test-drb

test-drb@ccmp.vtda.org

101090 discussions

by manney＠nwohio.com

> Look at how fast a CP/M system can be up and running Wordstar, compared to > a Win95 system running Word97. ...but try wordstar on a Win95 system! (Actually, I still sell a few 386 systems as dedicated, cheap systems for word processing.)

28 years, 3 months

Free IBM system 36

by allisonp＠world.std.com

<>640K (or lately, 32Mb). And I suspect that anytime Allison has even <>4K at hand, she kicks some butt. As someone who has (and still does) develope hardware and software, Thank You! <"power user" t The original term is apple/mac in origin and was someone that knew the guts and made their system situp and bark(sometimes literally!). <Oh, and of late it seems to be more like 64Mb is the minimum to do anythi <with a PC suffering the Winbloat. I totally agree that these can't handl Even my biggest vax only 16meg, and my PC a measly 8mb and I run all that and winders<ok 3.1 I cheat ;)>. Code bloat has become fantastic. <stuff that any decently configured computer with less than 64k could do <Look at how fast a CP/M system can be up and running Wordstar, compared t <a Win95 system running Word97. As someone that has some 10mhz z80 systems, that is an understatement. I spent most of the 80s blowing the doors of PCs with PDP-11/23s and z80s. It wasn't till the 386/33s that that became a real contest in my eyes. At that point I started using old vaxen to make the race interesting. Allison

28 years, 3 months

Free IBM system 36

by maxeskin＠hotmail.com

>Received: from host (server(a)lists.u.washington.edu [140.142.56.13]) > by lists.u.washington.edu (8.8.4+UW97.07/8.8.4+UW97.05) with SMTP > id PAA19170; Fri, 9 Jan 1998 15:49:56 -0800 >Received: from mx4.u.washington.edu (mx4.u.washington.edu [140.142.33.5]) > by lists.u.washington.edu (8.8.4+UW97.07/8.8.4+UW97.05) with ESMTP > id PAA13830 for <classiccmp(a)lists.u.washington.edu>; Fri, 9 Jan 1998 15:49:34 -0800 >Received: from star1.intellistar.net (star1.intellistar.net [206.105.64.2]) > by mx4.u.washington.edu (8.8.4+UW97.07/8.8.4+UW97.09) with ESMTP > id PAA11635 for <classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu>; Fri, 9 Jan 1998 15:49:32 -0800 >Received: from lizard ([206.105.68.14]) by star1.intellistar.net > (Post.Office MTA v3.1 release PO203a ID# 0-41809U2500L250S0) > with SMTP id AAA12 for <classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu>; > Fri, 9 Jan 1998 18:49:26 -0500 >Message-Id: <3.0.1.16.19980109194518.4e57ed1c(a)intellistar.net> >Date: Fri, 09 Jan 1998 19:45:18 >Reply-To: classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu >Sender: CLASSICCMP-owner(a)u.washington.edu >Precedence: bulk >From: Joe <rigdonj(a)intellistar.net> >To: "Discussion re-collecting of classic computers" <classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu> >Subject: Free IBM system 36 >Mime-Version: 1.0 >Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" >X-Sender: rigdonj(a)intellistar.net >X-Priority: 1 (Highest) >X-Listprocessor-Version: 8.1 beta -- ListProcessor(tm) by CREN > >Found this in a news-group. > > Joe > >My company needs the space and wants to give away an IBM System/36, >immediately! We need it out of here ASAP. Runs great! You haul. Call Rick >at 505-982-5573 or email: rogick(a)roadrunner.com > >The equipment is as follows: > IBM System/36 Model 5360 > IBM 4234 Dot Band Printer > 6 IBM 3197 Color Workstations > Motorola Codex 2205 Modem > Dual Tape Backup by Fathom Technologies > About 6 5250 Emulation Cards (Short Length) >Everything works great! OK, here's my question: would I, as a "power user" have any non- romantic/nostalgic/etc. use for such a machine? ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com

28 years, 3 months

Free System/36

by maxeskin＠hotmail.com

actually, what i meant by the power-user comment was a person who is not afraid to use a black-and-white command prompt if it can help him/her do something. So, would a System/36 be good for me? ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com

28 years, 3 months

IBM Rescue Needed -- New Mexico

by kyrrin2＠wizards.net

Heads up to any CLASSICCMP members in the Santa Fe area or nearby: Found this on Usenet from a fellow looking to clear out a System/36. If you can help, please contact the original author directly. Best of luck! -=-=- <snip> -=-=- Path: Supernews70!Supernews60!supernews.com!news.he.net!news.dra.com!nntp.mainstreet.net!feeder.swcp.com!fugu!SantaFe!not-for-mail From: rogick(a)roadrunner.com (Rick Byrne) Newsgroups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.misc Subject: Free IBM System/36 and Peripherals Date: 9 Jan 1998 16:17:45 GMT Organization: NMML Lines: 14 Message-ID: <695ij9$rpg$8(a)santaclara.santafe.edu> NNTP-Posting-Host: dial182.roadrunner.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=US-ASCII X-Newsreader: WinVN 0.99.7 Xref: Supernews70 comp.sys.ibm.pc.misc:92489 My company needs the space and wants to give away an IBM System/36, immediately! We need it out of here ASAP. Runs great! You haul. Equipment is located in Santa Fe, New Mexico. Call Rick at 505-982-5573 or email: rogick(a)roadrunner.com The equipment is as follows: IBM System/36 Model 5360 IBM 4234 Dot Band Printer 6 IBM 3197 Color Workstations Motorola Codex 2205 Modem Dual Tape Backup by Fathom Technologies About 6 5250 Emulation Cards (Short Length) Everything works great! -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Bruce Lane, SysOp, The Dragon's Cave BBS (Fido 1:343/272) kyrrin2 {at} wiz<ards> d[o]t n=e=t "...No matter how hard we may wish otherwise, our science can only describe an object, event, or living creature, in our own human terms. It cannot possibly define any of them!..."

28 years, 3 months

[Fwd: Fwd: Very Important, read, react, forward]

by photze＠batelco.com.bh

Well, it's not going to affect all of us. I don't see how the government can even claim to control the Internet. (Watch how I so cleverly tangle classics into this. ;-) ) The Internet is like space: Something which is relatively (accesibly) new. With Space, an agreement was made saying how it belonged to all nations. (That's my understading) Now, ever since the first TCP was made on a PDP-11/?? (sorry, memory's a bit bad) The 'Net has been rapidly growing. It's truely international. Here, we've got examples. People from US-Europe-Asia-Austrilia are collecting classics. Now, is it legal for the (US) government to censor a message say going from Tony-Riccardo (In Italy) I mean, it might not even go through a US server. The Internet should be out of any government's controls. We should just have an open standard. Governments should be able to VOTE, on an equal basis of that with companies, etc. And then there are those "encryption standards" last summer.... wiped out any chance of brain activity in DC, outside of businesses.... Tim D. Hotze -----Original Message----- From: Ward Donald Griffiths III <gram(a)cnct.com> To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers <classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu> Date: Saturday, January 10, 1998 6:35 AM Subject: Re: [Fwd: Fwd: Very Important, read, react, forward] >Joe wrote: >> >> At 10:28 PM 1/8/98 -0600, you wrote: >> > >> >Uhhhhhhhhhhhhhh...two words...'topic' is one. 'off' is the other. >> > >> >=-) >> > >> >Anthony Clifton - Wirehead >> >> One more word ---- HOAX! Since when did the FCC start regulating the >> telephone industry? Phone rates are set by the individual state public >> service commisions not by the FCC. > >Sorry to say, it _does_ affect us (though yes, it's off-topic, but most >of us communicate through Internet links). The FedGov has a couple of >taxes on local phone bills for many years. And unless you've forgotten >the CDA, they want control over the Net, with special tools to decode >any messages someone wants private. Classic computers will not work >with those standards, of course. Yes, even if you aren't libertarian. >(I know damned well that there are one or two socialists on this list), >we can be affected -- we can be forbidden to communicate. And there >are at _least_ two attempts in progress to "reword" the CDA so that it >takes away just as much freedom but doesn't hit the federal judicial >hot buttons. > >Seems outrageous? The First Amendment covers everything. Presently. >transmitting Nobel's (the guy who funded the Prize) formula for >explosives is being watched by our "masters". Some of us collect >computers that may have been in government hands before the general >policy of "rip out the hard disk and hit it with the chainsaw" came >into effect. Other hobbies have been crippled by the government -- >remember guns (my next love after computers as computers are my next >love after science fiction)? Oh, it's platonic. >-- >Ward Griffiths >Dylan: How many years must some people exist, > before they're allowed to be free? >WDG3rd: If they "must" exist until they're "allowed", > they'll never be free.

28 years, 3 months

[Fwd: Fwd: Very Important, read, react, forward]

by rigdonj＠intellistar.net

At 10:28 PM 1/8/98 -0600, you wrote: > >Uhhhhhhhhhhhhhh...two words...'topic' is one. 'off' is the other. > >=-) > >Anthony Clifton - Wirehead One more word ---- HOAX! Since when did the FCC start regulating the telephone industry? Phone rates are set by the individual state public service commisions not by the FCC. Joe > >On Thu, 8 Jan 1998, will emerson wrote: > >> >> >

28 years, 3 months

Free IBM system 36

by rigdonj＠intellistar.net

Found this in a news-group. Joe My company needs the space and wants to give away an IBM System/36, immediately! We need it out of here ASAP. Runs great! You haul. Call Rick at 505-982-5573 or email: rogick(a)roadrunner.com The equipment is as follows: IBM System/36 Model 5360 IBM 4234 Dot Band Printer 6 IBM 3197 Color Workstations Motorola Codex 2205 Modem Dual Tape Backup by Fathom Technologies About 6 5250 Emulation Cards (Short Length) Everything works great!

28 years, 3 months

The IBM PS/2 model 70 again! -E61

by SUPRDAVE＠aol.com

In a message dated 98-01-08 22:43:53 EST, you write: << I have a couple of junk Model 30's if anyone... My vote goes to the Model 25 as the most horrid computer PC of all time. Unexpandable, impossible to work on. Ick! >> actually, i think its kind of neat in a strange way. all in one form factor, like a compact mac. in fact, the IBM Eduquests are built the same way. the only bad part is expandability and if the monitor or power supply dies, you're finished. david

28 years, 3 months

Clock (off topic)

by engine＠chac.org

Between Christmas and New Year's I was cleaning out my mother's house and found a Texas Instruments TI-71, complete with its docs and warranty card. This is a small, line-powered digital clock. Still works fine. What interests me here is that I recall hearing an unsupported contention, years ago, that this was the _first_ commodity digital clock that used seven-segment displays instead of flippers. Can anyone confirm or deny? Tony, you probably know this one. TIA, __________________________________________ Kip Crosby engine(a)chac.org http://www.chac.org/index.html Computer History Association of California

28 years, 3 months

SwTPC web page

by yakowenk＠cs.unc.edu

Well, it isn't impressive yet, but there isn't much point to keeping it hidden either. So, here's the URL for my beginnings of a web page for SwTPC - Soutwest Technical Products Corp: http://www.cs.unc.edu/~yakowenk/swtpc Hope you like it. Bill.

28 years, 3 months

archiving history (was: Tektronix Workstations)

by sinasohn＠ricochet.net

At 10:12 AM 1/8/98 -0500, you wrote: >Tektronix made a number of interesting UN*X workstations (their flavor [...snip-o-rama...] >The following is some info about these that I collected from someone >who worked at Tektronix during the time: [...snipitty-doo-dah...] >The Magnolia was a proof-of-concept design, built in small quantities for [...snipola...] >Here's a quick run-down (somewhat chronological): [...schnippy...] This is the kind of info that I really believe should be archived on the web for all eternity. I don't own a tektronix ws now, so although interesting, it's not something I really want to clutter up my email folders with. However, I might just get one next week. In which case, I'd really want this info. But, I wouldn't want to bother Bill for it again (and again and again...). If it were on a web page somewhere, a search in Alta Vista (or whichever search engine one used) would turn it up. So, I would like to *really* encourage people who have this sort of info to put it on the web. Of course, it's all fine and dandy for me to say that (especially when I have yet to get *my* collection online!) when I know you all have more important things to do and more important stuff to fill your webspace with. So, I'll offer to host and html-ize any stuff like this anyone wants to send me. Just dump it (any kind of: history, folklore, specs, special commands, secret codes, easter eggs, power supply voltages, etc.) in an e-mail and send it to me at <roger(a)sinasohn.com> and I'll get it on-line. (It won't necessarily be beautiful, but it will be useable.) Thanks! --------------------------------------------------------------------- O- Uncle Roger "There is pleasure pure in being mad roger(a)sinasohn.com that none but madmen know." Roger Louis Sinasohn & Associates San Francisco, California http://www.crl.com/~sinasohn/

28 years, 3 months

Big "B", update

by william＠ans.net

For the sake of those reader not too thrilled about the current Linux and x86 threads (zzzzz...), I offer the following update... I received a bit mopre information about the units, and either they are all pieces of a single Burroughs machine, or several individual machines. What is not clear is what model they are. I hope to get more information soon. The current owners have the things half buried in surplus junk (probably good stuff, too!), so I may need to prod them along. Does anyone on this list have any sort of data on Burroughs machines? I would like to get some sort of summary on the different models before taking any possible plunges into the "real big iron" world. William Donzelli william(a)ans.net

28 years, 3 months

Misc.

by dcoward＠pressstart.com

I just picked up a RCA Ascii keyboard. Does anyone have the pinout for it's connector? --------------------------------------------- I got this email today ( I think it's classic computer related), but I can't read Spanish. Can anyone help this person?

28 years, 3 months

VUPs to MIPS

by allisonp＠world.std.com

<With the current battle between RISC and CISC, MIPS now really is <"Meaningless Information Provided by Salesman". Technically, by the <current philosophy, an 8080 is a CISC processor. Go figure. Actually it's a partial indicator of execution speed and only a partial indicator of an systems capability. 8080 is CISC, instructions are complex(some are) and are expected to take many clock cycles. RISC by definition is at most two clock cycles to execute a given instruction. Generally RISC machines can perform several arithmetic/logical operations in one instruction making them look CISCier. They are also generally weak in addressing data as there are few addresing modes and rely on lots of registers for pointers. The problem with RISC is that compilers have to work hard to use the full capability of the cpu. VAX is CISC to the max with an extremely rich instruction set and addressing modes. FYI the VAX inherits most of the base instuctions from the PDP-11 which is the also very CISC. Now all this is nice when instructions are executed one at a time like the 8080 or 6502 did. This became meaningless with later VAXen that were more piplined so that current instruction execution overlapped the next. The 8088 also does this albeit weakly. With the RISC machines also doing super pipining the number of clock cycles became less meaningful and the "MIPS" did as well. Adding things like caches complicates this more as a cache flush or processor lock can really tie things up for long periods of time affecting performance. VAX VUPs are a more subjective standard as they are a measure of the system rather than the bare cpu SPECint92 is similar in that respect as doing real work generally makes the system a slave to outside influences like the disk system data rates and memory system size. A good example of this is that 6mhz Z80 can execute instructions at or about 1mips but IO to the average floppy is slow enough to make that cpu wait about 1-2 seconds for 16k of data. The disk systems for machines like Vaxen are designed to supply data at 20-1000 times that data rate. So if you sorting data (say a data files that is 16mb in size) the disk systems are also a big factor no matter what the system as the data and program will not for in local memory. Even with huge memories in the 100s of megabytes it's not always efficient(or possible with multitasking) to copy from disk to ram and sort then copy it back. Just a peak under the hood. Allison

28 years, 3 months

FW: IBM Magnetic cards

by manney＠nwohio.com

> I haven't seen a mag card reader of any 'stripe' in many years. Several HP calculators used 'em for awhile. The HP-41C had a motorized reader, while the -75 and (later) the 71B of fond memory used hand-pulled strips. I bought my 71 in '87, iirc. Hey -- I just realized -- it's a classic! Makes me feel OLD.

28 years, 3 months

translating...

by sinasohn＠ricochet.net

At 04:47 PM 1/8/98 -0800, you wrote: >I got this email today ( I think it's classic computer related), but >I can't read Spanish. Can anyone help this person? I can't read spanish, but I can pass on this URL: <http://babelfish.altavista.digital.com/> which lets you enter either a bunch of text or a URL and it will translate it for you. Pretty neat, although far from perfect. Can at least get you an idea of what that german/spanish/french classic computer page is talking about. --------------------------------------------------------------------- O- Uncle Roger "There is pleasure pure in being mad roger(a)sinasohn.com that none but madmen know." Roger Louis Sinasohn & Associates San Francisco, California http://www.crl.com/~sinasohn/

28 years, 3 months

sale in Portland this weekend

by sinasohn＠ricochet.net

At 01:51 PM 1/8/98 -0500, you wrote: >> I got an e-mail from InnFoGraphics Warehouse Liquidation, of a sale > >I plan on going down from Seattle on Saturday morning. Anybody else going? I can't make it (a bit far from San Francisco), but I'd be happy provide you with a shopping list. 8^) (Actually, it's pretty simple: any portable computers smaller large-laptop-size or smaller, $10 or less. 8^) --------------------------------------------------------------------- O- Uncle Roger "There is pleasure pure in being mad roger(a)sinasohn.com that none but madmen know." Roger Louis Sinasohn & Associates San Francisco, California http://www.crl.com/~sinasohn/

28 years, 3 months

OLD PC's

by sinasohn＠ricochet.net

At 01:28 PM 1/8/98 -0500, you wrote: >I think the inner city schools would have a better use for these machines, >or maybe special afterschool programs, or even donating them to under >priveledged kids locally. a lot of local programs certainly have *need* for them, but they would probably see more *use* overseas. The problem with older (and certainly very viable and useful) equipment in this country is getting it into operation, maintaining it, and putting it to work with software other than what one buys at CompUSA. I'd be happy to discuss this further (I am somewhat involved in this sort of thing myself) but I think it best kept to private e-mail (or the various newsgroups/mailing lists about the subject.) --------------------------------------------------------------------- O- Uncle Roger "There is pleasure pure in being mad roger(a)sinasohn.com that none but madmen know." Roger Louis Sinasohn & Associates San Francisco, California http://www.crl.com/~sinasohn/

28 years, 3 months

C-64c, How common?

by healyzh＠ix.netcom.com

I'm starting to wonder about how common the C-64c is. I have yet to see one, I picked up the manuals when a favorite bookstore had a set a few months back. Then last weekend I was at the bookstore and they had like 3 or 4 sets of manual. But like I said I've never seen an actual computer! Functionally are they any different from a standard 64? Zane | Zane H. Healy | UNIX Systems Adminstrator | | healyzh(a)ix.netcom.com (primary) | Linux Enthusiast | | healyzh(a)holonet.net (alternate) | Classic Computer Collector | +----------------------------------+----------------------------+ | For Empire of the Petal Throne and Traveller Role Playing, | | see http://www.dragonfire.net/~healyzh/ | | For the collecting of Classic Computers with info on them. | | see http://www.dragonfire.net/~healyzh/museum.html |

28 years, 3 months

linux

by allisonp＠world.std.com

To quote the good doctor "it lives". Finally I've gotten linux (slakware V3) to install on the 386, I finally stripped the disk of the semifunctional version that wouldn't boot and installed it fresh and it seems to run properly. More importantly it boots properly on power up. Right now X-win is not installed as 8meg is all it's got. One annoying thing is the autoprobe for CDrom, it's slow. Generally the speed is good. What has me fully baffeled is there is now clue what I've done different since the last three times. Now the next task is getting SLIP or PPP going so that it can access the internet. Then I want to get x-windows and it's related tools going. I also have to get an IP stack going on the dosbox to share files. Any experts out there? Allison

28 years, 3 months

Classic Macs mailing list?

by sinasohn＠ricochet.net

At 09:26 AM 12/1/97 -0600, you wrote: > I'm interested in the classic Macs mailing list (I have a Plus). >Where do I sign up? Okay, so I'm inefficient and disorganized... 8^) I was going through some old mail and realized I never forwarded the info about the classic macs list. So, here it is: ----------------------------------------- To subscribe to Classic Macs, send e-mail to <Majordomo(a)hitznet.com>. In the body of the message write subscribe classics You will be added within a day. _______________________________________________________ If you are new to the list, please take time to visit the Classic Macs archives. Many, many common questions have been asked already and you may find what you seek in previous posts. This will save the list members much time in not having to pore over frequently asked and answered questions many times. The Classic Macs Archives are found at: http://www.zws.com/classicmacs/ Thanks to Lewin A.R.W. Edwards for maintaining and hosting the archives. _______________________________________________________ --------------------------------------------------------------------- O- Uncle Roger "There is pleasure pure in being mad roger(a)sinasohn.com that none but madmen know." Roger Louis Sinasohn & Associates San Francisco, California http://www.crl.com/~sinasohn/

28 years, 3 months

[Fwd: Fwd: Very Important, read, react, forward]

by wpe＠interserv.com

28 years, 3 months

The IBM PS/2 model 70 again! -E61

by allisonp＠world.std.com

< My vote goes to the Model 25 as the most horrid computer PC of all time < Unexpandable, impossible to work on. Ick! >> < <actually, i think its kind of neat in a strange way. all in one form fact Actually I had a PS2/25 here and while the number of slots were limited I did put a 420meg hard disk(using a ISA-8 to IDE adaptor board) and a 14.4 modem in it for a friend and there was two slots left. It was tiny. When she retired it for a 386 I took the motherboard out and used the PS and the disks for a SB180 systemwith a scsi disk. It's form factor was just right. Now the disks are 3.5" 782k cpm/qd format and the 20mb scsi disk has a home in keeping with the 7"x3" sb180 (z180, 256k ram, scsi) board. Nice little CP/m (zcpr) system. I kept the M25 board as it's a pretty sane 8086 xt-turbo board. Allison

28 years, 3 months

OLD PC's

by photze＠batelco.com.bh

-----Original Message----- From: Uncle Roger <sinasohn(a)ricochet.net> To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers <classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu> Date: Friday, January 09, 1998 5:10 AM Subject: Re: OLD PC's >At 09:11 PM 1/8/98 +0300, you wrote: >>The problem with this guies theroies: In this 3rd world country, schools >>have MMX machines. > >Perhaps, but is that: > >a) Schools for dependents of US citizens working for US > companies in Bahrain, No, there's only one of those. (It's a DoDDs school) They've got 286's in classrooms, 386's in science labs, 486's in 3 computer labs, and Pentiums in the library and a new computer lab. They're trying to replace the 486's, so that they move the 486's in the classrooms, but the new Pentiums will have to run Windows 3.1, as that's what they're doing now. >b) local schools in an wealthy country (i.e., the government > is wealthy even if the citizenry isn't) No, the government is relatively wealthy, but the local schools mostly have 386's and 486's. I haven't visited many, so don't bind me by that. >c) only the schools located in the major cities? Major cities? Here? (Ask Zane) ;-) >In the philippines, it ain't true. Heck, my girlfriend's sister-in-law's >family doesn't even have a telephone. Yep. But there are lots of immigrants from the Philippines here, but the thing is, I'd think taht they're better back home. I mean, here, they get paid around $150 a month for 12hrs a day, and 7 days a week. And to think that they call it third world... (should be eighth or so...) :-( >There is a company here in San Francisco that ships hundreds (if not >thousands) of older PC's and such overseas *everyday*. They're huge, and >it's really an amazing operation. And yes, they occassionally get some >classic computers worth saving. Yes, or, what they could do at the school is give them to student's who can't afford computers. WP 5.1 will run on a 286, you can get Windows 3.1 out of 'em, they'll run almost all DOS software. (Well, except for games, etc.) And, when finished with an early Epson dot-matrix, they make machines that are good for doing reports, PrintShop, etc. Tim D. Hotze

28 years, 3 months

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test-drb