Hi There,
I am working on restoration, documentation of a some vintage navigation
systems from the late 1970ties, which have been designed in the UK. They
contain an archaic bit-serial computer and I'd be interested if
someone on this list recognizes the architecture and/or can confirm
my assumptions:
The bitserial computer consists of around 300 TTL chips (54xx);
it has 8 bits instructions and operates on 16 bit memory. The 3
LOWER bits of the opcode define the instruction and the HIGHER
bits the location (0-31, i.e. address) - most other architectures
I know have the instruction coded in the MSBs! Here is a list
of the basic instructions:
1 : Load Ac from memory
2 : Store Ac to memory
3 : Add to Ac
4 : Sub from Ac
5 : IO-Instructions (32 Channels, there are some special
channels as 0 loads AC with "0" whereas channel 31 loads
-1 into Ac).
6 : Shift instructions - depending on the address field,
Ac is shifted arithmetically (preserving MSB, the sign) or
cyclic.
7 : Bit test instructions - 0-15 test bits of the Ac register,
16-31 test external digital inputs and are used for
communication with the hardware.
And finally, put last for didactic reasons:
0 : Here we have a bunch of special instructions depending
on the address field, like selection of memory page,
conditional jump, loading of data from ROM into the
Accumulator (Ac), multiply, divide, conditional JUMP,...
What makes the architecture very unique to me is, that it has
32 bit capability, i.e. there is a "double length" flag and if this
is set, most commands operate on 32 bit (1-6, MUL, DIV).
Additionally there is a "logic flag" which causes e.g. the
instuctions ADD and SUB to switch to change their operation from
ADD/SUB to logic AND/NXOR.
Apart from this, ROM and RAM are separated (the CPU cann not exe-
cute code in RAM) and the RAM is segmented in 4 pages of 31 words.
The machine does not have got a stack, there is no subroutine call
and only just one flag used for conditional JUMPs. Via the test in-
structions (e.g. test Accu bit 3, test Ac<0) this flag is modified
and a following "Jump if Flag Set" acutally causes the conditional
JUMP.
As the navigation system is made by Ferranti I, already had a look
at the varouos computers made by them (Mark1, Pegasus, Atlas, and
Argus). I think given the timeline, and the word widths the Argus 600
or 700 architectures may be closely related, but the 600's command
set is quite different...
http://www.wylie.org.uk/technology/computer/Argus/PeteFarr.htm
Can anyone out there confirm this? Is a instruction set listing of
the Argus 700 available somewhere?
A video on the system can be found fon YouTube although this is
not focused on the digital computer it may be of interest as
it gives a overview on the application, the projected map cockpit
display (one of the devices controlled by the system) and it shows
my homebrew logger developed durig analysis of the box:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-EQqfxiGgd8
Interesting in this system is also the delicate mechanics and the
mix of digital computing, analog computing (platform stabilization,
compensation of cross talk errors and anisoelasticity, platform
erection, first integration from acceleration to speed) and
mechanical computing (the ingetration of turn rate happens me-
chanically within the gyrsocopes).For this reasons, these systems
are the most extraordinary masterpiece of engineering I know...
Best regards,
Erik, Germany, Munich...
Hello vintage computing fans - we are finally ready to officially
re-announce the 11th annual Vintage Computer Festival Midwest! Here
are the essentials:
What: A weekend of friends, fellowship and frivolity centered around
the hobby of vintage computing. Buy, browse, show or sell or any
combination thereof.
When: September 10-11, 2016
Where: The Holiday Inn of Elk Grove Village, Illinois, minutes from
O'Hare International Airport (with a free shuttle)
How Much: Zero, 0, null, %0, nil, @0, aught, ought, naught, 0x00,
nada, zip, or goose-egg. It's free, too. (BIG ASTERISK BELOW)
Last year's move to our new, larger event hall was a resounding and
popular success. This year, processes have been streamlined, layouts
optimized, synergies leveraged and core competencies enhanced so that
2016 will see us there again with a little bit more space (all that we
can get this time) and the same great food, hours and convenience that
worked so well last time. Some OK T-Shirts, too, if I finish them on
time.
Reservations for tables and potential speaking slots will be taken via
web form here: http://vcfmw.org/signup.html. We'll contact you soon
to follow-up on space requirements or presentations. There is no need
to register to attend the show. Table spots may fill up quickly -
late registrants may end up with sub-optimal locations.
Special convention rate hotel reservations for the Holiday Inn are now
open. Follow the link on our site to the reservation page with
pre-filled code. If you are making your reservation with your own
discount code or without one, please still mention our show (code
"VCF") as that is one way we track attendance figures (and more
reservations = friendlier hotel.)
Please visit our website and FAQ at http://vcfmw.org for all the
latest relevant information and don't hesitate to contact me with
questions not covered there.
(BIG ASTERISK) VCFMW is a community-supported event and does not
charge admission - therefore we depend on your donations to cover the
costs of the facility rental and other necessaries. Please visit our
web page to find two methods of donation (PayPal and GoFundMe) and
give what you can. If you'd like to donate directly at the show or by
some other method, please let me know privately.
Thank you to all that helped make our show great last year and we hope
to see you again in September!
-j
Date: Mon, 13 Jun 2016 15:20:11 -0400
From: "Bill Sudbrink" <wh.sudbrink at verizon.net>
To: "'General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts'"
<cctalk at classiccmp.org>
Subject:
> I think that VCFed (was MARCH) had that one
> signed at the same workshop that mine was
> signed at. A couple of others were signed
> at the same time. Picture of Herb getting
> his signed (right after mine) here:
>
> http://www.retrotechnology.com/restore/sol_1.html
Woz was at VCF 8.0 (2005) and I quickly bought a Macintosh Portable for $50 from one of the vendors just so I could have him sign something - got a picture of him doing so as well:
http://tinyurl.com/jkxcv89
On older Apple 68k machines, having an Apple-branded CDROM means you can
be assured it'll boot (though it's rumored that many generic SCSI CDROMs
work for booting) and also that it'll "just work" on most of the OSs.
I'm guessing it's a simple check to see if the vendor in the firmware is
"APPLE". Has anyone ever managed to hack the firmware of something like a
Yamaha, Pioneer, or Plextor drive so that it lies and says it's "APPLE"
thus being fully enabled by the OS & hardware ? Does anyone know anything
about flashing CDROM firmware and the dynamics of such things? I wonder if
it'd just be a matter of a simple hexedit/byte-patch on the firmware image
then load it up... Is this a bogus idea?
The reason for this is that if it's possible, I could buy a Pioneer slot
loading SCSI CDROM drive, stuff it into my Quadra 660AV, and then hack it
to "just work" instead of needing drivers et al. The slot cover isn't big
enough for a normal tray-drive CDROM to work. Thus I can only use a CD300i
caddy-based drive (or theoretically - a slot drive). My 300i is a bit of
PoS and even after I cleaned it, the thing still has a lot of read
problems.
-Swift
I recently received something very special to me, a Symbolics XL1200 LISP
machine, with framethrower and the works.
Despite being shipped in the original SMBX designed carton, UPS dealt a
great deal of damage to the system. It looks like it was hit by a truck.
This, predictably, makes me very sad.
Is there anyone, preferably local, with the skill and tools to make this
thing look a little better who can lend a hand?
How do I get started undoing the dents and extremely bent base?
thanks,
- Ian
--
Ian Finder
(206) 395-MIPS
ian.finder at gmail.com
> From: William Degnan
>> For 777560/60 (standard for the console), you want A7/A3 and V4/V5
>> 'in'.
> I intend to use a serial terminal to access the console via M912
> CONSOLE ROM.
Got it; that would mean you're wanting the standard console.
> I believe you're saying to connect A7/A3 and V4/V5
Right, insert jumpers A7 and A3, and also V5 and V4.
> I still don't understand the pattern.
They specify the device address and vector in binary.
A7 is the 7th bit of the address, i.e. the 0200 bit. And since the DL11 is
'address jumper in for 0', that bit in the device's address is going to be
_0_ when the jumper is in. That would turn 777770 (remember, the device is a
block of 8 bytes, from xxxxx0 to xxxxx7, so you can't set the low 3 bits in
the base address, they must be 0) into 777570. Similarly, A3 is 010, and
turns 777770 to 777760. Put them together, you get 777560.
V5 = 040, V4 = 020, so they become a vector of 060.
> What would A4, A5, A6 and V7, V6, V3 represent
A4 = 020, A5 = 040, A6 = 0100. V7 = 0200, V6 = 100, V3 = 010.
> Is there a table with the jumpers and values somewhere?
No, but I'll whip one up and stick it on the Computer History wiki.
> Specifically something that lists all jumper combos and their
> corresponding addresses?
Well, _all_ the combinations would be 2^8 combinations (there are 8 address
jumpers), which is pretty sizeable, and I don't feel like listing them all,
but I can list a couple of the most common ones (e.g. console, second line,
etc).
Noel
Hi,
I have really fond memories of this operating system (from before the
SVR4 Solaris days). It was the first UNIX I used (and I'm still a big
BSD fan).
(Not sure what the protocol is here for asking something like this so
if I run afoul of a copyright policy or something, just tell me to
stop asking and I will.)
Is there any way someone can get their hands on an install disc for
this? I have some old SPARC hardware that it would be fun to run on
if I could find the installer.
Thanks,
Bryan
> From: William Degnan
> OMG
Yeah, but look at it this way: their being inverted can be a memory jogger -
'Oh, the DL11, that effed-up interface where the jumper sense is inverted
between address and vector!' Then you only have to look up one of the two.. :-)
> Yes, so I can use a terminal with the machine, I need a working
> terminal.
"Terminal" != "console". (Or, rather, the latter is a unitary subset of the
former.) The 'system console' is, by definition, on all PDP-11's, a DL11-type
serial interface at 777560. However, it may have many 'terminals'! :-)
>> For 777560/60 (standard for the console), you want A7/A3 and V4/V5 'in'.
> I think you mean 60/64, right?
Sort of (unless you mean 'instead of 777560/60, you meant 60/64, right?').
777560 is the base address, 60 is the base vector.
The receiver registers are 777560-2, and the transmitter are 777564-6, but on
the DL11, one can only set the base of the entire group of 4 registers, one
can't move the transmit and receive around independently. Similarly for the
vector, one can only set the base; the receive (B) and transmit (B+4) are
paired in the hardware.
Hence, "777560/60".
Noel
I have a PDP-11/23 with two RL02 drives, in a third party rack, that I
need to rehome. The PDP does not have any cards installed! Nothing has
been tested.
Available! Cheap! Always open to trades. The rack is a shorty, and I
could deliver it within reason.
I still have those MINC-11 cards, too.
--
Will, in IBM land NY
> From: William Degnan
> Does anyone have a M7800 (DL11) set for 9600 b N71 or N81 jumper'd with
> the default address for use as a serial terminal interface?
Yup. (And BTW the baud's not jumpers, it's the dials.)
> I understand the other jumpers on the card, but the address and vector
> jumpers confuse me.
Join the crew... :-)
The simple rule on the DL11 is that vector jumpers are the inverse of address
jumpers: for the vector, jumpers are 'in' for '1', and for the address, they
are 'in' for '0'.
> I think for use as a simple serial terminal interface I need to jumper
> "in" *A9, A7, A5, A4, A3* ... correct? Vector jumpers *V6, V7 "*in" .
You mean for the console, right? (All DL11's are 'simple serial terminal
interfaces' ;-).
The jumpers you give are for DL11 #1, address 776500, vector 300. For
777560/60 (standard for the console), you want A7/A3 and V4/V5 'in'.
Noel
I am in possession of two Magnavox (North American Philips) CM8562
monitors. Out of the box they handle composite and digital RGBI (CGA)
input. What I'd like to do is get one to handle analog RGB (like arcade
boards, Amiga, Atari ST, and Apple IIGS put out). I wouldn't think this was
possible, but I seem to have a certain memory that I saw mention of doing
just that *somewhere* on the web a few years ago, even though I can't find
that mention now.
According to the rather unwieldy chart at
http://gona.mactar.hu/Commodore/monitor/Commodore_monitors_by_model_number.…
, the service manual and schematic for the Commodore-branded 1084 and
1084S-P is "also good for Magnavox ... CM8562". I assume this means the
monitors are basically the same underneath. Both of those Commodore
monitors support analog RGB. However, when I look at the service manuals
provided for those, they specifically state in several places that parts of
the manual referring to analog RGB do not apply to the CM8562.
Also, according to
http://www.retrocomputing.net/parts/commodore/1084S-P1/docs/1084p/readme.txt
, there are two chassis designations, which both confusingly include the
string "CM8562": CM8505/CM8562/CM8705/CM8762, 8CM505/8CM515/8CM542/8CM643
on the one hand; and 8CM542/CM8562/CM8762 on the other. The latter is noted
as only accepting digital RGBI.
Physically, both monitors I have have an 8-pin DIN input for the digital
RGBI, and a circular area with the legend "lin RGB" underneath. One one
monitor, that circular area is perforated; on the other one, it's just a
circle but with no indication that it can be easily knocked out. I have not
yet opened either one.
So... does anyone know if these monitors can in fact be made to accept
analog RGB? Or have a way I could tell after opening them up? And, of
course, I'd like instructions on just how to do it, if it is possible.
--
Eric Christopherson
I have two brand-new 13" green screen monitors available.
We got them at work from a surplus source a LONG time ago, I
think to replace failing monitors in Graph-on 140 terminals.
These are Motorola DS4003-500 units, with AC power supply
for either 120 or 240 V operation.
They take a card-edge connector for video and sync. (I
think they are RS-170 for composite sync, but I'm not
completely sure.) I used a scope to pick up the horizontal
frequency, it was 53.6 us or ~ 16.5 KHz.
I did power one of them up, and it gave a green raster when
the brightness was turned up.
Anybody interested?
Jon
Everyone,
CHM contacted me. They're seeking copies (or better yet, original disks)
of Lotus Development?s Executive Briefing System for the Apple II and
Prentice-Hall?s VCN ExecuVision for the IBM PC.
The software is not on Bitsavers, Archive.org, etc.
Contact: dbrock at computerhistory.org
-Evan
2016-06-11 22:00 GMT+02:00 Pete Turnbull <pete at dunnington.plus.com>:
> On 11/06/2016 18:17, Mattis Lind wrote:
>
>> I just dig out this little thing form my father stash of various stuff.
>>
>> When bringing up the setup screen it does not look like the one in the
>>
> > manual.
>
> I love the way they felt they had to explain the keyboard at such length.
> And explain that the unmarked key is the space bar - I remember when I was
> about 6 or 7, having to ask my dad how to get a space on his office
> typewriter.
>
> I was also amused to see they have a section on connecting it to the UK's
> BT lines (in the days when things needed BT Approval) so it's obviously
> intended for UK use, yet it's pictured with an American power lead.
Unfortunately for me my unit does not seem to be the same as the one in the
manual. The section on connecting to BT lines is probably still valid since
it does have a Rockwell modem board in it.
I did find an old Computerworld ad from 1989 which matched. Informer 213 -
emulating a 3274 control unit with an attached 3178 mod 2 terminal. Someone
with IBM knowledge might share what that means and how the terminal can be
used.
Anyway. I put together a webpage on the thing:
http://www.datormuseum.se/peripherals/terminals/informer-213
/Mattis
>
>
> --
> Pete
>
Hi all --
Having overcome my earlier issues with SIMH, I now have MULTOS/8 happily running on the real hardware, with two terminals. (Yay!). I'd like to get the system up to four terminals and here's where I'm running into trouble.
I've modified PARAM.PG appropriately (set JOBS to 4, TERMS to 4, and filled in the device codes for the extra terminals). I've rebuilt JOBS.BN and MULTOS, ran BUILD and inserted J1 through J4 and everything runs and the system comes up with 4 terminals (yay!).
What isn't working properly are the job devices J1 through J4 -- each of these provides each terminal/user his/her own "virtual" drive on the system's RK05 pack -- effectively it partitions the RK05 into four smaller drives, J1: through J4:. With the two user setup, J1: and J2: are approximately 3000 blocks in size (so each basically gets one side of the RK05 pack). With the four-user setup, I'd expect J1:, J2:, J3: and J4: to each be about 1500 blocks, but they're still reporting as 3000 blocks each.
What's more, the actual starting offsets of J1: through J4: appear to be what I'd expect (that is, J1 starts at 0, J2 starts at ~1500, J3 starts at ~3000, etc.). So if I start filling these drives, eventually they clobber each other.
The only manual I've found (http://www.pdp8.net/os/multos8/) suggests that these should be appropriately sized (see section 2.1.1) automagically, but this does not seem to be the case; doing a ZERO on them creates a filesystem 3000 blocks in length.
I'm digging through the source code to look for clues, but I haven't found anything yet.
Anyone fooled with this before?
Thanks,
Josh
yes there was a vast difference between him and Jobs
Ed#
In a message dated 6/14/2016 9:32:18 A.M. US Mountain Standard Time,
cctalk at snarc.net writes:
> Woz sounds like a nice guy.
He's incredibly nice. It always impresses me.
should have kept the good signed stuff
and sold the lesser stuff perhaps?
unless you had them sign a stack of them.
Ed#
In a message dated 6/13/2016 12:00:32 P.M. US Mountain Standard Time,
cctalk at snarc.net writes:
> One thing I did want to ask was, there was some debate about an original
> signed Apple. I couldn't make out if there was or was an announcement or
if it did or
> did not get sold.
The auction has four days remaining:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/191890608380.
We're also auctioning a signed Sol-20:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/191890605553
Both machines are super-clean, fully working, and autographed by their
respective inventors (Woz/Felsenstein).
All proceeds go to VCFed which is a non-profit.
> Also what had northern California go to do with it?
Nothing. :) Someone asked, in a wishful thinking moment, if the
announcement is about a new VCFestival in southern California. I replied
it's not and that northern Calif. is a good place to visit for VCF West
this summer.
Hi
I have had some success in fixing a couple of TK tape drives.
They now load and unload every time you press the button.
SFSG now to talk to them from RT.
Using the diagnostics on the format (RX50) disk the Identify function
shows the drive and by inference its controller.
However its calls it MUX. I seem to remember under RT you needed to do
a SET or ASSIGN to link it to the driver.
Anybody know the correct syntax so I can init the tape and start to
read and write files to and from it.
Rod
Hi folks
The website is now back up at http://declegacy.org.uk and will slowly
fill with content in the next couple of months about the upcoming event.
Registration is now possible.
Kind regards, Mark.
The tentative plan is to run the next one in October. The date should be
firmed up in the next month or so.
Typically I run the event once every 18 months or so.
Regards, Mark.
On 14 April 2016 at 15:50, Rob Jarratt <robert.jarratt at ntlworld.com> wrote:
> It is a very informal event, organised by Mark in his own time. He has
> family and work commitments like all of us, so I expect he has not been
> able to find the time.
>
> Regards
>
> Rob
>
> Sent from my Windows 10 phone
>
> From: Rod Smallwood
> Sent: 14 April 2016 15:09
> To: General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts
> Subject: Re: DEC Legacy UK show
>
> So why did it say See you in 2016?
>
>
> On 14/04/2016 15:03, Dave Wade wrote:
> > I thought Mark was only aiming for every two years.
> >
> >> -----Original Message-----
> >> From: cctalk [mailto:cctalk-bounces at classiccmp.org] On Behalf Of Rod
> >> Smallwood
> >> Sent: 14 April 2016 14:14
> >> To: General Discussion: On-Topic Posts <cctech at classiccmp.org>
> >> Subject: DEC Legacy UK show
> >>
> >> DEC Legacy UK show
> >>
> >> Where did it go ?
> >> 2015 then nothing
> >>
> >> Rod Smallwood
> >>
> >
>
>
>
>> should have kept the good signed stuff
>> and sold the lesser stuff perhaps?
>> unless you had them sign a stack of them.
>
> I think that VCFed (was MARCH) had that one
> signed at the same workshop that mine was
> signed at.
No. These are different ones. These were donated to us very recently
specifically for auctioning as a fundraiser.
Would you believe it.
VCF forum is up to its old tricks again.
Same old thing. Can't log in
Last time I got told I had registered when I had not.
Just like the banks your PIN number was used so it must have been you.
Our software can never be at fault. The user is always wrong.
Rod
What are the chances? Slim, but I'll ask anyway.
Now that I'm giving my Nova 3/12 some more attention and beginning to debug its 6045 hard drive, I'm interested in dolling up the system some more, and replacing filler panels with things that emit noise and heat. My manuals say that I can mix 6030 floppy drives on the same bus with the 6045 hard drives, so I'd like to add one to my rack.
So, does anybody have a 6030 floppy drive for swap or sale?
I'm in southern California, which can be a relevant detail when talking about transporting vintage gear.
While I'm at it, additional removable packs for my 6045 drive would be helpful, too. Especially if there's anything interesting on them.
--
Mark J. Blair, NF6X <nf6x at nf6x.net>
http://www.nf6x.net/
I have been able to use my Data General Nova 3's Program Load function to load in the 091-000036-01 self-loading bootstrap program, and then use that bootstrap to load in absolute binary tape images from *.ab files, all over the TTI channel from a terminal emulator.
Now, I'm trying to hack Toby Thain's Nova assembler to emit auto-loading images by prepending the self-loading bootstrap to the assembled program, with a binary patch to make the bootstrap jump straight into the absolute binary loader rather than halting at address 000121. It seems to me that I should be able to use this scheme to assemble programs which I can then Program Load through the TTI channel, and simply send the image over the serial port from a terminal emulator.
I have the assembler hacked up to prepend the patched loader, and the patch I made seems to cause the bootstrap to jump right into the absolute binary loader; I simply replaced the HALT that ended up in 000120 with a JMP 000121. However, the binary loader continues running after presumably digesting the data that followed the bootstrap.
Toby's assembler outputs "relocatable binary" code in .rb files, and I don't understand if/how that differs from the "absolute binary" format in the .ab tape images that I can successfully load. I'll continue researching, but I'd appreciate it if anybody might be able to provide any clues to dispel my confusion.
Regarding my hacked up assembler, I don't know whether it's advisable to post it publicly after getting it working, since it'll have original DGC binary code embedded in it. Opinions?
--
Mark J. Blair, NF6X <nf6x at nf6x.net>
http://www.nf6x.net/
My Nova 3/12 system has a 6045 cartridge hard drive, with one fixed platter, one removable platter, and a capacity of 10M. I haven't managed to boot my computer from it yet, and after a long pause, my Nova 3 is requesting another time slice of my attention.
I can see in the drive's technical manual where I can specify surface 0-3 in the commands. I assume that the built-in bootstrap loader in the Nova 3 reads drive 0, cylinder 0, surface 0, sector 0, and places it at memory location 0, simply by virtue of all of the registers having been reset after an initial power-up and spin-up. The bootstrap loader code I've seen looks like it just issues a read command without initializing the memory address register and disc address/sector count register. I don't fully grok that code yet, so maybe I'm mistaken.
I have not found mention yet of which surface numbers correspond to the fixed platter and which correspond to the removable one. Is the removable platter selected as surfaces 0 and 1, such that the system would normally boot from the removable platter? Or would it normally boot from the fixed platter, with the removable platter being used to get data on and off the system?
Incidentally, I wonder if anybody has any original printed technical documentation relevant to my Nova 3 system which they might like to sell. I'm working off PDFs right now, and I'd like clean original paper copies for easier perusal and reference.
I'm also interested in replacing the filler panels in my Nova's rack with other interesting peripherals. Maybe a floppy drive? My 6045 is supposed to be able to be mixable with 6030 drives on the same bus, according to the 6045 manual. If anybody has some excess Nova hardware that might fit into my system, please let me know.
--
Mark J. Blair, NF6X <nf6x at nf6x.net>
http://www.nf6x.net/
Just wondering if anyone knows what these chips are for/from/etc.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/152124208945
Interesting look to them. I would say EPROM but the magnifying window is weird...
-Ali
After getting my TRS-80 Model II keyboard repaired and up & running last week (http://www.insentricity.com/a.cl/257), I've been messing around with the Kermit source code to see if I can add hardware flow control support. I'm able to build Kermit using LASM on CP/M or on an emulator, but it would be nice to be able to setup a Makefile so I can do the build directly on Linux.
Is there a LASM compatible assembler out there with source available that I can run on Linux? I've tried a whole lot of different ones that are capable of doing 8080 & Z80 assembly, but not one understands the syntax of LASM (or I'm just not running them with the right flags).
I've tried so far:
z80asm - http://savannah.nongnu.org/projects/z80asm
as - http://john.ccac.rwth-aachen.de:8000/as/index.html
kio's zasm - http://k1.spdns.de/Develop/Projects/zasm/Distributions/
zasm - http://lpg.ticalc.org/prj_zasm/
z80-asm - http://wwwhomes.uni-bielefeld.de/achim/z80-asm.html
z80pack - http://www.autometer.de/unix4fun/z80pack/
Alternately, is the source code for Ward Christensen's LASM available anywhere? The best I could find was a note from a Kermit developer from 27 years ago asking for the source. I suppose I could use a disassembler, but then I don't have proper labels or comments.
--
Follow me on twitter: @FozzTexx
Check out my blog: http://insentricity.com
So I previously:
http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctech/2015-June/006953.html
wrote:
>> I see 'three' different kinds of 'UNIBUS to cables' cards listed:
>> M9014 UNIBUS to 3 H854s
>> M9015 3 H854s to UNIBUS
>> M9031 UNIBUS to 3 3M cables for 11/74
>> M9042 UNIBUS to 3 H854, Dual
> So I have compared an M9014 and an M9042; the former is a 'normal'
> height dual module, the latter is a 'short' dual module. I suspect that
> they have the same pinout on the Berg headers; I tried a couple of
> UNIBUS signals, and they led to the same pin on the Bergs on the two
> different units.
> If and when I get energetic I will make a complete pinout list for the
> two units (I haven't been able to find any documentation on any of them
> online).
I have completed this pinout list, and it is now documented here:
http://gunkies.org/wiki/UNIBUS_H854_header_pinout
I have also verified that both the M9014 and M9042 use the exact same pinout.
If _anyone_ has either an M9015, or an M9031, can they please let me know?
I'd like to document exactly what they are.
(I have this sneaky suspicion that the numbers were allocated, but the cards
never built: for the UNIBUS, unlike the QBUS, you can use the same card on
each end of a set of flat cables - that's because the UNIBUS dual connector
does not have separate 'grant in' and 'grant out' pins, unlike the QBUS.)
Since BC11A cables are now very hard to find, and the white flexible printed
circuit flat cables (I think that's the correct jargon, can someone please
correct me if I got that wrong) used in them is probably not obtainable now
(outside a special order), I suspect we may soon be using pairs of these
cards (they are very simple), along with a 3-set of 40-conductor (2x20 pin
headers) in place of them.
But that's for another day!
Noel
Hi folks,
Got a couple of Apple ][s that were rescued from a steelworks outbuilding
and as usual they have ASTEC power supplies with .1uF and .01uf RIFA
look-at-me-and-I'll-explode caps in and I'm running out of spares.
What's the current considered replacement for these? There seems to be a
wide range available with even wider ranging prices from EVOX, VISHAY,
MATSUSHITA, PANASONIC (ok, matsushita again), Iskra, KEMET etc.
Drowning in options, not just heavy rain :)
--
Adrian/Witchy
Binary Dinosaurs creator/curator
Www.binarydinosaurs.co.uk - the UK's biggest private home computer
collection?
Hi all,
anybody know, which system used it?
It is a 1986 CRT controller, which was pretty fancy
back then. But never saw actual hardware with it ...
Thanks
>
> From: Don North <ak6dn at mindspring.com>
> Subject: Re: UNIBUS M9312 ROMS (Don North)
> Message-ID: <498c12dd-437a-31ce-0a04-4602e50f6f55 at mindspring.com>
>
> There is a three PROM set 23-86[234]A9 for device code XM which is DDCMP
> boot
> over a DMC11/DMR11. Those PROMs are available and on my web page.
>
> I am not aware of the four PROM set you mention, but it could certainly be
> a
> custom one for that application.
>
> --
> Don North
> AK6DN
>
>
I looked in my notes. The 11/34s and KL10 talked through DMR11-ACs using
the megabit COAX interface. Maybe the three PROM version that you have is
the right one for this configuration, and there was another PROM on the
M9312.
--
Michael Thompson
So there was some prior discussion on the list about using the later 1MB
M8750 cards (used in the VAX-11/750, /730, etc) in the MK11 memory of a
PDP-11/70:
http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctech/2015-March/003598.html
However, that seems to require some kludgery in the MK11 (sending 4 separate
'board select' signals to a single memory card, etc).
I'm interested in using the 1MB M8750 cards because the smaller 256KB M8728
cards (which the MK11 _will_ take, although there's very little about that in
extant DEC documentation) are now seemingly unobtainium.
(Almost all the MK11 documentation that I have only talks about the 64K
M7984. The only one that does mention the M8728 is the -11/70 Maintenance
Service Guide, KA-K1170-MG-003, and it doesn't say much, just indicates that
one just plugs them in, and the controller recognizes them. So I've been
studying the prints to see how that all works - there are per-slot/board
'personality' lines the MK11 can read.)
The thing is that M8728 cards use the exact same PCB as the M7850 - in fact,
there are lots of 'M8728' cards listed online, because it says 'M8728' in the
etch, but they are in fact M8750's (as shown on the handles)!
So I had a brainwave: why not use M8750's, but jumper them to look like
M8728's? I'd only be using 256KB of a 1M card, but I can live with that (I
just bought a giant stack of M8750's for a fairly nominal amount). It would
let me use the M8750's without having to do hardware mods to my MK11.
So, has anyone here ever worked out how to use M8750 cards in the MK11 in this
manner?
It looks like all one has to do is i) figure out how to jumper the M8750 to
look like an M8728 (there is no documentation on the M8728 extant, AFAICT),
and ii) make sure that the A7 pin to the 64K RAM chips of the M8750 is driven
consistently to either '1' or '0' (it looks like there's a jumper in the A7
drive line, and one could connect the appropriate post of that jumper to
ground to do that).
So, if someone has done this before, or, failing that, if anyone has M8728
documentation (although I can get the M8728 jumper etc info off an M8728 I
have coming, if not), I would be extremely grateful!
Thanks in advance (I hope :-)!
Noel
I'm investigating getting MULTOS/8 running on the 8/e here at the museum and I thought I'd start by getting acquainted with it on SIMH.
I've picked up the disk pack from Dave Gesswein's site here: https://www.pdp8online.com/pdp8cgi/os8_html?act=dir;fn=images/os8/multos8.r… and the manual here: http://www.pdp8.net/os/multos8/
MULTOS as currently configured on the RK05 image appears to be set up for two terminals and everything listed in BUILD looks to agree with respect to the SimH hardware configuration. I set up a password file per the instructions, and after I set the DATE, I do an:
.R MULTOS
And am greeted with:
HELLO !
THIS IS THE MULTOS/8 MULTI-USER OS/8 TIMESHARING SYSTEM
CREATED BY COMPUTER METHODS
7822 OAKLEDGE ROAD
SALT LAKE CITY, UTAH 84121, USA
PHONE 801-942-8000
PLEASE INPUT TIME IN 24-HOUR FORMAT
(E.G. 0925 FOR 9:25 AM AND 1935 FOR 7:35 PM):
1601
THANK YOU !
THE SYSTEM IS NOW TIMESHARING
TYPE CONTROL/H TO LOG ON.
At this point, the system becomes unresponsive; CTRL-H appears to have no effect. AC and MQ seem to be incrementing over time as the docs describe.
I've poked around and in PARAM.PG, the address of TTY #2 is set to 32 (VT78?), rather than the 40 I'd expect. I changed this and reassembled the JOBS device handler, and then used BUILD to rebuild the system using it. I'm still getting the same behavior, however...
I have a bit of experience with OS/8 (but I'm not an expert) and nearly zero experience with MULTOS, so before I start debugging in SimH I thought I'd check to see that I'm not doing anything intensely stupid here...
Thanks!
Josh
I just dig out this little thing form my father stash of various stuff.
Had to replace the input filter module since there were a small cloud when
powering it up. It also left fair amount of thick smelly tar in the
machine. But the exact replacement were still to be found some 30 years
later.
The little thing is driven by a 68B09 processor, some ROM and RAM and a big
NEC ship marked "Informer". Maybe a custom ASIC. The screen is a Lohja /
Finlux 512x256 EL display.
When bringing up the setup screen it does not look like the one in the m
<https://www.jefftk.com/informer-213-ae-manual.pdf>anual. It looks more
IBMish.
http://i.imgur.com/7EX5uTz.jpg
It says 374/SNA - Rev 2.1
Does anyone have a more non-IBMish firmware set (or is there some other way
to make it more VT100)? A 27256 and a 2764 goes into the terminal.
There is a Youtube video, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CvPR8UypXNw , on
a Informer 213 but the firmware seems to be different (at around 1:31).
/Mattis
I wanted to reactivate a TI Professional Computer (TIPC) and all I get
some seconds after powering it on is the message
"** system error ** 0004"
and a beep, lasting for about 2 seconds.
The TIPC is an early, not really compatible clone of the IBM PC 5150. I
wonder if I need to do some reengineering and/or disassembling or if
there is a service manual out there.
greetings,
Martin
--
Martin Peters
martin at shackspace.de
Just wondering if anyone knows what these chips are for/from/etc.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/152124208945
Interesting look to them. I would say EPROM but the magnifying window is weird...
-Ali
Okay so I'm trying again, as the Classiccmp software is not letting my
post through with the correct name of the subject computer included in the
post (I've tried thrice).
My D#CM at TE II has begun behaving very strangely.
The computers began to develop keyboard issues a few weeks ago, which
resolved to be some or all of a set of small filtering caps (which on my
board, looked just like picofuses) that sit on the lines for the
keyboard/video port failing. Replaced those with 470pf caps (after I
incorrectly identified and installed picofuses the 1st time), the computer
now recognizes the keyboard, but now fails 9 out of 10 times to go through
a proper boot sequence, generating a randomly garbled version of the test
screen patterns and then sometimes attempting to boot the floppy (but
fails).
Anyway, if anyone has a mainboard left over from a Spare Time Gizmos
project and would like to get sell it, I'd be interested.
Thanks,
Tom
Folks
I have today collect a recent E-Bay purchase. It appears to be an IO
Selectric that has been left in a garage for a long period of time and is
very gummed up. It will turn over with the manual handle, and it appears to
try and type, but the carriage does not advance. All the tapes and chords
appear to be in place. I have put some pictures here:-
https://onedrive.live.com/redir?resid=277A0739F125010E!119461&authkey=!AGfgR
GXKAjqDm7E&ithint=folder%2cJPG
sorry for the long link. Does anyone have any suggestions as to which
manuals are appropriate, and which documentation was followed to allow it to
be used as a printer?
Dave Wade
G4UGM
http://hackaday.com/2016/05/29/dragging-teletypes-into-the-21st-century/?ut…
--
The contents of this e-mail and any attachments are intended solely for the use of the named
addressee(s) and may contain confidential and/or privileged information. Any unauthorized use,
copying, disclosure, or distribution of the contents of this e-mail is strictly prohibited by
the sender and may be unlawful. If you are not the intended recipient, please notify the sender
immediately and delete this e-mail.
remember c3 p meant 3 different selectable processors...
In a message dated 6/10/2016 2:04:07 P.M. US Mountain Standard Time,
spacewar at gmail.com writes:
That looks like an Ohio Scientific C3-B with two 74MB hard drives.
I'd really like to get that, and I'm within reasonable distance, but I
don't think I'll be able to do it.
c 3b or c 3p?
I remember a model c3p.....
In a message dated 6/10/2016 2:04:07 P.M. US Mountain Standard Time,
spacewar at gmail.com writes:
That looks like an Ohio Scientific C3-B with two 74MB hard drives.
I'd really like to get that, and I'm within reasonable distance, but I
don't think I'll be able to do it.
In cooperation with Faculty of Management, Comenius University in
Bratislava, Slovakia, SDIWC is inviting everyone to attend and participate
in The Third International Conference on Information Security and Cyber
Forensics (INFOSEC2017)
<http://sdiwc.net/conferences/3rd-international-conference-information-secur…>
that
will be held on June 29-July 1, 2017. The event will be held over three
days, with presentations delivered by researchers from the international
community, including presentations from keynote speakers and
state-of-the-art lectures.
All registered papers will be published in SDIWC Digital Library, and in
the proceedings of the conference.
The conference welcomes papers on (but not limited to) the research topics
posted below.
Thank you so much and See you in the conference.
Best regards,
Joan Sali
Conference Manager
INFOSEC2017
<http://sdiwc.net/conferences/3rd-international-conference-information-secur…>
---------IMPORTANT INFORMATION---------
http://sdiwc.net/conferences/3rd-international-conference-information-secur…
Venue: Faculty of Management, Comenius University in Bratislava, Slovakia
Date: June 29-July 1, 2017
Contact email: infosec17 at sdiwc.net
Submission Deadline Open from now until May 01, 2017
Notification of Acceptance May 20, 2017 or 4-7 weeks from the submission
date
Camera Ready Submission Open from now until May 28, 2017
Registration Deadline Open from now until May 28, 2017
Conference Dates June 29-July 1, 2017
Some time ago, there were two posts asking how to operate the simh LGP-30 emulator. It is not exactly obvious from the rudimentary manual, and it seems nobody had figured it out completely. I am slightly obsessed with this machine at the moment (it happens), so here is a how-to on operating the emulator and running the tape library of Christian Corti on it - in the hope it's of use to others looking for clues:
http://obsolescenceguaranteed.blogspot.ch/2016/06/using-simh-lgp-30-emulato…
Corti's LGP-30 emulator, by the way, gives a much better feel for the machine. But simh source is available, which I needed because I'm making a replica hardware front panel for the machine.
Regards,
Oscar.
> From: Devin Davison
> It looked like a good batch of boards and i was holding out on finding
> a machine.
I hope that "a machine" wasn't 'an empty machine to plug them into' - because
AFAICT the chances are that happening are basically zero. (People seem to
save either i) complete machines, or ii) just the boards - apparently not
realizing that without the backplane, etc, the boards are only useful as
spares.)
> Any good place to get a 11/780 aside from watching the local scrap
> centers with my fingers crossed one will be there?
For some reasons, /780's seem to be pretty rare. I suspect it's a case of
'they were mostly all scrapped long ago in favour of later models which were
faster and smaller' (we see the same thing in other lines).
Don't get me wrong, I truly do fervently hope that you do find one somehow,
but one has to be realistic, I think. (I'd love to have an RF11, but I'm
pretty sure they almost all went to the big scrap-heap in the sky many moons
ago; so I'm not holding on, waiting for one to appear - rather, I'm getting
on with the stuff that _is_ still here.) Sorry to be such a downer... :-(
Noel
>
> From: Don North <ak6dn at mindspring.com>
> Subject: Re: UNIBUS M9312 ROMS
>
> Actually the page listed below is a big out of date with respect to some
> M9312
> images (it is not an up to date mirror).
> The up to date page is at: http://ak6dn.dyndns.org/PDP-11/M9312/
>
> --
> Don North
> AK6DN
>
RCS/RI has some PDP-11/34 systems that booted, I think using DDCMP, via a
COAX interface from a PDP-10 KL10. I think that it took four ROMs to hold
the boot loader. You might not have a copy of those ROMs.
--
Michael Thompson
Hi everyone,
I am looking to clean out some of my stuff. I'm 'buried' in it.
This is just the begnning.... so if you are looking for anything in
particular; PC, Mac, Sun, SGI, misc, feel free to inquire.
If you want to get heard above the noise when replying (spam sucks),
add PURGE into the subject line.... that will help me find responses or
inquiries fast.
So, here is the first batch of stuff, organized by drives, misc, kvm,
wireless, PC, laptop, Sun, SGI, Apple, Digital (DEC), Cisco, and finaly
toner and ink cartridges.
Obviously there are so many items here, it would take time to price all
this stuff. So I'm open to reasonable offers. I'm not trying to make
it rich, I'm looking for a reasonable amount so that you get a decent
deal, and I get this stuff move on out. Eventually if it doesn't move
it will go into storage, recylced, or dumpstered. I've got to get some
space back.
There are lots of parts here, but also some completed (or mostly
complete) Macs, PC, Sun, SGI, etc. I have some older PC laptops to
list, and I'll have more Mac, Sun, SGI, and more to list as time goes
on. But I have to start somewhere.... so here is the list....
Drives (hard drive, optical drive, mo drive, etc)
-------------------------------------------------
SCSI hard drives (too many to list) (I have a number of Sun and
generic, i.e. good number of ST11200N, and some ST31200N for an example)
IDE hard drives (too many to list)
SATA hard drives (qty of 250G, a few others)
ESDI hard drives (a few)
MFM hard drives (some, i.e. Maxtor XT1140, Maxtor XT2190, Micropolis
1325, etc) (I'm not dumping these, just listing them for those who know
what they are and want to inquire with real offers, so this is listing
for completeness, not to make space like most things here)
Misc
----
15" XVGA LCD monitor, no stand, but includes a wall mount bracket.
Power supply included.
RJ45F to DB25M kits. Still sealed, make your own pinout
Canon SX printer parts (inquire with what you are looking for)
New Compaq Ipaq, was only charged and tried once, it has sat in a box
since. Original packaging not present
Qty 6 MeanWell ESP240-27 power supplies (27V 8A)
AGA Discus 600M MO drive (external)
Cabletron MT-800 MAU, 8 port AUI ethernet 'hub', untested
Digtal DELNI-BA MAU, 8 port AUI ethernet 'hub', untested (may have 4
bad ports (4 labelled with an 'X' under them)
Whistle Interjet (internet access/server appliance (google it))
HP Printer PAL (turn your PCL printer into a FAX receiver), new in box,
never opened
syquest SPARQ1A1 internal IDE 1.0G removable media drive (like the
IOMega Jaz), untested (don't have media to test with)
Ayquest SQ555, SCSI interface, 5.25" removable media drive, 44M
capacity, no media, working pull
KVM Stuff
---------
Qty 3 Avocent Outlook 2160ES KVM (each has 16 ports, supports 2
consoles) (these can be daisy chained)
Qty 17 Avocent KVM cables (106-2326-00) for the 2160ES (and other
Avocent KVMs). Each cable supports 2 systems.
Wireless Stuff
--------------
5 Summit SDC-CF10G 802.11G compact flash wireless cards with laptop
style antenna connector, and one antenna lead/connector pig tail
5 Summit SDC-PC10G PCMCIA to Compact Flash adapters for the SDC-CF10G
(and others?) wireless compact flash cards
PC Stuff
--------
Qty 1 Mouse Systems PC Jr Optical Mouse
Gateway G6-200 PC (will got for a nice AT tower if all you need is a
case)
Qty 12+ Pentium III heatsink/fans. Server grade with IBM 22P4370 part
# on them.
Qty 3 VXI VRMs (073-20742-30) (IBM FRU 1K7371)
150W PC AT power supply ('mini AT' ? not the full size from the IBM AT
style case)
PowerTronic TK-4230DC full size AT power supply
Qty 1 Generic 400DPI PC Bus Mouse, excellent condition (Logitec 'half
moon' style, but generic brand)
Qty 1 Ditto I080Fi internal tape drive
Multiple PC AT Keyboards
Multiple Pentium motherboards, some with cpu, some without, no manuals
Qty 4 3COM 3C597 Fast EtherLink EISA
Laptop stuff
------------
Qty 6 new Latitude D600/610/520 (and others?) battery, not the recalled
ones, the good ones, need charging as they've been on the shelf for a
long time
Dell Latitude D520 palm rest, new in box, with trackpad component
missing, a used working trackpad is included but not installed
Dell Latitude D520 palm rest, new in box (with new trackpad as
delivered from Dell)
Dell Inspiron C840 UXGA 15" TFT Screen, new in box from Dell
Sun Stuff
---------
Mini-DIN console cable (Mac modem cable), new in package
Qty 2 SLC CPU boards (untested, I don't have an SLC/ELC to test in)
Qty 3 ELC CPU boards (untested, I don't have an SLC/ELC to test in)
Qty 1 Ultra 5/10 mainboard (working pull) (will sell with or w/o CPU)
Qty 1 Ultra 10 riser PCB (370-3982)
Qty 1 Ultra 10 floppy drive (370-3159)
Qty 3 Sun 411 drive enclosures (old 'dotted' style)
Qty 2 Sun 411 drive enclosures (new style, just sun diamond logo, no
'Sun' text)
Qty 1 Sun 411 drive enclosure (new style, diamond shaped logo, and
'Sun' text/script)
Qty 6 Sun 611 drive enclosures
Qty 2 Sun 411 "dotted" style top case covers
Qty 2 Sun 411 top case covers (new style with logo and 'Sun'
text/script)
Qty 1 Sun 1/1+/2 (and 3/80) power supply (300-1038)
Qty 6 Sun 411 drive enclosure SCSI cabling/fan/'backplane' assembly
Multiple Sun 411 fans
Qty 12 Sun 370-1420 floppy drives (out of SS10, should work in others
as well (one has no door/bezel)
Qty 1 SS20 Hard Drive bracket
Qty 1 set of the newer revised SS20 side vents
Qty 1 Ultra 450 4 drive SCSI backplane
Qty 1 Ultra 450 8 drive SCSI backplane
Qty 12 Sun 411 drive enclosure 300-1090 power supplies
Qty 3 Sun 411 drive enclosure 300-1105 power supplies
Qty 1 Sun 411 drive enclosure 300-1037 power supply
Qty 9 Sparcstation 10 power supplies
Qty 1 SS5/SS20 power supply
Qty 1 SS10 top cover
Sun Unltra 10 workstation. Can't recall if this has a hard drive in it
still or not. This was a working system when retired.
SGI Stuff
---------
3COM 3C597 Fast EhterLink EISA cards (see misc section above)
Qty 1 Indogo 2 Power supply PC4074 p/N 6064470
SGI Indy R5000, no RAM, no HD, no HD bracket, has XZ graphics card
stack (030-8235 030-8234), has the better Sony power supply
SGI Indy power supply, Nidec brand, 943-0813
SGI Indy power supply, Sony brand, 060-0008
Indy top cover
Indigo purple top cover
Indigo teal top cover
Indog2 backplane (030-8104)
Qty 4 3COM 3C597 Fast EtherLink EISA (can be used on SGI Indigo 2
(google it))
Apple Stuff
-----------
Apple IIGS, nice condition, powers on fine, no setup to do a boot test
with
iMac KB and mouse, translucent ruby red
iMac 450MHz iMac mainboard
Dual Floppy Macintosh SE
Workgroup Server 95 (may not have the WGS card, I'd have to check, w/o
it's a Quadra 950)
Macintosh IIsi
Macintosh IIcx
Qty 2 Macintosh LCIII
Qty 3 new in box M7600LL/E Airport Card
Qty 2 new in box M8881LL/A Airport Extreme card
Apple IIc power supply
Mini-DIN Mac Modem cable, new
Apple Mac II Power Supply
Apple Design keyboard M2980
Ingram Micro zip/etc tape drive bracket/bezel for Mac 7200/7500/others?
Digital (DEC) Stuff
-------------------
DELNI-BA (see misc section)
Qty 2 Vaxstation 3100 M76
Qty 2 Vaxtation 3100 M38
Qty 1 Vaxstation 3100
Qty 1 VAxstation 3100 (larger enclosure (taller)
Qty 1 AlphaPC64 Motherboard (21A02-A3), in original box, never used, I
bought as new years ago and never used it
Qty 2 Digital LN03 maintenance kits
Qty 3 Digital LN03 toner kits
LN03 font cargridges (LN03X-CY, LN03X-CB, LN03X-CR (qty 2), LN03-SX,
LN03X-CW, LN03X-CR)
Digital LN03 Programmer Reference Manual
Cisco Stuff
-----------
Cisco 1720 w T1 CSU/DSU WIC and power supply
Cisco 3600 1E2T card w T1 CSU/DSU WIC
Cisco 4FE card (74-3188-01)
Cisco PIX515 power supply
Cisco PIX515 fan assemblies
Cisco PIX515 plastics
Toner Cartridges
----------------
Qty 2 HP C4191A black (for 4500/4550)
Qty 2 HP C4194A Yellow (for 4500/4550)
Qty 2 HP C4192A Cyan (for 4500/4550)
Qty 1 HP 98A (for 4/4+/4M/4M+/5/5M/5N)
Qty 1 HP 98A new in open bag (for identification) (for
4/4+/4M/4M+/5/5M/5N)
qty 3 HP 96A (for 2100/2200)
Qty 1 HP C4092A (for 1100/3200)
Qty 1 Brother TN530
Qty 1 Generic Canon SX refilled cartridge
Qty 1 HP 92285A (for Laserjet/LaserJet Plus/LaserJet 500/Apple
LaserWriter I)
Qty 1 EP in open bag new (Laserjet/Laserjet Plus/LaserJet 500/Apple
LaserWriter I)
Qty 1 HP 15X (1200/1220/3300/3380)
Qty 1 HP 12A
(1010/1012/1015/1018/1020/1020plus/1022/3015/3020/3030/3050/3050Z/3052/3055/M1005mfp/M1319mfp)
Qty 1 Xerox 6R902 (same as HP 95A) (Canon SX) (used, remaining toner
amount unknown)
LN03 toner and maintenance kits (see Digital section)
Ink Cargridges
--------------
Qty 3 HP #70 Photo Black (DesignJet Z2100, Z3100)
Qty 2 HP #70 Light Gray
Qty 3 HP #70 Light Cyan
Qty 3 HP #70 Cyan
Qty 2 HP #70 Yellow
Qty 1 HP #70 Light Magenta
Qty 2 HP #70 Magenta
Qty 3 HP #70 Matte Black
Qty 1 HP #97 (C9363W)
Qty 4 Canon 24 Black (S200, S300, i320, i450, i470D, Multipass F10/F20)
Qty 4 Canon 24 Color