- test-drb@ccmp.vtda.org - classiccmp.org

Windows CE: Future classic (OT, in a way...)

by higginbo＠netpath.net

At 01:28 PM 6/15/98 -0500, you wrote: >Sure, just as easily as you can move stuff between the 6502 based Nintendo >and an AIM-65 (i.e., no way dOOd -- even if the CPU is the same, nothing >else is). However, I seem to recall that Microsoft recently signed-up a >game machine manufacturer for CE, and it was either Nintendo or Sega. Sega. For the new 128-bit console system: Dreamcast. Coming to America next year. Out in Japan by Fall this year. <offtopic alert! offtopic alert!> Err, man, those Atari Pong games sure were a gas back in the 70's, man! Groooovy! *Whew!* Close one. ________________________________________ john higginbotham limbo.netpath.net - webmaster, http://www.pntprinting.com - "Teamwork is essential; it gives the - enemy other people to shoot at." -

28 years, 1 month

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New toy, HP Apollo 4500, and it's broken...

by DSEAGRAV＠toad.xkl.com

I got a apollo 4500. It has a 68030 inside, and a 700-someodd meg MFM (?) harddisk. I have no idea what it runs. This one has a SummaSketch pad with it. It was used for CAD stuff. What's it run? The problem with it is, the video card appears to have died. WHen I power the machine on (It has a VERY LARGE [21"] RGB monitor. Any chance of me connecting it to a PC? It has 3 plugs, R G B, and expects sync on green) and the monitor, I get garbage. The garbage is the same almost every time. There is 3 patterns. The first one is just garbage, the second one is the same garbage only dimmer, and the third is a light blue blank screen. All of them are light blue colored. The summasketch puck is also wrecked, someone's jerked the MMJ plug off the end. But I can get another one of those. There is a switch in the back (Next to the reset (?) button) than, when pressed, activates a 4-LED indication inside the case. When I start the machine, it flickers around, and stops at 1 on, 2 3 and 4 blinking. Is this a failure code? What's this switch for? Am I correct in my assumption? (Dead video) I've already pushed all the socketed chips in as far as they'll go. That didn't help. I also removed the video card (It has no socketed chips) and reseated it. This also has a network adapter, labled DOMAIN RING. What wire does that expect? I'm guessing it's not Ethernet... Oh, the label on the front says APOLLO DOMAIN 4500. FOrgot that :) -------

28 years, 1 month

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Mini-Monitors?

by sinasohn＠ricochet.net

At 01:30 PM 6/12/98 -0800, you wrote: >I know of sources that satisfy everything except the *cheap*. >Small VGA color monitors - 5", 7", etc. - are readily >available from all the folks who sell embedded systems and >components. Expect to pay $600 and up, though. > >For a similar price you can also get VGA-compatible color LCD >displays in the same size range. Ooh, that would be *perfect*, except for the $. 8^( Hmmm.. How good is the security at these places? 8^) But seriously, a 5-7" monitor for $600? I guess there's not as big a market for them, but the folks that need 'em *really* need 'em. >a Pentium motherboard that's only 2.5" square! Now that's pretty damn cool! I picked up a SIIG computer. It's a 386SX (and probably too new for here) and is about 4" wide by 3" tall, by about 11" long. Fully self contained, just add monitor and keyboard. Has 16-bit and 8-bit ISA Slots (1 each), and both floppy and hard drive. Pretty darn cool; it's my new voicemail system. 8^) --------------------------------------------------------------------- O- Uncle Roger "There is pleasure pure in being mad roger(a)sinasohn.com that none but madmen know." Roger Louis Sinasohn & Associates San Francisco, California http://www.sinasohn.com/

28 years, 1 month

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Windows CE: Future classic (OT, in a way...)

by photze＠batelco.com.bh

OK. I just purchased a Windows CE handheld. I realized that: 1) It represents MS's rebirth. That, along with cross-platform apps, means that MS isn't going to be doing to much with Windows 9x/NT after a couple years... 2) It's lighting fast, and covers all kinds of processors. Now, I've got 2 questions: 1) With a Velo, is there any way to save files after it's turned off without purchasing a hard card? 2) With a MIPS-based handheld, could I get stuff moving between this and my N64? Ciao, Tim D. Hotze

28 years, 1 month

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Windows CE: Future classic (OT, in a way...)

by photze＠batelco.com.bh

>Thanks for the tip, Tim. I'll dump all of my intel stock now. :-) Seriously, that doesn't mean going away from Intel. x86 is supported. Besides, Linux'll take over x86's hardware.... ;-) >> 2) It's lighting fast, and covers all kinds of processors. > >The H/PC was a bit of a flop. For some reason, not many people wanted to >buy a machine that looked like Windows95, but ran on slower hardware with >no application compatibility. Well, believe it or not, it took Microsoft for "open-season" to start on handhelds. >However, I like the new Pilot rip-off, the Palm-sized PC, better. And if >you've never seen their Auto PC for cars, brace yourself for some drooling >(guaranteed to flop at the current $2K price though). They're also making >inroads into embedded systems with CE. Great. Now, stoplights and car batteries will freeze on me. >> 1) With a Velo, is there any way to save files after it's turned off without >> purchasing a hard card? > >You've got internal battery-backed RAM for that. OK. >> 2) With a MIPS-based handheld, could I get stuff moving between this and my >> N64? > >Sure, just as easily as you can move stuff between the 6502 based Nintendo >and an AIM-65 (i.e., no way dOOd -- even if the CPU is the same, nothing >else is). However, I seem to recall that Microsoft recently signed-up a >game machine manufacturer for CE, and it was either Nintendo or Sega. That's what I thought. But I heard a friend talk about it... As for the Sega, Windows CE's OK for what I want it for: Simple eMail. No graphics, no attachments. I don't want Windows CE freezing up my game machine. Especially not when UNIX based competitiors are availabe. I said that I liked Windows CE. I didn't say that it was the best at anything. Just shows promise. Ciao, Tim D. Hotze

28 years, 1 month

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Old Microsoft stuff...

by photze＠batelco.com.bh

>Green? For the first half-dozen years I never saw any Microsoft >documents in color. I have several Microsoft manuals and binders >from when their office was in Arizona and all of those are >black on white. Later stuff from when they moved to a suite in >Bellevue was still in black and white. I didn't see any green until >1980-1982 when Microsoft was selling Digital Research's CP/M with >their Softcard (Z-80 drop-in for the Apple II). OK. How many softcards were made? >BASIC implementation for dozens of personal computers in the late 70's >and very early 80's, most importantly. I know that. Was their first BASIC the 4K tape one for the Altair? >> Anything >> for say... the Apple II? > >Absolutely. Applesoft BASIC (in every II+ and later, and installed as >an option in most II's) was written by Microsoft. Microsoft also sold >several well-known Apple II games (ADVENTURE is the most well-known). They wrote that? DUDE!!!! (I recently aquired a Applesoft BASIC manual (C) 1979, in near mint condition.) >You know, I could go on for pages and pages with software that Microsoft >sold in the late 70's and early 80's for non PC-platforms. You'd probably >be much better educated about computing in that era if you simply went >and found the _BYTE_ magazines from that time frame and read the ads. OK. See, I checked out MS's museum, and I'd have to say that from a corporate perspective, it had a pretty fair view of things. They had the Apple II, Macintosh, Altair, etc. there. >Tim. (shoppa(a)triumf.ca) Tim D. Hotze

28 years, 1 month

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New toy, HP Apollo 4500, and it's broken...

by JRichardson＠softwright.co.uk

>>>I think it depends on the machine. My DN3500 is about PC/AT sized. My >> >425 is a less tall, but takes up more desk area. didn't these things need some sort of domain controller or something to boot? I remember playing around with one at the place where I used to work repairing old machines and it got a sensible display up but then refused to boot. Mind you, I seem to remember that it took two keyboards - a standard PC one and an HP-specific one... the whole lot went to the tip sadly, minus the SCSI disks which were formatted for a different system (mind you, I rescued a few good machines from that place over time - the Tower32/700, Tektronix XD88, Philips P3800, numerous Link 480Z's and BBC model B's to name but a few...) >> disk and MB in it, the FPU went to my upgraded Mac SE), and I didn't even >> get ONE part out, just a face full of PCB fumes(whatever those boards are blowtorches work wonders surprisingly. It's very rare to toast a chip providing you're careful with heat distribution (not recommended for repair jobs on boards that you want to keep though ;*) cheers Jules

28 years, 1 month

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Old Microsoft stuff...

by photze＠batelco.com.bh

I guess you're right. But still... er... um... Tim D. Hotze -----Original Message----- From: Tim Shoppa <shoppa(a)alph02.triumf.ca> To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers <classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu> Date: Monday, June 15, 1998 10:46 PM Subject: Re: Old Microsoft stuff... >> Yep. I know that. But MS dominance didn't exactly happen overnight. They >> didn't have much of a hold in anything until the IBM PC took off... > >I'd disagree with you here. Microsoft had a much broader scope before >the IBM PC, selling hundreds of pieces of software for dozens of >different platforms. And certainly a plurality, if not a majority, of 8-bit >home micros booted straight into Microsoft BASIC. Just about every >consumer-oriented-everything-in-a-box CP/M system came bundled with >MBASIC! > >Tim.

28 years, 1 month

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Old Microsoft stuff...

by JRichardson＠softwright.co.uk

>> Olympic Decathalon (responsible for many a broken left/right arrow key >> required for the running competitions). is that the same game as Daley Thompson's Decathalon on the old Spectrum? Seem to remember that burning out a few keys - I didn't realise it was a Microsoft product though!! Jules >

28 years, 1 month

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Old Alpha's (OT)

by photze＠batelco.com.bh

Nope. I mean (mostly) DEC systems based on the Alpha 64-bit microprocessor. Sorry for any confusions... Tim D. Hotze

28 years, 1 month

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Old Microsoft stuff...

by jeff.kaneko＠ifrsys.com

> Hi. Now, I don't want to start a flamewar, but still, Microsoft HAS played > an important part in personal computing, for better or for worse. From 1986 > or so onwards, they were a industry dominator. > Now, from what I understand, the origional MS logo was GREEN? Somebody > have a picture? Yes it was green. If I can find an example, I'll scan it for you. > Other than OS's and current Office Applications (and, of course, > Internet Explorer, which is a decent browser, and DOES have pleanty of > innovation, if you're prepared to admit it.), what did MS make? Anything > for say... the Apple II? PDP's? UN*X boxes (once again, omitting current > ports of IE 4.0)? Well, you're getting a copy of MULTIPLAN for the Apple ][. Seems like there was a word processor for the A][ as well. Don't forget Excel for the MAC. Excel was on the Macintosh long before it became a standard on that 'other' windowing OS. In fact, Excel is the only Microsoft product that actually *PREDATES* the operating system it runs on! No, MS Word dosen't count-- WinWord was a totally new product, bearing *no* resemblence to the original 'Word' for Mess-DOs. Excel was a straight port (well, it *looks* that way, anyway). If I look through some old issues of byte, I'm sure I'll find others . . . Jeff

28 years, 1 month

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Old Alpha's (OT)

by JRichardson＠softwright.co.uk

>> Which "Alpha"? Alpha Micro? Hmm, is that "Alpha micro" as in "Alphatronic PC"? I have a few of those things lying around someplace in various states - my old university wrote their own terminal software for them, burned it out to eeprom, and we used to use them as terminals to access the Unix systems. IIRC I did see reference to an expansion box that allowed the use of hard drives with CP/M on - I did a lot of digging at the time and never turned up anything for them - I just had the custom Uni terminal ROMs and a set of BASIC ROMs that originally came with the machines. They were made by Triumph-Adler, from what I remember. Any information on these boxes would be most helpful!! (I have the original manuals, but they don't exactly go into a lot of detail) cheers Jules >

28 years, 1 month

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Old Microsoft stuff...

by photze＠batelco.com.bh

Yep. I'll count that. BTW, welcome back! One time, I was eMailing you for help on something... didn't get a response... then you stopped posting to ClassicCmp... Ciao, Tim D. Hotze -----Original Message----- From: John Higginbotham <higginbo(a)netpath.net> To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers <classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu> Date: Monday, June 15, 1998 8:59 PM Subject: Re: Old Microsoft stuff... >At 05:37 PM 6/15/98 +0300, you wrote: > >> Other than OS's and current Office Applications (and, of course, >>Internet Explorer, which is a decent browser, and DOES have pleanty of >>innovation, if you're prepared to admit it.), what did MS make? Anything >>for say... the Apple II? PDP's? UN*X boxes (once again, omitting current >>ports of IE 4.0)? > >Does Microsoft BASIC on the TRS-80 Model 100 count? > > >________________________________________ >john higginbotham limbo.netpath.net - >webmaster, http://www.pntprinting.com - >"Teamwork is essential; it gives the - >enemy other people to shoot at." - > > > >

28 years, 1 month

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Old Alpha's (OT)

by allisonp＠world.std.com

<Hi. Just wanted to know if anyone out here knows where I can get an old <alpha... (real old). < Ciao, Ah, you gotta be kiddin.... The alpha is maybe max 8 years old! Allison

28 years, 1 month

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PDP model line / rarity?

by JRichardson＠softwright.co.uk

>>> hmm. My university had a 7 which as far as I know was never used - it >>> just sat there as a conversational point in one of the physics labs. I >>> probably could have taken it, but just don't have the room for it (nor >>> the knowledge to keep it running, and I don't have the time these days >>> to learn about any new machines sadly!) >> >> When was this -7 just sitting there, out of curiosity? well I graduated a couple of years ago, so I last saw it probably about three years ago now (never had much call to go into the physics buildings). as I said, I don't know PDP machines so couldn't tell you how much of a system there was there or what state it was in - it had a paper sign hanging on the front saying "PDP7" and used to get pointed out during tours (heh heh, so I guess there could have been anything in there!! :) wish I'd taken a better look at it (mind you, as I said I couldn't really justify keeping such a beast, and I used to get enough obsolete equipment that the computing department used to throw out anyway!) cheers J. >

28 years, 1 month

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PDP model line / rarity?

by allisonp＠world.std.com

<I was just wondering on the rarity of DEC's PDPx machines - I gather <that '11s are still pretty common (relatively!), but what about earlier <machines in the line? PDP = Programmed Data Processor. It was a ploy to tame down the idea of large, expensive and complex computers. The PDP-8E/F/M/A series was quite popular swith sales in the many tens of thousands. There are many of these in service as machine tool controllers and other uses. PDP-11 series was even more prolific. Rare machines are the PDP-1 (few left), PDP-5 the forunner to the 8, and 10s. The total sales for the PDP-1/4/5/6/7/9/10/12/15 combined was under 5000 units. Generally the 18 and 36bit machines are tough to find and if found represent a bit of work to run. Allison

28 years, 1 month

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PDP model line / rarity?

by mbg＠world.std.com

>I was just wondering on the rarity of DEC's PDPx machines - I gather >that '11s are still pretty common (relatively!), but what about earlier >machines in the line? There seem to be a fair number of -8's in private hands, at least there are a number of people who post on alt.sys.pdp8 who have them. Probably more Decmates then older -8s. As for -11s, I have quite a few, mostly qbus... There are even some people who have -10s and -20s at home. I've not seen any info on others like -4, -7, -9, -15, etc (other than the emulators that Bob Supnik of DEC wrote). >Also - what did PDP stand for? (I don't expect that "Portable" came into >it ;*) Sorry for the dumb question - I grew up with classic 8-bit micros >and 32-bit Unix machines - shame I missed out on some of the big old >boxes, they sound like fun (if a bit impractical from a storage point of >view!! :) PDP = Programmed Data Processor. Megan Gentry Former RT-11 Developer +--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+ | Megan Gentry, EMT/B, PP-ASEL | Internet (work): gentry(a)zk3.dec.com | | Unix Support Engineering Group | (home): mbg(a)world.std.com | | Digital Equipment Corporation | | | 110 Spitbrook Rd. ZK03-2/T43 | URL: http://world.std.com/~mbg/ | | Nashua, NH 03062 | "pdp-11 programmer - some assembler | | (603) 884 1055 | required." - mbg | +--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+

28 years, 1 month

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Composite <> Video

by sinasohn＠ricochet.net

Just want to check... Composite Video (as in a lot of 8-bit computers) is *not* the same thing as the Video ports on, say, a VCR or camcorder, right? And Composite is also not the same as what the Atari 2600 (et al) use to hook up to a telly? Thanks... --------------------------------------------------------------------- O- Uncle Roger "There is pleasure pure in being mad roger(a)sinasohn.com that none but madmen know." Roger Louis Sinasohn & Associates San Francisco, California http://www.sinasohn.com/

28 years, 1 month

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MS Windows 1.03 for sale

by desieh＠southcom.com.au

-----Original Message----- From: Doug Yowza <yowza(a)yowza.com> To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers <classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu> Date: Monday, June 15, 1998 7:39 Subject: Re: MS Windows 1.03 for sale >On Mon, 15 Jun 1998, Sam Ismail wrote: > >> I bid $4billion! Oh wait, its only v1.03. I was looking for 1.02. Never >> mind. > >I have 1.02. Will that be cash or credit card? > >-- Doug > email: desieh(a)southcom.com.au desieh(a)bigfoot.com museum_curator(a)hotmail.com Apple Lisa Web Page: http://www.southcom.com.au/~desieh/index.htm ive got 1.02 but its in french, or is that france?? want it:> maybe not................

28 years, 1 month

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Mini-Monitors?

by fauradon＠pclink.com

I found their web site: http://www.digisys.net/timeline/lcd.html Looks like they have few for good prices Francois ------------------------------------------------------------- Visit the Sanctuary at: http://www.pclink.com/fauradon -----Original Message----- From: Allison J Parent <allisonp(a)world.std.com> To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers <classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu> Date: Sunday, June 14, 1998 2:20 PM Subject: Re: Mini-Monitors? ><In Circuit Cellar this month there is an add from timeline inc. It has a ><VGA LCD 640 X 480 Sanyo LMDK55-22 listed for $25. That is the only info ><given on the add. their phone number is (800) 872-8878 no web site :( ><Francois > >I'll call tehm but I suspect it will be like the DELL(sharp) LCD I have >and while VGA sized it is not a vga interface. > >Allison >

28 years, 1 month

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another classiccmp coinkydink URL

by mor＠crl.com

Considering the recent chatter on analog computers, plus the Dow Jones 10,000 problem somebody brought up, I found this listing at Haggle.Com pretty cute: http://www.haggle.com/cgi/getitem.cgi?id=201642752 -- mor(a)crl.com http://www.crl.com/~mor/

28 years, 1 month

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Final Xerox Star demo

by fmc＠reanimators.org

Frank McConnell <fmc(a)reanimators.org> wrote: > > I'm really hoping to be there, but I still have to figure out how to get > > from Walnut Creek at 5pm to Palto Alo at 5:30... > > I see a need for speed. Hmm, usually they start a few minutes late, > but Umm, duh. I plead damaged swap area. Anyway, usually they start a few minutes late, but at the TCMHC site I think that's because it takes that long for folks to quit gawking at the old iron and sit down. -Frank McConnell

28 years, 1 month

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Final Xerox Star demo

by fmc＠reanimators.org

Uncle Roger <sinasohn(a)ricochet.net> wrote: > >> >> Final Demo of the Xerox Star Workstation > >> >> 5:30 to 7:00pm > > I'm really hoping to be there, but I still have to figure out how to get > from Walnut Creek at 5pm to Palto Alo at 5:30... I see a need for speed. Hmm, usually they start a few minutes late, but > Ooh, I *love* waving my appendages, especially my phelanges! That's the spirit! Tongues, too! > Only, Wednesdays, esp. the second wed are not good... Make it the second > Thursday and you've got a deal. 8^) Well, second Wednesday was Paul's suggestion (and "suggestion" may be too strong a word), and he and I are both flexible. I figure whoever shows up at PARC will probably yak about this some Wednesday night and hopefully we will arrive at something close enough to consensus to post a real time and place. -Frank McConnell

28 years, 1 month

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Mini-Monitors?

by allisonp＠world.std.com

<In Circuit Cellar this month there is an add from timeline inc. It has a <VGA LCD 640 X 480 Sanyo LMDK55-22 listed for $25. That is the only info <given on the add. their phone number is (800) 872-8878 no web site :( <Francois I'll call tehm but I suspect it will be like the DELL(sharp) LCD I have and while VGA sized it is not a vga interface. Allison

28 years, 1 month

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Mini-Monitors?

by allisonp＠world.std.com

<>I'm also interested in same and know someone that might like info. <>There is a truck load of applications for a cheap/compact/lowpower <>VGA display. <> <>Allison < <Geez, Allison, If I was a EE god like yourself, I'd grab me a coupla <busted|older laptops and build an interface for the LCD screens. 8^) Humm, I have a dell laptop display and it will take a potload of ttl and ram to make it into a system... the results will be more power hungry than I want. FYI this is NOT for a PC so PC hacks are not the most useful. Allison

28 years, 1 month

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RCA VP3301 Data Terminal

by carl.friend＠stoneweb.com

G'day. In the last large haul I made (which included an Eclipse S/130 and a Nova 4) for my collection, I acquired a little RCA terminal which bills itself as an "Office Appliance". It's quite clearly a small video terminal and seems to be based around the 1801 microprocessor. I'm wondering if anybody has the manuals for the little beast and can tell me what the power supply puts out, and on what pins (it's got a DIN connector on the back labelled "power"). I'd sort of like to fire it up and see how it works. Thanks! ______________________________________________________________________ | | | | Carl Richard Friend (UNIX Sysadmin) | West Boylston | | Minicomputer Collector / Enthusiast | Massachusetts, USA | | mailto:carl.friend@stoneweb.com | | | http://www.ultranet.com/~engelbrt/carl/museum | ICBM: N42:22 W71:47 | |________________________________________________|_____________________|

28 years, 1 month

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AT&T 6300's

by sinasohn＠ricochet.net

At 12:42 PM 6/12/98 -0700, you wrote: >> Found a stack of AT&T computers. Some are labelled "PC 6300" (The unix PC, >> iirc?) but others are marked "6300 WGS", a designation I've not heard of > >The 6300 WGS (Work Group Server) was a tower cased system that was not These were (I'm pretty sure) desktops, almost identical to the PC 6300's, only wiht a cream colored front. --------------------------------------------------------------------- O- Uncle Roger "There is pleasure pure in being mad roger(a)sinasohn.com that none but madmen know." Roger Louis Sinasohn & Associates San Francisco, California http://www.sinasohn.com/

28 years, 1 month

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Mini-Monitors?

by sinasohn＠ricochet.net

At 03:14 PM 6/12/98 -0400, you wrote: ><Does anyone know of a *cheap* source of a VGA-compatible display? What I ><looking for, especially, is low power usage, followed by compactness and ><portability. Thanks! > >I'm also interested in same and know someone that might like info. >There is a truck load of applications for a cheap/compact/lowpower >VGA display. > >Allison Geez, Allison, If I was a EE god like yourself, I'd grab me a coupla busted|older laptops and build an interface for the LCD screens. 8^) --------------------------------------------------------------------- O- Uncle Roger "There is pleasure pure in being mad roger(a)sinasohn.com that none but madmen know." Roger Louis Sinasohn & Associates San Francisco, California http://www.sinasohn.com/

28 years, 1 month

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New toy, HP Apollo 4500, and it's broken...

by jfedorko＠virtualadmin.com

Sounds vaguely familiar, I remember two versions of the 2100s one had a black front panel w/red lights, the other one had a beige front panel. They were the CPU of HP2000 timesharing systems. They were pretty neat for their time (mid-70s) and I did my first "on-line" programming on them. The earlier ones boot off of paper tape, then the new technology... mylar oooh! I don't remember if they ever got weaned off tape booting though. Once you logged in you were at the command line and in a basic interpreter. They introduced me to instant gratification programming vs. waiting a day or so for the cards and the printout to come back or having to wire boards. Oh, yea... if it's one of the older ones, when the big oil filled capacitor goes in one of the disk drives the vented panel provides for spectacular visuals! If you don't want it, please let me know the details on it. -----Original Message----- From: museum(a)techniche.com [SMTP:museum@techniche.com] Sent: Saturday, June 13, 1998 3:36 PM To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers Subject: Re: New toy, HP Apollo 4500, and it's broken... This is somewhat tangential, but I suspect whoever is reading about HP Apollo's may be able to contribute. I came across a rack mount system in the local surplus store. The faceplate reads "HP 2100c Programmable Microcomputer System". Any ideas what this is? Worth picking up? Jon >> >> <I got a apollo 4500. >> <It has a 68030 inside, and a 700-someodd meg MFM (?) harddisk. >> >> More likely SCSI (single 50pin cable) or EDSI (two cables like MFM). >> MFM drives topped out at 160mb or so, EDSI went to at least 400mb maybe >> higher. > >Definitely ESDI or SCSI. Although they could have had SMD or ESMD >as well. > >> >> <I have no idea what it runs. This one has a SummaSketch pad with it. >> <It was used for CAD stuff. >> >> Some kind of unix. > >Possibly, though the Apollo's ran Domain/OS which was Multics inspired >but later it went to BSD compatibility and looked like both Unix and >Multics. > >> >> Allison >> >> > >Actually, there are a lot of Apollo collectors out there and the video >card may be getable. The Apollos used 3C505's for ethernet and some other >Token ring interface. > >Bill > >+---------------------------------------------------------------------------+ >| Bill/Carolyn Pechter | 17 Meredith Drive | Tinton Falls, New Jersey 07724 | >| 908-389-3592 | Save computing history, give an old geek old hardware. | >| pechter(a)shell.monmouth.com | >+---------------------------------------------------------------------------+ >

28 years, 1 month

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ESDI disks

by mbg＠world.std.com

>More likely SCSI (single 50pin cable) or EDSI (two cables like MFM). >MFM drives topped out at 160mb or so, EDSI went to at least 400mb maybe >higher. ESDI, and I know they can handle higher capacity disks (though I can't speak to the actual limit) as I have several ESDI disks which are 770mb unformatted (about 668mb formatted). A couple of them are the Hitachi DK515-78. I also have some Maxtor drives, but I don't remember their designation. Megan Gentry Former RT-11 Developer +--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+ | Megan Gentry, EMT/B, PP-ASEL | Internet (work): gentry(a)zk3.dec.com | | Unix Support Engineering Group | (home): mbg(a)world.std.com | | Digital Equipment Corporation | | | 110 Spitbrook Rd. ZK03-2/T43 | URL: http://world.std.com/~mbg/ | | Nashua, NH 03062 | "pdp-11 programmer - some assembler | | (603) 884 1055 | required." - mbg | +--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+

28 years, 1 month

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Mini-Monitors?

by fauradon＠pclink.com

In Circuit Cellar this month there is an add from timeline inc. It has a 6" VGA LCD 640 X 480 Sanyo LMDK55-22 listed for $25. That is the only info given on the add. their phone number is (800) 872-8878 no web site :( Francois ------------------------------------------------------------- Visit the Sanctuary at: http://www.pclink.com/fauradon -----Original Message----- From: Rax <rax(a)warbaby.com> To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers <classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu> Date: Saturday, June 13, 1998 6:20 PM Subject: Re: Mini-Monitors? >>> <Does anyone know of a *cheap* source of a VGA-compatible display? What I >>> <looking for, especially, is low power usage, followed by compactness and >>> <portability. Thanks! >>> >>> I'm also interested in same and know someone that might like info. >>> There is a truck load of applications for a cheap/compact/lowpower >>> VGA display. >> >>At least small CGA and mono monitors have been cheap for a long time. >>Places that advertise in Electronics Now tend to have them for ~$30ish. >>They are usually open-frame. >> > >Also try Nuts & Volts magazine. Lots of ads from purveyors of all sorts of >goodies for the mad inventor that lurks inside each of us. > >R. > >-- > > > >Warbaby >The WebSite. The Domain. The Empire. >http://www.warbaby.com > >The MonkeyPool >WebSite Content Development >http://www.monkeypool.com > > Dreadlocks on white boys give me the willies. > > > > >

28 years, 1 month

1
0
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Magazine values

by nerdware＠laidbak.com

Hi, gang. I'm just curious what old electronic magazines are worth. I haven't been able to find them in a price guide -- I have all the PE Altair issues (including the 680) and would like to know if they are worth anything I need to worry about insuring. Don't get excited -- I'm not going to part with them. It's just that I've heard that they're worth some money and I'd like to know. Thanks Paul Braun NerdWare -- The History of the PC and the Nerds who brought it to you. nerdware(a)laidbak.com www.laidbak.com/nerdware

28 years, 1 month

2
2
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AT&T 6300's

by sinasohn＠ricochet.net

Found a stack of AT&T computers. Some are labelled "PC 6300" (The unix PC, iirc?) but others are marked "6300 WGS", a designation I've not heard of before. In any case, is anyone interested in them? They're available at a good price. Condition unknown, possible monitors/keyboards, but dunno. Lemme know if I should pick 'em up. --------------------------------------------------------------------- O- Uncle Roger "There is pleasure pure in being mad roger(a)sinasohn.com that none but madmen know." Roger Louis Sinasohn & Associates San Francisco, California http://www.sinasohn.com/

28 years, 1 month

5
5
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Mini-Monitors?

by allisonp＠world.std.com

<Does anyone know of a *cheap* source of a VGA-compatible display? What I <looking for, especially, is low power usage, followed by compactness and <portability. Thanks! I'm also interested in same and know someone that might like info. There is a truck load of applications for a cheap/compact/lowpower VGA display. Allison

28 years, 1 month

5
5
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CP/M

by peacock＠simconv.com

+AD4-Did MP/M run on Z-80s? BTW, is there a reasonable chance the CP/M on +AD4-one micro w/5.25+ACI- disks be compatible with another with 5.25+ACI- disks, +AD4-i.e. my apple with a C-128? Also, if a computer can run CP/M 3 can it +AD4-run eariler versions? (Note i'm not talking about apps here). Yes, MP/M ran on the Z80 first, then on the 8086. A multi-user Z80 was no speed demon but it was cheap compared to a PDP-11. BTW, the very first initial release of MP/M was actually coded for 8080, the task dispatcher did not save the extra Z80 registers. I discovered it the hard way, reported it to DRI, they fixed it right away. Apparently whatever machine they used to test MP/M was 8080 or 8085 based. Compatibility on floppies was about nil, very very few disks could be moved from one machine to another. If anything, 5.25+ACI- compatibility was worse than 8+ACI- floppies. Any Z80 machine that could run V3 had all the hardware needed to run V2. CP/M V1 was designed only for 8+ACI- SSSD floppies, the BIOS didn't have the drive tables in it to support anything else. Jack Peacock

28 years, 1 month

1
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Hacked Mac and Other Systems

by foxnhare＠goldrush.com

I Remember a Computer Shopper (you know, back when there ware actually a few decent articles in it, as well as a ton of advertising) referred to those Mac Clones as 'HackIntoshes' Sounds appropriate to me... > From: "Zane H. Healy" <healyzh(a)ix.netcom.com> > Subject: Re: Early Mac Clones > > >bit hard getting a mac into a pc case though, remember that macs have all > >the connectors on board, > > > >desie > > Can't be any worse than the people that put Atari's or Amiga's in a PC > case. I've seen a Atari TT030 in a PC Tower, and it's quite popular among > Amiga people to tower their A1200's. All it takes is some creative cabling. > > Zane I have a set of texts on making a "Tower 64" (bundling a Commodore 64, Ram Expansion, drives, etc. in a tower PC case) which I have been seriously considering, actually I think I'd prefer a Tower 128 myself. Larry -- -+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+- Larry Anderson - Sysop of Silicon Realms BBS (300-2400bd) (209) 754-1363 Visit my Commodore 8-Bit web page at: http://www.goldrush.com/~foxnhare/commodore.html -+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-

28 years, 1 month

1
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New toy, HP Apollo 4500, and it's broken...

by museum＠techniche.com

This is somewhat tangential, but I suspect whoever is reading about HP Apollo's may be able to contribute. I came across a rack mount system in the local surplus store. The faceplate reads "HP 2100c Programmable Microcomputer System". Any ideas what this is? Worth picking up? Jon >> >> <I got a apollo 4500. >> <It has a 68030 inside, and a 700-someodd meg MFM (?) harddisk. >> >> More likely SCSI (single 50pin cable) or EDSI (two cables like MFM). >> MFM drives topped out at 160mb or so, EDSI went to at least 400mb maybe >> higher. > >Definitely ESDI or SCSI. Although they could have had SMD or ESMD >as well. > >> >> <I have no idea what it runs. This one has a SummaSketch pad with it. >> <It was used for CAD stuff. >> >> Some kind of unix. > >Possibly, though the Apollo's ran Domain/OS which was Multics inspired >but later it went to BSD compatibility and looked like both Unix and >Multics. > >> >> Allison >> >> > >Actually, there are a lot of Apollo collectors out there and the video >card may be getable. The Apollos used 3C505's for ethernet and some other >Token ring interface. > >Bill > >+---------------------------------------------------------------------------+ >| Bill/Carolyn Pechter | 17 Meredith Drive | Tinton Falls, New Jersey 07724 | >| 908-389-3592 | Save computing history, give an old geek old hardware. | >| pechter(a)shell.monmouth.com | >+---------------------------------------------------------------------------+ >

28 years, 1 month

2
1
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CP/M

by maxeskin＠hotmail.com

Did MP/M run on Z-80s? BTW, is there a reasonable chance the CP/M on one micro w/5.25" disks be compatible with another with 5.25" disks, i.e. my apple with a C-128? Also, if a computer can run CP/M 3+ can it run eariler versions? (Note i'm not talking about apps here). >OK to fair. ;) It was file level password protection and required the >whole colume to be enabled for it. Security level was low though. If the >user could assemble and run a program they could write code to access the >disk directory and toggle the right bits and they had control. It was >aimed at captive applications where the user had limited resources and >could not get directly at the file system. Many of the things in CPM3 >are there to provice more direct compatability with MP/M. > >As to weird, no most of the additions they did were similar to the ZCPR >groups and other were doing in parallel and had sound basis. > >Allison > > ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com

28 years, 1 month

1
0
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Old Alpha's (OT)

by photze＠batelco.com.bh

Hi. Just wanted to know if anyone out here knows where I can get an old alpha... (real old). Ciao, Tim D. Hotze

28 years, 1 month

1
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New toy, HP Apollo 4500, and it's broken...

by allisonp＠world.std.com

<I got a apollo 4500. <It has a 68030 inside, and a 700-someodd meg MFM (?) harddisk. More likely SCSI (single 50pin cable) or EDSI (two cables like MFM). MFM drives topped out at 160mb or so, EDSI went to at least 400mb maybe higher. <I have no idea what it runs. This one has a SummaSketch pad with it. <It was used for CAD stuff. Some kind of unix. <The problem with it is, the video card appears to have died. <WHen I power the machine on (It has a VERY LARGE [21"] RGB monitor. Any <chance of me connecting it to a PC? It has 3 plugs, R G B, and expects <sync on green) and the monitor, I get garbage. The garbage is the same a it can be but I forget the modes required also you need a cable for it. Connecting to a PC is more trouble than its worth generally. Allison

28 years, 1 month

2
1
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CP/M

by allisonp＠world.std.com

Max, Please clip off the unwanted parts of the message. <><The CP/M 3+ manual says the syntax is drive:12345678.123;password. <><Maybe it's a weird DR thing. They tended to add weird stuff... < <So, how DID it work? OK to fair. ;) It was file level password protection and required the whole colume to be enabled for it. Security level was low though. If the user could assemble and run a program they could write code to access the disk directory and toggle the right bits and they had control. It was aimed at captive applications where the user had limited resources and could not get directly at the file system. Many of the things in CPM3 are there to provice more direct compatability with MP/M. As to weird, no most of the additions they did were similar to the ZCPR groups and other were doing in parallel and had sound basis. Allison

28 years, 1 month

1
0
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CP/M

by maxeskin＠hotmail.com

So, how DID it work? > >Password protection? There wasn't any as part of CP/M. ><The CP/M 3+ manual says the syntax is drive:12345678.123;password. ><Maybe it's a weird DR thing. They tended to add weird stuff... > >You didn't say CPM3! If you say CPM it is assumed the more common v2.x >version. V2.x did not have passwords, V3.0 did. Obviously if this apple >cpm card has V3 disks it it was a very late one or someone went to some >trouble to port v3 to it. FYI: v3 was not widely popular. > >Allison > > > > ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com

28 years, 1 month

1
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Alloy Engineering tape drive

by allisonp＠world.std.com

<I have acquired the manuals, S100 controller, and cartridge tape <drive, but not the software, for an Alloy Engineering cartridge tape Alloy is still in business I believe. <This system came from a multi-user Concurrent CP/M 80286 system in the <early 80's. The system disk was pulled from the S-100 box when it was MID80s... the 286 on s100 was about 84-86ish. the earliest data I have >from intel is late 83 for the 286. good luck finding the software as it was never PD and alloy controllers where never that common that I've seen. Allison

28 years, 1 month

1
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FW: DEC WT/78?

by allisonp＠world.std.com

<Hugh Henderson <hendronicus(a)hotmail.com> <saginaw, MI USA - Friday, June 12, 1998 at 18:07:56 < <I rescued a Digital WT/78 word terminal with a Digital RX02 computer <attached. Ok, the WT78 is one of DECs early compact word processing systems. The CPU is the intersil 6100 (PDP-8 reduced to a chip). The RX02 is nto acomputer but a disk box and controller for 256k/512k 8" floppies. (others in that family are the DECmate, DECmateII and DECmateIII) < It does try to boot, but I don't have the system disk. I'd sure love <to see the beast run. The images for the disks(both WPS and OS/78) are on the net and you would need a system that can create 8" disks. Alternately someone that has a system with RX02 disks (they were used on PDP-8, PDP-11 systems). < What does it run? What kind of processors does it use? It has network <and modem connections. The primary processor that runs the OS is a varient of the PDP-8 family reduced to a single chip. The disk system has it's own processor but that is not user programmable. It _does_not_ have network connections. The idea of a network at that time was unrealistic for such a low end machine. The modem connection however is eaxactly that and could be used to connect the machine to a host for file transfers. <How do you use those, and what were they originally for? It was originally used for word processing running WPS78, it also runs OS/78 an older PDP-8 operating system that looks a tiny bit like DOS. Allison

28 years, 1 month

1
0
0 0

Mini-Monitors?

by allisonp＠world.std.com

<That's why my LCD panel sits in the box. :-( < <> There are (were?) a few vendors that made very nice single chip solutio <> for converting base VGA into something an LCD could use. <> <> Hitachi? < <Ooh! Does anyone have a relevant Hitachi data book? My assessment is that for the display I have to convert serial video (VGA) to two 4 bit parallel streams for a partitioned display is unrealistic. The next simpler option if to generate video directly in the form required for the display and that is also somewhat ponderous. I didn't see anyhting suitable on the Hitachi site. Allisom

28 years, 1 month

1
0
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CP/M

by allisonp＠world.std.com

Password protection? There wasn't any as part of CP/M. <The CP/M 3+ manual says the syntax is drive:12345678.123;password. <Maybe it's a weird DR thing. They tended to add weird stuff... You didn't say CPM3! If you say CPM it is assumed the more common v2.x version. V2.x did not have passwords, V3.0 did. Obviously if this apple cpm card has V3 disks it it was a very late one or someone went to some trouble to port v3 to it. FYI: v3 was not widely popular. Allison

28 years, 1 month

1
0
0 0

FA: Various systems

by tomowad＠earthlink.net

> Auction services have their place, but I think that we on the list >should be given the "right of first refusal". If one of the list members has >something to sell, give the others a first crack, with some time limit (like >a week), before listing it on eBay or Haggle. Perhaps list subscribers who wish to list their items on an auction service could offer a discount to other subscribers (e.g. "Mention you saw this add on the Classic Computers mailing list and get 10% off."). This way the seller gets the higher prices of the auction services while at the same time offering an advantage to list subscribers. Tom Owad

28 years, 1 month

1
0
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Alloy Engineering tape drive

by peacock＠simconv.com

I have acquired the manuals, S100 controller, and cartridge tape drive, but not the software, for an Alloy Engineering cartridge tape drive. I have two manuals, the Interface Guide For the IDXS-100, and TIP (Tape Interchange Package) Operator's Guide, both dated 1981. The tape drive is an early 3M cartridge tape, capacity of about 14MB formatted. I also have a big box of backup tape cartridges. This system came from a multi-user Concurrent CP/M 80286 system in the early 80's. The system disk was pulled from the S-100 box when it was retired, and the original floppies are long gone. I figure if I can find either a Z80 or 8086 version of the TIP program I can get the system directory off the backup tapes. Does anyone know more about these tape drives? A binary of the TIP program? Jack Peacock

28 years, 1 month

1
0
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Mini-Monitors?

by peacock＠simconv.com

>There are (were?) a few vendors that made very nice single chip solutions >for converting base VGA into something an LCD could use. > >Hitachi? > Cirrus Logic made LCD controllers that would drive an LCD and also an external monitor. I have an older Compal TS-38 laptop with the chip, driving a dual scan color LCD, but with a switch to go to an external monitor.

28 years, 1 month

1
0
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IIRC

by fauradon＠pclink.com

I've seen Him/Them Beign flamed about it on some newsgroup (pretty funny too), other than that Have no idea. Francois ------------------------------------------------------------- Visit the Sanctuary at: http://www.pclink.com/fauradon -----Original Message----- From: Doug Yowza <yowza(a)yowza.com> To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers <classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu> Date: Thursday, June 11, 1998 11:56 PM Subject: Re: IIRC >On Thu, 11 Jun 1998, Francois wrote: > >> Well, "If I Recall Corectly" that's what it means. > >BTW, whatever happened to lisard/communa? The consistency with which >"they" used pronouns was impressive: IIRC -> iwrc. > >-- Doug >

28 years, 1 month

2
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