- test-drb@ccmp.vtda.org - classiccmp.org

by roblwill＠usaor.net

O.K. I think I'll try Minix, but where can I get it?? I can't seem to find it on the web anywhere (using WebCrawler). Does anyone have a copy that they could email, or a website to go to to download it? Happy Holidaze -and- ThAnX, -- -Jason Willgruber (roblwill(a)usaor.net) ICQ#: 1730318 <http://members.tripod.com/general_1> -----Original Message----- From: Allison J Parent <allisonp(a)world.std.com> To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers <classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu> Date: Sunday, December 20, 1998 2:23 PM Subject: Re: Linux or what? > >How about minix 2.0. It run on 8088 and fits in small disks. > >Likely the caldara openlinux can be trimmed of you eliminate the source >files. The problem is not fitting it on the disk but will you have useable >disk left? Finding a 40mb disk for that laptop would be a good idea. > >Allison > >

27 years, 7 months

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Type 0665? This is 5.25" FH IBM HD, on topic. :)

by SUPRDAVE＠aol.com

my june94 ref guide suggests this is a 30meg hard drive for an IBM AT. FRU 8286216. not worth much, but fascinating to take apart! In a message dated 12/20/98 6:37:05 PM EST, jpero(a)pop.cgocable.net writes: << More info might help: Type 0665, 060386-ESP177-38 I have error table with 2 entries, cutout area is 20, and FPU # is 62X1017, 470 110127 30MB stuck to the front end metal plate. I had an old exact hd chassis design which had 4 platters without the extra circuit board that I have now that attaches upright to the mainboard at "front end" hidden behind metal plate. >>

27 years, 7 months

3
3
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Need help on notebook

by mbg＠world.std.com

I don't know if this fits the 10-year-old rule (I doubt it), but my brother has an Epson ActionNote 4SLC2/50 and for Christmas I'd like to upgrade the measly 100+ Mb system disk he has with something a little larger (approx 300 Mb). I'm sure it probably has the 528 Mb limit, but that's okay, I don't have a disk that large (in 2.5" form factor) to give him. Anyway, I wanted to know if anyone has information on this notebook and can tell me if it can accept larger disks. Does it have the capability of SETUP and setting disk parameters (if the disk itself doesn't match one of the type 1-47 disks)? Rather than clutter the list with off-topic PC stuff, please respond to me directly. Thanks in advance for all the help... Megan Gentry Former RT-11 Developer +--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+ | Megan Gentry, EMT/B, PP-ASEL | Internet (work): gentry!zk3.dec.com | | Unix Support Engineering Group | (home): mbg!world.std.com | | Compaq Computer Corporation | addresses need '@' in place of '!' | | 110 Spitbrook Rd. ZK03-2/T43 | URL: http://world.std.com/~mbg/ | | Nashua, NH 03062 | "pdp-11 programmer - some assembler | | (603) 884 1055 | required." - mbg | +--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+ My home_systems page has been massively updated... check it out.

27 years, 7 months

1
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Linux or what?

by allisonp＠world.std.com

<My laptop's an 8088 with 640K RAM, CGA, 720k 3.5" floppy, and a 20 MB HD. <Obviously, not big enough. What I want to know is if I can get some old <version of it, or some "mini version", that still has the newer features, <just in a smaller package. Or does anyone have an alternative O/S that I <could run on it, besides DOS? How about minix 2.0. It run on 8088 and fits in small disks. Likely the caldara openlinux can be trimmed of you eliminate the source files. The problem is not fitting it on the disk but will you have useable disk left? Finding a 40mb disk for that laptop would be a good idea. Allison

27 years, 7 months

2
1
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Neat time-wasters for DEC enthusiasts

by A_Finney＠wfi-inc.com

Ok, I may be a little slow and everyone else on the list has been to these pages... The first is about retro-computing on digital.com's main site: http://www.digital.com/info/DTJN02/DTJN02HM.HTM The second isn't so nicely packaged, it's just a loose set of documents that are (I assume) intended just for this facility. I personally found some interesting stuff by hunting through the trees, but then I am like an empty vessel when it comes to these systems. But neat documents, like the RSX-11M System Generation Guide... http://www-ols.fnal.gov/ols/documents/docpn.html If anyone hunting through the latter site finds anything of real interest, I'd love to hear about it... Aaron

27 years, 7 months

8
8
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Electrical knowledge, was Another ~1960 computer kit

by kurtkilg＠geocities.com

On Sun, 20 Dec 1998 ddameron(a)earthlink.net wrote: > Another example, it surprises me how many "electrical" people do not > understand, for example, what happens when one wires speakers in series or > parallel. What _does_ happen? ---------------------------------------------------- Max Eskin | kurtkilgor(a)bigfoot.com | AOL: kurtkilgor

27 years, 7 months

4
3
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Can I conclude......

by mbg＠world.std.com

Jon - Somewhere in my collection is a set of ASR-33 technical manuals (four in the set, if I remember correctly). I'll start searching to see if I can find them... On another note, I came across my pdp-8/i maintenance manuals (vol.1 and Vol.2) the other day... Megan Gentry Former RT-11 Developer +--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+ | Megan Gentry, EMT/B, PP-ASEL | Internet (work): gentry!zk3.dec.com | | Unix Support Engineering Group | (home): mbg!world.std.com | | Compaq Computer Corporation | addresses need '@' in place of '!' | | 110 Spitbrook Rd. ZK03-2/T43 | URL: http://world.std.com/~mbg/ | | Nashua, NH 03062 | "pdp-11 programmer - some assembler | | (603) 884 1055 | required." - mbg | +--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+

27 years, 7 months

2
1
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Another ~1960 computer kit

by mbg＠world.std.com

ard(a)p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) wrote: >; Tape player - a trivial music program for the P850 >; Written 1987 by A.R.Duell, and placed in the Public Domain. >; Reads a paper tape from the standard reader (a Trend HSR500interfaced >; to the PTR card). The tape contains pairs of bytes which define the >; pitch (in number of empty loops per half cycle) and duration (in number >; of cycles). This program produces sound by toggling the LSB of the >; Digital I/O (DIOC) unit >; As few other users know P850 assembler, I'll try and explain the >; instructions If I remember correctly, this is exactly how the hackers at Stanford got the DECsystem-10 to play music, but toggling the low-order bits of the AC (Bits 30-35) and driving a speaker. This gave them 6 'voices'. Someone developed a music compiler and there was a lot of music entered by various people... My favorite was 'Bumble Boogie'. About 15 or so years ago, a friend of mine wrote a compiler for the same music files in -11 macro, and I (knowing a little more music than he) entered a number of pieces. I entered some like Beethoven's Moonlight Sonata and Joplin's Crush Collision Rag. I wish I could find that compiler again... I still have LOTS of the music files. Megan Gentry Former RT-11 Developer +--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+ | Megan Gentry, EMT/B, PP-ASEL | Internet (work): gentry!zk3.dec.com | | Unix Support Engineering Group | (home): mbg!world.std.com | | Compaq Computer Corporation | addresses need '@' in place of '!' | | 110 Spitbrook Rd. ZK03-2/T43 | URL: http://world.std.com/~mbg/ | | Nashua, NH 03062 | "pdp-11 programmer - some assembler | | (603) 884 1055 | required." - mbg | +--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+

27 years, 7 months

2
1
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Electrical knowledge, was Another ~1960 computer kit

by netcafe＠pirie.mtx.net.au

-----Original Message----- From: Tony Duell <ard(a)p850ug1.demon.co.uk> To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers <classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu> Date: Sunday, 20 December 1998 14:56 Subject: Re: Electrical knowledge, was Another ~1960 computer kit >Incidentally, in the days of valves, you could light a neon mains tester >by holding it near (not touching) the line output valve (sweep tube?). A >very quick test for EHT problems. A screwdriver (insulated handle!) blade touched to the top cap of the 1S2 would produce a healthy arc when held somewhere near chassis if the line/eht stage was running. This practice did not survive the transition to solid state devices that disliked the spikes etc it could cause! >> Another example, it surprises me how many "electrical" people do not >> understand, for example, what happens when one wires speakers in series or >> parallel. Several non-electrically minded customers of mine now have 1st hand knowledge of the effects of this. 1 particular Guy had no less than 8 speakers wired in a series/parallel MESS (whether a speaker was series or parallel was determined by it's physical location in relation to the audio leads he had running all over the house) Actual impedance was around 1 ohm on the left channel and about 2 on the right. Result: 1 very dead STK chip output amp. Amazingly, it actually worked for about an hour before expiring. Seems he had done something similar in the past (old fella) with valve based stuff, and aside >from a little(?) distortion it worked. I guess that proves that valves have their advantages. I suspect the Speaker Transformer on the valve amp could have been used to boil water though. Cheers Geoff Roberts Computer Room Internet Cafe Port Pirie South Australia. netcafe(a)pirie.mtx.net.au

27 years, 7 months

2
1
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Electrical knowledge, was Another ~1960 computer kit

by ddameron＠earthlink.net

At 12:18 PM 12/20/98 -0500, you wrote: >On Sun, 20 Dec 1998 ddameron(a)earthlink.net wrote: >> Another example, it surprises me how many "electrical" people do not >> understand, for example, what happens when one wires speakers in series or >> parallel. > >What _does_ happen? Power is divided to the speakers, as a function of power formula's for series/parallel circuits. The amplifier also has a resultant load. These considerations can be important for the amp ratings, as well as the speaker ratings and sound level matching. -Dave

27 years, 7 months

1
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Genicom 3820 printer info wanted.

by netcafe＠pirie.mtx.net.au

Hi Folks, I have acquired a Genicom 3820 High speed serial printer that I'm hoping to use on my Microvax II. I think it was previously on a Microvax 2000, (got that too :^) As usual, I have no docs whatsoever. Had a look at the Genicom web site, but nothing there is useful, since this is evidently a "Legacy" model. I need to find some technical info on this, especially dip switch settings, so it can be configured to run off a serial port on a Microvax II, or even a DMB32 on a Vax 6000. Any additional info is a bonus of course. Any help appreciated. Computer Room Internet Cafe Port Pirie South Australia. netcafe(a)pirie.mtx.net.au

27 years, 7 months

1
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Linux or what?

by jolminkh＠nsw.bigpond.net.au

>Off the top of my head about the only other thing I can think of is >CP/M-86, which had been available, but the "Unofficial CP/M Web Page" seems >to have disappeared (did it move?). > Here is a link to the current location: http://www.mathcs.emory.edu/~cfs/cpm/

27 years, 7 months

1
0
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Linux or what?

by roblwill＠usaor.net

I've been thinking of putting Linux on my laptop. Thing is, I have a few questions: What are the requirements for it? I was looking at Caldera OpenLinux, and one of the download files was 30 MB. My laptop's an 8088 with 640K RAM, CGA, 720k 3.5" floppy, and a 20 MB HD. Obviously, not big enough. What I want to know is if I can get some old version of it, or some "mini version", that still has the newer features, just in a smaller package. Or does anyone have an alternative O/S that I could run on it, besides DOS? Happy Holidaze -and- ThAnX, -- -Jason Willgruber (roblwill(a)usaor.net) ICQ#: 1730318 <http://members.tripod.com/general_1>

27 years, 7 months

2
1
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DOS Version of Supnik PDP-11 Emulator?

by healyzh＠aracnet.com

A while back someone had mentioned that they'd compiled a DOS version of the Supnik emulator. Is it available for FTP somewhere? Zane | Zane H. Healy | UNIX Systems Adminstrator | | healyzh(a)aracnet.com (primary) | Linux Enthusiast | | healyzh(a)holonet.net (alternate) | Classic Computer Collector | +----------------------------------+----------------------------+ | Empire of the Petal Throne and Traveller Role Playing, | | and Zane's Computer Museum. | | http://www.dragonfire.net/~healyzh/ |

27 years, 7 months

4
5
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Another ~1960 computer kit

by ddameron＠earthlink.net

Hi Tony and all, At 03:09 PM 12/19/98 +0000, you wrote: >One of the most depressing things I've done recently was buy a number of >books (some second-hand, some new) with titles like 'The boy mechanic', >'Every boy his own mechanic', etc. > >OK, so the titles are sexist, and I do believe that's wrong, and that >there's no reason why girls shouldn't also be interested in this sort of >thing. > >But worse still is the fact that back in the early years of this century, >it appears that boys - say about 12-15 years old - were expected to try >woodwork, metalwork, using a lathe, wiring electric lights, bells, >telephones, etc, making induction coils, etc, etc, etc. Things that I bet >few boys ever try today. And yet, today, it could be made a little easier >for them. > I have some of these books, and it always amazes me what "boys" were doing back then - all the things you mentioned and more. One day I hope to start aluminum casting. Alfred Morgan was writing books like this at least until up to the 50's. Just today I bought a 1927 book on radio construction and repair. Last week I listened to a tube/valve regenerative SW receiver. OFF topic: Max wrote: There's little need to make coils these days, and wiring electric lights isn't very fun when one can play around with things millions of times more complex. Hey! I've wound several experimental coils this year. Did you wonder _how_ a transformer works? I know the equations to design one, but am asking something more fundamental. The secondary winding of a transformer has voltage induced in it, but what couples the energy to it from the primary winding's magnetic field? (Hint: The magnetic field can be zero at the secondary) As for wiring lights, Christmas tree light strings here are now cheap series strings although the bulbs may have some wire turns wrapped around the leads to prevent a open circuit if a bulb burns out. This often don't work, so the entire string is usually thrown away, like many modern ASIC type computer boards END off topic -Dave

27 years, 7 months

4
4
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Can I conclude......

by museum＠techniche.com

Hi Aaron, Can I conclude from the lack of a response that I didn't make the cut for the ASR-33 documentation? Was I too late or ......?????? Thanks Jon > >Free (*) manuals, maybe some hardware too. > >Multiple sets of ASR-33 teletype maintainance volumes and print sets. > >Dynex Series 6000 Disk Drive instruction (/maint) manual. > >System Industries Model 3040 manual. >System Industries Modem 3051 print set. >(I have the OMNIBUS card for these around here someplace too.) > >Diablo Series 40 print set & manual. > >Plessy PM-80 (or something like that) prints set & manual (I think >I have one or two of the cards too), it's OMNIBUS core memory. > >Four trays of PDP-11 paper-tape diagnostics. > >Some kind of Roytron/Litton OEM punch manual (I need to look at this >one and make sure it's not something in a DEC box). > >PDP11 PAL/EDIT/ODT/PIP/LINK/LIBR manual. > >PDP-8/e (ONLY!) maintainance manual Vol 1. (note: old version!) > >PDP10 reference handbook. (big) > >Decsystem 10 TECO > >Decsystem 10 Users Handbook, 2nd ed (big) > >EMAIL replies to me, not to the newsgroup or mailing list. > >(*): Free for the cost of shipping. I will use subjective criteria >in resolving between multiple requesters for the same material. I >apologize in advance if I do not personally reply to you. > > >-- >Aaron Nabil >nabil(a)teleport.com >

27 years, 7 months

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Electrical knowledge, was Another ~1960 computer kit

by ddameron＠earthlink.net

I guess this post will also show how weird I am. At 09:31 PM 12/19/98 +0000, Tony wrote: >> >But worse still is the fact that back in the early years of this century, >> >it appears that boys - say about 12-15 years old - were expected to try >> >woodwork, metalwork, using a lathe, wiring electric lights, bells, >> >telephones, etc, making induction coils, etc, etc, etc. Things that I bet >> >few boys ever try today. And yet, today, it could be made a little easier >> >for them. >> > >> I have some of these books, and it always amazes me what "boys" were doing > >Some of them are available as reprints from Lindsay Publications (in the >UK, available from Camden Miniature Steam Services). > Lindsay is at www.lindsaybks.com. I have many too. Have tried to talk him into having more computer books besides the "How to repair and upgrade your PC" type. The "Practical Electronics" TTL calculator would be good if he could do something like that. >> aluminum casting. Alfred Morgan was writing books like this at least until > >I've never tried it, but I believe that getting a _good_ casting from >aluminium is not that easy. Sure it's an easy metal to melt, but it also >picks up all sorts of garbage very easily, leading to a terrible casting. >Iron/steel is supposed to be easier to cast - if you can melt it. I've read the next step up from aluminum, copper or brass, can have its own problems too. > >> >> OFF topic: >> Max wrote: >> There's little need to make coils these days, and wiring electric lights >> isn't very fun when one can play around with things millions of times more >> complex. >> >> Hey! I've wound several experimental coils this year. Did you wonder _how_ a > >This year? This week, more like :-). > >> transformer works? I know the equations to design one, but am asking > >It may just be me, but I never like using equations to _explain_ >anything. Sure they're useful tools when you come to design a transformer >(or whatever), but you should be able to understand the operation of the >transformer using qualitative arguements. Well, more often than "this year", actually. I like practice and experiments, but sometime require some equations/theory. Think of a transformer secondary wound with coax cable. What would happen... > >> As for wiring lights, Christmas tree light strings here are now cheap series >> strings although the bulbs may have some wire turns wrapped around the leads >> to prevent a open circuit if a bulb burns out. This often don't work, so the >> entire string is usually thrown away, like many modern ASIC type computer boards > >You mean people don't get little packets of replacement bulbs and play >'hunt the dud' any more. That used to be a ritual each winter here for >many years. Apparently not much anymore. Don't have a "Voltstick" type of detector yet. Are they only AC, or can they pick up the charge on a CRT screen? > >Those little electrostic field detectors (aka 'Voltstick') took all the >fun out of it ;-). > And, >These people didn't have a clue that you could make logic circuits using >relay contacts. > >Don't get me wrong. I'm totally in favour of digital _electronics_, >microcontrollers, FPGAs, etc when they're the right solution. But when I >want to make an XOR gate to control the light over the stairs here, you >can be sure I'm going to use a couple of changeover switches and nothing >more. And Max wrote: > >OK, now I have the feeling I may have forgotten something. When you wire >some bulbs in series, and one burns out, they all fail. If they are wired >in ||, and one burns out, the others keep burning. What more is there? True, series and parallel are basic, but not too interesting if you only stop there! 2 single-pole double throw (changeover) switches can be wired so either one can turn a light on or off. Like one switch at the top and one at the bottom of stairs. Suppose you need a third switch? A double-pole, double-throw one will work. When you see how it is wired, you see how any number can be wired. And the light is now a "parity" indicator! (No when I knew how to wire the switches, had never heard of the word parity yet.) Another example, it surprises me how many "electrical" people do not understand, for example, what happens when one wires speakers in series or parallel. >I wonder how many people here have made a light bulb, or a cell/battery >from scratch. OK, on this list, quite a few I would guess. Elsewhere, >close to 0? What about winding a motor (and that's almost on-topic - one >day you're going to have to rebuild an LA36, and carriage motors are >neither common nor cheap...) Yes to all 3. >You can learn a lot more by actually making something (however poorly it >actually performs) than by reading a book or playing with a simulation. >The latter are useful as well (particularly the books), but in the end >you actually have to try making something. > >I heard that a number of physics graduates from, I think US, but it >might have been UK, universities were given a battery, some wire, and a >bulb of the same voltage as the battery. The task was to light the bulb. >An amazing percentage (something like 80%) couldn't do it (and no, there >were no tricks). Sad if true. Thanks for bringing back the memory of a very early experiment I did. I took apart a flashlight and had the bulb and a D size cell. Both the bulb and the cell looked like they had one terminal- the metal bump on the bottom of the bulb and the center metal contact on the top of the D cell. But when the 2 were connected, the bulb didn't light. So I had to go back and examine the flashlight more closely, then find some wire. Learning that way sticks. -Dave

27 years, 7 months

2
1
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Another ~1960 computer kit

by ddameron＠earthlink.net

I was looked through some older magazines and found another computer kit >from about 1959, 1960, a full page ad for the "geniac". It has 6 dials, each with 16 sets of radial holes. It's cost was US$19.95 and made in Mass. My guess is it was electro-mechanical, but could not tell any more from the ad. The ad said it could play "Nim", but that doesn't seem to be that unusual. Has anyone seen one or knows what it did? Thanks, -Dave

27 years, 7 months

12
25
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I don't believe this spam I just got!

by healyzh＠aracnet.com

I can't believe it. My NETCOM account is on some SPAM list of NETCOM subscribers (apparently someone sometime sold their user list). Anyway, I just got a SPAM from a computer seller. Half the stuff listed is classic DEC Hardware! Based on the prices on Exabyte stuff if they hadn't spammed me I'd probably be interested in doing business with them!?!?! I just don't believe it! Zane | Zane H. Healy | UNIX Systems Adminstrator | | healyzh(a)aracnet.com (primary) | Linux Enthusiast | | healyzh(a)holonet.net (alternate) | Classic Computer Collector | +----------------------------------+----------------------------+ | Empire of the Petal Throne and Traveller Role Playing, | | and Zane's Computer Museum. | | http://www.dragonfire.net/~healyzh/ |

27 years, 7 months

4
6
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More -11 systems

by mbg＠world.std.com

Again, contact the person listed in the post, not me: - - - - - I have the following warm and not-so-friendly creatures available free to good home (they've had their shots and are eager to please): Cards: 1 DLV2 1 TMM10010 1 M8186 7 USDC 1101 Systems: 1 PDP-? containing the following cards: 1 TMM10010 1 8186 1 DLV2 Appears to have a QBUS USDC Cabinet 1 PDP-? containing the following cards: 1 TMM10010 1 8186 1 DLV2 Appears to have a QBUS USDC Cabinet The two systems power up and produce the "@" prompt. Sorry, there are no disks for these systems. Sorry, I know nothing more than the above. We have been cleaning house and I've asked that these items be saved for distribution to a cheerful, happy household! The systems are located at U.S. Design in Columbia, MD. I would prefer that you come by and pick these systems up, all or in part. First-come, first-served! If you're interested, please call me at (410)-381-3000 x130 to set up a pick up time. Thanks, Chuck McCrobie (** MAD VAX **) - - - - - Megan Gentry Former RT-11 Developer +--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+ | Megan Gentry, EMT/B, PP-ASEL | Internet (work): gentry!zk3.dec.com | | Unix Support Engineering Group | (home): mbg!world.std.com | | Compaq Computer Corporation | addresses need '@' in place of '!' | | 110 Spitbrook Rd. ZK03-2/T43 | URL: http://world.std.com/~mbg/ | | Nashua, NH 03062 | "pdp-11 programmer - some assembler | | (603) 884 1055 | required." - mbg | +--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+

27 years, 7 months

1
0
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Some pdp-11s and a uVax available

by mbg＠world.std.com

This was posted on a newsgroup - contact the address in the posting, not me. - - - - - > I have two PDP-11's and one Microvax II which I need to sell or donate > (maybe give away). After doing a search I came across your site and thought > you might know of someone who might be interested in these machines. They > have worked hard for our hotels and need a new home. I appreciate your > time. Keven Combs IS Director HSC-Hotels kcombs(a)bellsouth.net - - - - - Megan Gentry Former RT-11 Developer +--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+ | Megan Gentry, EMT/B, PP-ASEL | Internet (work): gentry!zk3.dec.com | | Unix Support Engineering Group | (home): mbg!world.std.com | | Compaq Computer Corporation | addresses need '@' in place of '!' | | 110 Spitbrook Rd. ZK03-2/T43 | URL: http://world.std.com/~mbg/ | | Nashua, NH 03062 | "pdp-11 programmer - some assembler | | (603) 884 1055 | required." - mbg | +--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+

27 years, 7 months

1
0
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Couple oddball RSX-11M questions

by mbg＠world.std.com

<>house. Using the network I should be able to transfer those Disk Images <>over to the PDP-11. However, can I mount those disk images under RSX-11M <>4.2 like I can RT-11 disk images under RT-11? If so what do I need to do <>this? >Check out Megan's (I think it's www.world.std.com/~mbg) page I think she >has something you can use for that. Thanks for the nod, Allison, but my file transfer program is RT<->RT only at this time... I've never found someone knowledgable *and* interested enough to write the RSX peer for the program. Actually - some of the RSX stuff is already in my source, but I'm not an RSX-heavy, so I've never built or tested it. Then again, with TCP/IP being available, my program seems like a moot exercise (though it was and is a lot of fun to work on). I have been thinking about a Digital Unix and/or Linux peer for it. Megan Gentry Former RT-11 Developer +--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+ | Megan Gentry, EMT/B, PP-ASEL | Internet (work): gentry!zk3.dec.com | | Unix Support Engineering Group | (home): mbg!world.std.com | | Compaq Computer Corporation | addresses need '@' in place of '!' | | 110 Spitbrook Rd. ZK03-2/T43 | URL: http://world.std.com/~mbg/ | | Nashua, NH 03062 | "pdp-11 programmer - some assembler | | (603) 884 1055 | required." - mbg | +--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+

27 years, 7 months

1
0
0 0

alt.folklore.computers

by foxvideo＠wincom.net

Is anyone besides me having trouble with alt.folklore.computers? Regards Charlie Fox Charles E. Fox Chas E. Fox Video Productions 793 Argyle Rd. Windsor N8Y 3J8 Ont. Canada email foxvideo(a)wincom.net Homepage http://www.wincom.net/foxvideo

27 years, 7 months

4
3
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Another ~1960 computer kit

by kurtkilg＠geocities.com

On Sat, 19 Dec 1998 CLASSICCMP(a)trailing-edge.com wrote: > Unfortunately, lots of "fundamental" knowledge gets left out when you > skip electric lights and go to things much more complex. OK, now I have the feeling I may have forgotten something. When you wire some bulbs in series, and one burns out, they all fail. If they are wired in ||, and one burns out, the others keep burning. What more is there? ---------------------------------------------------- Max Eskin | kurtkilgor(a)bigfoot.com | AOL: kurtkilgor

27 years, 7 months

2
1
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Debian Linux

by rhblake＠bigfoot.com

In case no one else has located this source of info for the Debian version of Linux, you can go to http://www.debian.org/ for all sorts of info. Wanna guess where I found it? On a links page at http://www.dorkbot.com/ (yes this is a real site).

27 years, 7 months

1
0
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RSX-11M and TAR

by CLASSICCMP＠trailing-edge.com

>So, does anyone know of a good TAR program for RSX-11M that can be used to >un-tar a tar file? Or am I off in left field somewhere again :^) Absolutely - it's distribued with DECUS C. See, for example, ftp://metalab.unc.edu/pub/academic/computer-science/history/pdp-11/rsx/decu… for the C version, or ftp://metalab.unc.edu/pub/academic/computer-science/history/pdp-11/rsx/decu… for a PDP-11 BASIC version. If you'd prefer physical BRU tapes of various DECUS SIG items, I can arrange to run off copies from the masters here. There's also a CD-ROM in the works. -- Tim Shoppa Email: shoppa(a)trailing-edge.com Trailing Edge Technology WWW: http://www.trailing-edge.com/ 7328 Bradley Blvd Voice: 301-767-5917 Bethesda, MD, USA 20817 Fax: 301-767-5927

27 years, 7 months

1
0
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RSX-11M and TAR

by healyzh＠aracnet.com

Looking through the Metalab (used to be Sunsite) PDP-11 archives, I realized that probably the easiest way to get some of the RSX-11 DECUS stuff over to my system would be to have FTP tar it up for me and I could then send the resulting tar to the PDP-11. This of course assumes that there is a way to un-tar it once I get it to the PDP-11. So, does anyone know of a good TAR program for RSX-11M that can be used to un-tar a tar file? Or am I off in left field somewhere again :^) Zane | Zane H. Healy | UNIX Systems Adminstrator | | healyzh(a)aracnet.com (primary) | Linux Enthusiast | | healyzh(a)holonet.net (alternate) | Classic Computer Collector | +----------------------------------+----------------------------+ | Empire of the Petal Throne and Traveller Role Playing, | | and Zane's Computer Museum. | | http://www.dragonfire.net/~healyzh/ |

27 years, 7 months

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Couple oddball RSX-11M questions

by allisonp＠world.std.com

<>house. Using the network I should be able to transfer those Disk Images <>over to the PDP-11. However, can I mount those disk images under RSX-11M <>4.2 like I can RT-11 disk images under RT-11? If so what do I need to do <>this? Check out Megan's (I think it's www.world.std.com/~mbg) page I think she has something you can use for that. <>Second question. As I understand it, using DECnet it is possible to use <>the tape drive on VAX from another VAX. Yes but that is mostly vax/vms to vax/vms. I use it all the time as I have a TLZ04, Tk50, TLZ30 on three different machine and I mount and use tapes across the net and even do backups that way. You do that with 7machines and 3 drives. <> Well, the VAX in the house doesn't <>have a tapedrive, and I've not run the network out to the garage. So is i <>possible to have the VAX access the TK-50 on the PDP-11/73 via DECnet? Put a tape on the vax. ;) I think RSX decnet may not do that. <My favorite solution would be sneakernet - pull the drive and controller <and move it ! Me too. I'd put the tape on the VAX. The 11/73 can backup to RL02s or even RX50. It can also copy files to the vax if you have the net. Allison

27 years, 7 months

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Another ~1960 computer kit

by ddameron＠earthlink.net

At 06:47 PM 12/18/98 +0000, Tony wrote: >[...] > >Sounds interesting... I don't think I have the appropriate year of WW, >though. I do have all the articles for the PE 'digical', which was a >build-it-yourself-from-TTL 4-function calcualtor. This sounds interesting. Is PE "Popular Electronics" or another mag.? I assume it was in the 1970's, could you say what issues? Thanks, -Dave It used successive >addition for multiplication (and was thus slow as heck) and a diode >matrix ROM for the control store. Needless to say it is rather interesting. > >How I wish we got projects like this in magazines today... I quess you make up your own today. -Dave > >-tony > > >

27 years, 7 months

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Fw: PDP Stuff available in Columbia, MD. (Maryland?)

by netcafe＠pirie.mtx.net.au

US PDP collectors, Saw the following in comp.sys.dec. -----Original Message----- From: Chuck McCrobie (** MAD VAX **) <mccrobi(a)ibm.net> Newsgroups: comp.sys.dec Date: Friday, 18 December 1998 15:17 Subject: PDP Stuff >I have the following warm and not-so-friendly creatures available free >to good home (they've had their shots and are eager to please): > >Cards: >1 DLV2 >1 TMM10010 >1 M8186 >7 USDC 1101 > >Systems: >1 PDP-? containing the following cards: > 1 TMM10010 > 1 8186 > 1 DLV2 > Appears to have a QBUS > USDC Cabinet > >1 PDP-? containing the following cards: > 1 TMM10010 > 1 8186 > 1 DLV2 > Appears to have a QBUS > USDC Cabinet > >The two systems power up and produce the "@" prompt. Sorry, there are >no disks for these systems. Sorry, I know nothing more than the above. >We have been cleaning house and I've asked that these items be saved for >distribution to a cheerful, happy household! > >The systems are located at U.S. Design in Columbia, MD. I would prefer >that you come by and pick these systems up, all or in part. First-come, >first-served! > >If you're interested, please call me at (410)-381-3000 x130 to set up a >pick up time. > >Thanks, > >Chuck McCrobie (** MAD VAX **) Cheers Geoff Roberts Computer Room Internet Cafe Port Pirie South Australia. netcafe(a)pirie.mtx.net.au

27 years, 7 months

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PDP-8 for free, ACT FAST!!!! Like, This afternoon

by netcafe＠pirie.mtx.net.au

-----Original Message----- From: Jon Healey <museum(a)techniche.com> To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers <classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu> Date: Saturday, 19 December 1998 15:02 Subject: Re: PDP-8 for free, ACT FAST!!!! Like, This afternoon > I asked if this was the "right" dumpster. > >He said that it was but that there was a line of MIT students >waiting when the computers hit the loading platform. They >apparently didn't last long. Good. It didn't wind up as razor blades or beer cans. I hate it when that happens. Sounds like it found a home. cheers Geoff Roberts Computer Room Internet Cafe Port Pirie South Australia. netcafe(a)pirie.mtx.net.au

27 years, 7 months

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Fw: *URGENT* moving IBM 5360 to museum-need advice

by netcafe＠pirie.mtx.net.au

Hi folks, This gentlemen could use some expert advice. I don't know diddly about IBM stuff of this magnitude, so, at his request, I have reposted his plea here. Can someone respond directly to him with some useful information? Thanks in advance..... I've also suggested that he join the CC list...:^) -----Original Message----- From: Tony Epton <aceware(a)iinet.net.au> Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Date: Saturday, 19 December 1998 18:04 Subject: *URGENT* moving IBM 5360 to museum-need advice >On Tuesday we will be moving an IBM 5360 10 Km from a warehouse to our >museum. > >Can anyone please give me any advice on issues such as how to lock >down drives and any other steps which should be taken to protect the >machine while moving it. > >I already have another IBM 5360, with a disk expansion bay. But this >machine is of rather dubious origins. I bought it from a scrap metal >yard and I don't know how badly treated it was before I obtained it. >Also, to move it I had to dismantle the power supply to reduce the >weight. I carefully labelled every lead but unfortunately some of the >labels fell off. Hence I have been reluctant to power it up for fear >of it errupting into a molten ball of flames. >For these reasons I was thinking of gutting the present machine for >any good parts and replacing with the newer machine. >The new machine has no expansion bay but was working two years ago >when turned off. >How hard would it be to add the expansion bay on to the new machine ? >In terms of configuration steps ? > >Some guys are going to use a forklift to move the machine on Monday >and stick it in a storage area - what do I need to do beforehand ? > >Many thanks in anticipation. > >Tony Epton >Hardware Curator >Australian Computer Museum Association (Western Australia) Cheers Geoff Roberts Computer Room Internet Cafe Port Pirie South Australia. netcafe(a)pirie.mtx.net.au

27 years, 7 months

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PDP-8 for free, ACT FAST!!!! Like, This afternoon

by mbg＠world.std.com

>Well Don't feel too bad everyone, >at least we were represented. <...> >He said that it was but that there was a line of MIT students >waiting when the computers hit the loading platform. They >apparently didn't last long. Sorry your detour was unproductive, but I'm really glad that the machines didn't end up in land-fill somewhere... Megan Gentry Former RT-11 Developer +--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+ | Megan Gentry, EMT/B, PP-ASEL | Internet (work): gentry!zk3.dec.com | | Unix Support Engineering Group | (home): mbg!world.std.com | | Compaq Computer Corporation | addresses need '@' in place of '!' | | 110 Spitbrook Rd. ZK03-2/T43 | URL: http://world.std.com/~mbg/ | | Nashua, NH 03062 | "pdp-11 programmer - some assembler | | (603) 884 1055 | required." - mbg | +--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+

27 years, 7 months

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PDP-8 for free, ACT FAST!!!! Like, This afternoon

by museum＠techniche.com

Well Don't feel too bad everyone, at least we were represented. I was kind of passing by Boston this evening (on my way >from Connecticut to New Hampshire). So I made plan for a little detour when I saw this original message. I was not familiar with the "alley" in question so it proved to be a pretty painful adventure (for any of you familiar with the streets of downtown Boston). I knew I wouldn't arrive by 6pm, but when I finally found the right dumpster, it was closer to 8pm. All that was left were two empty steel racks. While I was rummaging an employee happened by on a cigarette break. I asked if this was the "right" dumpster. He said that it was but that there was a line of MIT students waiting when the computers hit the loading platform. They apparently didn't last long. Now, aren't you glad you didn't all drive into Boston like I did? Merry Christmas, Jon ========================================== >< That is today! If you're in Boston and want a PDP-8 or want to help >< someone get one, please act fast! Please pass this note on to anyone >< you feel could help rescue this system. > >Damm, no wau I could make it in there and I want one too. > >Allison > >

27 years, 7 months

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Couple oddball RSX-11M questions

by healyzh＠aracnet.com

Since DECnet I can get files from my Linux box to the VAX, and from there to the PDP-11 when it's running RSX-11M 4.2 it's now easier to get stuff transfered to the PDP-11, and this weekend I hope to have TCP/IP working under RT-11 since I figured out how to transfer files from the RSX disks to the RT-11 disk. Now the first quesiton is this. I've got a bunch of RL01's and RL02's with software on them, and when I got them I backed them up onto my Linux box so I could play with them in the Emulator without having RL01/02 drives in the house. Using the network I should be able to transfer those Disk Images over to the PDP-11. However, can I mount those disk images under RSX-11M 4.2 like I can RT-11 disk images under RT-11? If so what do I need to do this? Second question. As I understand it, using DECnet it is possible to use the tape drive on VAX from another VAX. Well, the VAX in the house doesn't have a tapedrive, and I've not run the network out to the garage. So is it possible to have the VAX access the TK-50 on the PDP-11/73 via DECnet? Zane | Zane H. Healy | UNIX Systems Adminstrator | | healyzh(a)aracnet.com (primary) | Linux Enthusiast | | healyzh(a)holonet.net (alternate) | Classic Computer Collector | +----------------------------------+----------------------------+ | Empire of the Petal Throne and Traveller Role Playing, | | and Zane's Computer Museum. | | http://www.dragonfire.net/~healyzh/ |

27 years, 7 months

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Another find available in Maryland

by mtapley＠swri.edu

All, I wrote: >...Village Thrift Store in Laurel, MD, on the north side of 198 about a >mile west of 95. (Same place as last time I found a cool computer ... That would be a mile west of the Balt.-Wash. parkway, *2*95. I hope nobody wasted a trip due to my abysmal map-reading skills. Sorry about that! - Mark

27 years, 7 months

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Another find available in Maryland

by mtapley＠swri.edu

All, Next time I come to Maryland I am $^&(*& well going to bring more luggage. Awright, gentlemen, start your engines. The finish line is the Village Thrift Store in Laurel, MD, on the north side of 198 about a mile west of 95. (Same place as last time I found a cool computer while travelling and couldn't carry it home.) The prize is a Hewlett Packard Portable Plus together with an HP 9114B box (which I think is just an external battery powered 3.5" floppy. Anyone?). It runs Lotus 1-2-3 and there are a couple of other programs on it which I didn't have time to explore. There was only one power supply for the computer plus the external box. Price was not marked. The store worker quoted me $30 for the two of them, but (already aware that I could not pack it) I said "hmph" and walked off. Hopefully he'll now quote you a lower price. There were HP-IL (?) cables connecting the two. The computer said it had a 300/1200 boud modem, and did have an RJ-11 jack. It also said "file not found" on drive A: and had about 2.7 Mbytes left on drive B: That's about all I remember about it. Let me know how it is... - Mark

27 years, 7 months

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TI 9900N

by netcafe＠pirie.mtx.net.au

-----Original Message----- From: Max Eskin <kurtkilg(a)geocities.com> To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers <classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu> Date: Saturday, 19 December 1998 8:47 Subject: TI 9900N >I just got this curious item from somebody. It's labelled LORAN C >NAVIGATOR on the back. I haven't powered it up yet, but I guess this is >something similar to GPS Well, sorta. ie both are navigation systems. LORAN is a civil version of a radio hyperbolic navigation aid developed by the Brits in WW2. The Germans had a similar thing, which was originally based in the Bay of Biscay, when the Brits found out about it, instead of destroying it, they had charts made to suit it, and it was used extensively by Coastal Command in the area. It was continued as a nav service after the war, last I heard, it was actually still operating, but that was about 7 or 8 years ago now. The British version was called GEE and was used to navigate (mostly) bomber command aircraft, although I believe Coastal Command and possibly the RN minesweepers and other small ship also used it. In those days it was mostly used by aircraft though. >(only LORAN is on the ground, isn't it?). LOng Rnge Area Navigation. No, it doesn't really matter, it will work in a ship, a plane or a car. (Or on foot if you have a small enough one to carry.) >It looks pretty old, and certainly has digital electronics in it. Could >someone tell me what to do with this thing? Would it be useful in a car or >an airplane? (I have neither) A small boat, like a yacht or a power boat could use it. If they do, and you have the the special maps it needs, then yes, you should be able to use it ok. I know it was popular with small boats in the US area til a few years ago, yachts especially used it quite a bit. I found the following web site, info there says LORAN-C is still operating, and it now seems likely it will continue til 2005 at least. http://www.illgen.com/ila/news/LoranDecision.htm Hope this helps. Cheers Geoff Roberts Computer Room Internet Cafe Port Pirie South Australia. netcafe(a)pirie.mtx.net.au

27 years, 7 months

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TI 9900N

by allisonp＠world.std.com

< > I just got this curious item from somebody. It's labelled LORAN C < > NAVIGATOR on the back. I haven't powered it up yet, but I guess this i < > something similar to GPS (only LORAN is on the ground, isn't it?). It < > looks pretty old, and certainly has digital electronics in it. Could < > someone tell me what to do with this thing? Would it be useful in a ca < > an airplane? (I have neither) < < Loran is a system of radio transmitters that ships and planes use to < navigate by triangulating the direction of the signals from two or < more stations. Can't thing of too much use for it in a car, unless < you're going _way_ off-road. It's loran C, still in use for aircraft and ships that cannot afford or do not yet have NAVSAT(GPS) hardware. IT's basically a specialized 100khz reciever and signal processing system coupled to a microporcessor to translate LOP to lat/long. Accuracy better than 1mile and typicaly .2mile. I have a smaller one in my plane and still use it. I wouldn't mind having one of the old TIs as they were amoung the first commercial loran C. Allison

27 years, 7 months

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PDP-8 for free, ACT FAST!!!! Like, This afternoon

by allisonp＠world.std.com

< That is today! If you're in Boston and want a PDP-8 or want to help < someone get one, please act fast! Please pass this note on to anyone < you feel could help rescue this system. Damm, no wau I could make it in there and I want one too. Allison

27 years, 7 months

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Luftschiffe (was:ebay - Minivac 601, 1st pers. digital computer 1960s)

by rigdonj＠intellistar.net

At 04:31 PM 12/18/98 -0500, you wrote: >> >From what I've heard, the reason why the US military stopped using >> airships was because so many crashed in storms... > >The first bunch did (1920s-30s), but they were reborn in the 1940s, as >they were _wonderful_ ASW platforms. They continued to be used well into >the 1950s, carrying early warning radar stuff. > They're still being used for RADAR platforms. There's one flying not 30 miles from here. Supposedly being to used to stop the flow of drugs. Yeah -- right! Joe

27 years, 7 months

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PDP-8 for free, ACT FAST!!!! Like, This afternoon

by mbg＠world.std.com

The following was posted on alt.sys.pdp8... I don't have any other knowledge of it, and can't save it myself... SOMEONE, please save it! I have been asked to post the following anonymous tip about the availability of a PDP-8 system in Boston: ------------------------------ Two functional PDP-8e minicomputers, 32k, RK8e disk, TD8e DECtape, bound for dumpster in Boston Friday afternoon, 18 december. Researcher has finally decided he needs floor space more than potential access to original data. Also RK05 disk packs, documentation, tapes, etc. In racks, with wheels. 243 Charles St., Boston, alley beside Mass. Gen'l Hosp. Founders' House, rolling out between 4pm and 6pm. "Too much paperwork" to donate or sell, they say. If you have a truck, and make appropriate offerings to the housekeeping folks, they could be yours. ------------------------------ That is today! If you're in Boston and want a PDP-8 or want to help someone get one, please act fast! Please pass this note on to anyone you feel could help rescue this system. Doug Jones jones(a)cs.uiowa.edu

27 years, 7 months

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H/Z 100 parts source

by lwalker＠mail.interlog.com

For those who are looking for a parts source for these beasts , a new one has popped up. Well, Gernware Enterprises >finally< put up some web pages on all the stuff still in stock for all the old ZDS systems. Although these systems are long obsolete, Gernware still has both new products and used parts available for the Z-100, Z-150, Z-171, Z-248, and other stuff (including a 8-color flatbed plotter!). It can't hurt to try Gernware to keep an old ZDS system running! Front of the line ZDS software for the Z-100 is being offered this time around. And as always at below really cheap costs. For all the details hit the web pages at: www.borg.com/~gern Gernware wishes a merry seasons greetings to all Gernware customers, both the loyal past customers and future ones! Cheers, Gern I don't know who thsi is but it's a rare source. ciao larry lwalker(a)interlog.com

27 years, 7 months

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GRiD Compass, anyone?

by sinasohn＠ricochet.net

At 10:55 PM 12/17/98 -0600, you wrote: >And that reminds me, Compass owner that I am, to ask if there are any >other Compass owners out there? I've got an 1100, 1101, 1129, and 1139. I've got an 1101 that doesn't work. I'd love any others anyone wants to part with. --------------------------------------------------------------------- O- Uncle Roger "There is pleasure pure in being mad roger(a)sinasohn.com that none but madmen know." Roger Louis Sinasohn & Associates San Francisco, California http://www.sinasohn.com/

27 years, 7 months

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Emulex doc archive site gone now . . .

by sinasohn＠ricochet.net

At 09:14 AM 12/17/98 -0600, you wrote: >There have been other cases where sites were "framing" content from >other people's sites - imagine a super-news site that gave you the >impression all the content was their own, but that only embedded >(via links) content made by others, side-stepping their menus >and banners, etc. Today's relevant bit from TBTF below. I can certainly see the issue with making content appear to be yours, when in fact it was someone elses (I seem to remember someone framing WSJ articles this way, and rightfully getting busted.) However, the simple act of "get your tickets at ticketmaster.com" (with an embedded link) is more akin to "go three blocks that way, and turn left and you'll see TM on the right". --------------------------------------------------------------------- O- Uncle Roger "There is pleasure pure in being mad roger(a)sinasohn.com that none but madmen know." Roger Louis Sinasohn & Associates San Francisco, California http://www.sinasohn.com/

27 years, 7 months

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OT: Learning new words (was RE: "Single instance" machines)

by CLASSICCMP＠trailing-edge.com

>(mean?) humorous streak. They taught him a very interesting form of >English - and colourful. Instead of saying "wow, excellent!", they >convinced him that the correct thing to say was "most spannerlike!", and >that a correct form of greeting was "Hello Sailor!". There were many more >interesting variations, and his English was eventually, suffice it to say, >unusual :) Six words: "My hovercraft is full of eels" Tim.

27 years, 7 months

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Halleluyah! Hooray! Eureka! Success! (OS-65U)

by bill＠chipware.com

A few of you may know that one of my first postings to Usenet (alt.folklore.computers) was a request for a copy of Ohio Scientific's OS-65U 6502 operating system. I have been looking for it since 1993. Well, Santa came to me a little early today in the form of the UPS man and I have here in my hand (well, sitting on the desk next to me) a factory original set of 8 inch floppies of OS-65U! Level 1 version 1.44 CD-23 revision. I also have demo disks, and level 1 v 1.2 CD-7 revision. I think to myself, "My quest is over." Now the real work begins. I own six 8 inch floppy drives that came with OSI machines. None of them have had a disk in them since I have owned them (I haven't had one to put in them until now!). three are: Siemens FDD 200-8P one is: Shugart Model 801 the other two are in a box, I'll have to check later. One of the Siemens has the gold face plate I mentioned in another post. The Siemens look like double sided drives, the Shugart is definitely a single sided drive. Nothing on the disks indicate single or double sided. I think they are soft sectored (only one index hole). How should I proceed? Could I get full repair and calibration instructions for these drives? Does anybody have an 8 inch set up that can read and duplicate most formats? Maybe recover questionable/compromised data on the disks? Thanks, Bill Sudbrink

27 years, 7 months

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SOL feeding frenzy?

by Watzman＠ibm.net

Actually, in the US, the FCC regulations on emissions did not go into effect until 1981 or 1982, before that the only laws were those general laws against operating an unlicensed or unauthorized transmitter. You could make an argument that any given item constituted such a transmitter, but even the FCC did not interpret things this way until the formal Class A / Class B certification rules went into effect. Kits are a "grey" area, but generally it would be expected that they would comply when assembled according to the instructions (and believe me, pre-1980 computers are generally WAY out of compliance). Since you are dealing with a "regulation" and not a "law" (in the US, anyway), enforcement is an administrative function of the FCC rather than a civil/criminal action by the courts (although in some cases it can spill over). The safety issue, in the US, is NOT a legal requirement (except in the state of Oregon and some cities/counties, including Los Angeles). Otherwise, there are generally no laws requiring UL approval. But just try to get insurance or defend a lawsuit if you are a company that markets a non-UL approved product. UL only applies to devices that use certain threshold levels of voltage; a board would not be impacted, but an IMSAI chassis that plugs into the wall, for example, would - and it would not pass (there is exposed full line voltage, among other things). ---------- From: Tony Duell [SMTP:ard@p850ug1.demon.co.uk] Sent: Wednesday, December 16, 1998 8:38 PM To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers Subject: Re: SOL feeding frenzy? > > I would actually like to be able to buy a "new" IMSAI (for example), = > even if it wasn't made by IMSAI, but I would want it to be understood = > that it was a newly produced copy. It won't happen, however, in part = > because it would be illegal to make any of these computer as "new" = Well, there might be interlectual property/copyright problems, but do the other rules apply to kits/bare boards? The UK rules are strange IIRC. Kits have to pass the appropriate directives (covering EMC/safety, for example), when assembled as per the instructions. But I seem to remember that bare boards can be classed as components, and are thus exempt. Of course if you then populate the board, you'd better make sure it causes no interference. Or at least I think that's roughly how most people interpret the regulations. The people who composed them seem not to realise that experimental designs exist, that example circuits exist, and that nobody can know what a circuit will do until it's built and tested... > products. There were no FCC regulations when these machines were = I am sure there _were_ FCC rules, mainly to do with causing interference to other services. Now, if it causes no intereference outside your house, who is to know or care :-). OK, if %random-public buys a computer he should be able to assume it'll not interfere with his TV in the same room. But if you build one, then provided it only wipes out _your_ TV and not those of your neighbours, then there's no real problem. > originally built, and none of them are in compliance, and they couldn't = > be put in compliance without a complete redesign (in fact, they are WAY = > out of compliance). Most of these were also not UL approved either. So = I don't see how UL approval can be applied to a bare board (OK, if it's designed so user controls are live or something...), since whether it is safe or not depends on how it is constructed, what parts are used, whether or not it is cased, etc. -tony

27 years, 7 months

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2650 (was:Type list (was: single instance machines))

by CLASSICCMP＠trailing-edge.com

>> I seem to recall that there were commercially available 2650 S100 cards.... >Do you have more information ? I recall this as well. The source of more information would undoubtedly be to page through a big stack of _BYTE_'s from the mid and late 70's. Remember, in the S-100 world "commercially available" means that someone etched a PC board and maybe, if you're lucky, they actually typed up a manual with hand-drawn schematics. Tim.

27 years, 7 months

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Modem tones over television or radio

by jfoust＠threedee.com

Somewhat apropos the recent thread about sending mains power through modems, can anyone tell me if it's legal or illegal here in the States to send data in the audio of television or radio? Certainly there would be bandwidth and therefore speed limitations, but does the FCC allow this? Is it legal in other countries? - John

27 years, 7 months

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