Could be an AT&T 6300; I seem to remember Olivetti and AT&T worked together
or something.
>All were priced in the 10-15 dollar range. Which, if any, would you
>buy?
Well, depends on your interests. If you're interested in PC (i.e., Intel
x86/MS-DOS) history, definitely go for the Sanyo. If you're more into the
older, more proprietary systems (S-100 stuff/CP/M) go for the amstrad. If
you're a Unix/workstation person (Sun, Apollo, UnixPC, etc.) or perhaps
into foreign stuff or something, go for the Olivetti. (Note, I don't
*know* that the Olivetti runs Unix or anything, just a longshot possibility.)
Me, I'd probably go for the Sanyo first, then the Amstrad. The amstrad,
btw, came with a printer.
--------------------------------------------------------------------- O-
Uncle Roger "There is pleasure pure in being mad
roger(a)sinasohn.com that none but madmen know."
Roger Louis Sinasohn & Associates
San Francisco, California http://www.sinasohn.com/
At 07:17 PM 3/11/98 +0000, you wrote:
>PCW8256/PCW8512 : AMSM8256/8512 5.48
I have one of these manuals, with some waterlogging, if anyone wants to
avoid UK shipping. Cost is $.55 + shipping from San Francisco. (that's 55
cents, which includes a 1 cent profit. I'm gonna be rich! 8^)
--------------------------------------------------------------------- O-
Uncle Roger "There is pleasure pure in being mad
roger(a)sinasohn.com that none but madmen know."
Roger Louis Sinasohn & Associates
San Francisco, California http://www.sinasohn.com/
At 02:25 PM 3/11/98 -0500, you wrote:
>There's also the problem that folks seem to think that CD-R's are
>indestructable so they do not take care of them (i.e. not putting them back
>in the jewel cases, playing shuffleboard with them, etc.).
CD's too. I saw a guy pull a stack of 15-20 CD's out of his pocket, no
case or anything, and start shuffling through them like a deck of cards.
Picked one out, put it on the seat beside him, took the CD out of his
player, and put it and the rest back in his pocket.
I guess they still worked (though his player had a (I think) 10 second
buffer, so it has plenty of time to do retries.) 'course he didn't look
like the sort of bloke who listened to anything older than a week.
--------------------------------------------------------------------- O-
Uncle Roger "There is pleasure pure in being mad
roger(a)sinasohn.com that none but madmen know."
Roger Louis Sinasohn & Associates
San Francisco, California http://www.sinasohn.com/
>BTW, I've seen a few non-name SIMMs with dry joints between the
>surface-mount chips and the carrier board. Resoldering those
was an
>entertainment...
>
>Probably more on-topic for this list is a 30 pin SIMM that I
have in my
>spares box. It's 256K*9, using pin-through-hole chips (normal
41256 DRAMs
>in 16 pin DIP packages). It does use the normal SIMM pinout
AFAIK.
Those are adapter boards to convert old DIP DRAMS into SIMMs. I
did a bunch when 1MB SIMMs were $50 each. There are still
places that sell them, JDR in California for one.
Jack Peacock
i've got a PCRT, the desktop form factor, but i need the proprietary keyboard.
any leads?
david
In a message dated 98-03-13 13:17:41 EST, you write:
<< PC/RT?
Anyone want to get rid of one?
Thank you,
David Wollmann
dwollmann(a)ibmhelp.com
DST ibmhelp.com Technical Support >>
The reason why people think it's "illegal" to solder PC parts is
because high temeratures can damage semiconductors, or so it says on
every soldering guide I have ever seen. That's what those heat sinks
are for. Now about the sockets, I'd imagine quite a few SIMMS were
broken trying to fit them in. While mostly, it's easy, I had to
pound on some DIMMS I was installing into 10 Macs recently. By the
way, does anyone want an Orchid RAM expansion board for a PS/2?
Sorry, no driver files or anything. I will give it for free. AFAIK,
it works and has either 1, 1.5, or 2 MB RAM on it.
>
>I've seen this stated on several newsgroups as well, but I can't
>understand why it's impossible to solder a new SIMM socket onto a
>motherboard. You can break up the old one, desolder the pins one at a
>time, fit a new one (I've seen them on sale in the UK), and solder it
in.
>Takes about 10 minutes. I've done it before now.
>
>There is a myth doing the rounds that it's impossible to use a
soldering
>iron on PC parts. I don't know where it came from, but it's 100% false.
>
>BTW, I've seen a few non-name SIMMs with dry joints between the
>surface-mount chips and the carrier board. Resoldering those was an
>entertainment...
>
>Probably more on-topic for this list is a 30 pin SIMM that I have in my
>spares box. It's 256K*9, using pin-through-hole chips (normal 41256
DRAMs
>in 16 pin DIP packages). It does use the normal SIMM pinout AFAIK.
>
>I think it came from an Amstrad machine, and I think there are diagrams
>of them in some Amstrad service manuals.
>
>
>-tony
>
>
______________________________________________________
Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com
I got into the web site today, out of interest, and went as far as the
registration page which is working today. They want $35 per month from
foreigners just to enter the site :-(
Regards
Pete
I used to populate the XMS cards with 256K DRAM as well, largest being
2MB (72 chips). As I recall, the 256K DRAM dips were down to about
$2.50~$3.50 a pop when our benevolent Congress stepped in to help us
and the price rose to the $12.00+ range. I was impressed. We had
orders to fill and were being burned bad.... those weren't the days.
Marty Mintzell
______________________________ Reply Separator
_________________________________
Subject: Re: Getting bent (ON topic if not thread)
Author: classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu at internet
Date: 3/13/98 3:17 PM
At 12:52 3/13/98 -0600, David wrote:
>256K DRAMs bring back all sorts of bad memories. We used to sell 384K
>expansions for the PCjr....Not only were they hell to populate, but when
>the DRAM prices went through the roof, we were only selling a few at ~$300
>a pop.
The thing about those Everex 3MB XMS cards was, I actually did several of
them (groan) with DRAM I'd stocked up on. At the worst of the RAM spike,
the best price I could have gotten on 256K DRAM was US$12.45 per chip.
Which made those d**n Everex cards worth, nominally, over $1300 each....
but we just gritted our teeth, because a 9-chip 1MB 30-pin SIMM was $595!
__________________________________________
Kip Crosby engine(a)chac.org
http://www.chac.org/index.html
Computer History Association of California
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From: Kip Crosby <engine(a)chac.org>
To: "Discussion re-collecting of classic computers"
<classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu>
Subject: Re: Getting bent (ON topic if not thread)
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On Mar 13, 12:52, David Wollmann wrote:
> Now we just have to worry about busting the cheap plastic
> retainers on some of the older sockets. I hate it when I have to trash a
> mobo for a busted SIMM socket.
They're not usually very hard to replace. I've fixed at least two motherboards
such as you describe by using the SIMM sockets swiped from one that really was
DBR. Even new SIMM sockets aren't expensive.
--
Pete Peter Turnbull
Dept. of Computer Science
University of York
I know there has already been a discussion on the Sony SMC-70, but it seems
to have terminated after being sidetracked into a discussion of floppy
connectors.
I've stumbled upon quite a large collection of Sony modules for these
things. This is currently what I have sitting in front of me:
SMC-70G Micro Computer
??????? Genlocker
SMI-7012A Dual Floppy Unit
SMI-7074 NTSC Superimposer
SMI-7050 Cache Disk Unit -- What is this?
SMI-7075 Videotizer
Now, is there anywhere that I can get an OS and the software to use all that
equipment with? Can someone 'lend' me images of thier floppies? (If anyone
has them!)
The main computer module is fuctional -- I can boot it to the point where I
get a console monitor and get type 'b' and get into 'Sony BASIC'. I don't
currently have enough RGB NTSC video equipment to test the rest out.
Thanks,
Adam
( Adam Fritzler afritz(a)iname.com )
http://afritz.base.org/
Anyone remember how to set the default boot drive on a Sun3?
This is not a Sun4, so the monitor commands are completely different
>from anything manufactured in the last ten years....
Thanks!
--jmg
Recently there were a number of VAXservers offered from VCC.
The disposition is they are gone. Some comments for those that are
curious.
They were VAXservers (KA410e) meaning they do not have the graphic console
and they are old and as 3100s go slow. Compared to a m30, m38, m80 series
these are the slowest models. So if you not familiar with VAXen...they
were designed and intended as cheap servers.
Each one weights about 20-25 pounds basic weight of the 3100 pizza box
regardless of model. I priced packaging and shipping in the USA
as $30-50 each (even the tape drives weigh alot!). Thy may be small but
they weigh a lot. That's a lot of money. I can't deal with it. So I'm
not into shipping them. Many people wanted one shipped from VCC and none
took into account that the source had a job to do and no time or resources
to pack them and send them to indiviuals for free and there was no way to
recover the cost back. Me I'm broke so I can't lay out cash to ship them.
Take this as a hint when trying to procure systems/pieces. The source
generally desires LOW EFFORT/COST meaning you pick it up.
Allison
>The infamous Japanese PCjr? The JX was the last straw for the jr community.
>When we heard about it we though IBM was fixing to revive the jr--little
>did we know. Is there any chance you could post a couple snapshots of the
>JX somewhere? I'd love to have a look at one so I can cry in my beer.
I opened one of them up to check her out, and have a shot of the system
with the cover off. As soonas I get the film proceesed I'll put them up.
An ugly beast though - I like them, but they are an ugly dark gray.
>IIRC, the JX could boot PC-DOS 2.10. If it's inwards are anything like the
>PCjr, it's a 128K box, so unless it has been expanded, you're probably
>stuck with DOS 2.10 or 3.x.
It seems they were 512k as standard, but there was no seperate video ram
so 64k of that was taken.
thanks heaps,
Adam.
On Mar 12, 22:01, Doug Yowza wrote:
> Speaking of IMSAI's, I just bought a PROM/RAM board from somebody (it's on
> its way) without knowing exactly what it is (that's my standard MO). All
> I know is that it's a Vector Graphics board for an IMSAI (and comes with
> the original receipt from IMS, as well as an original IMSAI catalog!) and
> I can tell from Bill R's Tandy catalog
> (http://incolor.inetnebr.com/bill_r/Tandy_TOC_Frames_Page.htm)
> that it was intended as a front-panel replacement (are your fingers red
> and swolen?).
>
> My guess is that a PROM/RAM board is sort of a ROM emulator. Am I close,
> or is it just a board that can handle PROMs and RAMs?
I'd expect it's just a board that can hold either PROMs or static RAM. A "ROM
emulator" usually refers to some plug-in device, often controlled by a logic
analyser or EPROM programmer with a ribbon cable, that pretends to be a ROM.
Used for development purposes: instead of switching the machine off, counting
to 15, pulling the EPROM, blowing another, fitting it, straightening the pins,
fitting it again, powerering up... you can modify the code on the fly (or while
the machine is halted).
Do you mean it's a board that can do vector graphics, or that it was made by
"Vector Graphics"? I assume the latter, as the former doesn't fit with the
rest of your description. A "front panel replacement" usually means a
ROM/PROM/EPROM board with bootstrap and perhaps monitor code, so you could type
simple commands and get a (textual) response on a VDU instead of having to
toggle the switches and watch the blinkenlights. Quite often, ROM boards could
be could be jumpered for different addresses, not just a bootstrap address, and
sometimes they could hold byte-wide static RAM instead of byte-wide EPROM.
--
Pete Peter Turnbull
Dept. of Computer Science
University of York
That NY Times article that Charles Fox mentioned requires a username and
password to access. Charles, could you pull that from the web site and
post it here for all to see?
Sam Alternate e-mail: dastar(a)siconic.com
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Computer Historian, Programmer, Musician, Philosopher, Athlete, Writer, Jackass
Coming Soon...Vintage Computer Festival 2.0
See http://www.siconic.com/vcf for details!
(Another cheap way to start a dumb thread)
I came across a thread on a newsgroup about IBM naming schemes, and was
wondering about all of the Systems/ and Series/. This is what I could come
up with for the hardware...
S/1, PS/1, PS/2, S/3, S/4,
S/23, S/32, S/34, S/36, S/38, S/88,
S/360, S/370, S/390, AS/400,
RS/6000, ES/9000
Are there any I missed?
William Donzelli
william(a)ans.net
Ok...here's the problem
The machine come up with garbage on the screen.It would also seem that the
video is inverted, I can see the retrace lines etc, so the horizontal
blanking is not working either by the looks of it.
What I suspect is wrong is that either U42 (the 6845 labeled in my machine
as a motorola SC80757P) or U102 (the 4.3 video support chip) is faulty (or
both?).
Does anyone have any info on U102 (what is it..can I get another?) or any
other thoughts.
Some other notes are.
1. It seems to boot (I get a very crappy tandy logo in inverse on the
screen) though the screen is so unstable as to be unreadable.
2. It does not matter if it is in 64 or 80 column mode, the video is still
crap.
3. I suppose the Char generator rom could also be a problem
Any help would be appreciated. BTW does anyone have the diagnostic disc for
the 4/4P ?
Cheers
+----------- Keith Whitehead -----------+
| Physics and Chemistry Depts |
| Massey University |
| Palmerston North |
| New Zealand |
| |
| Ph +64 6 350-5074 Fax +64 6 354-0207 |
+------------------------------------------+
I have a Z80 computer that I built from a kit in 1978 and I hate to just
set it on the curb and scrap it. It was designed and sold by 'the digital
group' of Denver, CO. It has a Z80 8 bit microprocessor, 2.5 mh, 64K
memory, 80 X 24 output to a monitor, dual 8" floppy drives added later from
Bell Controls of CA and a CPM operating system.
Components:
1 Cabinet containing processor board, memory boards, disk I/O boards, TV
output board and power supply.
2 Keyboard
3 Dual 8" floppy disk drive
4 19" monitor for output
5 Modem
6 Documentation
I would like to donate it. Interested?
Ron Slonneger
Peoria, IL
>anything that a turing machine can't prove is unprovable. kurt godel
I'm reading Douglas Hofstadter's Godel, Escher, Bach, which is about
information, patterns, number theory, intelligence, and so on. I
implore everyone to read it, it is something any scientist ought to be
familiar with like the three laws of motion. Copyright 1979,
ISBN 0-394-74502-7. He wrote some more books after this one, but this
one is better. Two others I have read deal with the same thing.
______________________________________________________
Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com
Can someone tell me what this thing is? It was a freebie (a appearnlty
rightly so). It's got a genuine MC68000P12 in it. When I plug the video
in and turn it on, it just sits at a blank screen with a flashing cursor
in the corner.
I've gathered that it's somesort of graphics workstation but I know
nothing more.
Thanks,
Adam
----------
Adam Fritzler
afritz(a)iname.com
http://www.afritz.base.org
----------
>Instead, Q is low and NOT Q is high which is the reverse of
what SHOULD
>be the case. What's the deal? Bad 7474? Or is my thinking
SCREWED UP?
>
>IF my thinking is correct and my suspicion that the 7474 is
bad, is it
>safe to replace it with a 74LS74? A friend of mine and I had a
long
>conversation about what you can replace with what and I've
forgotten
>what he told me about that.
>
considering the low speed of a 6800, an LS (or even an HCT)
should work...but, are you sure it isn't the case of a fast
pulse on the D input when CLK is hit (on the falling edge if
memory is correct)? and you aren't seeing it (using a logic
probe or a triggered scope)? did you check the voltage in to D?
maybe it's in no mans land (i.e. around 2v). Maybe its the IC
driving the flip flop D input thats bad, or a fast pulse is
hitting the R* input
Anyway, I'd take it out and put in a socket if you think its
most likely cause
Jack Peacock
