I wrote:
> If I get the 11/730 running, I'll worry about a name then.
> [mentioned net-booting]
Antonio Carlini wrote:
> It will boot from the TU58 but I don't know of anything that
> will then boot it over the net over MOP.
Jochen Kunz suggested:
> The NetBSD/VAX boot loader?
> It uses DHCP and NFS to load an ELF image.
This might work. This 11/730 was packaged in a low-boy (~42" tall)
rack with RL02 on top, an R80 on the bottom. I received the host
because it was crashing on bad sectors in the R80, and the person
using it was given a free 11/750 & rack of RA81s from another lab.
The TU58 might be a bit cramped for a full-on bootloader with all
kinds of network support at 256k minus whatever else needs to be
on there for the machine to boot to the console. However, if it
can then read a more complete loader from the RL02, or even a
miniroot...
Hmmm... Very Interesting...
--Steve.
I lost (in addition to lots of old computer items) two
things I'm trying to get information for my insurance
company on.
The first is a ASR35 that was 'loaded', over the years
I had converted a TWX ASR35 in to on that had every
option you could think of.
I just did a search of Google, and could find almost no
references to it, sad in its own right.
I also lost a ASR 38, but that's for another time.
The other item destroyed, was a IBM 129 Punch card verifier.
A 129 is a 29, with the ability to verify previously
punched cards. It also could be used as a card reader. Mine
had that option.
Both were very clean, low usage. They both were 'backup'
machines that in the case of the 129, had less then 100 hours
on its run time meter.
Both had full sets of manuals, spare parts etc. The 35 included
a never used type unit in the box.
So if anyone could help with where I can start to look for
replacements, value etc. I would be most thankful.
Thanks in advance for any leads
-pete
Hi,
I have a couple of Brikon model 723 floppy drive testers made by Brian
Instruments of Fullerton, California. One of the testers that I have has
the "R" option. The "R" option is a feature that includes a bunch of flying
leads tahat you can attach to various test points on the drive under test
and measure various analog parameters. It's shown in the factory brochure
and it appears to be a ribbon cable with a small blue box on it and about 8
or 10 individual leads coming out of the box. The leads appear to have
banana plugs on them where they plug into the box and the other ends have
grabber clips on them. Does anyone have one of these cable/pods? If so can
you send me the pin out so that I can make one or can I borrow it long
enough to make schematics of it?
Joe
Mike,
I just found you message about having the ciruit diagrams for a Disk Smith System 80. I found one of these the other day in a recyling center and always had a soft spot for them as it was first computer. The one I found works, but has a problem in the video circuit. It is repairable, but would be a lot easier if I had schematics to work from (I collect video games from the same era as well so my skills in repairing these would help me a great deal :) If you have a scan or even a photocopy of this manual, I would glady purchase it off you.
Cheers, Geoff
I was driving into town when I spoted the aforementioned computer in some
phule's garbage. I stopped and pulled it out. However, when I turn it
on, the screen comes up 4 grey scan lines, then alternating 8 black scan
lines and 8 grey scan lines. A friend mentioned that this is normal boot
config, that it should then proceed to the happy mac icon and so on. He
asked if the ROM was still in it. I can't get the box open though : I
don't have the extra special long torx driver to get at the 2 top screws.
And the hex extention bits I have don't fit into the hole.
Anyone have a clue about how to revive this? I'd love to get netbsd
running on it.
Or is it hopeless?
-Philip
This is yet another incomplete project that I am trying to finish... I
have an IBM System/23 Datamaster, and I am attempting to get it to
work. When turned on, it displays a series of numbers on the screen,
and stops at "FD". Of the numbers printed, "0B" is inverted and
flashing. I found a listing of the error codes in google's cache of
classiccmp.org (part of the archive seems to be down).
http://216.239.51.104/search?q=cache:83dbK69EHG8J:www.classiccmp.org/
mail-archive/classiccmp/1997-07/0566.html+IBM+System/
23+error+site:www.classiccmp.org&hl=en&ie=UTF-8 According to this,
the error code "0B" indicates that one of the ROM chips on the logic
board has failed. The chip is soldered to the board, but replacing it
with a socket and an EPROM shouldn't be a problem, but I don't know
anything about these chips, or if they have an EPROM equivalent. I have
repaired my EPROM programmer, so I now have the ability to burn my own
EPROM chips. The problem I face now is that I need the data for the new
chip. Does anyone have a ROM image of this chip that they could send
me? Also, does anyone know the pinouts of these ROM chips on the
System/23 board? (or as IBM calls them, ROS modules, for Read Only
Storage). Thanks!
Ian Primus
ian_primus(a)yahoo.com
Hi, the UNIBUS FAQ sais that the grant cards G727A is a dual-height
card with NPG grant. But from the cards I have I see the G727A is
a single height card with only bus grant, not NPG, and it is a
knucklebuster. The one that's dual-height and has handles is the
G7273. I also have a 3rd party vendor dual height bus+NPG grant card.
I suppose it shouldn't be too hard to make grant cards yourself.
I think I have my VAX11/780 UNIBUS under control now. I threw out
all cards except for the UDA50 pair, put in a new terminator and
filled all with appropriate grant cards. Now the UDA50 initializes
fine and I get the 8/9 blink fine the port-A light goes on on the
RA90. Still the VAX doesn't seem to get anywhere and after a while
the lights go off. May be I'm too impatient and should just wait
long enough?
-Gunther
> > I'd be interested to find out what network names/nicknames some
other
> > classiccmpers have given their machines.
Mine are an assortment of groups.
The SGIs, which are the largest group that are networked, are mindy (my
original Indy), mork (another Indy), mearth (another!), orson (Origin
2000), volgar and exidor (O2s), but the Indigos mostly still have the
names they were given by previous owners (dopey, ziggi, mrtoad, ...).
My laptop is called dancer because it moves about; the windows PC is
called floorbox because it's just a box that sits on the floor. The
NeXT slab is predicably called monolith (blame the previous owner). I
have a few Acorn machines named after districts around Newcastle (which
is where a couple of them came from), and a few other machines
(PDP-11s, microVAXen, a couple of Suns, a Mac, etc) named by their
previous owners.
The network printers are star (a Star Laserprinter8), twinkle (big HP
colour deskjet), and coruscor (made up word, an HP LJ5M PostScript
printer).
Most of the rest are functional names (the GatorBox is gator, the
LANmodem is lanmodem, and the ATM switches and bridges are named after
their colours: orange (ATM-Ethernet), red (ATM-FDDI), purple (route
server), magenta (ATM switch)).
--
Pete Peter Turnbull
Network Manager
University of York
On Oct 18, 18:47, Jochen Kunz wrote:
> On 2003.10.18 06:40 Pete Turnbull wrote:
>
> > Mine are an assortment of groups.
> My "primary" names are James, MissSophie, SirTobie, MrWinterbottom
and
> AdmVonSchneider. If you don't know these names, well, I can't explain
> the origin. You have to see the film. ;-)
"Dinner For One". I've not see it for years, though. It should be
"Toby" though, not "Tobie" :-)
--
Pete Peter Turnbull
Network Manager
University of York
I know this is off-topic, but we all could use a good laugh.
NOTE: Remove all furry, feathered, or scaly critters from your lap, shoulders, or wherever, and put down all spillable and snortable substances, BEFORE you read this!
http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?threadid=160851
Other than that, enjoy! ;-)
-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
Bruce Lane, Owner & Head Hardware Heavy,
Blue Feather Technologies -- http://www.bluefeathertech.com
ARS KC7GR (Formerly WD6EOS) since 12-77 -- kyrrin(a)bluefeathertech.com
"Quando Omni Flunkus Moritati" (Red Green, aka Steve Smith)
Thanks for all the replies to my post.
All the PDP-11 stuff has been paid for, picked up, and has gone to a good home.
The PDP-8/I backplane is most likely spoken for.
Bill
Well, I had a very bad time with mailman and sendmail today. I was assuming
the problem was with sendmail. After screwing around with it all day, I'm
not so sure the problem is sendmail. I found the following items:
1) A LOT of people on the list have very slow mailservers. This is bad in
conjuction with the way mailman queues messages.
2) All the junk email coming into the list gets a "your post awaits
moderator approval" return email, and most of those domains don't exist, or
have servers that are extremely bogged down, also causing a problem with the
way mailman queues messages.
3) Mailman queues messages in very large groups. A single post to the list
generates 4 emails, each one with around 150 recipients. When sendmail
processes one of these single messages, as it sends to one of the recipients
and encounters a VERY slow mail server, everyone else on the recipient list
just sits and waits. The delays are... to me... well... horrid.
4) When I set mailman to send one email per recipient, sendmail still only
had one runner processing the queue. Of course, the same problem exists them
as #3.
Everything I tried seemed to make it the same or worse. I tried starting a
separate localhost only daemon of sendmail which doesn't do DNS lookups,
setting the outbound sendmail daemon for persistant queueing, put in a
caching only nameserver on the mailserver, set mailman to send one recipient
per message, etc. before running out of time to work on this. I suspect that
this all started with the upgraded mailman, this version apparently has it's
own message queueing and is very different from previous versions. I've
kinda hit the point of not being able to see the forest for the trees, so if
someone is up on mailman and sendmail I'd appreciate some insight. If you
have some thoughts (besides "dude, switch to using XXXXX for your MTA"),
please email me directly so I get the email quickly.
In response to the people who have suggested replacing sendmail... I would
like to call attention to what the website for mailman says. Bear in mind,
the mailman camp is somewhat anti-sendmail, instead favoring qmail, exim,
and postfix. However, note what THEY say about sendmail... "Moreover, with
appropriate work, sendmail can be configured to be the fastest and
highest-volume general-purpose MTA on the planet." This is in the section
where they compare sendmail to exim, qmail, and postfix. So I'm not the only
one who believes in sendmail.
I put things back the way they originally were. I'll ponder it over the
weekend.
Regards,
Jay West
jwest(a)classiccmp.org
---
[This E-mail scanned for viruses by Declude Virus]
Hi Bob
The boot loader for my Nicolet is similar in that
it over writes itself. It fits into about 15 words
so it is quite easy to toggle in. They even took
advantage of the 'don't care' fields in some instructions
to take advantage of minimizing switch changes. Even
the memory location is chosen because it is has bits
that fit well in adjacent instructions.
It is quite remarkable that they can squeeze so much
into so few instructions. I have written a boot loader
that I use to transfer data to and from an H89 ( Heathkit )
computer that takes about 52 bytes. Most is com port
initializing. It was nice when the hardware was jumper
configured. The loader would be much smaller.
The loader is such that I can send it by email and someone
can bring a H89 up from scratch. They just need a couple
of blank 10 sectored disks and my code.
Later
Dwight
>From: "Bob Shannon" <bshannon(a)tiac.net>
>
>Oh no, many HP boot loaders use self modifying code.
>
>Take a look at the source for the H 264X terminal boot rom, it alters an
>instruction by
>using it as the target for an increment-and-skip-on-zero instuction. HP
>took great pains
>to squeeze some boot loaders into only 64 words. As a result you have
>to reload these
>loaders from ROM each time they run.
>
>ben franchuk wrote:
>
>> Tony Duell wrote:
>>
>>>>> C requires a stack pointer and a index register.Offhand I don't
>>>>> think your hardware supports that.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Certain HP2xxx do have index registers (the ones with the EIG
>>>> instructions
>>>> IIRC), but guess how FORTRAN compilers handle indexed array accesses
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Err, self-modifying code? That was the traditional way to do this
>>> sort of thing.
>>
>>
>> I think the PC is noted more more self-modifying code than the old
>> machines. The only real self modifying code (on your typical early
>> machine) is the fact the return address is placed in the first word
>> of subroutine code.
>>
>>> -tony
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
I am looking for full source code for a *VERY* tiny C compiler written in
any common assembly language. I'm much more concerned with size of the
compiler than functionality/features. Can anyone suggest one or know where
the source might by laying around? I thought I had heard ages ago about some
microcomputer C compilers being well under 32K.
As to how this relates to classiccmp... well.. *blush* I'm actually thinking
of porting C to the HP2100. The whole thing has to fit in 32K of ram,
including drivers, etc. Not sure what OS it will be placed on, perhaps
HP-IPL/OS. Might make a simple native OS for it or might even make it
standalone, not sure yet.
Did I recently post about being overcomitted? heh
Jay
---
[This E-mail scanned for viruses by Declude Virus]
I picked up a DEC AlphaServer 2100 today. Is anyone interested in it?
It has what I believe to be a RAID array. I haven't looked inside yet.
Anyone interested in making an offer? I don't think I want to keep it.
--
Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org
[ Old computing resources for business || Buy/Sell/Trade Vintage Computers ]
[ and academia at www.VintageTech.com || at http://marketplace.vintage.org ]
please ignore
Not sure sure the problem is sendmail. There is much wailing and gnashing of
teeth going on here *sigh*
---
[This E-mail scanned for viruses by Declude Virus]
I have a number of old DECUS U.S. Symposium audio tapes that I would
like to archive before they completely disintegrate. I have a way to
digitize these and store them in a variety of formats. I'm not sure
what format is best for archive and distribution, though I assume
something like WAV or AIFF for archive and MP3 for distribution. I
have no prior experience at this and would appreciate any suggestions
on the best approach.
Also suggestions on who to contact to make these archives legally
available on the web would be welcome.
Is anyone else archiving these?
As a teaser, here's what I have:
1987 Fall:
N008 Understanding Ethernet
N037 Cryptographic Security for Ethernet
DA054 Optimizing VMS device Drivers for Realtime I/O
V104 Tape 1 VAX Magic, War Stories, and Horror Tales
V104 Tape 2
1988 Fall:
PC031 Internal Enhancements to AppleTalk for VMS
NE050 An Introduction to the Digital's Distributed Name Service (DNS)
GR054 Renderman: A 3D Scene Description Interface for Computer
Graphics System
GR033F Computer Graphic and Visualization
Thanks,
John
And of course there should be an "Uncle Donald" around there somewhere :-)
-----Original Message-----
From: cctalk-bounces(a)classiccmp.org
[mailto:cctalk-bounces@classiccmp.org]On Behalf Of Jay West
Sent: Friday, October 17, 2003 8:38 AM
To: cctalk(a)classiccmp.org
Subject: upcoming classiccmp wierdness
I finally have carved out a little time to work on the sendmail config for
huey (the classiccmp list server). I know exactly what needs to be done and
there are several ways to do it, I'm not sure which way is best. Hence, I
will be experimenting a bit today and possibly over the week. During that
time, expect some oddity from the list. I'll keep you posted on the
progress.
Trivia note - Why did I name the classiccmp list server machine huey? The
first computer I ever used was an HP 2000 TSB system in highschool. It's
name was Huey. I couldn't resist the nostalgia. We also had a PDP-11/03 with
RT-11 & TSX-plus. It was named Dewey. So if classiccmp ever gets split to
another machine, it will be called (you guessed it) Dewey. Three? Well,
Louie of course :)
Jay West
---
[This E-mail scanned for viruses by Declude Virus]
I finally have carved out a little time to work on the sendmail config for
huey (the classiccmp list server). I know exactly what needs to be done and
there are several ways to do it, I'm not sure which way is best. Hence, I
will be experimenting a bit today and possibly over the week. During that
time, expect some oddity from the list. I'll keep you posted on the
progress.
Trivia note - Why did I name the classiccmp list server machine huey? The
first computer I ever used was an HP 2000 TSB system in highschool. It's
name was Huey. I couldn't resist the nostalgia. We also had a PDP-11/03 with
RT-11 & TSX-plus. It was named Dewey. So if classiccmp ever gets split to
another machine, it will be called (you guessed it) Dewey. Three? Well,
Louie of course :)
Jay West
---
[This E-mail scanned for viruses by Declude Virus]
Actually the first calculator I bought in graduate school was a TI-52, I still have it and the manual. Please email me an address and I will email you a scan of the manual. My battery packs are shot but I have saved them. I also have the case. The 52 could do factorials and logs. It was really handy for computing probabilities using factorials for my statistics classes.
When I first went to college they had a remedial class for students who didn't know how to use a slide rule. I already knew how since my grandfather gave me one in 6th grade. I used a slide rule all through college until 1975 when I bought a calculator.
Mike
m m c f a d d e n a t c m h . e d u
> Hi, my name is Tobias and i own a TI-52 calculator. As it was given to me,
i'd really like
> to program it(thoug it's as old as me).
> But this model is too old, and i can't get a manual for it.
>
> So i'd like to enquire whether you know how to get a manual for the TI-52.
>
> Thanks in advance!
>
> best regards
> Tobias Petschke
>
>From: "Jim Battle" <frustum(a)pacbell.net>
>
>Dwight K. Elvey wrote:
>...
>> In any case, I never understood the stigma of using self
>> modifying code. It does require careful documentation if
>> it is expected to be maintained. There is no reason why
>> it can't be as robust as any other code if done properly.
>> I suspect it was used as a sales talk when someone was
>> trying to pitch their version of code to be better than
>> someone else's. Such things as overlays would qualify as
>> more risky uses of self modifying code but that is done
>> without mention.
>
>Obvious drawbacks --
>
>doesn't work if you ROM the code
>
>indeterminate behavior on certain chips that have instruction caches.
>the data cache snoops and invalidates the write address, but the
>instruction cache doesn't snoop and so requires an explicit flush (eg,
>the i860).
>
>even if the icache snoops the write, it can have a performance impact
>depending how often the code is modified since it can result in a full
>instruction pipe flush.
>
>even without caches, there can be a race between the data being written
>and the instruction fetch path. some self modifying code that works
>reliably on a 386 may not work on a 486.
>
>in an interrupt driven environment, such code is unlikely to be
>reentrant/thread safe/interrupt safe.
>
>it is harder to maintain.
>
>but, I agree, sometimes a coder has to do what a coder has to do.
>
>
Hi
I should have mentioned the issues with instruction caches
and pipelines. After all, our K8 is heavy into this. I was
thinking more in terms of small micros or even in the case
where there is a well defined cache that can be used to advantage.
Anytime one does something out of the ordinary, one needs
to make it clear all of the restrictions and such of how
it is to be used. One of the examples of how a known cache
can be to advantage is like the adsp2100 works. It has a 6
instruction cache so that it can do things like over write
the current instructions in memory for an overlay while
running the loader code from the cache. It does need the
interrupts disabled but this can be handy for something
like a flash update.
Dwight
Hey, all:
I'm meeting the nicest people lately. :) I've run into someone who
has a DEC Pro 350 which he'd like to sell to a respectful owner. Here's
his description of the system:
> DEC Pro-350 (circa fall 1983)
> 10GB drive
> 2 400K floppies (400K each? 800K each? now I don't remember)
> VT-220 style keyboard and display
> hang-on copyholder for the monitor
> vertical stand for the system unit
> all P/OS diskettes and manuals
> RSX-11M disks and manuals (some are copies)
> Original boxes (unsure of the condition)
>
> LA-100PC printer
> extra ribbons (if I can find them) - reinkable
> some rom cartridges including Epson MX-80 emulation (again - if I can
> find them)
> no box - sorry
>
> The BIOS battery is probably dead by now, but it's 3 AAA nicads if I
> remember. Other than that, it's ready to go.
I found it an encouraging sign that he regretted not having the original
printer box. :) Anyway, anyone who has an interest and/or questions
and/or offers can contact the owner directly. His name's Ron Hansen, his
e-mail is <ogre(a)brainlink.com>, and from the e-mails we've exchanged he
sounds like a nice guy. :)
Thanks!
-O.-
Message: 16
Date: Sat, 11 Oct 2003 09:04:11 -0400
From: Ian Primus <ian_primus(a)yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: ASR33 Teletype interfacing
To: "General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts"
<cctalk(a)classiccmp.org>
Message-ID: <67FFB9E5-FBEB-11D7-86CD-000393D7845A(a)yahoo.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed
I am late in an response to this ASR33 discussion but the comments here
definitely hit some memory banks buried deep.
In the early 70's, I recall that 120VDC was the source for 60ma current
loop to teletype, and it seems to me that "full-duplex" had the send
side sourced from the teletype and the receive side sourced from the
connected transmission equipment. There was something special that was
done to "echo" at the local printout any typed keys, It seems that it
was jumpers at the transmission equipment between the incoming "xmit"
current and the outgoing "Rcvd" current, again it must have put them in
series. It also rings in my head that the interfaces changed when 20ma
came out and they could not be intermixed. A machine would be either 60ma
or 20ma and required an overhaul to change it. 20ma was a result of reduced
physical part requirements for robustness and EMF splatter reduction.
Test equipment of the time put out "RY's", and that was almost a perfect
square wave at 120Vdc, 60ma as I remember. I have conveniently forgotten
most of what we did to repair these units, but I do remember a tank where
the units were given a bath in something??? If air couldn't get things
cleared and freed up, it got a bath then a complete relube???!!!!
The comments to "running open were correct. That is the sign that no
current was available to the unit. The current kept it "held".
On Thursday, October 9, 2003, at 04:52 PM, Tom Jennings wrote:
>> I have been attempting to get my ASR33 teletype connected to something
>> and communicating, but so far I have not been successful. I have built
>> the interface here :
>> http://www.daedalus.co.nz/~don/computing/20mahack.html
>
>
> It wont work, sorry...
>
Somehow I'm not surprised. Something told me that it was too simple to
work properly.
> Teletypes are inductive loads. Though they only want 20 mils, the
> voltage needs to be high to get the initial magnet pull-in (basic RL
> theory). ASR33 loops were generally run at 100V or so, but I run my
> Model 28 at 14V, with non-perfect error rate, and I don't use the
> keyboard.
I take it that the voltage isn't that crucial, just the current?
> The keyboard and printer are IN SERIES. If you hit keys while it's
> printing you foul it up. Normal.
What about on a full duplex machine? Is it the same, or are they
separate?
> Because it's inductive, it makes a spike when yuo turn the voltage off.
> You need to suppress this with a diode, a resistor and capacitor, for
> example.
>
> They're not subtle interfaces, and weren't meant to be.
>
> If you just want to print, you can rig up a power transistor, two
> resistors, a diode, and a high-voltage DC power supply to do the trick,
> and drive it from the serial port.
>
> If you want to receieve also, you can use another transistor and
> resistor to pick off the change in loop current that happens when you
> press keys which open the loop, and drive the serial port.
>
> I've done one of these fairly recently, and if poked with a
> not-too-sharp stick, I'll scan the schematic and pu on my website.
*poke*
<grin>
If it's not too much trouble, I'd like to see it. From what I have
heard, there are lots of ways to do this, and i would be very
interested to see how you did it.
Thanks!
Ian Primus
ian_primus(a)yahoo.com
---
Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
Version: 6.0.528 / Virus Database: 324 - Release Date: 10/16/2003
Does anyone have a copy of the host system software for the circa 1984
Seiko RC-1000 watch terminal?
I thought I had a copy that ran on DOS as a character mode app, but I
cannot find the original diskette. The original PC I used is long gone.
Dave.
>From: "ben franchuk" <bfranchuk(a)jetnet.ab.ca>
>
>Tony Duell wrote:
>>>>C requires a stack pointer and a index register.Offhand I don't think
>>>>your hardware supports that.
>>>
>>>Certain HP2xxx do have index registers (the ones with the EIG instructions
>>>IIRC), but guess how FORTRAN compilers handle indexed array accesses
>>
>>
>> Err, self-modifying code? That was the traditional way to do this sort of
>> thing.
>
>I think the PC is noted more more self-modifying code than the old
>machines. The only real self modifying code (on your typical early
>machine) is the fact the return address is placed in the first word
>of subroutine code.
>
>> -tony
>>
Hi
I don't call this self modifying. Where you have a port
command like the 8080 and you overwrite the port address
before executing, now that is self modifying. Something
like over writing an add instruction with a subtract
would qualify as self modifying. Placing the address at
the beginning is no different than pushing
the address onto a stack, other than that it isn't reentrant
( with out extra code and then not for interrupts ). The
first address isn't code, it is a variable space. The executed
code never changes.
My Nicolet uses the entry address saving method.
In any case, I never understood the stigma of using self
modifying code. It does require careful documentation if
it is expected to be maintained. There is no reason why
it can't be as robust as any other code if done properly.
I suspect it was used as a sales talk when someone was
trying to pitch their version of code to be better than
someone else's. Such things as overlays would qualify as
more risky uses of self modifying code but that is done
without mention.
Dwight
On Oct 16, 13:40, John Lawson wrote:
> ----------------cut n paste----------------------------
>
> Received: from huey.classiccmp.org (huey.classiccmp.org
> [209.145.140.36])
> by mail3.panix.com (Postfix) with ESMTP
> id B220098214; Thu, 16 Oct 2003 13:00:45 -0400 (EDT)
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> (envelope-from tomj(a)wps.com)
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> id A6B2C378DC; Mon, 13 Oct 2003 11:14:43 -0700 (PDT)
> From: Tom Jennings <tomj(a)wps.com>
> To: cctalk(a)classiccmp.org
> In-Reply-To: <200310131508.h9DF8gH5075481(a)huey.classiccmp.org>
>
>
> ------------end cut n paste-----------------
>
> I see there is quite a delay between two of the entries - 3 days.
As
> Arte Johnson used to say on Laugh-In: "Veeeeeeeery Eeeenteresting!"
But schtupid :-)
Those headers show that it took a few minutes to get tpo
huey.classiccmp.org (acting as receiver) -- that might be just mismatch
between the clocks -- and then 3 days to get to be forwarded (from the
same machine!). I've noticed a few headers with delays since we last
discussed this, but none quite as extreme! However, I can think of
some possible reasons.
In this case, I'd guess that for some reason (maybe the sender isn't
subscribed, or sent from an address that differs in some way from the
address he subscribed with) the message had to be moderated -- we rely
on Jay's goodwill and free time to do that, and if he's busy, I imagine
that he does the really obvious ones in batches where he doesn't really
need to examine them closely, and some get held over for a closer look
when time permits. He also has to sleep and eat sometimes!
In some other cases I've noticed, where the delay is a few hours, the
same reasoning might still apply, even to messages sent by a
subscriber. If you send to the list, and your headers give a different
username, hostname, or domainname than the one you used to subscribe,
it will need to be moderated.
Another possibility is that any kind of DNS lookup failure -- including
a slow response -- could cause the sending process on huey to requeue
the message. This happens a lot with people who use dynamic DNS
services and try to run their own mailserver on an ADSL line. They
forget that even though they can update the DNS within a few seconds
(or usually several minutes) when their IP address changes, most of the
rest of the world that's interested in them has already cached the old
data and it doesn't expire for a while (I've know it take days).
Yet another possibility right now, with all the viruses, and floods of
mail saying "we didn't deliver your mail because it had a virus and
we're too stupid to read the headers and see they're forged"[1] (not
mentioning AOL or certain other ISPs) is that some ISPs are finding
their mail servers swamped and hence slow. The ISPs that have suddenly
put virus-checking in place are particularly badly off, because the
scanning takes several times as many computrons as simple mail handling
does. huey might try to deliver a message and not be able to at some
particular instant, so it gets requeued. I've seen this happening on
our mailservers at work (we can easily handle what we're getting and
sending, but sometimes outgoing mail is queued because the recipient's
servers can't).
The above also happens a lot with ADSL users trying to run their own
servers, because right now some of them are getting hit with lots of
spam and virus-generated crap. However, that wouldn't explain why you
saw such a delay (since panix is not a little linux box on the end of a
DSL line).
[1] Several viruses currently forge the "From" line, making it seem
that email from some infected machine actually came from a different
user/machine. Easy to spot if you bother to look, but lots of people
-- even serious ISPs -- don't.
There are lots of other possibilites. Most mail transport agents, like
sendmail, have several built-in timeout functions, to cover various
eventualities. Sendmail has loads of them, mostly short, but the net
effect is that if some check or lookup takes too long, the associated
email is queued. Most MTAs only run the queues periodically (common
settings in sendmail are every 15 or 30 minutes) so you see that if
some recipient has some systematic problem (like bad/slow DNS, or being
hammered by DOS attacks or viruses) it doesn't take many delivery
attempts for the delay to mount up *for that recipient*. One I came
across the other day was that one sendmail was trying to do an ident
lookup on incoming mail. The ident protocol is an old and not very
useful way of trying to validate a sender's username; not many people
run ident daemons so if a recipient's server tries to do this
validation, it can take tens of seconds for it to decide it's not going
to get anywhere with it. Meanwhile, the sender may give up. Another
one I've seen, though not for a little while, is using an out-of-date
blackhole list -- depending on how the recipient server checks
blackhole lists, it might take a long time to decide whether to accept
a message, and meanwhile -- you guessed it -- the sender has given up
waiting and requeued the mail.
--
Pete Peter Turnbull
Network Manager
University of York
Ok, the folks at www.auctionbdi.com have put these out in their current
auction (which ends Sunday, October 19th at midnight pacific time. The lot
numbers are as follows:
SJ-97 for the 3400s, MV2, and 4000/300. Plus a pair of skis?
SJ-98 for the VAX in the H9644 cabinet with the SCSI drives (the door says
MicroVAX 3600 I believe).
SJ-99 is the pallet of mixed stuff I believe. (The pictures aren't up yet...)
--Chuck
--------------------- Previous Email ...
A number of VAXen are available this week from www.auctionbdi.com. I gave
them all of my "spares machines" which I cannot store and no one in the Bay
Area wanted. The good news is that BDI will ship them to you pretty much
anywhere in the country and the minimum bid is $25. The lot to look for has
3 MV3400's (in BA213 cases), one VAX 4000/300 (in a BA440 case) and one
MicroVAX II in a pedestal BA23 case. I don't recall how complete they are,
I do thing the 4000/300 is complete except for some DSSI plugs which I
needed to bring my 3800 on line. Two of the 3400's have the front "door"
(one says MicroVAX 3400, one says VAXServer 3400). If you've got a 3400 or
4000/300 there are plenty of parts to "enhance" your system. I believe the
4000/300 has 192MB of memory but can't swear to it)
There is also a MicroVAX 3600 in a H9644 rack. This one I've never looked
at in depth other than to note that it has a 4 SCSI drives and a tape but a
gap where the SCSI controller had been. Given that it couldn't talk to the
disks I pretty much ignored it.
Finally there are some PC parts with a nice 17" NEC 5fg monitor (including
the special NEC VGA cable). The monitor is nice but not an "Energy Saver"
(it stays on as long as power is applied, no standby mode) Probably not of
interest to this crowd but I thought I would mention it.
--Chuck
On Oct 9, 22:16, Tothwolf wrote:
> On Thu, 9 Oct 2003, Vintage Computer Festival wrote:
> > On Thu, 9 Oct 2003, Fred Cisin wrote:
> >
> > > But would it be feasable to have the mailing list software
> > > automatically put a "non-member submission" addition in their
subject
> > > line? "[NMS]"
>
> Or...maybe replacing the From: email address in the archive emails
with
> the list email address hasn't worked as well as folks thought it
might?
Ah, does that mean I'm not the only person who doesn't like that? It
just looks wrong to me, putting some other address against my name, and
I'm sure that's part of the cause of so many non-subscriber replies
being sent to the list (I'm sure most are meant to go to the original
poster). The intent was to prevent address harvesting, but I'd prefer
my address was just obfuscated in some way (maybe split up). Wasn't
the address-replacing meant to be temporary, until a better way was
found to obfuscate the sender address? Actually, I don't care if it's
not even obfuscated, but I know others do.
--
Pete Peter Turnbull
Network Manager
University of York
Right before I go to eBay with this - I know there are a couple or three
Musicians here - I have a 1977 Yamaha CS-80 8-voice polyphonic synth for
sale. I thought to take a chance on Classiccmp - one never knows...
If you know what this is, and you're interested, please contact me
off-list for more details. I have the Service Manual for it, which is now
made purely of Unobtanium.
Hey - it *does* have a special-pupose computer chip in it: the Keyboard
Scanner / Note Multiplexer is a very early CMOS mask-programmed "PLA" sort
of thingy... so I'm not too far off-base here.
Cheers
John
Hi Bob,
I have been having regrets about selling my Imsai-8080 a few years ago.
Did you ever find a home for yours, or is it still up for sale?
Mark
--
Mark G. Thomas (Mark(a)Misty.com)
voice: 215-591-3695
http://www.misty.com/http://mail-cleaner.com/
I've looked around and I can't find my answer, so I'm asking here as I'm
hoping a collector will know.
I have a box and manual here marked "Microsoft Windows & MS-DOS Operating
System Plus Enhanced Tools".
I'm trying to determine what version of windows it is. I'd look in the
manual, or look at the disks, but the package is still shrink wrapped and
I don't want to open it. There is no outer box with version info as this
was a "Distribution Only With A New PC" version.
The manual is all white, with black text. No logos, no nothing. The only
other things on the package are the Cert of Auth card (number 603301052)
that has a PN 0-1258 in the bottom corner... and a sticker marking that
the package has 3.5 diskettes.
I was guessing Win 3.1 and DOS 6.2, but I thought DOS 6.2 only came on
3.5 disks, and so the label would seem redundant. So then I wondered if
is was an older version of DOS, and thus maybe an older version of
Windows.
Like I said, I've searched, but was unable to turn up anything (found one
ebay hit that sounds like they are selling the manual, but it doesn't say
in the listing what version its for, and there is no pic so I can't
compare and be sure). I'm hoping there is someone on the list that might
have what I have described and can tell me what version of Windows and
DOS is inside.
TIA
-chris
<http://www.mythtech.net>
Issit Me - or innit - dunno!
But I note this, as I try to wrap my head around the intricaies of how
bytes get from one place to another place..
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Received: by linux.local (Postfix, from userid 500)
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From: Tom Jennings <tomj(a)wps.com>
To: cctalk(a)classiccmp.org
In-Reply-To: <200310131508.h9DF8gH5075481(a)huey.classiccmp.org>
------------end cut n paste-----------------
I see there is quite a delay between two of the entries - 3 days. As
Arte Johnson used to say on Laugh-In: "Veeeeeeeery Eeeenteresting!"
And here at work, the plague of Worms and Virii and other pests is
rising exponentially - might need a firewall for the firewall... even this
poor old Shell account is geeting waves of Spam - interesting to see the
procession of 'topic cycles' - from Medicine in Canada to On-line Poker to
Cable Descramblers to, umm... body part Enhancers. ;}
And now for something rather more on-topic:
Want to buy RL02 drive(s) with daisy-chaining cables and a terminator or
two - will pay for shipping - contact off-list - I'm in Carson City,
Nevada - 89706. (USA units only, of course.)
Cheers
John
Alex White wrote:
>
> Well, i'm looking at what's available to me *now* and that's an old
> collector friend of mine with quite a few PDP11 Q18/22 backplanes
I picked up bare Q22 backplanes in case I find out I have Q18's in
some of the cruft I've collected. Like a weird 3 backplane rack box,
each backplane roughly the size of the one from a BA23. And there's
a VT103 (incl. Qbus) that I'm not sure of...
Hopefully your friend has these in some nice BA-series boxes of
some kind.
> [ DSSI clustering ]
To my mind the hardest part is getting the cables for this. I've
been keeping my eyes open here in the States, and only just a short
time ago got two. The seller thought (understandably) they were a
strange type of SCSI cable and listed them as such. Thank goodness
for the pictures on eBay... ;^)
> I haul these things around with me from University flat to
> University flat.
Ooof! I wouldn't want to move "real computers" every three to six
months...
> The girlfriend is happy for my collection to grow - she passed
> me an ebay UK link to a 6200 a few months or so ago and said
> that she'd quite like to have one around *grins*
A woman of such sophistication and refined taste is clearly a
keeper. Make concessions, write a permanent To-Do item for some
flowers, or whatever else is necessary...
--S.
Hi,
I saw your post on pdp stuff. How near Washington? I live near Philadelphia, PA. It would
be about a 4 hour drive for me. Is the stuff spoken for yet?
Tim R
last year you posted a link to the 10391b inverse assembler toolkit on HP (agilent)'s website.
That link is not longer valid. Would it be possible to get a copy of the files from you, or
a valid url/ftp link? I actually bought the disk with my hp1670a years ago but can't find it.
Thanks for any help!
George Najarian
Najay Engineering, Inc.
last year you posted a link to the 10391b inverse assembler toolkit on HP (agilent)'s website.
That link is not longer valid. Would it be possible to get a copy of the files from you, or
a valid url/ftp link? I actually bought the disk with my hp1670a years ago but can't find it.
Thanks for any help!
George Najarian
Najay Engineering, Inc.
Any interest among the group in a couple of PDP-11/34A
machines and one 11/05?
The two 11/34A's are in the 10-1/2" boxes.
They each have core memory. I think 128K
but I'm not sure. Have the calculator keyboard
style front panel. Have the printset for
the CPU.
The 11/05 is the 5-1/4" box. Has core memory,
interface card for paper tape reader/punch,
and some other stuff. Plus the add-on upgrade
core memory in another 5-1/4" box. I think
it's 64K words total. Toggle switch front panel.
Have the prints on the CPU and some other related
documentation.
No racks, and no other peripherals. Some UNIBUS
cables and a few other random cards.
The machines have been out of use for quite some
time and are dusty, and I don't know if they work,
but it's purely an as-is deal.
Additionally, I have a PDP-8/I backplane available.
No front panel and no cards.
For pickup in person only, near Washington DC.
Anybody here want to make me an offer before I put
'em on eBay?
Bill
__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
The New Yahoo! Shopping - with improved product search
http://shopping.yahoo.com
Hello, all:
I'm doing some spring cleaning (six months late) and I'm offering
this stuff up to the list first. Items are as-is and last status, if
remembered, is listed. I know that a few are pretty common, but I feel bad
about just pitching them into the dumpster without at least offering them up
first. I may ultimately resort to selling some on eBay if no one wants them.
Some items are heavy and would need a local pickup. My location is
Nassau County, New York (Long Island).
Here's the list:
* MacPortable (non-backlit). Working when last used, with spare
batteries, desktop charger and carrying case. Screen has a line of bad
pixels near the bottom.
* PC/Convertible. Working although battery is shot. I believe that I
have boot disks for this, too.
* PC Portable. Working; very clean. Very heavy (really a PC with a
handle). Comes with some software but I haven't taken a complete inventory.
Might be shippable by UPS.
* DEC MicroVAX 1 in tower case with spare parts (including RD52
drives and spare boards). Working last time I used it 3 years ago. Has
Ultrix v.4 on it (no distribution disks unfortunately). Very heavy. Pickup
only.
* 3 Pentium Pro 200 MHZ/256k CPUs. Unmatched steppings (SL22V,
SL22T, SL22M). When using in an SMP configuration, steppings should be the
same. I ran into this when setting-up the dual-CPU ProLiant server at home.
* Apple Ethernet CS card (part number M3065Z/A) for late-model Macs.
* Promise Technologies EIDE4030T caching IDE card for VL bus. As I
recall, this was the "bee's knees" of IDE cards in the 486 era.
* Spare Kilobaud magazines: 12/78, 1/79
* Spare BYTE magazines: 12/77, 1/78, 1/81, 6/81, 7/81, 11/81, 12/81,
1/82,
10/83, 9/85, 10/85 (2), 2/86, 6/86, 10/86, 11/86, 9/87, 10/87
Payment? Trade or cost of shipping. Here's what I'm looking for:
* S-100 video board with docs/SW.
* Ciarcia SB180 single-board computer.
* Altair documents/manuals for my Altair32 emulation project
(reminder,
http://highgate.comm.sfu.ca/~rcini/classiccmp/Altair32.htm)
* Broken arcade game in upright cabinet with monitor (horizontal
configuration;
for MAME project). Will have to work something out on the
shipping due to its
size and weight. This one probably best if local.
* Plastic case for the KIM-1
* 6502 pod for Fluke 9010A troubleshooter
* 6502-related magazines
* Other??
Please contact me off-list at xyzzy_r_cini(a)nospam.optonline.net
(remove xyzzy, underscores and nospam.) if anyone's interested.
Thanks.
Rich Cini
Does anyone in this group know of a vendor/source that sells/ships the TED
chips, 8501R1 - I have a few plus/4's with bad processors. Please email
billdeg(a)degnanco.com. I know that they are hard to find, but I have hope
that some one here may have a contact. I could buy another plus/4 from
Ebay, but I would like to avoid this.
Bill
Wilmington, Delaware.