- test-drb@ccmp.vtda.org - classiccmp.org

by rcini＠optonline.net

Hello, all: I'm posting working code and pre-built binary, along with a binary image of Altair BASIC 3.2. It works very well. I have no way yet to guage relative speed to a real Altair, but it seems pretty responsive. What I'd like to do is ask an Altair owner on this list to create some sort of benchmark program and run it on his real Altair. Then, I'll run it on the Altair32 and that'll give me a basis for improving the speed of the emulator. Thanks again and enjoy. Rich Rich Cini Collector of classic computers Build Master for the Altair32 Emulation Project Web site: http://highgate.comm.sfu.ca/~rcini/classiccmp/ /************************************************************/

24 years, 10 months

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Identify this mystery Q-Bus board!

by zaft＠azstarnet.com

I have an unidentified Q-Bus board that I'm hoping someone will recognize. it's a quad-height (i.e. full-size) board. On the component side is says "RELIABILITY ASSOCIATES" and (c) 1987 and "TIME SLOT CONTROLLER". It has two 40-pin headers and a 20-pin header and two pushbutton switches. Chipwise, it's got a 68000RC10, a couple of 68450s, three MK68564s, and a 74S409N, all socketed, and a host of PALs and MSI/SSI chips. Anybody know what this is? Also does anyone have data sheets for 74S409? Gordon Gordon Zaft zaft(a)azstarnet.com

24 years, 10 months

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6502 vs 68000

by paul＠orchard.wccnet.org

> Date: Sun, 19 Aug 2001 07:26:19 -0600 > From: "Richard Erlacher" <edick(a)idcomm.com> > Subject: Re: SemiOT: Mourning for Classic Computing > > There are lots of things one CPU could do more simply than another, > but, normally, there were others that went the other way. I remember, > back in '80 or so, demonstrating that the 4 MHz 6502 was considerably > faster and more code efficient than the 8 MHz 68000. This was, of > course, because the 8 MHz 68K had to fetch two words just to get its > opcode, though it didn't take long to execute it once the opcode and > operands were in place. In 1980, most 8-bit CPUs were more efficient that the 68000 in terms of code size as long as you limited yourself to 64K. When you got past 64K, the 68000 scaled smoothly while programming the 8-bitters became a Chinese fire drill. Paul R. Santa-Maria Monroe, Michigan USA

24 years, 10 months

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Gateway Z80 ISA cards

by optimus＠canit.se

I've come across two full-length eight-bit ISA cards from Gateway Communications. The main chips on it is a family of Zilog chips: Z80 CPU, 2?SCC, Z80 CTC. The blanking plate fatures a micro-D50, the same kind found on SCSI cards. It's not uncommon to find Zilog chips on SCSI controllers, but that connector was AFAIk introduced with SCSI-2, and an 8-bit SCSI-2 card seems like an odd thing to do. The card is labelled WNIM Z80 and is copyrighted 1990. The farther end of the card features two 10-pin headers marked PORT 1,2 and PORt 3,4 respectively. What could this board be for? -- En ligne avec Thor 2.6a. Remember: - On the Amiga, you can make a way. - On Linux, there is a way, you just don't know it. - On Windows, there is no way and you know it. Aaron Digulla

24 years, 10 months

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FS: VAXStation 3100/M76

by cmcmanis＠mcmanis.com

I bought a pallet with some VAXStations at auction and I'm going to sell several of them on Ebay to raise funds to cover the cost of storage for the rest of my collection. However, before I do that, and at the risk of ruining my market, there are three types of systems available: VS3100/M76 16MB Mono, w/ RZ23 VS3100/M76 16MB Color (8pln, not the SPX), w/RZ23 VS4000/M60 24MB Color, w/RZ24 If you want one, make me an offer by midnight pacific time thursday (I'm planning to start listing them Friday). Note I will expect you to cover the cost of packing and shipping it which shouldn't be all that much (say 30 lbs from Sunnyvale, CA 94087). Note that I'll balance the offer against the hard luck story that comes with it :-) So if you have a good story that will help your cause. I will include an MMJ cable with a male DB25 adapter (either DTE or DCE your choice). No, none of them came with the funky SCSI cable that you need for a VS3100. I've also got a VS3100 M30? (KA42) with an RX23 that is available for $10 + postage (it has 8MB and no internal hard drives) --Chuck

24 years, 10 months

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Update SIMPLEX doc

by ajp166＠bellatlantic.net

From: Chuck McManis <cmcmanis(a)mcmanis.com> >I've updated the SIMPLEX document and would appreciate critical reviews for >accuracy completeness. The URL is here: ><http://www.mcmanis.com/chuck/computers/simplex.html> > >It also includes my idea for the front panel. I don't know if it will work >out that way but that is what I'm shooting for. If I'm lucky the whole >thing will fit in one Radio Shack project box, (assuming I make it out of >an FPGA) if I build it out of tubes it will probably take up a couple of >racks :-) An aside to this.... Why fpga other than as an exercise in FPGA and cpu design? Why not program a PIC or somesuch to emulate the processor??? I doesnt have to be fast as a teaching tool and the ram/rom required to do this would be reasonable. Allison

24 years, 10 months

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SC/MP NIBL emultor by Henry Mason

by sipke＠wxs.nl

Hi Folk, Henry Mason coded an emulator for the SC/MP NIBL system This was a SC/MP based development system that National Semiconductor made. It includes the NIBL ROM so you can program it in very itsypitsy tiny BASIC. I'll be on the lookout for more info on this system. Its aviable for downloading I've included it in my SC/MP page http://xgistor.ath.cx Drill down to: ==> Vintage Computers ==> SC/MP Elektor Emulator Regards, Sipke de Wal

24 years, 10 months

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Assembly vs. Everything Else (was: SemiOT: Mourning for ClassicComputing)

by pete＠dunnington.u-net.com

On Aug 18, 22:29, Derek Peschel wrote: > Acorn designed a 6502-based computer for the BBC, called (natch) the BBC > Microcomputer. Sophie Wilson wrote a fine BASIC for the machine. When > Acorn designed the ARM chip and a line of computers based on that, the BASIC > got ported, but I don't know who did that work. Sophie did. She wrote TWIN (Two WINdow Editor), ChangeFSI (image manipulation program), and some ray-traced demos as well, and several other things. -- Pete Peter Turnbull Network Manager University of York

24 years, 10 months

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Update SIMPLEX doc

by cmcmanis＠mcmanis.com

I've updated the SIMPLEX document and would appreciate critical reviews for accuracy completeness. The URL is here: <http://www.mcmanis.com/chuck/computers/simplex.html> It also includes my idea for the front panel. I don't know if it will work out that way but that is what I'm shooting for. If I'm lucky the whole thing will fit in one Radio Shack project box, (assuming I make it out of an FPGA) if I build it out of tubes it will probably take up a couple of racks :-) --Chuck (And thanks to Jim Battle who pointed out a clearly better way to do accumulator loads.)

24 years, 10 months

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SemiOT: Mourning for Classic Computing

by technos＠nerdland.org

HTML isn't flimsy as a language goes.. The problem is the wack intrepreters. Each does something different, especially in the case of a broken document.. (Not starting a browser flamewar.. No, I'm not. Really. No flames. Shaddup already!.) Jim > > HTML is no programming language, silly. You'd learn more by running a > Cardiac, > and besides, HTML is so flimsy that it can never be predicted in any > whatsoever. > > -- > En ligne avec Thor 2.6a. > > Die Zeit kommt aus der Zukunft, die nicht existiert, in die > Gegenwart, die keine Dauer hat, und geht in die Vergangenheit, > die aufgehort hat, zu bestehen. > --- Augustinus (Rom. Kirchenlehrer, 354-430 n. Chr.)

24 years, 10 months

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This week's finds

by optimus＠canit.se

A summary of what I've stumbled over in the past week or so: One ABC80. This one's been equipped with a TKN80 80 column kit. It also came with two datasettes. One interesting tidbit is that the keyboard is actually made by Keytronic. And the Z80 is a really pretty model, all white with very visible traces and the core mounted on top of it all. One Spectravideo MSX datasette, as though I haven't got enough of those already. One Atari 1040STFM with Notator dongle. I had to skip the monitor. One extremely hacked-up Amiga 500. With all the solder, broken pins, added sockets and switches, it's one hideous "Rock lobster". One Commodore VC-1520 plotter/printer. One North Hills MAU. It's surprisingly small. But isn't it supposed to have any AC mains? One BayTech multiport controller 525. What is this? It's a smallish box with five DB25 ports in the back. Each port has still got a DB25/RJ45 adaptor, which makes it worthwhile regardless of what it actually might be. A lot of electronics out of a can recycling machine, TOMRA brand. Seems to be VME, with a lot of useful Motorola chips. An AC adaptor for a Luxor VEC (Also known as a Fairchild, SABA, etc). Various Mac parts, including a video capture card and a MIDI interface. -- En ligne avec Thor 2.6a. Was ist ein Erwachsener? Ein Kind, das vom Alter aufgepumpt ist. --- Simone de Beauvoir

24 years, 10 months

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Danish

by optimus＠canit.se

My, what an interesting find today. I just hope the boys were able to find a taxi, or it will have ended up on a dirty road in the middle of nowhere. The beast I'm referring to is an RC855, made by Regnecentralen of Denmark. It's a brown and beige (which seems to have been the colours of choice for all Scandinavian computers, whether Luxor, Tandberg or Regnecentralen =) tiltable screen with a sturdy stand into which a microcomputer is fit. It also came with two eight-inch floppy drives, which someone with a sick sense of humour has named "Picollo". I also managed to find two floppies, one of which seems to contain CP/M. Urgh. Couldn't it have been something more interesting? Nevertheless, it's Danish, so I like it. The floppies are daisychained on a D36. There are also two serial ports, a detachable keyboard and some kind of network port, IIRC a three or four-pin DIN connector. Among other finds were a C64C, an Atari 520STFM (yawn) and two small Memorex Telex boxes with VGA out and twinax networking. Some kind of terminals apparently, these seem to have been used in a cinema booking system. There was also a DECwriter IV there, but I had to leave it since some people think VGA monitors are more fun than 300 bps hard copy terminals. =) -- En ligne avec Thor 2.6a. When cherry tree blooms, people go and walk there, eat dumpling, bring sake and talk each other such things as "A superb view!" and "Full of spring here", and they become very happily and cheerful. But this is a lie. People gather below cherry trees and get drunk, vomit, fight, which are happening since the old days of Edo period. From long time ago. THE FULL OF CHERRY BOOLMS, CHAPTER 1

24 years, 10 months

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an odd question

by mmcfadden＠cmh.edu

I know that the control key on the DEC terminals stripped off the high order bit on the character that followed. The Control-G series would sound the bell on either the VT100 or LA34. the G character is an octal 107 Control-G sends out an octal 007 which is the bell All sorts of modem, printer, and terminal combinations used the entire ASCII character set. When we replaced our VT52's we found out you could send out series of cursor control codes on VT100's to move the cursor and then output a character. Early star trek games on video terminals used this instead of sending out spaces and characters. You could also plot line graphs and barcharts using control codes. Mike mmcfadden(a)cmh.edu

24 years, 10 months

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classiccmp-digest V1 #690

by dittman＠dittman.net

> > PROGRAM SayHello(INPUT, OUTPUT) > > BEGIN > > WHILE (TRUE) > > BEGIN > > WRITELN('Hello World'); > > END; > > END. > > I think what you wanted to say was this: > PROGRAM SayHello(OUTPUT); > BEGIN > WRITELN('Hello World'); > END. The BASIC program printed "Hello World" over and over, so the WHILE loop is used do the same thing in the Pascal program. Your program just prints "Hello World" once. -- Eric Dittman dittman(a)dittman.net School Zones: Man's attempt to thwart natural selection.

24 years, 10 months

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FS: Silent 700s and Trimm 19" rack mount box with slides

by cmcmanis＠mcmanis.com

Hi everyone, cleaning out more stuff this evening and have unearthed a few things. Everything is in Sunnyvale, California, zip 94087. First an EXTREMELY rare Texas Instruments Silent 700 with Bubble Memory storage (model 765). These are very unusual because there was only a short period of time between when bubble memory was practical and the whole Silent 700 was impractical :-) The Silent 700 series are thermal printing, hard copy terminals. Works fine. $75 + postage. (Strangely a bubble memory unit for this thing brought $76 on Ebay a while back, go figure) Second, is a less rare but very nice Silent-700 model 785. The thing that distinguishes this terminal from the others is that it has real lower case letters (versus the original Silent 700's "short" upper case standing in for lower case). Works fine, $25 + postage. Third a very nice Trimm Technologies 19" rack mount box. This box has a full rack slide mounting kit (both the rails and the slides for the rack) so you can put it into a 19" rack, it is 4U high and has an opening in the front for a 5.25" full height peripheral (disk or tape). It also has the mounting brackets for said peripheral which will hold either one or two devices (you could, for example, mount a CDROM drive and a DAT drive above each other. Inside is a standard switching power supply with at least 8 "standard" power plugs for SCSI devices (4 pin disk/tape power plug). There are also two SCSI-2 connectors on the back, each connected to a long ribbon cable inside (reaches to the front of the box) to allow you to run dual busses. This is extremely useful on VAXen where you have one SCSI controller talking to a tape drive and the other talking to a bunch of disks. The power switch comes to the front and has a 'Highland Digital' logo on it. There are many strategically placed holes on the bottom for mounting additional disk drives or brackets for more stuff. $20 plus postage takes it, if you want just the rack slides I'll understand can send just those. They are the 40 lb ones (1" wide) versus the 100 lb ones (3" wide) If no one wants this stuff I'll probably put it up on Ebay. --Chuck

24 years, 10 months

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non HP RPN calculators (was: Re: SemiOT: Mourning for

by dittman＠dittman.net

> #As I said, I find any calculator other than an RPN one to be very > #difficult to use (and I make a lot of mistakes attempting to do so). > #There would have to be something _very_ special in a non-RPN machine > to > #convince me to use it... > # > #-tony > > I totally agree with this. I bought an HP 21 when I was in college > (the first calculator I owned, and which I stll have), and even today I > have a hard time figuring out when to hit the "=" sign on non-RPN > calculators. What's so hard about a non-RPN calculator? If you want to do the equivalent of 2+2, you enter 2, +, 2, and =. For a non-RPN calculator you basically enter the calculation the same way you write it. If you've got a non-simple calculation and you've not a calculator with ( and ) you can use them, too (most reasonable calculators have them). -- Eric Dittman dittman(a)dittman.net School Zones: Man's attempt to thwart natural selection.

24 years, 10 months

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SemiOT: Mourning for Classic Computing

by dhquebbeman＠theestopinalgroup.com

> On Fri, 17 Aug 2001, Douglas Quebbeman wrote: > > > I do think it's less likely for someone to pick up bad programming > > habits if they start with Pascal, but that's not an absolute, just a > > probability thing. > > Bad programming habits are either LEARNED or NOT CORRECTED early enough! Semantics? Around here, "picked up" would include LEARNing, among other things... > My high school computer science teacher was a great TEACHER. I envy people who had the benefit of teachers whose skills were farther advanced than those of the students. No one could ever answer the questions I asked, so I realized I'd have to teach myself. > TEACHERS make all the difference! So it is imperative that you go out and > find STUDENTS to TEACH! I find myself in a bad situation everytime someone wants me to "show them"; I show them precisely as I learned, and they just give me deer-in-the-headlight look. As I said above, no one taught me, so I'm clueless as to how to teach others. Regards, -dq

24 years, 10 months

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Assembly vs. Everything Else (was: SemiOT: Mourning for ClassicComputing)

by mcguire＠neurotica.com

On August 18, Jeffrey S. Sharp wrote: > > Now, why is it so important to have a PRINT statement? > > Iggy Drougge said: > > So that you may print "HELLO WORLD". It's essential for the newbie. > > Please bear with me. Does it have to be "HELLO WORLD" exactly, or could > something different suffice? This is an important point...It needs to be "HELLO WORLD" exactly, otherwise it won't work. -Dave -- Dave McGuire Laurel, MD

24 years, 10 months

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SemiOT: Mourning for Classic Computing

by jeff.kaneko＠juno.com

On Fri, 17 Aug 2001 23:23:05 +0100 (BST) ard(a)p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) writes: >> The assembly languages I like are ones where the instructions and > addressing modes are 'orthogonal'. That is to say that any > instruction can use any addressing mode, and any registers. Like a PDP11 or a > P800, or to a lesser extent the VAX. That was the cool thing about the NS-32000's-- it was designed to be *very* orthogonal. I find it very sucky that good design is frequently hampered by crappy marketing. > The ones I dislike are the ones with all sorts of special cases (the > destination operand must be in this register unless it's this mode, > etc). Well, after having had to program one for a while, the Z-80 definitely fits into this category. I strongly suspect that parts from that era had these design aspects (e.g. orthogonality) limited by their die size. ________________________________________________________________ GET INTERNET ACCESS FROM JUNO! Juno offers FREE or PREMIUM Internet access for less! Join Juno today! For your FREE software, visit: http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj.

24 years, 10 months

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free for postage or or toss

by thompson＠mail.athenet.net

VITALINK Translan 350 bridge. LAN interface: ethernet II or 202.3 Data link: V.35, DS-1, RS232, RS499 Data Link speed: 9.6kbs to 2.048Mbps Dimensions: 5.5in x 17.5in x 23.5in Weight: 32lbs, 14.5Kg (Motorola 68000 processor, as I recall) Includes two manuals and a floppies that worked to boot the machine several years ago. Software Version 10.4 Ref. Manual Gettings started guide. >From about 1988-1990 timeframe. --

24 years, 10 months

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Marketing (was RE: SemiOT: Mourning for Classic Computing)

by zaft＠azstarnet.com

At 07:15 AM 8/16/2001 -0400, you wrote: >I've always believed that consumers should research the products they >purchase, and that a good product will sell itself. Marketing merely >raises the ultimate costs of a product, so perhaps you'll understand >why I don't have a very high opinion of it. Or of a generation or >programmers who rose to serve marketing's needs. While marketing costs money that must be recovered in sales, if a product has a high volume in can be sold at a smaller margin and therefore cost less than it otherwise would. Therefore good (<-) marketing can lower the price of a product even though it adds to the cost. GZ

24 years, 10 months

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DECMux 300?!?

by dittman＠dittman.net

> What the heck is a DECMUX 300? I thought it was a DECServer 200/MC when I > pulled it off the pallet but no, it wasn't. I think the DECmux 300 is a 8/16/32 port to single serial port multiplexor, usually used to multiplex several terminals over one high speed link, but my memory could be misfiring. -- Eric Dittman dittman(a)dittman.net School Zones: Man's attempt to thwart natural selection.

24 years, 10 months

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Amiga magazines free/trade

by jimoaks＠hotmail.com

claude id love to get these, ive not much to trade but would be willing to pay you for them. Let me know Thanks Jim >From: "Claude.W" <claudew(a)videotron.ca> >Reply-To: classiccmp(a)classiccmp.org >To: <classiccmp(a)classiccmp.org> >Subject: Amiga magazines free/trade >Date: Fri, 17 Aug 2001 13:13:10 -0400 > >More Amiga mags to donate or trade. These are all clean: > >Amiga Transactor: 89: Jan, Oct, April, Sep, July, June, Feb, March, April >also Jun 88 > >Amigo Times : Issue' 1.2, 1.3, 1.4, 1.5, 1.6, 1.7, 1.8,.1.9 > >Always looking for 8/16 bit micros or semi-recent SGI or SUN >machines/hardware... > >Claude >http://www.members.tripod.com/computer_collector > > > _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp

24 years, 10 months

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an odd question

by dhquebbeman＠theestopinalgroup.com

> Fred said: > > How about type balls > > I believe for the Selectric, being IBM, they would be blue. Postings are down, severe belly cramps again? ;-) -dq

24 years, 10 months

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VAX stuff in OH, PA, NY, MA, CT, RI

by gunther＠aurora.regenstrief.org

Hi, I'm going to go on vacation with a car driving from Indy through OH, PA, NY to New Haven, CT, so I'll be close to everything on the east coast. Will visit NY city too. Now the question is anything VAX going on there? Do you know of any places where one could go browse and may be find stuff? Anyone who always wanted to get rid of something but was too afraid to ask? :-) I am especially interested in finding an RA90 or 92 somewhere just so to pick up so I finally can actually run my VAX 6460. I can store and ship larger items too. If I could find a star-coupler or a TU81+ that would be super cool. Of course I wouldn't mind tripping over a nice 11/785 :-) There's got to be something on the east coast, right? thanks for your suggestions, -Gunther -- Gunther Schadow, M.D., Ph.D. gschadow(a)regenstrief.org Medical Information Scientist Regenstrief Institute for Health Care Adjunct Assistant Professor Indiana University School of Medicine tel:1(317)630-7960 http://aurora.regenstrief.org

24 years, 10 months

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SemiOT: Mourning for Classic Computing

by dhquebbeman＠theestopinalgroup.com

> >What I don't like is dog-and-pony shows, too much sturm und drang. > > It's all about sturm und drang. We had a kid in the neighborhood who was a great show-off... he used to ride his bicycle head-on at cars, doing a wheely, then veer off at the last second. I figured if he survived to adulthood, then there'd be a job in marketing for him. > Programming contests are another deal. They're just about academic > programming. Demos are more like MTV on a computer screen. Yeah, and I always considered MTV to be one big marketing outlet. At least I appear to have this in perspective now... I've always believed that consumers should research the products they purchase, and that a good product will sell itself. Marketing merely raises the ultimate costs of a product, so perhaps you'll understand why I don't have a very high opinion of it. Or of a generation or programmers who rose to serve marketing's needs. Regards, -dq

24 years, 10 months

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DECMux 300?!?

by cmcmanis＠mcmanis.com

What the heck is a DECMUX 300? I thought it was a DECServer 200/MC when I pulled it off the pallet but no, it wasn't. --Chuck

24 years, 10 months

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SemiOT: Mourning for Classic Computing

by dhquebbeman＠theestopinalgroup.com

> Douglas Quebbeman skrev: > > >> But then is Pascal that bad? > > >Bad? Bad at what? bad *for* what? > > We were discussing beginner's languages and alternative to BASIC. I do think it's less likely for someone to pick up bad programming habits if they start with Pascal, but that's not an absolute, just a probability thing. > I think the interpreter makes BASIC unequalled pedagogically. If you like the immediacy of the interpreter environment, you should try programming in Smalltalk-80. Typing an expression, selecting it, and choosing DO IT (or PRINT IT) >from the context menu is almost as fast as ?"This is a test" -dq

24 years, 10 months

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Keyboard for VT320

by matt＠knm.yi.org

Hi, A friend of mine was recently given a vt320 - unfortunatly it's keyboardless - don't spose anyone's got one spare (preferably in the UK)? -- Matt --- E-mail: matt(a)pkl.net, matt(a)knm.yi.org, matt(a)printf.net matt(a)m-techdiagnostics.ltd.uk, matthew.london(a)stud.umist.ac.uk mattl(a)vcd.student.utwente.nl, mlondon(a)mail.talk-101.com Web Page: http://knm.yi.org/ http://pkl.net/~matt/ PGP Key fingerprint = 00BF 19FE D5F5 8EAD 2FD5 D102 260E 8BA7 EEE4 8D7F PGP Key http://knm.yi.org/matt-pgp.html

24 years, 10 months

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classiccmp-digest V1 #690

by Alan.Pearson＠cramersystems.com

Various people wrote: > CESIL (Computer Education in Schools Instructional Language), Ha ha, I'd forgotten about that one... I remember typing in a CESIL interpreter into the Speccy from some magazine or other. It was even slower than ZX BASIC though so I gave up on it after a couple of weeks.. > If the eight-bitters had booted into Pascal, perhaps things would have > looked differently? For me the immediacy of an interpreted language was what made it fun, and therefore encouraged me to find out more about programming. We were taught PASCAL and 6809 assembly in my first year at college, both excellent learning languages (one for high-level structured programming and the other for the low-level 'how a computer computes' stuff) - both were nowhere near as much fun as BASIC because you had to compile/assemble them before you could "do anything". A lot of the time was spent learning the language syntax ("why does it need a semicolon here" or "why does the opcode need to go at least one space in") rather than learning programming concepts, which I found a bit distracting. OK nowadays it's not a big deal to pick up a new language, but when I was just starting out learning non-intuitive rules about semicolons was quite a headache. Compare the possible pitfalls in here (what are INPUT, OUTPUT? why no semicolon after BEGIN and WHILE (TRUE)? why a full stop after the last END? what does 'while true' really mean anyway? etc) PROGRAM SayHello(INPUT, OUTPUT) BEGIN WHILE (TRUE) BEGIN WRITELN('Hello World'); END; END. when compared to this: 10 PRINT "Hello World" 20 GOTO 10 BASIC's appeal was its simplicity and immediacy. I don't agree with Wirth that it pollutes the mind irrevocably either, I mostly use C++ or Java these days and never have to use the much-maligned 'goto'. The only time I use global data is for the occasional acceptable (even trendy!) "singleton" design pattern :-) --al PS I guess my mind has been polluted though, I'd rather hack 68K any day ;-)

24 years, 10 months

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Amiga magazines free/trade

by claudew＠videotron.ca

More Amiga mags to donate or trade. These are all clean: Amiga Transactor: 89: Jan, Oct, April, Sep, July, June, Feb, March, April also Jun 88 Amigo Times : Issue' 1.2, 1.3, 1.4, 1.5, 1.6, 1.7, 1.8,.1.9 Always looking for 8/16 bit micros or semi-recent SGI or SUN machines/hardware... Claude http://www.members.tripod.com/computer_collector

24 years, 10 months

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SPARCStations anyone?

by LFessen106＠aol.com

In a message dated 8/17/01 12:21:45 PM Eastern Daylight Time, pechter(a)bg-tc-ppp389.monmouth.com writes: > > I've got a nice one (SLC I think) here... I added 64mb (4 16mb) of 72 pin > parity simms and it works great if anyone's interested in a sparc in > a mono monitor. > > I've also got an IPX (64mb of memory) available if anyone's interested. > > Bill Heck yeah Bill! -Linc Fessenden In The Beginning there was nothing, which exploded - Yeah right... Calculating in binary code is as easy as 01,10,11.

24 years, 10 months

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tape drive question

by ojw＠dircon.co.uk

Hi. Having recently been the happy recipient of an HP 7978 tape drive I have set about the task of finding new blank tapes for it. Not too difficult until faced with the embarrassing question of whether my tapes need to be Wright Line seal or Easy Load (Auto Load ?). My vintage magnetic media experience doesn't go much beyond 8 inch disks, so I wondered if anyone could please give me some hints on how to answer this. (Of course I haven't got any manuals). Thanks in advance.

24 years, 10 months

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DECserver 90M fault codes

by mrbill＠mrbill.net

I've got the manual, but it doesent go into detail about the fault/failure codes. I dont have a console terminal or ethernet connection hooked up to this yet - but when power is applied, it goes through the self-test, lighting up 8 7 6 5 4 3, then those LEDs blink, 2 and 1 are dark, and only the POWER LED is lit otherwise. Anybody know what this means, exactly? Is this a paperweight? Bill -- Bill Bradford mrbill(a)mrbill.net Austin, TX

24 years, 10 months

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SemiOT: Mourning for Classic Computing

by dhquebbeman＠theestopinalgroup.com

> You still don't get it. Demos have no marketing relevance whatsoever. They're > done just for the fun of it, and the prestige. They don't fulfill any needs > and don't claim to do it. I don't even see why I'm trying to explain to you, > you don't even seem to read what I write. No, I trying very hard to grok this. Is this in the United States? What part of the country? It doesn't happen around here (Louisville, KY metro area), I'd have heard of it. Given the Internet, I suppose my world shouldn't be limited to a 150-mile radius, but in a way, it is. -dq

24 years, 10 months

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Romar TOY-11

by taylor＠crystal.nrl.navy.mil

I have this qbus board that is a date/time clock. It was made by Romar Peripherals and looks very simple, does anyone have any info on this board? I would like to use it in a RT11 system to set the date/time automatically. It is based on a National Semiconductor 58167 clock chip, I think the board is set to respond to an address176600.

24 years, 10 months

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Altair32 News

by RCini＠congressfinancial.com

Hello, all: Just to relay some great news. Theo has killed the last of the nagging bugs in the processor core (mostly flag-setting stuff) and has successfully gotten Altair BASIC 3.2 (4k BASIC) to run!!! I have some code to cleanup tonight and I'll post new sources over the weekend. Woo, hoo! http://highgate.comm.sfu.ca/~rcini/classiccmp/Altair32.htm Rich ========================== Richard A. Cini, Jr. Congress Financial Corporation 1133 Avenue of the Americas 30th Floor New York, NY 10036 (212) 545-4402 (212) 840-6259 (facsimile)

24 years, 10 months

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SPARCStations anyone?

by LFessen106＠aol.com

In a message dated 8/16/01 10:27:57 PM Eastern Daylight Time, cmcmanis(a)mcmanis.com writes: > Is anyone on the list interested in SPARCStation 1's ? > --Chuck Sure! -Linc Fessenden In The Beginning there was nothing, which exploded - Yeah right... Calculating in binary code is as easy as 01,10,11.

24 years, 10 months

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SPARCStations anyone?

by marino13＠btinternet.com

I would be but I'm presuming you're in the States right? > Is anyone on the list interested in SPARCStation 1's ? > --Chuck >

24 years, 10 months

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terminal inventiveness (was Re: an odd question

by ajp166＠bellatlantic.net

From: Stan Sieler <sieler(a)allegro.com> To: Chuck McManis <cmcmanis(a)mcmanis.com>; classiccmp(a)classiccmp.org > So here are some specific questions that might be interesting to answer: > 1) What was the first example of a TERMINAL (See above)? In the late 60s I did use the H1000 (hazeltine) wich was glass tty. > 2) When was a processor (micro, bit-slice, whatever) first > DEDICATED to operating a terminal? That came in the mid 70s, later than some of the terminals that could do #3. > 3) What is the first terminal that could manipulate its own > buffer memory in response to a "control" code? at least one example was the VT52, it had gotoxy and a few other controls but was not uP based. > 4) What is the first terminal that could display graphics and > text? (either alternately or simultaneously) I beleve the TEK401x and even the tube in the PDP1 (vector graphics) could do that. Likely predates standalone tubes. However the first serious graphics tube I encountered as a text/standalone was VT100 with line drawing or VT125 with regis/sixel and VT100 text. 5) what was the first terminal to have memory "above" the screen? (I.e., some number of lines could scroll off the top, but could still be scrolled back later) (Probably HP 2640A) This was implemented on the SWTP CT1024 many others did it. 6) what was first terminal with user-installable option cards? (Probably HP 2640A) H1500, Vt100, CT1024 and others. Allison

24 years, 10 months

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Upcoming Garage Sale

by kyrrin＠bluefeathertech.com

Greetings, port-VAX'ers and CLASSICCMP'ers, I wanted to let you all know I'm going to be doing a one-day-only garage sale on Sep. 15th (Saturday) from 10:00 to 17:00 at 12641 SE 277th Pl., Kent, WA (southeast of Seattle). I'll be clearing out a bunch of VAXen and Qbus stuff, along with disk drives, cables, tape devices, test gear, etc. If you're local to the area, or going to be in the area, swing by. I never know when I'll be putting out something that someone may have been digging for. Thanks much for the small bit of advertising space. -- Bruce Lane, Owner & Head Hardware Heavy, Blue Feather Technologies -- http://www.bluefeathertech.com ARS KC7GR (formerly WD6EOS) since 12-77. "Plut? Ahh, Gribble Snort!"

24 years, 10 months

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terminal inventiveness (was Re: an odd question

by ajp166＠bellatlantic.net

From: Lawrence LeMay <lemay(a)cs.umn.edu> >Fairly early examples are: > prior to this there was the H1000. >2/70 TEC inc. model 410/415, 420/425, 430/435 > >4/70 Applied Digital Data Systems (ADDS) Consul 920 > >5/70 Univac Uniscope 100 > >10/70 Hazeltine 2000 > >> >> 2) When was a processor (micro, bit-slice, whatever) first >> DEDICATED to operating a terminal? >> >> 3) What is the first terminal that could manipulate its own >> buffer memory in response to a "control" code? >> >> 4) What is the first terminal that could display graphics and >> text? (either alternately or simultaneously) >> >> I'm guessing that the Lear-Seigler machines were near the front... > >Nope. The ADM-1A didnt come out until 8/73. There were many out there befor the ADM1A, When that one hit VT05s were around. See 1973 small computer handbook. The ADM1 was notable for several reasons but being first was not it. the fact that it was lower in cost than many and by 1975 avaiable as a KIT for much less made it popular. For me I'd been using electronic terminals for a few years by 1973 with the H1000, VT05 being notables but there were others around. Allison

24 years, 10 months

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Who reads their email the most Classically?

by fmc＠reanimators.org

"Curt Vendel" <curt(a)atari-history.com> wrote: > Is anyone running any internet connected lynx servers with dialup > capability??? I've wanted to do this myself as many older Atari 8-bit > groups would like access for email and newsgroup reading to stay connected > with the online Atari communities. They're called "shell accounts". Yes, they exist as commercial offerings. For example, Panix in NYC (http://www.panix.com/) and a2i communications in the San Francisco Bay Area (http://www.rahul.net/). -Frank McConnell

24 years, 10 months

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Big Iron

by CAA007216＠mail.ono.es

Is there somebody out there with space to get this "microcomputer": http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=1625704207 Greetings Sergio

24 years, 10 months

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PDP-8/i Question

by djg＠drs-esg.com

>From: "Will Jennings" <xds_sigma7(a)hotmail.com> > >OK, >How the hell do you tell if the thing is negative or positive bus? I need to >know this before I go and buy some peripherals... > If the lower rows have M650/M651 then it is negative bus. I'm sure your's is positive bus so you won't be going after the stuff I want :-). David Gesswein http://www.pdp8.net/ -- Run an old computer with blinkenlights. Have any PDP-8 stuff you're willing to part with?

24 years, 10 months

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WTB/T: hp-21 battery pack anyone?

by cmcmanis＠mcmanis.com

Well since it appears I'll be holding on to this calculator, and I've verified that it does indeed work if I kludge up a battery pack. Does anyone have a spare HP battery pack I could buy/trade for? It doesn't particularly matter if the pack is dead, we can rebuild it :-) --Chuck

24 years, 10 months

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Fwd: Apple IIgs rescue in Florida

by jfoust＠threedee.com

>From: Compnavi(a)aol.com >Date: Tue, 14 Aug 2001 20:13:23 EDT >Subject: Computer Donation >To: jfoust(a)threedee.com > >Mr. Foust - > >Due to the fact that computers have so drastically revolutionized the world >and the way we live, and due to the fact that proper history of computers and >a collection demonstrating this history will be more valuable than a >collection of historical automobiles or planes, or any item collected >previously, it would be my pleasure to offer you a piece of computer history >for your collection. > >I would like to donate to your museum a perfectly working and complete Apple >IIgs setup. ? This setup includes the computer itself, the standard issue >Apple monitor, a 5.25" floppy drive, a 3.5" floppy drive, a dot-matrix >printer, and a full suite of software. The software diskettes still sit in >their original boxes. ? The equipment is in perfect condition ??? neither a >scratch nor a crack to be seen. All is Apple brand equipment purchased at >the same time. > >The IIgs became a staple in classrooms around the country, and in American >homes. ? Its role as one of the first computers to be mass-produced and >integrated into education deserves special recognition. ? As a member of the >teen generation ??? a generation that has grown up with Apple and the IIgs ??? >this computer is a part of our history, and part of our memory. Just as >exhibits regarding the fifties and sixties make the baby boomers blush and >remember fondly their childhood when regarding tinker toys, Lincoln Logs, and >tin lunch boxes ??? and then remember Armstrong stepping on the moon, Kennedy >being shot, and King???s great words, my generation will look back at our >computers, and other electronic amusements, and wander back to a time we long >to remember ??? and yet we might not have such great men and shining moments to >draw an association to. ? Our technological triumph may be the only great >endeavor of my generation's childhood, but its effect will be long lasting. > >Use the Apple IIgs I offer you in an exhibit now, or store it for display >later, but please don't let it end up where it is currently destined: the >county dump. > >Please feel free to contact me if you have any questions or assorted points >of inquiry. > >Sincerely, > >? - Josh Mendelsohn > >_________________________ >Joshua Marc Mendelsohn >3101 North 47th Avenue >Hollywood, FL 33021 >(954) 962-0505 >compnavi(a)aol.com

24 years, 10 months

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Down-under articles on retrocomputing

by jfoust＠threedee.com

>Date: Tue, 14 Aug 2001 14:38:13 +1000 >From: Nathan Cochrane <ncochrane(a)theage.fairfax.com.au> >Reply-To: ncochrane(a)theage.fairfax.com.au >Organization: The Age newspaper >To: "Nathan Cochrane (E-mail)" <ncochrane(a)theage.fairfax.com.au> >Subject: Many thanks for your help on the emulation article > >Once again, my deep appreciation for your help in compiling the >article(s), which you will find online at: > >Bernie's lost in time >Bernie Meyer flips a CD-ROM into his PC and, in an instant, turns it >into a time machine. Within a few seconds an old friend ? a red and >white chequered ball ? bounces around the screen. Welcome to Amiga, >circa 1985. >http://www.it.mycareer.com.au/news/2001/08/14/FFX6PT25BQC.html > >When I grow up I'll be a Mac >Emulators fall into the category of virtual machines, a class that takes >in Sun Microsystems' Java. The emulator software makes a PC, Macintosh, >Linux or any other desktop think it's another computer or console game >system. >http://www.it.mycareer.com.au/news/2001/08/14/FFXAYW25BQC.html > >Going retro >It was a humble Sinclair Spectrum computer that, nearly two decades ago, >nudged the teenage Pierre Scotney on to a path of programming and logic >that he hopes will lead to a gene therapy for heart disease. >http://www.it.mycareer.com.au/news/2001/08/13/FFXGPU25BQC.html > >If you have problems getting a hard copy of today's paper, let me know >and I will organise to have one sent to you. > >This is the first of two packages on emulation and retrocomputing. The >second will appear in the Livewire supplement embedded in the Green >Guide liftout, probably in the next 13-20 days. > >All the best > >Nathan

24 years, 10 months

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Need ST506-based HD (20MByte or 55MByte)

by rmeenaks＠olf.com

Hi, Does anyone have a spare ST506-based HD laying around unused. I am specifically looking for a 20MByte or 55Mbyte in size. Here is the models I am specifically looking for: NEC D3126 Olivetti HD352 But any would do. I am planning on reviving a TMB05 transputer disk controller (M212-based transputer tram motherboard with a ST506 disk drive interface). This is just one of the many missing pieces. The board is basically unsocketed, so it is missing a lot of chips, etc including the M212. I found a source for the M212, but still need a HD. Thanks, Ram -- ,,,, /'^'\ ( o o ) -oOOO--(_)--OOOo------------------------------------- | Ram Meenakshisundaram | | Senior Software Engineer | | OpenLink Financial Inc | | .oooO Phone: (516) 227-6600 x267 | | ( ) Oooo. Email: rmeenaks(a)olf.com | ---\ (----( )-------------------------------------- \_) ) / (_/

24 years, 10 months

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SemiOT: Mourning for Classic Computing

by jeff.kaneko＠juno.com

On Thu, 16 Aug 2001 07:15:53 -0400 Douglas Quebbeman <dhquebbeman(a)theestopinalgroup.com> writes: > We had a kid in the neighborhood who was a great show-off... > he used to ride his bicycle head-on at cars, doing a wheely, > then veer off at the last second. Hey! That could have been me! We put together a bike from misc parts, but didn't have a proper rear wheel (a 'front' wheel was substituted). The result? The Kamikaze Bike: No Brakes. No Pedals. No Fear. I piloted that sucker down the street in front of our house (it was a fairly steep hill). I crashed and burned into a hedge at the bottom, but oooooh what a rush. > I figured if he survived to adulthood, then there'd be a > job in marketing for him. Well, I survived into adulthood, and became a programmer-- go figure. > Marketing merely raises the ultimate costs of a product, so > perhaps you'll understand why I don't have a very high > opinion of it. Or of a generation or programmers who rose > to serve marketing's needs. Marketing has another *very* undesirable effect-- It allows lousy products to succeed, and good products to fail (for lack of). I would rant and rave about how these 'successful' products then frequently become 'standards', but I won't beat that rotting, stinking horse anymore. OB Classic: Yesterday I scored a VaxStation 4000/90 with 2 x 600mb drives, and 128Mb of RAM (or thereabouts-- it has 8 x 16Mb simms). Jeff ________________________________________________________________ GET INTERNET ACCESS FROM JUNO! Juno offers FREE or PREMIUM Internet access for less! Join Juno today! For your FREE software, visit: http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj.

24 years, 10 months

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