- test-drb@ccmp.vtda.org - classiccmp.org

by marvin＠rain.org

Since I have never seen the 8800BT, I'm sure it is rare, at least he says a number of times that this stuff is RARE. Shipping and handling including insurance is only $100 plus the winning bid. However, it does have some good photos of the unit. http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=35408024

27 years, 9 months

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Lisa software available

by Marion.Bates＠Dartmouth.EDU

A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: text/enriched Size: 1537 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/19981014/807da3bb/at…

27 years, 9 months

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Off-Topic Wierdness

by maxeskin＠hotmail.com

Reading an article, it's not really a hoax. It's a partnership of crackpots. THOUGHT: "T=C * A * I(Squared)" Yeah, right! Get with the '90s! We don't analyze human thought with equations any more! >>In addition to inventing the GUI, the IBM PC, Sun Workstations and Apples, >>as well as several CPUs, he's created a "computer science" organization >>and nominated himself for Computer Scientist of the Year! >> http://www.acsa.net/1996b2.html >> > >Since he's such an important figure in the history of computers, I think we >should invite him to be the keynote speaker at next year's VCF... > >R. > >-- > > > >Warbaby >The WebSite. The Domain. The Empire. >http://www.warbaby.com > >The MonkeyPool >WebSite Content Development >http://www.monkeypool.com > > > Once you get the nose on, the rest is just makeup. > > > > > > ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com

27 years, 9 months

2
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Some "Classiccmp-Friendly" pinouts posted....

by aaron＠wfi-inc.com

After being frustrated trying to view some of the pinouts posted on the web with lynx (everyone using frames/tables/etc), I have created a shell-user-friendly pinout directory on my web server. I've got ~75 of 200 (give or take) up so far, and I'll be working on it for the next couple of weeks. http://www.prinsol.com/pinouts/ If you have the time and the giving spirit overcomes you, please share any that you find missing. Especially those from scarce/rare/unusual machines that might help someone who rescues one with no available documentation. And for God's sake, please let me know if I screwed up on any of these, before someone trusts my addled transcriptions and blows something up! Related, but a little more selfish, could someone give me the pinout for the HP-IB port? Aaron

27 years, 9 months

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Quick thrift run...

by aaron＠wfi-inc.com

A couple of quick snags from the local thrift: Wyse-60 terminal, no keyboard: $4.95 "Programming in Assembly: Macro-11", E. Sowell: $.50 Someone posted a couple of days ago that they got some Wyse keyboards? Anyone have an extra for the model 60 that I just got that they would part with for a few $$$? Aaron

27 years, 9 months

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Off-Topic Wierdness

by sinasohn＠ricochet.net

At 09:23 PM 10/12/98 -0400, you wrote: >Would someone please check out accpc.com/home0.html#About, and enlighten >some of us "historically challenged" individuals as to how much of their >"history" is possibly truth vs. B.S.? They claim they had a windowing product in late '73/early '74 which is supposedly long before the Alto -- But I thought the Alto was earlier than that? I dunno for sure, but it sure sounds like a bunch of BS to me. --------------------------------------------------------------------- O- Uncle Roger "There is pleasure pure in being mad roger(a)sinasohn.com that none but madmen know." Roger Louis Sinasohn & Associates San Francisco, California http://www.sinasohn.com/

27 years, 9 months

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Software Collecting

by sinasohn＠ricochet.net

At 08:22 PM 10/12/98 -0700, you wrote: >Does anyone on this list collect software, and if so, what is considered >desireable software to collect? Only in the form of Vic-20 carts (which I ended up doing simply because I found the big box of carts I had accumulated in the mid-80's.) --------------------------------------------------------------------- O- Uncle Roger "There is pleasure pure in being mad roger(a)sinasohn.com that none but madmen know." Roger Louis Sinasohn & Associates San Francisco, California http://www.sinasohn.com/

27 years, 9 months

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Commodore "PET 2001-8" Vintage Computer

by MPritchard＠EnsembleStudios.com

Not to be bitching; but my email program; Microsoft Outlook, can't handle HTML messages; thus I get an attached text object that is very, very hard to decypher - on every single message from Marvin. (and others). Is it too much to ask for people to send plaintext? -Matt Pritchard > -----Original Message----- > From: Matt Pritchard [SMTP:MPritchard@EnsembleStudios.com] > Sent: Tuesday, October 13, 1998 2:41 PM > To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers > Subject: RE: Commodore "PET 2001-8" Vintage Computer > > Am I the only person who can't read messages made up of tons of HTML junk? > > -Matt Pritchard > Graphics Engine and Optimization Specialist > MS Age of Empires & Age of Empires ][ > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Marvin [SMTP:marvin@rain.org] > > Sent: Tuesday, October 13, 1998 12:55 PM > > To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers > > Subject: Commodore "PET 2001-8" Vintage Computer > > > > This message uses a character set that is not supported by the Internet > > Service. To view the original message content, open the attached > > message. If the text doesn't display correctly, save the attachment to > > disk, and then open it using a viewer that can display the original > > character set. << File: message.txt >>

27 years, 9 months

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Commodore "PET 2001-8" Vintage Computer

by MPritchard＠EnsembleStudios.com

Right, I know other can. For me I just don't have an option to change. (This is my work e-mail; does eudora interface with exchange server and have a compatible scheduler?) -Matt Pritchard (10 yard penalty; going off topic) > -----Original Message----- > From: van lincoln [SMTP:vlincoln@earthlink.net] > Sent: Tuesday, October 13, 1998 10:48 AM > To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers > Subject: RE: Commodore "PET 2001-8" Vintage Computer > > I can read it. I use eudora light. > van > > > > > > At 02:41 PM 10/13/98 -0500, you wrote: > >Am I the only person who can't read messages made up of tons of HTML > junk? > > > >-Matt Pritchard > >Graphics Engine and Optimization Specialist > >MS Age of Empires & Age of Empires ][ > > > >> -----Original Message----- > >> From: Marvin [SMTP:marvin@rain.org] > >> Sent: Tuesday, October 13, 1998 12:55 PM > >> To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers > >> Subject: Commodore "PET 2001-8" Vintage Computer > >> > >> This message uses a character set that is not supported by the Internet > >> Service. To view the original message content, open the attached > >> message. If the text doesn't display correctly, save the attachment to > >> disk, and then open it using a viewer that can display the original > >> character set. << File: message.txt >> > > > >

27 years, 9 months

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MITS Altair 8800BT Computer (RARE!!!)

by allisonp＠world.std.com

< Since I have never seen the 8800BT, I'm sure it is rare, at least he say < number of times that this stuff is RARE. Shipping and handling includin < insurance is only $100 plus the winning bid. However, it does have som < good photos of the unit. Marvin, Please stop with the HTML, reduce it to text for this forum. MITS 8800BT is the turnkey (front pannel less) version of the 8800B and fairly common. The PERTEC labeled version is scarcer. Allison

27 years, 9 months

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MITS Altair 8800BT Computer (RARE!!!)

by kaikal＠MICROSOFT.com

Mine has MITS on the front panel and Pertec on the serial number tag. Pictures at http://www.geocities.com/~compcloset/MITSAltair8800bt.htm Kai -----Original Message----- From: allisonp(a)world.std.com [mailto:allisonp@world.std.com] Sent: Tuesday, October 13, 1998 3:09 PM To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers Subject: Re: MITS Altair 8800BT Computer (RARE!!!) < Since I have never seen the 8800BT, I'm sure it is rare, at least he say < number of times that this stuff is RARE. Shipping and handling includin < insurance is only $100 plus the winning bid. However, it does have som < good photos of the unit. Marvin, Please stop with the HTML, reduce it to text for this forum. MITS 8800BT is the turnkey (front pannel less) version of the 8800B and fairly common. The PERTEC labeled version is scarcer. Allison

27 years, 9 months

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Commodore "PET 2001-8" Vintage Computer

by MPritchard＠EnsembleStudios.com

It doesn't appear to be in this version (Outlook 97). That's what I get for not upgrading to the latest, most bloated, and buggiest beta software. (I'm still running version 3 of my browser too!) -Matt P > -----Original Message----- > From: Kai Kaltenbach [SMTP:kaikal@MICROSOFT.com] > Sent: Tuesday, October 13, 1998 4:45 PM > To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers > Subject: RE: Commodore "PET 2001-8" Vintage Computer > > If you're running Outlook, do Tools.Options/Mail Format, choose Rich Text > from the drop-down list box instead of HTML. > > Kai > > -----Original Message----- > From: Matt Pritchard [mailto:MPritchard@EnsembleStudios.com] > Sent: Tuesday, October 13, 1998 2:34 PM > To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers > Subject: RE: Commodore "PET 2001-8" Vintage Computer > > > Right, I know other can. For me I just don't have an option to change. > (This is my work e-mail; does eudora interface with exchange server and > have > a compatible scheduler?) > > -Matt Pritchard > (10 yard penalty; going off topic) > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: van lincoln [SMTP:vlincoln@earthlink.net] > > Sent: Tuesday, October 13, 1998 10:48 AM > > To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers > > Subject: RE: Commodore "PET 2001-8" Vintage Computer > > > > I can read it. I use eudora light. > > van > > > > > > > > > > > > At 02:41 PM 10/13/98 -0500, you wrote: > > >Am I the only person who can't read messages made up of tons of HTML > > junk? > > > > > >-Matt Pritchard > > >Graphics Engine and Optimization Specialist > > >MS Age of Empires & Age of Empires ][ > > > > > >> -----Original Message----- > > >> From: Marvin [SMTP:marvin@rain.org] > > >> Sent: Tuesday, October 13, 1998 12:55 PM > > >> To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers > > >> Subject: Commodore "PET 2001-8" Vintage Computer > > >> > > >> This message uses a character set that is not supported by the > Internet > > >> Service. To view the original message content, open the attached > > >> message. If the text doesn't display correctly, save the attachment > to > > >> disk, and then open it using a viewer that can display the original > > >> character set. << File: message.txt >> > > > > > >

27 years, 9 months

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Commodore "PET 2001-8" Vintage Computer

by kaikal＠MICROSOFT.com

If you're running Outlook, do Tools.Options/Mail Format, choose Rich Text >from the drop-down list box instead of HTML. Kai -----Original Message----- From: Matt Pritchard [mailto:MPritchard@EnsembleStudios.com] Sent: Tuesday, October 13, 1998 2:34 PM To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers Subject: RE: Commodore "PET 2001-8" Vintage Computer Right, I know other can. For me I just don't have an option to change. (This is my work e-mail; does eudora interface with exchange server and have a compatible scheduler?) -Matt Pritchard (10 yard penalty; going off topic) > -----Original Message----- > From: van lincoln [SMTP:vlincoln@earthlink.net] > Sent: Tuesday, October 13, 1998 10:48 AM > To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers > Subject: RE: Commodore "PET 2001-8" Vintage Computer > > I can read it. I use eudora light. > van > > > > > > At 02:41 PM 10/13/98 -0500, you wrote: > >Am I the only person who can't read messages made up of tons of HTML > junk? > > > >-Matt Pritchard > >Graphics Engine and Optimization Specialist > >MS Age of Empires & Age of Empires ][ > > > >> -----Original Message----- > >> From: Marvin [SMTP:marvin@rain.org] > >> Sent: Tuesday, October 13, 1998 12:55 PM > >> To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers > >> Subject: Commodore "PET 2001-8" Vintage Computer > >> > >> This message uses a character set that is not supported by the Internet > >> Service. To view the original message content, open the attached > >> message. If the text doesn't display correctly, save the attachment to > >> disk, and then open it using a viewer that can display the original > >> character set. << File: message.txt >> > > > >

27 years, 9 months

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Commodore "PET 2001-8" Vintage Computer

by MPritchard＠EnsembleStudios.com

Am I the only person who can't read messages made up of tons of HTML junk? -Matt Pritchard Graphics Engine and Optimization Specialist MS Age of Empires & Age of Empires ][ > -----Original Message----- > From: Marvin [SMTP:marvin@rain.org] > Sent: Tuesday, October 13, 1998 12:55 PM > To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers > Subject: Commodore "PET 2001-8" Vintage Computer > > This message uses a character set that is not supported by the Internet > Service. To view the original message content, open the attached > message. If the text doesn't display correctly, save the attachment to > disk, and then open it using a viewer that can display the original > character set. << File: message.txt >>

27 years, 9 months

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auction grabs

by CharlesII＠nwonline.net

My dad recently came accros some intresting stuff at a county auction. I wasn't there or he would have baught more stuff :-) but however he did find some keyboards that look like they came from a terminal and a computer. Does WYSE ring a bell to anyone? But the biggest enigma is an IBM 4224 printer which from the diagram on the back look like it was made for some sort of LAN, but not ethernet. The plug it would take would be about an inch in diameter. This was previously used by the board of elections and in that case was probably was wired in some sort of esotaric network. The other puzzel is an ethernet card that is deffentatily not 10 years old but just bear with me. The face plate already is a dead give away that it is not made for a PC. The other thing is that the interface to the computer uses a plug that has 3 rows of 32 pins. Could any one tell me wat this interface is, and what I could do to adapt this to be used by a PC's serial poart? Another find was in the tons of IBM formated disks I found an original wang floppy disk but without the orginal format :-( Thats all for now.

27 years, 9 months

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dishwasher + mainboards

by roblwill＠usaor.net

I know this is getting WAY off-topic, but to get it slightly back on-topic.... If you would happen to barf on your , say, C64, would it damage any of the traces on the motherboard or the keyboard? <sorry - couldn't resist:)> -- -Jason (roblwill(a)usaor.net) ICQ#-1730318 ---------- > From: Cameron Kaiser <ckaiser(a)oa.ptloma.edu> > To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers <classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu> > Subject: Re: dishwasher + mainboards > Date: Tuesday, October 13, 1998 10:05 AM > > ::Last time I vomitted, some of that stomach acid came up exactly the same > ::path as it would have to go down if I drank it. > > Your stomach also does not contain *just* dilute HCl. You're also barfing up > a buffered solution (all the electrolytes in the food you eat), a gunk of > mucus (I can't believe I'm writing this before breakfast) which further > retards acid action, and food which usually is slightly alkaline itself. > Moreover, the pH 3 in your stomach is needed only to activate enzymes like > trypsin and pepsin from their inert state. It's not like your entire stomach > is a bubbling pit of acid; most of the catalytic activity is performed by the > enzymes, or else you would break things like proteins into inorganic or > elemental compounds instead of the amino acids and monosaccharides you need. > > -- > -------------------------- personal page: http://calvin.ptloma.edu/~spectre/ -- > Cameron Kaiser Information Technology Services Database Programmer > Point Loma Nazarene University Fax: +1 619 849 2581 > ckaiser(a)ptloma.edu Phone: +1 619 849 2539 > -- FORTUNE: You learn from your mistakes. Today will be very educational. -----

27 years, 9 months

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Fairchild Channel F units

by dcoward＠pressstart.com

Francois said: >>#19 is the hardest to find. >How about the demo cart #2? Is that a har to find Item? I was speaking about the "regular" cartridges. >And I've managed to collect all of the regular cartridges, except >for #26, in the boxes with instructions. >#19 is the hardest to find. I really don't have any interest in the Demo carts because they are so popular. I do have a prototype of football but that came with some other carts. Phil Clayton said: >.How about the RCA Studio II machine ? > Have you ever seen one of these machines ? I have one. Not because I found it, but because it was given to me. Other than that I have not seen another. >Check this site out: http://newton.physics.arizona.edu/~hart/vgh/main.html I wish I have the time to put up nice pictures like this. Great page. >As far as I know the Fairchild F8 microprocessor was not used in >any other applications, however the RCA 1802 microprocessor..... I did get a chance to do some F8 programming about 1982 at AMF's Electronics Research Lab. I had to modify the code in a rowing machine. They added a clip for the ear lobe that measured your heart rate. I used a 3870 because I could try out new code by inserting a new EPROM on to the processor. I did burn out one of the 3870s and I stuck a white ceramic 1702 on top and made it into a tie clip to remind me. That was the only processor I have every destroyed. And I still have it today. As for the instruction set, the only thing I remember is that the ACC was always trashed on a return from subroutine. I think the processor use it to pull the return address from the stack. What was the question? ========================================= Doug Coward Press Start Inc. Sunnyvale,CA =========================================

27 years, 9 months

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Software Collecting

by paulk＠microsoft.com

> There was a huge burst of interest on the Apple2 newsgroups last > year in the original Ultima's, with the first Ultima in the original > packaging with all the pieces fetching up to $300. > Wow. Well, don't I feel smart, then, for picking up a copy at a thrift store for $1.99 a few years ago. It didn't have the coins but was otherwise complete -- and the coins weren't worth $298.01, in my opinion. Buying things over the Internet is a mixed blessing. > Sellam Alternate e-mail: > dastar(a)siconic.com > Paul Kearns paulk(a)microsoft.com

27 years, 9 months

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Commodore "PET 2001-8" Vintage Computer

by franke＠sbs.de

> This was put up on ebay and the auction will close about 7 hours from now > (at about 6:00 p.m. pst). Currently there has only been one bid on it at > the opening bid of $575. > http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=34347085 Oh Oh - way expensive - At this price I already start to think about selling some of my PET/CBMs. Gruss H. -- Ich denke, also bin ich, also gut HRK

27 years, 9 months

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Pre - Columbus traveler with classic computer?

by maxeskin＠hotmail.com

The chief advantage of any kind of history is, IMHO, to reach the understanding of how similar the past is to the present. This applies to computer history as well. Only people who are familiar with it know that the computers we use today (except uncommon parallel and analog computers) are based on Von Neumann's theories more than 30 years ago. There is no real advancement. There is multiplication of matrices by a scalar value... There is nothing new under the sun, as a very old book says. >As mor as I learn about this 'dark ages' as less dark they >apear. Not even very different from before or after (especialy >not differentfrom now ). > >Gruss >H. > >-- >Ich denke, also bin ich, also gut >HRK > ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com

27 years, 9 months

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Software Collecting

by maxeskin＠hotmail.com

Ouch! I couldn't do that! I have lots of old software, most of which I have the urge to discard, but hope to put it to good use in a display of some sort. > However when a school dumped all their teaching software for >Commodore and Apple computers, I picked it all up >since I didn't want it going to the dump. This stuff is dated in the >middle 80's. I tend to segregate any original Apple or Commodore Educational software is definitely part of Apple's history.There are lots of crappy games and word processors for Apple and Commodore,which are really quite uninteresting. I tend to pass up most. > >As Sam said, some of the classic games and productivity software are worth >keeping. But what about the rest? > ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com

27 years, 9 months

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Columbus analogy (Was: Corrections to trivia

by maxeskin＠hotmail.com

Who wouldn't be? With on maps, once the coast is not visible, you're on your own! >It is true that sailors in those days were leery of sailing too far >from coast -- because there was no way to determine longitude until >accurate clocks were developed many years later. ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com

27 years, 9 months

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Commodore "PET 2001-8" Vintage Computer

by marvin＠rain.org

This was put up on ebay and the auction will close about 7 hours from now (at about 6:00 p.m. pst). Currently there has only been one bid on it at the opening bid of $575. http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=34347085

27 years, 9 months

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Off-Topic Wierdness

by franke＠sbs.de

>>In addition to inventing the GUI, the IBM PC, Sun Workstations and Apples, >>as well as several CPUs, he's created a "computer science" organization >>and nominated himself for Computer Scientist of the Year! >> http://www.acsa.net/1996b2.html > Since he's such an important figure in the history of computers, I think we > should invite him to be the keynote speaker at next year's VCF... > R. Great idea. Saaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaam - get up, and try to catch him - a speaker of this format might be your #1 for VCF 3.0 (And for shure I will attend it - woooha!). Gruss H. Serious: He might be a real good choice to get a 'new' vision. (And we still have no fun part for the first day :) -- Ich denke, also bin ich, also gut HRK

27 years, 9 months

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Picture up (RE: Microsci HAVAC)

by roblwill＠usaor.net

Mine was more like the mechanism of either a TRS-80 drive, or an IBM Tandon drive. The heads were connected to a horizontal stepper by a thin metal sheet. -- -Jason (roblwill(a)usaor.net) ICQ#-1730318 ---------- > From: Tony Duell <ard(a)p850ug1.demon.co.uk> > To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers <classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu> > Subject: Re: Picture up (RE: Microsci HAVAC) > Date: Monday, October 12, 1998 4:00 PM > > > BTW: I used to have a Disk II, and the heads were positioned by a stepper > > motor, and didn't have any "spiral-grooved disc" anywhere in the entire > > unit. > > Odd... I've got a number of Disk II's here, and every one has a stepper > motor under the chassis with a disk on the spindle of it above the > chassis. There's a spiral groove in the disk and a little lug on the head > assembly that fits into the groove. The stepper motor turns the disk and > thus moves the heads. > > Maybe there are several versions of the Disk II > > -tony

27 years, 9 months

5
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Pre - Columbus traveler with classic computer?

by franke＠sbs.de

> < >> My question is why did everything go to Hell between 300BC and 0AD? H > < >> you believe the earth was flat? Where did this idea come from > < > Wasn't that around the time of the burning of the 'library' in > < > Alexandria? > < In fact, did anybody belive this, or is it just a > < urban legend ? > I think it is ascribed to the dark ages, roughly 700-1400AD Europe. :)) > The polical power of the church was strong then and science was nearly > exitinct. Science ? Just define science - AFAIK they had a lot of scientific research - just more in a way a 'bit' different. Their approach ist just alien for us today. And in fact, the church at this time wasn't anti-science they promoted research and payed a whole lot of money to support researchers. But like every big institution they are a bit slow when it comes to new ideas (Ever tried to launch a project based on a complete new idea ?). Even if you advance to the time of Galileo, the force behind the bann have just been some 'fellows' out of sheer envy. As mor as I learn about this 'dark ages' as less dark they apear. Not even very different from before or after (especialy not differentfrom now ). Gruss H. -- Ich denke, also bin ich, also gut HRK

27 years, 9 months

1
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Fairchild Channel F units

by MPritchard＠EnsembleStudios.com

> < The Odyssey^2 had an Intel 8048 with a 512 byte BIOS, 128 bytes of RAM > < (don't recall the chip) and the video (& sound) was driven by the Intel > < chip - the only application the chip was ever used in; (trivia - multipl > < 8244's could be hooked together with the output of one (slave/master mod > > The part I believe is a programmed 8044 RUPI. the 8044 is a 8051 core > with a slave interface and a SDLC controller. 8051s could be serially > connected via their 9bit serial port (also present on the RUPI). It would > > be the first place of comparison. Intel DId this with the 8041/2 in the > form of printer controller, 8278 (keyboard and display driver), also the > GPIB controller (8291) and the well known 8042 AT keybord controller found > > in AT and X86 systems. > > Allison > > ----------------- Nope. Trust me on this; I've got the docs. and the story of it's development from an Intel person responsible for it. Some parts of the silicon may be similar, but it was designed from the ground up as a video display chip for some sort of consumer electronics. My point was that it wound up being used is just this one application (the Maganvox Odyssey^2/Phillips G7000) and never made available through other channels. I was just pointing out that the 8244 has some capabilites that were not used in that application. What I find so attractive about it (and all the stuff that era), is that it respresents a window in time where the basic foundation blocks for todays stuff (which we take practically for granted) was developed; and the limitations they had to work under (i.e. not practical to have enough memory for a direct bit mapped display, the state of chip fabrication and design, etc) which were unique to that time. I comapre it _alot_ to the automobile industry between 1898 and 1914. Do you guys have any idea how many car compaines sprang up (and faded away)? -Matt Pritchard Graphics Engine and Optimization Specialist MS Age of Empires & Age of Empires ][

27 years, 9 months

1
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Fairchild Channel F units

by allisonp＠world.std.com

< The Odyssey^2 had an Intel 8048 with a 512 byte BIOS, 128 bytes of RAM < (don't recall the chip) and the video (& sound) was driven by the Intel < chip - the only application the chip was ever used in; (trivia - multipl < 8244's could be hooked together with the output of one (slave/master mod The part I believe is a programmed 8044 RUPI. the 8044 is a 8051 core with a slave interface and a SDLC controller. 8051s could be serially connected via their 9bit serial port (also present on the RUPI). It would be the first place of comparison. Intel DId this with the 8041/2 in the form of printer controller, 8278 (keyboard and display driver), also the GPIB controller (8291) and the well known 8042 AT keybord controller found in AT and X86 systems. Allison

27 years, 9 months

1
0
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Off-Topic Wierdness

by rax＠warbaby.com

Have y'all heard American Computer Company? They claim to have alien technology that's going to enable them to come out with a chip that holds 90 gigs. Uh-huh.... http://accpc.com/tcapdisplay.htm 90 GB of Solid State Storage on a Single Wafer! An original Semiconductor Device based upon J-S Dielectric-Junction Electron-Bond-Species Manipulation Semiconductors arranged in a High Density Ultra High Speed Integrated Quantum Junction Array I particularly like the Electron Bond Species Manipulation bit. R. -- Warbaby The WebSite. The Domain. The Empire. http://www.warbaby.com The MonkeyPool WebSite Content Development http://www.monkeypool.com Once you get the nose on, the rest is just makeup.

27 years, 9 months

6
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Pre - Columbus traveler with classic computer?

by franke＠sbs.de

>> My question is why did everything go to Hell between 300BC and 0AD? How could >> you believe the earth was flat? Where did this idea come from? >> Paxton > Wasn't that around the time of the burning of the 'library' in > Alexandria? > Chuck In fact, did anybody belive this, or is it just a urban legend ? :) H. -- Ich denke, also bin ich, also gut HRK

27 years, 9 months

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16K RAM was 300 bucks in 1977

by MPritchard＠EnsembleStudios.com

What's important to note is how much $200, $300, or $2600 in 1977 would buy us today. Factoring in inflation, what would that be equivalent to today? -Matt Pritchard Graphics Engine and Optimization Specialist MS Age of Empires & Age of Empires ][ > -----Original Message----- > From: Phil Clayton [SMTP:handyman@sprintmail.com] > Sent: Monday, October 12, 1998 10:41 AM > To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers > Subject: 16K RAM was 300 bucks in 1977 > > > In 1980 I moved into a Commodore Pet with a single IEEE Floppy drive, this > was like heaven, A > nice clear green 9 inch monochrome monitor, no more cassette tapes, 32K > RAM, what more could a > person want.. Well OK, add a Printer another $700.00, and a 300 baud modem > $200.00.. And at > about $2600.00 I had a dream machine.. Phil... >

27 years, 9 months

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Fairchild Channel F units

by MPritchard＠EnsembleStudios.com

The Democarts, (both of them) and #19 are very hard to find. From talking with other collectors, the democarts appear to be slightly more common. Personally, I have a Channel F, Boxed Channel F II, and 23 of the 28 carts; but I don't have #19, or either of the Democarts. There was also a picture of a keyboard controller (K-1) on the box for Channel F II. Perhaps a prototype exists for it. As I recall the F8 was a microcontroller in the same vein as the 8048; but that it multiplexed it's address and data lines; allowing for fewer connectors on the cartridges. I think it also had 64 bytes of internal RAM; organized as set of registers (sorta) which probably means that there was no ram in the system. I suspect the Channel F R&D effort was a rather small one; I had a chance to learn about the R&D effort behind the Magnavox Odyssey^2, and discovered that there was only a handful of people behind it doing the actual development (one guy wrote half the game library) and that it had very poor support from management at magnavox. All throughout the history of it, from 1978 to 1983, they were always told "this will be the last stuff you do for the O^2, then we pull the plug" and each time they'll sell out the latest run of carts/systems and be given a reprieve. management finally became serious about it in 1983 just in time for the video game crash. The Odyssey^2 had an Intel 8048 with a 512 byte BIOS, 128 bytes of RAM (don't recall the chip) and the video (& sound) was driven by the Intel 8244 chip - the only application the chip was ever used in; (trivia - multiple 8244's could be hooked together with the output of one (slave/master mode) being fed into the next one. Intel shows no reference to the chip or any mention of it in their archives, but I have the story on it from the horse's mouth (and the data sheets :) ) Somewhere, way way back in my archives, I have a copy of a post from someone who claimed to work at Farichild way back when (and knew about the channel F). I should try and dig it up someday to see if he could be tracked down. -Matt Pritchard Graphics Engine and Optimization Specialist MS Age of Empires & Age of Empires ][ > -----Original Message----- > From: Francois [SMTP:fauradon@pclink.com] > Sent: Monday, October 12, 1998 9:11 PM > To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers > Subject: Re: Fairchild Channel F units > > >#19 is the hardest to find. > > > How about the demo cart #2? Is that a har to find Item? > > Francois > ------------------------------------------------------------- > Visit the desperately in need of update > Sanctuary at: http://www.pclink.com/fauradon

27 years, 9 months

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Pre - Columbus traveler with classic computer?

by allisonp＠world.std.com

< >> My question is why did everything go to Hell between 300BC and 0AD? H < >> you believe the earth was flat? Where did this idea come from < < > Wasn't that around the time of the burning of the 'library' in < > Alexandria? < < In fact, did anybody belive this, or is it just a < urban legend ? I think it is ascribed to the dark ages, roughly 700-1400AD Europe. The polical power of the church was strong then and science was nearly exitinct. Allison

27 years, 9 months

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Vaporware (and not) from '83 CES

by david_a._vandenbroucke＠hud.gov

The CC-40 was real. I have one. Dav Vandenbroucke Economist U.S. Dept. HUD david_a._vandenbroucke(a)hud.gov <classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu> AT INTERNET on 10/11/98 02:47:22 AM To: classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu AT INTERNET@CCMAILDOM cc: (bcc: David A. Vandenbroucke/PDR/HHQ/HUD) Subject: Re: Vaporware (and not) from '83 CES

27 years, 9 months

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dishwasher and my 64

by jim＠calico.litterbox.com

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27 years, 9 months

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dishwasher + mainboards

by roblwill＠usaor.net

> Unless I have my capacitors crossed, some dishwashing agents are > chlorine-based, and H20 <=> OH- + H+; mix a free Cl- ion in and you have > hydrochloric acid. > Well, I think they make it safe enough not to turn to hydrochloric acid (I hope). Considering that people do put plastic dishes in the dishwasher, and most have plastic drains and pumps. If we had dishwashing soap turning to HCl all the time, a lot of people would have a big mess on their hands (and soap companies would probably have a lot of lawsuits). -- -Jason (roblwill(a)usaor.net) ICQ#-1730318

27 years, 9 months

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Wyse Systems (was RE: auction grabs)

by jsalzman＠hersheys.com

I worked for a company once as a service tech fixing CPT Word Processing systems. When PC based word processing started to become popular (mid '80s), CPT bridged the gap between their longtime standalone word processing units and desktop PCs by using Wyse PC clones (the ones with the blue backlit LCD display on them). They primarily consisted of a clone style case with an expansion board. The CPU board plugged into the expansion board like an add-on card and was primarily an entire 286 or 386 computer on a card. The keyboard connector was an RJ-11 with an optional DIN adaptor for conventional keyboards. The other card typically found in the system was a bridgeboard which was an entire CPT system on a card with a monochrome video out. The 2 cards talked to each other and became a full computer with built in CPT word processing simultaneosly running along with a DOS/windows based environment. The monitor was a portrait style page white display. The on screen display could be split to show DOS on top and CPT on the bottom or made to show a full screen CPT system as the CPT systems were originally designed. Many govornment agencys used these systems to bridge their own transition from dedicated word processing systems to PCs. Jeff Salzman >> > computer. Does WYSE ring a bell to anyone? But the biggest enigma is an >> >> Wyse terminals are fairly well-known, and I think they sold a PC clone at >> one point. > >Actually several PC clones from 8088 up through at least the 80386. IIRC >some of the later ones were quite stylish with diagonally-mounted LCDs >(date, time, etc.). > >The later PCs and terminals used an RJ-11 (phone) connector for the >keyboard cable. AS I recall, though, it was easily adaptable to an IBM >AT connector. I believe the keyboards were interchangable between the PCs >and terminals. >

27 years, 9 months

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Pre - Columbus traveler with classic computer?

by Innfogra＠aol.com

In a message dated 98-10-13 03:37:16 EDT, you write: << is true that sailors in those days were leery of sailing too far from coast -- because there was no way to determine longitude until accurate clocks were developed many years later. >> We know now that the Egyptians knew the 25,000 mile figure around 700 BC and possibly much earlier. Recently they pulled a brass differential geared device that may be an astronomical calculator from a wreck in the Mediterainian that dates back to 300 - 400 BC. I bet the device is older yet, it is hard to carbon date brass. They recently discovered settlements on the south coast of Chile that date back 30,000 yrs. I believe that there was regular but infrequent trade & travel between Egypt and South America 4000 years ago. My question is which way did they go, the long way, via China, the Bearing Straits and down the west coast of the Americas; or did they go the short way, which is from the westernmost tip of Africa straight across the Atlantic. This distance is is shorter than the length of the Mediterainian. If you were able to calculate the distance one had traveled by going the long way (I think this was done first); I would think that the short way would become obvious. To get back to classic computers, I bet this brass device is one of the first computers, if differential geared devices count. My question is why did everything go to Hell between 300BC and 0AD? How could you believe the earth was flat? Where did this idea come from? Paxton

27 years, 9 months

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Fairchild Channel F

by allisonp＠world.std.com

< I don't recall keybounce being a problem with Level I BASIC -- it < reared its ugly head after the upgrade to Level II. Correct. L1 basic had a good keyscan routine. LII basic it got mucked up in the interest of speed. Allison

27 years, 9 months

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Picture up (RE: Microsci HAVAC)

by allisonp＠world.std.com

< the infamous grooved disk? is there anything wrong with that design? loo < fairly clever and reliable. i havent seen any wear problems with the 20+ < disk drives i have. the only minor issue is adjusting the head stop for < all you have to do is sight a little dot on the grooved disk (apple call < cam) with the little metal cam follower and make adjustments as needed. The biggest is the follower could slip out of the groove requiring manual intervention. They were also very slow step rates 30-40ms! I also found that there was enough mechanical hysteresis plagueing them to affect media portability. Allison

27 years, 9 months

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Microprocessor holy wars...

by foxnhare＠goldrush.com

> From: Uncle Roger <sinasohn(a)ricochet.net> > Subject: Re: Corrections to trivia > > At 09:51 PM 10/7/98 -0700, you wrote: > >Intel came out the winners; they wanted it the most. But it would have > >happened with or without them. You had the 6800, the 6502 and a whole > >slew of others. The computers built around those processors were just as > >relevant and would have happened anyway. > > I will admit up front that I don't know everything, and I am not an EE > (dropped out of community college) but it seems to me that Intel hadn't won > anything until ~81 when IBM came out with their PC. Until then, the Z80 > and 6502 were as dominant (if not more so) than the 8080/8085? I'd believe that: Z80 (CP/M) 6502 (Apple). > In fact, I'll go so far as to suggest that perhaps if IBM had gone with, > say, the z8000, Intel would not be anywhere near as big as it is? > > It seems to me that what really got the "cheap computer revolution" going > was the Z80 (CP/M, TRS-80, etc.) and the 6502 (Atari, Commodore, Apple II). > Because no matter what the tech-heads are doing in their garages, nothing > is a revolution until you can buy it at Sears. One of the driving forces behind the prevelance of non-Intel micros in the 70s was that Intel processors were expensive (actually they still are!). I think the 8080 was about $200 when MOS started selling 6502s for under $40. Of course with that Intel lowered thier prices (to about $100 or so). Not to say that the Z80, 6502 and others were bad CPUs, it's just that Intel was not looking for the hobbiest/home market at all, and if it wern't for a big business name (IBM) behind it it would still be looking for a 'killer box' (like 'killer app' is to software) to be used in. And IBM was known for the safe route, proven chips and designs, (no innovation made cloning alot easier) and Intel had the name and a good track record among business machine microprocessors. -- -+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+- Larry Anderson - Sysop of Silicon Realms BBS (300-2400bd) (209) 754-1363 Visit my Commodore 8-Bit web page at: http://www.goldrush.com/~foxnhare/commodore.html -+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-

27 years, 9 months

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Columbus analogy (Was: Corrections to trivia

by franke＠sbs.de

> Then again, even today, people seem to think that Europe and Asia are > separate continents, even with vastly better maps and roads and rails > crossing the border between them in many places. They are, at least in the same way as Europe ans Africa. Gruss H. BTW: is there _any_ African Computer known ? Maybe Kits or other Homebrew from SA or even a 'real' homecomputer/Bussinessystem ? -- Ich denke, also bin ich, also gut HRK

27 years, 9 months

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Thanks for the help.

by Aaron_J_Hayden＠student.ferris.edu

I'd like to thank everybody who gave me info on the PC Jr. I got it going late last week. It turns out it needs two power supplies for the cpu. Apparently the people who owned it before me had it upgraded and the upgrade requires it's own power. I saw the second power plug, but it wasn't marked and I didn't think of it needing a second supply. Anyway, it runs like a top now. All of the info was greatly appreciated. Aaron

27 years, 9 months

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Cipher F880 9-track Docs/Schematics

by aaron＠wfi-inc.com

I was cleaning out the garage and came across my one real documentation treasure, the doc binder for my Cipher F880 tape drive. The nifty thing is that they put all of the schematics, engineering data (including a price breakdown of every individual component), and mechanical diagrams (lots of blowups) in there too. Does anyone have a pressing need for this documentation? I won't give up the original, but if someone expresses some real interest I could scan it in and post it on a web server or something. It's a lot of material, but it's interesting that they give so much detailed technical information in there. I'll get around to it eventually anyway, just for archival purposes... Aaron

27 years, 9 months

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MMD-2

by yakowenk＠cs.unc.edu

Hey, I've got a couple of E&L MMD-2's here. These are neat little 8080 educational SBC's. Hex keypad, "function" keypad, 7-segment LED's, and three sets of 8 LED's for I/O ports 0, 1, 2. Includes a cassette interface, bus expansion connector, serial interface, and even an EPROM programmer for 2708/2716's. Most impressive! But I didn't get any sort of manuals with them. I've figured out most of the obvious stuff, but it would be nice to know the format expected by the "load" function, the meaning of a few unlabelled switches/jumpers, the meaning of "BRL HI" and "BRL LO", and so on. Anybody remember these things? Thanks, Bill. PS. These things seem to be using the word "pop" to mean "burn", as in "popping an EPROM". Was this a widespread usage? I've heard the words "burn", "blow", and "program" used this way, but "pop" is new to me.

27 years, 9 months

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Microsci HAVAC

by Innfogra＠aol.com

I can't believe I am doing this much research on a computer I have already sold, but it is interesting. I found the Havac (that is it's name) in the "what's New?" column in Byte, May, 1984. It is an Apple work-alike and they also call it a transportable Computer. It uses the 6502 processor and a 164K 5 1/4" floppy. 64K of ram and 8K of rom and has high res color graphics. The manufacturer claims that over a 1000 Apple II programs will run on it. It is supposed to have printer, serial and Game ports beside the external floppy connector. It's suggested list was $850. I couldn't find an advertisement though, only the announcement. the good news is that I found a couple of boot disks in my archives which I will send to Kai. Paxton

27 years, 9 months

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Picture up (RE: Microsci HAVAC)

by roblwill＠usaor.net

Actually, I don't think the apple was the standard multi-colored apple. I think it was just red (If I remember correctly). It had the black face, with the front flip-down latch/door, and it had a metal enclosure. However, thinking back, I think it had a P/S in it (I no longer have it, because it wouldn't work with anything). I'm not sure about the P/S, but I do remember a round cord coming out of it. -- -Jason (roblwill(a)usaor.net) ICQ#-1730318 ---------- > From: Sam Ismail <dastar(a)ncal.verio.com> > To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers <classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu> > Subject: Re: Picture up (RE: Microsci HAVAC) > Date: Monday, October 12, 1998 8:53 PM > > And you are sure this was a full-height, Apple manufactured, metal > enclosure, black face plate with the colorful apple logo, Disk ][? > > Sellam Alternate e-mail: dastar(a)siconic.com > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- --- > Ever onward. > > Coming in 1999: Vintage Computer Festival 3.0 > See http://www.vintage.org/vcf for details! > [Last web site update: 09/21/98] >

27 years, 9 months

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Corrections to trivia

by allisonp＠world.std.com

< So, is Columbus less important because the Vikings reached the Americas < before him? Or is it only important that most of the lasting effects < descend from Columbus? since I'm not a student of this general branch of history I can't comment accuractly. It would seem to me the big differnece was the wave of colonization that resulted. Better put, the vikings were here. Columbus told the world two things, it's not flat and there are great riches in the east. Somewhere in ther is the difference in those explorations goals. < Yes this is OT, but it mirrors one of the recent arguments on ClassicCmp < and it could be argued either way because both arguments have validity. < It comes down to what the individual thinks is 'important'. True. The consideration is not the indiviual importance of any item but it's impact on the collective picture. What is significant is the picture was in some respects a collection of snapshots in time without continuity or context. There were/are pieces missing from the puzzle and it would be nice to fill them in. For example; Two of the oldest computing models Harvard and Von Neuman date back to the first machines yet they influence machines still. To make the picture complete we also need to know if there are other models and what they are. An aside to this is while Intel is currently the apparent successful leader en masse we still don't know how it will play over time yet to come. There have been near reversals in the past and it would only take the next design leap to change the current course. Also the industry is only 30 years old in a century where we are still developing fundemental technologies. My example for that is in the late 70s and early '80s everyone said that 16bit CPUs would wipe the 8bitters away. It sorta did, but not to the projected extent. There would be a wave of 8bitters like the Kaypro, ampro, SB180 to name a few in the 84-86 window and later. The 16 bit machine really didn't reflect enough of an improvement as the next level needed more. I'd say Apple knew (tripped on) this when they did the jump >from 6502 to 68000 (internally 32bit). It would be 32 bit cpus that would have the real impact. I expect that while Merced and Alpha are having an impact we have yet to see the next significant impactor. While we are going much faster, the way we compute is still logically similar to some very old machines. Allison

27 years, 9 months

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Fairchild Channel F units

by fauradon＠pclink.com

>#19 is the hardest to find. How about the demo cart #2? Is that a har to find Item? Francois ------------------------------------------------------------- Visit the desperately in need of update Sanctuary at: http://www.pclink.com/fauradon

27 years, 9 months

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dishwasher and my 64

by SUPRDAVE＠aol.com

jeez,. if anyone needs a 64, ive got 3 i want to get rid of. i'm apple ][ biased. =D In a message dated 10/12/98 8:37:42 PM US Eastern Standard Time, eric(a)brouhaha.com writes: > Jim Strickland <jim(a)calico.litterbox.com> writes: > > Well, I reassembled the 64, after cutting a manilla file folder to replace > > the paper between the metal shield on the back and the back of the board. > ... > > So okay, where DO I get a replacement keyboard for this thing? Also a > case > > in nicer condition would be nice. This one had a keyboard cover hinge > > permanently cemented to the top. > > It would be much easier just to find an entire 64 in good condition. Keep > the one you have now for spare parts.

27 years, 9 months

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