test-drb

test-drb@ccmp.vtda.org

101090 discussions

by allisonp＠world.std.com

<So what you're saying is that my dream of a steam-driven computer isn't t <ravings of a madman after all... Humm... steam driven logic... sequential, genius locomotive. Ah, err, been done. ;) Allison

27 years, 10 months

HP 85

by mbg＠world.std.com

I just wanted to find out if people on this list think that $100 for an HP85 with printer and tape drive is a fair price. Megan Gentry Former RT-11 Developer +--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+ | Megan Gentry, EMT/B, PP-ASEL | Internet (work): gentry(a)zk3.dec.com | | Unix Support Engineering Group | (home): mbg(a)world.std.com | | Digital Equipment Corporation | | | 110 Spitbrook Rd. ZK03-2/T43 | URL: http://world.std.com/~mbg/ | | Nashua, NH 03062 | "pdp-11 programmer - some assembler | | (603) 884 1055 | required." - mbg | +--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+

27 years, 10 months

What is the first computer?

by allisonp＠world.std.com

<that relay) in your logic. If you took an electronic logic circuit and <replaced the gates with relays, the result would be very slow. But if you <implemented the same logic with relays and redesigned it, the result <would be possibly useable. Logic design with realys have different implmentations as a bistable with gates can be one relay. Stepping relays are inherent counters and can be made to count to any amount. I've used realy logic for machine control, operating speed 2 to 5 sec per interation so fast was not a required thing. Doing sequential work using relays and switches is really fun. Of course all that drove air valves so there was air logic too. ;) Oh, and you can do logic with air valves, air one shots, even flipflops.

27 years, 10 months

principals in online selling? (was: IMSAI 8080)

by maxeskin＠hotmail.com

Well, I've never seen one. Then again, I've never seen your ass. Why were they black? Was it a special edition? Were the beige ones or the black ones first? > >> its just getting worse by the minute check this out from the Obsolete >> Computer helpline: >> >> >> Matt Antonellis <206-343-7576 P.S.T.> >> seattle, wa usa - Friday, June 19, 1998 at 18:43:02 >> >> FOR SALE: $500 rare BLACK AppleIIplus very good condition call MATT >> ANTONELLIS in SEATTLE 206-343-7576 > >Rare my hairy ass. This is about as rare as the hair on my ass. > >Sam Alternate e-mail: dastar(a)wco.com >------------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > September 26 & 27...Vintage Computer Festival 2! > See http://www.siconic.com/vcf for details > [Last web page update: 06/18/98] > > ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com

27 years, 10 months

HP 85

by maxeskin＠hotmail.com

So how much do you want for my two gallons of distilled enjoyment :) >Others might disagree with my definition of "worth", but if you think >you'll get more than $100 of enjoyment out of the setup, then I'd say >it's worth it. > >With all the discussions lately about auctions and pricing, I think >folks are losing sight that collecting classic computers is something >that we do for fun, not as an investment! Personally, I get far more >delight from restoring and using the machines than I do from bragging >about what I own. > >Tim. > ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com

27 years, 10 months

Sun 3/50

by maxeskin＠hotmail.com

My visit to the MIT Flea today was unproductive. But, so it wouldn't be wasted, I grabbed a Sun 3/50 for $1. It seems to work, and is in good condition. I looked at the board, it has a 68020. Can someone tell me more? Also, how do I hook it up to a terminal? Which pins do I need? I plugged my Mac in, but it didn't show anything. My Mac serial cable only has pins 2,3,6,7,8, and 21. ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com

27 years, 10 months

HP 85

by Anthony.Eros＠digital.com

Megan - > I just wanted to find out if people on this list think that $100 for > an HP85 with printer and tape drive is a fair price. I'd have to say probably not. I have a pair of HP-85s that I snagged in the last 18 months. One cost me $1.00 at a private school flea market and the other cost $12.50 at an auction run by Goodwill. The system from Goodwill included an HP padded travel case -- in fact, the system was originally stacked with some luggage and had not been bought during that portion of the auction. I found out after I pointed the system out to the auctioneer and bought it when they auctioned off the rest of the computer stuff (usually C64s, Atari, and the occasional Apple IIc or Mac Plus) that I could have simple asked for a "no bid" sale for the last bid price in the luggage area and gotten the system for $3.50. -- Tony Eros NSIS - ENS/Internet Wilmington, DE -----Original Message----- From: mbg(a)world.std.com [SMTP:mbg@world.std.com] Sent: Sunday, June 21, 1998 1:35 PM To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers Subject: HP 85 I just wanted to find out if people on this list think that $100 for an HP85 with printer and tape drive is a fair price. Megan Gentry Former RT-11 Developer +--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+ | Megan Gentry, EMT/B, PP-ASEL | Internet (work): gentry(a)zk3.dec.com | | Unix Support Engineering Group | (home): mbg(a)world.std.com | | Digital Equipment Corporation | | | 110 Spitbrook Rd. ZK03-2/T43 | URL: http://world.std.com/~mbg/ | | Nashua, NH 03062 | "pdp-11 programmer - some assembler | | (603) 884 1055 | required." - mbg | +--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+

27 years, 10 months

principals in online selling? (was: IMSAI 8080)

by fauradon＠pclink.com

So how much do you sell you hair for? ;) Francois ------------------------------------------------------------- Visit the Sanctuary at: http://www.pclink.com/fauradon -----Original Message----- From: Vintage Computer Festival <siconic(a)jasmine.psyber.com> To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers <classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu> Date: Saturday, June 20, 1998 11:23 PM Subject: Re: principals in online selling? (was: IMSAI 8080) >On Sun, 21 Jun 1998, Desie Hay wrote: > >> its just getting worse by the minute check this out from the Obsolete >> Computer helpline: >> >> >> Matt Antonellis <206-343-7576 P.S.T.> >> seattle, wa usa - Friday, June 19, 1998 at 18:43:02 >> >> FOR SALE: $500 rare BLACK AppleIIplus very good condition call MATT >> ANTONELLIS in SEATTLE 206-343-7576 > >Rare my hairy ass. This is about as rare as the hair on my ass. > >Sam Alternate e-mail: dastar(a)wco.com >--------------------------------------------------------------------------- ---- > > September 26 & 27...Vintage Computer Festival 2! > See http://www.siconic.com/vcf for details > [Last web page update: 06/18/98] >

27 years, 10 months

principals in online selling? (was: IMSAI 8080)

by rcini＠email.msn.com

>>What really scrapes my oxide is an approach that I am starting to see more >>often in postings in and newsgroups. (it has happened to me twice now in >>the last month) >>Someone posts an item with an asking price. I respond to the message with >>a counter offer. The seller responds with a counter-counter offer that I >>find acceptable. I respond to the message with my acceptance and provide >>shipping details. The seller then responded back indicating that he has >>received a higher offer and that the unit has been sold without so much as >>an opportunity for further response. Although I've participated in "auctions" of this type, I haven't gotten shanked by another bidder. I can see how easy the private auction process can be abused. I sometimes find myself doubtful of the bid increments that I've seen; too easy to fake interest to inflate the price. >>BTW: a HERO-2000 auction just closed on eBay for $4027.78... (sheesh!) I always wanted one of these when I was a kid. Wasn't it about $2k new? Unbelievable. Classic computers and robots, the next Beanie Babies! >>-jim (the obviously overly idealistic one...) Rich Cini/WUGNET <nospam_rcini(a)msn.com> - ClubWin! Charter Member - MCP Windows 95/Windows Networking - Preserver of "classic" computers <<<< ========== reply separator ========== >>>>>

27 years, 10 months

Old Microsoft stuff...

by maxeskin＠hotmail.com

Is there anyone who DIDN'T make a UNIX port? Apple - A/UX IBM - AIX MS - Xenix AT&T - UNIX DEC? DR? > >You mean Xenix? > Ciao, > >Tim D. Hotze > > ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com

27 years, 10 months

New e-mail address

by dastar＠ncal.verio.com

Excuse the interruption, but if you've been using dastar(a)wco.com to send me e-mail then please note I have a new e-mail address: dastar(a)verio.com You can also always reach me at sam(a)siconic.com which will probably never change. Sam Alternate e-mail: dastar(a)siconic.com ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Ever onward. September 26 & 27...Vintage Computer Festival 2 See http://www.siconic.com/vcf for details! [Last web page update: 06/11/98]

27 years, 10 months

principals in online selling? (was: IMSAI 8080)

by desieh＠southcom.com.au

-----Original Message----- From: Hans Franke <franke(a)sbs.de> To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers <classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu> Date: Sunday, June 21, 1998 6:30 Subject: Re: principals in online selling? (was: IMSAI 8080) >> I agree with you completely...however evil ebay may be, at least it is a >> structured enviornment with rules and etiquette that is regulated. > >Agreed > >> I am of the opinion that some of these characters are scrounging around >> ebay and newsgroups soliciting bidders just to get out of paying the >> commission...then they invent these rediculous auction scenarios. I think >> there should be some sort of formal boycott. > >I still like sBay an similar systems. At least they secure the >process a bit - like in an ordinary auction. And auctions are, >for shure, no place for rare or most wanted items. Not VL and >not RL. But they are a good thing to get fair prices for some >unusual or common things. I bought some rare spare parts via >eBay for just cents (and a brand new never opened never used >complete Mac IIsi for less than 100 USD :). But the best hits >are always on ordinary swap markets (flea markets) (like today >*g*) - even electronic swaps tend to have high prices. > >Gruss >H. > >-- >Ich denke, also bin ich, also gut >HRK > email: desieh(a)southcom.com.au desieh(a)bigfoot.com museum_curator(a)hotmail.com Apple Lisa Web Page: http://www.southcom.com.au/~desieh/index.htm its just getting worse by the minute check this out from the Obsolete Computer helpline: Matt Antonellis <206-343-7576 P.S.T.> seattle, wa usa - Friday, June 19, 1998 at 18:43:02 FOR SALE: $500 rare BLACK AppleIIplus very good condition call MATT ANTONELLIS in SEATTLE 206-343-7576

27 years, 10 months

Website status?

by yakowenk＠cs.unc.edu

On Fri, 19 Jun 1998, Christian Fandt <cfandt(a)servtech.com> wrote: ] Hey gang! ] ] Several times during the past week or ten days I've tried to connect to the ] ClassicCmp website http://haliotis.bothell.washington.edu/classiccmp but ] never seemed to be up. Always got a message after Netscape timed out ] suggesting the web server is either down or not responding. Anybody know ] what's happening? That's been dead for nearly as long as I've been here, about a year. And there's also that rescue-list put up by Isaac Davis, that also has been non-maintained for as long. My suggestion to everybody is to put up your own classiccmp page, and make sure you include the words "classic computer" so it can be found easily through the search engines. Or, if you are volunteering to rescue old machines, include the words "classic computer rescue squad", and include your interests, geographical area, and contact info. At one point, I was extremely tempted to put up some "official" web pages to take over for those dead pages. But then I thought about it: both of the other two who did this have vanished without a trace. Maybe I don't want to follow too closely in their footsteps. :-) Bill. ] Thanks, ] --Chris ] -- -- ] Christian Fandt, Electronic/Electrical Historian ] Jamestown, NY USA ] Member of Antique Wireless Association ] URL: http://www.ggw.org/freenet/a/awa/

27 years, 10 months

COMODORE=TANDY

by yakowenk＠cs.unc.edu

On Fri, 19 Jun 1998, Chris Halarewich <chrish(a)knet.kootenay.net> wrote: ] I was looking around at http://www.patents.ibm.com ] ] I discovered that Commodore Electronics held the ] patent for the case of the TRS-80 CoCo2(3?), which makes me wonder if ] they designed the rest of the computer for Radio Shack. ] ] Any Edgeumacated guesses anyone...anyone :) ] ] Chris Halarewich The data sheet for the Motorola 6883 Synchronous Address Multiplexor, which is the key wonder-chip in the CoCo 1 and 2, includes a schematic that accounts for about 80% of the CoCo design. The 6883 and 6847 were clearly designed to be used together, and the rest of the design was pretty much driven by that. Of course, the CoCo does have a little stuff hanging off of the two PIA's that isn't given in that data sheet. But I'd be surprised if they had gone to Commodore for that. Of course, I'm surprised enough at the patent on the case (who would need to infringe a patent to make a rectanguloid plastic box?!), so I guess the origin of the remainder of the circuit design could surprise me too... Bill.

27 years, 10 months

More additions to the Museum

by jrkeys＠concentric.net

Here are some of this week's finds: 1. 3-Apple Monochrome monitors IIe 2. 8-Apple 5.25 FD 3. 8-Giltronic Selecto-switch for Apple's 4. UltraDrive 45 for Mac with all cables and terminator 5. Apple duodisk A9M0108 6. 2-Apple IIe's 7. RCA Data Terminal model UP4801 similar to C64 a all in the keyboard unit even has a Acousic coupler conection and a RJ11 phone jack built in. 8. AMPI printer model 88 9. 2-Apple IIgs one is the WOZ limited edition model. 10. A Data General/One model 2 I already had a model 1, this unit came with the power supply. 11. EPSON PX-8 model H101A notebook computer has builtin micro cassette unit missing power supply but can run on batteries. 12. Digicard shared resource expansion unit and a contoller unit for apples. 13. Corvus OmniDrive model 45MB 14. 4-Apple Color Monitor IIe 15. Box of cables all types (a large box) 16. 2-IBM RT tower units need work 17. Heathkit Microcomputer learning system model 3400 series ET-3400A 18. HP 32936A ROM Drawer 19. 3-Mac 128k kb's 20. Box VAX manuals 21. Some old HP test equipment catalogs 22. Color Classic Mac 23. AT&T Mono monitor for 6300 24. AT&T kb for 6300 KBD302 25. And many more items than can be listed here because of the 10 year rule. It was good week for me and I hope you all have had some good fines. Keep on Computing John

27 years, 10 months

Quarter classics (was: Big Iron Was:RE: Backwate

by franke＠sbs.de

>> You just searched a phon directory ? Didn't you ? Or >> who told you that I live near the Deutsches Museum ? >> True, my apartment is just 100m from the (back) entrance. >> Their _very_ early collection - up to the Zuse - ist quite >> good, but anything later is crap - or at least the display >> is crap - I left the museum society because of the computer >> displays. I'm especialy upset because they have _real_ >> unique things to show in a _unique_ way, but they just build >> some junk place. > It can't be as bad as the Science Museum in London, surely. I was there > earlier this week, and what a _joke_!!! I never been there - hmm maybe I should tak a weekend - is there a Website to get the opening hours ? > The digital computing collection seems to consist of the Pilot ACE (worth > seeing, but it's _never_ in operation), the Babbage difference engine > (again, well worth seeing), and a poor collection of random bits of more > modern machines/peripherals. Oh, thats also the best description for the 'modern' displays in the Deutsches Museum: random bits. Especialy for the small devices. >> Example: they recived a _complete_ SIEMENS 2002, the first >> fuly transistorized copmuter. Not only the main boxes - >> they got _everything_ needed to show the machine complete, >> including _all_ manuals, even spare parts. I think it would >> have been possible to rebuild this marvelous machine and >> power it up (ok, once) to show it. Maybe it is still possible, >> but it has to be done soon - right now several of the old >> tecnicans are still alive, but in ten years from now noone >> will be here to tell the story. > We've had this discussion here before. Museums are (IMHO) too interested > in preserving the fabric of a device (which is important, but not the > most important thing) rather than the operation. My guess is that in > (say) 50 years time there will be machines in museums that are still in > exactly the same condition as when they were taken out of service, but > nobody knows how to get them running again, what they were really used > for, or how to operate them. We (as in the majority of people on this > list) are doing the opposite in general. We keep machines working, even > if it means doing some non-original repairs (but we try to keep things as > original as possible). I suspect our collections and those of museums > will both be of value in the future, but for different reasons. Ok, the 2002 wouldn't be exactly the machine for continous display in action, but even if it is just as static display, this one time running test ist the best verification that the static display is _complete_. (In fact, the critical part of the 2002 is the storage drum - even back in time when it was new, every power up and down had to be guarded by tecnicans - hmm but even here, since the drum is a closed device, one could replace it (invisible) by a modern electronic emulation... just thinking) Gruss H. -- Ich denke, also bin ich, also gut HRK

27 years, 10 months

Quarter classics (was: Big Iron Was:RE: Backwate

by franke＠sbs.de

> But then you're missing all the fun of watching the drum! That's the > cool part about REALLY old machines. With them, one could still get > his hands dirty in oil, as opposed to dust. The drum was (is) capsuled. Nothing to wiew beside a big old e-motor. Gruss H. (hates exchange) -- Ich denke, also bin ich, also gut HRK

27 years, 10 months

IMSAI 8080

by jeff.kaneko＠ifrsys.com

Guys: I am posting this message on the behalf of a third party. PLease contact him directly. For Sale: IMSAI 8080 Microcomputer This is the model with the switches on the front panel (non turnkey). Inside: Several memory boards Original IMS CPU Tarbell tape controller MicroComplex Phase Lock II FDC (by Frank Hogg) Video Adaptor/Keyboard Interface Outside: External Keyboard Dual Cassette drives (they look pretty strange) Dual 5.25 Floppy drives (non IMSAI) There is 'A Ton' of software for this thing, and it's supposed to run CP/M (I've seen the docs, but not the floppies). All of the boards, software, etc. have the original docs. Alot of the software is on cassette. There are also a bunch of spare boards: qty Make Model Whatizit? --- ------------- --------------------- -------------- 11 Micro Complex Phase Lock II FDC 1 North Star MDC-A2 MDC 1 Coex 64k Static RAM 1 Tanner 64k Static Ram 1 MITS 8800 CPU CPU Card 1 Solid State Music S-100 Video Interface 1 Morrow 8k RAM Module 1 WameCo EPM-2 EPROM Board 1 PolyMorphic Syst. A/D + D/A 2 Morrow/Godbout Econo-RAM 4k memory 1 STM 8k(?) RAM Board 1 Celetron Altair Board Extender 1 Vandenburg Data 16k Static Ram The seller would favor selling the whole lot. Asking price: $300 Contact: Denys G. Fredrickson denysgf(a)juno.com

27 years, 10 months

First personal storage media...

by franke＠sbs.de

>> At 09:25 PM 6/18/98 -0700, you wrote: >>>New Topic! Ok people: what sort of storage media (and for what system) did >>>you guys carry around to start out with? >>> I started with cassettes for the PETs at high school, though not as old as >>>some but still nostalgic. I still have my original first tape, though it had >>>been transfered to a new housing and snaps when a good (assertive?) datasette >>>rewinds it, it is still readable. >> First??? DECtape, 1 inch wide on the 4 inch reels from the PDP-8 in the >> OMSI computer labs. On occasion 8 level paper tape from the teletypes that >> we used to access a GE time-share system in Seattle. > Well I guess this dates me, but , 80 column punch cards. Do > not bend ,spindle or mutilate. > The only benefit was when a few years later on my advertising > distribution company was delivering a promo for a large supermarket > firm that shall go unnamed, cards that had some prizes included. > The cards were put thru an interpreter at the check-out counter > and some were winning cards if you had the item mentioned in > your basket. Since I could read the cards we pulled some of the > better prizes and presented them at different stores. > " Oh I won a Steak ? Thats great , I just happen to have one in > my basket." > We lived more dangerously in those days. Nice - I could offer 9 hole paper tape over a (modified) T100 Teletype on my Kim - before that I used paper and pencile until the program was 'finished' and than an PROM burner for archiving - superiour accestime :) Gruss H. -- Ich denke, also bin ich, also gut HRK

27 years, 10 months

What is the first computer?

by allisonp＠world.std.com

<Yes, relays are a lot slower than electronic devices, and yes, they may <be less reliable. But they're not as slow as all that. They are reliable, especially the sealed ones...saves extracting bugs(moths) with tweezers(aka: Lt Hopper). Speed; the problem is cascade. I've worked with relay trees of good size and while each can do 10s of repetitions persecond tens of them in cascade can only complete one cycle in a second. To do logic like a counter using relays is slow even though the individual relays may be fairly fast. Though using s stepper relay is faster than chained relays. Allison

27 years, 10 months

principals in online selling? (was: IMSAI 8080)

by franke＠sbs.de

> I agree with you completely...however evil ebay may be, at least it is a > structured enviornment with rules and etiquette that is regulated. Agreed > I am of the opinion that some of these characters are scrounging around > ebay and newsgroups soliciting bidders just to get out of paying the > commission...then they invent these rediculous auction scenarios. I think > there should be some sort of formal boycott. I still like sBay an similar systems. At least they secure the process a bit - like in an ordinary auction. And auctions are, for shure, no place for rare or most wanted items. Not VL and not RL. But they are a good thing to get fair prices for some unusual or common things. I bought some rare spare parts via eBay for just cents (and a brand new never opened never used complete Mac IIsi for less than 100 USD :). But the best hits are always on ordinary swap markets (flea markets) (like today *g*) - even electronic swaps tend to have high prices. Gruss H. -- Ich denke, also bin ich, also gut HRK

27 years, 10 months

wnated manuals for HP 9915

by rigdonj＠intellistar.net

The title says it all. I'm looking for ANY documentation for the HP 9915. Joe

27 years, 10 months

What is the first computer?

by franke＠sbs.de

> Allison J Parent wrote: >><> Mechanical: man or motor powered, bars cams, wheels >><> Electric: Relays, steppers, solonoids and contacts has logic tree. >><> Electronic: uses active devices, tubes, transistors, ICs some types of >>> diodes and neon filled tubes. >><A good definition, I could agree, althrough I've seen >><Electric and Electronic the same, since a relay isn't >><diferent from a transistor or a tube for the effekt >><(beside the current). >> The distinction for the last two is significant from a design and speed >> standpoint. the design process is very different at the detail level. > Yah, with a relay-based system, a one-hertz clock speed would be > setting a record. Woooooosh - Your 'record' machine was just bypassed by a 1941 Zuse build from junk telephone relais. According to Zuse a multiplication took 3 seconds. A Multiply nedded 16 Machine cycls and 16/3 equals to 5.33 Hz - just - 5 times faster - calculated on cycles, but one cyle had 5 stages. Satge 1 to 3 where used for execution, while 4 and 5 are used for load and fetch - the operation fetch ocuresd simultaniously to the store. So even this early had paralell working units (didn't tried Intel to tell us that this was one of the big inventions of the Pentium - you know the processor with all the little rainbow coloured man inside instead of the usual LGM) Althrough the speed was something like 5 or 6 Hz, it is legal to speak about a clock speed of 15 to 18 Hz when comparing to newer machines. And for relay speed itself - 40 to 100 (controlled) switchings per second have been possible for pre war relais and EMS relais (technique of the 60s) are able to do up to 1500 Hz - we tried it 20 years back :) Gruss H. -- Ich denke, also bin ich, also gut HRK

27 years, 10 months

Quarter classics (was: Big Iron Was:RE: Backwate

by maxeskin＠hotmail.com

But then you're missing all the fun of watching the drum! That's the cool part about REALLY old machines. With them, one could still get his hands dirty in oil, as opposed to dust. >>> who told you that I live near the Deutsches Museum ? >>> True, my apartment is just 100m from the (back) entrance. > >>> Their _very_ early collection - up to the Zuse - ist quite >>> good, but anything later is crap - or at least the display >>> is crap - I left the museum society because of the computer >>> displays. I'm especialy upset because they have _real_ >>> unique things to show in a _unique_ way, but they just build >>> some junk place. > >> It can't be as bad as the Science Museum in London, surely. I was there >> earlier this week, and what a _joke_!!! > >I never been there - hmm maybe I should tak a weekend - is >there a Website to get the opening hours ? > >> The digital computing collection seems to consist of the Pilot ACE (worth >> seeing, but it's _never_ in operation), the Babbage difference engine >> (again, well worth seeing), and a poor collection of random bits of more >> modern machines/peripherals. > >Oh, thats also the best description for the 'modern' displays >in the Deutsches Museum: random bits. Especialy for the small >devices. > >>> Example: they recived a _complete_ SIEMENS 2002, the first >>> fuly transistorized copmuter. Not only the main boxes - >>> they got _everything_ needed to show the machine complete, >>> including _all_ manuals, even spare parts. I think it would >>> have been possible to rebuild this marvelous machine and >>> power it up (ok, once) to show it. Maybe it is still possible, >>> but it has to be done soon - right now several of the old >>> tecnicans are still alive, but in ten years from now noone >>> will be here to tell the story. > >> We've had this discussion here before. Museums are (IMHO) too interested >> in preserving the fabric of a device (which is important, but not the >> most important thing) rather than the operation. My guess is that in >> (say) 50 years time there will be machines in museums that are still in >> exactly the same condition as when they were taken out of service, but >> nobody knows how to get them running again, what they were really used >> for, or how to operate them. We (as in the majority of people on this >> list) are doing the opposite in general. We keep machines working, even >> if it means doing some non-original repairs (but we try to keep things as >> original as possible). I suspect our collections and those of museums >> will both be of value in the future, but for different reasons. > >Ok, the 2002 wouldn't be exactly the machine for continous >display in action, but even if it is just as static display, >this one time running test ist the best verification that the >static display is _complete_. > >(In fact, the critical part of the 2002 is the storage drum - >even back in time when it was new, every power up and down >had to be guarded by tecnicans - hmm but even here, since >the drum is a closed device, one could replace it (invisible) >by a modern electronic emulation... just thinking) > >Gruss >H. > >-- >Ich denke, also bin ich, also gut >HRK > ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com

27 years, 10 months

First personal storage media...

by maxeskin＠hotmail.com

Sorry about the white space, I'm using Lynx, as always... I agree with that! I've taken two sets of disks for Mac System 7 from a Mac Lab, and both had bad disks. OTOH, the 6.0.4 disks still work fine, probably because of the lower density. Sometimes I wonder if there's something wrong w/my drives, but they can read data written by other drives... >a month later. And yes my drive heads are clean, and the drive is set up >as per the service manual. > >Sometimes I wish I could pay more for a disk and get one that lasts. My >data is worth a lot more than $5 or whatever. > >> >> New Topic! Ok people: what sort of storage media (and for what system) did >> you guys carry around to start out with? My first exposure to storage was 5.25" disks in third grade for the Apple ][. It was old then. We were being terrorized by a moron who spent a month telling us to put disks into a sleeve. I wondered if he knew to do anything else. BTW, can a disk be damaged if taken out while it is being read from? That was a sin I had commited... > >After that came : magnetic cards on an HP41CV, 5.25" floppies (initially >on the school's RML380Z, then on my TRS-80), paper tape (I got a >non-working ASR33 and repaired it), 8" floppies, 3" floppies, punched >cards, 3.5" floppies, hard disk packs, 9 track tapes, QIC tapes. > >Of course many of those are used on more than 1 machine, and I'm only >listing the first time I used them. > >-tony > > ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com

27 years, 10 months

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test-drb