On Tue, 19 May 1998 14:42:09 +1000, "Desie Hay" <desieh(a)southcom.com.au>
wrote:
>>anybody have IBM PC DOS 1.00? or know of where I may d/l it from the net
>>somewhere??
A quick look downstairs shows that I have a complete copy of DOS 1.1.
According to "Upgrading and Repairing PCs 4th Ed.", PC-DOS was versioned as
follows:
<------------------------- File
Sizes ------------------------------>
Ver. File Dates Command.ComIBMBIO.COMIBMDOS.COM
=== ======== ============ =========== ===========
1.0 8/4/81 3231 bytes 1920 bytes
6400 bytes
1.1 5/7/82 4959 bytes 1920 bytes
6400 bytes
According to other charts, there were no differences in the available
internal and external commands, so I don't readily understand the difference
in the command interpreter file sizes (patches??)
I'm sure that I can find some way to get you the 1.1 diskette.
------------------------------
Rich Cini/WUGNET
<nospam_rcini(a)msn.com> (remove nospam_ to use)
ClubWin! Charter Member (6)
MCP Windows 95/Windows Networking
Collector of classic computers
<<<========== Reply Separator ==========>>>
In a message dated 98-05-14 08:25:05 EDT, you write:
<< The //gs and Macs do, maybe the later //c or //c+ >>
the //c does not have the mini din connector so i guess its probably on the gs
and c+ models do. i have an aftermarket 800k mac drive that either has motor
eject and it also has a pushbutton eject also. i have an old apple magazine
>from years ago that has a compatibility matrix for all the apples and drives.
if anyone wants more info, i can find the magazine.
david
>> I have a Rainbow 200, but I'm missing the keyboard and mouse, and it
>>doesn't
>> seem to take a serial console.
hmm, don't know about the 200, I've got a 100B machine and the keyboards
plug into the back of the display units from what I remember. I think
you could use a VT100 keyboard, don't know about mouse support
(presumably standard serial as on a PC...)
>> I have the CP/M disks for it as well, it has no harddisk.
hard disk controllers and colour display boards were like gold dust for
these machines... blank disks are probably pretty rare these days if the
200 uses those same strange two-in-one disk drives that the 100 had -
you had to have disks without the centre reinforcing rings or they'd
screw up the drive spindles over a period of time....
cheers
Jules
>-------
>
Okay, someone out there may have an instruction sheet they could scan
for this:
I have around half a dozen ISA parallel/serial expansion cards that
I need the jumper data on. These are only
marked on two lrger chips as Winbond W86C551's and the only other
marking is screen printed at the bottom
near the slot. It reads "DIO-222-OHM REV. A" which I assume is it's
model number, probably stands for Dual
I/O model 222. It has a COM A fixed to the filler card at the
backbone and a COM B on a ribbon on an
expansion plate. There is a LPTA and LPTB just the same. It has a
set of jumpers on the lower side below the
lower of the two Winbond chips and it's amrked as JP1 and has three
rows tall and 13 rows wide. The left has 1,
14 and 27 screened on the pc board and the right side has 13, 26
and 35 screened on.
I've used a few that were previously set as LPT2, LPT3, COM3, COM4
but as I come across machines that
need a different setup I'll need a set of instructions. If anyone
has a copy that they could scan and attach as a
graphic, or could fax to me (502-756-6991) or could photocopy and
mail to me I'm sure I could work out
something to repay them.
--
--------------------------------------------------------------------
Russ Blakeman
RB Custom Services / Rt. 1 Box 62E / Harned, KY USA 40144
Phone: (502) 756-1749 Data/Fax:(502) 756-6991
Email: rhblake(a)bbtel.com or rhblake(a)bigfoot.com
Website: http://members.tripod.com/~RHBLAKE/
ICQ UIN #1714857
AOL Instant Messenger "RHBLAKEMAN"
* Parts/Service/Upgrades and more for MOST Computers*
--------------------------------------------------------------------
<I know basically how microcode works. It's the one-cycle instructions li
<"gate data bus to address bus" or "gate data bus to ALU".
<One MOV can be 2-5 microinstructions.
First most microinstructions are bit coded... meaning that it can do
several things concurrently if the hardware can based on what bits are
set. That also means you cant output data to the data bus while trying
input data. Watch out as some of the vax MOVs are fairly complex
instructions.
<The large question I have is: How does the MOV translate to microcode?
<Does the VAX figure a microcode offset based on the opcode? Is there a t
<of entry points somewhere? How is this done?
The macroinstruction is a pointer to a table entry that containes the
address of a microsubroutine that will execute it. That means in hardware
there will be a rom or ram between the instruction register and the
external microcode address entry point (usually a operand to a microcode
jump.).
<Another thing, the VAX 780 was microcoded from the console RX01. Does an
<have a copy of that RX01? Can anyone get a disk image? What else was on
<(RT-11? P/OS?)
I believe it was RT-11 with special application code for starting and
monitoring the 780. The 730 and 750 had minimal microcode and used a
tu58 to load the remainder or overlay existing ucode to patch it.
Allison
<>> I have a Rainbow 200, but I'm missing the keyboard and mouse, and it
<>>doesn't
<>> seem to take a serial console.
NEever heard of a 200 there was a 100, 100+ and 100B.
<you could use a VT100 keyboard, don't know about mouse support
<(presumably standard serial as on a PC...)
No mouse. Keyboard was LK200 same as vt220 and later terminals and the
monitor was VR201 (mono) or one of the others. It did not use a serial
console as it was like a PC and had color graphics.
<hard disk controllers and colour display boards were like gold dust for
<these machines... blank disks are probably pretty rare these days if the
<200 uses those same strange two-in-one disk drives that the 100 had -
<you had to have disks without the centre reinforcing rings or they'd
<screw up the drive spindles over a period of time....
Media is common 360k pc. The format is oddball (rx50) but the rainbow
could format a floppy. Hard disk controllers can be found (in the USA).
Allison
<- AMD Enhanced Am486
<- AMD Am5x86
<- AMD K5
<- AMD K6
<- Centaur IDT-C6
<- Cyrix 486DRx2
<- Cyrix 5x86
<- Cyrix 6x86 & 6x86MX
<- IBM 6x86 & 6x86MX
<- NexGen NX586
<- SGS-Thomson ST486
<- SGS-Thomson 6x86
<- Texas Instruments TI486DX2 & DX4
Ok so you listed all the code compatable cpus, they are for all intents
the same thing only varying in performance. Still intel instruction set.
<Windows CE 2.0 supports the following chipsets:
Never heard of this one.
<- Digital
Ok can you be specific... at one time the PDP-11, VAX and Alpha were
all in production concurrently. I'd suspect Alpha. MS never had a
clue about VAX.
Allison
At 11:21 PM 5/18/98 -0500, you wrote:
>
>Geowork's GEOS was an early (better-than-Microsoft-but-crushed-anyway)
>Windowing system that ran on both x86 and 6502 (and maybe more).
>
Also ran on the Commie C64 and 128. I have the manual for it. If anyone
wants it you can have it for $2 and the cost of shipping.
Joe
>I like to bash Microsoft as much as the next guy, but their CPU support on
>Windows CE is pretty good: x86, MIPS, Hitachi, PPC, and ARM, at least.
x86??? That would make a REALLY COOL sub-$500 PC. PPC??? So MS didn't
COMPLETELY cut it off.... I guess that if Intel (or anyone else) wanted,
they could make a 386/486 (AMD's ElanSC400 comes to mind) processor
based-WindowsCE system, requireing less effort to port to CE.
Tim D. Hotze
> I thought I had read something recently about some company releasing a
> re-hashed version of GEOS for PCs, but my proxy is hosed and a search would
> take forever. I think it was on C|NET in a review of alternative OSs.
Brother has a brand new GEOS laptop they're selling for about $500 or so.
Perhaps that's what you're thinking of.
Roger Ivie
ivie(a)cc.usu.edu
<> Wasn't it the DRAM used on the infamous MITS 4KB DRAM S-100 memory card
<> The one that never worked because they used a one-shot for the RAS-CAS
<
<Hmm.. I doubt it. The 4060 doesn't have separate RAS and CAS inputs and a
<multiplexed address. There were 16 pin 4K DRAMs that did, though.
It was used for the 88-s4k and the earlier 88-MCD both were cranky
designs as the S4K didn't like z80s and the MCD was just flakey
due to sloppy timing and board level noise.
<> timing. That was one collector item that should be put in a landfill.
Those two memories were best left in the dumpster. The rams used were
easy to work with as they only needed a CE to latch the address and cause
a read, write or refresh. They were at the time fairly fast as well
which is where some designers got burnt from the noise that was generated
by the fast switching.
<As I keep on telling people "I'll not show you how to use {one shots |
<monostables}. By the time you know how to use them correctly, you can
<figure out how to use them without my help" :-)
Oneshots are ok but, critical timing and cascaded timing is nuttyness
when combined with board level noise. The Altair boys used oneshots to
solve timing problems when combinational logic was more correct. The
problem was even the s4k was plagued by board level noise and strange
decodings.
Allison
An interesting bit from our archive knowledgebase...
Windows/286 Running on DEC Rainbow with 286 Board [aropenv]
ID: Q51199 CREATED: 21-NOV-1989
2.11
WINDOWS
Summary:
The Rainbow Adaptation Kit for Microsoft Windows/286, marketed by
Suitable Solutions, Inc., of Santa Clara, California, permits Rainbow
users to install Windows/286 Version 2.11 directly from the
Windows/286 retail kit. For more information about the Rainbow
Adaptation Kit, contact Suitable Solutions at (408) 727-9090.
-----Original Message-----
From: Roger Ivie [mailto:IVIE@cc.usu.edu]
Sent: Tuesday, May 19, 1998 10:48 AM
To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers
Subject: Re: Windows 1.x platforms...
> Windows 1.x-2.x were Intel and 100% compatible only (including AMD 286
since
> it was manufactured under license by Intel), and ran without problems on
the
> NEC V20 (8088 clone). Bear in mind that there wasn't really any secondary
> CPU market at that time.
Back in the Windows 1 timeframe, IBM had not yet taken over the universe.
Some non-clones (such as the DEC Rainbow) ran Windows; basically DEC
wrote or contracted for the device drivers necessary to make it work.
I don't recall whether Windows 2.x ran on the 'bow; I didn't have access
to one during that timeframe.
Hotze wrote:
>
> OK... I know that Windows 1.x/2.x was horibbly unsuccessful... but I
> remember reading about some platforms that Windows was ported to that
seemed
> pretty strange... (IE non-x86).
> Anyone???
This is probably a dim memory of the Rainbow port. The Rainbow had both an
8088 and a Z80 (when running MS-DOS, the Z80 was used only for floppy and
(IIRC) keyboard I/O).
Roger Ivie
ivie(a)cc.usu.edu
> Windows 1.x-2.x were Intel and 100% compatible only (including AMD 286 since
> it was manufactured under license by Intel), and ran without problems on the
> NEC V20 (8088 clone). Bear in mind that there wasn't really any secondary
> CPU market at that time.
Back in the Windows 1 timeframe, IBM had not yet taken over the universe.
Some non-clones (such as the DEC Rainbow) ran Windows; basically DEC
wrote or contracted for the device drivers necessary to make it work.
I don't recall whether Windows 2.x ran on the 'bow; I didn't have access
to one during that timeframe.
Hotze wrote:
>
> OK... I know that Windows 1.x/2.x was horibbly unsuccessful... but I
> remember reading about some platforms that Windows was ported to that
seemed
> pretty strange... (IE non-x86).
> Anyone???
This is probably a dim memory of the Rainbow port. The Rainbow had both an
8088 and a Z80 (when running MS-DOS, the Z80 was used only for floppy and
(IIRC) keyboard I/O).
Roger Ivie
ivie(a)cc.usu.edu
Windows 1.x-2.x were Intel and 100% compatible only (including AMD 286 since
it was manufactured under license by Intel), and ran without problems on the
NEC V20 (8088 clone). Bear in mind that there wasn't really any secondary
CPU market at that time.
Windows 3.x was also supported on IBM Blue Lightning and AMD processors.
Windows 95 logo program lists the following chipsets:
- AMD Enhanced Am486
- AMD Am5x86
- AMD K5
- AMD K6
- Centaur IDT-C6
- Cyrix 486DRx2
- Cyrix 5x86
- Cyrix 6x86 & 6x86MX
- IBM 6x86 & 6x86MX
- NexGen NX586
- SGS-Thomson ST486
- SGS-Thomson 6x86
- Texas Instruments TI486DX2 & DX4
Windows NT 3.51 supported Intel, MIPS, Alpha, and PowerPC.
Windows NT 4.0 supports Intel and Alpha.
Windows CE 2.0 supports the following chipsets:
- AMD
- ARM
- Digital
- Hitachi
- MIPS
- Motorola
Kai
-----Original Message-----
From: Ward Donald Griffiths III [mailto:gram@cnct.com]
Sent: Monday, May 18, 1998 9:18 PM
To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers
Subject: Re: Windows 1.x platforms...
Hotze wrote:
>
> OK... I know that Windows 1.x/2.x was horibbly unsuccessful... but I
> remember reading about some platforms that Windows was ported to that
seemed
> pretty strange... (IE non-x86).
> Anyone???
Nope, nein, none. While (16-bit and under) Windows can be used with
other processors _now_ courtesy of WABI, WINE and other independent
projects, only NT has ever been officially supported by Microsoft on
any non-Intel (or "clone" -- though MS's support is questionable in
that case) CPU. And support for NT on non-Intel processors has been
dropping and is not promised for the future. (Then again, support for
any Microsoft product can't be counted upon a year after release or
release of the the next version, whichever comes earlier).
--
Ward Griffiths
They say that politics makes strange bedfellows.
Of course, the main reason they cuddle up is to screw somebody else.
Michael Flynn, _Rogue Star_
<> grabbed the boards hoping that these chips were pin-compatible with th
<> old 2102L or RCA1822 or MOS 6550 256x4 SRAMs.
<
<Alas not. Not even the same type or capacity :-(
I do have a bunch of:
2101 256x4 22 pin static nmos
5101 256x4 22pin static cmos
2111 256x4
2112 256x4
6508 1kx1 cmos static
2102 1kx1 16pin static
2114 1kx4 20 pin
6514 1kx4 20 pin
4060 4kx1 22pin dynamic
upd411 4kx1 semistatic 85ns 22pin
4104 4kx1 static
d414 4kx1 dynamic ras/ cas/ 16pin
2167 16kx1 70ns 18 pin
4116 16kx1 16 pin dynamic
And a few other oddballs. You never know when you need a ram... ;)
Allison
OK... I know that Windows 1.x/2.x was horibbly unsuccessful... but I
remember reading about some platforms that Windows was ported to that seemed
pretty strange... (IE non-x86).
Anyone???
Tim D. Hotze
<When did Intel (if ever) discontinue the 4000 series???
< Ciao,
The 4004 hit the endangerred species list in 76, with not recommended for
new designs. I think last buy production was in 79.
Allison
-----Original Message-----
From: Uncle Roger <sinasohn(a)ricochet.net>
To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers
<classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu>
Date: Tuesday, 19 May 1998 12:56
Subject: Finds and questions
>This weekend (despite iminent death due to a stomach virus) I managed to
>add a few interesting things to my collection:
>
>Toshiba T1000
>HP 110
>GRiD GRiDCase 2
>GRiD GridCase 1520
>Grid GridCase 1535
>Grid Battery (spare)
>Grid P/S (spare, replaces battery)
>Two external Grid Disk Drives
>
>Now for the questions.
>
>The GridCase 2 seems to have an internal 10MB hard drive (gotta be a 3.5"),
>but it also has a DB25 sticking out the side where the HD is. Has anyone
>else seen this? Is it a GRiD option? Is the DB25 for an external floppy,
>since the HD seems to be where the floppy should be? The HD makes some
>rather unhappy noises, though it seems to work fine; anyone have any
>suggestions for the best way to get the data/OS off the hard drive in case
>of failure? (Just copy to floppies?) It comes up in something called
>(iirc) InteGRiD; anyone know anything about this?
>
>Haddock claims the T1100 was Toshiba's first laptop; just by looking at the
>numbers, one would think the T1000 would have come first. According to
>Toshiba's spec files, both machines ran Toshiba MS-DOS 2.11, had 512K RAM
>(but the T1000 could go up to 1.2MB), both had a 4.77mhz 80c88, etc. So,
>anyone know for sure what came first?
>
>I guess that's it for now. Of course, if anyone has any further info,
>anecdotes, or specs on any of these machines...
>
>
>--------------------------------------------------------------------- O-
>
>Uncle Roger "There is pleasure pure in being mad
>roger(a)sinasohn.com that none but madmen know."
>Roger Louis Sinasohn & Associates
>San Francisco, California http://www.sinasohn.com/
>
email: desieh(a)southcom.com.au
desieh(a)bigfoot.com
museum_curator(a)hotmail.com
Apple Lisa Web Page:
http://www.southcom.com.au/~desieh/index.htm
Im 99.999% sure the T1000 was first...............
when i purchased mine around 10 years ago im almost sure that it was the
only one they where offering that
was IBM compat
-----Original Message-----
From: Joe <rigdonj(a)intellistar.net>
To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers
<classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu>
Date: Tuesday, 19 May 1998 5:30
Subject: Re: North Star Horizon [Rare systems]
>At 11:25 AM 5/18/98 -0700, you wrote:
>>On Mon, 18 May 1998, Desie Hay wrote:
>>
>>> this is getting abit of track here but nobody seems to mind:
>>> well im in australia and ive got some mechines that i bet you guys have
>>> never heard of:
>>>
>>> Dick Smith System 80
>>> (TRS-80 model 1 clone)
>
> Well if you like that kind of stuff, there's a LNW 80 for sale in a
>surplus store here (Skycraft, in Orlando, Florida) for $25. It's another
>TRS clone but it's supposed to have the interfaces and extra memory
>built-in. Comes complete with a couple of manuals. I know very little
>about the TRS stuff and nothing about this clone so if you have questions
>post them to the list and see if someone else can answer them.
>
> Joe
>
>
>>
>>Sure we've heard of this. You Aussie blokes have been talking about the
>>Dick Smith systems for a while now.
>>
>>> UNIVAC
>>> (CPM box, looks like a terminal)
>>
>>Believe it or not I have heard of this. I think some other feller from
>>down under mentioned it at some point.
>>
>>> OSI C4P
>>> (looks like a SOL termianl computer, dont know anything else about it?
>>> anybody else know anything about it??)
>>
>>Ohio Scientific Challengers are no secret.
>>
>>Sam Alternate e-mail:
>dastar(a)siconic.com
>>--------------------------------------------------------------------------
-
>----
>>Ever onward.
>>
>> September 26 & 27...Vintage Computer Festival 2
>> See http://www.siconic.com/vcf for details!
>> [Last web page update: 05/11/98]
>>
>>
>
Well this UNIVAC I have, I acutally got it imported or what that be
exported:>
>from the states.............
This weekend (despite iminent death due to a stomach virus) I managed to
add a few interesting things to my collection:
Toshiba T1000
HP 110
GRiD GRiDCase 2
GRiD GridCase 1520
Grid GridCase 1535
Grid Battery (spare)
Grid P/S (spare, replaces battery)
Two external Grid Disk Drives
Now for the questions.
The GridCase 2 seems to have an internal 10MB hard drive (gotta be a 3.5"),
but it also has a DB25 sticking out the side where the HD is. Has anyone
else seen this? Is it a GRiD option? Is the DB25 for an external floppy,
since the HD seems to be where the floppy should be? The HD makes some
rather unhappy noises, though it seems to work fine; anyone have any
suggestions for the best way to get the data/OS off the hard drive in case
of failure? (Just copy to floppies?) It comes up in something called
(iirc) InteGRiD; anyone know anything about this?
Haddock claims the T1100 was Toshiba's first laptop; just by looking at the
numbers, one would think the T1000 would have come first. According to
Toshiba's spec files, both machines ran Toshiba MS-DOS 2.11, had 512K RAM
(but the T1000 could go up to 1.2MB), both had a 4.77mhz 80c88, etc. So,
anyone know for sure what came first?
I guess that's it for now. Of course, if anyone has any further info,
anecdotes, or specs on any of these machines...
--------------------------------------------------------------------- O-
Uncle Roger "There is pleasure pure in being mad
roger(a)sinasohn.com that none but madmen know."
Roger Louis Sinasohn & Associates
San Francisco, California http://www.sinasohn.com/
I went to the big (650 booths) antique show at the Cow Palace this weekend
and saw exactly zero (0) computers. (Other than laptops and such in use by
dealers.) Dunno how long it will be, though, before they start to show up.
Did overhear one dealer tell another "ebay is great -- you can go on there
and sell stuff for *way* more than it's worth." 8^)
P.S., Did manage to find 6 or 7 Donald Ducks that Rachel didn't have, and
got me a couple of Land Rovers too.
--------------------------------------------------------------------- O-
Uncle Roger "There is pleasure pure in being mad
roger(a)sinasohn.com that none but madmen know."
Roger Louis Sinasohn & Associates
San Francisco, California http://www.sinasohn.com/
At 03:25 PM 5/17/98 PDT, you wrote:
>Some sick variations on the concept of a laptop, mostly from compaq.
>I don't know why the docks outnumbered the laptops by such an extent.
Because docking stations sit on desks, nice and safe beneath their
monitors, while laptops go out to play with the Samsonite Gorilla,
automobile firewalls, toddlers, etc.
--------------------------------------------------------------------- O-
Uncle Roger "There is pleasure pure in being mad
roger(a)sinasohn.com that none but madmen know."
Roger Louis Sinasohn & Associates
San Francisco, California http://www.sinasohn.com/
At 02:33 PM 5/15/98 -0500, you wrote:
>It would be fun and almost educational to outsiders to have a
>series of slides showing the evolution of the common Intel chipset,
>or memory chips.
Fry's Electronics (in Sunnyvale? -- Off Lawrence Expy) has a display with a
topless 4004 and a topless Pentium (of some sort). Quite a difference
indeed. (btw, this is the same one that has the CHAC Apple 1 and some
other items from Perham on display).
--------------------------------------------------------------------- O-
Uncle Roger "There is pleasure pure in being mad
roger(a)sinasohn.com that none but madmen know."
Roger Louis Sinasohn & Associates
San Francisco, California http://www.sinasohn.com/
