- test-drb@ccmp.vtda.org - classiccmp.org

by jeff.kaneko＠juno.com

I grabbed a couple of DSSI controllers thinking they were SCSI (silly me). Anyone have drives for these things smaller than a bar fridge? Anybody *need* one? Jeff ________________________________________________________________ GET INTERNET ACCESS FROM JUNO! Juno offers FREE or PREMIUM Internet access for less! Join Juno today! For your FREE software, visit: http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj.

25 years, 2 months

3
2
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D-116 Mini

by truthanl＠oclc.org

Date: Mon, 07 May 2001 08:27:53 -0400 From: Eric Chomko <chomko(a)greenbelt.com> Subject: D-116 Digital Computer Controls - minicomputer Has anyone ever heard of such a thing. I dug out a manual and a book on the system, and remember working on one years ago. The books are dated 1972-3. The company is out of New Jersey. Anyone one know anything about the D-116 system or about the fate of the company: DCC? Eric Yes Eric, I have a D-116 in my Garage!. It has a a full flank of front panel switches, a tty port and a paper tape machine Mounted in a 5 foot vertical Bud Cabinet. I have a shoebox full of tapes including some Diagnostics. I also have an IBM PC with a 20MB filecard which was used instead of the paper tape as an excerciser/ development program loader. OCLC the online Computer Library Center, where I work, used these as front end processors, to a bank of Tandem Computers. They were the units that ran the polling protocol similar to IBM Bi - Sync, I would e interested in your literature. Could you Scan the Manual or give me some description of it? Sincerely Larry Truthan truthanl(a)oclc.org. I am a "digest subscriber" on classiccmp.org, Please respond to my Email for most direct correspondence.

25 years, 2 months

1
0
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Falcon PLA

by jeff.kaneko＠juno.com

Does anybody know where I could find the programming image for the address decode PLA for the 11/21 FALCON SBC? I need tomake sure that the one I have is original; if not, I'll have to make a new one. ALso, anybody got a boot rom image for this? Thanks-- Jeff ________________________________________________________________ GET INTERNET ACCESS FROM JUNO! Juno offers FREE or PREMIUM Internet access for less! Join Juno today! For your FREE software, visit: http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj.

25 years, 2 months

1
0
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Serious Request For Moderation (On Topic)

by RCini＠congressfinancial.com

I have a simple way of dealing with off-topic items that usually don't interest me (like musings about eBay or gun control)...it's called the <DEL> key. I don't let these tangents concern me as they eventually burn themselves out like an LED that one has connected directly to a 12v power supply. I've been on this list for, what, 4 years now. Everyone will have an opinion on any given topic. It's what gives the list some personality at the expense of some bandwidth. Time for a diversion. OK, let's bash Microsoft... Rich -----Original Message----- From: Ken Seefried [mailto:ken@seefried.com] Sent: Tuesday, May 08, 2001 10:53 AM To: classiccmp(a)classiccmp.org Subject: > Subject: Re: Serious Request For Moderation (On Topic) > From: "Sipke de Wal" <sipke(a)wxs.nl> > > I'll turn to all of you my other cheek while thinking > that this list is in serious need of a MODERATOR > Here, here. Two months on the list, and from what I can see one third of the postings have consisted of rude, ignorant, childish, self-righteous people flaming (pro & con) about eBay, and one third of rude, ignorant, childish, self-righteous people flaming about gun control (pro & con). Barely a quarter of any of the traffic is actaully about classic computers. I might point out for those on the list that clearly enjoy that type of signal-noise ratio, there are *other* places where you can go to vent your spleen dedicated to the topics. Of course, now we'll get two weeks of the same people going back and forth about moderation, and how vitally important and relevant to the classic computer world their opinions about eBay & gun control are, with the associated escalation of insults and derision... Nevermind... Ken

25 years, 2 months

1
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> Subject: Re: Serious Request For Moderation (On Topic)

by ken＠seefried.com

> From: "Sipke de Wal" <sipke(a)wxs.nl> > > I'll turn to all of you my other cheek while thinking > that this list is in serious need of a MODERATOR > Here, here. Two months on the list, and from what I can see one third of the postings have consisted of rude, ignorant, childish, self-righteous people flaming (pro & con) about eBay, and one third of rude, ignorant, childish, self-righteous people flaming about gun control (pro & con). Barely a quarter of any of the traffic is actaully about classic computers. I might point out for those on the list that clearly enjoy that type of signal-noise ratio, there are *other* places where you can go to vent your spleen dedicated to the topics. Of course, now we'll get two weeks of the same people going back and forth about moderation, and how vitally important and relevant to the classic computer world their opinions about eBay & gun control are, with the associated escalation of insults and derision... Nevermind... Ken

25 years, 2 months

1
0
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"Every OS Sucks"

by spectre＠stockholm.ptloma.edu

The great irony is that you can't display this video on anything but the modern OSes that the video alleges "suck" (viz., you need Real-ly Bad Player and/or Windows World Media Domination Player). http://cramsession.brainbuzz.com/video/everyossucks/default.asp?OSsucks=Open -- ----------------------------- personal page: http://www.armory.com/~spectre/ -- Cameron Kaiser, Point Loma Nazarene University * ckaiser(a)stockholm.ptloma.edu -- DON'T PANIC! ---------------------------------------------------------------

25 years, 2 months

1
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Zuse info available on www.zuse.org

by jos.mar＠bluewin.ch

Thos of you interested in Zuse's old work should move to www.zuse.org This site is made by Karl Zuse's son. The site mainly exists to sell a multimedia CD that is upposed to be filled to the brink with information on Karl Zuse's machines, from the mechanical Z1 until the end of the Zuse company. An interesting note : a copy of the Z3 is being made, with modern relais that feature a LED reflecting the relais state. This machine will make the rounds in Germany soon. Jos Dreesen

25 years, 2 months

25
43
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Need help with retrieving data from a DOS 2.11 formated flopp y disk

by Robert_Feldman＠jdedwards.com

Skipped content of type multipart/alternative

25 years, 2 months

1
0
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eBay alert: TI 980B mini and a HUGE IBM drive

by JRichardson＠softwright.co.uk

OK, that has to be the coolest-looking piece of junk I've seen :-) Does anyone have any websites dedicated to all of the huge old oddball stuff like this? Jules > ---------- > From: ip500[SMTP:ip500@home.com] > Sent: 04 May 2001 20:35 > To: classiccmp(a)classiccmp.org > Subject: Re: eBay alert: TI 980B mini and a HUGE IBM drive > > Lay of the crack! Powder is much easier on the memory!! And that was > here, about a month ago. I've got one hanging over my desk on BIG chains > secured to eyebolts into the main joists of the floor above. Good > conversation piece! > Craig > > URL for the pix is: > http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=1235355979 > > "Jeffrey S. Sharp" wrote: > > > > Quoting ip500 <ip500(a)home.com>: > > > IBM drive 1235355979 > > > These were not offered here first > > > > No, but I think I remember someone talking about finding the big IBM > > drives on this list and even posting those same pictures. Or maybe > > that was another list. Or maybe I should lay off the crack... > > > > -- > > Jeffrey S. Sharp > > jss(a)ou.edu >

25 years, 2 months

1
0
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D-116 Digital Computer Controls - minicomputer

by chomko＠greenbelt.com

Has anyone ever heard of such a thing. I dug out a manual and a book on the system, and remember working on one years ago. The books are dated 1972-3. The company is out of New Jersey. Anyone one know anything about the D-116 system or about the fate of the company: DCC? Eric

25 years, 2 months

6
9
0 0

Mac Portable (Was Re: Seriously OT: Firearms)

by pete＠dunnington.u-net.com

On May 7, 0:57, Mike Ford wrote: > >Yes, that 3.6V AA1/2 is rare and OVERPRICED around here. 16.xx to > >20 ea CDN. Still searching for cheaper sources in canada. Must it > > I buy them for about a buck at the swapmeet, maybe not brand brand new, but > not used and typically within the expected 5 year or so shelf life. Plenty > of people sell them new on Ebay for $6, so I don't bother. > > I will mention that I still have a few hunderd of the 4.5v alkalines for $5 > or less in quantity. Mike, are these the same batteries used in the Mac Plus? I can't seem to find any equivalent over here. -- Pete Peter Turnbull Network Manager University of York

25 years, 2 months

2
1
0 0

IBM Series/1

by vance＠ikickass.org

Anyone know where I can get technical docs for this thing? I have a couple of programming manuals, but I would like stuff like service manuals and hardware configuration guides. Peace... Sridhar

25 years, 2 months

2
1
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Computers as weapons

by pete＠dunnington.u-net.com

On May 7, 15:26, James B. DiGriz wrote: > Trying to get in something at least a little on-topic, I've heard of > people being killed accidently by industrial robots and such, or the > prospect of the imminent demise of hospital patients due to script > kiddies screwing around with medical records databases or life support > equipment, but does anyone know of an instance where a computer was used > to kill someone? Including military or intelligence cases? The only documented case I recall immediately is the famous Therac-25 case. This was essentially a case of misdesign, which led to half a dozen deaths. A Google search for "therac" or "leveson" will find plenty of references. Some time ago, when I was doing a course on Software Engineering for Safety Critical Systems, I came across a book with several other reports, but I can't remember the title or author :-( I don't recall any other fatal incidents, though. -- Pete Peter Turnbull Network Manager University of York

25 years, 2 months

3
2
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Need help with retrieving data from a DOS 2.11 formated floppy disk

by pete＠dunnington.u-net.com

On May 7, 14:14, jimmy tsai wrote: > The company I work for has a machine that runs on DOS 2.11 > There are some data on that machine that we need to retrieve. The > information is transfered from that old machine to a 1.44mb floppy. > > When we put the floppy into our pentium winNT4 computer , we can not > read the information on the floppy. The NT os simply says it does not > know what format the files are at. I'm pretty sure 1.44M/HD disks didn't appear until DOS 3. Chances are the old machine has a double-density 720K drive, and if so you really shouldn't be putting 1.44M disks in it (they're a different coercivity). What you end up with is 9 sectors per track on a disk that the newer machine recognises as high density 18 sectors per track, so it tries to read it at double the data rate, and fails to find anything useful. If I'm right, you need to find some proper double density disks, distinguishable by not having the square hole on the right. -- Pete Peter Turnbull Network Manager University of York

25 years, 2 months

1
0
0 0

Trenton State Computer Festival

by pete＠dunnington.u-net.com

On May 7, 13:52, healyzh(a)aracnet.com wrote: > It's not a Computer, but I know for a fact that an HP5MP Laserjet will not > work with 60ns RAM, it wants 70ns RAM (company I bought the RAM from sent > 60ns by mistake). It just plain wouldn't recognize the RAM. That may be because 72-pin SIMMs have 4 sense connections that tell the host the speed and size. 60ns was rare when the 5 came out, and I expect HP didn't include recognition of that code (possibly because it could also mean something much slower -- some codes are re-used, though I can't remember if the 60ns code is). If you changed one link on the SIMM I expect it would work fine -- so long as the SIMM was FPM not EDO. Most of the 60ns SIMMs I've seen are EDO, and that certainly won't work in an HP5M. -- Pete Peter Turnbull Network Manager University of York

25 years, 2 months

1
0
0 0

Emulex QT14 and Fujitsu M2442: Problems writing two or more files on one tape

by hans＠Huebner.ORG

Hi there, I recently acquired a DEC TSV05 QBUS Pertec controller and a Fujitsu 9-Track tape drive. My TSV05 actually is a relabeled Emulex QT14 with a different prom on it - The DEC version only talks TSV05 emulation whereas the QT14 also speaks TMSCP. I've put the controller into my VAX 4000/500A which runs VMS 7.2 The Drive/Controller combo works fine for reading tapes. Writing works as well, but only the first file can be written. Upon trying to write the second file, the drive starts to spin the tape back and forth and then stops, giving the following error message: %COPY-E-WRITEERR, error writing MSA0:[]VMS072.B;1 -RMS-F-WBE, error on write behind -SYSTEM-F-DRVERR, fatal drive error %COPY-W-NOTCMPLT, DUA4:[000,000]VMS072.B;1 not completely copied To me this looks as if the drive has problems writing file marks, or I am doing something wrong. As I do not have any documentation on the drive, I'm asking here: Does anyone know the problem and has a solution for it? Do I need to configure the drive or the controller differently? Are there any VMS paramters I need to modify to get the thing to write multiple files on one tape? Thanks in advance, Hans -- finger hans(a)huebner.org for details

25 years, 2 months

1
0
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Florida Ballot Machines to be Auctioned

by vcf＠siconic.com

Palm Beach to Auction Voting Machines Palm Beach County is selling the voting machines at the center of last year's chad debate to help pay for more modern voting equipment. Supervisor of Elections Theresa LePore says because the Florida Legislature has voted to ban punch card ballots, the county will soon begin selling some or all of its 5,000 Votomatic machines on eBay, the online auction house. Proceeds from the sale will help the county buy voting equipment expected to cost between US$3 million and US$14 million. The state will give the county US$1.9 million. Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org

25 years, 2 months

3
3
0 0

Teradyne PDP-11/84's

by msell＠ontimesupport.com

Hello, I'm looking at the possibility of purchasing an old DEC PDP 11/84 that was part of a Teradyne board test system. Does anyone remember seeing/working with these systems? In particular, I'd like to know: 1) Was it a common DEC PDP 11/84 with DEC markings, in a DEC rack, or was it redone by Teradyne, with their markings and special enclosure? 2) Were there any special firmware modifications that would make this difficult to use as a "regular" PDP 11/84? I'd like to obtain a 11/84 and a 11/34 for use at home for hobby purposes, running a mix of DEC and "other" operating systems, just for novelty. Sorry for the lack of experience in those questions, I've had very little experience with PDP 11's, but I do remember they were nice machines to work with when I did have the chance. Maybe soon I'll have all the time in the world to use one.... : ) - Matt "One World, One Web, One Program" - Microsoft Promotional Ad "Ein Volk, Ein Reich, Ein Fuhrer" - Adolf Hitler Many thanks for this tagline to a fellow RGVAC'er...

25 years, 2 months

1
0
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DEC Collectors Lunch, V1.02

by bob＠jfcl.com

This is a reminder that the second DEC collectors lunch of the season will be held this Saturday, May 12th, at high noon, in the Mountain View Fresh Choice Restaurant. You can find the full details, including a map, on our web page at http://www.jfcl.com/Computers/dcl.htm . The first DCL, held last month, was a great success and we hope to see all the same old faces plus a few new ones this time. Anyone interested in old DEC computers is welcome, so please feel free to forward this invitation to anyone you know who fits that description. Bob Armstrong

25 years, 2 months

1
0
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Free: HP 9000/350 & monitor (working)

by sieler＠allegro.com

Hi, If anyone wants a working HP 9000/350 & color monitor, please let me know. It runs HP-UX 8.0 (IIRC), and X-Windows. It's in Cupertino, CA, and time is of the essence. (I'd prefer to keep back the HP-IB disk drive, or swap it for a somewhat similar HP disk drive, if possible.) thanks, -- Stan Sieler sieler(a)allegro.com www.allegro.com/sieler/wanted/index.html www.sieler.com

25 years, 2 months

4
3
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Can I use pc keyboard on a pc jr

by ibmmacman＠midmaine.com

I have an IBM PC Jr that works but don't have the keyboard with it. is there a way to take an old IBM pc keyboard and make an adapter to make it work on the jr ?

25 years, 2 months

6
5
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Different IBM Model M keyboard

by fernande＠internet1.net

Hello, I like the IBM Model M keyboard. They are very durable, have a good feel, and I can easily find them cheap. Yesterday, I bought one that is a bit different, However. The feel, isn't quite the same, which really surprises me. It's not particularly bad, just a little different. I don't think it is any newer or older than others I have owned. The big difference is not feel, but color! This one has colored keys! I think it is set up for use with Wordperfect, but am unsure. The Shift keys are green, the alts blue, and ctrls are red. Then some of the other keys are a very light yellow, or creamy color and are labeled for different functions. Each of those keys has 4 functions depending if you press the shift, the alt, or ctrl. Unfortunately, I am missing one blue alt key cap :-( Is this factory IBM, or is it a fairly standard Model M with an aftermarket key cap kit? These aren't just stickers like I have seen before. Chad Fernandez Michigan, USA

25 years, 2 months

5
5
0 0

System 36 Rescue?

by ncherry＠home.com

One of my neighbors is tossing a System 36(?) (5632) out in the trash anyone interested? It's located in Central NJ (Turnpike 8A, Monroe Twp) and I can store it for a while. I doubt there is much there and I don't know the condition. -- Linux Home Automation Neil Cherry ncherry(a)home.net http://members.home.net/ncherry (Text only) http://meltingpot.fortunecity.com/lightsey/52 (Graphics) http://linuxha.sourceforge.net/ (SourceForge)

25 years, 2 months

3
2
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eBay alert: TI 980B mini and a HUGE IBM drive

by ip500＠home.com

Trying to follow the suggested format for alerting the list to an "unusual" item on eBay. Just listed a very nice TI 980B ..Lots of lights and switches [no blikenlights however .. it does power up but no action on the panel]. The disk drive is a pull from a 3380E IBM drive cabinet and is by far and away the largest I've ever seen .. probably 130+ pounds. For the HTML impaired among us, item numbers are: TI 980B 1235346938 IBM drive 1235355979 These were not offered here first ... What is the "going" price for either?????? eBay, for all it's supposed faults still seems to be the venue of choice for odd and/or unique items. Craig

25 years, 2 months

12
33
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System 36 Rescue?

by mcguire＠neurotica.com

On May 6, Neil Cherry wrote: > One of my neighbors is tossing a System 36(?) (5632) out in the trash anyone > interested? It's located in Central NJ (Turnpike 8A, Monroe Twp) and I can > store it for a while. I doubt there is much there and I don't know the > condition. About how large is this system? I might be able to give it a home within the next couple of weeks. -Dave McGuire

25 years, 2 months

2
1
0 0

Memory.

by geoffr＠zipcon.net

Is there anyone out there that needs 4164 or 41256 (64Kx1 and 256Kx1) DIP ram? I'm going through some of my old stuff and found some sleeves of 64 and 256K drams.

25 years, 2 months

1
0
0 0

Mac Portable (Was Re: Seriously OT: Firearms)

by jhellige＠earthlink.net

>Can we get back ON TOPIC and talk old computers, such as how to coax a dead >mac portable to power up? I have one and can get a cracking sound out of the >speaker but nothing else. Also, try this page for some additional info: http://www.geocities.com/SiliconValley/Heights/3959/index.html Jeff -- Collector of Classic Microcomputers and Video Game Systems: Home of the TRS-80 Model 2000 FAQ File http://www.geocities.com/siliconvalley/lakes/6757

25 years, 2 months

1
0
0 0

o-scope

by ajp166＠bellatlantic.net

From: Jim Strickland <jim(a)calico.litterbox.com> >> Probe compensation is off or the amplifier (vertical) are misadjusted >> internally. > >Ookay, how do I fix this? Is there an adjustment screw inside? And if so, >any recommendations on what not to touch so I live through the experience? :) Touch nothing. You require the manual and some aid/experience in adjusting something like the vertical amp. FYI there is serious HV inside scopes. Be careful. Allison

25 years, 2 months

2
1
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o-scope

by ajp166＠bellatlantic.net

From: Jim Strickland <jim(a)calico.litterbox.com> >So I'm a 'scope newbie, does the probe impedance (13 pf) have to match the >rating on the jack on the scope (47 pf) for the waves coming out of the >calibration jack to be properly square? And if so, does anyone have a source >for probes that work with ancient scopes like this? No not required to match. That specification is the capacitance presented across the input jack along with the scopes input resistance (usually 1megohm). Most scope probes have an adjustment to compensate for this and therefor it's not a problem. >Other than the waveform distortion (at worst the square waves wind up looking >like shark teeth, and at best they're a bit sloped on the leading and top >edges) the scope seems to work fine as far as I can tell. Probe compensation is off or the amplifier (vertical) are misadjusted internally. A square wave on that series should look square. Allison

25 years, 2 months

3
2
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How many transistors in the 6502 processor?

by ajp166＠bellatlantic.net

I'd heard, four bits in four packages. Allison -----Original Message----- From: Fred Cisin (XenoSoft) <cisin(a)xenosoft.com> To: classiccmp(a)classiccmp.org <classiccmp(a)classiccmp.org> Date: Sunday, May 06, 2001 3:26 PM Subject: Re: How many transistors in the 6502 processor? >On Sun, 6 May 2001, Mike Ford wrote: >> My guess is that 68000 as a name had a lot to do with adding a zero to 6800. > >I have been told several times that the 4004 was named after being the >equivalent of 4004 transistors. I don't believe that. But what WAS the >origin of the name? > >

25 years, 2 months

2
1
0 0

o-scope

by jim＠calico.litterbox.com

It's not a computer, but it's surely over 10 years old... I got a scope today, a Tektronix either a 535a or 545a according to the operator's handbook in the little hidey hole in the top of the case. (which I'll gladly scan if anyone wants a copy). So I'm a 'scope newbie, does the probe impedance (13 pf) have to match the rating on the jack on the scope (47 pf) for the waves coming out of the calibration jack to be properly square? And if so, does anyone have a source for probes that work with ancient scopes like this? Also, how do I tell a 535a from a 545a? Other than the waveform distortion (at worst the square waves wind up looking like shark teeth, and at best they're a bit sloped on the leading and top edges) the scope seems to work fine as far as I can tell. Also, can anyone recommend a good book on scope use for newbies? -- Jim Strickland jim(a)DIESPAMMERSCUMcalico.litterbox.com ----------------------------------------------------------------------- BeOS Powered! -----------------------------------------------------------------------

25 years, 2 months

3
3
0 0

Interesting show on the Computer Garage

by Lee.Davison＠merlincommunications.com

> England doesn't allow guns, and look at the mess they're in. Huh? What mess? > Guns kill plenty of people, sure. Guns don't kill people, people with guns kill people. Lee. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- ---- This email is intended only for the above named addressee(s). The information contained in this email may contain information which is confidential. The views expressed in this email are personal to the sender and do not in any way reflect the views of the company. If you have received this email and you are not a named addressee please delete it from your system and contact Merlin Communications International IT Department on +44 20 7344 5888. ________________________________________________________________________ This message has been checked for all known viruses, by Star Internet, delivered through the MessageLabs Virus Control Centre. For further information visit: http://www.star.net.uk/stats.asp

25 years, 2 months

2
1
0 0

+ and - on HP21 calculator?

by cmcmanis＠mcmanis.com

Hi, I've got an HP-21 that is missing the battery pack. Does anyone know which pin is plus and which minus when you look at the calculator from the back, with the AC adapter plug facing up? I can probably synthesize a battery pack with a couple of AA NiCd cells but wouldn't want to hook it up backwards. There are two contacts at the "back" of the battery box for the cells and it would be useful to know this info ... --Chuck

25 years, 2 months

3
5
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How many transistors in the 6502 processor?

by ajp166＠bellatlantic.net

From: Davison, Lee <Lee.Davison(a)merlincommunications.com> > >I've never heard of mos-multi-emitter-transistors > >Just etch multiple mos structures and have a common gate. Tie drains and >sources as required. > >Lee. Very common, also devices were split and run in parallel as two smaller devices were faster or had better characteristics then one larger one. On silicon designs rarely translate to discrete beyond the early parts. Allison

25 years, 2 months

1
0
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Allison: 2910c version of z80 and FPGAs - a little O/T

by ajp166＠bellatlantic.net

From: Richard Erlacher <edick(a)idcomm.com> >rather, the old solid 8's or 11's. Emanuel once told me there are a couple of >makers of PDP-11 look-alikes that work well enough to be of interest. Like the Mentec, they have the license and make cpu/systems to go with the OS. Some are quite fast compared the the 1978 gold standard (PDP-11/70). >From the other standpoint I can easily fine PDP-11/23s and even 11/73 or 11/83 series machines making the effort somewhat moot. People have done PDP-8s for "lab projects" for years and at least one was packed in to two arrays (cpu, memory and IO!) on a board small enough to barely hide a 3.5" drive. The problem is PDP-8 is not a rom friendly design from the start. PDP-11 is better there but much of the stuff out there wants for RAM, excluding the unique code for the Falcon and later class SBCs. Allison

25 years, 2 months

1
0
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For Sale: DEC System 5000 Memory Boards

by markn＠mr2.net

hi Folks... i have 8 memory boards salvaged from a DECSystem 5000, each board contains 78 TC511000AJ-10 chips (39 on each side). These are untested, although they came from a working system and have been kept in anti-static bags since removal. please email me with offers, i'm in the UK so i'd prefer to sell them only in the UK... although i will ship internationally if it's worth it. there's a picture of a board at: http://www.daneel.demon.co.uk/auctionimages/decmemory.jpg many thanks mark ======================= Mark Nias http://www.mr2.net http://www.marknias.com =======================

25 years, 2 months

1
0
0 0

XiLinx XC40xx-PC84

by Lee.Davison＠merlincommunications.com

> I found a dozen or so Xilinx protoboards, size of a punch card half of it > open, 2 digit display, couple buttons, some kind of serial looking > connection, runs off a 9v battery, big socket in the middle > with a square chip in it of the same name. It's an XC4003A demo board and it came with tools, demo projects and a cable to hook it to your PC to program it. The idea was you could see how easy FPGA use was and then you'd buy 1000s of them for your next project. I have the chip datasheet, it's available from freetradezone.com > Who wants one for $5 and shipping, on the condition they figure out what it > is and report back? Do I qualify for the $5 card? 8^)= Lee. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- ---- This email is intended only for the above named addressee(s). The information contained in this email may contain information which is confidential. The views expressed in this email are personal to the sender and do not in any way reflect the views of the company. If you have received this email and you are not a named addressee please delete it from your system and contact Merlin Communications International IT Department on +44 20 7344 5888. ________________________________________________________________________ This message has been checked for all known viruses, by Star Internet, delivered through the MessageLabs Virus Control Centre. For further information visit: http://www.star.net.uk/stats.asp

25 years, 2 months

2
1
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Allison: 2910c version of z80 and FPGAs - a little O/T

by ajp166＠bellatlantic.net

From: Richard Erlacher <edick(a)idcomm.com> >There's been so much unwarranted (IMHO) skepticism about the ability to transfer >a solid DEC CPU design into CPLD/FPGA that I'd really like to see someone try >it. The DEC folks didn't often do the wierd things that make circuits act There are several PDP-8s outther on FPGAs and there is nothing to say others would not be doable save for maybe enough gates (CPLDs) to do the job. >fix the older designs so they'd work fine in current technology, and probably >MUCH faster. I'm not interested in DEC stuff myself, but the fact that there Potential for speed is definately there using newer technology. >are several manufacturers making logical equivalents of the DEC CPU's today Well most of them are doing it from DEC mask sets under license. I presume you mean Alpha and PDP-11 (11/93 class). >yield 150), you'll get it done. Once the design is entered, simulated, >synthesized, simulated and tested as implemented, there's room for fixes. The If you dont simulate and test the sim you will likely fail. Allison

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ewy

by Demon02554＠aol.com

if ewy sees this email me...i lost your address thanks, Robert Cobbins

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Allison: 2910c version of z80

by ajp166＠bellatlantic.net

From: Chuck McManis <cmcmanis(a)mcmanis.com> >tools are *free*. You do have to take the time to learn VHDL but so far the >payoff has been worth it for me. I'm having a blast with this thing. My VHDL.... that was the cost I refer to. Most of me design experience is pre VHDL availbility. I already have the Lattice Synario and that bends my mind greatly. I havent used the small 2064 and 3030 FPGAs I have a good handful of yet. Time is costly for me these days. >"final" is a PDP-8 w/ Serial terminal (think DECMate in a single chip) with >full lights and switches. This chip can do that easily. I don't think it Major cool. My personal "I'd like to do" is a 32 bit wide '8 by grafting another 20 bits to the right side of the word and running it fast. Same instrcution set and the left 5 bits would remain the same. I'd use all 32 bits for OPR instructions to eliminate decoding (one per bit) and simplify the IOT interface some. Obviously the page (formerly 128 words) would be much bigger but direct addressing of 256MW out of a 4gb address space wouldn't be a significant shortcomming. I doubt I'd need to do the EMA. ;) Allison

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How many transistors in the 6502 processor?

by Lee.Davison＠merlincommunications.com

>I've never heard of mos-multi-emitter-transistors Just etch multiple mos structures and have a common gate. Tie drains and sources as required. Lee. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- ---- This email is intended only for the above named addressee(s). The information contained in this email may contain information which is confidential. The views expressed in this email are personal to the sender and do not in any way reflect the views of the company. If you have received this email and you are not a named addressee please delete it from your system and contact Merlin Communications International IT Department on +44 20 7344 5888. ________________________________________________________________________ This message has been checked for all known viruses, by Star Internet, delivered through the MessageLabs Virus Control Centre. For further information visit: http://www.star.net.uk/stats.asp

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Fwd: Classic Computer Collection

by jhellige＠earthlink.net

Here's an email I received this morning that I thought I"d pass on. If interested, please reply to the original sender. Jeff >Status: U >From: "gen" <gen(a)webline.plus.com> >To: <jhellige(a)earthlink.net> >Subject: Classic Computer Collection >Date: Sun, 6 May 2001 15:44:58 +0100 >X-Priority: 3 > >Hi there > >I got your email address from the internet. > >I have a substantial collection of 'antique' computers, mostly 'first >editions' of systems such as Apple, IBM, Sirius, Apricot, Macintosh, Epson, >etc. These are not old and used, they are in pristine condition in their >original boxes with manuals, software & literature. In particular I have an >original Mac (128), 512K, MacPlus, 1st Mac II, Apple //e, //c, software, >collectables, etc. >Would you know of anyone interested in buying any of these items? I am >based in the UK. > >Regards -- Collector of Classic Microcomputers and Video Game Systems: Home of the TRS-80 Model 2000 FAQ File http://www.geocities.com/siliconvalley/lakes/6757

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For Trade: PDP-11/23

by norm.anheier＠pnl.gov

I have a PDP-11/23 in a BA-23 enclosure (for example see: http://www.telnet.hu/hamster/pdp-11/kepek/updp1123.jpg). I rescued this >from a recycler. Anyone interested in this, I don't collect full systems -- yet! I am willing to part this out if you need something specific. Unfortunately the case is cracked and the front and back bezels and the processor and coprocessor chips are gone. Everything else is there. I have no idea what components are functional. It would be great if someone has some use for this, otherwise its going back to the recycler. Any trades for oldprocessor chips would be appreciated. Also, I frequently see old minicomputers, such as the PDP-11 at the scrapyard. I have no idea what is common and what is on everyones most wanted list. Anyone have any pointers to such a "most wanted list"? Thanks Norm

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Allison: 2910c version of z80

by ajp166＠bellatlantic.net

From: Richard Erlacher <edick(a)idcomm.com> >3000A and 3100 series. My old XACT tools unfortunately don't support it either, >however, as the tools I bought only went through the 2K series. I've been >unable to find the dongle for that, however, though I don't miss it. The copy of XACT and earlier tools I can use for the 2064s runs fine on dos wothout a dongle. >The OS under which the XILINX tools seem to run best, at least according to >their tech support folks, is Win98, though they claim it runs just as well under >NT4. I see essentially no difference, myself. There are new tools for LINUX, I've run Synario under W95 and WinNT4 without problems. >by the way, though I don't know how well they work or are supported at XILINX. >They are VERY generous with support, however, once you've bought into their >tools, even though I only bought the cheapest set. Yes, they are good but not so cheap. >I'd not be afraid to give the SPARTAN series a try for building an experimental >version of a '70's-'80's generation CPU. They are relatively (choke) >inexpensive and available in versions with sufficient on-board RAM that you >might not need the higher pin counts required to interface external memory. >Unfortunately, the high-pin-count parts are hard to prototype. The real problem is making/buying a protobaord for the high pin count, that and time to actually do it. I know there are plenty of parts out ther that can and many different tools. Allison

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How many transistors in the 6502 processor?

by ajp166＠bellatlantic.net

From: Brian Chase <bdc(a)world.std.com> >Nice, now if I could only get enough info to implement one in TTL. :-) >Silly, yes, but it would be a fun project. Well you know the timing, instruction set, internal organization and register set... what else do you need? Granted VHDL would be nice but the internal circuit schmatics as built are anything but TTL. The biggest difference from the mos version going ttl would likely result in is a static register cells instead of dynamic making the result fully stopable. Allison

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Allison: 2910c version of z80

by ajp166＠bellatlantic.net

From: Heinz Wolter <h.wolter(a)sympatico.ca> >AMD did have an Ap note on the 2901's that described >a then fast (I think about 4mhz) version of the 8080. At 4mhz that was 2x standard 8080 speed. Hitting 8mhz with (the 1981 parts) with 2901s as Z80 was hard and that was only 2x. Within a year (1982) there would be 6mhz z80s and by 1984ish 8mhz z80s. >IDT later made much faster versions of the 2901 and 2910- >in CMOS and they were I recall about twice as fast. 2901's Foo, the 2910 was only soso. Would have liked a faster 2902 or 2911. >a nice Virtex or Spartan fpga will fit a whole processor >with up to 1mbit or sram on chip. Far more interesting, out of my range of tools to do. Allison

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o-scope

by djg＠drs-esg.com

From: Jim Strickland <jim(a)calico.litterbox.com> >So I'm a 'scope newbie, does the probe impedance (13 pf) have to match the >rating on the jack on the scope (47 pf) for the waves coming out of the >calibration jack to be properly square? And if so, does anyone have a source >for probes that work with ancient scopes like this? > Most probes can be adjusted to work with a range of capacitance, they normally have a little adjustment hole at the end that attaches to the scope. Adjust it for the flattest trace. >Also, how do I tell a 535a from a 545a? > Look above the CRT and see if it says TYPE 535 or TYPE 545? I assume this is a big old tube scope, if not ignore the rest. >From Oscilloscopes, Selecting and Restoring a Classic by Stan Griffiths the 535A is 15MHz bandpass 5MHz trigger. 545A 33 MHz bandpass 5 MHz trigger. Bandpass may be less depending on what plugin is installed. I have a 547 (50 MHz bandpass and trigger) which I use to maintain my PDP-8's. Mine is a nice scopes but can be a little temperamental. Depending on what you are using it for the limited bandwidth (especially trigger) may be an issue. David Gesswein http://www.pdp8.net/ -- Run an old computer with blinkenlights

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TVs Undercurrents report on JIMs computer garage/classic computer collecting, who wants to see this?

by claudew＠videotron.ca

Hi all I taped the re-braodcast of this today. I am thinking of transfering this to a multimedia file and dumping it somewhere, it's about 5-10 minutes and does not go indept on the "hobby" but it's kinda fun and I think Jim has a few good "quotes" in there...about the hobby, computers and the vintage "market".... Now I only have to check to see if I have something around here to transfer this to a file... Claude http://computer_collector.tripod.com

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How many transistors in the 6502 processor?

by ajp166＠bellatlantic.net

From: Mike Cheponis <mac(a)Wireless.Com> Reordered your list by transistor count and added caveats... >From Microprocessor Report, in chronological order: > >8008: 3.5K transistors 14 mm^2 >1802: 5K transistors 27 mm^2 if 1802 were done in Nmos it would have been far lower transistor count. As it is CMOS there are many cases in the logic where two complmentary transistors exist where NMOS would have used one. It is also the ONLY one on the list that was fully static logic. Its registers used a lot of transistors as the raw flipflop. >6502: 4K transistors 21 mm^2 fewer transistors and also a clever design made for an easy mask that had good yeild for the die size. >6800: 4.1K transistors 16 mm^2 >8080: 4.8K transistors 20 mm^2 >8085: 6.5K transistors 20 mm^2 >Z80: 8.5K transistors 18 mm^2 >6809: 9K transistors 21 mm^2 >Z8001 17.5K transistors 39 mm^2 >8086: 29K transistors 33 mm^2 >8088: 29K transistors 33 mm^2 >68000 68K transistors 44 mm^2 >I really hate to interrupt this group's speculation with actual data, but >I'm weird in that way. Thanks, it's not as if the data was a top secret. Allison

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How many transistors in the 6502 processor?

by ajp166＠bellatlantic.net

From: Richard Erlacher <edick(a)idcomm.com> No question the 6502 was fewer gates than z80/6800 as that was the guys to chase. The 8080 was hard to hit as the 8080 required so much more external support that any of the 5V only cpus. It would be more fair to compare 6502 to 8085 in the gate count and die size derby. >believe the 650x core with only four internal software-accessible registers >(A,X,Y, SP) would have a substantially lower gate count than a Z80, which has >lots of register resources, (A,B,C,D,E,H,L,IX,IY,SP, plus a second set of the >same) and it does, but nowhere near the ratio that these registers suggest. Of >course there are several ways of looking at the definition of "gate" but it's Think of registers as memory bits... Z80 those number about 208 where 6502 has far fewer. However this is relative as a register can be one transistor and cap (dynamic) or a lot more for static. I believe the 6602 was a dynamic machine like many of the time. >odd that the ratio of gates consumed by each of these cores doesn't approach the >>2:1 that this estimate reflects. The production level pricing, basically a >cost based on silicon by the pound, seems to reflect this same ratio as do the >comparisons of the era when the 6502 was current. Whats not relected is the associated gating and silicon busses. Those eat logic and realestate as they are often less regular. >What would be interesting, since it's conspicuously absent from the list quoted >below, is the transistor count in the 6802 (a 6800 with internal clock >generator) and 6809. Yes, those should be there. Allison

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