- test-drb@ccmp.vtda.org - classiccmp.org

by kylevowen＠gmail.com

Just thought I'd share with you all one of my pet projects for the past few years. I have written an HP-35 and HP-45 simulator for the PDP-8, which uses the original microcode from these calculators. Thus, it is just as accurate as the original calculators, I would believe. Not really sure why I decided to do this, but I suppose I enjoy both HP calculators and PDP-8 programming. I guess it's nice to have a scientific calculator at one's disposal too while sitting in front of a PDP-8, too. It also shows that something like this could've existed back in the early 1970s if one were so inclined to do it. Perhaps it's also a bit of homage to the Expensive Desk Calculator for the TX-0 and PDP-1. Anyways, you can grab the code from here: https://github.com/drovak/hpcalcpdp8 The HP-45 support is new as of the past couple of days; I went ahead and through in a help function to explain the keys. Toggle between 4XXX and 0XXX on the switch register to toggle between HP-45 and HP-35 modes, respectively. Feel free to give feedback; I've tested it fairly extensively in SimH with no major issues other than no error indication on the HP-35. I have a debug mode which prints each register every instruction cycle, but I haven't used it too much in recent times; I went ahead and IFDEF'ed it as it also reads from the switch register. OS/8 support will come soon, as that shouldn't be challenging. You need 8k to run this, though I also uploaded my original hp35pdp8.pal code which runs in 4k. It lacks the help function (and obviously the HP-45 simulator), but otherwise, works pretty much the same. Big thanks to Eric Smith for his 'nonpareil' work which inspired much of the simulator. Kyle

9 years, 9 months

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changing Subject header in thread [was Re: Ill-considered complaints [was: RE: early networking (was Re: G4 cube (was Re: 68K Macs with MacOS 7.5 still in production use...))]]

by spacewar＠gmail.com

Rich Alderson wrote: > Actually, Mr. Cook, the standard for the last 35 years or so has been to > change the subject line, with the old subject in SQUARE BRACKETS with the > characters "was: " prepended. Any decent newsreader or threading mail > reader knows how to deal with that, and threading is unbroken. What was > broken in the messages about which you complain is the substitution of > parentheses () for brackets []. I had no idea that there was a standard. Is it in an RFC or something? I've commonly seen either parenthesis or square brackets used, and I've normally used parenthesis myself, but if there's a documented standard, I'll consider switching.

9 years, 9 months

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Internet of Things (was Re: Linux at 25)

by spacewar＠gmail.com

Chuck Guzis wrote: > I was a bit surprised to > find that my home thermostat was running BusyBox. Cameron Kaiser wrote: > s/surprised/alarmed/ > Remember, it's going to be the Internet of Pwned Things before too long. Unfortunately most people elide the first two letters of the initialism, leaving only "IoT". It is actually the "Insecure Dangerous Internet of Things".

9 years, 9 months

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PDP-8 Code Optimization (was Re: HP-35/45 Simulator for PDP-8)

by kylevowen＠gmail.com

On Tue, Sep 13, 2016 at 3:38 PM, Doug Ingraham <dpi at dustyoldcomputers.com> wrote: > > Thanks for an interesting bit of optimization! Need some more optimization fun? :) Vince and I were working on some code to add two signed 12 bit numbers and detect overflow, returning MAX_INT or MIN_INT in AC in the case of overflow, or the sum in AC otherwise. Here's what Vince came up with so far: CHKOVF, 0 TAD OVFA /GET A TAD OVFB /ADD B DCA OVFSUM /SAVE IT TAD OVFA /A XOR B AND OVFB CMA IAC TAD OVFA TAD OVFB SPA CLA /IF SIGNS DIFFER... JMP NOPROB /WE'RE DONE TAD OVFA /MIGHT BE OVERFLOW, A XOR SUM AND OVFSUM CMA IAC TAD OVFA TAD OVFSUM SMA /DID WE OVERFLOW (DIFFERENT SIGNS)? JMP NOPROB /NO, NO PROBLEM CLA CLL CMA RAR /YES, AC=3777 (MAX INT) DCA OVFSUM /SAVE IT TAD OVFA /GET THE SIGN OF CORRECT RESULT SPA CLA /SHOULD IT BE NEGATIVE? ISZ OVFSUM /YES, 3777 -> 4000 (MIN INT) NOPROB, CLA /GET CORRECTED SUM TAD OVFSUM JMP I CHKOVF /OUTTA HERE OVFA, 0 OVFB, 0 OVFSUM, 0 This tests the signs of both numbers; if they differ, there's no chance of overflow. If they're the same, it checks the signs of the augend with the sum; if they differ, an overflow occurred, and MAX_INT or MIN_INT will be returned depending on the sign of the augend. We tried clever tricks previously, using SNL/SZL and SMA/SPA after shifting the sign of the augend into the link and keeping the addend in the AC, but found these to be longer. Kyle

9 years, 9 months

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G4 cube (was Re: 68K Macs with MacOS 7.5 still in production use...)

by rlloken＠telus.net

On Tue, 13 Sep 2016, Liam Proven wrote: > Whereas my Mac mini has 3rd party RAM and both an SSD and an HD > (upgrades from a Toshiba desktop-replacement notebook that the Mac > replaced) on a 3rd party bracket, and I'm using a Dell 5-button mouse > and an Apple Extended keyboard from '97 or so, on a 3rd-party ADB-USB > adaptor. And a pair of mismatched 2nd hand 23" LCDs. ... > And with the original '80s keyboard, it _feels_ (and sounds) like a > proper (i.e. '80s) Mac when I'm typing on it. :-) My Mac Mini has been treated to new modern keyboard purchased at rediculous expense upon the recommendation of my long time friend G.L.Nerenberg II. And it says underneath "WASD Model: V2 Type: Cherry MX Green". It is gloriously noisy! I have an aluminum Apple keyboard in the box this keyboard came out of, those Apple chicklet keyboard are just plain horrible. -- Richard Loken VE6BSV, Systems Programmer - VMS : "...underneath those Athabasca University : tuques we wear, our Athabasca, Alberta Canada : heads are naked!" ** rlloken at telus.net ** : - Arthur Black

9 years, 9 months

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bitsavers FP11-B schem: M8115-0-01 sheets 1 and 2 missing?

by fritzm＠fritzm.org

Hi all, I?m working on debugging an FP11-B floating point option in a PDP-11/45. I?ve just discovered that in the engineering drawings for this on bitsavers, sheets 1 and 2 of the FRL board prints are missing :-( Does anybody have a complete set of FP11-B drawings? I can work around the missing sheets if I have to because sheet 1 is just the IC layout sheet and sheet 2 is probably quite similar to sheet 3, but it sure would be convenient to have the whole set? cheers, ?-FritzM.

9 years, 9 months

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Telnet was Re: G4 cube (was Re: 68K Macs with MacOS 7.5 still in production use...)

by cliendo＠gmail.com

Agree. It's quite easy to telnet to a port to see if you get a response. Do it a lot. > Are ifconfig, netstat, traceroute, et al really insecure? (Maybe a case > could be made for traceroute) These types of changes to the core of > userland are epic dumb IMHO. Telnet is very useful for debugging, and > certainly dropping telnetd is a good thing - which everyone has done.

9 years, 9 months

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G4 cube (was Re: 68K Macs with MacOS 7.5 still in production use...)

by glen.slick＠gmail.com

On Sep 13, 2016 9:16 AM, "Al Kossow" <aek at bitsavers.org> wrote: > > I've been working on archiving documentation and firmware from microprocessor > based CRT terminals for a couple of months, since I realized they are disappearing > the same way CRT monitors have. Did you ever get any Motorola EXORterm docs that were mentioned here? http://www.vcfed.org/forum/showthread.php?44638-Motorola-EXORciser/page4

9 years, 9 months

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Logic Analyser Advice

by mark＠markesystems.com

> I finally managed to pick up a logic analyser for a price I could justify. > It is a HP1630G and it comes with a number of pods. However the pods do > not > seem to have the actual wires/probes. Is there a separate part number for > these that I should look for. There seem to be quite a few items like > this: > http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/291753390848, are these likely to be suitable > alternatives? Sign seen on an HP logic analyzer at a local swap meet: HP 1630G Logic Analyzer: $10 Complete set of probes: $500 ~~ Mark Moulding

9 years, 9 months

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Recovering 4mm tar tapes

by dj.taylor4＠comcast.net

I have a pair of 4mm DDS tapes from 1999 that I would like to recover. I was able to read one with tar on a Debian (jessie) Linux system, but the second gives an error. The tape that I could read is a Sony with DDS markings and 4 bars next to the DDS logo. It was written on an SGI computer. I was able to read this with a simple tar -xvf /dev/st0 command. The second tape is a 3M brand with DDS markings and 4 bars next to the DDS logo. It also has 'Media Recognition System' and DD-90 written on it. Here is the dialog and error: root at T5400deb:/home/taylor/4mm_tar_1998# lsscsi [0:0:4:0] disk codesrc SCSI2SD 4.2 /dev/sdc [0:0:5:0] disk codesrc SCSI2SD 4.2 /dev/sdd [0:0:6:0] tape ARCHIVE 4326XX 27871-XXX 0324 /dev/st0 [3:0:0:0] disk ATA WDC WD800JD-75MS 1E04 /dev/sda [3:0:1:0] cd/dvd PLDS DVD+-RW DH-16A6S YD11 /dev/sr0 [4:0:0:0] disk ATA ST500DM002-1BD14 KC45 /dev/sdb root at T5400deb:/home/taylor/4mm_tar_1998# mt -f /dev/st0 status drive type = 114 drive status = 318767616 sense key error = 0 residue count = 0 file number = 0 block number = 0 root at T5400deb:/home/taylor/4mm_tar_1998# tar -xvf /dev/st0 tar: /dev/st0: Cannot read: Input/output error tar: At beginning of tape, quitting now tar: Error is not recoverable: exiting now The tape drive is a Seagate CTD8000R-S with COMPAQ markings. There are 5 jumpers to configure the drive and one is for MRS which the jumper config page I have says it is enabled (Default), however the pins are missing for that option. What does that mean? (None of the config jumpers were installed for the tape that I could read) Is the 2nd tape just bad and can't be read? Or do I need a slightly different tape drive? Doug

9 years, 9 months

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68K Macs with MacOS 7.5 still in production use...

by vintagecomputer＠bettercomputing.net

Man I remember when the Cube came out.. I saw one on display at an Apple store with 23 inch Cinema display. ?Man I wanted one badly. ?But wayyyy too much money. ?Definitely want one for my collection. ?Probably not too expensive now. Sent from my Samsung device -------- Original message -------- From: George Rachor <george.rachor at gmail.com> Date: 2016-09-11 8:09 PM (GMT-08:00) To: "General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts" <cctalk at classiccmp.org> Subject: Re: 68K Macs with MacOS 7.5 still in production use... My wife and I purchased the G4 cube, monitor, as well as enhanced sound package.? It?s primary? purchase was using it as a music server and some games.? My wife was working with Apple II e?s and very early Mac?s at the time. Over time I had to replace a failing hard drive. I retired it last week as I couldn?t put a modern browser on it.? The last few years I used it for only music. Retire means I?m packing it up to put in a dust proof container and placed in storage. Not looking to get rid of it but will obviously will someday. Not really vintage but it has served a long and happy life. George Rachor Hillsboro, Oregon george at rachors.com > On Sep 11, 2016, at 6:35 PM, Chris Hanson <cmhanson at eschatologist.net> wrote: > > What do you mean by ?retired,? and what kind of setup did you have for it? > >? -- Chris > >> On Sep 11, 2016, at 11:10 AM, George Rachor <george.rachor at gmail.com> wrote: >> >> I just retired my G4 cube (still working).? Replaced it with a NOT NEW iMac. >> >> George Rachor >> george at rachors.com <mailto:george at rachors.com> >> >> >>> On Sep 11, 2016, at 7:16 AM, Liam Proven <lproven at gmail.com> wrote: >>> >>> http://arstechnica.com/civis/viewtopic.php?p=30456459#p30456459 >>> >>> Found via: >>> >>> http://arstechnica.com/apple/2016/09/an-os-9-odyssey-why-do-some-mac-users-… >>> >>> -- >>> Liam Proven ? Profile: http://lproven.livejournal.com/profile >>> Email: lproven at cix.co.uk ? GMail/G+/Twitter/Flickr/Facebook: lproven >>> MSN: lproven at hotmail.com ? Skype/AIM/Yahoo/LinkedIn: liamproven >>> Cell/Mobiles: +44 7939-087884 (UK) ? +420 702 829 053 (?R) >> >

9 years, 9 months

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G4 cube (was Re: 68K Macs with MacOS 7.5 still in production use...)

by rlloken＠telus.net

Mark, I strongly support the addition of Oscar to your Mac Pro. -- Richard Loken VE6BSV, Systems Programmer - VMS : "...underneath those Athabasca University : tuques we wear, our Athabasca, Alberta Canada : heads are naked!" ** rlloken at telus.net ** : - Arthur Black

9 years, 9 months

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Recovering 4mm tar tapes

by cruff＠ruffspot.net

> On Sep 12, 2016, at 11:00 AM, cctech-request at classiccmp.org wrote: > > Is the 2nd tape just bad and can't be read? Or do I need a > slightly different tape drive? It may be bad or perhaps it was written with a larger block size? I don?t recall what tar does if the tape was written with a record size larger than the default. You might try using dd if=/dev/st0 bs=65532 of=... on the tape to see if you can read it at all. I don?t recall what the maximum record size on these tapes are, but it seems like it isn?t a full 65KiB. Also, make sure the drive is not configured for fixed block mode.

9 years, 9 months

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Classic computer get together in Lower Mainland, BC, Canada

by azd30＠telus.net

Hi, This might only be of interest to people in the Pacific North West. We are starting a new retro-computer club in Chilliwack, BC. Both Rob C, and myself have a pretty good collection of 'classic' computers and rather than having them sit in a basement collecting dust, we thought we'd bring them out on a monthly basis for show and tells and demos... We are planning on making this a monthly meeting. I plan on bringing an ATARI 130XE w/1050 and an SD2SIO card, and the ATARI Assembler to demonstrate some 6502 ML programming, a minimal PDP11/23 in a H9281-BA enclosure (CPU, memory and DLV11 to power up to ODT) and a GrID tablet computer Rob C (who set this whole thing up) will be bringing: >I was thinking I would bring out some of the micro-controllers I have been using, together with my >ATMega based home brew computer that I have been building. I was also thinking of bringing >out my retro-chip tune tracker PC that I built and do a music demo. Meeting details: CHILLIWACK RETRO-COMPUTING CLUB 7:00PM September 22, 2016 Sardis (FVRL) Library 5819 Tyson Road, Sardis, BC We also have an email and a FB group set up (web site coming soon): chilliwackretro (at) gmail (dot) com www.facebook.com/chilliwackretro cheers -- alex

9 years, 9 months

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OpenVMS manuals (Grey wall + HP) available, Windermere UK

by mark＠wickensonline.co.uk

Greetings I have a set of OpenVMS 7.3 era manuals available (grey wall). They are located in Windermere, UK. At the moment I am unable to ship them due to lack of packing materials so it would be either via collection or by an arrangement. The manuals are generally in good condition. I can get a list together if anyone is interested. I also have a large numbr of HP/Compaq softbound manuals which came as a set also available. Please email me direct if interested. I am the organiser of declegacy.org.uk so if you want to come along on October 15th-16th and collect them you've got a reason to visit Windermere. Please feel free to pass this message on to anyone you think might be interested. Regards, Mark. ----- End forwarded message -----

9 years, 9 months

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obscure forgoten Machean of Europe?

by tdk.knight＠gmail.com

I've got the model for the Phillips p1000 love to get more stuff to go with it. Got the paper cut out scan someone sent me a while back. Came across this doing my once every few months search https://aconit.inria.fr/omeka/items/show/595 http://amitrtlu.free.fr/guirimand/G3d.htm What other obscure European Machean are out there? All seems we see is HP and Dec mostly talked about yet we forget about allot of others and the thread about that random lot of military grade Machean the chm called junk trash didn't want got me thinking

9 years, 9 months

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Using a modern USB joystick on a vintage computer (Atari compatible)

by mark＠wickensonline.co.uk

I've seen plenty of examples of adapters to use a vintage joystick with a modern computer. I'd like the opposite - to use a USB controller with a vintage computer (Atari compatible - for example ZX Spectrum, Commodore 64). Does anyone know of an adapter or a homebrew project? Thanks, Mark.

9 years, 9 months

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Finding developer docs for VME hardware?

by cmhanson＠eschatologist.net

Anyone have any suggestions for how to go about finding developer documentation for VME hardware? I haven?t been having much luck with Google searches. Given that (aside from its use by workstation manufacturers) most VME hardware was intended for composing systems from disparate parts, I assume that most of it at one time had programming documentation available. After all, you can?t just provide binary drivers when you know neither what CPU nor what OS your customers will be running?or even if they?ll be running an OS, versus some tightly-coded assembly. My current interest is in using something like a D/A board or a specific audio interface[1] to provide audio for a VME-based workstation that lacks it, but I figure being able to find information like this will be generally useful to those of us with VME hardware. -- Chris [1] Something like a Vigra MMI-210: <https://www.highbeam.com/doc/1G1-9634773.html <https://www.highbeam.com/doc/1G1-9634773.html>>, about $125 on eBay.

9 years, 9 months

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Need info on obscure Flip Chip

by jnc＠mercury.lcs.mit.edu

Yes, I did see that list entry, but I was needing the pinout, a more detailed functional description, etc. Noel

9 years, 9 months

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Need info on obscure Flip Chip

by jnc＠mercury.lcs.mit.edu

Hi, I'm looking for information on a semi-obscure Flip Chip; an M826 (sort sort of combination clock/counter). I can't find out anything about it. Apparently the M8xx Flip Chips were generally custom modules intended for a specific device, which is probably why I can't find anything on it. I've looked in the Digital Logic Handbooks for 1969-1977, with no luck. So I also looked through the Spare Module Handbook to see if I could find something else that used it, so I could see if the documentation for that thing covered it (e.g. I found the M167 in the RS64 Maintenance Manual). However, I struck out there too. My Google-fu wasn't strong enough to turn up anything online. Anyone have anything on this beast? Noel

9 years, 9 months

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Need info on obscure Flip Chip

by jnc＠mercury.lcs.mit.edu

9 years, 9 months

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Next order of MFM emulator/reader baords

by djg＠pdp8online.com

I will be ordering another batch of boards. If you wish to order more boards email me djg at pdp8online.com with how many and if bare, with surface mount chips, or fully assembled. If you currently are on the waiting list you don't need to reply. Info is here. http://www.pdp8online.com/mfm/ The price may be $5 more since it looks like the quantity will be less than last time. Bare boards should ship by end of month. I haven't found a place at these quantities to have them assembled for less than listed price so have been doing them myself. Assembled boards may be a couple more weeks. I will collect payment when getting ready to start shipping.

9 years, 9 months

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obscure forgoten Machean of Europe?

by jnc＠mercury.lcs.mit.edu

> From: Adrian Stoness > All seems we see is HP and Dec mostly talked about Well, don't forget that i) a lot of people (like me) are interested in things they worked with 'back in the day', and for many people, that is very likely to be DEC and HP machines, since they were very common, ii) the conversation is partially driven by what's available now, and again, because they were so common BITD, there are more of them now, and finally iii) the list has a lot of US-based members, and they wouldn't have run across (either back then, or now) machines from the somewhat obscure European manufacturers. I don't think anyone looks down on the more obscure machines, in fact I personally (and many others, I suspect) are very happy to see people paying attention to them, and my respects to the people who are working to save them. Noel

9 years, 9 months

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obscure forgoten Machean of Europe?

by COURYHOUSE＠aol.com

SMECC is looking for any Philips Broadcast year new or old sorta like http://www.smecc.org/ldk20/philliconnector1.jpg which is one of our ldk-20 cameras... they can say on the side Philips, or later Thomson or BTS Philips was a great developer and implementer of CCD Technology in video cameras. this studio camera has computers in it for the control unit and you can store setups etc on Flash memory cards I keep one at the house to learn to program up the MCU controller etc for the one at the museum. So anything Philips, or later Thomson or BTS hardware, software, cables, adv. materials, training books is indeed welcome here and if you have a lighted script holder we need one for the unit at the museum.... it looks like this... http://www.smecc.org/ldk20/philli57.jpg People ask on our duplicate stuff what would we trade for? here is a non computer area that works well to get some of our extras. Have a great weekend Ed# _www.smecc.org_ (http://www.smecc.org) In a message dated 9/11/2016 11:40:13 A.M. US Mountain Standard Time, cclist at sydex.com writes: On 09/11/2016 08:23 AM, Paul Koning wrote: > Philips was founded around the end of the 19th century as a maker of > light bulbs, got into vacuum tubes in the 1920s or so. Philips was into everything. For simple appliances, most in North America were completely unaware of the parent company, because personal care products are marketed under the "Norelco" brand. I believe that Philips acquired Sylvania, then sold it to Funai. In 2000, Philips was the largest manufacturer of semiconductors, having acquired both Signetics and VLSI Technology. later spun off as NXP to a private investment consortium. If you own a Sonicare electric toothbrush, that's Philips too. It's pretty safe to say that almost everyone has a Philips product somewhere in their life--it may not be branded with the Philips name however. --Chuck

9 years, 9 months

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SWTPC GT-6144

by vintagecomputer＠bettercomputing.net

I am finally getting around to getting this GT-6144 graphics board working. ?It seems pretty straightforward, however I am confused by the advice given re:use with the CT1024 vs 6800. ?The instructions describe using it with either or, I think. ?I'm wondering what the right way to hook up would be if you are using both together. ?I'm thinking it must be CT1024 in that case, otherwise you'd need two monitors? ?I just want to be able to program the GT-6144 from the 6800 while using the CT1024. Anyone familiar enough with these to offer advice? Thanks in advance!! Brad

9 years, 9 months

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Components available - the rest of the story

by t.gardner＠computer.org

The rest of the story. As Al pointed out, much to our surprise, the museum has rejected an offer >from Art's estate for the donation of a Fast Fourier Transform computing system which included both the Unicomp Computer and a hardware FFT accelerator. This is a very strange decision since the system is one of the earliest if not the first implementation of a FFT in anti-submarine and anti-aircraft warfare. FFT mathematics dates to 1965 but processor until much later had the power to do it real time in software at the resolution necessary, so Art invented the hardware accelerator and multiple units were sold to the Navy. The estate is appealing the museum's decision. The estate would like to keep the FFT system together and so if the museum continues with a cranial rectal inversion it will look to other alternatives including those of u who have already I will respond by email not later than tomorrow to the several list members who expressed interest in the components and/or the computer. I'm busy today helping set up the Atari retrospective for the IEEE Silicon Valley History Committee. Regards, Tom Date: Tue, 6 Sep 2016 18:16:23 -0700 From: Al Kossow <aek at bitsavers.org> To: cctalk at classiccmp.org Subject: Re: Components available On 9/6/16 4:18 PM, Tom Gardner wrote: > A friend of mine died recently; he was amongst many things an > electronics tinkerer and has a closet full of small parts in bin > cabinets (resistors, capacitors, ICs, transistors, hardware, etc.). There is also a Unicomp 18 bit minicomputer, paper tape reader, and FFT processor circa 1972 in the garage (6ft rack) with full documentation. I walked out of the donations meeting with the other curators today who thought it was a piece of s**t and didn't want to take it, calling it a 'dumpster fire' Art was a friend of mine. Hopefully it can go someplace where it can be appreciated. Talk to Tom about it, unfortunately, time is short. -- 73 AF6WS Bickley Consulting West Inc. http://bickleywest.com "Black holes are where God is dividing by zero"

9 years, 9 months

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Logic Analyser Advice

by jnc＠mercury.lcs.mit.edu

> From: Ian S. King > Do you have the grey rectangular bits that plug into the pods? If not, > you're pretty much screwed Not necessarily. I bought a couple of Tek 1240's, without pods or probes, but managed to locate a goodly supply of each on eBait. The key for me was to find the original Tek part number for the pods and probes, and then search for that. The same might work for this HP thingy. Noel

9 years, 9 months

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Identify HP Pods

by radiotest＠juno.com

At 01:10 PM 9/10/2016, Glen Slick wrote: >Those are the leads that go with the HP163x series logic analyzer pods such as the HP 1630G that Rob Jarratt was just asking about here. Aaah - that is why I did not recognize them - I had seen only the 165x/166x leads. Dale H. Cook, GR / HP Collector, Roanoke/Lynchburg, VA http://plymouthcolony.net/starcity/radios/index.html

9 years, 9 months

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VC8E Option

by anders＠abc80.net

> >On Thu, Sep 8, 2016 at 11:59 PM, Pontus Pihlgren <pontus at update.uu.se> >> >wrote: >>> > > >>> > >Hmm, yes, I think I might actually. What do you have so far? >>> > > >> > >> >I don't have much yet, unfortunately; still trying to get my thoughts >> >together on how it should be implemented. Mark Pizzolato recommends using >> >as much existing display code as possible. I did start an issue for it >> >here, though:https://github.com/simh/simh/issues/337 >> > >> >Kyle > I found Phils code when I looked into this yesterday. There also the VR12 > emulation in the, now dormant, GreenPea[1] project. I was wondering which > graphics library to use but since both simh and GreenPea uses SDL I guess > that settle that. > > I found and read Dougs[2] VC8E summary. Do you have any other docs? A > cursory look on bitsavers didn't give any result. > > /P > > [1]https://github.com/andysan/greenpea/ > [2]http://homepage.cs.uiowa.edu/~jones/pdp8/man/vc8e.html > There is at least schematics on bitsavers: http://bitsavers.trailing-edge.com/pdf/dec/pdp8/omnibus/VC8-E_engineering_d… I encourage you to do this, I have a working VC8E if you what me to try anything. /Anders

9 years, 9 months

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Components available - the rest of the story

by couryhouse＠aol.com

I thought chm had woosed.. out on it already?.. Sent from my Verizon, Samsung Galaxy smartphone -------- Original message -------- From: Tom Gardner <t.gardner at computer.org> Date: 9/10/16 11:24 (GMT-07:00) To: cctalk at classiccmp.org Subject: RE: Components available - the rest of the story Hi Jason: Yes the LCM has asked for it. If the CHM says no, we need to work out details of the transfer and may take u up on your offer to help in transport.? Note it is a 6-foot rack with about 5 file drawers of documents Regards, Tom -----Original Message----- From: Jason Howe [mailto:jason at smbfc.net] Sent: Friday, September 09, 2016 10:40 PM To: cctalk at classiccmp.org Subject: Re: Components available - the rest of the story Have they thought about other museums, like the LCM up here in Seattle?? I'd be happy to volunteer to go get it and bring it back North. --Jason On 09/09/2016 08:39 AM, Mark J. Blair wrote: >> On Sep 9, 2016, at 00:59, curiousmarc3 at gmail.com wrote: >> >> I might be interested, as I already have two FFT systems that I am restoring (an HP 5420A and a HP 5451C). I am local. Just drop me an email. > > If Marc adopts it, he'll surely make some excellent Youtube videos about it! > >

9 years, 9 months

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SWTPC 6800 Weirdness

by vintagecomputer＠bettercomputing.net

Okay, I have it all dialed in now! With that iffy memory board swapped out, the system works beautifully. I did have some trouble loading Altair BASIC but after looking at a video of someone running it I discovered an extra line that appeared to be in the Altair patch file and also a couple of memory addresses that were altered. Once I did that, the prompts came up and it let me enter a program! The only problem was for some reason Hyperterminal was cutting off a column or two - so instead of the OK prompt I had O. I figured that was probably just Hyperterminal, so I switched the system back to 110 baud, loaded Altair BASIC, and then switched to the CT-1024. It worked perfectly! Pretty magical being able to use this software I've only seen demonstrated in videos on vintage hardware! Can't wait for the day I have a real Altair and teletype. I'm going to hunt around for more S19 files. I'd also like to learn more about how to program this thing (I assume in assembly). And then another thing on my wish list would be to have both the MP-S and MP-C cards working together in a way that I could use one to load and save stuff off to my PC terminal and the other for actual terminal interface. Thanks again for the help and suggestions!! Brad

9 years, 9 months

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Identify HP Pods

by radiotest＠juno.com

While going through some bags of probes that I recently acquired I found two of these HP pods that do not bear HP model numbers, just the company name and logo: http://i.ebayimg.com/00/s/MTIwMFgxNjAw/z/ONAAAOSwBahVJjOo/$_57.JPG as well as the clips used with them: http://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/7aEAAOSwENxXlk5E/s-l1600.jpg They appear to be pods for an HP logic analyzer, but they are not the HP 16xx series analyzer pods with which I am familiar. Can anyone identify them? Dale H. Cook, GR / HP Collector, Roanoke/Lynchburg, VA http://plymouthcolony.net/starcity/radios/index.html

9 years, 9 months

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50 yrs. of Star Trek!

by COURYHOUSE＠aol.com

You bet it does! My friend Jim Early explained to me how it was used on the Bell Solar Batteries ( solar cells) for TELSTAR Ed Sharpe PDP-8 SN18 In a message dated 9/9/2016 7:55:19 A.M. US Mountain Standard Time, dpi at dustyoldcomputers.com writes: On Thu, Sep 8, 2016 at 11:34 AM, Fred Cisin <cisin at xenosoft.com> wrote: > On Thu, 8 Sep 2016, Murray McCullough wrote: > And use so much transparent aluminum. > Transparent aluminum exists. It is called sapphire. Sapphire is the crystalline form of aluminum oxide. If you recall, Apple was thinking of using it for the touch screen face of the iphone. -- Doug Ingraham PDP-8 SN 1175

9 years, 9 months

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50 yrs. of Star Trek!

by COURYHOUSE＠aol.com

yep! In a message dated 9/8/2016 10:46:36 A.M. US Mountain Standard Time, pete at pski.net writes: > On Sep 8, 2016, at 1:31 PM, Christian Liendo <cliendo at gmail.com> wrote: > > The only "computer" related thing I can think of is the scene from > Star Trek IV: The Voyage Home, where Scotty works on the Macintosh > trying to show transparent aluminum. > > In my own humble opinion it is one of the best scenes ever from a Star > Trek movie or show. ?Hello, computer!?=

9 years, 9 months

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50 yrs. of Star Trek!

by COURYHOUSE＠aol.com

you mean when he picks up the mouse and says.... hello computer into it? yea I fell outta my seat! Ed# _www.smecc.org_ (http://www.smecc.org) In a message dated 9/8/2016 10:31:59 A.M. US Mountain Standard Time, cliendo at gmail.com writes: The only "computer" related thing I can think of is the scene from Star Trek IV: The Voyage Home, where Scotty works on the Macintosh trying to show transparent aluminum. In my own humble opinion it is one of the best scenes ever from a Star Trek movie or show.

9 years, 9 months

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VC8E Option

by kylevowen＠gmail.com

Charles Dickman's site shows a VC8E screenshot with text: http://www.chdickman.com/pdp8/spacewar/ However, unless I'm missing something, I don't actually see what would've drawn the characters. A little digging on Bitsavers shows there was a VC8E driver. http://bitsavers.trailing-edge.com/bits/DEC/pdp8/papertapeImages/russ.ucs.i… Even in this, I don't see any sign of a character lookup table or the like. Where would all of this have been created? Thanks, Kyle

9 years, 9 months

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50 yrs. of Star Trek!

by c.murray.mccullough＠gmail.com

What role did Star Trek play in the rise of small computers that are so ubiquitous today? This science fiction series prognosticated many things but how many actually happened or am I expecting too much from a television show of 50 years ago? Happy computing! Murray

9 years, 9 months

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DEC, non DEC at VCF

by useddec＠gmail.com

The following is a partial list of things I plan on bringing to VCF tomorrow. I plan on being there by noon, and will return home Saturday night. If you have any interest, flag me down. If I have time I?ll try to grab some 8 boards. Thanks, Paul M3106 DZQ11 M3107 DHQ11 M7081 LA120 LOGIC BOARD M7504 DEQNA M7546 M7677 11/84 M7846 RX11 M7940 DLV11 M7944 MSV11-B M7946 RXV11 M7955 MSV11CD M7957 DZV11 4 LINE M8012 BDV11 M8013 RLV11 M8014 RLV11 M8015 KPV11-A M8017 DLV11-E M8021 MRV11-BA M8027 LPV11 M8029 RXV21 M8043 DLV11-J M8044 MSV11-DD M8053 DMV11 M8959F 64K M8059K128K M8067F 64KW M8067 128KW M8186 11/23 CPU M8189 11/23+ CPU M8190-A KDJ11-BF M9047 GRANT G7273 GRANT PDP8-E no cards VT52, untested 2 computer automation naked minis-never used mini 4 9 full cards can't see model of the other one, but i think it is a 4 or 5 card 2 motorola M-4408 NIB, bought new from Carroll Touch, a local company that made early touch screens for plato. Nova 3 no boards, nice clean Kennedy 9610, very clean

9 years, 9 months

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WTB: GRiDcase 3 screen or entire GRiDcase 3 or 1520 with small plasma for parts

by ian.finder＠gmail.com

Mine just died, an entire row driver went out. I just bought this thing! :( -- Ian Finder (206) 395-MIPS ian.finder at gmail.com

9 years, 9 months

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Unicomp Minicomputers [WAS: RE: Components available]

by t.gardner＠computer.org

See http://bitsavers.informatik.uni-stuttgart.de/pdf/unicomp/UNICOMP_Brochure_19 70.pdf Unicomp became Spectra Data became Gilmore Industries and then ??? Art worked for Unicomp Tom -----Original Message----- From: Mark J. Blair [mailto:nf6x at nf6x.net] Sent: Thursday, September 08, 2016 2:50 PM To: General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts Subject: Re: Components available I am not at all familiar with Unicomp minicomputers, and I'd love to see pictures of this one. I'm sorry that I'm not closer to the machine, but it sounds like heroic rescuers are already lined up to keep it from getting scrapped. -- Mark J. Blair, NF6X <nf6x at nf6x.net> http://www.nf6x.net/

9 years, 9 months

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TK50 with DEC All-in-1

by curt＠atarimuseum.com

Hi Anyone have a TK50 install of this ? Either for sale, trade or loan? Thanks, Curt

9 years, 9 months

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AS400 Model 170 potentially available...

by lbickley＠bickleywest.com

Weirdstuff has been offered an AS400 Model 170 located in a data center. If anyone is interested in purchasing it, let me know off list - please include the approximate price you'd be willing to pay for the critter. I'll pass your info on to Weirdstuff so they can decide whether to make a bid on it or not. Note: I am not affiliated with Weirdstuff other than as a paying client. They don't like to see vintage gear scrapped anymore than I do. Regards, Lyle -- 73 AF6WS Bickley Consulting West Inc. http://bickleywest.com "Black holes are where God is dividing by zero"

9 years, 9 months

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Y Combinator is restoring one of Alan Kay's Xerox Alto machines

by curiousmarc3＠gmail.com

> > On Sep 5, 2016, at 9:30 AM, Josh Dersch <derschjo at gmail.com> wrote: > > > > At the LCM, I used an Apple II to test out the Alto's memory -- the > > Alto II XM uses 4116 RAM chips. I swapped in a row at a time and wrote a > > little BASIC program to test for obvious errors. This was > > time-consuming, but eliminated the obviously bad chips, which helped immensely. > > Oh, that's so simple and clever! Are these 16k chips? I don't have an Apple II, > but I wonder if I could use the same trick and plug them in my HP 85 > for which I just managed to burn the service ROM, which has a memory > test built in. Josh, I checked, and the mysterious HP 1818-1396 or 1818-0341 RAM chips used in the HP-85 appear to be NEC uPD416-2 or MOSTEK 16k chips. They appear to be pin for pin, voltage and speed compatible with the MOSTEK 4116-3 used in the Alto. So it looks like I could check the Alto Xerox II-XM RAM chips on my HP-85. 8 at a time, that might take a while :-). Thanks for the tip, I'd never have thought about it! Marc

9 years, 9 months

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Q-Bus Memory Diagnostics and Repair

by jnc＠mercury.lcs.mit.edu

> From: Jerry Weiss > I'll give that a try. Please let us know how you make out with it! :-) > I've been making do with the SMS 1000 manual for the basic settings as > well. Yeah, that's better than nothing. I just looked over my notes from looking into the CMV-x000, and alas I don't have any useful data to report (yet). > I ran a different diagnostic w/o parity testing enabled. That's kind of odd; the top block of results make it look like it's dropping the 0400 bit (e.g. "S/B", which I assume means 'should be', = 161612, and "WAS" = 161212 makes it sound like it dropped the 0400 bit); but the block below makes it look like it's picking that bit (it shows 0 and 0400 under the S/B and WAS columns for that location). Eh, no biggie; clearly the 0400 bit has issues! ;-) > I see stuck bits and address decoding problems. It looks like some > memory addresses return the contents of another address. Not sure I see that happening? If your CPU is an 11/73 (which can directly 'access' [hate that verbism :-] all of memory from ODT, unlike the 11/23 which is restricted to the bottom 256KB), try playing around with a failing location, and its alternative, directly, and see if a store of random data into one can be read back directly >from the other; e.g. set 03561212 to 0, store 0123456 in 03561612, and then try reading 03561212, etc. Then go back to 03561612 and see if you get 0123456 back when reading it. Etc, etc. That should quickly verify if the problem is just some locations which drop/pick bits, or if there are addressing issues. > I may just clip the power lead on the chip I think is faulty to confirm > I have the correct target. I looked at my CMV-x000 boards, and on all of them, the chips are soldered in, not socketed (which most of the other ones I looked into had, which made working out the chip<->bit tables very easy - pull random chips, and see what happened :-). But your proposed move should let you identify if you have the right chip. Once done, you might want to check low memory from ODT to make sure you don't have the banks inverted (i.e. what looks like the top bank is not in fact the bottom). It probably wouldn't boot the diagnostics, if so, but it'd nice to find out directly! > Hopefully the bit ordering matches the board marking and bottom row is > the highest address of memory banks. Please let me know what the layout is, and I'll start the Computer History wiki page for this board with that info. Noel

9 years, 9 months

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Q-Bus Memory Diagnostics and Repair

by jnc＠mercury.lcs.mit.edu

> From: Jerry Weiss > The first is an MSV11-PL 512KB-Q-Bus 22bit. > Dead to both CSR and Memory address access in ODT. > ... before start poking around with my scope ... can recommend a > particular methodology to finding the fault. Well, the CSR and RAM address detection circuits are separate (page 5 of 11 in the drawings), so since both are not responding, it has to be something in common: perhaps something on the input side like a bus receiver (e.g. BSYNC, pg 8), perhaps something on the output side like a control line driver (e.g. BRPLY, same page), or some of the common circuitry that drives it (e.g. TRPLY generation on pg. 5). The way to tackle this is to write a two instruction loop that reads the CSR (that will be easier to grok than RAM access); it will need a NXM trap catcher which just does an RTI, too; and don't forget to set up the SP. Then, pick some likely point half way along the signal path (e.g. MSEL, on the right hand edge of pg. 5), and see if that's doing what it should. If no, start moving back upstream; if it is OK, start going downstream from there. > The second board is a CMV1000 that probably has a bad Memory Chip. > I don't have either prints or a manual for this board. Yes, either/both for this, and the sister CMV4000 (same board with 256K chips) would be really fantastic to locate. I'm in the process of working out what all the jumpers/mean do, and will work out which chips correspond to which bits, and document them, like this page: http://gunkies.org/wiki/CMV-504 However, we're not there yet for this card, so... > I was expecting bad and xor to be 16bit values, but they appear to be > mostly 22bit addresses. But then again this isn't a DEC board. That shouldn't make a difference. I can't make head or tail of the output either; can anyone else help? (I don't use DEC diagnostics, I have rolled my own PDP-11 memory diagnostic.) > The board itself is labeled with bits 0-7 P0 P1 8-15 across the top Well, that is a good hint... :-) > Any suggestions as to which chip might be suspect? Step A is to find out what the failing location(s) are, and what the bad data is. So either figure out the DEC memory diagnostic output, or roll your own (you can have mine if you like, I have Unix assembler source, or I can give it to you in .LDA binary). Noel

9 years, 9 months

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Components available

by t.gardner＠computer.org

Hi A friend of mine died recently; he was amongst many things an electronics tinkerer and has a closet full of small parts in bin cabinets (resistors, capacitors, ICs, transistors, hardware, etc.). The ICs look mostly old. His wife and kids have no interest and would like to find a good home for these parts rather than recycle the lot. They are in Palo Alto CA Anyone interested in using them could just pick them up in the next week or so. Any other ideas? Really hate to see these go to recycle. Tom (650) 941-5324 <tel:%28650%29%20941-5324>

9 years, 9 months

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{wtb} DEC VT100 5 spoke rolling stands

by smj＠ma.sdf.org

I'm looking for a couple DEC VT100 5 spoke rolling table stands. Please contact me privately if you have one available. Thank you

9 years, 9 months

1
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Powering up a 3741

by coryheisterkamp＠gmail.com

Hello gents, seeking some advice. I recently brought home my IBM 3741 Data Station that has been in controlled storage since the late 90?s and was working at that time. Given almost 20 years has passed, what would be the best way to power it back up? I believe I have a variac of sufficient size around and I'm assuming it's a linear power supply but any advice would be appreciated on the matter. Thanks, Cory

9 years, 9 months

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RK05 packs

by jnc＠mercury.lcs.mit.edu

From: Paul Koning > Some IBM systems ... have a "2315" drive which is an RK05. Yeah, I think that was the original source of these packs. The Diablo 30/31 drives (used on the RK11-C controller before the RK05 was created) were designed to use 2315 packs. > From: Tony Duell > My intention was to put the hub on a spare spindle .. put the platter > on, turn it round by hand and use a lever-type dial gauge to get > minimum run-out. One of the people I buy PDP-11 parts from reports that he actually did this (using the exact procedure you describe) BITD. Apparently there's some multi-platter pack that has the same exact platter as the RK05 (2315) pack, and he had some damaged RK05 packs, and moved platters from the bad multi-platter pack to the RK05's. Noel

9 years, 9 months

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Odd memory error in PDP-11/04

by jnc＠mercury.lcs.mit.edu

> From: Paul Koning > Semiconductor memory, right? Yup. > A possible reason would be that the address drivers for that bit, or > the address decoders in that chip, are busted. The result would be that > reads and writes always touch the same address in the chip. Oooh, good point. That's a better explanation of the symptoms than mine, since it answers the thing that was confusing me ("why it can be either set or reset with a write, but freezes in one state for reads"). A fully-populated 64KB MS11-J card has 4 rows of 16Kx1 chips, so if the machine ever runs again, the first thing to check is to see if that bit at 040000 (or 0100000, if it's a larger than 32KB card) is tied to that bit at 0; if not, it's the addressing circuitry in the chip. (Looks like E75, but it might be E72). > The fact that other bits repeat every 20 also suggests issues with > addressing logic. That I don't think is a memory chip issue, since it causes the entire word to repeat, and on that card, each bit of the word is in a separate chip. > From: Jim Stephens > Is there a hint as far as the affected hardware in that the ODT is > working, but the ram is not? The rom that is running ODT is also being > accessed for read correctly. Good point. So it's probably not something in the CPU that's repeating every 020 locations. Also, IIRC, that ODT code doesn't use memory, it runs entirely out of the registers. There's some good reason for that (probably to avoid messing with the contents of memory), but maybe also so that it runs without working memory - ISTR that we discussed this at one point here, but I'm too lazy to look for the discussion. So that's why ODT runs even if the RAM isn't working. Anyway, if the 020 problem is in the memory too, it's probably the A04 bus receiver (E55), although it might be the address latch (E88, a 7475) or the RAS/CAS mux (E99, 74S153). Step a would be to put a scope probe on the output of the bus receiver (pin 2) and see if it's hopping up and down - if that, that chip is OK, and the problem is further down the line. > I don't know if the rom path to the ODT code is different than the ram, Yes. The ROM for the ODT is stored in the M9301 card (at least, if it's an 11/04, it's probably an M9301 - could be an M9312, too). The RAM is in another card, an M7847 (MS11-J). > it is interesting that the console code is being fetched, along with > the data from the serial controller to communicate with the console > terminal Which indicates that the UNIBUS is probably OK; the console serial is on yet another card, the M7856 (DL11-W); the CPU, RAM, bootstrap and serial line all talk to one another over the UNIBUS. Noel

9 years, 9 months

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