test-drb

test-drb@ccmp.vtda.org

101090 discussions

by dogas＠leading.net

hmm.. also in looking through the xenix docs I see mentioned, the DT-1. I've got a PT-210 and pre-coco vidtex and have been looking for a DT-100 but dont remember the DT-1. What's it like? - Mike: dogas(a)leading.net

26 years, 8 months

Chicago trs-80s

by dogas＠leading.net

Having had a small chance to digest the new trs pillsI find that I newly have: - a 6000hd 15meg 1d that I'm currently running xenix 3.01.00 on -a 16 1d that is missing some internal cables, this one has an odd model 16 vanity plate and matching keyboard. -a 6000hd 15meg 1d -a 16 2d with a bad floppy and intermittant keyboard -a 6000 15meg 1d -a 6000 15meg 1d -a 16b 2d with a bad monitor -a 16b 2d - keyboards for 6000 (and a white key one) 12, 16, and 16b - 8meg hd system (big black) - 20meg hd sytem (small white) - 3 extra 8" floppies - a bad 15meg winchester replacement - assundry cabling And digging into the closet (past all the skeletons) I pulled the following software out of stasis - xenix basic interpreter - model II cobol dev system - versaledger - scripsit - multiplan -profile plus - ar/ap/payroll - trs-dos - videotex Plus - trs-dos II - trs-dos 4.0 - model 16 system disk - xenix CTAR - profile 16 - xenix 3.02.00 - xenix profile upgrade - xenix multiuser upgrade - profile 16 upgrade - xenix 1.3.xx for model 16 Will the trsdos stuff above work under tsh? Now to dust off the drive heads and install some stuff. If anyone has any complimentary warez or needs copies yada yada yada. ;) - Mike: dogas(a)leading.net

26 years, 8 months

PDP8 Paper Tape

by ethan_dicks＠yahoo.com

--- allisonp(a)world.std.com wrote: > > > boxes of paper tapes labeled "262.1-S PDP-8 Printer Driver Source", > > > "265.1-OB PDP-8 printer Diagnostic Object 1 of 3", and the other 2 boxes. --- After _I_ wrote: > > I myself cannot tell what printer those work with from the numeric portion > > of the title, but I can say that just for parallel printers, OMNIBUS -8's > > supported > > the LA180, the LQP01 and LQP02. Common serial printers... > You forget LE8, LP14, lp25 series of line printers. I didn't forget them... I never knew about the LE8 nor the LP14, and I didn't know that there was ever an interface for the LP25 for any model of 8. It's all news to me. > PDP-8s were used with large and faster line printers of the day. I have only ever seen PDP-8's used with what would be termed "personal" class printers. > Also the LA30 DECwriter was a parallel interface at 30cps. I have heard of the LA30. I didn't know it was parallel. Never seen one. -ethan _________________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com

26 years, 8 months

Is this normal? ODT Question

by CLASSICCMP＠trailing-edge.com

>So I've got a Q-bus system with 64KW (128KB) of RAM that is allegedly an 18 >bit backplane. When I'm in ODT I can type: > >@177770/ >And enter values for 1777772, 1777774, 1777776, and then it wraps around to >000000. > >If I start at 200000 it works until 3777777 and then wraps to 2000000. So >it seems to not cross a 64KB boundary. That's how it's supposed to work. If you look in the tech manual for the processors, you see that there's a 16-bit register for the "low" part of the ODT address, and another register for the high part of the ODT address, but there's no carry connecting the two. > Also the boot area is 177300 ? so it >is in the upper 4K of the 64KB address space, is it legal to have memory >"above" the I/O page? Absolutely. In fact, some configurations had only a 2Kbyte I/O page to allow a little bit of extra memory, and this still works (albeit not officially supported) under RT-11 (it was tested before the 5.7 release.) -- Tim Shoppa Email: shoppa(a)trailing-edge.com Trailing Edge Technology WWW: http://www.trailing-edge.com/ 7328 Bradley Blvd Voice: 301-767-5917 Bethesda, MD, USA 20817 Fax: 301-767-5927

26 years, 8 months

PDP8 Paper Tape

by marvin＠rain.org

Ethan Dicks wrote: > > --- Marvin <marvin(a)rain.org> wrote: > > > > I was rummaging around the back bedroom last night and found (again) three > > boxes of paper tapes labeled "262.1-S PDP-8 Printer Driver Source", > > "265.1-OB PDP-8 printer Diagnostic Object 1 of 3", and the other 2 boxes. I > > have no idea what printer this might be used with. It came with the PDP-8L I > > acquired many years ago. These tapes are rolled black tape. Anyone know what > > these might be? > > Do you have any way of reading the tapes in? One way to tell is by reading > the comments. Another way is by checking the IOT's used for the printer I/O. The only paper tape reader I have right now is an ASR-33 and aside from it being buried :), I can use it to read the tapes in. The PDP-8 was bought new by someone here in Santa Barbara, and then donated to a local school which is where I got it. It came with an ASR-33 (which I sold years ago <sigh>), a Tri-Data tape recorder (anyone familiar with them?), and a schematic package. One of these days, it would be fun to fire it up (hopefully not a pun!)

26 years, 8 months

PDP8 Paper Tape

by allisonp＠world.std.com

> > boxes of paper tapes labeled "262.1-S PDP-8 Printer Driver Source", > > "265.1-OB PDP-8 printer Diagnostic Object 1 of 3", and the other 2 boxes. I > > have no idea what printer this might be used with. It came with the PDP-8L I > > I myself cannot tell what printer those work with from the numeric portion of > the title, but I can say that just for parallel printers, OMNIBUS -8's > supported > the LA180, the LQP01 and LQP02. Common serial printers were the older members You forget LE8, LP14, lp25 series of line printers. PDP-8s were used with large and faster line printers of the day. Also the LA30 DECwriter was a parallel interface at 30cps. THey were far from limited to ASR33s (LT33). Allison

26 years, 8 months

PDP8 Paper Tape

by ethan_dicks＠yahoo.com

--- Marvin <marvin(a)rain.org> wrote: > > I was rummaging around the back bedroom last night and found (again) three > boxes of paper tapes labeled "262.1-S PDP-8 Printer Driver Source", > "265.1-OB PDP-8 printer Diagnostic Object 1 of 3", and the other 2 boxes. I > have no idea what printer this might be used with. It came with the PDP-8L I > acquired many years ago. These tapes are rolled black tape. Anyone know what > these might be? Do you have any way of reading the tapes in? One way to tell is by reading the comments. Another way is by checking the IOT's used for the printer I/O. I myself cannot tell what printer those work with from the numeric portion of the title, but I can say that just for parallel printers, OMNIBUS -8's supported the LA180, the LQP01 and LQP02. Common serial printers were the older members of the DECWriter line (e.g., LA-36, probably not the LA-120). If that source is for an older, non-OMNIBUS model, I wouldn't have a clue as to what model of printer it would want to talk to. I think only the LA-36 was available in current-loop configuration (excepting, of course, real TTY's). Do you have a way of reading in the tape? -ethan _________________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com

26 years, 8 months

Heatkit 5 1/4 floppies

by lwalker＠mail.interlog.com

I made a curbside rescue of a dual ext. fdd. Two FH 5 1/4 floppies mounted vertically. ZenithDS Heathkit H77 with ribbon cable connector. Looks more like an 8" mechanism than your standard floppies. I'm assuming these were for a Z-100 guaged by the ZDS H-K label timeframe . Any info on them ? Judging by the mechanism that I can see , like Rainbow drives but not laterly opposed , they're SS. ciao larry lwalker(a)interlog.com Collectors info http://members.xoom.com/T3C

26 years, 8 months

sending you a book?

by dpeschel＠u.washington.edu

I asked you about a book I got for you; you seemed interested but I still want to confirm. Also I need your postal address. -- Derek

26 years, 8 months

Last Chance for GRiDPad's

by sinasohn＠ricochet.net

At 06:13 PM 4/6/99 -0400, you wrote: >Hi Uncle, been away for several days... Did I miss anything? Nope, still working on getting them out. My dad is currently sorting/separating cables. Be patient, everybody. (Paying the mortgage is a little higher priority. 8^) --------------------------------------------------------------------- O- Uncle Roger "There is pleasure pure in being mad roger(a)sinasohn.com that none but madmen know." Roger Louis Sinasohn & Associates San Francisco, California http://www.sinasohn.com/

26 years, 8 months

Timonium Hamfest

by sinasohn＠ricochet.net

At 11:14 AM 4/1/99 -0500, you wrote: >Almost every computer involved person I know who >has any control of their work schedule: > >1) Gets up after the sun has properly warmed the earth > where they live Dysania: (n) an inability to function early in the morning. I've got it bad. (It's a real word, at least according to Balderdash, a commercial version of the game Dictionary.) --------------------------------------------------------------------- O- Uncle Roger "There is pleasure pure in being mad roger(a)sinasohn.com that none but madmen know." Roger Louis Sinasohn & Associates San Francisco, California http://www.sinasohn.com/

26 years, 8 months

homemade computer for fun and experience...

by edick＠idcomm.com

It is exactly that. . . a YMMV thing . . . My experience with terminals was always a disappointment. I can't even think of a way to fix it. The people who wrote and sold software made assumptions about what's out there, and, if you used three different vendors' software, it was unlikely any of the sophisticated features, including emulations, by the way, would work well enough to use the same terminal in all cases. Only with the lowest common denominator (ADM-3A) did one have a reasonable time of it. Dick -----Original Message----- From: Allison J Parent <allisonp(a)world.std.com> To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers <classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu> Date: Tuesday, April 06, 1999 9:08 PM Subject: Re: homemade computer for fun and experience... ><This is going to be a YMMV thing, but I've never had problems with normal ><serial terminals, especially not DEC ones. > >AS someone actively running s100 and assorted other cpm systems... A soft >terminal that can emulate ADM1, ADM3, Vt100 and telvideo covers the crowd >right up until you get some oddball code that used a 64x16 VDM1. The >reality was no standards and it's really not gotten that much better. > >My solution... An H19 thats over 21, A vt100 (all others are broken), >a few Vt320s and a Vt340. The thing is I also run DEC hardware and while >they will support any ansi tube a real VT is still easier to use. > ><> I have never had a desire for DEC hardware, mainly because of my distast ><> (and disdain) for their application of technology, and of course for thei > >Personal preference. I happen to like them and they seem to run a long >time. At least all of mine still runs and the 11/03 cpu I have has turned >20! > ><Don't forget that this started with somebody who wanted to homebrew their ><first computer. In which case it should be as simple as possible. > >therein is the essence of the string and why terminals are somewhat nicer >even if they lack color graphics you can play doom on. > ><> See . . . there are reasons NOT to use a terminal. >< ><Sure. Not every machine should use a serial terminal, but equally, not ><every machine needs a built-in graphics display. Which you build is up to ><you. > >I'll add you still need a serial line for a modem. Then you still need a >printer. CPM being a nongraphic OS and there is a distinct lack of >software that uses graphics for it... kind of a moot point if you can >have a 1280x1024 color tube. I can say this as I have a visual 1050 >that has a rather elaborate display system and there is lttle use for it >save for it can emulate a terminal at a cost of another micro, ram and >firmware to run it. Nothing like debuging two systems and blind at that. > >Allison >

26 years, 8 months

microcode, compilers, and supercomputer architecture

by allisonp＠world.std.com

<> To put this slightly on topic, we all know that computer systems have <> become more reliable in the last 20 years but does anyone have any real Potentially they are. there are fewer chips and connectors to fail and chips can be highly reliable however... The average PC is tossed togeher from a motly assortment of parts and software and usually works, sometimes. With that cases are more a fashon statment rather than given the thought toward cooling... those 333mhz celerons do get mightly hot and those cheap bushing fans do fail often. When new system have the uptime records of my 12 year old uVAXII we can debate this... the record is 422 days contuinious uptime without reboot, it was limited by a power failure. I've built Z80 based systems with uptimes measured in years (still counting as they are battery backed). They are running very debugged code and power failure is not seen due to power systems that expect brownouts. It's not to say they cannot out do that, only that reliability is a measure of quality and sadly most PCs greatly lack the latter. Technology does not automagically beget reliability, it affords the opportunity to create it. Often that boat never docked at the airport. Allison

26 years, 8 months

homemade computer for fun and experience...

by allisonp＠world.std.com

<This is going to be a YMMV thing, but I've never had problems with normal <serial terminals, especially not DEC ones. AS someone actively running s100 and assorted other cpm systems... A soft terminal that can emulate ADM1, ADM3, Vt100 and telvideo covers the crowd right up until you get some oddball code that used a 64x16 VDM1. The reality was no standards and it's really not gotten that much better. My solution... An H19 thats over 21, A vt100 (all others are broken), a few Vt320s and a Vt340. The thing is I also run DEC hardware and while they will support any ansi tube a real VT is still easier to use. <> I have never had a desire for DEC hardware, mainly because of my distast <> (and disdain) for their application of technology, and of course for thei Personal preference. I happen to like them and they seem to run a long time. At least all of mine still runs and the 11/03 cpu I have has turned 20! <Don't forget that this started with somebody who wanted to homebrew their <first computer. In which case it should be as simple as possible. therein is the essence of the string and why terminals are somewhat nicer even if they lack color graphics you can play doom on. <> See . . . there are reasons NOT to use a terminal. < <Sure. Not every machine should use a serial terminal, but equally, not <every machine needs a built-in graphics display. Which you build is up to <you. I'll add you still need a serial line for a modem. Then you still need a printer. CPM being a nongraphic OS and there is a distinct lack of software that uses graphics for it... kind of a moot point if you can have a 1280x1024 color tube. I can say this as I have a visual 1050 that has a rather elaborate display system and there is lttle use for it save for it can emulate a terminal at a cost of another micro, ram and firmware to run it. Nothing like debuging two systems and blind at that. Allison

26 years, 8 months

OT: ABS - or is it Pure BS/wheel sensors

by roblwill＠usaor.net

I wonder is it would be possible to devise something that would use some sort of disc with a bunch of holes in it and the sensors from an old (8"?) floppy drive? A desperate attempt to get this somewhat back on topic :) -- -Jason Willgruber (roblwill(a)usaor.net) ICQ#: 1730318 <http://members.tripod.com/general_1> =============================== ---------------Original Message----- From: Stan Perkins <stan(a)netcom.com> To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers <classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu> Date: Tuesday, April 06, 1999 3:01 PM Subject: Re: OT: ABS - or is it Pure BS/wheel sensors > >It's probably a similar system to the one used by Etak with their early >car navigation systems. Basically, they used a special adhesive tape >that contained a small bar magnet every inch along its length. This was >applied to the circumference of the inside of each front wheel rim, and >a Hall effect sensor was attached to a point on the front axle (usually >to a part of the brake caliper assembly) where it was within an inch of >this tape as it passed by. Each magnet passage would produce a countable >pulse, and the Etak computer could determine the wheel speed and >direction of rotation for each front wheel. *Supposedly* it could also >detect a turn by the differential speed of the front wheels, but it also >had a flux gate compass to help determine direction and turns. > >A pretty clever system that worked quite well, considering it was all >done without reference to external navigation data sources like GPS, >LORAN, etc! > >Since your system apparently produces only a single pulse per >revolution, I would guess there's one magnet somewhere on each wheel >rim. The speed resolution with only a single pulse per revolution is >probably not good enough for ABS use. > >Hope this helps, >Stan >

26 years, 8 months

Chicago trs-80s

by dogas＠leading.net

My vacation/computer-rescue-mission has come to a close and there is now a big honkin pile of trs-80 6000 and 16b toys on my living room floor. :) Several of them have broken this or thatsz but the first one I pulled, a 6000hd 15mhd, booted into Xenix 3.0.1 I think (Microsoft '84). the 68k in it crashed after about 20min of xenix frolicking. She's resting now. I'd like cc and tcp for this if anyone can help me out? I 'm sure some parts will be available as soon as I figure out what I have. Software, give me software or give me death. ;) - Mike: dogas(a)leading.net

26 years, 8 months

Industrial PeeCee

by jpl15＠netcom.com

I am looking for an "Industrial" IBM-compat PC... the kind that is mounted in a 19" rack enclosure with a small monitor integral to the box, and usually a keyboard underneath on a slide-shelf. My purpose is to run one of the PDP11 sims and Linux, and to function as a more modern 'peripheral farm' and a comm node to my Real PDP collection. I am looking for a 486 or Pentium I unit with 8-16 meg of RAM, .5 - 1.5 G HD, compatible BIOS and able to run Win95... if it *has* to. One serial, one parallel, one SCSI, and Ethernet, or capable of supporting all these at once. I am looking to trade or buy. Obviously I prefer not to have to buy new, I would much rather keep it 'local'. NOTE: ABS braking is neither required nor desired on the above unit. Cheerz John

26 years, 8 months

! Heads Up ! -- System becoming available

by mbg＠world.std.com

Just wanted to let eveyone know that I have been contacted by someone who works for a company where they have three (3) KS10s. One of the machines is *CURRENTLY OPERATIONAL*. One was shut down several months ago, and the person who wrote to me doesn't know about the third. There are nine (9) RP06 disk drives distributed between the three systems, two additional ones are broken. Two tape drives are on line (with problems) and one is broken (one TM03 and two TU77s). The computers are in a room without a raised floor, so the cables are simply laying around. The terms are that we (whoever) takes the equipment must do so at their own cost, and must take everything, including cables and non-working units. Dismantling can start April 21st, removal has to be by April 27th. No later than this. The KS10s take up about 6sqft of floor space each, and are about 600 lbs., the RP06s apparently take up about 7-9 sqft and I don't know how much they weight. I don't know about the tape drives. Someone told me it may be between 6000 and 8000 lbs all together... Systems are located in Cambridge, Massachussetts. We need to give an answer by April 13th at the latest. I suspect that if it isn't saved, it will go to the scrapheap, landfill, crusher, <fill_in_your_own_worst_nightmare_here>. So, is anyone game? Please contact me off-list. I'll *try* to coordinate this. This is a chance to handle some *REAL IRON*... Megan Gentry Former RT-11 Developer +--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+ | Megan Gentry, EMT/B, PP-ASEL | Internet (work): gentry!zk3.dec.com | | Unix Support Engineering Group | (home): mbg!world.std.com | | Compaq Computer Corporation | addresses need '@' in place of '!' | | 110 Spitbrook Rd. ZK03-2/T43 | URL: http://world.std.com/~mbg/ | | Nashua, NH 03062 | "pdp-11 programmer - some assembler | | (603) 884 1055 | required." - mbg | +--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+

26 years, 8 months

HP 88780 9-track tape drive

by svs＠ropnet.ru

G'day, Yesterday four geeks (including myself) had tried to convince a HP 88780 9-track SCSI drive (cleverly disguised as Tandem 5160) to accept 6250 bpi tapes. It works OK at 1600 bpi, but refuses to admit it knows about 6250: "mt setdensity 3" on a Linux box results in "Incompatible media installed" error (when the tape written at 6250 bpi is loaded.) The problem is: no docs. By playing with front panel buttons, we discovered lots of interesting knobs to turn (CONF 40..199), but weren't inclined to try them all. What CONF will allow 6250 bpi density to be used? Or is it permanently disabled by Tandem-customized firmware? -- Sergey Svishchev -- svs{at}ropnet{dot}ru

26 years, 8 months

ABS - or is it Pure BS

by roblwill＠usaor.net

*Having had decades of extensive driving during the long cold winters in *western Canada, Qebec and Ontario , I would consider myself a quite skilled *slippery road driver. The worst thing you can do when you go into a skid is *lock your brakes. The best is to turn into the skid and use your accellerator *and steering to bring it back under control. I would rather have any brake *action under my control and hope I can steer out of it without using them.There *are courses up here which teach this technique. ABS seems just damnright *dangerous to me, What happens when that novice (or anyone for that matter) who is used to ABS, when the ABS system fails? * except perhaps for the complete novice who would lock his *brakes out of fear and inexperience. I have also had experiences of *power-steering failure one of which resulted in a serious accident for myself. * *ciao larry *lwalker(a)interlog.com * *Collectors info http://members.xoom.com/T3C *

26 years, 8 months

Last Chance for GRiDPad's

by dogas＠leading.net

Hi Uncle, been away for several days... Did I miss anything? Thanks - Mike

26 years, 8 months

Hallelujah!

by dogas＠leading.net

Amen. :) - Mike: dogas(a)leading.net -----Original Message----- From: Max Eskin <max82(a)surfree.com> To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers <classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu> Date: Saturday, April 03, 1999 11:44 PM Subject: Hallelujah! >I've finally gotten around to reading a LISP book that I had bought months >before, and I can see why people refer to LISP as a religious experience >(I've seen that said at least twice). It's really a wonderful language. I >wonder how it is worse than BASIC or Perl. Also, although I didn't really >take the time to really understand smalltalk (Squeak is slow and >unstable), I can see the beginnings of smalltalk in LISP. Wow. This thing >really is pretty amazing. This should be taught in every computer >programming course, along with PAL-8, C, and Perl. I am now certain that >if a language is hard to learn (C++ comes to mind), there's something >wrong with it :) > >--Max Eskin (max82(a)surfree.com) > >

26 years, 8 months

OT: ABS - or is it Pure BS/wheel sensors

by roblwill＠usaor.net

I'm not sure if anyone else knows about what I'm talking about, but in my Jeep (pre-ABS), there's a little panel on the dashboard (not original). There's 4 LED's on the panel (one corresponding to each wheel). When the wheel corresponding to a particular LED is completely stopped, the LED lights steadily red. When the wheel is turning, the LED flashes green (one flash for each revolution). Anyone know how this would work (with out me pulling it out of my Jeep)? It would be probably a good accessory for non-ABS cars. -- -Jason Willgruber (roblwill(a)usaor.net) ICQ#: 1730318 <http://members.tripod.com/general_1>

26 years, 8 months

ABS - or is it Pure BS

by hhacker＠home.com

>2) even if the ABS system fails it still works just like non-ABS brakes. unless >the vacuum (power assisted) system fails or the brake line is cut, or (very >unlikely) the piston sticks open, the brakes will work just fine. > ABS - American Bull Shi... I have noted one difficulty with ABS, and that is its failure to operate on snow and ice. Since I live in Southern California, I do not get that much snow but, in any quick application of my Mustang's breaks, on snow covered roads, they always seem to lock up. Well, the pumping action occurs but, at each application of the pump, I notice wheel lock-up. There is no stopping. William R. Buckley

26 years, 8 months

microcode, compilers, and supercomputer architecture

by mbg＠world.std.com

>>Sure. And the microcode compilers I've written and used are much better >>at optimizing horizontal microcode than I have the time or patience to >>do by hand. >Your lack of time and patience is not equal to the claim you make >regarding the quality of optimisation possible. well put... I've yet to find a compiler which can produce code which could not then be further optimized in some way by a person well versed in that machine's architecture... Megan Gentry Former RT-11 Developer +--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+ | Megan Gentry, EMT/B, PP-ASEL | Internet (work): gentry!zk3.dec.com | | Unix Support Engineering Group | (home): mbg!world.std.com | | Compaq Computer Corporation | addresses need '@' in place of '!' | | 110 Spitbrook Rd. ZK03-2/T43 | URL: http://world.std.com/~mbg/ | | Nashua, NH 03062 | "pdp-11 programmer - some assembler | | (603) 884 1055 | required." - mbg | +--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+

26 years, 8 months

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test-drb