- test-drb@ccmp.vtda.org - classiccmp.org

iSBC 86/14 Single board computer manual available

by anheier＠owt.com

I have a 1982 Intel iSBC 86/14 and iSBC 86/30 single board computer hardware reference manual available for trade. Any one interested? Thanks Norm

23 years, 3 months

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Bunch of XT parts available

by anheier＠owt.com

I have a bunch of, I believe, XT parts available. For example ISA hard disk controllers, serial port and parallel port boards and cables available for trade. Drop me an email it you are looking for something specific. Thanks Norm

23 years, 3 months

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MacTV Remote...

by alhartman＠yahoo.com

There is a MacTV remote going on eBay... 5 days left. http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2301518730&category=4610 Regards, Al __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com

23 years, 3 months

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Expect to see fewer hard drives.

by Robert_Feldman＠jdedwards.com

This story just came out: http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/ap/20030116/ap_on_hi_te/unera sed_hard_drives_10 "So, you think you cleaned all your personal files from that old computer you got rid of? Two MIT graduate students suggest you think again. Over two years, Simson Garfinkel and Abhi Shelat bought 158 used hard drives at secondhand computer stores and on eBay. Of the 129 drives that functioned, 69 still had recoverable files on them and 49 contained "significant personal information" - medical correspondence, love letters, pornography and 5,000 credit card numbers. One even had a year's worth of transactions with account numbers from a cash machine in Illinois. " I expect that more people/companies will resort to smashing the hard drives of computers they get rid of :(

23 years, 3 months

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Update: BBC Acorn

by julesrichardsonuk＠yahoo.co.uk

> > ARM Evaluation Kit I just checked - mine's S/N 0184 according to the label where the cable comes out. If that started at 0 I guess they made a few... I found the IEEE 488 interface too, which I also seem to have a polystyrene box for but no cardboard, manuals or disks. Curious. (no S/N or label of any kind on that, and I didn't feel like opening the case. I expect they made thousands of those anyway) No sign of the Z80 box I may of had, but it might be up in the loft. cheers Jules __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Everything you'll ever need on one web page >from News and Sport to Email and Music Charts http://uk.my.yahoo.com

23 years, 3 months

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Caption Competition! (bit OT)

by t.myers＠protasis.co.uk

That looks a lot like the old Prestel Viewdata terminal I used to have. 1200/75 baud modem, I believe it was badged by Royal Bank Of Scotland for their Prestel banking service. Caption could be "The houswife of 1999 will use a computer rather than the telephone to gossip with her chums"? Tim.

23 years, 3 months

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VXT X terminal question

by msokolov＠ivan.Harhan.ORG

Hi folks, I wonder, does anyone know what VAXstation CPUs does VXT software run on? VXT software runs (of course) on the VXT2000 X terminal box, but can also run on many regular VAXstations. It officially supports KA42 (VS3100 M30/38/40/48) in order to provide a software upgrade from VT1300 to VXT2000 (VT1300 is a KA42 without local mass storage and with a different badge on the box), but I have also heard (turned up in Google search) that it'll run on a KA410 (VS2000) as well. This last point makes me think "hmm, it must be fairly generic, I wonder what other VAXstations can it run on?" Specifically I wonder whether it would run on a KA43 (VS3100 M76). I'm willing to bet that it'll handle the SPX video board just fine, as the video in the real VXT2000 is an SPX clone, but I'm concerned about how it would handle the Rigel CPU. VS3100 M76 was certainly in existence when VXT2000 was designed and the VXT software was written, but did they include support for it in the released code or not? MS

23 years, 3 months

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FA: TRS-80 Model IV with Corvus Omninet Network Interface

by florit＠unixville.com

Hullo fellow classiccmp enthusiasts; I'm in the process of clearing up some 'never started' project space, and have put my TRS80 Model IV find >from a few years ago up on ebay. I had intended to make the system a serial terminal, but it doesn't have a serial port and I never got around to buying one. I then thought of gutting it and making it into a modern PC. I was talked out of wrecking working vintage hardware just for the case. The neato thing about this TRS80 is (what I was told to be through usenet) the Corvus Omninet Network interface, aka Network 4 board; this is a diskless client for the network. Unfortunately I have no documentation, software, or proof, that it actually is Corvus Omninet, so take my commentary with a grain of salt. My limited probing on the inside of the system did not show any boards with the company name on them, for example, but I did not break open the shielded board area for a closer look (see pics). If this in fact was a real Omninet client system, you would also need a server or controller and the software to run it; again, from word of mouth, I was told it was likely a x86 or the like with a hard drive in it and the Omninet interface on it. On the auction page you will find a load of nicely sized pictures for it, and perhaps another TRS80 enthusiast will be able to determine if I was told correctly or not about the network. Here's the auction link: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2301561688&category=1247 Here's the thread archived on google groups here: http://groups.google.com/groups?hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&th=740c326f7620… Interesting tidbits from the above thread, thanks to "Frank Durda IV": "Corvus Omninet and Network 4 are the same beast. Tandy bought Omninet chipsets and made their own boards for the Model 4 and 1000HX/EX computers. The educational operating system that Tandy sold for use with Network 4 was written by a guy in his garage (living in the northwest as I recall)." "Omninet/Network 4 are trunk networks, more like Thinnet Ethernet in topology. (Some people came up with repeater/boosters that allowed non-daisy-chain wiring for Omninet/Network 4, but that is an extension of the basic design.)" "The underlying signaling in Omninet/Network 4 is differential, which means unshielded twisted pair works great (even using RJ11 plugs for interconnects work fine), but Tandy decided they would make more money by selling shielded wire and making you use those irritating wing-nut connectors. Tandys choice also meant that if you had one computer in the lab plugged into an outlet with a hot neutral, Tandys wiring scheme would promptly blow-out all of the machines on the network the moment you plugged that one computer in since they tried to share a shield ground via the shielded cable. This happened fairly often, and 30+ computers would simultaneously make Bing-Pop-Zing sounds as the tops blew off integrated circuits inside the case, followed by burning smells. Later, Tandy included an outlet tester with the installation kit and recommended its use..." AAAAAACCCKKKKKKKK! The horror! No burning smell from this one, however. This system was bought from a store in Sunnvyale, CA called 'Weirdstuff' that takes old computers and resells or strips them for their valuables. Wierdstuff is a cool store, check them out if nothing else to visit a blast to the computer and electronics past. They had a stack of these TRS-80 Models IVs at the time. They had been there for some time in the warehouse. Some of the systems had Tracking ID tags talking about 'Fremont School District', which is an area in Silicon Valley. My guess is they were traded or given away to make space for a more modern setup and weirdstuff ended up with them. Hope you liked all the background on it. I love collecting these old 'puters and hope to pass it on to someone equally enthusiastic. L

23 years, 3 months

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ADMIN: What if ClassicCmp were a blog?

by kees.stravers＠iae.nl

At 03:09 16-1-2003 -0500, Chad Fernandez wrote: >Jeffrey Sharp wrote: >> In my quest to cover every aspect, to think about every permutation of what >> ClassicCmp *could* be in the future, I have yet another question to ask >> ClassicCmp subscribers: What if ClassicCmp were a weblog, in the style of >> Slashdot or Kuro5hin? > >It sounds like you are talking about a web board type thing. Please NO. > There are a few that I read from time to time, but they are a pain to >navigate, and email is so much easier! Web boards are what non-computer >people tend to use, in my opinion. I wish the various truck boards I >read were mailing lists!!!! I totally agree with Chad. If classiccmp were changed into a web board format, I would leave. Thanks to the mail list format, all messages are delivered to my computer when they are sent, and I can look through them at my leasure. I do not have to go and check if something new and interesting has appeared, because all messages will be on my computer already. Mail is push and web board is pull, and pull is unneeded work when push is available in my opinion. Reading email is much easier to do than reading a web board, for the boards I have seen you have to do an unbelievable amount of mouse clicking or other interaction with your computer to see the messages, a lot more than you would have to with your email program. For people already bordering on RSI problems this is not a good thing. Also you have to wait on the server for each message to appear, more waiting time than you would have from your mailer. And you have to be online all the time to read the board, and with mail you go online, get all the messages, and disconnect again. Over here in Europe local calls are not free! Reading classiccmp online would soon be too expensive. Please keep the mailing list format. It is fast, simple, and easy to use. There are enough tools available to deal with the unavoidable spam. Kees. -- Kees Stravers - Geldrop, The Netherlands http://www.vaxarchive.org/ http://home.iae.nl/users/pb0aia/cm/

23 years, 3 months

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Glacier Peak Rainbow

by gbs＠gstebbins.com

I just happened to run across your archived messages from last November when searching the 'net for something else. I'm not quite sure from what I saw exactly where the messages were posted. That sure brings back memories! I still have the old files from Glacier Peak Rainbow sitting on a hard drive (it's not like the old days when I was worrying about exceeding the space on a 10 or 20 MB hard drive). There are about 640 files in 22 MB. I could burn CDs for anyone interested. Gary Stebbins former Glacier Peak Rainbow sysop

23 years, 3 months

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Looking for Mike Kenzie

by mhstein＠canada.com

Yo, Mike! Trying to get a hold of you to chat more about Cromemcos, but not getting through. Any ideas? m

23 years, 3 months

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ADMIN: What if ClassicCmp were a blog?

by mhstein＠canada.com

Present system is excellent; if changes in _addition_ to email list, good idea. m

23 years, 3 months

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Caption Competition (bit OT)

by doug_jackson＠citadel.com.au

Likewist, no caption, but I bet the houseplant is long gone. (So is the telly, and the wallpaper!) Doug Jackson Director, Managed Security Services Citadel Securix +61 (0)2 6290 9011 (Ph) +61 (0)2 6262 6152 (Fax) +61 (0)414 986 878 (Mobile) Web: <www.citadel.com.au> Offices in Melbourne, Sydney, Canberra, Hong Kong, Boston > -----Original Message----- > From: Dr. Ido [mailto:drido@optushome.com.au] > Sent: Friday, January 17, 2003 1:17 PM > To: cctalk(a)classiccmp.org > Subject: Re: Caption Competition (bit OT) > > > >http://helmies.org.uk/images/cap_comp.jpg > > > > > >Then come up with an amusing/apposite caption :) > > > >Bonus points for anyone who can identify the make/model of > machine she's > >actually using. HINT: this photo was published circa. 1983, > and is almost > >certainly British. > > No witty caption, but it looks like a Tandata TD1600 viatel/prestel > terminal. Used to have a stack of them here, couldn't think > of any use for > them so they were stripped for parts over time. > > CAUTION - The information in this message may be of a privileged or confidential nature intended only for the use of the addressee or someone authorised to receive the addressee's e-mail. If you are not the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any dissemination, distribution or copying of this e-mail is strictly prohibited. If you have received this email in error please notify postmaster(a)citadel.com.au. Any views expressed in this message are those of the individual sender and may not necessarily reflect the views of Citadel Securix. Feel free to visit the Citadel Securix website! Click below. http://www.citadel.com.au

23 years, 3 months

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Maxtor drive goes under

by dwightk.elvey＠amd.com

>From: "Brian Chase" <vaxzilla(a)jarai.org> > >On Thu, 16 Jan 2003, Philip Pemberton wrote: >> Dwight K. Elvey wrote: > >> > The drive we were having problems >> > with were 2 and 4 gig drives. These had a servo information >> > corruption problem ( that by design would always fail over time ). >> >> Guess that rules out Kalok then. They bit the big one in 1994, way before >> 2GB and 4GB drives started appearing... > >I'm going to guess Micropolis. Those drives were absolutely crap. > >-brian. > > Wow! The man is psychic! Dwight

23 years, 3 months

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Caption Competition (bit OT)

by drido＠optushome.com.au

>http://helmies.org.uk/images/cap_comp.jpg > > >Then come up with an amusing/apposite caption :) > >Bonus points for anyone who can identify the make/model of machine she's >actually using. HINT: this photo was published circa. 1983, and is almost >certainly British. No witty caption, but it looks like a Tandata TD1600 viatel/prestel terminal. Used to have a stack of them here, couldn't think of any use for them so they were stripped for parts over time.

23 years, 3 months

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Caption Competition! (bit OT)

by pete＠dunnington.u-net.com

On Jan 16, 19:08, Hans Franke wrote: > Hmm. To me the screen layout looks quite like a Teletext page. > I have no idea how this service was called in the UK (The name > Viewtext pops up, but I'm not shure). These are data pages, > transmitted via 'invisible' lines, 'between' or 'below' the > picture (As a bunch of other information also is). That's Videotext (generic term) or Teletext (name used by the BBC and ITV). > Now, back to the picture, what realy puzzles me is the keyboard. > The service is strict one way, you could only select a page, and > a regular remote is all you need. > Of course it could be the British equivalent of our (CEPT based > BTx system, a early online service to be used on a 1200/75 > connection with pages, made in a way to be displayed on you > telly. But then the picture layout would be quite different. > That service hat a quite more apropriate set of graphic > elements. Latterly, BTX did use different graphics, using a sort of "shift out" mode for "high" resolution but the original Bildschirmtext was the same as the UK's PRESTEL and French MiniTel services (generic term Viewdata), which use the Teletext character set and graphics. Those were truly interactive dialup services. Prestel (which predates BTX) offered information pages, news, electronic mail, downloadable software, etc. It became quite popular in the UK in the early 1980's and the price of adapters fell rapidly, especially with the advent of the BBC Micro and similar machines which could use cheap modems, and the promotion of the MicroNet 800 service (microcomputer news, bulletin board, and telesoftware, starting at page 800) and services like Viewfax258 (guess which start page) and the popular MicroGnome (anyone remember Bob Clark?). Page numbers could be up to 9 digits, and each could have 25 sub-pages so there was room for a lot of information (I probably still have statistics somewhere, as I had an Information Provider account then). There were even several bulletin boards which used Viewdata protocols, and commercial services too. The main travel agents' service was a private Viewdata system, several stockbrokers and financial institutions used one, and the Open University had one. -- Pete Peter Turnbull Network Manager University of York

23 years, 3 months

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ADMIN: What if ClassicCmp were a blog?

by pete＠dunnington.u-net.com

On Jan 16, 13:21, Dwight K. Elvey wrote: > >From: pete(a)dunnington.u-net.com > > > >On Jan 15, at various times, Jeffrey Sharp wrote: > > > >> In my quest to cover every aspect, to think about every permutation of > >what > >> ClassicCmp *could* be in the future, I have yet another question to ask > >> ClassicCmp subscribers: What if ClassicCmp were a weblog, in the style of > >> Slashdot or Kuro5hin? > > > >I have to add my vote to the many others who've said "NO!!!" > > > >> - Posting and reading of messages would be doable from a web browser. > >An > >> email interface could be developed, but it wouldn't be the primary > >> method of participation. > > > >I would hate that. > > > >> - You would have an account with a username and password. > > > >Right, I need another username/password (likely with different rules to all > >the rest) like I need another hole in my head :-) > > > > ---snip--- > > I see no particular advantage to using a browser for the > use of this group. If one looks at the attempts with something > as global as news groups, we would be quickly trashed with > hundreds of "Please fix my PCee" stuff from those that have > little interest in classic machines. For those who weren't there, that was exactly what happened to alt.computer.hardware.homebuilt. Skipping over the long tale of woe, the upshot was that a new, moderated, group was created (comp.arch.hobbyist). Sadly, that sees little traffic as the interested parties seem to have moved to greener and more diverse pastures altogether (some of them, to this list). I hope we don't try to be an elitist mailing list, but lets not invite trouble. -- Pete Peter Turnbull Network Manager University of York

23 years, 3 months

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Caption Competition! (bit OT)

by pete＠dunnington.u-net.com

On Jan 16, 21:14, John Honniball wrote: > Adrian Vickers wrote: > > See: > > > > http://helmies.org.uk/images/cap_comp.jpg [...] > > Bonus points for anyone who can identify the make/model of machine she's > > actually using. HINT: this photo was published circa. 1983, and is > > almost certainly British. > > I think it's a Prestel adaptor made by Tandata. I had one, somewhere, > in the original polystyrene packaging. Yes, I was about to say Tandata or Tantel when I read this. There are still services that use Prestel/Viewdata protocols -- I spent ages writing a Viewdata terminal emulator for X-windows a few years ago, so I could use online banking from my Unix box. Still in use today :-) -- Pete Peter Turnbull Network Manager University of York

23 years, 3 months

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Expect to see fewer hard drives

by julesrichardsonuk＠yahoo.co.uk

> I expect that more people/companies will resort to smashing the > hard drives of computers they get rid of :( the local computer recycling place here won't actually take in any machines with hard drives intact (from companies or individuals) unless said persons can prove that the drive(s) have been 'professionally wiped' - whatever that means. The recyclers are worried about being sued by the very companies / individuals that they got the machines from in the event that any data falls into somebody elses' hands. PC clones form 99% of the stuff coming in, but it's a shame that when the odd bit of exotica does come in it is without any disks and essentially useless without a copy of the OS and a suitable drive (and the knowledge to install said OS). I understand the RAM usually gets pulled if it's anything remotely useful and the rest goes straight to the metal recyclers (I talked to them seperately and they crush everything immediately) cheers Jules __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Everything you'll ever need on one web page >from News and Sport to Email and Music Charts http://uk.my.yahoo.com

23 years, 3 months

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How many PDP-12's are there now?

by mross666＠hotmail.com

>If anyone wants to send me info, I'll volunteer to collect and put it >up on my website (I won't put email addresses or other incriminating >evidence unless you want me to :-)). OK, reports from the UK: I have one: http://www.corestore.org/pdp-12.htm She had two sisters, at the Burden Neurological Institute. I collected another one along with it, which I immediately passed on to... a person involved with a certain UK 'used DEC' trader, for his personal collection. No names, no pack drill... The third machine there was retained for a number of years, it was still required to be fired up occasionally to read old LINCtapes. It was promised to me, I called religously every few months... 'no we're still using it'... until the fateful day last year I called 'oh we got rid of that a few months ago, we gave it away to someone else who was interested since you hadn't called in a while...'. Bugger. Asked if they would put me in touch with this chap, as he had got a large quantity of spares with it, including a complete CPU/memory 'gate' - enough to build a fourth machine if he had had a rack etc. - thought it would make sense to pool resources. Said they would ask him for permission to put me in touch, he adamantly refused... secretive collectors, bah humbug. So that's three in the UK. Four, with the addition of the Science Museum / CCS example. Most are probably working or near-working, mine has some things to fix, been in storage for years. Now, I would be interested in a list of pdp-15's... Mike http://www.corestore.org _________________________________________________________________ MSN 8 with e-mail virus protection service: 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/virus

23 years, 3 months

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ADMIN: What if ClassicCmp were a blog?

by dwightk.elvey＠amd.com

>From: pete(a)dunnington.u-net.com > >On Jan 15, at various times, Jeffrey Sharp wrote: > >> In my quest to cover every aspect, to think about every permutation of >what >> ClassicCmp *could* be in the future, I have yet another question to ask >> ClassicCmp subscribers: What if ClassicCmp were a weblog, in the style of >> Slashdot or Kuro5hin? > >I have to add my vote to the many others who've said "NO!!!" > >> - Posting and reading of messages would be doable from a web browser. >An >> email interface could be developed, but it wouldn't be the primary >> method of participation. > >I would hate that. > >> - You would have an account with a username and password. > >Right, I need another username/password (likely with different rules to all >the rest) like I need another hole in my head :-) > ---snip--- I see no particular advantage to using a browser for the use of this group. If one looks at the attempts with something as global as news groups, we would be quickly trashed with hundreds of "Please fix my PCee" stuff from those that have little interest in classic machines. If we made it a closed group, like it is now, we'd still have the problem that even with current technology, many of us are bandwidth limited on how we use the web ( minor problem for me ). I can't think of any real advantage of going to some web based system and it would surely remove many from our group. DON'T TRY TO FIX WHAT ISN'T BROKEN!!!! Dwight

23 years, 3 months

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ADMIN: What if ClassicCmp were a blog?

by pete＠dunnington.u-net.com

On Jan 15, at various times, Jeffrey Sharp wrote: > In my quest to cover every aspect, to think about every permutation of what > ClassicCmp *could* be in the future, I have yet another question to ask > ClassicCmp subscribers: What if ClassicCmp were a weblog, in the style of > Slashdot or Kuro5hin? I have to add my vote to the many others who've said "NO!!!" > - Posting and reading of messages would be doable from a web browser. An > email interface could be developed, but it wouldn't be the primary > method of participation. I would hate that. > - You would have an account with a username and password. Right, I need another username/password (likely with different rules to all the rest) like I need another hole in my head :-) > - Members can participate from any computer with a web browser. Even lynx. > Surely anything that can run a mail client can run lynx... Browsers are much more cumbersome and slow than any sensible email client. And run on fewer systems. I sometimes use older systems for which there is no web browser, not even a text-based one, but there is a mail client. And using a browser require you to be online to read, which is not so good for those of us who use dialup. It also makes it harder to save individual messages. I often do that with mail; it's much harder to keep copies of web pages sensibly. > - Anonymity and privacy can be more well-respected. The 'sender' of a > post is your username, not your email address. A system can be > implemented where another member can discover your email address only > after you give them permission to do so. You could also do that with mail. I'd prefer that wasn't implemented, though see below. Sometimes it's more appropriate to respond directly to someone, off-list. > - There's no worry about HTML, attachments, wierd character sets, spam, > virii, or cctech moderation delay. You could do most of that with email filtering too. In fact, it would be nice, in my opinion, if we did filter out the HTML (and the HTML portions of multipart/alternate messages, which we seem to have had more of recently). > - Your inbox receives less clutter. You spend less bandwidth on mail. Actually, most people would spend *more* bandwidth on a website, because going back to a previously-viewed message would typically reload the page. More importantly, there are a lot of dialup users here. With a website you need to be online all the time you're reading, rather than slurping down a chunk of mail (as my system does a few times a day) to read offline. Less importantly, my system can do an early-morning mail fetch just before the end of the cheaper-rate nighttime period, and the mail is then there for me to read when I'm sufficiently awake (ie after two mugs of coffee) a little later (daytime call rate). > - It's a huge change from the status quo. We may lose some members. Including me :-) Returning to the idea of having both email and a website, isn't the website essentially an extension of the existing archive (possibly more sophisticated)? I agree it's good to have both, but let's keep the mailing list as the primary and the archive as, well, an archive. > The trouble with MUAs is getting some way of either (a) serving > mail folders to remote locations or (b) serving the login session to remote > locations. Both of those are doable (IMAP, SSH) but can be a pain to set up > for some users. Then there's the problem of ensuring you have the right > software at the remote location (IMAP-capable email client, SSH client). In > some cases (e.g. student lab, internet cafe on vacation), you can't count on > that. In nearly every case, you *can* count on some form of web browser. I disagree. Most ISPs run either IMAP or POP3 (or both). I have yet to see an Internet cafe, or attend a conference with 'net facilites, where I couldn't read my email. *Replying* to the list might be a problem in a few cases, but most ISPs (at least, most I'm familiar with here) operate some kind of authentication system so that users away from their normal location can still send mail (eg replies) from Internet cafes and the like. > On Wednesday, January 15, 2003, JP Hindin wrote: > > It surely can't be hard to have the mailing list archival software munge > > eMail addresses... > > Not at all. But messages delivered to subscribers aren't address munged. You > can look at the headers of this message and get my email address. I don't > think it's a big deal, but someone else might. Fair point. I don't mind my address being in the headers either, and in fact I prefer them to be there so people can email me directly, but if some do and some don't prefer that, perhaps we could set some preference per-user so that their submissions are/not munged. Some list manager software has that facility built-in. Summing that lot up, if the list were changed to become primarily web-based, I'd vote with my feet -- albeit with great regret -- but I have no objection at all to enhancing some of the mail facilities and providing additional methods of access and/or additional services. -- Pete Peter Turnbull Network Manager University of York

23 years, 3 months

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hackers Guide to the Apple II

by cmurray＠eagle.ca

Hi Tony(Duell), Yes indeed the term 'hacker' was used in the original form as it was created back by MIT students in the 60s. It was an honorable title. Murray--

23 years, 3 months

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Ron Collison (and anyone else): XENIX

by justin＠ingrid.raspberrytea.com

I would be interested in buying XENIX, or trading for something. I would have replied to your email, but I read these forums on the web interface, so your email didn't appear there, and I don't have it delivered. If anyone has copies still availible, please email me: justin(a)raspberrytea.com BTW, whats true about the number of manuals/disks, etc, etc. Anyone have good resources on capabilities? does X compile on it? support for video. I assume it doesn't work, but then I've seen stranger things. Thanks!, Justin

23 years, 3 months

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Help with pricing on vintage computers?

by acme＠ao.net

From: Sellam Ismail <foo(a)siconic.com> > On Tue, 14 Jan 2003, Mike Ford wrote: > > > I love this logic, the price on ebay a place where all the traditional > > requirements of willing buyer, willing seller, and open market are met, > > isn't valid because its too high. No the acceptable price is the price you > > once saw in a scrapyard after years of digging through the place 3 times a > > week and have never seen since. > > Pasta tastes good with marinara. ????? Glen 0/0

23 years, 3 months

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Maxtor drive goes under

by SUPRDAVE＠aol.com

In a message dated 1/16/2003 2:00:16 PM Eastern Standard Time, philpem(a)dsl.pipex.com writes: << 2GB and 4GB drives started appearing... To this day I refuse to touch Kalok drives, not that there's many of them left. And if this bloody Seagate 52520 in my webrouter clunk-clicks once more it's getting swapped out! $DEITY, this thing is almost as loud as the Kalok was when it failed. Speaking of which, has anyone got a Kalok drive in their collection? Dead or alive? >> Ive got one. A 20meg one I think and it worked when it was put away. very noisy though. Looks cheap.

23 years, 3 months

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Macro Assembler, Xenix, 8086/8088 Primer, Mac Repair, and early version of DOS

by collison＠cnri.reston.va.us

Macro Assembler, Xenix, 8086/8088 Primer, Mac Repair, and early version of DOS To those of you who have sent email expressing interest in 1 or more of the above, I have not forgotten - I have not had time to respond, yet - hope to shortly

23 years, 3 months

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A couple of Good Finds Today

by pete＠dunnington.u-net.com

On Jan 15, 18:44, Keys wrote: > At Goodwill I got a book titled BIT BY BIT An Illustrated History of > Computers by Stan Augarten for 25 cents and it has lots of great pictures > and stories in it. That's a good book. I got my copy for 50 pence several years ago. -- Pete Peter Turnbull Network Manager University of York

23 years, 3 months

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ADMIN: What if ClassicCmp were a blog?

by pete＠dunnington.u-net.com

On Jan 15, 22:43, Jeffrey Sharp wrote: > On Wednesday, January 15, 2003, Zane H. Healy wrote: > > With email I can read CLASSICCMP on anything, with a Web-board, I'd be > > limited to a modern computer. > > Surely anything that can run a mail client can run lynx... Not necessarily. My older Acorn machines can read and send mail but there's no web browser that will run on them. I wouldn't be at all surprised to find that's also true of some other older systems that people here might use. -- Pete Peter Turnbull Network Manager University of York

23 years, 3 months

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Mac TV

by cb＠mythtech.net

>Just out of interest, can a Mac TV output PAL video and operate off 230V >(UK >mains voltage)? I'd love to get one (and get it to do something useful), >but >they don't seem to have appeared in the UK market yet. >OTOH, I *do* have a VCR that can operate as an NTSC->PAL converter... I can't say for 100% sure, but I would say that most likely, yes, it will work. Most Mac's could handle dual power IIRC (either auto detecting, or via a switch on the power supply), and Apple's other TV Tuner cards can input NTSC, PAL, and SECAM, you just select which one you want in a preference for the TV Viewer application. So I would guess the MacTV will do it as well. You will need a connector to convert from a screw on F connector, to a PAL connector, but that should be easy to come by. But, a note, you ask can it OUTPUT PAL, if you really mean output, like use the tuner in the MacTV, and run it to a VCR or another TV, then the answer may be no, as I don't think the MacTV output anything. You connected the antenna or cable to the Mac, and watched TV directly on the Mac screen. You could toggle between TV viewing or Mac (and IIRC, watch TV in a 1/4 size screen on the Mac desktop as well). But all viewing was done directly on the Mac itself. -chris <http://www.mythtech.net>

23 years, 3 months

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Maxtor drive goes under

by bones＠northrock.bm

It's always fascinated me how people have such strong opinions of one particular drive manufacturer over another. Commonly one will say that they have a certain make of drive and it's never failed them and they've tried this other one and they're dying left and right, etc. ad nauseum. I come at this issue from the perspective of a field service engineer and subsequently independant consultant. The fact is that, particularly with IDE drives, no matter the manufacturer, it's purely the luck of the draw whether one is blessed with a good production run. I get the feeling that, to cut costs, most manufacturers have the QC people working a couple of days a week, and even then they're not exactly the best paid position in the sweatshop. The same goes for cars - you just find the one you're psychologically comfortable with. No bearing on statistical reality, but to the buyer that manufacturer's product will always be superior, and faults will be more tolerable than those of the manufacturer who's product is "in the doghouse" for whatever reason. As for Dell going the way of PacBell, etc., well I can only say we've got what we asked for. We wanted cheap computing, we got cheap computing. If they raised their standards and correspondingly their prices, we'd run like heck to the next guy who offered their system for a couple of quid less. If you want a rock-solid system with total manufacturer's support and guaranteed uptime and all that jazz, you'd have to shell out over $50,000 plus support contracts, etc. Just like in the old days of some of the larger systems we discuss on this forum. Just my $12.34 (Like everything else here in Bermuda, my opinion has to be shipped here and customs duty paid <grin>). With apologies for the rant, Dennis (not Miller :-)

23 years, 3 months

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IBM 5322

by xds_sigma7＠hotmail.com

Here, in the future, use the IBM US Sales Manual: http://www2.ibmlink.ibm.com/cgi-bin/master?xh=6IoY5YcEq*i*pR1USenGnN9332&re… Yes, its a NASTY looking address, but using that took me .23 seconds to find out the 5322 is a Datamaster CPU.. but then I scrolled down and the beast had been ID'ed. Will J _________________________________________________________________ The new MSN 8: smart spam protection and 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail

23 years, 3 months

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PDP-11/60 available for pickup in Houston

by dlw＠trailingedge.com

I have a PDP 11/60 available in Houston. It is untested and in an unknown state. There are just the two main components out of the cabinet with cards (I don't know what all cards are in there) and the two power supply units. Also have a front panel control. I'm being force to get rid of these as soon as possible. If nobody wants them I'll have to take it to the scrapper. Hopefully there is someone out there that can take these and make good use of them. ----- "If you want to see it, see into it directly; but when you stop to think about it, it is altogether missed." "When the mind is free of any thought or judgement, then and only then can we know things as they are." David Williams - Computer Packrat dlw(a)trailingedge.com http://www.trailingedge.com

23 years, 3 months

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OT: paging MAC expert(s) --- What's a Performa

by alhartman＠yahoo.com

> > I have a 200Mhz 6400 tower. Pretty nice machine, > except that it lacks > > ethernet. I've got it running MacOS 8.0, and until > recently, I also had BeOS > > on it. Runs both really well. Has a built in > subwoofer for incredibly rich > > sound. My main complaint: Other than adding RAM or > PCI cards, upgrades are > > nearly impossible with that impenetrable case. There was a recent article in MacAddict that a model of PCI Ethernet Cards from D-Link has MacOS 9/X drivers. I've bought several and they work great! And they are 10/100... Model number is DFE-530TX+, I've bought them for under $20.00US Give it a go! Regards, Al Hartman (Macintosh Emulation List Host) http://www.topica.com/lists/MacEmuList Enlightenment means taking full responsibility for your life. - William Blake __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com

23 years, 3 months

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ADMIN: What if ClassicCmp were a blog?

by Edward.Tillman＠valero.com

I have to agree with most of what I've read here. Though I'm very new to your list, I'd really much rather it stay an e-mail list. To do otherwise, puts me in mind of the the bulky and cantankerous mail groups in MSN (Hotmail) or Yahoo - lotsa spash and excess drivel, but much less bang for your buck. Further, you'd lose the spontenaiety. For folk who have trouble picking out the thread they want to follow in the lists, they can always configure their e-mail clients with topic folders (yeah, even older e-mail clients like Eudora or Juno; and for those even older, echo/netmail offline readers!). That puts the onus back on the participant, and not on an often overworked administrator or moderator. As an ex-BBS sysop (1.387.57, 1991-1997), that's a position I can well apreciate. Cheers! Ed Tillman Store Automation Tech Support Specialist Valero Energy Corporation San Antonio, TX; USA Phone (210) 592-3110, Fax (210) 592-2048 edward.tillman(a)valero.com <mailto:edward.tillman@valero.com> > -----Original Message----- > From: cctalk-admin@classiccmp.org@PEUSA On Behalf Of Paul > Thompson <thompson(a)new.rr.com> > Sent: Wednesday, January 15, 2003 9:39 PM > To: cctalk(a)classiccmp.org > Subject: Re: ADMIN: What if ClassicCmp were a blog? > > On Wed, 15 Jan 2003, Zane H. Healy wrote: > > > Email is a fast, sleek and lowbandwidth medium. Web-boards, on the > > otherhand are cumbersome and time consuming. With email I can read > > CLASSICCMP on anything, with a Web-board, I'd be limited to a modern > > computer. If this were to happen, I can guarentee a lot of people would > > leave. > > > -- >

23 years, 3 months

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Mac TV

by cb＠mythtech.net

>So I should offer the guy something like 10 bucks for it and then offer it >to the list for like 30 or, that way I can make some money to send to VISA >and someone who loves Macs will be happy and it won't get junked, in other >words. Please don't flame me for wanting to profit, but I'm seriously broke >and need to pay Chris Kennedy/Visa/my parents/go to college/get gas/fix my >power steering/pay J. Darren Petersen/etc. I think a $20 profit is fair, as >I already spent time finding it, gas getting there, and would spend money >obtaining it as well. Thoughts? Yes... if you can snag it for $10, and small profit is worth you time, then by all means, do it. And if it works and/or is relatively complete, let me know... I'll buy it >from you. My overall point before wasn't that you should NOT buy one, just that you should not pay a high price expecting that you will get an even higher price for it later... but if you can get it cheap (like $10), you can be assured you will get some kind of profit on it. There is nothing wrong with making a profit on things... I just didn't want you to get burned thinking that the MacTV was going to get Lisa 1 like prices, and so you ran out and paid $100 for one expecting to resell it for $1,000. -chris <http://www.mythtech.net>

23 years, 3 months

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Still no action (PDP-8/L repair)

by charlesmorris＠direcway.com

On Wed, 15 Jan 2003 22:33:17 -0600, you wrote: >><HOPE> Shouldn't be too hard to find </HOPE> >>since it's doing nothing. If it had flaky bits or words or pages, >>different story, but absolutely dead can only be a few things. > >Ya, like a broken core sense wire! Fortunately that is not the case. All 64 X, 64 Y, sense and inhibit lines have the correct resistance. I found fairly quickly that B MEM ENABLE was leaving its source but not getting to the core amps. I couldn't find the presumably broken wire on the backplane so I ran a jumper but still no function. (It's normally high all the time, so a disconnected TTL input is usually 1). this is somewhat depressing that the backplane may have reached end-of-life, if bad wirewraps are starting to show up. It is over thirty years old... Now READ and WRITE are pulsing to the selectors. Unfortunately I don't have a current probe to check out the R/W currents and waveforms. Guess I could put a .1 ohm resistor in the line which would give a 32 mv signal on the 320 ma pulse. -Charles

23 years, 3 months

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DEC PDT-11/150

by tim.myers＠protasis.co.uk

I'm having to get rid of my collection due to losing the space it's housed in. The PDP-11/73s have already gone on Ebay, as has the Transputer kit. Next to go is my PDT11/150, you can find it here http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=1247&item=23016 11053&rd=1. I never got round to playing with this machine, and I know very little about it, I hope someone can give it a good home. Tim.

23 years, 3 months

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Need to get hold of Jim Austin

by xds_sigma7＠hotmail.com

I'd be interested in hearing about HP 1000 Lab Automation systems as well, since my HP-1000E (2113E) was originally part of of.. 3353E I believe. Will J _________________________________________________________________ MSN 8 with e-mail virus protection service: 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/virus

23 years, 3 months

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Need to get hold of Jim Austin

by tim.myers＠protasis.co.uk

Could Jim Austin please drop me a line re: HP 1000 Lab Automation Systems. Tim.

23 years, 3 months

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Octane comes from October (WasRichard Crandall just cancelled a payment to you)

by xds_sigma7＠hotmail.com

Hans, Likely just another case of Germans doing something better (IMHO), much like DIN versus SAE horsepower. I did know about the R+M/2 method for American gas, and you can get 100 octane here, just not easily in my state.. In California, some 76 stations sell 100 octane. Will J _________________________________________________________________ Add photos to your e-mail with MSN 8. Get 2 months FREE*. http://join.msn.com/?page=features/featuredemail

23 years, 3 months

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Utter eBay Madness (was help w/pricing)

by xds_sigma7＠hotmail.com

>Would that be traction or stationary ? > Rich Stephenson Don't leave out steam engines as in steam locomotives, railroad equipment... Will J _________________________________________________________________ MSN 8 helps eliminate e-mail viruses. Get 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/virus

23 years, 3 months

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SV: IBM system 3 Re: PDP-12 on eBay (IBM 650 on ebay)

by xds_sigma7＠hotmail.com

I must be due for finding something damned cool then, since I gave my -2065 to Eric as I couldn't rescue it... No way would I let that hit the dumpster! Will J _________________________________________________________________ MSN 8 with e-mail virus protection service: 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/virus

23 years, 3 months

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ADMIN: What if ClassicCmp were a blog?

by julesrichardsonuk＠yahoo.co.uk

> What is your opinion? Let's answer this one in-list, please. on the car front, I go through www.triumphstag.net which was initially set up as a web interface to the mailing list, but has slowly evolved into something more like what you describe for classiccmp. sounds like that's the sort of thing you'd need as the mailing list is still the primary means of communication but the website adds the registry, 'for sale' list and other odds and ends. The web interface to the mail gateway does have the odd problem now and then, with some posts occasionally turning up twice - drop Dave (who runs the site) an email as he should be able to shed some more light as to why! I think I'd still use the classiccmp mailing list for emails, but it'd be nice to have somewhere to store information (as mentioned in another post to this list) and be able to search archives etc. by the way, I'm never seen all the HTML and base64 junk on the Stag list that seems to come through to classiccmp - it must be filtered out somehow in which case it'd seem sensible to look into how to do that for this list! :-) (and if you could filter out my yahoo automatically-added .sig that's be good too ;-) cheers Jules __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Everything you'll ever need on one web page >from News and Sport to Email and Music Charts http://uk.my.yahoo.com

23 years, 3 months

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ADMIN: What if ClassicCmp were a blog?

by Edward.Tillman＠valero.com

Please see my point-by-point comments below... Cheers! Ed Tillman Store Automation Tech Support Specialist Valero Energy Corporation San Antonio, TX; USA Phone (210) 592-3110, Fax (210) 592-2048 edward.tillman(a)valero.com <mailto:edward.tillman@valero.com> > -----Original Message----- > From: cctalk-admin@classiccmp.org@PEUSA On Behalf Of JP Hindin > <jplist(a)kiwigeek.com> > Sent: Wednesday, January 15, 2003 10:08 PM > To: cctalk(a)classiccmp.org > Subject: Re: ADMIN: What if ClassicCmp were a blog? > > > > On Wed, 15 Jan 2003, Jeffrey Sharp wrote: > > Right away, I see several benefits: > > - Members can participate from any computer with a web browser. Even > lynx. > And right now members can use any eMail client, even elm or > mutt... They're just as common, right? > [Tillman, Edward] Web browsers are slower, crankier, and more of a hassle than any email client, including the older ones... > > - Anonymity and privacy can be more well-respected. The 'sender' of a > > post is your username, not your email address. A system can be > It surely can't be hard to have the mailing list archival software munge > eMail addresses... It seems to be doing it now okay. Where's the problem? > [Tillman, Edward] If the person really wants that kind of privacy, why is he/she here? From my admittedly short-lived perspective, this list is a rather comfortable coming-together of professionals and hobbyists, experts and laymen who like what they do, and want to share their information and resources openly. Putting it all behind the proverbial firewall would most assuredly kill it. > > - There's no worry about HTML, attachments, wierd character sets, > spam, > > virii, or cctech moderation delay. > You can't attach eMails to the list can you? (How do you attach a worm > therefore?). As for HTML and character sets, its a small inconvenience > honestly - not that many posters use it, after all. > [Tillman, Edward] Moderation delay *can* be a good thing. What's the issue? > > - Your inbox receives less clutter. You spend less bandwidth on mail. > Instead you spend it on all the extra HTML markup on web page posts? > [Tillman, Edward] If folks want less clutter in their inboxes, they can darned well configure their email clients with topic folders (rules...), as I do both at home and at work. That way, the list downloads directly to its folder, leaves my inboxes clean, and is in a tight package when I'm ready to read it... Almost all email clients, regardless of age, allow that. > > - It scales well as more members join and start posting. > [Tillman, Edward] As an email list, directly configured into user defined topic folders, this isn't even an issue. > With a fine MTA (qmail anyone?) you can do alright, but I agree, a slick > mod_perl style web interface probably scales "better". > However, as my friend always used to say, when we are so logged with > traffic that we have scaling issues - well that will be a good day indeed > to know we are that popular, and dealing with it will be a joy. > (He was a Buddhist, what can I say) > [Tillman, Edward] Buddist, huh? Maybe that's why all this is working so well...? (snickers!, smiles!) > > - Features you want can be added in code, quickly. The current setup > is > > great for turn-key mailing lists and such, but it is tough to > extend. > > What kind of extra features? > [Tillman, Edward] Ditto... (?) > This is just my two cents; I would rather not move to such a style of > list. I think classiccmp is wonderful the way it is. > Feel free to pick bones out of my retort. > [Tillman, Edward] Hehehe... I kow how you feel. Sysops, Admins and Mods always wanna experiment, and sometimes, we even do it right. I discovered a long time ago, to my chagrin when I lost over 100 users on a BBS: If you have a good thing, don't mess with it. > JP >

23 years, 3 months

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Technique for scanning in documentation

by tim＠tim-mann.org

> Acrobat 4 can import up to 50 files at once. So if you have > scanned to 50 individual TIFFs you can import them all in > one go (it's not that speedy though!). I expect that > Acrobat 5 can also import, but I could never find the > right menu ! What it can do (which 4 and earlier could not) > is spit out a PDF file as individual G4 compressed TIFFs. G4 compression is pretty poor. I really like DjVu format instead of PDF. It uses much better compression technology (JBIG2 for bitonal black/white and fractal compression for color images) and gives better legibility as well. Check out the free, open source tools for creating and viewing it at http://djvu.sourceforge.net/, and the free-beer Windows and Mac viewers at www.djvu.com. For DjVu examples, see some of the newer documents on my TRS-80 page, http://www.tim-mann.org/misosys.html I think Acrobat 5 may also have JBIG2 compression, though earlier versions didn't, so if you have that, you may do about as well as DjVu for bitonal (aka "line art") scans. People trying to view them will need an up-to-date version of the Acrobat reader too, of course. -- Tim Mann tim(a)tim-mann.org http://www.tim-mann.org/

23 years, 3 months

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Mac TV

by xds_sigma7＠hotmail.com

So I should offer the guy something like 10 bucks for it and then offer it to the list for like 30 or, that way I can make some money to send to VISA and someone who loves Macs will be happy and it won't get junked, in other words. Please don't flame me for wanting to profit, but I'm seriously broke and need to pay Chris Kennedy/Visa/my parents/go to college/get gas/fix my power steering/pay J. Darren Petersen/etc. I think a $20 profit is fair, as I already spent time finding it, gas getting there, and would spend money obtaining it as well. Thoughts? Will J _________________________________________________________________ The new MSN 8 is here: Try it free* for 2 months http://join.msn.com/?page=dept/dialup

23 years, 3 months

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Web-based MailList: No.

by jpl15＠panix.com

I personally would hate/loathe/despise any web-based Krep, since I (and a very small minority of others) read my mail in ASCII using Pine under a Unix Shell account, and I ain't plannin' on a-changin' it. Although there is something to be said of the Wikiwiki scenario... it seems to bridge the User Interface gap well. Of course I can't speak as to it's Admin or Secure aspects... Cheers 7-Bit John

23 years, 3 months

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M100 Keys Sought

by Edward.Tillman＠valero.com

Wanna grab a shuttle pod and take a spin? I'm sure we can find an ol' 486/33 computer to run the thing... Cheers! Ed Tillman Store Automation Tech Support Specialist Valero Energy Corporation San Antonio, TX; USA Phone (210) 592-3110, Fax (210) 592-2048 edward.tillman(a)valero.com <mailto:edward.tillman@valero.com> > -----Original Message----- > From: cctalk-admin@classiccmp.org@PEUSA On Behalf Of "Eric > Smith" <eric(a)brouhaha.com> > Sent: Wednesday, January 15, 2003 6:20 PM > To: cctalk(a)classiccmp.org > Cc: 3sdiarftt02(a)sneakemail.com > Subject: Re: RE: M100 Keys Sought > > >> Should I bet on the galaxy? > > > > No keys. > > Are you certain? It has on occasion taken me 15 minutes to find keys > just around my house. I'd expect that verifying that the M100 galaxy > has no keys would take one heck of a long time. > > > >

23 years, 3 months

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M100 Keys Sought

by Edward.Tillman＠valero.com

Ed Tillman Store Automation Tech Support Specialist Valero Energy Corporation San Antonio, TX; USA Phone (210) 592-3110, Fax (210) 592-2048 edward.tillman(a)valero.com <mailto:edward.tillman@valero.com> > -----Original Message----- > From: cctalk-admin@classiccmp.org@PEUSA On Behalf Of "Dwight K. > Elvey" <dwightk.elvey(a)amd.com> > Sent: Wednesday, January 15, 2003 1:33 PM > To: cctalk(a)classiccmp.org > Subject: Re: M100 Keys Sought > > >From: "Fred Cisin (XenoSoft)" <cisin(a)xenosoft.com> > > > >> > Is that the Samsung M100 phone? > >> > Or the Lotus Elan M100? > >> > (I doubt that you have the M100 spiral galaxy for sale) > > > >On Tue, 14 Jan 2003, Scarletdown wrote: > >> I'll sell you the Large Magellanic Cloud for $50,000, and throw in > >> the Small Magellanic Cloud as a bonus. :) > > > >Sorry. > >Much as I'd love to add it to my collection, I'm having MAJOR > >problems with storage space - I had to hand over most of my > >collection to Sellam, just due to lack adequate space. > >(space is NOT expanding) > > > > > > Hi > EPA might complain. Super nova 1997A has been spewing > out a lot of radio active waste. Since this is part of > it, shipping may also be an issue. > Dwight > [Tillman, Edward] In that case, maybe a small lead-lined box? or ball? Wonder what kind of safety features came with Orion's Belt? After all -- that big ol' galaxy in that itty-bitty ball... Cheers!

23 years, 3 months

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